S01.E08: When We Are in Need

[PurpleTentacle]

55 minutes ago, b4pjoe said:

In pre-apocalypse there was conservation of hunting. Before there was conservation some animals came dangerously close to being extinct like the American Buffalo. With no animal conservation during the apocalypse people might have virtually wiped out the animals in the first few years making them more scarce than before the apocalypse.

That's because of way too many people using way too overpowered guns. With all the dead people and scarce amo that shouldn't be a problem. Remember even if you weren't infected, Fedra likely murdered you.

Also even with current hunting methods, deer are not endangered and only really kept in check by natural predators. In europe they are a big pest, because not enough predators are around and hunters can't rid of them fast enough.

26 minutes ago, paigow said:

They are too small and quick... you would spend a lot of bullets for a small return... Impossible to get close enough for baseball bats or knives.

The monkeys didn't seem to be very concerned with humans until they got close. With a rifle they should be easy to shoot. Why these guys seemingly didn't have guns with them is still weird.

[conquistador]

Was there anything stopping Ellie from sniping David’s crew when they came to her street? We had already seen her sniping skills, it would seem like a better approach to hide in some backyard and at least get one sure hit then to ride up at them guns blazing.

[b4pjoe]

8 minutes ago, PurpleTentacle said:

That's because of way too many people using way too overpowered guns. With all the dead people and scarce amo that shouldn't be a problem. Remember even if you weren't infected, Fedra likely murdered you.

Also even with current hunting methods, deer are not endangered and only really kept in check by natural predators. In europe they are a big pest, because not enough predators are around and hunters can't rid of them fast enough.

I'm pretty sure in the late 1800's and early 1900's when the American Buffalo was nearly wiped from the face of the Earth the weapons available were not overpowered than the guns that were available in 2003. I also think FEDRA was more of a problem in the cities. I doubt they controlled any of the vast areas of forest in the west like Wyoming, Colorado, Idaho etc...and remember in the early days of the apocalypse there probably was no weapon/ammo shortage so those people were free to take as many animals as they please with no police or government to worry about.

Currently in the entire USA you can't just wake up and decide to go out and kill a few deer that day. I'm not a hunter but I know plenty of people here in Illinois that deer hunting is like a religion and they have to apply for a deer permit which they may or may not get. And I believe it is only good for one deer. Yes...deer are not endangered today. That is directly because of conservation efforts over the years.

[paigow]

22 minutes ago, conquistador said:

Was there anything stopping Ellie from sniping David’s crew when they came to her street? 

Her plan was to put as much distance between herself and Joel, not a high body count or stationary firefight.

[Anela]

1 hour ago, conquistador said:

Of the episodes we have seen so far, this one was probably burdened the most with genre tropes and also some plot contrivances. However, I think the directing sells it anyway - there are some wonderfully tense moments, my favorite being the scene where Ellie is about to get cut up. 

 

This was the first episode to remind me of the Walking Dead. Several storylines, rolled into one.

Re: dead people as food. I wouldn't want any, and it sounds like they weren't giving people a choice. Nobody was telling them that Uncle David, and Sarah from down the road, were hanging in the meat locker, up next on the menu. 

[kay1864]

1 hour ago, conquistador said:

Perhaps what Ellie has is a newly mutated form of autoimmune disease

Anyone else think that Ellie smearing blood on Sam’s wound might have helped him a little? His infection didn’t seem as advanced as it should’ve been after several hours.

[Niuxita]

Interesting how everyone immediately caught on to the fact that David 1) was a pedophile and 2) was about to rape Ellie. When he said that about how the struggle was his favourite part, or something to that effect, my mind immediately went to "Oh so he was a serial killer." 

[Jodithgrace]

I had been this way and that about David, whether or not he was a good guy. I mean preachers in these type of shows are never good guys, but thus far the show has been good at twisting tropes, and he did seem compassionate. But then he sat down at the table where everybody was eating soup, and was served a big honking plate of meat, and I knew right away he wasn’t a good guy. Then 20 seconds later he slapped the girl and removed all doubt. 

The problem with fishing is that unless the lake was stocked with giant marlin, or some such, it would take a huge amount of normal sized fish to feed a group that size. And fishing in such cold weather isn’t easy. Hunting provides better buck for the bang. (Sorry) 

And here I was wondering if the people would turn their noses up at eating horse meat, and then I thought hungry people will eat just about anything. Little did I know…

[Starchild]

3 hours ago, paramitch said:

She was amazing. She had incredible charisma and stage presence even as a young child. And I loved her genuine stagecraft -- she had this fantastic presence, great speaking voice and sense of command. Just wholly believable as a child noble/ruling leader.

If there's anyone who hasn't seen Game of Thrones and has no intention of seeing it (or doesn't mind potential spoilers), this compilation of Ramsey's scenes shows you the seeds of Ellie's ferocity.

 

[Capricasix]

1 hour ago, Jodithgrace said:

Hunting provides better buck for the bang. (Sorry)

Ba dum tss 😁

[Kel Varnsen]

Nice episode so much tension, especially the last part in the burning building. My favourite part though was that finally in an undead/ zombie type show (or even movie) people realized that if you live somewhere where it gets below freezing in winter the infected stop being a threat. The Inuit must be doing just fine.

9 hours ago, maystone said:

According to a 2018 survey there were 393.3 million guns in the US. I'd been hearing more recently that that number is now 400 million. Now imagine how much ammo accompanies each gun. That's a whack of bullets. I mean it still beggars the question of how they're finding all of that ammo in their travels, but yeah - lots of bullets would still be in existence.

Lots of bullets and probably lots of dead people with Bill level supplies of guns and ammo.

[Demian]

10 hours ago, izabella said:

And why aren't there thousands of animals roaming around?  I would have thought they'd take over after humans became nearly nonexistent.

What I wonder is, if this fungus-thing has evolved to infect humans, why are there any other mammals around?  Shouldn't this fungus-thing also be taking out the rabbits, and the deer, and the cows, and the horses?

It's why I always end up hating zombie stories -- the zombie-causing agent should affect far more species, and it never, ever does.

[munchiewoman]

14 hours ago, Uncle JUICE said:

I mean can't there be ONE genuinely nice religious guy in any of these stories?

I say this as an atheist ...yes, why did they have to go there? I was hoping they would surprise me and he would be a good guy.  Even a good guy who has resorted to cannibalism.  That would have been intriguing.  People do bad things when they're trying to survive.   And then they made him truly evil and gross, and I was kind of disappointed.  I hope on rewatch someday it'll be better, but it did feel like overkill.  Even his intense desire for Ellie didn't feel real.  

But the acting, as usual, was amazing.  Bella's fear and desperation, both for Joel and her own survival, really came through the screen.

[40Love]

20 hours ago, CarpeFelis said:

22 hours ago, paigow said:

Where is everyone else? The Steakhouse / Temple is on fire and nobody cares to help...

Yes, I was surprised Ellie got to walk out and not be met by a crowd coming to put out the fire!

I suspect it was early morning and they were probably instructed to stay away. The pastor and his henchman were about slaughter Ellie for food.  Most of the flock didn’t know they were eating people. As David said, they are sheep, who do what they are told. 

Plus, most of the fighting and gun-toting members were killed by Joel and subsequently Ellie. The rest of the cult were elderly, kids and subservient women. They weren't going to stop Joel and Ellie anyway.

[Scaeva]

22 hours ago, Demian said:

You and me both.  In the world of this series, billions of people have been turned into mushroom farms, but the minute a horse gets shot to death, everyone's all, "OMG! The poor horsie! I HATE HBO!"

It's because animals, like small children, are truly innocent and entirely dependent on their caretakers. The horse's death would be more tragic than any of those of the adult humans involved in the story because it did not understand what was going on, had no "hand" in the events that led to it's death, and that death is ultimately senseless and came about because of a rather depressing tendency for humans to be selfish or violent.

Even if Joel had died this episode, the horse's death would be more tragic. The horse was innocent. Joel isn't.

[40Love]

3 minutes ago, munchiewoman said:

  14 hours ago, Uncle JUICE said:

I mean can't there be ONE genuinely nice religious guy in any of these stories?

I was pleasantly surprised that the town where Tommy lived seemed to be filled genuinely decent people. 

[Demian]

2 minutes ago, Scaeva said:

The horse's death would be more tragic than any of those of the adult humans involved in the story because it did not understand what was going on, had no "hand" in the events that led to it's death, and that death is ultimately senseless and came about because of a rather depressing tendency for humans to be selfish or violent.

A horse lacks the ability to be self-aware. I feel far more sorry for the humans who've been transformed into mushroom farms, and -- in this episode -- the humans who were targeted to become food.  Call me crazy.

[Scaeva]

23 hours ago, cardigirl said:

Maybe I missed it, but were the people being harvested? In other words, were they eating only people who died of "natural' causes or were they killing people for food?

I felt bad for the horse. 

I think it was a little bit of both.

Looking back now at the earlier episode where the older Native American couple told Joel & Ellie to head back east, instead of west, and that no one returns from crossing the river to the west....I think the implication now is that people who were crossing the river were encountering that other group of survivors, being killed, and then eaten.

[Scaeva]

6 minutes ago, Demian said:

A horse lacks the ability to be self-aware. I feel far more sorry for the humans who've been transformed into mushroom farms, and -- in this episode -- the humans who were targeted to become food.  Call me crazy.

Animals feel pain & fear, no different than humans. The horse however was innocent & had no hand in any of the violence. 
 

It's why in films like War Horse for example, the the plight of the horses is more tragic than that of the humans dying around it. Its the humans' war, not the horses.

[Demian]

3 minutes ago, Scaeva said:

It's why in films like War Horse for example, the the plight of the horses is more tragic than that of the humans dying around it. Its the humans' war, not the horses.

I'm guessing you had no relatives who died in WWI.

[Scaeva]

5 minutes ago, Demian said:

I'm guessing you had no relatives who died in WWI.

Have you ever been in the military?

I served in the US Marine Corps, and think the deaths of military working dogs is more tragic than that of the military personnel they serve beside in combat zones. That isn't to say that I don't find the death of people in war sad or tragic. But those wars are started by humans, not dogs, and a Marine who was killed in war at least knew the risks and enlisted of their own free will.

 

Edited March 7, 2023 by Scaeva

[Demian]

Not engaging on this, because you're definitely (and justifiably) going to win (A Marine? You win. Automatically.)  I still will, however, assert that people mean more than dogs. 

[Anela]

22 minutes ago, Scaeva said:

I think it was a little bit of both.

Looking back now at the earlier episode where the older Native American couple told Joel & Ellie to head back east, instead of west, and that no one returns from crossing the river to the west....I think the implication now is that people who were crossing the river were encountering that other group of survivors, being killed, and then eaten.

That's what I was thinking. They had to go in that direction, to get to the university, and the scientists who were supposed to be working on a cure, or a vaccine. Then they were attacked at the school. Since Ellie ran into them, hunting in the same area, they can't have gone that far, after he was stabbed. 

[snickers]

28 minutes ago, Scaeva said:

It's because animals, like small children, are truly innocent and entirely dependent on their caretakers

I take it you never been to Alaska? Montana? the Dakotas?

People from around there carry guns for a reason....

14 minutes ago, Scaeva said:

It's why in films like War Horse for example, the the plight of the horses is more tragic than that of the humans dying around it. Its the humans' war, not the horses.

I find this comment offensive, and I quite liked the movie War Horse plus I don't want to speak for Speilberg, but I don't think that was entirely his intention when he did the movie, plus the play is bit different than the movie, I personally think the intent of the movie was to bring awareness and appreciation to the what horses did and the role they played in all wars from WWI and before, but yes, seeing those horses getting worked to death lugging that heavy equipment around was brutal.  But humans dying in a world war, I would say, yeah, more tragic. 

Getting on topic...

I shouldn't be surprised more people seemed outraged about the horse dying compared to what David tried to do to Ellie 🤷🏽‍♀️

2 hours ago, Niuxita said:

nteresting how everyone immediately caught on to the fact that David 1) was a pedophile and 2) was about to rape Ellie.

For me the telltale sign was his "confessions" along with the touch he tried to do when he placed his hand on the bars. BUT, i didn't see the signs of the cannibalism....even when I was like, "wait, they didn't have the venison yet, do they?"

I should have seen that coming....

I'm surprised more weren't disturbed by the Ellie attempted rape/violence at the end.  I mean, I think everyone agrees she had to do it, but I'm surprised people were not turned off by that scene (as much as they were by the horse shooting scene 😶). 

I can't believe next week is the finale, I thought we had 10 episodes 😄

 

[Starchild]

18 minutes ago, Demian said:

I still will, however, assert that people mean more than dogs. 

Not bad people ;)

[Scaeva]

21 minutes ago, snickers said:

I take it you never been to Alaska? Montana? the Dakotas?

People from around there carry guns for a reason....

I find this comment offensive, and I quite liked the movie War Horse plus I don't want to speak for Speilberg, but I don't think that was entirely his intention when he did the movie, plus the play is bit different than the movie, I personally think the intent of the movie was to bring awareness and appreciation to the what horses did and the role they played in all wars from WWI and before, but yes, seeing those horses getting worked to death lugging that heavy equipment around was brutal.  But humans dying in a world war, I would say, yeah, more tragic. 

Getting on topic...

I shouldn't be surprised more people seemed outraged about the horse dying compared to what David tried to do to Ellie 🤷🏽‍♀️

 

 

People in Alaska, Montana, and the Dakotas need guns to defend themselves from domesticated horses?

I know you mean wild animals like bears (even though stastificallly attacks by bears are extraordinarily rare), but my post was clearly talking about domesticated ones.

I wasn't outraged by the horse's death. No animals were harmed in real life. I was just attempting to explain why people might find an animal's make pretend death on film, sadder than all those make pretend deaths of humans. Besides, all the humans that died in this episode were part of some cannibal cult being run by a creep.

What did you find offensive? I didn't say peoples' deaths in WW1 were not tragic. I just said the horses, unlike the people involved, were innocent, and that gives their deaths an extra layer of tragedy. 

Edited March 7, 2023 by Scaeva

[Anela]

17 minutes ago, snickers said:

 

I shouldn't be surprised more people seemed outraged about the horse dying compared to what David tried to do to Ellie 🤷🏽‍♀️

 

I don't think that's true. But I'm not up for a debate.

Edited March 7, 2023 by Anela

[Demian]

10 minutes ago, Scaeva said:

What did you find offensive?

Nothing!  I'm actually watching 9 to 5 right now.

Edited March 7, 2023 by Demian

[grawlix]

3 hours ago, Jodithgrace said:

The problem with fishing is that unless the lake was stocked with giant marlin, or some such, it would take a huge amount of normal sized fish to feed a group that size. And fishing in such cold weather isn’t easy. Hunting provides better buck for the bang. (Sorry) 

Admittedly, I'm not familiar with living in snow filled winters or by a lake.  But, wouldn't a body of water that size be attractive to various types of animals?  Does no one in the cult know about traps?  It seems like the group was heavily dependent on hunting and scavenging.

[paramitch]

1 hour ago, 40Love said:

I suspect it was early morning and they were probably instructed to stay away. The pastor and his henchman were about slaughter Ellie for food.  Most of the flock didn’t know they were eating people. As David said, they are sheep, who do what they are told. 

Plus, most of the fighting and gun-toting members were killed by Joel and subsequently Ellie. The rest of the cult were elderly, kids and subservient women. They weren't going to stop Joel and Ellie anyway.

I noticed that it was a wholly separate building but hadn't even thought of that. I think you make a terrific further point here that David and his lead henchmen (who were invested in keeping the "meat" secret) would have not allowed the other regular folks to enter outside of meal prep and mealtimes (and were probably brutal about enforcing that like they were about everything else). People probably actively avoided it altogether. (And again, it was only 3-4 minutes from fire start to Ellie's escape.)

1 hour ago, Scaeva said:

Looking back now at the earlier episode where the older Native American couple told Joel & Ellie to head back east, instead of west, and that no one returns from crossing the river to the west....I think the implication now is that people who were crossing the river were encountering that other group of survivors, being killed, and then eaten.

I don't think this really works logistically. The Indigenous couple were back in Wyoming, over 5 days' travel away on horseback. This is Colorado, and David's people are on foot and very limited in their hunting radius for that reason.

Maria also clarified in Jackson that they did deliberately leave the bodies of raiders and evil people out in the open as a warning to keep people discouraged from crossing the river or entering their town's vicinity. Which makes sense.

53 minutes ago, Anela said:

That's what I was thinking. They had to go in that direction, to get to the university, and the scientists who were supposed to be working on a cure, or a vaccine. Then they were attacked at the school. Since Ellie ran into them, hunting in the same area, they can't have gone that far, after he was stabbed. 

See above -- yes, Ellie and Joel didn't flee far from the CSU campus, but the people the Indigenous couple were talking about as "evil" weren't David's people, but Tommy's people, who are genuinely good people who just use the bodies of bad people as scare tactics. David's people are 3 states away and would never leave bodies out and about (since they were butchering and eating them).

44 minutes ago, snickers said:

I find this comment offensive, and I quite liked the movie War Horse plus I don't want to speak for Speilberg, but I don't think that was entirely his intention when he did the movie, plus the play is bit different than the movie, I personally think the intent of the movie was to bring awareness and appreciation to the what horses did and the role they played in all wars from WWI and before, but yes, seeing those horses getting worked to death lugging that heavy equipment around was brutal.  But humans dying in a world war, I would say, yeah, more tragic. 

Really? I really haven't seen anyone say outright that humans dying isn't tragic, just that they have a hard time watching animals die, and they felt bad for the horse. I mean, yeah, I've definitely seen plenty of people saying they felt worse for the horse than for David and the other evil henchmen, but that's not  all that surprising.

Meanwhile, Spielberg's film War Horse was lovely, but it was definitely markedly changed from Stafford's stage play (the National Theatre production is still one of the most beautiful and creative things I have ever seen onstage). And I do think it (ironically) made a point of showing that the horse's innocence did make its experience of the carnage of war a different kind of tragedy. Not the ONLY tragedy (of course the loss of life was as well). But still.

Quote

 

I shouldn't be surprised more people seemed outraged about the horse dying compared to what David tried to do to Ellie 🤷🏽‍♀️

 

But have we really seen more people upset over the horse dying specifically  than about Ellie's attempted rape? I mean, sure we've had some conversations about how hard it is to watch animals die onscreen, but that's not the same thing as the masses being hunky-dory with Ellie's trauma, either.

Quote

I'm surprised more weren't disturbed by the Ellie attempted rape/violence at the end.  I mean, I think everyone agrees she had to do it, but I'm surprised people were not turned off by that scene (as much as they were by the horse shooting scene 😶). 

I think there hasn't been a ton of discussion about Ellie's brutal killing of David precisely because it was so disturbing. That entire sequence was incredibly upsetting -- Ellie's near-death, her assault by David, her near-rape, her killing him in self-defense then being unable to stop herself from obliterating him -- it was horrifying and sad.

I hate watching Ellie descend into violence (even though she has had to simply to defend herself), because of course that is changing her, chipping away at what little innocence she has left.

By contrast, the sadness of many of us for the horse has simply been a lighter point of solidarity (sings "Bye Bye, Li'l Sebastian").

[snickers]

59 minutes ago, Scaeva said:

I know you mean wild animals like bears (even though stastificallly attacks by bears are extraordinarily rare), but my post was clearly talking about domesticated ones.

I was talking about wolves too, but I agree, those kinds of attacks are rare…..but….the Revenant 😉

 

1 hour ago, Scaeva said:

What did you find offensive? I didn't say peoples' deaths in WW1 were not tragic. I just said the horses, unlike the people involved, were innocent, and that gives their deaths an extra layer of tragedy. 

If you are talking about the soldiers specifically in the film, ok, but to give the general statement that humans are not innocent in war is incredibly offensive, I mean, let’s not go there with WW2….

11 minutes ago, grawlix said:

Admittedly, I'm not familiar with living in snow filled winters or by a lake.  But, wouldn't a body of water that size be attractive to various types of animals?  Does no one in the cult know about traps?  It seems like the group was heavily dependent on hunting and scavenging.

They didn’t seem like the brightest of the bunch-

[paramitch]

17 minutes ago, snickers said:

If you are talking about the soldiers specifically in the film, ok, but to give the general statement that humans are not innocent in war is incredibly offensive, I mean, let’s not go there with WW2….

Saying that horses are innocent is not saying that humans cannot also be innocent. Just that animals have a different kind of innocence. Not that no innocent human lives are lost in warfare, for goodness' sakes. I would imagine that's a pretty universally accepted concept.

I really don't see any genuine reason for outrage here. Some of us just really like animals and felt bad for the sweet loyal horse that saved Ellie and Joel.

[theredhead77]

I just want to clarify that I was not outraged they killed the horse. I am generally distressed by animals being hurt or killed in the media I watch. TWD was very difficult for me to watch. I’ll never watch Lassie, Black Beauty, Marley & Me, etc… and I’ll look at doesthedogdie.com when I’m concerned. That scene was distressing to me. 

David assaulting Ellie was also distressing. I’m not outraged by it, I’m not writing the network about it. One can be distressed without being outraged and they can be equally, or unequally distressed about individual events.

I forget. Do the clickers have self awareness of what happened to them or are they shells that are just driven to feed (zombies)?

 

 

 

[conquistador]

4 hours ago, Demian said:

What I wonder is, if this fungus-thing has evolved to infect humans, why are there any other mammals around?  Shouldn't this fungus-thing also be taking out the rabbits, and the deer, and the cows, and the horses?

It's why I always end up hating zombie stories -- the zombie-causing agent should affect far more species, and it never, ever does.

The real-life Cordyceps does seem to have predilection towards ants specifically (although other species can be infected by spores), so I assume that is the inspiration. At least we have an in-universe explanation for why the outbreak was only in humans (contamination of human food supply).

I immediately thought the monkeys at the research center had cordyceps, given how similar we are to them biologically.

Edited March 7, 2023 by conquistador

[CooperTV]

7 hours ago, shelley1234 said:

Now I'm a vegetarian so I don't want to eat any of it, but I'm also not living in a fungus zombie dystopian nightmare, so who knows how my morals would shake out about what I would or would not eat if I was.  

We aren't cannibals not because it's gross, but because it causes physical harm in the long run. Prions causing degenerative neurological deceases would make a great impact on a population that practices gastronomic or ritualistic cannibalism.

The same way incest is bad not because it's morally abhorrent but because it causes genetic defects and genetic deceases to increase in a population.

[MJ Frog]

20 hours ago, Uncle JUICE said:

What if he's a nice guy preacher, but their circumstances have forced cannibalism on them, and he hates it but can't tell anyone...or if he's not a preacher at all, he's just a guy who's a community leader, maybe like a former mayor. 

I enjoyed the episode, and I understand why the writers did what they did to get where they needed to go, but I have to admit this would have been a much more interesting choice for that character. And, possible unpopular opinion, if they aren't murdering people, cannibalism is a perfectly reasonable, if unsavory, option when faced with starvation. No pun intended.

Also, Joel did kinda feak me out a little in this episode. I genuinely felt bad for map pointy guy and didn't expect Joel to kill him. The man was restrained, injured, and terrified.

Had to forgive him a little when he said "baby girl" though. Those words were the best part of the episode.

[paigow]

2 hours ago, MJ Frog said:

Also, Joel did kinda feak me out a little in this episode. I genuinely felt bad for map pointy guy and didn't expect Joel to kill him. The man was restrained, injured, and terrified.

Like Thanos, Joel is inevitable... Anybody that tries to kill him gets no mercy

[shelley1234]

7 hours ago, snickers said:

BUT, i didn't see the signs of the cannibalism....even when I was like, "wait, they didn't have the venison yet, do they?"

I should have seen that coming....

I'm surprised more weren't disturbed by the Ellie attempted rape/violence at the end.  I mean, I think everyone agrees she had to do it, but I'm surprised people were not turned off by that scene (as much 😶

 

I knew they were eating people as soon as they asked when the body would be buried and the cagey way David answered.  

I was disturbed by the attempted rape and at least slightly comforted that Ellie fought him off and he didn't get to finish what he started.  

Ellie's violence when she killed him?  Totally understandable.  It was overkill, but also clearly showing her trauma and rage.  As a woman who has felt like prey more times than none, I get her.  And David deserved the worst death that he could get.  

I hope the rest of the town eats him.  

Edited March 7, 2023 by shelley1234
Editing the quote to what I was responding to

[Peace 47]

3 hours ago, MJ Frog said:

Also, Joel did kinda feak me out a little in this episode. I genuinely felt bad for map pointy guy and didn't expect Joel to kill him. The man was restrained, injured, and terrified.

I feel like kind of a psycho, but I didn’t feel sorry for either of these guys, even a little bit.  They were there to murder Joel.  Map guy still wasn’t giving Joel answers at first, saying he didn’t know anything about a girl, and Joel’s time was running out to find Ellie alive.  So of course he needed to go more extreme.  And Joel had to kill those guys because he couldn’t risk them escaping and coming after him.

Once again, Great job, Joel:  no notes.

It was so poignant about how protective Ellie was of Joel in this episode.  Trying to take care of him in miserable conditions; having “medicine” practically tumble out of her mouth as soon as David offered something to trade (like she couldn’t say it fast enough); drawing David’s group away from the house and making herself a literal target in the hopes that she could draw their attention away from Joel.  And that’s not even getting into the horrific trauma she suffered from David.  The way she left that last little bit of food on Joel’s blanket when he couldn’t even swallow water was so sad.  That poor kid.

Edited March 7, 2023 by Peace 47

[Uncle JUICE]

9 hours ago, munchiewoman said:

I say this as an atheist ...yes, why did they have to go there?

Samesies! :) 

 

3 hours ago, MJ Frog said:

And, possible unpopular opinion, if they aren't murdering people, cannibalism is a perfectly reasonable, if unsavory, option when faced with starvation.

I think it's an interesting opportunity miss, to have to explain how after all this time, this community somehow was able to feed themselves (we're in outbreak year what, 20 at least?), create a safe haven of sorts at this resort, but somehow couldn't figure out how to hunt animals, and store them. It's weird, and would have given the show a chance to explore another avenue you never expect in a zombie show. Instead it was like "this cannibal compound led by a religious zealot with evil intentions and who is also a pedophile and serial child rapist..." Guys, that's called a hat on a hat on a hat on a hat. Dial it back!

Someone upthread said it, and it's demonstrably true: basically two weeks after humans stop hanging around in an area, it's teeming with wildlife. There was a small town in Wales, I think, during the initial lockdown phases of Covid, I'm talking like August / September 2020, where because the people were sheltering in place and so few people were out, that these mountain goats basically just took up residence there. THat definitely would have happened in the environment we're talking about here. So either this weirdo was choosing cannibalism, or the resort is populated by people for whom natural selection is COMING.  

[CooperTV]

7 minutes ago, Uncle JUICE said:

So either this weirdo was choosing cannibalism, or the resort is populated by people for whom natural selection is COMING.  

I assume David chose cannibalism because it appealed to him specifically, with him being a serial killer and all. I mean, their group could go anywhere, they could hunt those university monkeys, or deer, or go fishing, whatever. Instead they tried to kill a man with a child and got really upset the man somehow fought back. Then they decided to eat Joel's "victim", again, instead of hunting monkeys or rabbits.

Edited March 7, 2023 by CooperTV

[Uncle JUICE]

5 minutes ago, CooperTV said:

I assume David chose cannibalism because it appealed to him specifically, with him being a serial killer and all.

Totally forgot he's also a serial killer and not just using bodies of the recently deceased. What a weird character choice, where his being a serial killer barely makes the list of villainous qualities!

[paigow]

Hunting wild monkeys is one thing, lab monkey meat might be worse than starvation...

[CooperTV]

6 minutes ago, paigow said:

Hunting wild monkeys is one thing, lab monkey meat might be worse than starvation...

While I kinda agree, are we sure this is not the next gen monkeys out there? They somehow managed to survive and procreate in this place. If the Cannibal Club people would know what monkeys are eating, maybe they could loot those places?

Edited March 7, 2023 by CooperTV

[Hanahope]

7 hours ago, CooperTV said:

We aren't cannibals not because it's gross, but because it causes physical harm in the long run. Prions causing degenerative neurological deceases would make a great impact on a population that practices gastronomic or ritualistic cannibalism

Isn't that were madcow disease came from?

[bitchin camaro]

13 hours ago, Niuxita said:

Interesting how everyone immediately caught on to the fact that David 1) was a pedophile and 2) was about to rape Ellie. When he said that about how the struggle was his favourite part, or something to that effect, my mind immediately went to "Oh so he was a serial killer." 

As soon as he said he used to be a teacher, I knew. And I bet he got fired for messing with kids. 

I'm not suggesting that male teachers are generally creepy, but the way he said it gave me the willies. The kind of dude who goes from being a teacher to being a preacher has a hard-on for power and authority and uses whatever is the currently socially acceptable position where he can put himself in proximity to people he can control. 

[Constantinople]

3 hours ago, paigow said:

Hunting wild monkeys is one thing, lab monkey meat might be worse than starvation...

 

3 hours ago, CooperTV said:

While I kinda agree, are we sure this is not the next gen monkeys out there? They somehow managed to survive and procreate in this place. If the Cannibal Club people would know what monkeys are eating, maybe they could loot those places?

We don't know if they're next generation monkeys, but the Fireflies are interested in finding a cure (according to Marlene), this appears to have been the headquarters for Firefly CDC for a time, and vaccines are tested on monkeys, so the monkeys Joel and Ellie saw may be the Firefly lab monkeys.

I have been wondering for a while what the Firefly CDC would do if Ellie were brought to them, particularly if they conclude that saving humanity and saving Ellie are incompatible.

This is uninformed speculation on my part. I haven't played the game, nor have I read about it. I don't know if Ellie ever will meet up with Firefly CDC and if so, what happens if she does.

[monakane]

This show!  I love it but I'm glad it's only 1 episode a week.  It's not a show I could binge.  It's too intense, so I'm glad to get a week's respite.  I stood up and cheered when Ellie killed that murdering pedophile rapist cannibal.  I got the pedo vibe from him in the beginning when he was talking to that little girl.  Excellent acting from everyone in that episode.

[calvinshobbes]

On 3/6/2023 at 4:26 AM, cardigirl said:

I have another question, something I thought about during the episode. Where are they getting all of their ammo from?  It's 20 years post pandemic, and I'm pretty sure the munitions factories are all shut down. Just curious. The colony didn't have enough food, but they had plenty of bullets.  I'm trying to figure that out.  LOL. 

When Joel sold the pills to the FEDRA soldier in the first episode, the soldier  talked about the factory in Atlanta that supposedly made just pills and bullets. I guess people still know what is most important 20 years into a zombie apocalypse 

Edited March 7, 2023 by calvinshobbes

[cardigirl]

16 minutes ago, calvinshobbes said:

When Joel sold the pills to the FEDRA soldier in the first episode, the soldier  talked about the factory in Atlanta that supposedly made just pills and bullets. I guess people still know what is most important 20 years into a zombie apocalypse 

Colorado, or wherever Joel and Ellie and that god-forsaken group of people are, is pretty far away from Atlanta. I'll buy that bullets are being made somewhere, but I doubt that they are easy to come by for small splinter groups. 

I realize that this show is based on a video game and shooting is a big part of that universe, so I'll try to stop questioning logical things. 🤪