S01.E07: VII

[formerlyfreedom]

Quote

Chase is forced to face the consequences for his past choices. Harper learns an impossible truth.

Airing Thursday, July 21, 2022 - season finale!

[Medicine Crow]

So glad the end is in sight.  I've burned enough daylight on this one ... all for the love of Jeff.

[AimingforYoko]

I was wondering if the math was ever right for Emily to actually be Dan (Johnny's) kid, and it looks like I should've been more skeptical. So why now, is Hamzad dying or something and wants an heir?

[WaltersHair]

3 hours ago, Medicine Crow said:

 ... all for the love of Jeff.

This, but I thought tonight was the finale. Now I have to wait another week?

People will complain this was dialogue heavy, and it was, but I loved it. All that truth spilling out. I was appreciative that they made the 'red shirt' guys smart too.

[AimingforYoko]

18 minutes ago, WaltersHair said:

This, but I thought tonight was the finale. Now I have to wait another week?

No, this was the season finale. The show's been renewed.

[LoveLeigh]

This episode was the season finale and it ended with a cliffhanger. 

I think it's all so stupid. I do not really care what happens next. 

[WaltersHair]

1 hour ago, AimingforYoko said:

No, this was the season finale. The show's been renewed.

I have little interest in watching the 'dads' go after Emily or Emily bonding with her bio dad.  Maybe they can pull a rabbit out of a hat and show us something new.

[aghst]

Emily has not one, not two, but three dads.

Called it a few episodes ago.  She was featured too much to play just a daughter role.  

And Harper said he figured out who she was when she was so curious about her mother, probably when he said those awful things about her wanting access to a Wal Mart and decided to fuck a CIA guy to get out of Afghanistan.

But how does a girl from two Afghani parents have freckles?  They're not fair skinned are they?

Old Hamzad is the guy who played Farouk in Legion IIRC.

Can't believe two ex military special ops guy just falls for the woman walking right in front of them and being bewildered that she's an assasin.

But still the biggest implausibility is how this old guy who doesn't look like the ruler of Afghanistan could pull all these strings to take out US citizens and federal officers.

Now you'd think she considers Chase and Harper more her fathers than Hamzad.  Yet she has the hijab on, ready to meet her real daddy.

But it's not like Hamzad abandoned her, she was ripped from him.

[voiceover]

I need to look up how far into shooting the series they’d been granted a Season Two.  I know there was a break after — four? — eps because of virus ish.  I assume they were offered it before filming the last ten minutes of tonight’s ep.  Because my reax to that final scene was: Oh, fuck you!

And not because I was super hyped for the next series.  

[themadman]

Show started out strong but lost me at the end. I have zero interest in a season 2. I too said "fuck you!" to that final scene.

[SlovakPrincess]

The Jeff Bridges / John Lithgow interaction made this episode 100% better than most of the other episodes.

Is the show trying to make me feel bad for Hamzad now?  Maybe it's just that the older Hamzad actor was really conveying a lot of emotion with his limited screen time.  Also ... Younger Hamzad wasn't entirely wrong that the ore deposits or whatever Abbey/Belour refused to tell him about could potentially save their country, and her refusal to trust him with that information (because she thinks it's somehow better to win little battles with his Afghan rivals while Russia continues to wage war on all of them) is ... well, it's a weird position to take.  Basically: "I think you should lead the country, but I don't think you can be trusted with this information about its natural resources that might actually help the country -- also I'm taking our kid and leaving with the ex-CIA guy."  I can sort of see why he's mad.  

It's a little bizarre that this whole story uses Afghanistan as a backdrop ... while completely ignoring last two decades of history in the country.  How does Hamzad figure into that?  And how does Hamzad have all this power to pull strings with Bote and the US government?  

Do Chase and Harper have a  plan at the end of the episode, as they walk slowly into the sunset, patting each other on the back?  I assume they're going to confront Hamzad and find Emily but that was a strange last scene to end on.  

[cardigirl]

5 hours ago, aghst said:

Now you'd think she considers Chase and Harper more her fathers than Hamzad.  Yet she has the hijab on, ready to meet her real daddy.

But it's not like Hamzad abandoned her, she was ripped from him.

One reviewer said it will be interesting next season to see if she is still on mission, in other words, if she's still planning on killing Hamzad. 

And apparently Chase and Harper are on their way to find her, rather than heading home. 

While most viewers had already figured out that Angela/Emily was Hamzad's biological daughter, I had no idea she had already been born. How terrible for Hamzad, to lose his daughter like that. It seems that the entire first season was setting up the real story and next season will tell the rest.

I will watch for it. 

[seacliffsal]

5 minutes ago, cardigirl said:

While most viewers had already figured out that Angela/Emily was Hamzad's biological daughter, I had no idea she had already been born. How terrible for Hamzad, to lose his daughter like that. It seems that the entire first season was setting up the real story and next season will tell the rest.

Yes to this.  I think most of figured out that Emily/Angela/whomever was really Hamzad's daughter and agreed that the only surprise was that she was already born.  So, if the writers thought this was going to be the most shockingest shocking cliffhanger ever-they were wrong.  It was more of a letdown as I was hoping there would be a surprising turn of events and there wasn't.  I am out for the second season as I don't need to see a season's worth of "why didn't you tell me, you always told me you would only tell me the truth, yada, yada, yada..."  I also don't need to see an instant family with Zoe stepping in as 'mom.'  

I think the only thing that could have saved this season for me would have been if they had brought the dogs with them as they pursued Hamzad as the dogs were the best part of the show.

[dubbel zout]

7 hours ago, aghst said:

Emily has not one, not two, but three dads.

Is there a book for this? Heh.

7 hours ago, aghst said:

she has the hijab on

It was a scarf, not a hijab. Angela is in a place where it's expected for women to cover their heads, and regardless of her personal feelings, I can see her being culturally sensitive enough to take the scarf when offered it. Why needlessly antagonize people just to make a point?

The "cliffhanger" was pretty anticlimactic. I don't know if I'm in for the second season or not. I'll probably watch a few episodes to see where they decide to take the story.

[Zaffy]

So Emily/Angela/Parwana is Hamzad's kid.
But is she???
I wouldn't rule Pavlovich out of the who's the father game. I mean why not? 
Now I want 2nd season to be "Mamma Mia" in Afghanistan. That I would watch.
And maybe another potential father might appear! Abbey seemed to be a busy bee!
 

p.s.1  So Hamzad did ALL this in order to get his daughter (but is she?) home. I mean why not just kidnap her or travel to US to meet her?

p.s.2  Emily/Angela/Parwana (or even maybe Tatiana?) will need some serious therapy after all this. She will end up killing all 3 (or it 4?) dads of hers, right?

[seacliffsal]

I also questioned why Hamzad waited until now to find his daughter-he has known for 20 years that his wife took his daughter, so why now?

[Razzberry]

Hazben seems totally dominated by his wife, which is not a good look for a warlord.  You'd think the daughter's freckles would make him wonder about the baby-daddy, but I guess DNA kits don't exist there?   All this stupidity could have been easily avoided.

We're back to this "little girl" nonsense..

Sez you.  Look, she's a woman in her thirties and a federal agent.  Frankly I don't give a damn.  Her father could have been anyone, most likely of European ancestry.

[Affogato]

Oddly enough, and piqued by the many comments, I did a crude search for 'Afghan skin' (yes, I didn't think it would work) and got a number of pictures of people from Afghanistan, and many of them had the same markings, whether they are freckles or not. I don't know what the actress's background is, but it seems in keeping with the character.

In one scene (in an earlier episode) there is a woman holding a baby in the background, while young'Chase' was talking to young Hamzad. I'd assumed it was another woman, but it probably was Emily and Abby, and probably was a clue.

I imagine that Hamzad only now found out about her and I still wonder if Abby, in her dementia, hadn't called him, starting the wheels in motion--and maybe making him also think about the assets his wife stole.

1 hour ago, seacliffsal said:

I also questioned why Hamzad waited until now to find his daughter-he has known for 20 years that his wife took his daughter, so why now?

I'd guess because he didn't know where they were until recently.

Edited July 22, 2022 by Affogato

[Iceman13]

Was the Thomas Perry book that this was based on this badly written?

[dubbel zout]

4 minutes ago, Affogato said:

1 hour ago, seacliffsal said:

I also questioned why Hamzad waited until now to find his daughter-he has known for 20 years that his wife took his daughter, so why now?

I'd guess because he didn't know where they were until recently.

He also likely didn't know her current name(s). Chase arranged it so that "Emily" was dead, so if Hamzah was able to track her that far, it would have made it almost impossible to find her as "Angela."

[aghst]

I don't think Afghanis are Arab?

So they're surrounded by Iran to the west, Pakistan to the East and Central Asian republics like Tajikistan and Uzbekistan to the north.

Quote

The population of Afghanistan is around 40 million as of 2021.[1] The nation is composed of a multi-ethnic and multilingual society, reflecting its location astride historic trade and invasion routes between Central Asia, South Asia, and Western Asia. Ethnic groups in the country include Pashtun, Tajik, Hazara, Uzbeks, Nuristanis, Aimaq, Turkmen, Baloch and some others which are less known.[6][7][8] Together they make up the contemporary Afghan people.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Afghanistan

The actress playing the young Belour was born in Lebanon.

The actor playing young Hamzad is Iranian-American, born in San Jose, CA, according to the Wiki, who played tennis at San Diego State.

The actress playing Emily was born in Riverside, CA, to an Iraqi father and a mother with Irish, Norwegian and Italian ancestry.  She was a child actress and she played Maebe as a young girl on Arrested Development.

The old Hamzad isn't credited but pretty sure he is Navid Negbahan, the Iranian actor who played Farouk in Legion.

I guess there are far more actors of Arab or Iranian ancestry than those of Afghani descent.  Possibly they could use Pakistani or Indian actors but their accented English is different from the accent that Arabs have when they speak English.

[Auntie Anxiety]

Second season? Yeah, no thanks. The first one was bad enough. I feel like an idiot for watching all seven episodes. Pure, unadulterated dreck. 

[LoveLeigh]

11 minutes ago, Auntie Anxiety said:

Second season? Yeah, no thanks. The first one was bad enough. I feel like an idiot for watching all seven episodes. Pure, unadulterated dreck. 

What is amazing is that the first two episodes were so great. 

[Auntie Anxiety]

37 minutes ago, LoveLeigh said:

What is amazing is that the first two episodes were so great. 

Yes, I agree. Perhaps it was all the critics were given to watch and they based their reviews on those episodes. But things quickly went downhill after that. And even though it might be a minority opinion, I think Jeff Bridges’ acting left a lot to be desired. The thing he does with his mouth (like a elderly person who doesn’t have any teeth) is distracting. His body seems to be riddled with arthritis (walking looked soooo painful). I know he had had a bout of non-Hodgkins lymphoma as well as Covid, which might have taken a toll on him physically. A second season is a hard no from me.

[Rickster]

39 minutes ago, LoveLeigh said:

What is amazing is that the first two episodes were so great. 

I’ve had a lot of complaints about this show, mostly around the dialogue, but to me, one critical plot mistake was changing who we thought Chase was, from a retired spy/operative in a house in the woods, to a gazillionaire with luxury apartments and private planes at his beck and call. I guess the writers thought this was a clever plot twist, but to me, it totally upset my expectations about who he was and how the plot might develop, and not in a way that made any logical sense.

[SusieQ]

1 hour ago, Auntie Anxiety said:

Second season? Yeah, no thanks. The first one was bad enough. I feel like an idiot for watching all seven episodes. Pure, unadulterated dreck. 

Everybody, thanks for the update. I didn't watch this episode and now I can save myself the time to do ANYTHING else!

I thought this was going to happen--- once they said it was renewed. I'm guessing this is not how the book ended. My understanding is that Thomas Perry is well regarded mystery writer. Sure wouldn't guess it by this show.

[Affogato]

59 minutes ago, Rickster said:

I’ve had a lot of complaints about this show, mostly around the dialogue, but to me, one critical plot mistake was changing who we thought Chase was, from a retired spy/operative in a house in the woods, to a gazillionaire with luxury apartments and private planes at his beck and call. I guess the writers thought this was a clever plot twist, but to me, it totally upset my expectations about who he was and how the plot might develop, and not in a way that made any logical sense.

Odd because that makes all the sense to me.  They would have more than one alias. Raising Emily without attracting attention makes sense, once she was in upper schools. Since they have assets being able to manage them makes sense. There are probably other alias we haven’t seen. The money means you can have boltholes for you and emily. 
 

the clincher is the source of the riches probably is what makes it worth Hamzad’s while to pursue them. 

[Rickster]

25 minutes ago, Affogato said:

Odd because that makes all the sense to me.  They would have more than one alias. Raising Emily without attracting attention makes sense, once she was in upper schools. Since they have assets being able to manage them makes sense. There are probably other alias we haven’t seen. The money means you can have boltholes for you and emily. 
 

the clincher is the source of the riches probably is what makes it worth Hamzad’s while to pursue them. 

I don’t disagree with this, exactly. My point is more that if you go back to the first two episodes, Chase turned out to be a very different character than they led us to expect. I did expect plot twists, but the way they unfolded failed (for me) to logically connect to the character we saw at the beginning.

[Dowel Jones]

11 hours ago, SlovakPrincess said:

Do Chase and Harper have a  plan at the end of the episode, as they walk slowly into the sunset, patting each other on the back?

They were at an airport and there was an earlier scene where Chase said he had to meet an airplane, or else...

Plot twist - Two weeks after Emily is returned to Hamzad, a phone call is placed to Harper.  "Listen, can you take her back? This ain't happenin' "

[Zaffy]

3 hours ago, Rickster said:

but to me, one critical plot mistake was changing who we thought Chase was, from a retired spy/operative in a house in the woods, to a gazillionaire with luxury apartments and private planes at his beck and call

Actually that was one of the few things making sense. What didn't make sense was Dan renting a house from someone like Zoe. 
With his income he could have had a few places ready, not necessarily lux ones, but discreet enough (like the owner not living next to him or not having to meet an owner at all). But the script wanted him to meet Zoe....
Of course the biggest WTF was deciding to go out with her for dinner.

[SlovakPrincess]

1 hour ago, Rickster said:

I don’t disagree with this, exactly. My point is more that if you go back to the first two episodes, Chase turned out to be a very different character than they led us to expect. I did expect plot twists, but the way they unfolded failed (for me) to logically connect to the character we saw at the beginning.

This was definitely my reaction as well.  And I’m not sure why Chase had unlimited funds — maybe I’m just blanking on this and it was explained … but it couldn’t be from whatever ore deposits Abbey knew about because how on earth would she and Chase access / get money for them when they had to run away in the night and go directly into hiding?

(I fully admit I may just be a dummy… also I space out during the episodes, which doesn’t help).

Edited July 22, 2022 by SlovakPrincess

[aghst]

This show was probably pitched as a multi season show, with outlines of each season that FX knew about and agreed to.

Most of the time, networks announce renewal while the current season is airing or right after conclusion.

But sometimes, they announce it ahead of time like Slow Horses on Apple TV +, they said there would be two seasons, not long after the show became available for streaming.

I assume most of the plot points are in the book not likely the show runners are making major changes. Heard somewhere that Zoe had a very minor character in the book for instance.  But Emily getting abducted and Chase going after her is probably what happens in the book?

[WritinMan]

Wow. The show started so strong and then collapsed into boring stupidity. I mean, you can be either boring or stupid, but both? Come on, man.

I won't be returning for season 2.

Edited July 23, 2022 by WritinMan

[dubbel zout]

15 hours ago, Zaffy said:

With his income he could have had a few places ready, not necessarily lux ones, but discreet enough (like the owner not living next to him or not having to meet an owner at all). But the script wanted him to meet Zoe....

Zoe wasn't supposed to be in the house next door. But as you wrote, the script wanted Chase to meet her. I like Amy Brenneman, but I think she was wasted in the show. Unless there's some twist with her character in the second season, I don't need to see Zoe again. And even if there is a twist, it will annoy me, so, see ya, Zoe!

[bankerchick]

Have Jeff Bridges and John Lithgow agreed to come back for Season 2?  I can see them signing on for a short series based on their probably reading the synopsis (or hearing the pitch) and maybe the script for episode 1, but I have to think by the time they were filming episodes 5-7, they were just getting through it thinking 'no fucking way am I coming back for season 2 of this.'

[Razzberry]

Bridges and Lithgow are the only reasons I watched the entire season, even though Bridges was unfortunately somewhat limited.  Lithgow turned out to be my favorite player, but only because he's the most emo-driven master spy I've ever seen and it's unintentionally hilarious.   Little wonder he felt an instant kinship with Angela, who physically assaults her instructor for calling her Freckles.  He can't even take a phone call without almost coming undone.

[aghst]

Yeah the blubbering is kind of hard to believe.

He's surrounded by macho, former special ops types.

Hard to believe he'd be respected if he's often seen being emotional.

[isalicat]

Yah, I don't know what to say about this...I simply loved the first episode and then felt like the show had turned into a simulcrum of itself. The worst part was the Zoe character being dragged along and then the really stupid conversations about whatever "gift" she might have blah blah blah who cares and what has this to do with anything else? If I watch season 2 it will because the guy from Legion is in it now and maybe if it gets surreal enough, Villanelle will pop up! (a girl can dream...:)

[ferjy]

Oh great, road trip! Perfect setting for more yammering. And there it was. 

“I used to spend a day blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah...” 

I have never seen a set of more loquacious people. Constantly relating yet another story or dream. All soooooo long. 

And now a second series coming.  {{cries}}

Had to laugh after Harper maneuvered away from the police..

“Not bad.”

“Fuck you.”

It was the best conversation they’ve had. Certainly the most concise!

On 7/22/2022 at 8:10 PM, WritinMan said:

Wow. The show started so strong and then collapsed into boring stupidity. I mean, you can be either boring or stupid, but both? Come on, man.

I won't be returning for season 2.

It was so slow, I actually watched the shootout. 😄 I always zip by shoot’em ups. 

[alvajon]

On 7/22/2022 at 1:25 PM, Auntie Anxiety said:

The thing he does with his mouth (like a elderly person who doesn’t have any teeth) is distracting.

I agree, very distracting-- maybe supposed to be a trait of the character, or maybe there are teeth missing.  And the scruffy beard makes it worse, you never see his teeth.

Also, was it decided that there were only two plane tickets purchased, or three? Knowing now that Emily was Hamzad’s child, she would have been the third ticket, but I thought Chase told Harper that there were only two.    

Zoe’s makeup does look pasty and overdone.

John Lithgow reminds me of Rudy Giuliani (looks only).  I loved Lithgow in both Harry and the Hendersons and the evil bad buy in Cliffhanger.  

[Mr. R0b0t]

Maybe Angela has a map to the gold tattooed on her back.

[dubbel zout]

5 hours ago, alvajon said:

Also, was it decided that there were only two plane tickets purchased, or three? Knowing now that Emily was Hamzad’s child, she would have been the third ticket, but I thought Chase told Harper that there were only two.

The passenger list showed two people—Chase and Hamzad's wife—but maybe Chase was able to talk Emily onto the plane. I think this one of those things we're supposed to hand wave.

[cardigirl]

2 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

The passenger list showed two people—Chase and Hamzad's wife—but maybe Chase was able to talk Emily onto the plane. I think this one of those things we're supposed to hand wave.

Chase said he almost asked for a third ticket because it was such a long flight, but he didn't want anyone to know that they were bringing Emily along. The plan was to kill Hamzad, I don't think Harper knew that there was a child involved. Requesting a third ticket would have raised questions. 

[Ottis]

On 7/21/2022 at 9:14 PM, WaltersHair said:

People will complain this was dialogue heavy, and it was, but I loved it.

So did I. I almost gave up on this show 3 eps in, but stuck with it. It's a mix of Tyrant (a show I really enjoyed overall, especially the two brothers) and Jason Bourne, and whatever show is about old guys. 

I can handwave old men as action heroes. Yeah, unlikely, but wisdom and experience carries the day, whatever. 

I still am not sold on whatever Hamzad's motivation is. And why he is choosing to pursue it this way.

And I liked that Zoe "had talent," but the matter came up too late and was then dropped as quickly. It needed more of a slow build. 

If the show can lean into wisdom/experience more, and develop Zoe more, and perhaps move away from Emily as a trophy for everyone, it has a chance to get better.

[dubbel zout]

11 minutes ago, cardigirl said:

Requesting a third ticket would have raised questions.

A big one of mine is how did Emily get on the plane if there was no ticket for her? She was old enough to have her own seat. I suppose Chase could have paid out of pocket, but Emily should have been added to the flight list. That's what I mean about hand waving. The point of all of that was to find out Emily was Hamzad's daughter and his wife took her to America with Chase. A plot point shouldn't raise more questions than it answers.

[Affogato]

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

A big one of mine is how did Emily get on the plane if there was no ticket for her? She was old enough to have her own seat. I suppose Chase could have paid out of pocket, but Emily should have been added to the flight list. That's what I mean about hand waving. The point of all of that was to find out Emily was Hamzad's daughter and his wife took her to America with Chase. A plot point shouldn't raise more questions than it answers.

Currently children up to 24 months don't need a plane ticket. These days they may require some documentation, but the trip in this story was a relatively long time ago. Someone might want to buy a seat for a child under two years simply to get them off their laps for part of the trip.

1 hour ago, Ottis said:

So did I. I almost gave up on this show 3 eps in, but stuck with it. It's a mix of Tyrant (a show I really enjoyed overall, especially the two brothers) and Jason Bourne, and whatever show is about old guys. 

I can handwave old men as action heroes. Yeah, unlikely, but wisdom and experience carries the day, whatever. 

I still am not sold on whatever Hamzad's motivation is. And why he is choosing to pursue it this way.

And I liked that Zoe "had talent," but the matter came up too late and was then dropped as quickly. It needed more of a slow build. 

If the show can lean into wisdom/experience more, and develop Zoe more, and perhaps move away from Emily as a trophy for everyone, it has a chance to get better.

I like the idea that I may be wrong, but I still maintain that Abbey is still screwing Hamzad and Chase around and that part of the story will be their changing views of her and what happened. I think Zoe is going to end up contacting Bote and learning to play the game on her own, in the states. I think she will pick up the dogs, and I still wonder if Waters isn't a person of interest.

[dubbel zout]

Emily seemed like an older child to me—say, 4—but whatever. It's a giant hand wave for me.

[aghst]

13 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

Emily seemed like an older child to me—say, 4—but whatever. It's a giant hand wave for me.

I think the 2 tickets, 3 passengers is just a narrative device for slowly revealing that Emily was already born when Belour and Chase fled Afghanistan.

[Affogato]

29 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

Emily seemed like an older child to me—say, 4—but whatever. It's a giant hand wave for me.

the only reason I suspect she might be older is that she runs the same background narrative that ran at the very beginning with Chase, as she first sees Hamzad--as if she remembered him as a father. I think someone less than two would have hazier memories. It will be important, I think, when we learn how old she was when she was taken and how well she remembers Hamzad.

That said, how old kids look is relative. I grew up in an area with kids that grew tall fairly young, I can't tell how old most children are because so many of them seem tiny.

Edited July 25, 2022 by Affogato

[bankerchick]

3 hours ago, Ottis said:

It needed more of a slow build. 

You sure can't say that about 99% of this show.

I thought I might re-watch the series, and pay attention this time, until I saw Ep 7 and realized it really wasn't worth it.  I went on a website (Decider?  Something like that) because it promised to explain a lot of stuff, but the writers were such fangirls of the show (spectacular, riveting, 'caught your breath yet?') that I figured they must be talking about a different show and their explanations were just as unclear.