Figure Skating

[Rootbeer]

11 minutes ago, absnow54 said:

The Free Dance is airing after the Super Bowl! Crazy coincidence! 

Especially considering this was not NBC's year to broadcast the Super Bowl.  They rotate coverage with the other networks that cover the NFL and actually traded with one of the other networks to get the Super Bowl broadcast for 2022.  And, as luck would have it, the Olympics are happening right at  the same time!  And the ice dance finals are taking place live right after the Super Bowl, during primetime in the US!  It really is incredible, isn't it?

[Guest]

49 minutes ago, Jeddah said:

You really can’t ever know what would have happened. Before the competition everyone in the world thought the US was a lock for women’s gymnastics gold, and turns out they weren’t! We don’t know how another skater would have done. In 2018 nobody thought Nathan would bomb in the team competition. I love, love, love Mirai, but I never thought she’d rise to the occasion like that and beat Kaori and Carolina Kostner in the team competition. This time I don’t think anyone predicted the US winning both times in ice dance. We don’t know for certain how Anna and Sasha would have skated. It’s not guaranteed that Russia would have won no matter what.

Yes, I think we can speculate that the Russians would have won either way, but it wouldn't be acceptable for the IOC to base anything off of that. If she's doped, the team medal needs to be voided- no questions asked imo.  (Which counts for nothing)

[Minneapple]

18 minutes ago, Good Queen Jane said:

Enough with the doping! There is more skating to watch. It's interesting that, other than the Free Dance, the rest of the skating competitions will take place in the evening in China which means the live skating will be broadcast in the wee hours of the morning in the USA. Of course, realistically Dance is the only other place the USA has a chance to medal. Funny how that worked out for NBC.

Former NBC Sports chairman Dick Ebersol convinced the IOC to not only move swimming and gymnastics for the 2008 Summer Games to American primetime, he convinced them to get China to move the Olympics from September to August (because NBC did not want to compete with the NFL for viewers in September). Remember NBC is spending more money to televise the games than any other network in any other country by far, so the IOC gives them a little pat on the back for that.

[absnow54]

7 minutes ago, ShellsandCheese said:

In theory but results can be voided for up to ten years after competition. So this doesn’t serve anyones purpose either…..

But if it had happened after the games, there would be far less brouhaha. If it hadn't come out yet, the Russian figure skaters would have continued to get a tongue bath by the commentators throughout the rest of the competition, and KV would have been lauded as the greatest female skater of all time, and had all the televised glory. Not many people are paying attention when medals are taken away after the fact.

[galaxygirl76]

3 hours ago, CeeBeeGee said:

Thank you! I am seeing a fair amount of "well, she should've known what she was putting into her body" and "she's old enough to compete so she's responsible." This is fucking RUSSIA! No, she is not responsible! She has almost no agency in that system! No, I don't think she should be able to compete; yes, I think the team scores (and Euros, etc.) should be voided. But leave her the hell alone! She is not the problem. It's fucking Russia--as always. They ruin everything. And they need to be kicked out in a meaningful way. They obviously haven't learned anything.

This is a girl who's told what to eat, what to drink, what to wear, what music to use, what choreo to use. She likely has very little agency about what's going on in her life. 

2 hours ago, Lady Whistleup said:

We can take it seriously without giving out lifetime bans to athletes.

It's not slander. It's pretty well-known by anyone who has eyes. There's so much doping that happens in sports, and 99.9% of it is never caught. 

Ben Johnson only got caught because he took his steroids too close to the Olympics after being told not to do so. Lance Armstrong never officially tested positive but we learned later those positive tests got buried by the UCI. Marion Jones never tested positive and lost all her medals. 

[Lady Whistleup]

For those wondering about the radio silence from other athletes, a picture like this explains it:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CZyWK7eoxjt/

It's Sasha Trusova congratulating Nathan Chen.

Skaters are actually incredibly close. Yes there are rivalries and not everyone is best buddies. But most of these skaters have been touring together, staying in the same hotels for meets, hanging out backstage, for years. 

[KittenPokerCheater]

Here’s thing:  My European friends, and my Asian friends (all who live there) complain to me about how American kids are infantalized and kept “young” as opposed to being strong and adult by 14.  So, I do find is feasible that Kamala knew she was taking banned substances.

My heart breaks for her, because I still don’t think she should skate.  

And unfortunately I will now be looking at all her past performances/competitions wondering how she would be skating if she skated clean.  She is immensely talented.

When it comes to doping.  Part of the reason it’s even more rampant in swimming/track/field is because it’s almost impossible to make any kind of money at the sport  unless you’re famous for winning.  And when you loose by .03 seconds and now you won’t be famous (with lucrative things like cover of Wheatis box, dancing with stars, commercials etc) the temptation must be extreme.

[Avaleigh]

1 hour ago, Jeddah said:

You really can’t ever know what would have happened. Before the competition everyone in the world thought the US was a lock for women’s gymnastics gold, and turns out they weren’t! We don’t know how another skater would have done. In 2018 nobody thought Nathan would bomb in the team competition. I love, love, love Mirai, but I never thought she’d rise to the occasion like that and beat Kaori and Carolina Kostner in the team competition. This time I don’t think anyone predicted the US winning both times in ice dance. We don’t know for certain how Anna and Sasha would have skated. It’s not guaranteed that Russia would have won no matter what.

Agreed. There's no point in having a competition at all if the results are already predetermined. Yes, it's unlikely that one of the US ladies will medal but you never know. I certainly wouldn't have predicted Karen's fourth place finish at worlds last year. I thought for sure that Hanyu would medal. I didn't think he'd win but I felt fairly confident that he'd get second,maybe third if he had an off day.

I know the assumption is that Trusova will medal but she's good for a once a year meltdown. Anna has had a couple of rocky skates too this season. You never know. You Young, Kaori, Loena, Wakaba Higuichi, and Alysa (assuming her jumps are fully rotated) all have a reasonable chance at making the podium. Mariah and Karen shouldn't be 100% out of the conversation either even though it is extremely unlikely. As they say, you never know what can happen.

[NUguy514]

2 hours ago, ShellsandCheese said:

Yeah. No need for a lifetime ban for a 15 year old with one bad test.

"One bad test"?  No, this wasn't a one-time situation; she's been doping for however long Eteri has been forcing this shit into her body, and it's just one more piece of evidence that Russia is systematically doping its elite athletes.  I'm not saying a lifetime ban is appropriate for her specifically (although I agree that a two-year suspension is effectively a lifetime ban in that horrible, abusive system); rather, Russia and every single one of its athletes should be kicked out of the Olympics for at least four years.

And I'm sorry, but swapping Kamila out for Anna or Sasha in the team event just replaces one doper with another – different players, same result, and it does affect the other teams.  The entire Russian team is on something, and it's incredibly naive for anyone (not directing that at you, just to be clear) to assume any of them is clean.  I can't imagine what is being pumped into Nikita to try to get his back through his two ice dance routines.

As far as why the positive test finally came to light so long after the sample was taken, it's my understanding that figure skaters are, indeed, low on the totem pole since there isn't an obvious history of doping the way there is in track and field or cycling.  However, once Russia won the team even, all of the athletes on the winning team had their samples bumped to the front of the line because they were now Olympic medalists (meaning it's extra important that these athletes are clean).  It's not the Swedish WADA lab's fault, really; this just seems to be the protocol.

[JTMacc99]

As is the case everywhere here in the Primetimer Forums, we expect everybody to feel free to express their opinions about anybody they see on TV.  We also expect everybody to treat other posters with the same respect they expect for themselves.

In short, it means we expect everybody to have discussions with others without making it personal with them, making passive-aggressive jabs, and/or mocking the opinions of others. 

Inability to follow these rules will result in posts being removed and be subject to further moderation actions.

 

[HartofDixie]

Great thread to read on Eteri and the Sambo 70 club.

https://twitter.com/mossyzinc/status/1492138622270812169

 

[Rootbeer]

1 hour ago, Lady Whistleup said:

For those wondering about the radio silence from other athletes, a picture like this explains it:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CZyWK7eoxjt/

It's Sasha Trusova congratulating Nathan Chen.

Skaters are actually incredibly close. Yes there are rivalries and not everyone is best buddies. But most of these skaters have been touring together, staying in the same hotels for meets, hanging out backstage, for years. 

These people are also deep in the midst of the most important competition in their lives, there is no final decision yet, the IOC has yet to make any sort of detailed statement about the actual allegations and consequences.  None of the skaters involved should be discussing it at all publicly.  It adds nothing but a distraction to what is already a very stressful time for them, friends or not.

It's like when someone in Hollywood gets accused of being abusive, the press immediately runs after everyone who's ever worked with them and asks their opinion.  It's why we get stuck with stupid remarks like, 'He was always nice to me' and 'I never saw anything'.  None of them should say a word until the facts are out there and we know the outcome.

[annzeepark914]

15 hours ago, Chaser said:

You have to marvel at the audacity of Russia. You get “banned” for cheating, your athlete gets caught cheating and you lift the automatic suspicion after a day in clown court. All on the worlds biggest stage. It’s just WOW.

Look up the word "chutzpah" in the dictionary & you'll see the Russian flag. Winning by any means is all that matters to them. Russia needs to be completely *out* of the Olympics for the next 10 or so years. And no more Olympics held in countries with dictators. 

[Guest]

19 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

Look up the word "chutzpah" in the dictionary & you'll see the Russian flag. Winning by any means is all that matters to them. Russia needs to be completely *out* of the Olympics for the next 10 or so years. And no more Olympics held in countries with dictators. 

At this point, I think the ISU needs to go farther and ban them from all international competitions for a full Olympic cycle, and the IOC needs to fully ban them from the Olympics without anything like the ROC competitors.

[ML89]

16 hours ago, ShellsandCheese said:

They all need to get their stuff together. Why is a sample taken on December 25th just being tested after the Olympics started on Feb. 8th - it might be the rules but that’s a dumb rule.

Reminds me of how Justify's doping test from the Santa Anita Derby that would have disqualified him from the Kentucky Derby was sort of mysteriously buried....

 

 

[Minneapple]

I can't help but think that NBC is totally relishing this drama. I bet they're furious at themselves for not pushing to have the ladies' final in primetime.

[Chaser]

Tara posted about the controversy on her IG. In summary, Kamila is just 15 years old on a big stage under lots of pressure but there is no place for a positive drug test at the Olympics. 

I’m kind of surprised she said something. Johnny is still silent. 

[Sarahsmile416]

3 minutes ago, Chaser said:

Tara posted about the controversy on her IG. In summary, Kamila is just 15 years old on a big stage under lots of pressure but there is no place for a positive drug test at the Olympics. 

I’m kind of surprised she said something. Johnny is still silent. 

He’s in mourning.  

[scarynikki12]

25 minutes ago, Minneapple said:

I can't help but think that NBC is totally relishing this drama. I bet they're furious at themselves for not pushing to have the ladies' final in primetime.

It occurs to me that NBC will want to show the medal ceremony with maximum drama so we should really be on them to get the team gold taken away.

[Jillibean]

4 hours ago, Lady Whistleup said:

For those wondering about the radio silence from other athletes, a picture like this explains it:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CZyWK7eoxjt/

It's Sasha Trusova congratulating Nathan Chen.

Skaters are actually incredibly close. Yes there are rivalries and not everyone is best buddies. But most of these skaters have been touring together, staying in the same hotels for meets, hanging out backstage, for years. 

I completely agree with the spirit of this comment, but I don't think Nathan and Sasha actually know each other well, or really at all. The "backstage" footage shows her sort of shyly trying to get his attention, him sort of nodding and then continuing to walk, and then her getting his attention again and holding out her phone where she had clearly used a translator to communicate whatever she wanted to say to him (presumably congratulations). It was actually very sweet and endearing, but also didn't suggest that they have much prior knowledge of each other. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that the Eteri girls are kept fairly isolated from other skaters during their competitive years. 

But yes, I think skaters are not going to be quick to say anything negative about another skater, especially knowing the particular limitations in free will experienced by athletes from countries like Russia where all training is state sponsored and overseen. 

[Domenicholas]

Something that just came to mind: Regardless of what happens, will any of the skaters associated with Eteri get the scores they're accustomed to?

Sure, their technical contents are a cut above the rest, but their massive scores are often due to high GOE and PCS. Is it possible, either unconsciously or deliberately, that non-Russia judges may hold back on their GOE and PCS more than they have before?

Edited February 11, 2022 by Domenicholas

[choclatechip45]

5 hours ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

Here’s thing:  My European friends, and my Asian friends (all who live there) complain to me about how American kids are infantalized and kept “young” as opposed to being strong and adult by 14.  So, I do find is feasible that Kamala knew she was taking banned substances.

My heart breaks for her, because I still don’t think she should skate.  

And unfortunately I will now be looking at all her past performances/competitions wondering how she would be skating if she skated clean.  She is immensely talented.

When it comes to doping.  Part of the reason it’s even more rampant in swimming/track/field is because it’s almost impossible to make any kind of money at the sport  unless you’re famous for winning.  And when you loose by .03 seconds and now you won’t be famous (with lucrative things like cover of Wheatis box, dancing with stars, commercials etc) the temptation must be extreme.

Yeah but are those friends high level athletes who are training for Olympics? I deal with a lot of former Olympians due to my job and you can really tell which ones have been training their whole lives and never went to school and which ones were on a NCAA team so they went to school through high school even if they graduated early. Especially with figure skating and gymnastics they don't have normal upbringings. 

I've lived abroad and have a lot of friends who did not grow up in America and people just like to bash Americans because we are an easy target. Some of my international friends are very immature in different ways than the Americans I'm friends with and grew up with. 

Edited February 11, 2022 by choclatechip45

[choclatechip45]

5 hours ago, Lady Whistleup said:

For those wondering about the radio silence from other athletes, a picture like this explains it:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CZyWK7eoxjt/

It's Sasha Trusova congratulating Nathan Chen.

Skaters are actually incredibly close. Yes there are rivalries and not everyone is best buddies. But most of these skaters have been touring together, staying in the same hotels for meets, hanging out backstage, for years. 

I think the reason why we aren't hearing anything from other athletes is because they suspected Eteri was giving drugs to her students for awhile, but didn't have any concrete proof. 

[CeeBeeGee]

5 hours ago, Lady Whistleup said:

For those wondering about the radio silence from other athletes, a picture like this explains it:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CZyWK7eoxjt/

It's Sasha Trusova congratulating Nathan Chen.

Skaters are actually incredibly close. Yes there are rivalries and not everyone is best buddies. But most of these skaters have been touring together, staying in the same hotels for meets, hanging out backstage, for years. 

I'm having fun translating the comments. Она--ракета русская! 

[Enero]

50 minutes ago, Jillibean said:

But yes, I think skaters are not going to be quick to say anything negative about another skater, especially knowing the particular limitations in free will experienced by athletes from countries like Russia where all training is state sponsored and overseen. 

I think it’s moreso not wanting to be drawn into this complete clustef****. I mean if I was an athlete in Beijing I wouldn’t be saying a darn thing even if I have a strong opinion about it or had heard rumors of the skater doping. The minute Nathan or whomever gives a sound bite about this, whether negative or positive, they will get drawn into this drama. And NOBODY wants that. So they’re doing the smart thing by staying mum.

[Rootbeer]

2 hours ago, Chaser said:

I’m kind of surprised she said something. Johnny is still silent. 

Johnny loves Russia, he spends a lot of time there.  He is very friendly with multiple Russian athletes and coaches.  He has a lot of Russian friends.  His ex-husband is Russian and undoubtedly has friends and family there.  Even though the divorce was bitter, I don't think Johnny wants to make life more difficult for anyone in Russia.  I think that, if he speaks up, it is going to be a very measured response, and not likely to be terribly controversial.  He needs to be careful or he won't be welcome in Russia in the future and the people and country mean a lot to him.  Speaking out against the Russian sports hierarchy could blow back onto people he cares about.

As Americans, we're used to speaking our minds, giving our opinions, exercising our right to free speech.  There are a lot of countries where speaking your mind is not only not valued, it can lead to very bad things.

Edited February 11, 2022 by Rootbeer

[ShellsandCheese]

I can’t wait for the rest of the competition. This scandal actually has me interested in the figure skating competition and truthfully, I wasn’t really interested in these games at all before. Ice Dancing and Pairs are likely going to be really interesting - and I’m still shook; who could ever guessed that there would be a doping scandal and not judging scandal in figure skating. 

[Lady Whistleup]

Looking ahead to the dance competition ... this one is probably the most predictable. P/C will win gold. There's like no doubt about that. The silver and bronze medals will probably be H/D and Sin/Kats. 

[Chit Chat]

28 minutes ago, Rootbeer said:

Speaking out against the Russian sports hierarchy could blow back onto people he cares about.

Exactly!  He has enough sense to know what not to say!  

30 minutes ago, Rootbeer said:

As Americans, we're used to speaking our minds, giving our opinions, exercising our right to free speech.  

Which is a good thing, but some of the stuff I see on social media leads me to believe that there are many folks out there who could learn a little restraint when it comes to posting every single thought that crosses their mind!!  (I'm not referring to anybody here!!)

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Minneapple said:

I can't help but think that NBC is totally relishing this drama. I bet they're furious at themselves for not pushing to have the ladies' final in primetime.

Head of NBC Sports on the phone with the the IOC “okay, here me out…. You delay your decision until they are on the medals platform. Then as the medals are being walked out, an announcement is made. The Russians are asked to leave the podium and allow the Americans to take their place. Only it needs to be said very quickly and only in English to increase the odds of them looking confused. Maybe the announcer could mumble? We’ll clean it up for the tv audience.”

[absnow54]

31 minutes ago, deaja said:

Head of NBC Sports on the phone with the the IOC “okay, here me out…. You delay your decision until they are on the medals platform. Then as the medals are being walked out, an announcement is made. The Russians are asked to leave the podium and allow the Americans to take their place. Only it needs to be said very quickly and only in English to increase the odds of them looking confused. Maybe the announcer could mumble? We’ll clean it up for the tv audience.”

Team Canada shows up to present the medals, polite shuffling ensues until Russia is left confused holding an empty platter off the podium and the National Anthem starts to play. 

[Enero]

From Kristi Yamaguchi To Sasha Cohen: Here's What 21 Of The Most Famous USA Figure Skaters Look Like Today

Many of these skaters like Cohen, Flatt, Abbott, Hughes, Kimmie etc. are married, engaged or have kids or are on to good careers outside of skating. 

I knew that Cohen had one child but didn’t know she had two. Can’t believe Tara has been married for 6 years. It doesn’t seem like it’s been that long. Kristi has a beautiful family and Nancy’s son is very handsome. Didn’t know Abbott had a kid. Cool update. 

[kittykat]

That pic of Sarah Hughes looking at her coach after her amazing OGM performance never ceases to brighten my day.

Of course they had to use THOSE pics of Jeremy Abbott and Ashley Wagner.

[emmawoodhouse]

Jeremy doesn't have a kid. He hashtagged something like #pretenddad in his IG post.

[BitterApple]

1 hour ago, Enero said:

From Kristi Yamaguchi To Sasha Cohen: Here's What 21 Of The Most Famous USA Figure Skaters Look Like Today

 

Damn, Kristi looks incredible. 

[Demian]

I'd just like to thank everyone on this forum board for providing me with a thorough education on the various scandals swallowing international skating competitions over the past couple of years.  Like most people, I focus on figure skating once every Olympics, and you guys are waaaaay better than NBC at spilling the tea.

[choclatechip45]

Johnny has always been obsessed with Russia. I remember him getting a lot of flack in 2014. I'm sure he is sad his fluff piece won't get aired. 

I'm excited for Ice Dance! After watching On Edge I am really hope for an all Montreal podium so they can beat Marina's record. I know it is unlikely. 

Also speaking of Marina does anyone know the deal with her trying to steal Nathan from Raf?

[scarynikki12]

Speaking of:

 

[HartofDixie]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10503191/British-journalists-revealed-Russian-skaters-failed-drugs-test-received-DEATH-THREATS.html?fbclid=IwAR2iXrN6Xyfg1Jzxe6xAeNqHOAnCcFL8AlfDjWeOE6divq_qyM70MK6jaa4

[CeeBeeGee]

8 minutes ago, HartofDixie said:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10503191/British-journalists-revealed-Russian-skaters-failed-drugs-test-received-DEATH-THREATS.html?fbclid=IwAR2iXrN6Xyfg1Jzxe6xAeNqHOAnCcFL8AlfDjWeOE6divq_qyM70MK6jaa4

Why am I not surprised that Russian "journalists" are a bunch of thugs?

[emmawoodhouse]

From the article, someone with some experience in systemic abuse.

"Katarina Witt, a two-time gold figure skater from Germany, went further - calling for any 'responsible adults' around Valieva to be kicked out of sport 'forever' while adding that her heart 'cries infinitely' for the teenager." 

 

[HartofDixie]

 

[healthnut]

Helpful graphic for casual fans. 

[GeminiDancer]

It’s 6:18 here. Who’s up with me to watch ice dance? 
 

I’m going to pay for this later. 

[healthnut]

I’m here with you @GeminiDancer 😃

[GeminiDancer]

Some of these teams have a very… interesting view of what “street dance” is. 

[GeminiDancer]

I’ll also add, I appreciate Tanith’s commentary a great deal. Already an upgrade from Tara. 

[absnow54]

41 minutes ago, GeminiDancer said:

It’s 6:18 here. Who’s up with me to watch ice dance? 
 

I’m going to pay for this later. 

My cat wakes me up at 6am, regardless. 

Tara’s dress was a little much for 6AM.

Not to interrupt the Ice Dance competition, but the CAS hearing for Kamila’s case will be tomorrow morning (US time) with a ruling within 24 hours, so results by Monday. The ISU has joined the suit along with IOC and WADA. 

[Lady Whistleup]

Awake for the ice dance RD. Kill me now.

[ML89]

The “where are they” mistaking Paul Wylie for Todd Eldridge is ironic…