S02.E14: What the Pho?

[TexasGal]

 

Quote

All hell breaks loose at Jennie’s Pho luncheon when Meredith sees Jen, Mary questions her innocence and Lisa feels attacked.  Meanwhile, Heather learns her brother is leaving the Mormon church, Whitney shares some shocking news about Mary and Robert Sr. and Jen and Sharrieff come to terms with her mounting legal fees.

Airdate: 12/19/2021

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

Heather and her brother look like the Mormon version of Tori Spelling and Randy Spelling playing the role of Heather and her brother. 

[heatherchandler]

Jesus Mary!  Telling an Asian woman you like her slanty eyes??  I’m loathe to even type that to discuss how insane it is.  She’s disgusting.

[Marley]

How did Heather’s brother not know that stuff about Mormonism? Her and her brother seemed over the top in that scene. I’m kind of over hearing about the Mormon church too lol.

Jen must think everyone’s an idiot. She’s paying family members $50K a month? And I’m supposed to believe her husband didn’t know what was going on. Lol ok that’s $600K a year. Jen just keeps saying she’s innocent. So what is she saying she’s being framed lol. This isn’t some mistaken identity robbery or whatever like pretty sure they have evidence.

That crater place creeped me out lol.

Fuck Mary and her creep ass husband. I need her shady shit to be exposed. I believe everything about her gross church. I don’t find her entertaining at all. I wish she wasn’t on the show. She doesn’t deserve to get even more money. Mary is clearly prejudiced against many ppl too and thinks she’s better then everyone.

Jennie meh pass. I don’t care about her and her husbands fake argument about children and sister wives.

Jens trash but Mary judging her is a good laugh. Altho I did like her asking her questions to Jen. Lol Jen just acting like it’s all something random. Lol they just randomly said oh let’s go get Jen Shah and Stuart that’ll be fun.

Jennie always seems to start yelling but it seems fake almost like she’s trying to have a moment. I wish she would just shut up sometimes.

Jens eyebrows freak me out lol.

Ah yes cry and run off. You are such a victim Jen poor you being framed. You are a saint basically lol.

Meredith being over it did kind of crack me up and when she told Lisa to stop yelling. Why is Lisa always crying like calm down take a Xanax.

Not sure this needed to be an hour and a half.

Edited December 20, 2021 by Marley

[MerBearStare]

Everyone arguing in front of Jen about who talked the most shit about her was absurdly hilarious. If it were anyone else, except Mary, I would feel bad for them, but Jen stole money from old people so...🤷‍♀️

I do kind of feel for the other housewives in regards to Jen. If someone were right in front of me crying and telling me how scared they are, I would have a hard time not sympathizing with them. And I'm sure they have no choice in filming with her (which is why Meredith's "don't invite me if you invite her" rings hollow), so it's probably easier to just pretend that Jen's arrest is all a mistake and a misunderstanding. 

Mary...just...goddamn, is she ever *not* an asshole? Good lord. Even her husband/step-grandfather seems to hate her. Not that he's a prize himself. Although I did laugh out loud at her, "I'm praying that you're guilty." Talk about a Freudian slip.

Edited December 20, 2021 by MerBearStare

[nexxie]

I would have enjoyed that Pho dinner if none of those women had been there - just the park, flowers, birds and food.

[princelina]

This is the oddest group of women Bravo has ever thrown together and asked us to pretend we believe they are all friends.

They're still learning about Jen and what happened so I'll give them a break on that.  But Jen's husband knows that they are renting that house for the show, so he knows it's not the "hub of both sides of the family" so I'm calling BS on him not knowing or at least suspecting her of being up to no good.

Mary's a creepy weirdo.  And I'm judging Meredith and Heather especially for pretending that they believed that Mary didn't judge Jen.

Meredith's boobs looked great at her "girls night" - oddly juxtaposed against her "plastic breastplate" TH.

If I ever see a man in a suit jacket with a Brooks Marks labeled tape connecting the lapels, I will go out and buy a can of paint and track him down to throw it at him, like those anti-fur protesters of yore 😂

[Cheezwiz]

Jen always looks insane, but she looked particularly insane in a few of her TH's where she was wearing bright pink eye make-up: was she wearing blue contacts? She looked completely unhinged. Paying family members 50,000 per year? Such a persecuted saint this one. I REALLY hope the charges stick. She really did not want to deal with the practical matters of paying her legal bills.

I can't believe it's taken these women this long to clue into the fact that Mary is a creepy loon, who is essentially pulling the same kinds of scams as Jen.

The Pho luncheon in the park looked really nice, but I actually fell asleep once everyone started bickering, and missed most of the rest of the episode. 

[nexxie]

Glad Whitney used the word “predator” for Creepy Mary and her Grandpa Husband - that’s exactly what they are. Though, considering the lawsuit against Justin, Whitney might have a predator in her own home. And then there’s Jen...

Appreciated the conversation between Heather and her brother - it must feel awful to come to the realization that you raised your kids in a cult. imo quite a few other religious organizations could also be put in that category - brainwashing is big business.

[Straycat80]

It was weird that one day was snow and winter then it seemed like the next day was summer time in the park for the Pho lunch. Which looked awesome, I was paying more attention to the food than the fight. 
I just can’t with Jen anymore. She pays 50k a month to her family and how much does she pay her large glam squad and assistants. Plus all the other crap she owns. And her husband isn’t questioning this? 
I wish Mary would get taken down. She lied about not talking shit about Jen. I hope they play the clips back at the reunion. And then she made the racist remark about Jennie. And no one said anything! 
I like Jennie but they need to drop the fake sister wife storyline. 

[JonnieUniteUs]

8 hours ago, princelina said:

Meredith's boobs looked great at her "girls night" - oddly juxtaposed against her "plastic breastplate" TH

They did look a lot more normal.

I know when my friends and I have a “girls night,” we all have our boobs exposed almost to the nipples.

🙄😅

[JonnieUniteUs]

Is Jennie the only one that is not afraid of Mary?

maybe she hasn’t been around her long enough to be intimidated/manipulated/brainwashed or whatever it is yet.

I would love for someone educated in the Bible to call Mary out on her BS.  And in front of her church would be great.

 

[Mindthinkr]

My gut tells me that Mary is no better then Jen. They have both bilked people out of their hard earned money. It shows on them too. Always wearing expensive designer outfits with accessories. (Even if Jen Shah allegedly rents her furs and jewelry…I’m sure that still costs and there must be some kind of insurance involved in case of) Don’t their parishioners or scammed people even realize that they are funding an OTT lifestyle for these people; especially since they don’t seem to be getting anything in return? Shame on these two cast members. I can’t begin to express how difficult it is to have a friendship with Mary. It’s either her way or she cuts to the quick. Her unnecessary comment about Jenny’s slanted eyes was racist and derogatory. It was also obvious that her husband is sick of running to her beck and call. 
 

Again another nice meal was ruined for the hostess. That seems to be a Bravo staple and I’m over it. 

[JonnieUniteUs]

34 minutes ago, Mindthinkr said:

Her unnecessary comment about Jenny’s slanted eyes was racist and derogatory

Can you imagine if Jennie came back with a comment about Mary’s eyes?  That would have been TV gold but she may have been too shocked or is too nice etc. 

[rlc]

Every episode is like bizarro Sophie's Choice: who do I hate the most. Every time someone opens their yap, I change my mind. Mary, Jen, Lisa...it's like freaking ping pong deciding. Cannot stand Meredith, but it is not in the same league of hatred. Wouldn't go so far as to say I like Whitney, but she seems to have a bit more sense than some of these strangely sycophantic harpies.  Heather is on the fence for me, but when she just sat back at the pho lunch and just started laughing, I truly liked her.

And Jenny was there. At least she confronted Mary. Maybe Mary will have to sic Jesus on her. 

Edited December 20, 2021 by rlc

[amarante]

1 hour ago, Mindthinkr said:

My gut tells me that Mary is no better then Jen. They have both bilked people out of their hard earned money. It shows on them too. Always wearing expensive designer outfits with accessories. (Even if Jen Shah allegedly rents her furs and jewelry…I’m sure that still costs and there must be some kind of insurance involved in case of) Don’t their parishioners or scammed people even realize that they are funding an OTT lifestyle for these people; especially since they don’t seem to be getting anything in return? Shame on these two cast members. I can’t begin to express how difficult it is to have a friendship with Mary. It’s either her way or she cuts to the quick. Her unnecessary comment about Jenny’s slanted eyes was racist and derogatory. It was also obvious that her husband is sick of running to her beck and call. 
 

Again another nice meal was ruined for the hostess. That seems to be a Bravo staple and I’m over it. 

I think the difference is that Jen Shah is an "impersonal" scam artist so the people she is scamming don't have any idea of who is stealing their money. It is even less "personal" than a classic Ponzi scheme where in the end the fleeced people know who stole their money.

Mary is just an awful all around person and verging on insane. I don't understand how people buy into any of the crap by religions but Mary is in a long tradition of Protestant preachers who exploit their congregation (cult members) and fund a lavish life style and for whatever reason the membership find the display of obscene wealth to not only be okay but to be a signal from god that their "leader" has the inside track with the big guy. Not that I am defending the Catholic Church or other "organized" religions but Protestantism in the US seems to have this weird one man/woman congregations. There doesn't seem to be any requirement that one even study or be officially ordained so any crackpot know nothing can open up a fundamentalist cult and start bilking the members. 

How is Mary allowed to get away with the slanty eye comment versus Brandy from Dallas? Not that I am defending Brandy who was a casual racist. Mary seems to be full of prejudices and a self hating black woman given her comments on fearing going into a store last season. 

And as mentioned I did enjoy the Freudian slip greatly when she said she was praying for Jen's guilt. 

I continue to be amused by the women who forget that their words and deeds are recorded and so claim they never did or said something like Mary did regarding her statements on Jen at Vail. With Mary I think she is so used to being around people who do not contradict her in any way that she has no experience with being "accountable" to people in the sense that *normal* people are accountable to friends, family and co-workers for their statements and actions. 

[Mindthinkr]

1 hour ago, JonnieUniteUs said:

Can you imagine if Jennie came back with a comment about Mary’s eyes?  That would have been TV gold but she may have been too shocked or is too nice etc. 

I was so waiting for that, but you’re right. She was too stunned to react.  

[JenE4]

That goes to show how over-the-top Narcissistic the majority of this bunch is that instead of focusing on what all of them were harping about or “thinking about the victims” (TM RHBH), I actually had empathy for Jen just sitting there while all of them were screaming about their own feelings. Jen’s the one who might actually have PTSD after what she’s going through—unlike Lisa (I think it was) who claims to have gotten PTSD just from hearing about Jen getting arrested! At least Heather finally stood up and said we’re all making it about ourselves when Jen is the one who’s actually going through this ordeal. Yes, Heather! The only one with any sense at that whole lunch! Speaking of the lunch, they all started storming off at various times while eating their bowls of pho, but they all apologized “at the end” while the pho was first being delivered. So I guess they had that calmer moment earlier on and THEN all hell started breaking loose. Jeez, people, don’t make me have empathy for the criminal! I can’t wait for Mary to be taken down a peg: “I love your slanty eyes!” What. The. Fuck?!?!? Wow! And the Mexican slur last week! “I’m praying that you’re guilty,” indeed!

[bosawks]

As this season goes on I'm actually beginning to think that Mary is sincere in her belief that she can send Jesus after people as she says in her tag.

I had no idea that the H in Jesus H. Christ stood for Hitman......

Edited December 20, 2021 by bosawks

[Talented Tenth]

13 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

Jesus Mary!  Telling an Asian woman you like her slanty eyes??  I’m loathe to even type that to discuss how insane it is.  She’s disgusting.

She didn't say "slanty"; she said "slanted". How is it insane and disgusting for Mary to say she likes a feature Jennie has?

2 hours ago, JonnieUniteUs said:

Can you imagine if Jennie came back with a comment about Mary’s eyes?  That would have been TV gold but she may have been too shocked or is too nice etc. 

TV gold for Jennie to compliment Mary's eyes?

[JenE4]

11 minutes ago, Talented Tenth said:

She didn't say "slanty"; she said "slanted". How is it insane and disgusting for Mary to say she likes a feature Jennie has?

TV gold for Jennie to compliment Mary's eyes?

Oh, come on, you know calling someone slanted eyes is a racial slur! If she just said you have beautiful eyes, fine, but calling out Jennie’s “slanted” eyes in the context of all of the Asian decor and dress was just as racist as when Mary said the Mexicans are making cocaine or whatever it was. 

[Keywestclubkid]

Mary with her I don't lie i wasn't talking about you Jen I didn't say ANYTHING bullshit.. she gets how Cameras work right?

[Talented Tenth]

1 hour ago, JenE4 said:

Oh, come on, you know calling someone slanted eyes is a racial slur! If she just said you have beautiful eyes, fine, but calling out Jennie’s “slanted” eyes in the context of all of the Asian decor and dress was just as racist as when Mary said the Mexicans are making cocaine or whatever it was. 

When attacking people's characters based on what they say, I think it's very important to be accurate in regards to what people said and did. She did not call her slanted eyes; she looked at a photo of her and said she loved her slanted eyes.  Are Jennie's eyes not slanted?  It's an accurate description.  If your eyes are blue, someone can't say they love your blue eyes?

When Mary spoke about Mexicans, she was expressing fear of Jen Shah and was attempting to compare her to the Mexican cartel. She was not insulting all Mexicans.  I can't figure out if people are playing obtuse or if they really did not understand that Mary was referencing the cartel. Simply mentioning nationality or complimenting someone's unique features that are prevalent in their race are not racist things.  

Edited December 20, 2021 by Talented Tenth

[Keywestclubkid]

Meredith to Lisa "you have been screaming for the past half hour I cant... then Heather Laughing out loud at that statement ...

6 minutes ago, Talented Tenth said:

When attacking people's characters based on what they say, I think it's very important to be accurate in regards to what people said and did. She did not call her slanted eyes; she looked at a photo of her and said she loved her slanted eyes.  Are Jennie's eyes not slanted?  It's an accurate description.  If your eyes are blue, someone can't say they love your blue eyes?

 

I think since Jennie took offense to it then thats all that needs to be said ... the person who she directed the comment to found it offensive .. point blank period

[JenE4]

28 minutes ago, Talented Tenth said:

When attacking people's characters based on what they say, I think it's very important to be accurate in regards to what people said and did. She did not call her slanted eyes; she looked at a photo of her and said she loved her slanted eyes.  Are Jennie's eyes not slanted?  It's an accurate description.  If your eyes are blue, someone can't say they love your blue eyes?

When Mary spoke about Mexicans, she was expressing fear of Jen Shah and was attempting to compare her to the Mexican cartel. She was not insulting all Mexicans.  I can't figure out if people are playing obtuse or if they really did not understand that Mary was referencing the cartel. Simply mentioning nationality or complimenting someone's unique features that are prevalent in their race are not racist things.  

Ok, then let’s look at the exact quotes. Copying the exact quotes from articles: “It’s not fair to put me with someone [like Jen]. When I think about Jen, I see heartless, I see a thug,” Crosby said during the episode. “Like, you know, those Mexican people that make all those drugs. To pit me with that?!” So, Mary did not say anything about the Cartel. So we’re both adding nuance, I suppose. Yet, Mary actually apologized for her racist comments after receiving backlash from viewers. As far as I know, no apology yet on the latest slur, which is also upsetting viewers: "I bet you looked pretty," said Mary, before adding, "You do have yellow tones though.” As if that wasn't bad enough, after seeing a photo of Jennie in the wig, she added, "Ooo nice, I like the slanted eyes. Love it." The term “slant-eye” is a long-standing racial slur. It’s not an “accurate description”—neither is any other racial slur or racist microaggression. 

[Talented Tenth]

25 minutes ago, Keywestclubkid said:

Meredith to Lisa "you have been screaming for the past half hour I cant... then Heather Laughing out loud at that statement ...

I think since Jennie took offense to it then thats all that needs to be said ... the person who she directed the comment to found it offensive .. point blank period

Yes, Jennie did find it offensive.  Maybe she has insecurities or issues with her features.  That doesn't mean that what Mary said was racist.  I'm trying find the logic behind accusing her of a racist comment for complimenting a feature she actually described.

[Keywestclubkid]

4 minutes ago, Talented Tenth said:

Yes, Jennie did find it offensive.  Maybe she has insecurities or issues with her features.  That doesn't mean that what Mary said was racist.  I'm trying find the logic behind accusing her of a racist comment for complimenting a feature she actually described.

God love you for defending Mary .. had she not thrown out racist shit before Id be right there with you .. and Yes if the person who you said hey great slant eyes to thinks its racist and offensive then its racist and offensive ... there is no defending that

Edited December 20, 2021 by Keywestclubkid

[MaggieG]

15 hours ago, Marley said:

Jen must think everyone’s an idiot. She’s paying family members $50K a month? And I’m supposed to believe her husband didn’t know what was going on. Lol ok that’s $600K a year. Jen just keeps saying she’s innocent. So what is she saying she’s being framed lol. This isn’t some mistaken identity robbery or whatever like pretty sure they have evidence.

This is why I can't with her. She's acting like this just happened to her and the government decided to be mean and come arrest poor Jen without any proof. Girl stop. But this is her MO, even when shown cold hard proof, she'll just start screaming or crying. I liked Mary for those few seconds that she was like "Oh come on, you had no idea?" 

And I'm sorry, but I thought the whole prayer was performative. Just another way to get sympathy and to show the world how amazing she is and innocent she is. Not buying it!

[Talented Tenth]

12 minutes ago, JenE4 said:

Ok, then let’s look at the exact quotes. Copying the exact quotes from articles: “It’s not fair to put me with someone [like Jen]. When I think about Jen, I see heartless, I see a thug,” Crosby said during the episode. “Like, you know, those Mexican people that make all those drugs. To pit me with that?!” So, Mary did not say anything about the Cartel. So we’re both adding nuance, I suppose. Yet, Mary actually apologized for her racist comments after receiving backlash from viewers. As far as I know, no apology yet on the latest slur, which is also upsetting viewers: "I bet you looked pretty," said Mary, before adding, "You do have yellow tones though.” As if that wasn't bad enough, after seeing a photo of Jennie in the wig, she added, "Ooo nice, I like the slanted eyes. Love it." The term “slant-eye” is a long-standing racial slur. It’s not an “accurate description”—neither is any other racial slur or racist microaggression. 

So, had she said "Jen scares me like those Italian people who are hit men", would we pretend the reference wouldn't be the mafia and say it was racist against all Italians?

Mary was referring to the undertones in Jennie's skin that made the blonde flattering to her.  Mary didn't say "slant-eye".  She told her she liked her slanted eyes, which they are.  

Mary is off in the head.  She married her step-grandfather and isn't the most articulate person.  She rarely has the best choice of words in any situation.  I can see why people find what she said problematic and unthoughtful, but to call her racist is a stretch.

[JenE4]

1 hour ago, Talented Tenth said:

So, had she said "Jen scares me like those Italian people who are hit men", would we pretend the reference wouldn't be the mafia and say it was racist against all Italians?

Mary was referring to the undertones in Jennie's skin that made the blonde flattering to her.  Mary didn't say "slant-eye".  She told her she liked her slanted eyes, which they are.  

Mary is off in the head.  She married her step-grandfather and isn't the most articulate person.  She rarely has the best choice of words in any situation.  I can see why people find what she said problematic and unthoughtful, but to call her racist is a stretch.

She also said she won’t go into 7-11 if there are black people outside of it. She’s so racist she’s even racist against her own race! Listen, I’m done with the back-and-forth. You can go ahead and have the last word if you want. Mary has said far too many racist things in my opinion to give her the benefit of the doubt that she just doesn’t know what she’s saying. At what point do we start holding people accountable? Her entire job is preaching to a congregation, so if anyone should be aware of the power of her words out of this bunch, it’s Mary. 

[Keywestclubkid]

12 minutes ago, JenE4 said:

Her entire job is preaching to a congregation, so if anyone should be aware of the power of her words out of this bunch, it’s Mary. 

ALL OF THIS

[Talented Tenth]

52 minutes ago, JenE4 said:

She also said she won’t go into 7-11 if there are black people outside of it. She’s so racist she’s even racist against her own race! Listen, I’m done with the back-and-forth. You can go ahead and have the last word if you want. Mary has said far too many racist things in my opinion to give her the benefit of the doubt that she just doesn’t know what she’s saying. At what point do we start holding people accountable? Her entire job is preaching to a congregation, so if anyone should be aware of the power of her words out of this bunch, it’s Mary. 

I don't have to have the last word.  This is a civil discussion as far as I'm concerned.  I am careful not to use the term racist and all of its iterations unless it's blatantly clear.  I believe for something to racist, there has to be intent and expressing something negative about another race based on their race.  I think there is a quickness to label something racist strictly on the basis of a person mentioning race without further examination.

Mary does not adhere to social norms probably due to how she was raised and groomed.  Again, this is a woman who married her step-grandfather.  I can't find many things about Mary that are normal.  I think she says things without thought and is very ignorant as to how things are going to come across.  I've seen many times on several platforms that Mary is socially inept/awkward.  I do not believe that Mary set out to put down Asians or Mexicans.  Were her comments in poor taste and reckless?  Yes.  I do find the comment about 7-11 problematic too, but Mary denied it.  

[nexxie]

Didn’t Mary tell Jen she hopes Jen’s found guilty, and then changed it to innocent? She really seems to have problems with Freudian slips! That eye comment was the equivalent of one of the others saying how they loved Mary’s nappy hair. Good grief!

[Haute Messe]

As abhorrent as Jen and Mary are, I still find me, me, me Lisa the most obnoxious. She never shuts her gob. 

[FlyingEgret]

Lisa: my lawyer called me

Whitney: you called your lawyer

Lisa: but then my other lawyer who I did not call called me back

Love it - so if someone doesn't answer your original call that means you didnt call? Nevermind the other lawyer you apparently just admitted to calling...

[Baltimore Betty]

I watched part of a docu series about the woman who ran a cult like church and focused on weight loss in the more you love G-d the more weight you will lose sort of crap, she had the darnedest hair, huge, gravity defying hair, fancy clothes, rail thin and of course she had a G-d complex, she reminded me so much of Mary it was eerie.  Mary can say or do anything to her congregation and they take it or do it, Mary sits at a table with other women who voice their opinions and remember what she, Mary had said about Jenn, Mary gets flustered and angry and wants to flee, I think the problem is those women are not part of her church and she is not use to any push back on what she says or does.

Mary tends to wear clothes that are way too big, ill fitting and swallow her up, I wonder if this is because she borrows the clothes she wears on the show and cannot alter them.

Jennie put on a lovely lunch, her cultural foods looked tasty, the table was beautiful, too bad it dissolved in to yelling.

I laughed hard at BRooks MArks latest genius design, a blazer with his name tape across the front of it, like who is going to want that? 

[bref]

"Slanted" is not a neutral, nor an accurate, description of what the eyes of Asian people look like; neither is calling their skin tone "yellow". These are highly charged terms with a racist history. Imagine if you "complimented" a Jewish person by saying you love their big Semitic nose, or told a black person you loved their nappy hair. Do you see why that would be a problem? I feel you are being deliberately obtuse here.

Mary's blase stereotyping of Blacks, Mexicans and Asians is pretty consistent. It's okay to call an obvious racist a racist.

Edited December 21, 2021 by bref

[AryasMum]

I’ve been attending girls nights most of my life, but I’ve clearly been underdressed.  I didn’t realize I should present tits first. Thanks for another lesson in class Meredith Everythingbutthe nipple Marks.  I’m surprised Brooks didn’t get the vapors. 

[AryasMum]

40 minutes ago, bref said:

"Slanted" is not a neutral, nor an accurate, description of what the eyes of Asian people look like; neither is calling their skin tone "yellow". These are highly charged terms with a racist history. Imagine if you "complimented" a Jewish person by saying you love their big Semitic nose, or told a black person you loved their nappy hair. Do you see why that would be a problem? I feel you are being deliberately obtuse here.

Mary's blase stereotyping of Blacks, Mexicans and Asians is pretty consistent. It's okay to call an obvious racist a racist.

I’ve got a Matthew chapter 9 verse coming to mind. 

[Bluesky]

No wonder younger women are getting smaller boob jobs or keeping their small breasts.  Looking at all these moms and grandmoms showing their big ole fake crooked boobs any chance they get.   Women in their twenties and early thirties are saying “no thanks”. 

[howiveaddict]

49 minutes ago, Bluesky said:

No wonder younger women are getting smaller boob jobs or keeping their small breasts.  Looking at all these moms and grandmoms showing their big ole fake crooked boobs any chance they get.   Women in their twenties and early thirties are saying “no thanks”. 

Well, it's good they set an example to younger women then.  😘

[Talented Tenth]

2 hours ago, bref said:

"Slanted" is not a neutral, nor an accurate, description of what the eyes of Asian people look like; neither is calling their skin tone "yellow". These are highly charged terms with a racist history. Imagine if you "complimented" a Jewish person by saying you love their big Semitic nose, or told a black person you loved their nappy hair. Do you see why that would be a problem? I feel you are being deliberately obtuse here.

Mary's blase stereotyping of Blacks, Mexicans and Asians is pretty consistent. It's okay to call an obvious racist a racist.

Why isn't "slanted" an accurate or neutral description?  Different racial groups have distinct features that set them apart from the rest.  I have never heard that the term "slanted" to describe an eye shape is racially offensive.  As a matter of fact, there are a lot of Black people who have slanted eyes as well.  There may be a cultural disconnect because slanted eyes are not seen as a bad thing in the Black community.  I think Mary was referring to Jennie's undertone when she said "yellow tone" and expressing that the wig was flattering to her skin tone.  I understand people are sensitive and it may have rubbed people the wrong way, but not pretending to not notice the physical racial differences and paying a compliment is not racist.

I do not consider slanted eyes as a description to be the same as the other terms you mentioned because those other terms have clearly been used in a negative manner and have a negative connotation.  It would not be racially offensive to me if a person who is non-Black said they love the curls of someone Black because curls is an accurate, neutral description.  Regarding the nose, "big nose" is not generally viewed as a neutral term so no, that wouldn't go over well.  White people tend to have blue eyes more than other races.  Is it racist to say someone likes someone's blue eyes?

[Bluesky]

8 hours ago, Talented Tenth said:

Yes, Jennie did find it offensive.  Maybe she has insecurities or issues with her features.  That doesn't mean that what Mary said was racist.  I'm trying find the logic behind accusing her of a racist comment for complimenting a feature she actually described.

Her eyes aren’t even slanted.  People have used that term as an ugly insult for decades and Mary knows it. Mary is not stable and I hope she loses her church members.  

[bref]

1 hour ago, Talented Tenth said:

Why isn't "slanted" an accurate or neutral description?  Different racial groups have distinct features that set them apart from the rest.  I have never heard that the term "slanted" to describe an eye shape is racially offensive.  As a matter of fact, there are a lot of Black people who have slanted eyes as well.  There may be a cultural disconnect because slanted eyes are not seen as a bad thing in the Black community.  I think Mary was referring to Jennie's undertone when she said "yellow tone" and expressing that the wig was flattering to her skin tone.  I understand people are sensitive and it may have rubbed people the wrong way, but not pretending to not notice the physical racial differences and paying a compliment is not racist.

I do not consider slanted eyes as a description to be the same as the other terms you mentioned because those other terms have clearly been used in a negative manner and have a negative connotation.  It would not be racially offensive to me if a person who is non-Black said they love the curls of someone Black because curls is an accurate, neutral description.  Regarding the nose, "big nose" is not generally viewed as a neutral term so no, that wouldn't go over well.  White people tend to have blue eyes more than other races.  Is it racist to say someone likes someone's blue eyes?

"Slanted" eyes and "yellow" skin have been used in racist caricatures of Asian people for centuries, literally, just as large Jewish noses and African textured hair has. Asian immigrants were once referred to as the Yellow Peril. This is not about other people being "overly sensitive" or Jennie being "insecure.". You can't possibly be serious with these comments.

Mary's statements were "complimentary" about as much as telling a Black person how articulate they are.

 

Edited December 21, 2021 by bref

[Marley]

Yes I’m sorry not sure where you grew up but ppl have been using slant eyes as a racial slur since I was a kid and I’m now 34.

Mary so obviously thinks she’s better then everyone. She’s insane tho.

[Cheezwiz]

4 hours ago, Talented Tenth said:

Why isn't "slanted" an accurate or neutral description? 

Mary, is that you?

Seriously, you are being so obtuse in your responses, it's hard to even know where to start. Mary was clearly raised and groomed in a bizarre manner - she's an ignoramus and completely socially inept. She's also provided ample evidence that she has all kinds of racist notions about various ethnic groups including her OWN. In no way is "slanted eyes" a neutral descriptor of an Asian person. Mary is BOTH an unhinged wackadoo AND a racist. One does not make the other defensible.

 

[Keywestclubkid]

9 hours ago, Talented Tenth said:

 

I do not consider slanted eyes as a description to be the same as the other terms you mentioned because those other terms have clearly been used in a negative manner and have a negative connotation. 

But it was offensive to her. A simple google search will tell you about how people used yellow skin and slanted has derogatory terms towards a whole community of people. Hell Brandi from Dallas got in trouble for saying slant eyes and talking in a racist accent … this was about a women who probably had these terms hurled at her throughout her life. She wasn’t just being sensitive or cranky or whatever else you want to use to defend Mary using the term. Come on now. 

[nexxie]

This conversation reminds me of people who purposely insult someone and then say, “I meant it as a compliment.”

We see you Mary The Narcissistic Cult Leading Con Woman.

imo Mary jumped in to insult Jenny just to see her happy face fall as she presented her beautiful Vietnamese meal in her beautiful dress in the beautiful park. Narcissists like Mary relieve their dark feelings by ruining things for others.

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

On 12/19/2021 at 9:31 PM, Alonzo Mosely FBI said:

Heather and her brother look like the Mormon version of Tori Spelling and Randy Spelling playing the role of Heather and her brother. 

Before that I found it slightly problematic that Meredith (I think) maybe it was Lisa said she straightened her hair when they talked about their outfits upon arrival. Why straighten your hair, is that what makes you look Asian? The outfits? Stereotypes. Cultural appropriation. Ignorant. 

[Starlight925]

30 minutes ago, Alonzo Mosely FBI said:

Before that I found it slightly problematic that Meredith (I think) maybe it was Lisa said she straightened her hair when they talked about their outfits upon arrival. Why straighten your hair, is that what makes you look Asian? The outfits? Stereotypes. Cultural appropriation. Ignorant. 

I thought the same thing.

The thing about these micro-aggressions is the lack of awareness by these women that these are, in fact, micro-aggressions.  Even if they're meant to be positive, they're stereotypes.

When Lisa brought up that she straightened her hair, I thought....where's the outrage?  Why is Lisa exempt from this?

I'm of a particular minority where one stereotype is a positive one, but I still don't like it when people say it to me.  Even as a little kid, it made me feel "Other'd".

Edited December 21, 2021 by Starlight925