Encanto (2021)

[Luckylyn]

I really loved this.   I got teary eyed towards the end.   Abuela’s fixation on the gifts made her so blind to whether or not her family as individuals were happy.   Her refusal to treat Mirabel as a worthy part of the family caused so much damage.  I think Mirabel’s lack of gift was intended as a reminder to Abuela that the gifts weren’t the most important thing and she just failed to recognize it.  All she had to do was love her and instead she treated Mirabel as a problem.  I loved the music.   

[Browncoat]

I just got back and I loved it as well.  The music was so good -- I was dancing in my seat!  And yep, totally teared up at the end.  Basically, ditto what you said, @Luckylyn!  

I enjoyed the short film before the movie, too.

[Luckylyn]

5 minutes ago, Browncoat said:

I just got back and I loved it as well.  The music was so good -- I was dancing in my seat!  And yep, totally teared up at the end.  Basically, ditto what you said, @Luckylyn!  

I enjoyed the short film before the movie, too.

I missed the short movie before the film because these people showed up late and found people in their reserved seats who refuse to get up.  After an argument the people who stole the seats got up and moved to the seats they were supposed to have.  Because their seats were directly in front of me my niece and I missed most of the short film.  Luckily, it was over before Ecanto started.

Otherwise it was a great movie theater experience.  The visuals were gorgeous.

[Spartan Girl]

Finally watched it now that it’s on Disney+ and I loved it. Don’t get me wrong, I wanted to see it in theaters, but knowing the exact date it would be on streaming…well, I figured it was better to wait. I actually think it was better than Raya and the Last Dragon.

On 11/26/2021 at 10:11 AM, Luckylyn said:

I got teary eyed towards the end.   Abuela’s fixation on the gifts made her so blind to whether or not her family as individuals were happy.   Her refusal to treat Mirabel as a worthy part of the family caused so much damage.  I think Mirabel’s lack of gift was intended as a reminder to Abuela that the gifts weren’t the most important thing and she just failed to recognize it.

Yes, just like in Coco, the family was the one with the problem, not the MC, specifically the grandmother who had to have things her way. But at least she came to her senses in the end.

Poir Bruno. Getting blamed for everything that went wrong even though the family KNEW he could see the future. I guess it’s always easier to blame the messenger when it’s something you don’t want to hear. Gee, what does that remind me of?

Liked how Isabella was initially bitchy, but lightened up when she realized that she liked not having to be perfect all the time. I’d get bored making nothing but conventionally pretty flowers too—though thst animation was lovely.

Stephanie Beatriz was fantastic, as was Lin-Manuel Miranda’s music.

[Wiendish Fitch]

18 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

Finally watched it now that it’s on Disney+ and I loved it. Don’t get me wrong, I wanted to see it in theaters, but knowing the exact date it would be on streaming…well, I figured it was better to wait. I actually think it was better than Raya and the Last Dragon.

For one thing... no Namaari! Yay! Already several steps up!

Encanto was just lovely. I love how, like in last year's Soul, Disney has released a film that, without pandering in a shallow and saccharine way, assures us that we all matter. We matter even if we're not the smartest, strongest, most talented, whatever. We all have something to bring to the table, and no one should ever make you feel "less than". Mirabel may not have had a magical talent, but she had her own gifts that were ultimately much more meaningful: fortitude, positivity, bravery, and love for family. I also liked that, while Mirabel wasn't bitter over not having a magical ability, she was still human enough to be a little uneasy and blue over it (I'd feel the same way)

Every time I think Disney's animation can't get any better, they surpass themselves yet again. From the embroidered details of Mirabel's dress to the fine hairs and pores on characters faces, I was just astonished.

The character designs were just delightful, and I loved the variety of everyone's looks. I also appreciated that they didn't make Luisa's strength and brawny figure an object of ridicule. She was gorgeous, confident, and everyone admired her. Bonus points for showing that having magical gifts can actually kind of suck, from the high demands and expectations to the devastation you can feel if you lose it.

Yikes, did anyone else catch that incest joke?!! Dang, Disney!

Bruno's situation was sad, the family was way too hard on him (causing him to be way too hard on himself). Not sure how I feel about that plot point.

The music was fun, though maybe not quite as memorable as Moana. The musical sequences, on the other hand? An absolute delight, can't think of a single bad one.

I thought the cousin who could shape-shift would be revealed as a villain, but that didn't happen. That's good, because why do shape-shifters always have to be evil, anyway?

[Spartan Girl]

18 minutes ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

Yikes, did anyone else catch that incest joke?!! Dang, Disney!

Omg yes Bruno’s telenovela!!!! I can’t believe they went there. Kind of felt like that was a GOT dig 🤣🤣🤣🤣

I couldn’t help drawing parallels to Coco in how the family conflict was caused by the matriarch’s reaction to heartbreak. Imelda banished music from the family (and inadvertently got Hector nearly wiped from existence) because she thought it was the only way to keep the family together, while Alma tried to make the family was perfect as possible so that they’d always be “worthy” of magical protection. And both wound up pushing their family away in the process. The road to hell is always paved with good intentions.

Edited December 25, 2021 by Spartan Girl

[Frost]

I loved Encanto and plan a rewatch today!   I'm curious as to how the shapeshifting gift is supposed to help the community?  Even Antonio's gift for communicating with animals would be beneficial.  Creating beauty, controlling weather, healing, seeing the future, super strength, etc can all be used for "good."  I've been combing my mind, trying to come up with a communal benefit for shapeshifting into other people.  

[Guest]

I loved it. I really liked that everyone felt complex and was struggling with the impossible expectations in their own way. Everyone could find someone to relate to. 

It’s amazing what Lin brings to the music. Each song was fun and enhanced the plot. I wonder which song is going to get pushed for the Oscar. Waiting on a Miracle, Surface Pressure and We Don’t Talk About Bruno are all worthy. The way he layered everyone’s lines at the end of We Don’t Talk About Bruno is a thing of beauty. 

1 hour ago, Frost said:

I'm curious as to how the shapeshifting gift is supposed to help the community?

The opening song did a really good job of highlighting each of their strengths. He benefits the community by making people happy.  “My primo Camilo won't stop until he makes you smile today“. He also shapeshifted into a mother to take a fussy baby. 

Edited December 26, 2021 by Guest

[Guest]

On 11/26/2021 at 7:11 AM, Luckylyn said:

I think Mirabel’s lack of gift was intended as a reminder to Abuela that the gifts weren’t the most important thing and she just failed to recognize it.  All she had to do was love her and instead she treated Mirabel as a problem.  I loved the music.   

It occurred to me that Abuela suffered the same insecurities has Maribel because she also didn’t have a gift. She was constantly trying to prove they deserved the miracle through her children and grandchildren. 

[absnow54]

7 hours ago, Dani said:

I wonder which song is going to get pushed for the Oscar. Waiting on a Miracle, Surface Pressure and We Don’t Talk About Bruno are all worthy. The way he layered everyone’s lines at the end of We Don’t Talk About Bruno is a thing of beauty. 

It looks like “Dos Oruguitas” is getting the primary awards push. It’s the song near the end when Alma tells Meribel about Pedro’s sacrifice. I agree with others that the songs weren’t as uniquely memorable as Moana’s, but they were very catchy, especially “We Don’t Talk About Bruno.” And “Dos Oruguitas” got me pretty misty eyed. 

[GaT]

Just watched this & enjoyed it. It was beautiful to look at, the colors were just wonderful. But unless I missed it, weren't Isabella & Mirabel supposed to hug it out? I don't remember seeing that.

[Sara2009]

11 hours ago, GaT said:

Just watched this & enjoyed it. It was beautiful to look at, the colors were just wonderful. But unless I missed it, weren't Isabella & Mirabel supposed to hug it out? I don't remember seeing that.

They do near the end of “ What Else Can I Do?”

 

 

[Dandesun]

I really loved this. It made me super emotional, too. The songs are so catchy, I've got 'We Don't Talk About Bruno' in my head and have for the past week. I think the thing I liked best was aside from the two relationships that needed the most work, there wasn't meanness within the family. There was so much love surrounding them all. I loved all the different colors in everything, how bright it all was.

Yeah, I really loved this movie. I did have to put closed captions on because I missed so much in the opening song. It all went so fast! But once I did that, everything was fine.

And Far From the Tree was really moving too. Loved them both.

[Brn2bwild]

They kept saying Mirabel never got a gift but it seems like she did?  The gift of sensitivity to the magic's strength?

[Frost]

I guess Mirabel's ability to sense the magic wasn't considered a "gift" since her door shut down and she never got her own room.  I liked that it wasn't until Mirabel was asked "what do you see?" and looked at her own reflection in the doorknob and said, "Me." that she was able to fully open to the magic.  I took me until the 3rd watching (I'm obsessed by this movie! 😄) to realize how important that moment was.  Mirabel finally accepted that she was perfect just as "me," without any magic, and independent of her family.  Poor Louisa started losing her power when she was worried that she could never do enough, even though she was running herself ragged trying to help everyone.  It's a really interesting message: family and community loyalty is great, but don't lose yourself in the bargain.  

It's actually kind of subversive for Disney.  My family is incredibly important to me, but I am also myself, separate and distinct.  

[angora]

I finally had a chance to see this over Christmas. My first instinct watching it was "pretty good," up until the last act when everything really kicked up a notch, but the film has really stuck with me. I've been thinking about it all week, and I'm still in the "listen to this and only this" phase of a new Lin-Manuel Miranda album. 

For the songs, "Surface Pressure" is the one that really wrecks me, but there's a lot of really great music here. I also love "Waiting on a Miracle," "All of You," and of course, "We Don't Talk about Bruno"--every LMM score needs at least one sequence of 3-4 different melodies layered on top of each other!

I thought the film did a nice job of giving Mirabel a strong central journey while still getting different amounts of dimension on the other characters as well. My favorites were Luisa (again with the "Surface Pressure"), Bruno (I still haven't recovered from the image of his plate scratched into the table,) and sweet little Antonio. I also really like that the "villain" is just unaddressed trauma, with Abuela being so terrified of what happened to her in the past that she's obsessively trying to protect the family's home/the miracle at the expense of the actual family. And we see how her expectations and exacting manner affect a LOT of people in the family, not just Mirabel. Bruno, Pepa, Isabela, and Luisa have all been caught in it too.

And goodness gracious, the animation is just spectacular! Just an explosion of color everywhere. Mirabel's outfit is so pretty, and I swear I can see every individual hair on her head.

[Llywela]

On 12/30/2021 at 4:16 PM, Frost said:

It's actually kind of subversive for Disney.  My family is incredibly important to me, but I am also myself, separate and distinct.  

Plus the whole story is centred around the refugee experience, which also seems kinda subversive, for Disney.

[Matt K]

On 12/26/2021 at 9:01 PM, absnow54 said:

It looks like “Dos Oruguitas” is getting the primary awards push. It’s the song near the end when Alma tells Meribel about Pedro’s sacrifice. I agree with others that the songs weren’t as uniquely memorable as Moana’s, but they were very catchy, especially “We Don’t Talk About Bruno.” And “Dos Oruguitas” got me pretty misty eyed. 

That's probably what I would have chosen as well, it's such a beautiful song and encapsulates a lot of the message of the movie.  They also played it over the end credits.  

 

I'm generally not a fan of musicals but this movie was amazing.  Surprisingly, I loved how the songs fit into the movie as a whole (plus they were great).  

Abuela was such an interesting character.  A lot of who she became was based out of that tragic beginning.  Like it's not just that the magical flame created the encanto and gave her family gifts but that the magic itself was tied into the death of her husband trying to protect the refugees.  Plus only her family were actually gifted with powers.  She definitely had survivor's remorse and I could see how she took the magic coming from her husband's sacrifice to mean that it was to be used to help the rest of the refugees no matter what.   

I'm having a little difficulty getting all my thoughts coherent for the movie but I really loved it.  

[SeanC]

LMM is such a great songwriter, every song has so many little lyrical details that you only get several listens in -- like in "What Else Can I Do?", where Isabela's line "I'm coming through with tabebuia" is echoed by the non-plant-aficionado Mirabel as "she's coming through with that booyah!"

[tennisgurl]

That was so delightful, its probably my favorite recent Disney movie, which is impressive as I have really enjoyed all of their recent output, but unlike those, I really have no complaints, not even nitpicky ones. I loved the characters, the music, the story, the animation, and the lessons that were learned at the end. I really like that there was no villain in the story, the only villain was the issues within the family and the only way to fight it was for everyone to finally be honest about how they were feeling and for Abuela to realize how she was looking at her family only through the lens of their magic (or lack thereof) and not at them as people. Abuela was such an interesting character, she was still clearly dealing with horrible grief and trauma after being forced to flee her home and losing her husband, and while she truly loves her family she became so obsessed with making this perfect life for them and making sure that they were helping their community and deserving of their gift that she lost sight of them actually being happy. I also enjoyed the lesson that, while family is important, its also important to have your own life and to find your own identity outside of them. 

Mirabel was a really likable protagonist, I appreciate how much she tried to stay positive despite not getting a gift and how much that clearly hurt her, and the lesson learned was a really good one, that you don't have to be "special" to be a worthy person and while "your special just the way you are" is often seen as a rather trite message common in family films, its still a really good one and they managed to make it fresh and relatable. The rest of the supporting characters were all great as well, so much that I hope that in a possible sequel we get more of them. Luisa, Antonio (and his various animal sidekicks) and poor Bruno were probably my favorites. Poor guy, its not his fault that he saw bad things coming and then they happened, but I guess its easy to shoot the messenger. I wonder if he mostly saw bad things and not good things because of his own self esteem issues, as it seems like a lot of the magic is attached to emotions? Or if he did see good things also but everyone only focused on the bad? Seeing the future sounds like it would be a pretty stressful power, probably followed by super hearing, which just sounds exhausting. 

The animation was as wonderful as ever with Disney, but what made this stand out was that, in a story that was mostly focused on one location, unlike a lot of Disney films, so they could focus on animating more mundane things like clothes, hair, houses, and they really made everything look magical, even just things like Mirabel's skirt and Isabela's hair. Of course we also got the lovely animation of the magic, especially Isabela's flowers and cacti, and of course the magical living house, which impressively made a house a likable endearing character on its own. 

Its also interesting that the magic is never really "explained" beyond it probably being created by Pedro's death protecting his family and the villagers, nor is it explained why Mirabel never got a gift. All we know is that its tied to the candle and to the emotions of the Madrigal family. I quite like that its not explained, in the vein of the magical realism genre that has long been a part of South American literature, especially in Columbia, the setting of the film and the home of Gabriel García Márquez, one of the pioneers of the genre. In fact, the whole plot feels a bit like a riff on his classic novel, 100 Years of Solitude, being the story of multiple generations of a family that founded their village and which magic seems to follow. 

Lin-Manuel Miranda is always always working on so many excellent projects, I sometimes feel a bit concerned. When does the guy sleep?

[blackwing]

I enjoyed it overall.  I'm curious as to why they decided to release on The Plus so quickly, only after 4 weeks in the theater.  We were going to see this in the theater but then I saw it on The Plus so stayed home instead.  Do studios account for streaming when considering the profits of a particular movie?  Like do they have some kind of calculation each month that says something like "We took in $200MM in streaming subscription revenue in January.  Viewers viewed 5 million programmes.  Encanto was 200K views.  So we need to attribute 200K/5MM x $200MM = $8MM to Encanto's revenue."

Because right now, the Wikipedia entry currently says that Encanto has earned $206MM at the box office worldwide and needs to make $400MM to break even.  I'm not sure if it's going to get there since it is now available on streaming.

On 12/26/2021 at 12:11 PM, Dani said:

It’s amazing what Lin brings to the music. Each song was fun and enhanced the plot. I wonder which song is going to get pushed for the Oscar. Waiting on a Miracle, Surface Pressure and We Don’t Talk About Bruno are all worthy. The way he layered everyone’s lines at the end of We Don’t Talk About Bruno is a thing of beauty. 

I think the music was good but I can't think of one song that has remained with me in my head, and I saw it just 3 days ago.  I think Lin Manuel is a great artist, but my feeling is that many of his songs end up sounding the same and relying on the same tricks, the fast speaking/talking/rapping wordplay that is prevalent in a lot of his work.

[scarynikki12]

2 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Poor guy, its not his fault that he saw bad things coming and then they happened, but I guess its easy to shoot the messenger. I wonder if he mostly saw bad things and not good things because of his own self esteem issues, as it seems like a lot of the magic is attached to emotions? Or if he did see good things also but everyone only focused on the bad? Seeing the future sounds like it would be a pretty stressful power, probably followed by super hearing, which just sounds exhausting. 

It looked like his visions were vague enough that he would get them wrong (thinking Mirabel was the reason they were losing their magic) but specific enough that he gave them more weight than they needed (the hug with Isa that seemed crucial but was a blink and miss it moment after her revelatory number). I think he just didn’t know how to correctly interpret them and went the negative route since he was getting blamed for things going wrong anyway. 

[calliope1975]

I liked the movie but didn't love it, but it's stuck with me for the last few days. Listening to the soundtrack is definitely changing my opinion a bit. Other than WDTAB, none of the songs impressed me at first, but listening again, there's sooo much in each of them, that they have now become earworms. 

I think I need to watch again to catch everything. Like Dolores talking about Bruno in the present tense because she knows he's there (you can even see him in the background during her part in WDTAB, which I missed until I watched the clip on YouTube. The characters were so well done without the typical stereotypes that could come with strong woman or beautiful girl, but when they were able to embrace who they really wanted to be, they also didn't change a la Sandy at the end of Grease. (Not the perfect example, but the same idea-ish.) They just got to be their real, imperfect selves. And all the shades of people in Colombia - yes, please. More of that. 

And I know LMM getting some backlash lately for being everywhere or whatever, but I love the way he wordplays and layers lyrics. "I grow rows and rows of roses." My language loving brain ADORES that. 

I think the biggest thing that's still kinda bothering me is Mirabel not having a thing. I know her thing was saving the family and it's okay to be "normal" in a family of observable powers, but my heart broke for baby Mirabel watching her door disappear. She deserves an awesome room and door, too, Casita!!! I've read the idea that her thing is her attachment and understanding of the house and her door disappeared because she is the house, but I still want her to get a room, lol. 

[Morrigan2575]

29 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

It looked like his visions were vague enough that he would get them wrong (thinking Mirabel was the reason they were losing their magic) but specific enough that he gave them more weight than they needed (the hug with Isa that seemed crucial but was a blink and miss it moment after her revelatory number). I think he just didn’t know how to correctly interpret them and went the negative route since he was getting blamed for things going wrong anyway. 

I think it falls under prophecy can be misunderstood or only partial. For instance he told Dolores that the man she loved would be betrothed to another...which was true he was supposed to marry Isabella. However, in the end, the betrothal was broken and Dolores got her HEA.

Same with Isabella, he predicted that her power would grow and it did but, not on her own, she needed Mirabel to push her. 

With Miracles the original prophecy was true, she both broke and restored the magic. Bruno kept saying it could go either way, when in reality it was both and seems it has to be both.

I'm still iffy on some stuff with Mirabel and the magic/her gift/no gift. I know that neither Alma nor Mirabel have gifts but, I still think they have power, or more to the point the magic/miracle comes from/through them.

I've seen stuff about how it's the family breakdown that fuels the magic breaking but, I really think it's the cracks/breakdown between Mirabel/Alma.

Of course I'm probably totally wrong

 

[Dandesun]

I've watched this movie about 5 times now and I cry every damn time 'Dos Oruguitas' starts. And then I'm a wreck through the entirety of 'All of You' as well.

I'd say it's a success as a film, for me at least.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, blackwing said:

I think the music was good but I can't think of one song that has remained with me in my head, and I saw it just 3 days ago.  I think Lin Manuel is a great artist, but my feeling is that many of his songs end up sounding the same and relying on the same tricks, the fast speaking/talking/rapping wordplay that is prevalent in a lot of his work.

For me, the music has been stuck in my head since I watched a week ago. Today I caught myself singing Family Madrigal even though it’s not my favorite. Surface Pressure and We Don’t Talk About Bruno also pop into my head frequently. It really just personal preference and LMM’s writing style works really well for me. It’s not really about the rapid wordplay but how infectious the beat is and how well the lyrics are integrated into the music. 

8 hours ago, blackwing said:

I enjoyed it overall.  I'm curious as to why they decided to release on The Plus so quickly, only after 4 weeks in the theater.  We were going to see this in the theater but then I saw it on The Plus so stayed home instead.  Do studios account for streaming when considering the profits of a particular movie?  Like do they have some kind of calculation each month that says something like "We took in $200MM in streaming subscription revenue in January.  Viewers viewed 5 million programmes.  Encanto was 200K views.  So we need to attribute 200K/5MM x $200MM = $8MM to Encanto's revenue."

Because right now, the Wikipedia entry currently says that Encanto has earned $206MM at the box office worldwide and needs to make $400MM to break even.  I'm not sure if it's going to get there since it is now available on streaming.

On 12/26/2021 at 10:11 AM, Dani said:

They do take it into to account but not in a direct way. As for why it went to Disney+ so early it’s probably because most releases have been extremely front loaded lately and Spider-Man was going to decimate all the other releases. It was more valuable for it to drive subscriptions and limit churn. 

5 hours ago, calliope1975 said:

And I know LMM getting some backlash lately for being everywhere or whatever, but I love the way he wordplays and layers lyrics. "I grow rows and rows of roses." My language loving brain ADORES that. 

I feel the same way. 

[Frost]

21 hours ago, calliope1975 said:

WDTAB

What is this?

[calliope1975]

We Don't Talk About Bruno

[Luckylyn]

Delores listening to Bruno’s rat novellas

https://youtube.com/shorts/yiDj6OdTMsU?feature=share

 

[kiddo82]

Those videos are hysterical.  I love how every one begins with Mirabel bashing. "Buenos dias to everyone--except Mirabel."  It's so wrong but you know that's not far off from how abuela treats her.

[shantown]

I haven't seen the movie, but "We Don't Talk About Bruno" has been stuck in my head since seeing it in a TikTok over a week ago. I think I'm going to have to seek it out, if only to get a different earworm stuck in my head!

[Spartan Girl]

Rewatched this with my friend last night, and she loved it too. But during the “Dos Oruguitas” sequences, I just realized that Alma is the rare Disney character that gets a full-fledged ugly cry while watching Pedro get murdered. It’s telling how different it is from the first version of the story we see at the beginning, Alma deliberately watering down the trauma and raw grief. It really emphasizes how she felt the only way forward was to harden herself and focus on perfecting everything to keep magical protection. While it doesn’t condone how she treated Mirabel and the rest of the family, it at least helps us understand and sympathize.

But if I have to see one more take from the Twidiots trashing her as the worst Disney parent ever, I’ll scream. Really?! I can think of tons that were worse!

 Also, they apparently were fine with Namaari in Raya being a two-faced backstabbing bitch who never apologized for anything she did, but somehow Alma’s sincere apology to Mirabel and Bruno wasn’t good enough?! 🤦‍♀️

Edited January 23, 2022 by Spartan Girl

[Wiendish Fitch]

27 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

But if I have to see one more take from the Twidiots trashing her as the worst Disney parent ever, I’ll scream. Really?! I can think of tons that were worse!

 Also, they apparently were fine with Namaari in Raya being a two-faced backstabbing bitch who never apologized for anything she did, but somehow Alma’s sincere apology to Mirabel and Bruno wasn’t good enough?! 🤦‍♀️

But, but... Namaari's young! And HAWT! And has a cute haircut! And looks good in fanart! Of course she's above and beyond reproach! 

*Gag/sigh combo*

I appreciated how complicated and flawed Alma was; she really didn't mean to hurt anyone, but she did without realizing it, which the majority of us are guilty of in some form or another. She was called out for her wrong-doing, saw the error of her ways, felt genuine remorse, sincerely apologized, and made a concerted effort to atone. Sadly, that's more than most people are willing to do in real life.

 I mean, shit, at least Alma's actions didn't trigger the near-apocalypse!

[scarynikki12]

I think Dos Oruguitas was the first time Alma had told the full story of Pedro's death to anyone who wasn't present for it. All of her children and grandchildren knew the sanitized version we saw to open the movie but she left out the extent of her own agony and the lingering effect it had on her. 

[Bill1978]

8 hours ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

I appreciated how complicated and flawed Alma was; she really didn't mean to hurt anyone, but she did without realizing it, which the majority of us are guilty of in some form or another. She was called out for her wrong-doing, saw the error of her ways, felt genuine remorse, sincerely apologized, and made a concerted effort to atone. Sadly, that's more than most people are willing to do in real life.

Guess this is why the Twidiots deem her the worse parent ever because in their eyes once you make a mistake you should be cancelled and not allow to apologise, learn and grow as a person. She just shows them how silly they are when they discover a tweet from 2010 when the person was 12 and insist they are the worse person in the world and should never earn another dime in their life.

[GaT]

9 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

somehow Alma’s sincere apology to Mirabel and Bruno wasn’t good enough?! 🤦‍♀️

Excuse me, but, We don't talk about Bruno, no, no, no

[Spartan Girl]

Stephanie decided to do her own Encanto/Hamilton mashup:

 

[SlovakPrincess]

Watched this with my nephew and, I feel bad saying this, but I didn't love the music in this movie.  

However, overall I loved the movie itself.   I had great sympathy for the grandmother once she acknowledged how wrong she had been to treat Mirabel the way she did and it was made clear why she was so rigidly protective of the magic and her family maintaining this standard she felt was necessary.   Mirabel, Luisa and Bruno were probably my favorite characters, but the grandmother was a pretty great complex character.

But is it weird that I was a little disappointed when the magic returned at the very end?  I thought the point was that the family was ready to live without relying on magic to define and protect them, and the village (when they all came to rebuild the house) showed that they loved and appreciated the family even without benefitting from the Madrigals' magical gifts. 

Edited January 24, 2022 by SlovakPrincess

[JessePinkman]

I can see how badly Alma's trauma effected her but all of these people screaming Generational Trauma and thinking that a singular sincere apology makes up for decades of mental abuse are something else. She mistreated her own grandchild and ruled the casita with such an iron fist that her own children and grandchildren couldn't even discuss their own brother/uncle. He was exiled from the family and had to live in the walls for a decade! And this happened when he was 40!

That said I don't think she's evil at all (and agreed there are much worse parents in the Disney canon). She was absolutely doing what she thought was best for herself and her family but I refuse to excuse bad behavior just because you're dragging around trauma on your back.

@SlovakPrincess

Quote

Watched this with my nephew and, I feel bad saying this, but I didn't love the music in this movie.  

I didn't love the majority of the songs either. 'Bruno' and 'Dos Oruguitas' (I was a mess at the end) were the highlights for me (and I know people love 'Surface Pressure' but it hurts my ears).

Edited January 24, 2022 by JessePinkman

[Spartan Girl]

7 minutes ago, JessePinkman said:

I can see how badly Alma's trauma effected her but all of these people screaming Generational Trauma and thinking that a singular sincere apology makes up for decades of mental abuse are something else. She mistreated her own grandchild and ruled the casita with such an iron fist that her own children and grandchildren couldn't even discuss their own brother/uncle. He was exiled from the family and had to live in the walls for a decade! And this happened when he was 40!

Not saying one apology makes up for any of that. It doesn't. But having seen the error of her ways, there was still time to try to be a better mother and grandmother. That was the takeaway for me.

Edited January 24, 2022 by Spartan Girl

[JessePinkman]

7 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

Not saying one apology makes up for any of that. It doesn't. But having seen the error of her ways, there was still time to try to be a better mother and grandmother. That was the takeaway for me.

I agree, I don't think the movie's intention was to say "Hey abuela apologized, it's all good now". They're clearly still a lot of healing to do. I was commenting on the discourse I've seen elsewhere about the movie.

Edited January 24, 2022 by JessePinkman

[SeanC]

30 minutes ago, JessePinkman said:

She mistreated her own grandchild and ruled the casita with such an iron fist that her own children and grandchildren couldn't even discuss their own brother/uncle. He was exiled from the family and had to live in the walls for a decade! And this happened when he was 40!

Alma wasn’t shown forbidding any mention of Bruno — Pepa, for one, also seemed to instinctively dislike hearing about him for reasons that had nothing to do with their mother.

Nor did she exile Bruno, he left because of how the whole community seemingly reacted to him.

 

[JessePinkman]

26 minutes ago, SeanC said:

Alma wasn’t shown forbidding any mention of Bruno — Pepa, for one, also seemed to instinctively dislike hearing about him for reasons that had nothing to do with their mother.

Nor did she exile Bruno, he left because of how the whole community seemingly reacted to him.

It seemed like the reaction to him came from the top down but maybe you're right.

[angora]

The way Alma/members of the family/the village treated Bruno was definitely at play, but he says the reason he left is because of the vision he had after Mirabel’s failed ceremony. Its outcome was unclear, but he figured “everyone would assume the worst, because I’m Bruno,” and he didn’t want Mirabel to be treated like he was.

What’s interesting is that Bruno’s decision to leave to protect Mirabel was probably a big contributing factor in the whole “we don’t talk about Bruno” thing. Obviously, his prophecies freaked a lot of people out and he became this kind of boogie man figure, but Alma thinks he deliberately turned his back on them, and her anger/hurt over that perception probably caused people to realize “don’t mention Bruno or Abuela will get upset.” There’s a moment toward the climax when Mirabel brings up Bruno and Alma snaps, “Bruno abandoned this family!”

And on the “one apology (no matter how sincere) isn’t enough” front, I think Bruno will be living proof of that. The Madrigals are in a better, healthier place at the end of the movie, but the tics and idiosyncrasies Bruno developed to cope with his years of isolation aren’t going to just go away. Every time he does his little rituals, Alma is going to have to think about her role in everything he suffered.

[Bill1978]

On 1/25/2022 at 4:07 AM, JessePinkman said:

I didn't love the majority of the songs either. 'Bruno' and 'Dos Oruguitas' (I was a mess at the end) were the highlights for me (and I know people love 'Surface Pressure' but it hurts my ears).

Glad I'm not the only one who wasn't totally blown away by the songs. I think 'Bruno' is the best of the cast songs and 'Dos Oruguitas' is suitably emotional and a highlight of the movie, theses are the two songs I've been listening to over and over. But overall well as I said to a friend the songs sound like well polished Dora The Explorer songs. I know that LMM gets a lot of praise for his talents but I am yet to be blown away by anything he has written. I have gotten tired of the rap singing he infuses into all his songs - I get it LM you can write rap. I also feel the production of the songs lent heavily into hoping the songs would hit the radio - Surface Pressure is a good example where there are invisible backing singers. (The presentation of some of the songs in the movie adaptation of Hairspray also suffered from this.

The other thing that was off putting was the presentation of the numbers where the characters sang directly into the camera or knew they were singing a song. Compare the framing of The Family Madrigal with the framing of Belle from Beauty and the Beast. Both songs serve a similar purpose of introducing characters but at no point during Belle do the characters act like or are given lyrics that indicate they know they are in a musical. It just takes me out of the musical concept if the characters know they are singing when that's not part of the plot (like say Enchanted or Buffy's Once More With Feeling).

I also feel LMM needs to work on leading into and out of a song, the best musicals are where the songs begin without you even knowing a song is about to start and then it seamlessly works back into the spoken word at the end. But I guess when the directors decide to frame most of the songs as music video clips, it was a bit hard for LMM to ease in and out of the songs with the script. Unfortunately, most of the songs in Encanto could be removed and nothing would be lost plot wise. Also another big no from me. I also felt it wasn't necessary to have 3 I Want songs either - really took focus away from Mirabel.

It sounds like I hate the movie, but I didn't. I really enjoyed it and have recommended it to everyone who asks what they should watch next. And I am grateful that for the time being 'We Don't Talk About Bruno' has made people forget about their obsession with 'Let It Go;

 

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, Bill1978 said:

I also feel the production of the songs lent heavily into hoping the songs would hit the radio - Surface Pressure is a good example where there are invisible backing singers.

The donkeys? 

29 minutes ago, Bill1978 said:

The other thing that was off putting was the presentation of the numbers where the characters sang directly into the camera or knew they were singing a song.

I was really curious about what they were going for in this aspect because it did straddle a weird line of awareness. There were a few points where I almost felt like the songs were Mirabel having a power that allowed her to hear what the others were feeling. Basically the animated equivalent to Zoey’s Extraordinary Playlist. Or her creating these fantasy sequences in her mind like Crazy Ex-Girlfriend. Particularly in Waiting on a Miracle she had some kind of prophetic experience that is never delved into. 

I have seen the theory that when Mirabel wiped her hands after touching the candle at her door ceremony she wiped off the power. I watched with someone who asked if Mirabel was the candle at the end. Both of those ideas make me speculate that she did embody the magic and developed an empathic ability allowing her to tap into others and the casita’s emotions. 

40 minutes ago, Bill1978 said:

Unfortunately, most of the songs in Encanto could be removed and nothing would be lost plot wise.

On this point I completely disagree. Without the songs Mirabel never sees the cracks in the house or bonds with her sisters enough to put the pieces together. The characters emotional journeys is told in those songs. Considering the whole plot is about generational trauma the plot can’t be told without the songs. 

[A.Ham]

Well, I loved this. And yes, there are two songs I want to listen to outside of the movie--"We don't talk about Bruno" and "Dos orugitas" I mean, from the first verse I fell in love with Dos orugitas. Watched it in English and then in Spanish, and discovered more little details on second viewing. 

[AimingforYoko]

Move over "A Whole New World", Encanto's "We Don't Talk About Bruno" becomes the second Disney song to top Billboard's Hot 100.

[Luckylyn]

28 minutes ago, AimingforYoko said:

Move over "A Whole New World", Encanto's "We Don't Talk About Bruno" becomes the second Disney song to top Billboard's Hot 100.

If he wins the Oscar he’ll be the only person to have won  pulitzer prize in addition to the EGOT right?

[SeanC]

51 minutes ago, Luckylyn said:

If he wins the Oscar he’ll be the only person to have won  pulitzer prize in addition to the EGOT right?

Richard Rodgers and Marvin Hamlisch also did that.