S01.E04: The Dragon Reborn

[paulvdb]

Quote

Moiraine struggles with uncertainty while Lan struggles with their new companion. Rand wonders about Mat and Mat starts to wonder at himself. Egwene and Perrin take their first steps down a different path. An incredible new power is unleashed on the world.

Premiere date: November 26, 2021

[AnimeMania]

Premiere date: November 25, 2021

[Zonk]

So Nynaeve is the fifth one. Have to say I was 99% sure about that one the moment the fifth one came up. Guess she lied about her age or it was unclear due to her being orphaned or the age isn't as important?

It also seems more and more likely that all five of them are the dragon. Maybe his soul broke apart when the world broke or something.

Also that breaking of the world set them back thosands of years? Are we going to see some fallen down skyscrapers at some point?

[Kate47]

1 hour ago, Zonk said:

Are we going to see some fallen down skyscrapers at some point?

We have! From episode one: 

 

[paigow]

Logain was like Eddie Brock but with 2 wispy Venoms???? Did they jump into a new host?

[quarks]

Nynaeve! 

This is what happens, Logain and Logain's Army, when you interrupt a Cute Close to Flirting Scene. Things go bang. I hope you learned your lesson.

 

 

[MissLucas]

Best episode so far. Good balance between exposition and action. Nynaeve being the/another dragon was not a surprise after last week's episod but I loved how it played out. 

I also liked how we got more glimpses of the various branches of Aes Sedai (helpfully color coded I guess that's where Bardugo got the idea for her Grisha outfits) and the relationship they have with their Warders through the eyes of Nynaeve. 

Mat is an idiot for keeping that dagger. Good fake-out (or wasn't it???) in the farmhouse letting us think that he had murdered the family. 

So, if men can't hold the One Power why does Moraine even consider Perrin, Mat and Rand as valuable candidates? And is that the reason the other Aes Sedai and the ...uhm Not-Amaryllis are wary of her?

Egwene and Perrin's plot was dragging but I suspect the philosophy of the Leaf will come into play later on.

[Humbugged]

3 minutes ago, MissLucas said:

Best episode so far. Good balance between exposition and action. Nynaeve being the/another dragon was not a surprise after last week's episod but I loved how it played out. 

I also liked how we got more glimpses of the various branches of Aes Sedai (helpfully color coded I guess that's where Bardugo got the idea for her Grisha outfits) and the relationship they have with their Warders through the eyes of Nynaeve. 

Mat is an idiot for keeping that dagger. Good fake-out (or wasn't it???) in the farmhouse letting us think that he had murdered the family. 

So, if men can't hold the One Power why does Moraine even consider Perrin, Mat and Rand as valuable candidates? And is that the reason the other Aes Sedai and the ...uhm Not-Amaryllis are wary of her?

Egwene and Perrin's plot was dragging but I suspect the philosophy of the Leaf will come into play later on.

Men can hold the One Power as was shown in Ep 1 , and with Logain this week and the story of Owen from Thom - it just drives them mad

Mat's dagger was blood free . And everybody who has ever read the books thought he was an idiot for keeping the dagger

[MissLucas]

Just now, Humbugged said:

Men can hold the One Power as was shown in Ep 1 , and with Logain this week and the story of Owen from Thom - it just drives them mad

Mat's dagger was blood free . And everybody who has ever read the books thought he was an idiot for keeping the dagger

That's what I meant, if they go bonkers why even bother with those three?

Evil dagger might have a lotus coating 😁 

[staphdude]

6 minutes ago, MissLucas said:

That's what I meant, if they go bonkers why even bother with those three?

Evil dagger might have a lotus coating 😁 

The most common Fantasy Trope is that the Hero/Heroine overcomes humble beginnings or overwhelming odds/circumstances

[munchiewoman]

5 minutes ago, MissLucas said:

That's what I meant, if they go bonkers why even bother with those three?

Because if the Dragon is a man who will go mad, they need to find him. If the Dragon is a man, a raging sun can do a lot of damage. That's why they're afraid of the Dragon being reborn.  You have Reds who believe the power was not intended for men to use at all (as Liandrin said in the first episode), those who believe the Dragon will break the world again and others who believe he may save it (as Logain was saying). So much uncertainty about what the Dragon will do once he is reborn. 

[quarks]

Definitely my favorite episode so far. Mostly because of Nynaeve, but not just Nynaeve.  The Tinker stuff seemed to be mostly character setup, sure, but I thought it was solid character setup, and I liked the discussion between Perrin and Illa about choosing non-violence, and why, and Aram explaining that yes, the Tinkers do leave their community to try other lifestyles, and not everyone comes back. I'm still not feeling Perrin yet, but I still thought this was a good episode for him.

I'm also not feeling Rand yet, but his conversations with Thom and Mat were pretty good. And that poor little girl and her little doll.

But mostly this was Nynaeve's episode - everything from her conversations with Lan and the other Warders, to her conversation with Liandrin, to that final moment of healing everyone and exploding with the One Power - Yes. All confirming Nynaeve as my hands down favorite so far. 

[DoctorAtomic]

2 hours ago, Humbugged said:

And everybody who has ever read the books thought he was an idiot for keeping the dagger

This is true. And Mat's always been my favorite. 

 

Edited November 26, 2021 by DoctorAtomic

[DearEvette]

This was a pretty badass and exciting episode.

I liked getting more face time with the other Aes Sedai and warders.  I have always had a soft spot for the Green Ajah.  They are the battle Ajah after all and they like getting their freak on with their double warders LOL.  I loved watching them letting loose.

Thom Merillin gets more interesting with each episode. 

That damn dagger!  And yes, I was a book reader who thought Mat was incredibly stupid for keeping the damn dagger especially since it was obvious it was tainted by Shadar Logoth evil.

I admit I am no fan of the Red Ajah, but given the level of Logain's power that they all seemed incredibly unprepared for, I was in sympathy with their stance on the matter. It is all well and good for the Amyrlin to insist he get a trial but it seemed like the traveling sisters were all soldiers and no generals.  There should have been someone at least given the authority to make field decisions.  Doing stuff by committee or adhering to the Amyrlin's edicts no matter what is ripe for just the sort of FUBAR situation they got.  Especially since as they said Tar Valon was hundreds of miles away.  And they knew he hand an Army and was charismatic enough to win over kings.  But I guess more than anything is showed that the Tower is more divided than just what Ajah a sister chooses.

I  do have to give kudos to the actor who played Logain.  His face acting as they were gentling him, ripping the One power away was well done.  He looked like he was experiencing an indelible loss and you can see him fighting it while simultaneously mourning it.  His madness fed his megalomania, but I couldn't help but feel a little sorry for him in the end.

But this episode belonged to  Nynaeve!!!

She was my book favorite character and her braid/braids are iconic.   I loved seeing her One Power her Braids right out of their neat coil.  LOL.  And her look of shock, Moraine's look of shock, Lan's look of shock -- the sheer WTFery of everybody at that ending.  What a high to end the episode on.

Edited November 26, 2021 by DearEvette

[staphdude]

25 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

She was my book favorite character and her braid/braids are iconic.   I loved seeing her One Power her Braids right out of their neat coil.  LOL.  And her look of shock, Moraine's look of shock, Lan's look of shock -- the sheer WTFery of everybody at that ending.  What a high to end the episode on.

Opposite for me. She always had a big fish in a small pond air about her and treats people with undue arrogance

[DoctorAtomic]

I did enjoy Perrin's time with the Tinkers. The actor did a good job being introspective without really saying too much. 

Thom fighting the Fade was really exciting too. 

10 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

I admit I am no fan of the Red Ajah, but given the level of Logain's power that they all seemed incredibly unprepared for, I was in sympathy with their stance on the matter. It is all well and good for the Amyrlin to insist he get a trial but it seemed like the traveling sisters were all soldiers and no generals.  There should have been someone at least given the authority to make field decisions. 

I agree with the assessment here too. This is a malleable situation on the ground. I would think though that given the opening of this episode, they would have known Logain was stronger than most and plan accordingly. On the flip though, it strikes me that there's no means of communication, like birds, to the White Tower to say, 'hey, uh, this isn't going to go well here. We need to do the trial like yesterday.' Even sending a warder to deliver the message and send more Aes while they held out should be an option. Again, agree with him continually busting out of the shield, they were literally backed into the corner there. 

Wow, Alanna's trick with the arrows was a supercool effect. Seeing the power in battle was really engaging and Logain melting the cage. 

[Danny Franks]

This episode was a great look at how scary a man channeling is. He's super powerful and he's crazy. That was so well visualised in the opening scene, with Logain hearing voices telling him to kill and to trust no one. Yikes.

One really cool thing I noted - he doesn't use any of the gestures that we've seen Moiraine use, he just... does stuff. It seems like the Aes Sedai train women in a certain way, and that isn't necessarily how channeling has to be done.

That plus all the info we got on the Aes Sedai structure and culture was great to see.

It was also really cool to see that an Aes Sedai of the Green Ajah (the battle ajah) seems to have a better grasp of destructive, offensive weaves than Moiraine, an Aes Sedai of the Blue Ajah, did. Alanna looked a lot more dangeorus than Moiraine, and had two Warders who were apparently into each other as well as into her.

I actually laughed out loud at the moment where Lan sees the Red sisters all looking at something, he turns and sees Nynaeve, looking distrustful and glaring, and just pulls this little face at how ridiculous she is. She's so grumpy and stubborn. Liandrin not knowing how to pronounce her name was definitely an in-joke for thirty years of book readers struggling to pronounce half of these names.

But then we get to see Lan with his Warder bros, and he seems much happier.

I really like Aram and the Tuatha'an. There's a genuineness to them that is refreshing and fun. And honestly, with everything going on in the episode, I needed a bit of lightness. Giving Perrin the option of a life that foreswears violence is just a kick in the teeth. "Has you life been better or worse since you picked up that axe?" Oof. Maria Doyle Kennedy killed it in that scene where she talked about wanting to make a better world for her daughter's soul to be spun out into.

The scene with Mat in the farmer's house was creepy, then just got creepier. I think the Fade killed that family... I think.

Final scene - Nynaeve. Just... Nynaeve.

Edited November 26, 2021 by Danny Franks

[DearEvette]

20 minutes ago, Danny Franks said:

I really like Aram and the Tuatha'an. There's a genuineness to them that is refreshing and fun. And honestly, with everything going on in the episode, I needed a bit of lightness. Giving Perrin the option of a life that foreswears violence is just a kick in the teeth. "Has you life been better or worse since you picked up that axe?" Oof. Maria Doyle Kennedy killed it in that scene where she talked about wanting to make a better world for her daughter's soul to be spun out into.

The scene with Mat in the farmer's house was creepy, then just got creepier. I think the Fade killed that family... I think.

Agreed and agreed.

I forgot to mention the Tuatha'an, but I like that this scene and conversation with Perrin a good exploration in part of why Perrin was married and that he accidentally killed his wife.  It is a circumstance that goes way beyond just a change up from the book and has character consequences and motivations down the road.

Also the Tuatha'an scenes were nice.  I like them even if I am generally not in agreement with a 100% pacifist way of life. It was nice to see some colorful merrymaking and dancing.

re: Mat.  Yes I think we are supposed to think he did it.  But I do believe the Fade killed the family but the Fade was led there/attracted there by Mat's dagger.

Also thought it was funny that Rand/Mat peaced the fuck out with no thought to Thom. 

[DoctorAtomic]

41 minutes ago, Danny Franks said:

Maria Doyle Kennedy killed it in that scene where she talked about wanting to make a better world for her daughter's soul to be spun out into.

This was a really important scene in shedding some light on what or how people view the concept of the 'wheel'. 

[Danny Franks]

10 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

re: Mat.  Yes I think we are supposed to think he did it.  But I do believe the Fade killed the family but the Fade was led there/attracted there by Mat's dagger.

Also thought it was funny that Rand/Mat peaced the fuck out with no thought to Thom. 

I didn't get that Mat's horse was discomfited by the presence of the dagger in the first scene, but the second time it happened it clicked. That thing is definitely cursed.

I like that the default reaction of most of these characters is "run the fuck away." It alway reminds me of Rincewind in the Discworld books, and it's honestly the most sensible reaction to most of the things that have happened to them.

[Zonk]

15 hours ago, Kate47 said:

We have! From episode one: 

Interesting. I guess I wasn't paying close intention.

After thousands of years, those really shouldn't be standing anymore or even be visible over ground. But magic, whatever. :D

I wonder what happened? Did the dragon destroy how electricity works? That's the only reason I could think off for being thrown back thousand of years. But even then, shouldn't there be guns around?

5 hours ago, MissLucas said:

So, if men can't hold the One Power why does Moraine even consider Perrin, Mat and Rand as valuable candidates? And is that the reason the other Aes Sedai and the ...uhm Not-Amaryllis are wary of her?

I think the Dragon would be the only one not effected by the madness the dark one corrupted the one power with. Which is why they are so sure that the men who go mad aren't the dragon.

Which also means if our three guys don't go mad, we know for sure they are all part of the dragon.

Edited November 26, 2021 by Zonk

[Humbugged]

20 minutes ago, Zonk said:

Interesting. I guess I wasn't paying close intention.

After thousands of years, those really shouldn't be standing anymore or even be visible over ground. But magic, whatever. :D

I wonder what happened? Did the dragon destroy how electricity works? That's the only reason I could think off for being thrown back thousand of years. But even then, shouldn't there be guns around?

I think the Dragon would be the only one not effected by the madness the dark one corrupted the one power with. Which is why they are so sure that the men who go mad aren't the dragon.

Which also means if our three guys don't go mad, we know for sure they are all part of the dragon.

See the Book to Show for the answers

[gik910]

29 minutes ago, Zonk said:

Interesting. I guess I wasn't paying close intention.

After thousands of years, those really shouldn't be standing anymore or even be visible over ground. But magic, whatever. :D

I wonder what happened? Did the dragon destroy how electricity works? That's the only reason I could think off for being thrown back thousand of years. But even then, shouldn't there be guns around

The companion cartoons give a little more insight here, the episode 1 cartoon is on The Breaking

Edited November 26, 2021 by gik910

[Zonk]

8 minutes ago, gik910 said:

The companion cartoons give a little more insight here, the episode 1 cartoon is on The Breaking

Where can I find those? I clicked through everything on prime and no dice.

[DoctorAtomic]

When you move the mouse over the screen the 'X Ray' menu will pop up - it has the actors/character names (which I wish HBO did with GOT), but there's also an 'Extras'. Click on that and the animations will pop up. 

[Zonk]

3 minutes ago, DoctorAtomic said:

When you move the mouse over the screen the 'X Ray' menu will pop up - it has the actors/character names (which I wish HBO did with GOT), but there's also an 'Extras'. Click on that and the animations will pop up. 

Thank you. Wow they couldn't have hidden that any deeper, could they? It's not under "bonus content", not on the extensive site explaining the world, but instead hidden two menus deep.

I assume we can talk about them here since they are companion pieces to the episodes.

The shorts show that the world wasn't as advanced as the skyscrapers might make it seem. Seemingly no more advanced than we see on the show today, if with bigger cities and more people.

They also explain why the dragon shouldn't be effected by the madness. After the last dragon had killed his wife and children due to the madness, the dark one released him from it, to show him what he'd done. So the reincarnation should still be free from it.

[DoctorAtomic]

I only knew to look for it because Danny posted a you tube video in the media.

There's a thread just for the animation. 

[Tachi Rocinante]

Best episode so far. 

• I was going to make a joke about a "ROYGBIV wedding", but then Nyneave . . .
• So the Tinkers are part Edema Ruh and part Amish?
• I was hoping Birgitte would get to see the world.  Maybe Thom will pick her up.

[Hanahope]

Really enjoying the show so far.  I know they moved pretty quick compared with the books, but that is typical. i would have thought the group would be together a bit more, though.

The hardest part is getting everyone's name down.  The men all seem to have easy names like Lan, Rand, Mat, Thom, the women all have these more complex names that make it difficult sometimes to know who they are talking about, let alone spell them.

I definitely need to watch the animations for more info and history.  

I do wonder how the bad guys find the good guys so easily, or figure out who 'may be the dragon.'  How did the tavern woman know about Rand and Mat?  at least with LOTR, there was mention of the ring being a beacon.  

 

[supposebly]

Alright! Now we're getting somewhere interesting! I appreciated Nynaeve actually asking questions without being so obnoxious previously. Yes, I didn't like her, so I didn't pay much attention to her until she opened up a bit to the wardens in this episode.

So, no, I didn't expect her to be the Dragon. I'm still confused. I thought only men can be the Dragon and Egwene was just tagging along because she could be a Wisdom?

I guess not. So, if the Dragon is a woman, they wouldn't need to worry so much since they don't go mad?

I loved that Logain cried when he lost the power. That was a nice touch. He really thought he would not break it the world. Despite the mad whispers.

I liked the interlude with Egwene and Perrin and the conversations about the philosophy of the Leaf people. 

Mat and the dagger, why did he keep it? It seemed to me that taking it was what released that black shadow stuff in the creepy city last episode. What was the voimiting all about? Caused by keeping the dagger?

I don't like the gleeman, he doesn't know Mat and seems to be projecting more than anything.

I think the red ones are Slytherin house. Opportunistic and do what is "expedient" as one of the others said. I was actually with them too for a moment when they pointed out they couldn't hold him for the whole journey. Although Liandrin is a snake ans Nynaeve pointed out.

I'm having a hard time with the names for people and places, too.

[Humbugged]

2 hours ago, Tachi Rocinante said:

Best episode so far. 

• I was going to make a joke about a "ROYGBIV wedding", but then Nyneave . . .
• So the Tinkers are part Edema Ruh and part Amish?
• I was hoping Birgitte would get to see the world.  Maybe Thom will pick her up.

2 - The are Pavees (Irish Tinkers) - this was 15 years before Kingskiller was written

3 - Next season is when she will turn up - something happens and she makes an entrance then she will turn up again in season 3 or 4 for good

[munchiewoman]

2 minutes ago, Humbugged said:

3 - Next season is when she will turn up - something happens and she makes an entrance then she will turn up again in season 3 or 4 for good

I think the poster was talking about doll Birgitte.

[Tachi Rocinante]

50 minutes ago, munchiewoman said:

I think the poster was talking about doll Birgitte.

Yep

[Ottis]

This was boring as hell until the last 10 minutes. I had to sit down twice to finish it.

Still think all the sisters should be wearing leather, not cloth.

Why does there always have to be an emotional dumb ass?

[thuganomics85]

Things certainly took an interesting turn there!

Figured something was going to happen since I didn't think they were going to go ahead and kill off a major portion of it's main cast after only four episodes (especially the two top billed ones), but Nynaeve busting out that power was a nice reveal.  So, I guess he is another possibly contender for The Dragon Reborn?  Or is a whole other thing going on with her?  Curiouser and Curiouser...

Liked getting more of an insight into the Aes Sedai and how they operate (good old color coordination!  It's always about the outfits your wear!)  And also the relationships between them and their warders, which are really strong.  Which, isn't necessarily always a good thing since that one warder almost screwed to pooch for everyone, after his Aes Sedai was killed.  I wonder if he'll continue to be a factor since they got someone like Peter Franzen (Harald from Vikings) to play him.

Rand and Mat's little journey is certainly going down some dark paths!  Mat really needs to get rid of that dagger stat.  Have to imagine this won't be the last of Thom, despite his last scene being him taking on an actual Fade (or whatever it was) by himself.

So, The Tinkers are a pacifist group?  Interesting and respectable idea, but knowing how most fantasy goes, I'm not sure this will end well for them.  The scene between Perrin and Ila was great: mainly due to Maria Doyle Kennedy giving one of the best performances here so far.

Another pretty solid battle scene.  Show has been pretty stellar with all of that so far.

Continuing to get more invested after each episode.

[ElizaD]

Any pacifist philosophy in a fantasy series with monsters is a tough sell, but Maria Doyle Kennedy really made the most of her scenes. Now I wish she'd gotten a major Aes Sedai role so she'd be around a lot more and help make this setting feel grounded in reality. Kate Fleetwood's Liandrin is promising as a tough antagonist, but despite all the screentime devoted to Aes Sedai and Warders in this episode none of it landed with the sense of honesty MDK brought to the Tinkers and their view of the wheel.

[DoctorAtomic]

I'm not one to call the Aes honest anyway. 

[silverstream]

That was a really strong ending to the episode.

I love the way this show visualizes magic so much. Also, I've always enjoyed the "stop the enemy's arrows and send them back" move, and how they did it here was so good!

They've pretty much turned it into a running joke that everyone immediately clocks on to that our crew is from the Two Rivers even though they keep denying it, and at least at the moment I'm still finding that pretty hilarious.

On 11/26/2021 at 8:19 PM, Danny Franks said:

I really like Aram and the Tuatha'an. There's a genuineness to them that is refreshing and fun. And honestly, with everything going on in the episode, I needed a bit of lightness. Giving Perrin the option of a life that foreswears violence is just a kick in the teeth. "Has you life been better or worse since you picked up that axe?" Oof. Maria Doyle Kennedy killed it in that scene [...].

Meh, I could have done without the "better or worse" line - sure, I kind of get it from her point of view, but from the point of view of what actually happened/the audience, Perrin would be dead if he hadn't picked up that axe, which she might consider better(?), but I certainly don't.

[TheGourmez]

On 11/26/2021 at 11:46 AM, DearEvette said:

re: Mat.  Yes I think we are supposed to think he did it.  But I do believe the Fade killed the family but the Fade was led there/attracted there by Mat's dagger.

I'm unsure what I'm supposed to think happened - there was black magic on Mat's face that drained away, right, once Rand and Thom came into farmhouse? I don't know if I was supposed to think that was the dagger's magic or the Fade's. The Fade is drawn to the Dragon, so I don't think the dagger drew it, just the Dragon potential of those two fellas. But if the dagger has been having an effect on Mat, that could explain his general moroseness, increasingly dark mood, and I guess it's making him sick?

I'm sad he didn't take the doll with him on his adventures and eventually home to his sisters.

Nynaeve's power reveal was awesome, but I think folks already knew she could channel the magic - that's what makes her a Wisdom, right, that she can channel magic to heal and probably do some other stuff to protect a village? Maybe I don't understand what a Wisdom is yet. I think the Aes Sedai and Nynaeve herself just didn't know how powerful she is. It's interesting that she could channel massive healing through rage.

I'm kind of sad Logain is isolated as a threat already. I liked the actor a lot and that he was genuinely strugging to be a good Dragon, even if unwilling to admit the madness.

[silverstream]

6 hours ago, TheGourmez said:

I'm unsure what I'm supposed to think happened - there was black magic on Mat's face that drained away, right, once Rand and Thom came into farmhouse? I don't know if I was supposed to think that was the dagger's magic or the Fade's

That wasn't the only time we saw the black magic drain into Mat (it also happened right after he threw up earlier, though I might have missed others), so that part was very likely the dagger, though I also think the murders were comitted by the Fade.

Either way, the Fade was definitely following either the dagger or Mat and Rand. It's just weird that it went into the farmhouse first rather than the barn, but that was for the extra shock value I guess.

[Atlanta]

7 hours ago, TheGourmez said:

Nynaeve's power reveal was awesome, but I think folks already knew she could channel the magic - that's what makes her a Wisdom, right, that she can channel magic to heal and probably do some other stuff to protect a village? Maybe I don't understand what a Wisdom is yet. I think the Aes Sedai and Nynaeve herself just didn't know how powerful she is. It's interesting that she could channel massive healing through rage.

I don't think she knew she could channel. From what I gather from the show and books is that a Wisdom is a sort of town leader among the women, hence her having issues with being so young, and also a healer. 

[DearEvette]

Wisdoms are usually the town healers and generally the person that the townspeople go to for guidance.  They are also called Wise Women or Wise Ones.  While I don't believe she or anyone consciously knew she could channel in the sense that is what the Aes Sedai do, the Two Rivers folk know she can 'Listen to the Wind' so there is some acknowledgement that she has some little extra something.  She is the youngest Wisdom which means she has probably demonstrated exceptional healing ability, curing someone of something super serious that may have always been fatal or reliably predicted some weather outcome etc.

[paigow]

59 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

She is the youngest Wisdom which means she has probably demonstrated exceptional healing ability, curing someone of something super serious that may have always been fatal or reliably predicted some weather outcome etc.

Like everybody knows she is Hermoine, but no idea she is actually Dumbledore / Gandalf level 

[Blue Plastic]

On 11/27/2021 at 12:44 AM, ElizaD said:

Any pacifist philosophy in a fantasy series with monsters is a tough sell, but Maria Doyle Kennedy really made the most of her scenes. Now I wish she'd gotten a major Aes Sedai role so she'd be around a lot more and help make this setting feel grounded in reality.

Oh, that would have been awesome!  She would be great as an Aes Sedai.

This episode was the first one that was more engaging to me and gave me more of the feeling I got when reading the books.  More immersive IMO and feeling that yeah, this world seems like it could be real.  Like, I felt the difficulty that the Aes Sedai were having with trying to keep Logain shielded.  Getting more from Lan and Nynaeve, feeling like they are more like actual people with personalities and not just  cardboard placeholders.  Especially getting more of the magic action, which is what I am really watching for - magic battles, yeah!

[Black Knight]

I would guess Maria Doyle Kennedy had availability issues that greatly limited which parts they could cast her in. Because otherwise, yeah, she's an obvious slam dunk for one of the prominent Aes Sedai or someone like that. You don't pass up the chance to cast MDK in a part like that for a part like this unless it is all she is available for.

[Taryn74]

43 minutes ago, Blue Plastic said:

Like, I felt the difficulty that the Aes Sedai were having with trying to keep Logain shielded.

And yet, they were so arrogant and cocky in thinking they had him under control. When one of them said that he couldn't hear anything they were saying, I turned to my hubby and said "In other words, he's listening to every word you're saying and this whole thing is going to go sideways in about ten minutes." LOL.

They really are doing a great job with the show, IMO. I've never read the books (hubby only picked them up recently at a used bookstore and he got frustrated trying to read them because the characters make stupid decisions so often) but I am totally immersed in the show. It makes me sad that we couldn't have gotten this quality of production with Terry Goodkind's Sword of Truth series. I would give anything to see those books brought to life in the same way.

[TheGourmez]

3 hours ago, DearEvette said:

Wisdoms are usually the town healers and generally the person that the townspeople go to for guidance.  They are also called Wise Women or Wise Ones.  While I don't believe she or anyone consciously knew she could channel in the sense that is what the Aes Sedai do, the Two Rivers folk know she can 'Listen to the Wind' so there is some acknowledgement that she has some little extra something.  She is the youngest Wisdom which means she has probably demonstrated exceptional healing ability, curing someone of something super serious that may have always been fatal or reliably predicted some weather outcome etc.

Oh, okay, so a Wisdom isn't using magic to heal, they're more like a doctor? I just assumed magic was involved in healing, this being a fantasy world. 😆

5 hours ago, silverstream said:

That wasn't the only time we saw the black magic drain into Mat (it also happened right after he threw up earlier, though I might have missed others), so that part was very likely the dagger, though I also think the murders were comitted by the Fade.

Ah, I missed it during him throwing up - must have looked away. My pet theory is that the Fade was using the dagger's hold on Mat to control him and may have murdered the family through Mat.

[DearEvette]

15 minutes ago, TheGourmez said:

Oh, okay, so a Wisdom isn't using magic to heal, they're more like a doctor? I just assumed magic was involved in healing, this being a fantasy world. 😆

No it is definitely magic.  But the people in Two Rivers may not be consciously labeling it that way and definitely not in the way they understand the Aes Sedai is using it.

[DoctorAtomic]

Not necessarily; your average Wisdom per se isn't using magic. Ny made a poultice for Moiraine's wound using plants and such she was picking in the forest there. Are there some that do, like how she 'listens to the wind?' Probably. Not every Wisdom is a channeler though. This Two Rivers area is way way way in the sticks. Moraine and Lan were talking about it when he was saying in the first episode how much they were traveling. Fain is the probably the most cosmopolitan person they've seen in their lives. 

Of course, with the big reveal here with Ny and the total mess they made with Logain, there's enough eggs to go on faces plenty. 

[ursula]

Am I missing something? because I thought Nynaeve was the Dragon after this episode but most of this discussion implies she's just a contender.