S01.E09: Double Time

[sistermagpie]

On 10/12/2021 at 9:21 AM, AnimeMania said:

I wonder what the policy is for letting people into the building and onto the elevators that go to apartments, is there a guard.

Presumably a door man. If there's elevators that go straight to apartments they would lock on that floor.

 

22 hours ago, Quilt Fairy said:

I'm not a big Jane Lynch fan.  She's basically the same character no matter what show she's in.  I was really hoping that Scott Bakula would walk in, after Oliver's comment to Charles in the first episode, "Oh, you're not Scott Bakula?"  Because surprisingly, an older, grayer Scott Bakula looks quite a bit like Steve Martin. 

Count Bakula is busy being courted by the Vampire Council on What We Do In The Shadows...

20 hours ago, chitowngirl said:

How does Sazz know what Charles is going to wear? Does he have a Day of the Week wardrobe??

I think it's part of her whole "I know how you think" thing.

4 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

I was confused about something. Jan said to Sazz, about Charles, "we've only been together for a few weeks, and half of that I was in the hospital." So what's half of "a few weeks"... maybe two or three weeks? OK. It's plausible she was in the hospital that long, depending on how bad the stab wound was. But when we heard a bit of the podcast episode that went out the day of this conversation, it was clear that only one week had elapsed since the podcast they sent out in last week's TV episode. (Or maybe even less.) So, was Jan in the hospital for a week or less? Or more like the 2-3 weeks she implied to Sazz? Or is this an inconsistency the writers didn't catch?

I thought that was Jan being sloppy. It seems like "half of that time" but she just means they haven't been together long and she just got out of the hospital.

3 hours ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

Jan didn't want him at the concert and I think it was more than just she didn't want him to know she isn't first chair.  Why would he care about that?  Why she lied and said she is first chair I don't know. 

We do know that Jan is very very sensitive about being second. Guess well have to see if she would kill to try to prevent it. She'd almost be justified too, the concert was so dickish introducing her like Dumbledore changing the House Cup winners at the end of the first Harry Potter book.

I almost wonder if Steve Martin was inspired to write the whole thing because he once saw one of those bassoon cleaner things.

[GaT]

8 hours ago, sskrill said:

Potential:  Charles (not likely), Oliver (not likely), cat guy, therapist, Oscars father (had lots of time to do it, so why now?) ...

Tim was killed just as Oscar was being released from prison, so I think Oscar's father might have shot him because he was worried that Oscar might do it, or that Tim might cause more trouble for Oscar. That's why now, as long as Oscar was still in prison, Tim couldn't do anything to him.

2 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

Count Bakula is busy being courted by the Vampire Council on What We Do In The Shadows...

I know! For a few seconds I was confused as to what show I was watching, you don't usually get two Scott Bakula mentions likes that in a week.

[shapeshifter]

2 minutes ago, GaT said:

Tim was killed just as Oscar was being released from prison, so I think Oscar's father might have shot him because he was worried that Oscar might do it, or that Tim might cause more trouble for Oscar. That's why now, as long as Oscar was still in prison, Tim couldn't do anything to him.

Since they said in this episode that Tim Kono died of poison, what crime would the shooter of dead Tim Kono be charged with?

I’m wondering if the female screams Tim Kono’s neighbor heard were not due to sexual pleasure, but rather a reaction to Tim being shot by the jealous boyfriend (of the bassoonist prodigy). Maybe Tim and the young bassoonist were seemingly asleep in bed when the bassoonist’s boyfriend shot Tim—not knowing he was already dead from poison. 
Perhaps by Bunny. 

[marketdoctor]

I'm on the "It could be Bunny" train as follows:

1.  She wants the podcaster/detectives out.

2.  She doesn't like disruptions, and both the podcast and the bassoon player fit that.

3.  Like everyone else, she didn't like the cat, and the poison matches...

4.  The poison used on Tim Kono, who was very disruptive for the building.  She might have even had a master key, and knew about the stealing/B & E.

None of that is a smoking gun, so I'm still at "possible."  Maybe she did it to please Sting, which would be a little too real for me, but could fit.

 

[Milburn Stone]

Everyone in the building killed Tim Kono!

[cardigirl]

3 hours ago, Haleth said:

Sazz said a couple times she thinks the podcast will be made into a movie/show. (I forget what director she said, but it was something like Charles would be Scorseseed.). She seems to be trying to get a jump on being cast as his double again. Which will probably be a bad idea.

I think the sex toys are Jan’s, not Tim’s.  I also think Allison the bassoonist is a red herring or maybe the next victim, and not involved with Tim at all. 

Sazz said that Charles was about to be Tarantinoed. 

[cardigirl]

39 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Since they said in this episode that Tim Kono died of poison, what crime would the shooter of dead Tim Kono be charged with?

I’m wondering if the female screams Tim Kono’s neighbor heard were not due to sexual pleasure, but rather a reaction to Tim being shot by the jealous boyfriend (of the bassoonist prodigy). Maybe Tim and the young bassoonist were seemingly asleep in bed when the bassoonist’s boyfriend shot Tim—not knowing he was already dead from poison. 
Perhaps by Bunny. 

The shooter, if they are not the same person as the poisoner, could be charged with intent, and a number of other lesser charges.

Presumably the neighbor heard the screams more than once, and from that assumed Tim knew what he was doing in the lovemaking department. 

Edited October 14, 2021 by cardigirl

[GaT]

20 minutes ago, Milburn Stone said:

Everyone in the building killed Tim Kono!

OMG! It's Murder On The Orient Express!

34 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

I’m wondering if the female screams Tim Kono’s neighbor heard were not due to sexual pleasure, but rather a reaction to Tim being shot by the jealous boyfriend (of the bassoonist prodigy). Maybe Tim and the young bassoonist were seemingly asleep in bed when the bassoonist’s boyfriend shot Tim—not knowing he was already dead from poison. 
Perhaps by Bunny. 

Or, maybe they went into the apt & found him dead?

[dovegrey]

8 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

I’m wondering if the female screams Tim Kono’s neighbor heard were not due to sexual pleasure, but rather a reaction to Tim being shot by the jealous boyfriend (of the bassoonist prodigy). Maybe Tim and the young bassoonist were seemingly asleep in bed when the bassoonist’s boyfriend shot Tim—not knowing he was already dead from poison. 
Perhaps by Bunny. 

In Episode 1, when the team briefly snooped at the crime scene, Dead Tim was fully dressed in the same clothes he had been wearing in the elevator, and he was laying near his front door. When the team searched his apartment, there was at least one lamp on the floor and other signs of disturbance. I couldn't/can't tell if that disturbance was due to a struggle, or if Tim took some lamps and side tables down when he collapsed from the poison. But he was definitely fully clothed and near his door, and all the blood from his head wound was pooled in that one spot.

The fire alarm could be a key to this. If I'm dead set on talking to someone or killing someone in their apartment, I'm not going to pull a fire alarm and then go try to find the person. That person's probably already leaving the building with everyone else. Either the fire alarm was a diversion for the shooter to leave without being noticed/an alibi of sorts (and Oscar was lying about hearing the gunshot), a ruse for someone to go into what they expected would be Tim's or someone else's vacated apartment, or not related to Tim's death at all. And, if I'm trying to avoid drawing attention to Something Really Bad, I'm not going to pull the fire alarm at all...it seems like the police or building management was going door-to-door to clear the building, and that's how Tim's body was found so quickly? I don't know.

I'm excited for the season finale and having some answers.

[shapeshifter]

26 minutes ago, dovegrey said:

In Episode 1, when the team briefly snooped at the crime scene, Dead Tim was fully dressed in the same clothes he had been wearing in the elevator, and he was laying near his front door. When the team searched his apartment, there was at least one lamp on the floor and other signs of disturbance. I couldn't/can't tell if that disturbance was due to a struggle, or if Tim took some lamps and side tables down when he collapsed from the poison. But he was definitely fully clothed and near his door, and all the blood from his head wound was pooled in that one spot.

The fire alarm could be a key to this. If I'm dead set on talking to someone or killing someone in their apartment, I'm not going to pull a fire alarm and then go try to find the person. That person's probably already leaving the building with everyone else. Either the fire alarm was a diversion for the shooter to leave without being noticed/an alibi of sorts (and Oscar was lying about hearing the gunshot), a ruse for someone to go into what they expected would be Tim's or someone else's vacated apartment, or not related to Tim's death at all. And, if I'm trying to avoid drawing attention to Something Really Bad, I'm not going to pull the fire alarm at all...it seems like the police or building management was going door-to-door to clear the building, and that's how Tim's body was found so quickly? I don't know.

I'm excited for the season finale and having some answers.

Maybe Bunny poisoned Tim, checked on him to see if he was dead, saw him shot, and pulled the alarm in hopes that the police would presume gunshot death if he was found before poison would become obvious? 

And maybe the neighbor who has admitted to not liking Tim and wanting his apartment is concerned that if Bunny is found guilty of poisoning him due to complaints, she (the neighbor) will be seen a complicit/guilty, so she made up the bit about a woman in the apartment (not Bunny)?

[dovegrey]

15 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Maybe Bunny poisoned Tim, checked on him to see if he was dead, saw him shot, and pulled the alarm in hopes that the police would presume gunshot death if he was found before poison would become obvious? 

And maybe the neighbor who has admitted to not liking Tim and wanting his apartment is concerned that if Bunny is found guilty of poisoning him due to complaints, she (the neighbor) will be seen a complicit/guilty, so she made up the bit about a woman in the apartment (not Bunny)?

These are all great ideas, and both are absolutely viable....except, man, if I'm Bunny and have it in me to kill someone, I'm going after Oliver first. 😅 In all seriousness, I'm so torn between the poisoner being the shooter or the poisoner and shooter being different people.

Right after I posted, I had a thought: could Tim have pulled a fire alarm from within his apartment, as he was dying? I've never been inside a condo to know if there are alarm buttons in the units or only in the hallways. I've only noticed each unit has a white phone in the Arconia.

[shapeshifter]

53 minutes ago, dovegrey said:

Right after I posted, I had a thought: could Tim have pulled a fire alarm from within his apartment, as he was dying? I've never been inside a condo to know if there are alarm buttons in the units or only in the hallways. I've only noticed each unit has a white phone in the Arconia.

Or, how about this: 

1. Bunny poisons Tim.
2. Bassoonist prodigy goes to bed and then to sleep with Tim.
3. Bassoonist's boyfriend walks into the apartment, sees them in bed, Tim jumps up towards the door and collapses, dying of poison...
4. ...as Bassoonist prodigy's boyfriend shoots Tim.
5. Bassoonist prodigy runs out of the apartment after the boyfriend/shooter, and she pulls the alarm on her way. 

IDK. It seems there should be a longer time between the poisoning and the shooting, but then why shoot someone who's already dead?
I guess to cover up the poisoning. 

Maybe the neighbor supplied the poison?

[dovegrey]

9 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

IDK. It seems there should be a longer time between the poisoning and the shooting, but then why shoot someone who's already dead?

What if Tim shot himself in response to hallucinogenic or depressant side effects (for TV purposes) of mixing the bourbon that Sazz "found" in this episode with the barbiturate that poisoned him? Then, the fire alarm was actually pulled in relation to the murder in the park that Mabel mentioned in Episode 2. Someone is the poisoner, but Tim is the shooter...and the police are wrong about primary COD...and Jan/Allison is a complete red herring. (I'd note that presumably Jan was playing the bassoon in Episode 1, right before Charles shut his window and cued up Cinda's podcast. I don't know if that rules her out or actually places her at the Arconia that night...)

All in all, I still think it's Ursula and not Bunny. I would note that Charles hallucinated the Looney Tunes characters after starting to drink Gut Milk, right? Okay, I'm back in speculation thread territory...

[spaceghostess]

On 10/12/2021 at 1:14 PM, AnimeMania said:

They did hold up a few sex toys. I looked up how to clean a bassoon and there was a small brush with a long wire handle to clean the mouthpiece and a cloth (looks like a handkerchief with a weighted string threaded through it) to clean the rest. I didn't see anything like what was shown, but hey, anything can be a sex toy, even that, especially if the person you are having sex with really likes bassoons.

My dad had both of the doohickies you mentioned to clean his instruments, but not the thing they showed.  I was wondering if that’s a newer tool; it’s definitely more streamlined and nicer looking than what I’ve seen. 

So Jan was second chair after all. Or she is now…

[AnimeMania]

7 hours ago, spaceghostess said:

So Jan was second chair after all. Or she is now…

I think Jan was the the first chair, since they made a big production about bring out another chair. Jan had been gone for quite some time, so the orchestra found someone else to play her part. When practicing they know what to expect when playing with the new person and had already made their adjustments accordingly. Jan would be a wildcard.

[dovegrey]

31 minutes ago, AnimeMania said:

I think Jan was the the first chair, since they made a big production about bring out another chair. Jan had been gone for quite some time, so the orchestra found someone else to play her part. When practicing they know what to expect when playing with the new person and had already made their adjustments accordingly. Jan would be a wildcard.

I agree with this, but it was apparently only one week between the end of 1x8 (when Jan was stabbed) and the beginning of 1x9/this episode. In this episode, Oliver issues a correction for "last week's podcast" that falsely accused Dimas of killing Tim and says it's good news that last week's episode was not their finale. So, Jan was out for one week tops, which seems highly unlikely...unless the wound was superficial and didn't hit any major organs, arteries, intestines, etc. Interesting?

[sskrill]

So I was just thinking - we know the Dimas' didn't shoot Tim because they were outside - but we don't know that they didn't poison him.  Wasn't he coming from their floor when he got on the elevator?  Oliver did all that raving about their dips - maybe he ate something while he was in their apartment which is how he was poisoned.  

We also saw Dimas Jr breaking into apartments, so its possible that he was the one who broke in and poisoned Olivers dog.  

Although I think he was in jail by the time that Jan was stabbed.  So whoever shot Kono stabbed Jan?

[AnimeMania]

50 minutes ago, sskrill said:

We also saw Dimas Jr breaking into apartments, so its possible that he was the one who broke in and poisoned Olivers dog.  

It doesn't much to break into Oliver's apartment because he never locks his door.

[Abra]

1 hour ago, dovegrey said:

In this episode, Oliver issues a correction for "last week's podcast" that falsely accused Dimas of killing Tim and says it's good news that last week's episode was not their finale. So, Jan was out for one week tops,

"Last week" to me doesn't mean exactly seven days, though. Let's say I'm listening to a new podcast episode on a Friday, and the last episode was the Monday of the previous week. That would still count as last week to me, and 11 days/a week and a half would have passed between the two.

[dovegrey]

32 minutes ago, Abra said:

"Last week" to me doesn't mean exactly seven days, though. Let's say I'm listening to a new podcast episode on a Friday, and the last episode was the Monday of the previous week. That would still count as last week to me, and 11 days/a week and a half would have passed between the two.

That's a good point. So, Jan was out for 7-11 days. How much would four extra days change? Do orchestras have FMLA and job protection?

I would note, however, that podcasts usually drop on a regular schedule. If the team broke their schedule to make the correction, then I would presume they dropped the episode earlier than expected. For example, if they dropped the Dimas Did It episode on Friday, then the correction from them would have been between Saturday and the following Friday, but probably earlier. It wasn't a listener saying it was last week's episode; it was Oliver. I doubt the team waited 11 days to say "oops, Teddy didn't do it!" I doubt they waited even 7 days. I don't think Jan was in the hospital for long.

For as tight as the writing has seemingly been, I do think the writers are bungling the timing or set decoration has gotten dates wrong. The Dimas surveillance footage from the night of Tim’s murder was dated January 16, and the date on Teddy’s phone right before he and Theo were arrested showed it was February 5. That's 20 days. How many podcast episodes did this group really drop in 20 days? And now we're only up to 27-31 days since Tim died, but the first scene of Episode 1 was 2 months after Tim died. I'm curious how this wraps up.

Edited to Add: The eviction notice on Oliver's door is dated February 7. So...that's 2 days after the Dimas' were arrested. :-)

Edited October 14, 2021 by dovegrey
Noted

[emma675]

I hope Bunny did it. I hate people who have that much power to throw people out of their homes for silly rules they deem are broken.

But seriously, I really have no idea who did it at this point, so bravo, show. However, if the murderer (murderers?) turns out to be a random no one remembers, I'm going to be irritated. But the cast of characters is so big now, it has a variety of people to choose from.

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, emma675 said:

I hope Bunny did it. I hate people who have that much power to throw people out of their homes for silly rules they deem are broken.

I second that emotion. 🙃
So I think Bunny's good for at least the poison.
But shooting and stabbing? 

[GaT]

4 hours ago, dovegrey said:

unless the wound was superficial and didn't hit any major organs, arteries, intestines, etc. Interesting?

If you had arranged to "stab" yourself, you would make sure to miss anything important. I'm still suspicious of Jan just because of the way she integrated herself into everything.

58 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

I second that emotion. 🙃
So I think Bunny's good for at least the poison.
But shooting and stabbing? 

I think Bunny is good for the poisoning , Jan stabbed herself, & Oscar's father did the shooting.

[cardigirl]

17 hours ago, dovegrey said:

All in all, I still think it's Ursula and not Bunny. I would note that Charles hallucinated the Looney Tunes characters after starting to drink Gut Milk, right? Okay, I'm back in speculation thread territory...

I don't associate him "hallucinating" those characters, really just that they "haunted" him because of the back story.  And I don't associate them with the Gut Milk.

I would like more of a tie in with Lucy though before the end of this season.  All of a sudden now we have Daisy, who Sazz stole from Charles-Hayden (who on earth has a hyphenated FIRST name).  He first told Mabel that he'd be alone for 25 years, leaving out Lucy and her mother, and also never telling Mabel about Daisy and Sazz stealing her away, so Charles-Hayden has been holding back from the team it seems.  It may mean nothing, but it makes me curious. 

[Sakura12]

Wasn't expecting Jane Lynch to show up as Charles' stunt double. And I do wonder if she'll be the next victim. 

I do like that we had Charles and Mabel bonding in the beginning and now we're seeing Oliver and Mabel. I think her sardonic personality matches better with his energetic one. They balance each other out. They also have more investment in this than Charles. She for her friend and he for his career and financial issues. 

I'm thinking Jan's stabbing was orchestra related. Because if she received a note that said I'm watching you and even if she was mad at Charles, you'd think she'd run and tell him about it instead of just going into her apartment. The prodigy or the boyfriend probably stabbed her so she could get first chair. I'd imagine an orchestra that had a big performance coming up would need you there to rehearse. So even missing a few days would matter and they would have someone replace her.

Tim's lover could also be related to the orchestra drama. Prodigy or the boyfriend could've shot or posioned Tim.

[KaveDweller]

8 hours ago, dovegrey said:

That's a good point. So, Jan was out for 7-11 days. How much would four extra days change? Do orchestras have FMLA and job protection?

Jan could have been replaced as first chair for reasons unrelated to the stabbing. Maybe she was first chair, then this prodigy showed up and was promoted up. Then Jan was too embarrassed to tell anyone. Or she was so used to saying she was first chair that she just kept doing it. It seems unlikely she was never first chair and lied about it. But either way, padding your resume doesn't make you a killer.

The bassoon cleaner in Tim's sex toy box is much more suspicious.

[callie lee 29]

On 10/13/2021 at 7:42 PM, Milburn Stone said:

Everyone in the building killed Tim Kono!

So does that make Tim Kono Ratchet/cassetti?

Edited October 15, 2021 by callie lee 29

[DoctorAtomic]

I could buy that if you're rehearsing for a big concert and any chair got *stabbed* the conductor immediately makes the executive decision to bench them, so to speak. Jan being embarrassed about it is fair. Jan pointed out that the piece is a showcase for bassoon, so if there's a prodigy in the wings, then you put them in. 

I don't care how convoluted the actual unraveling of the murder is, the show had better reveal them in the finale. I don't care if there's other cliffhangers for next season, but if they don't, that's way weak. 

I'm having a hard time that the three are booted out over the podcast on a simple show of hands too. It's an eyeroll for me for the sake of drama on the show, but it's hard to believe with no actual crime committed they couldn't drag it out in court. Oliver, not so much, having the outstanding rent, but Charles was there 30 years basically invisible. 

 

[callie lee 29]

47 minutes ago, DoctorAtomic said:

 

I'm having a hard time that the three are booted out over the podcast on a simple show of hands too. It's an eyeroll for me for the sake of drama on the show, but it's hard to believe with no actual crime committed they couldn't drag it out in court. Oliver, not so much, having the outstanding rent, but Charles was there 30 years basically invisible. 

 

I know. I mean I suppose if they violated some portion of a HOA or something similar maybe, eventually, an eviction could happen, but it's take likely a lot of money and time and Bunny doesn't seem that popular.

[emma675]

Maybe Bunny will be the next victim and next season is spent solving her murder? I kid but it would actually solve a lot of the trio's problems and there are tons of suspects. But they need to reveal Tim Kono's killer first.

[sjankis630]

On 10/13/2021 at 7:42 PM, Milburn Stone said:

Everyone in the building killed Tim Kono!

LOL. Murder on the Arconia Express!

[Ilovepie]

On 10/14/2021 at 6:48 AM, sskrill said:

So I was just thinking - we know the Dimas' didn't shoot Tim because they were outside - but we don't know that they didn't poison him.  Wasn't he coming from their floor when he got on the elevator? 

I like this - it makes sense with them having access to all of that stuff in the funeral home, and they have shown themselves to be ruthless when necessary. If they knew Tim was investigating them it's possible they poisoned him to get him out of the way. I just can't remember what they knew and when.

I don't think the prodigy has anything to do with this other than to reveal that Jan was lying to Charles.

And can someone explain why Mabel and Oscar were sleeping in Charles apartment along with Oliver?

The gag with Jane Lynch was awesome. I loved her mimicking Charles. I am going to miss this show after next week!

[DoctorAtomic]

24 minutes ago, Ilovepie said:

And can someone explain why Mabel and Oscar were sleeping in Charles apartment along with Oliver?

They were in Mabel's aunt's apartment. 

[BingeyKohan]

My Beautiful Mind board looks like this:

• We know from the premiere that we're building to Mabel crouching over a bloodied body - more likely stabbed than shot, and definitely not poisoned.
• Stabbing has come into play by way of Jan, though that could have been self-inflicted.
• So far we have poisoning, shooting, and stabbing. What kind of killer dabbles in all 3?? If Tim was shot as a cover for the fact that he was also (originally) poisoned, why shoot him vs stabbing him (or slitting his wrists, if the idea was to make it look like suicide)? A gunshot is so risky in terms of attracting attention. Was this really all done by 1 person, including the stabbing of whoever Mabel finds?
• (I do not, by the way, subscribe to the idea that the whole building is in on it)
• I continue to believe it's Oscar that Mabel finds bloody in the premiere/finale, even though it could be anyone wearing tie-dye merch at this point. She wouldn't get that close unless it was someone she really cared about.
• Gut Milk has to play into this somehow - they have taken pains to keep us aware of it. Though they have never shown its original source again (I don't think) which is odd. At the very least Gut Milk will have to be a future sponsor of the podcast! it totally sounds like a brand that would advertise on podcasts.
• It would be foolish to lead into the finale implicating Jan (with blood coming out of Charles no less!) then switch the focus to someone else - my prediction is that via flashback we'll see them working with Tim's phone and they'll reveal she took the opportunity to delete incriminating texts between her and Tim while Charles was distracted doing something goofy. 

[DoctorAtomic]

All of that leads me to think that the 'Murder on the Orient Express' theory might be most likely. 

[SunnyBeBe]

Why does Jan not seem to be very upset about being attacked?  No real fear about being attacked….returning to her apt without hesitation…..seems odd to me.  
 

I’m not a Lynch fan so…..whatever.

[MisterGlass]

Maybe one point in favor of the "Murder on the Orient Express" theory - Cinda Canning calls her future knock off podcast "Only Murderers in the Building."

[sskrill]

I just hope they don't ruin it by having it be the hot pretzel guy (like they did with Clickbait).

[Milburn Stone]

17 hours ago, BingeyKohan said:

• We know from the premiere that we're building to Mabel crouching over a bloodied body - more likely stabbed than shot, and definitely not poisoned.
• Stabbing has come into play by way of Jan, though that could have been self-inflicted.
• So far we have poisoning, shooting, and stabbing. What kind of killer dabbles in all 3?? If Tim was shot as a cover for the fact that he was also (originally) poisoned, why shoot him vs stabbing him (or slitting his wrists, if the idea was to make it look like suicide)? A gunshot is so risky in terms of attracting attention. Was this really all done by 1 person, including the stabbing of whoever Mabel finds?

I appreciate any attempt at unraveling this, but:

The stabbed body--why do you think the deceased didn't ingest poison before being stabbed?

Perry Mason (OG version) frequently used the device of the defendant who only thought she murdered the victim, later to have the truth come out that the victim was already dead--or died later--at someone else's hand. Whoever believes they murdered Tim Kono might be wrong! They might have assaulted him in some fashion but not been responsible for the cause of death. Or it might be a combination of an attempted homicide (that was not effective) with a suicide (that was.)

[sjankis630]

How would Jan stab herself and at the same time get rid of the attack weapon? Did she have an accomplice? And if so how would she know the best time to be stabbed so that Steve Martin would come by to save her?

[grandmabegum]

21 hours ago, sskrill said:

I just hope they don't ruin it by having it be the hot pretzel guy (like they did with Clickbait).

I call them soft pretzels so when I read this comment I thought you meant ATTRACTIVE pretzel guy and thought I missed something.

[SunnyBeBe]

1 hour ago, sjankis630 said:

How would Jan stab herself and at the same time get rid of the attack weapon? Did she have an accomplice? And if so how would she know the best time to be stabbed so that Steve Martin would come by to save her?

Idk. I’m just always suspicious of victims of violent crime who are so casual about it and who are cavalier about returning to the place of the attack without reservations. It’s like they know they are safe. How?  
 

I suppose you could stab yourself, put the knife into an air vent, then collapse on the floor.  Multiple people have murdered, then fake a self-induced injury.  Though, some have help. IRL, recently, SC attorney had someone shoot him in the head, yet he survived.   No proof that he murdered, though, his wife and son’s recent murder is under investigation…..🤔 Just saying.  

Edited October 16, 2021 by SunnyBeBe

[Milburn Stone]

23 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I’m not a Lynch fan so…..whatever.

I hear you. I don't mind her, but it would be refreshing to see her play someone other than "Jane Lynch" (Trademark, Patent Pending).

Long long ago in a galaxy far far away, I think I recall seeing her be someone else. Of course, they hire her these days to bring the shtick. A girl's gotta make a living.

[SunnyBeBe]

20 minutes ago, Milburn Stone said:

I hear you. I don't mind her, but it would be refreshing to see her play someone other than "Jane Lynch" (Trademark, Patent Pending).

Long long ago in a galaxy far far away, I think I recall seeing her be someone else. Of course, they hire her these days to bring the shtick. A girl's gotta make a living.

Right. The thing is….I think she has some real acting chops. She is capable of drama, imo.  But, now, it’s too predictable. 

[grandmabegum]

1 hour ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I suppose you could stab yourself, put the knife into an air vent, then collapse on the floor.  Multiple people have murdered, then fake a self-induced injury.  Though, some have help. IRL, recently, SC attorney had someone shoot him in the head, yet he survived.   No proof that he murdered, though, his wife and son’s recent murder is under investigation…..🤔 Just saying.  

You talking about this case? Cause it's insane. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/south-carolina-lawyer-who-plotted-have-himself-shot-now-accused-embezzlement-2021-10-15/

And I'm not saying it's easy, but people do stab/injure themselves IRL. Some do it for sympathy others do it out of spite or to create an "alibi" of some sort. In Jan's case it would be to make it look like she's a victim and not a suspect. And maybe she didn't do it herself, both can be true.

Edited October 17, 2021 by grandmabegum

[SunnyBeBe]

11 minutes ago, grandmabegum said:

You talking about this case? Cause it's insane. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/south-carolina-lawyer-who-plotted-have-himself-shot-now-accused-embezzlement-2021-10-15/

And I'm not saying it's easy, but people do stab/injure themselves IRL. Some do it for sympathy others do it out of spite or to create an "alibi" of some sort. In Jan's case it would be to make it look like she's a victim and not a suspect. And maybe she didn't do it herself, both can be true.

Yes. That’s it.  All kinds of wrong and such a mystery.  Ripe for a mystery podcast!

[dovegrey]

I also think it’s weird that Jan had zero reaction to being attacked, but I also don’t see why she would have done it to herself. She was an “insider” with the podcast team’s speculation and most of the evidence, and nothing pointed to her - or, if it did, the team didn’t realize and were 100% gunning for Dimas. She knew that, and she knew no one suspected her, so why stab herself right before the Dimas Did It episode dropped? The only reason I could think is if she did it in response to being kicked off the team and wanting them to feel bad and pay attention to her (she can’t be #2!), but that’s a long shot.

If she was stabbed by whoever killed Tim, then... She had a bag of groceries when she was stabbed; it was next to her on the floor. I think she left that morning, someone went snooping in her apartment, she came back before they had left, and that person attacked her from behind in a panic. Alternatively, or in connection to that, whoever stabbed Jan was trying to spook Charles, just like poisoning Winnie was supposed to spook Oliver.

Unrelated. With Jan being second chair - I think she got demoted because she was stabbed, and I think she didn’t want Charles to know that’s why she lost her coveted first chair position. She tried really hard to convince Charles to stop blaming himself for her getting stabbed. He would have lost it with guilt, had she told him that she also lost her prized role because of it. That’s why she lied.

Edited October 17, 2021 by dovegrey

[shapeshifter]

2 hours ago, grandmabegum said:

I call them soft pretzels so when I read this comment I thought you meant ATTRACTIVE pretzel guy and thought I missed something.

Hahaha! Same

[MisterGlass]

13 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

it would be refreshing to see her play someone other than "Jane Lynch" (Trademark, Patent Pending).

Yeah.  Though, I think she's effective as Pataki, and compared to her hosting roles it's considerably toned down.  I was not a regular watcher of Glee, but my impression is that after that role she was being cast a lot more for snark.  It's almost a shock now when you watch a movie like The Fugitive from the early 90s and realize she has a dramatic supporting role.  Or when you see her in a completely different kind of comedy like A Mighty Wind.

[sjankis630]

Jane Lynch's wink in a Mighty Wind was a great subtle intro to her character. Lol.