Gymnastics

[Jess14]

9 hours ago, choclatechip45 said:

By her team I mean her agent and her coaches. I have no issue with that too, but you have to wonder if it got to her. All of her interviews leading up to the games seem off. You barley hear elite gymnasts talk about scared they are to do their skills and she kept talking about how she didn't know what she wants to do after. I've been following Simone since 2013 and this whole year the joy seemed to disappear reminds me a lot of Gabby in 2016. 

Yes. It’s really not an either/or situation. There’s nothing wrong with Simone owning the fact that she’s the GOAT when it’s true. At the same time, it’s very possible that the fact that her name couldn’t be mentioned without also mentioning that she was the GOAT also played a role in putting unnecessary pressure on her. It’s a competition, and while I don’t for one second believe that Simone believed that the Olympics would be a coronation, it was certainly treated that way, especially by the media - and there was never a check on it either. Even the team coordinator played into that by suggesting that tenths didn’t matter because the US (on Simone’s back) was just so much better than everyone else. Other teams, like the Russians, and gymnasts were not even mentioned as being factors. I have friends who truly believed that Simone was going to sweep the golds in Tokyo, when in reality, she would’ve been lucky to get bronze on bars under any circumstance, and beam was never a guarantee given the start values that a couple of the Chinese gymnasts have (she would’ve won vault, floor, and AA definitely at her best). I cannot imagine the intense scrutiny and pressure that she had to be under heading into the games, which were already being held under less than ideal circumstances.

Anyway, I’m so thrilled that Simone bounced back and won bronze today. I hope that this medal and the resilience that she displayed helps to salvage this experience for her, and I wish nothing but the best for her going forward. 

[ombelico]

It appears that NBC is embargoing the replay, presumably to capitalize on Simone's return. Given that all of the other replays had been available right after the competition and that I value my sleep, I stayed unspoiled and went to load up the replay to find that it's not there! If there had been a note ahead of time that the replay wasn't going to be available, I would have woken up for it. Grr!

With today's bronze medal, Simone now ties Shannon Miller for the most Olympic medals by a U.S. gymnast (but Simone comes out on top with more golds, 4-2) and ties Larisa Latynina for most Olympic and Worlds medals (but Simone comes out on top with more golds, 23-18). I'm just so happy for Simone that she was able to safely compete on beam and go out from these Olympics on a good note.

[Jeddah]

1 minute ago, ombelico said:

With today's bronze medal, Simone now ties Shannon Miller for the most Olympic medals by a U.S. gymnast

I’m still bitter about the AA tie breaker in 2012. Aly Raisman should have 7 medals too!

[Conotocarious]

26 minutes ago, Jess14 said:

Yes. It’s really not an either/or situation. There’s nothing wrong with Simone owning the fact that she’s the GOAT when it’s true. At the same time, it’s very possible that the fact that her name couldn’t be mentioned without also mentioning that she was the GOAT also played a role in putting unnecessary pressure on her. It’s a competition, and while I don’t for one second believe that Simone believed that the Olympics would be a coronation, it was certainly treated that way, especially by the media - and there was never a check on it either. Even the team coordinator played into that by suggesting that tenths didn’t matter because the US (on Simone’s back) was just so much better than everyone else. Other teams, like the Russians, and gymnasts were not even mentioned as being factors. I have friends who truly believed that Simone was going to sweep the golds in Tokyo, when in reality, she would’ve been lucky to get bronze on bars under any circumstance, and beam was never a guarantee given the start values that a couple of the Chinese gymnasts have (she would’ve won vault, floor, and AA definitely at her best). I cannot imagine the intense scrutiny and pressure that she had to be under heading into the games, which were already being held under less than ideal circumstances.

Anyway, I’m so thrilled that Simone bounced back and won bronze today. I hope that this medal and the resilience that she displayed helps to salvage this experience for her, and I wish nothing but the best for her going forward. 

I agree with this. I also wonder about casting about for someone or something to blame.  It seems to me that the desire to do that implies that everything is always in our control and if we could just do everything close to perfect all the time nothing bad would ever happen. But that just isn’t true. No one knows really what brings on the twisties. She’s been under a lot of pressure before including the Rio Olympics where she was most definitely favored to win everything and hyped as possibly the GOAT.  The truth is there were a lot of crazy circumstances leading up to this Olympics that were just out of everyone’s control (like a worldwide pandemic) and I’m just not going to point to her coaches or a silly sparkly goat on her leotard as the reason this happened. Sometimes crap just happens and it’s probably best for all our anxiety levels as humans to accept that.

[Bill1978]

So proud of Tyson Bull. First Aussie male to ever qualify for an Olympic apparatus final and he managed to move up from his qualification position of 7th to 5th. An incredible effort. I was hoping he would sneak a surprise medal but it was not to be. 

[Jess14]

22 minutes ago, Conotocarious said:

I agree with this. I also wonder about casting about for someone or something to blame.  It seems to me that the desire to do that implies that everything is always in our control and if we could just do everything close to perfect all the time nothing bad would ever happen. But that just isn’t true. No one knows really what brings on the twisties. She’s been under a lot of pressure before including the Rio Olympics where she was most definitely favored to win everything and hyped as possibly the GOAT.  The truth is there were a lot of crazy circumstances leading up to this Olympics that were just out of everyone’s control (like a worldwide pandemic) and I’m just not going to point to her coaches or a silly sparkly goat on her leotard as the reason this happened. Sometimes crap just happens and it’s probably best for all our anxiety levels as humans to accept that.

I think that’s true. No one knows what caused Simone’s issues here. However, Simone herself talked about the pressure she was under after qualifications. Also, while she has been under pressure before, including Rio, I think that was very different than what she faced here. That team was never portrayed as “Simone and the team” like this one was. There were 2 gold medalists on that team, including the reigning AA champ, and Raisman was considered the leader of the team, although Simone was certainly the best gymnast on the team. Also, a lot of media attention (and basically all of the negative attention) was aimed squarely at Gabby. There wasn’t really “she needs to be brought down a peg or 2” against Simone, like there was this time. So, I agree that putting a goat on her leo wasn’t the issue, I just assume that it was the totality of the situation that weighed down on her. However, unless she says, we probably will never really know.

[Jeddah]

I haven’t watched, but apparently Sam Mickulak hit on Parallel Bars! I’m happy he went out on a high note (assuming this is it for him). I’ve been very critical of him over the years, but I’m glad he did put up a good routine when it counted even if it didn’t get him a medal.

[Steph619]

Congratulations to Simone for winning the bronze on balance beam! It was great to see her come back for this event and be happy. 
 

Suni was doing so well until that part where she almost fell off the beam! Had that not happened, I think she would’ve won a medal. I like her attitude though. She recognizes when she doesn’t perform well, but she accepts the results and moves on instead of dwelling on it.

Overall, I’m very proud of Team USA. A lot happened at these Olympics, but they never gave up. I love that everyone is coming home with a medal! 

[irisheyes]

1 hour ago, ombelico said:

 

It appears that NBC is embargoing the replay, presumably to capitalize on Simone's return. Given that all of the other replays had been available right after the competition and that I value my sleep, I stayed unspoiled and went to load up the replay to find that it's not there! If there had been a note ahead of time that the replay wasn't going to be available, I would have woken up for it. Grr!

 

Preach!!  I got up in time to see the last competitor before (my normal wake up time), but I wasn’t worried cause I thought I’d be able to catch the replay at work. Thanks NBC. 
 

I did get to watch the splatfest that was High Bar. They’re not amazing tricks unless you can stay on the bar. 

[Conotocarious]

38 minutes ago, Jess14 said:

I think that’s true. No one knows what caused Simone’s issues here. However, Simone herself talked about the pressure she was under after qualifications. Also, while she has been under pressure before, including Rio, I think that was very different than what she faced here. That team was never portrayed as “Simone and the team” like this one was. There were 2 gold medalists on that team, including the reigning AA champ, and Raisman was considered the leader of the team, although Simone was certainly the best gymnast on the team. Also, a lot of media attention (and basically all of the negative attention) was aimed squarely at Gabby. There wasn’t really “she needs to be brought down a peg or 2” against Simone, like there was this time. So, I agree that putting a goat on her leo wasn’t the issue, I just assume that it was the totality of the situation that weighed down on her. However, unless she says, we probably will never really know.

I think its fair to say I’ll be waiting for the last two Simone vs. Herself episodes to drop ASAP. 

So apparently someone asked Cecile what’s next for Simone and she replied “Therapy.” And therapy for herself as well. I think that’s a very honest and good answer and that’s exactly where they need to be….working through this with qualified mental health professionals. Because I DO agree that the pressure really got to her for any and all of those reasons. Shaking in her room and being unable to sleep before team finals is definitely feelings the effects of pressure. I just want to hug Simone. 

[Conotocarious]

11 minutes ago, irisheyes said:

I did get to watch the splatfest that was High Bar. They’re not amazing tricks unless you can stay on the bar. 

I used to love watching high bar but now that everyone has all these spectacular releases all the routines look the same to me.

[Jess14]

17 hours ago, ombelico said:

I don't think there's any way they could have left Jordan Chiles off the team without a huge uproar. She was solidly third in AA at both nationals and Olympic Trials with no missed routines. Although some other options (e.g., Skinner, Wong, DiCello) might have had the capability to beat her AA score on a given day, they never did at any point in the lead up to naming the team, IIRC. 

Also, in the end I'm glad that Jordan was on the team since it meant that both Cecile and Laurent could go (if only Simone were on the team, I'm pretty sure only Laurent would have been able to travel) and Cecile's presence this week has probably been really critical for Simone.

Agreed. Ultimately, I don’t think they could leave Jordan off given her results in 2021. She definitely earned her spot. In general, I just think this crop of gymnasts wasn’t necessarily ideal for a 4 person team, although they certainly could have won gold. I think in the best case scenario, a team of Simone, Suni, Jade, and a healthy Morgan Hurd/Riley McCusjer may have been the best positioned team to maximize the score across all apparatuses, but Jade had the individual spot, and Morgan and Riley weren’t healthy. If you look at many of the other options that were in contention, I don’t think they add much more to the team total than Jordan.

[BlackberryJam]

I'm probably in the minority, but I don't really care why Simone got the twisties. I just accept it and look at what she did to overcome them. That's what matters.

When we try to pinpoint one event or one cause for an issue like this, it makes it seem like mental health issues have external causes. They oftentimes don't. That's why people with wealth, family support, and a successful career still suffer from depression. Sure, some mental health issues are situational, but many, many are not. 

And knowing how hard it was to get up there on the beam, I bet that bronze means more to her than any of her golds. 

[Conotocarious]

I’ve seen two different replays of her beam routine and one is without commentary and one is with a British commentator and they are both so good. You can really hear the roar of the crowd when she finishes in the routine without commentary. So amazing. And I could definitely hear Jordan Chiles as well.

[Lady Whistleup]

Aww crap. No replay on NBC :( They better show the gold and silver routines.

[ombelico]

Hopefully these Olympics will be a wake-up call for everyone (athletes, coaches, media, the audience, *cough* National Team Coordinators *Cough*) that you never, ever, know what is going to happen. Putting all of the attention and focus on just one person both skews the pressure onto one set of shoulders and leads to a myopic loss of recognition for the other team members and other athletes.

I'm sad for Simone that she had to go through a crisis (for whatever reason) at the most inopportune time, but the silver lining is that it opened up opportunities for so many other wonderful athletes to win medals and get their moments in the sun. And paradoxically, it reveals just how remarkable her long-term success and dominance has been.  If she had come in and won team, AA, vault, beam, and floor golds as expected, it would have just been lauded as #SimoneThings, pointed to as evidence of her superhuman abilities, and she and her gymnastics would have continued to be taken for granted. What we saw this week was how fragile that success has been all along, and how much it takes from her to grace us with all of the wonderful performances we have had the immense privilege to witness all of these years. 

[Jenniferbug]

2 hours ago, ombelico said:

It appears that NBC is embargoing the replay, presumably to capitalize on Simone's return. Given that all of the other replays had been available right after the competition and that I value my sleep, I stayed unspoiled and went to load up the replay to find that it's not there! If there had been a note ahead of time that the replay wasn't going to be available, I would have woken up for it. Grr!

Exactly this. I am angry that every other event has had immediate replay, but not this one. Sorry NBC, I have a 10 hour day of work so I decided to sleep. Now that I'm spoiled, I won't bother watching the shitty primetime coverage. 

[Conotocarious]

2 minutes ago, Jenniferbug said:

Exactly this. I am angry that every other event has had immediate replay, but not this one. Sorry NBC, I have a 10 hour day of work so I decided to sleep. Now that I'm spoiled, I won't bother watching the shitty primetime coverage. 

You can see her routine easily online anyway. I agree this is shitty of NBC. So opportunistic and obnoxious! 

[Snow Apple]

1 hour ago, Conotocarious said:

I’ve seen two different replays of her beam routine and one is without commentary and one is with a British commentator and they are both so good. You can really hear the roar of the crowd when she finishes in the routine without commentary. So amazing. And I could definitely hear Jordan Chiles as well.

I’ve watched a few replays from other countries (I’m not sure what countries but they were English speaking) and now I’m annoyed by NBC’s obnoxious prime time commenting and bias more than ever.

[Frisky Wig]

Let’s take a moment to appreciate how many different countries got on the podium at this Games. And yeah, yeah, Notes app… 😆 

 

 

Isreal! Great Britain! Greece! Armenia! Turkey! Brazil! Italy! Belgium! Some of them are firsts for their counties in the sport! Amazing!
 

Also, USA women are bringing home a medal in EVERY category. The USA men on the other hand… 

Edited August 3, 2021 by Frisky Wig
Added stuff

[Snow Apple]

12 minutes ago, Jenniferbug said:

Exactly this. I am angry that every other event has had immediate replay, but not this one. Sorry NBC, I have a 10 hour day of work so I decided to sleep. Now that I'm spoiled, I won't bother watching the shitty primetime coverage. 

I hope we're allowed to bring up other websites. Someone posted a video on the Reddit Gymnastics sub. No commentary. It was just lovely to see Simone's routine without anyone talking throughout. Especially NBC commentary.

[Minneapple]

17 minutes ago, Snow Apple said:

I’ve watched a few replays from other countries (I’m not sure what countries but they were English speaking) and now I’m annoyed by NBC’s obnoxious prime time commenting and bias more than ever.

Actually since they removed Al, the commentary hasn't been awful. I could do without Tim but I like Nastia. And I don't think they have been all that biased. The streaming commentary is solid too.

That said, it's an abomination that NBC didn't show all the medalists' floor routines in primetime (Mai's routine was adorable). There is zero reason for them to not show all the beam routines tonight. The whole thing took less than an hour, and that included the gymnasts' introductions which NBC typically doesn't show. They can even edit out the long waits between the end of the routines and the scores coming up.

Edited August 3, 2021 by Minneapple

[Frisky Wig]

Everyday, NBC shows that they and their coverage are just awful. It’s almost like they wake up each morning, fire up a Zoom meeting and discuss amongst themselves “Good morning team! It’s day ___ of the Games. How can we fuck up our coverage today?”

[Conotocarious]

7 minutes ago, Snow Apple said:

I hope we're allowed to bring up other websites. Someone posted a video on the Reddit Gymnastics sub. No commentary. It was just lovely to see Simone's routine without anyone talking throughout. Especially NBC commentary.

That’s the one I saw and I highly recommend watching it without the commentary because you can hear that tiny crowd roar for her.

[BlackberryJam]

25 minutes ago, Frisky Wig said:

Let’s take a moment to appreciate how many different countries got on the podium at this Games. And yeah, yeah, Notes app… 😆 

 

 

Isreal! Great Britain! Greece! Armenia! Turkey! Brazil! Italy! Belgium! Some of them are firsts for their counties in the sport! Amazing!
 

Also, USA women are bringing home a medal in EVERY category. The USA men on the other hand… 

These firsts are great! Unfortunately, I'm afraid that Grandi will use this as proof that his leadership and decisions (cutting the teams to four, the qualifying as a specialist, etc) are growing the sport. 

[BrindaWalsh]

I personally am loving that we are seeing a variety of countries on the medal podium - USA, ROC, Brazil, Belgium, Great Britain, now China.  How fantastic for this sport during this games.  I know Simone was "supposed" to sweep it all, but if she had, in the GOAT way, we most likely wouldn't have Rebecca winning the first medal ever for Brazil and the first gold for an event final.  Jade wouldn't have had her gold on bars.  We we wouldn't be celebrating the first asian american to win individual gold.  There's bright and shiny gold/silver/bronze lining here.  

That said I am THRILLED for her bronze.  Not to mention, what an extraordinary way to take a bad situation and exhibit good sportsmanship, maturity, wisdom and leadership (to all of the older and allegedly wiser athletes who claim they can better handle pressure --- Novack! --- and throw their temper tantrums, I am looking at you.  Sit down, shut it and take notes from the GOAT).  She was honest with herself and her team, made some tough decisions, worked hard to come back, and supported her fellow athletes along the way. In the future when she looks back, this will probably be the medal that is the most special. 

GOAT indeed.    

 

[Lady Whistleup]

Omg Guan's parents watching her beam. Parents are the same everywhere:

 

[Harry24]

3 hours ago, Steph619 said:

Suni was doing so well until that part where she almost fell off the beam! Had that not happened, I think she would’ve won a medal. I like her attitude though. She recognizes when she doesn’t perform well, but she accepts the results and moves on instead of dwelling on it.

She was probably the biggest sideline cheerleader.  I noticed her jumping up and down during Guan’s routine and clapping energetically for everyone.  She’s just lovely.

[kittykat]

Wonderful Olympics for the ladies, so glad that Simone went out on a high note.

[Conotocarious]

6 minutes ago, Harry24 said:

She was probably the biggest sideline cheerleader.  I noticed her jumping up and down during Guan’s routine and clapping energetically for everyone.  She’s just lovely.

From someone who remembers the horrendous stiffness among the girls even on the team (the “gymnastics hug” where the girls look like they fear the other one is radioactive)in 1992 and 1996 the sportsmanship has just been remarkable this go-round.  I VASTLY prefer it this way.

[choclatechip45]

4 hours ago, Conotocarious said:

I agree with this. I also wonder about casting about for someone or something to blame.  It seems to me that the desire to do that implies that everything is always in our control and if we could just do everything close to perfect all the time nothing bad would ever happen. But that just isn’t true. No one knows really what brings on the twisties. She’s been under a lot of pressure before including the Rio Olympics where she was most definitely favored to win everything and hyped as possibly the GOAT.  The truth is there were a lot of crazy circumstances leading up to this Olympics that were just out of everyone’s control (like a worldwide pandemic) and I’m just not going to point to her coaches or a silly sparkly goat on her leotard as the reason this happened. Sometimes crap just happens and it’s probably best for all our anxiety levels as humans to accept that.

I think the difference was in Rio a lot of the attention was on Gabby leading up to the games. I remember at one point before the Games, NBC trying to sell us on Gabby winning the all around and I was like nooo that is not going to happen.

I don't think speculating is any different from when people were speculating about Gabby in 2016. I remember endless posts of people blaming her mother and her mom gave a cryptic response and a month later we found out about Larry Nassar. So yeah my cynical self wonders if something big is about to drop. 

 

Edited August 3, 2021 by choclatechip45

[Conotocarious]

Just now, choclatechip45 said:

I think the difference was in Rio a lot of the attention was on Gabby leading up to the games. I remember at one point before the Games, NBC trying to sell us on Gabby winning the all around and I was like nooo that is not going to happen.

 

You’re right. Gabby took the brunt of the brutal criticism. People were, well, their usual selves when it comes to Olympic gymnastics. Build them up, tear ‘em down. 

[choclatechip45]

I am very happy for the US Women's gymnastics team everyone medaled! They all should proud of themselves!

[NUguy514]

One thing I haven't seen mentioned in this thread regarding Simone is that July 27th (the day of team finals) was six years to the day after Simone went to several USAG functions, including a birthday party for Steve Penny's daughter, and Penny did not tell her Larry Nasser was under investigation for child molestation.  It's no wonder she was overcome with a physical condition on that day with all of the indescribable emotions she must have been feeling, too.  She is a hero.

[Conotocarious]

4 minutes ago, NUguy514 said:

One thing I haven't seen mentioned in this thread regarding Simone is that July 27th (the day of team finals) was six years to the day after Simone went to several USAG functions, including a birthday party for Steve Penny's daughter, and Penny did not tell her Larry Nasser was under investigation for child molestation.  It's no wonder she was overcome with a physical condition on that day with all of the indescribable emotions she must have been feeling, too.  She is a hero.

I did not know this. There’s a transcript of Simone being interviewed she mentioned “triggering” events and I wonder….

Another thing the transcript makes clear is she’s been off her ADHD meds since 2017. So that’s the end of that theory that I’ve seen floating around.

[Conotocarious]

https://www.news.com.au/sport/olympics/simone-biles-reveals-family-tragedy-after-winning-bronze-in-beam-final/news-story/1dd22cc121c212a17609c65fe2818970

Interesting article as we start to fill in the blanks.

[Lady Whistleup]

53 minutes ago, Conotocarious said:

From someone who remembers the horrendous stiffness among the girls even on the team (the “gymnastics hug” where the girls look like they fear the other one is radioactive)in 1992 and 1996 the sportsmanship has just been remarkable this go-round.  I VASTLY prefer it this way.

As I said, this is when social media is for the good. Gymnasts now see each other as actual people. They see each others' families and dogs. In the old days, gymnasts even from the same country were separated by coaches. I remember back in the day Steve Nunno's students were not allowed to mix with Bela Karolyi's gymnasts. It was ridiculous. They could stand shoulder to shoulder in team pictures and look as if the other was radioactive.

Another thing is elite gymnasts are a little older now. Back in the day they were sometimes 15 or 16. How mature can girls that age be? It's different when most everyone is in the 18-21 age. 

There's still bitchery though. Apparently the 2008 quad was not very close. Chellsie and Nastia didn't like each other, Asac and Shawn didn't like each other, and after the Beijing games Nastia and Shawn feuded for a long time.

[Quilt Fairy]

2 hours ago, Minneapple said:

There is zero reason for them to not show all the beam routines tonight

But....but....there's women's beach volleyball!  You can't tell me you don't want to see that! In primetime. Every night. 

[Conotocarious]

3 minutes ago, Quilt Fairy said:

But....but....there's women's beach volleyball!  You can't tell me you don't want to see that! In primetime. Every night. 

LOL, I cannot stand beach volleyball.

[proserpina65]

11 hours ago, NUguy514 said:

the only one discipline for which there isn't a pretty drastic drop-off is pommel horse (Whitlock's winning score this year was still down a bit from his 2016 winning score). 

You mean such a thing still exists?  Not according to NBC, apparently.

[Enero]

5 hours ago, ombelico said:

It appears that NBC is embargoing the replay, presumably to capitalize on Simone's return. Given that all of the other replays had been available right after the competition and that I value my sleep, I stayed unspoiled and went to load up the replay to find that it's not there! If there had been a note ahead of time that the replay wasn't going to be available, I would have woken up for it. Grr!

 

This is annoying me so much. I wasn't about to get up at 4am, EST to watch, but planned to watch the replay but of course it's not available.

Sorry NBC that's not going get me to watch your awful primetime coverage. In fact, I've not watched the Olympic coverage on TV since they started providing coverage on the app. It's so much better on the app in that the commentary more neutral and you actually get to see nearly all of the competitors. 

I'll just wait for them to put the replay up tomorrow and watch then. 

Congrats to Simone on her bronze. And looks like the Chinese ladies were finally able to win a medals too. Congrats to them as well. 

[choclatechip45]

16 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

As I said, this is when social media is for the good. Gymnasts now see each other as actual people. They see each others' families and dogs. In the old days, gymnasts even from the same country were separated by coaches. I remember back in the day Steve Nunno's students were not allowed to mix with Bela Karolyi's gymnasts. It was ridiculous. They could stand shoulder to shoulder in team pictures and look as if the other was radioactive.

Another thing is elite gymnasts are a little older now. Back in the day they were sometimes 15 or 16. How mature can girls that age be? It's different when most everyone is in the 18-21 age. 

There's still bitchery though. Apparently the 2008 quad was not very close. Chellsie and Nastia didn't like each other, Asac and Shawn didn't like each other, and after the Beijing games Nastia and Shawn feuded for a long time.

I wonder how much the national team camps have to do with this. The 2012 team was the first team I thought these gymnasts don't hate each other. I looked and saw Gabby/Kyla/Maroney were on a team together as a junior. 

[BlackberryJam]

10 minutes ago, Quilt Fairy said:

But....but....there's women's beach volleyball!  You can't tell me you don't want to see that! In primetime. Every night. 

I want to support those athletes, but of all sports, I enjoy watching that the least. Yet the do show every moment of every match in prime time. WHY, NBC, WHY?

Just now, choclatechip45 said:

I wonder how much the national team camps have to do with this. The 2012 team was the first team I thought these gymnasts don't hate each other. I looked and saw Gabby/Kyla/Maroney were on a team together as a junior. 

I think the Karolyis encouraged competition between gymnasts. And while they would "anoint" one as the "top", the difference between the top two or three wasn't much. With Simone, her skills and difficulty far outstrip the others, but she doesn't present like that's an insult to them or that they just need to get better. She's been there, as a survivor of Nassar and the Ranch. She knows how bad it was. And she has such a unique and delightful personality. She's there to support her teammates, not win gold by climbing on their backs.

These young women now can communicate with each other and develop friendships over time and distance, and without coach interference, in ways they couldn't before. It's really made a difference. 

 

[Lady Whistleup]

6 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

I wonder how much the national team camps have to do with this. The 2012 team was the first team I thought these gymnasts don't hate each other. I looked and saw Gabby/Kyla/Maroney were on a team together as a junior. 

This sounds nuts but apparently after 2008 was the first time gymnasts roomed with each other at competitions. Before gymnasts always roomed either with their coaches, parents, or MARTA. I think being allowed to have down-time together helped them bond. 

[KittenPokerCheater]

30 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

There's still bitchery though. Apparently the 2008 quad was not very close. Chellsie and Nastia didn't like each other, Asac and Shawn didn't like each other, and after the Beijing games Nastia and Shawn feuded for a long time.

Really?  I  don't disbelieve you, so where can I read more about this?  

It is true that when one looks at the teams 96-2004 (ish) all the gymnasts hugged each other like they were ordered to.  It was sad, and no one watching ever thought the hugs were sincere.

[Lady Whistleup]

Just now, KittenPokerCheater said:

Really?  I  don't disbelieve you, so where can I read more about this?  

It is true that when one looks at the teams 96-2004 (ish) all the gymnasts hugged each other like they were ordered to.  It was sad, and no one watching ever thought the hugs were sincere.

It was all over the webs but Nastia lost to Chellsie in the 2005 worlds by a tiny margin and called Chellsie "fat."

Shawn and Nastia explained their 8 year feud here.

[choclatechip45]

22 minutes ago, BlackberryJam said:

I want to support those athletes, but of all sports, I enjoy watching that the least. Yet the do show every moment of every match in prime time. WHY, NBC, WHY?

I think the Karolyis encouraged competition between gymnasts. And while they would "anoint" one as the "top", the difference between the top two or three wasn't much. With Simone, her skills and difficulty far outstrip the others, but she doesn't present like that's an insult to them or that they just need to get better. She's been there, as a survivor of Nassar and the Ranch. She knows how bad it was. And she has such a unique and delightful personality. She's there to support her teammates, not win gold by climbing on their backs.

These young women now can communicate with each other and develop friendships over time and distance, and without coach interference, in ways they couldn't before. It's really made a difference. 

 

Simone was attending camps way before she was the top gymnast. Most of these gymnasts are attending camps as juniors. I remember watching videos of her skills as a junior the most impressive thing about her was the vault. I was definitely more excited about Lexie Priessman and Ohashi in 2012. But yes there was a lot of speculation back in 2010 that Martha/Kathy Kelley approved Gabby moving to Chow's to light a fire under Shawn. A lot of the gyms in that 2010/2011 era had multiple top gymnasts Alicia/Aly, McKayla/Mattie Larson, Caquatto sisters/Anna Li, Rebecca Bross/Nastia.

Edited August 3, 2021 by choclatechip45

[Lady Whistleup]

Guan Chen Chen's beam routine here. Gorgeous.

[choclatechip45]

21 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

This sounds nuts but apparently after 2008 was the first time gymnasts roomed with each other at competitions. Before gymnasts always roomed either with their coaches, parents, or MARTA. I think being allowed to have down-time together helped them bond. 

Didn't Shawn/Nastia room together at the Olympics? I know the 2008 team had roommates at the Olympics.

15 minutes ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

Really?  I  don't disbelieve you, so where can I read more about this?  

It is true that when one looks at the teams 96-2004 (ish) all the gymnasts hugged each other like they were ordered to.  It was sad, and no one watching ever thought the hugs were sincere.

There was a facebook post on Sam Peszek's page that made it's way around the internet in 2008 that was making fun of Shawn.

I definitely remember Nastia being pissed when Chellsie won. 

[Lady Whistleup]

3 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

Didn't Shawn/Nastia room together at the Olympics? I know the 2008 team had roommates at the Olympics.

Didn't Nastia stay with her parents? I remember them saying Shawn stayed in the village and Nastia at a hotel.