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S36.E07: Die Another Jay

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Fallout from a shocking blindside puts a target on a strong pair of Agents. Devin presses an Agent's buttons, resulting in another night of mayhem. Agents must face their fears while hanging off of a helicopter during "Mission: Aerial Takedown."

Airs January 27th.

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Was real excited for that “your votes don’t count” twist, especially because I agreed with the reasoning. If you don’t try to play, you don’t get to make plays! 

Then it turned out to mean nothing anyway. Oh well. Sad to see Jay go, but happy that Leroy is still in it!

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Play stupid games, win stupid prizes, Jay.

The editing on this show is not subtle, but it was extra not-subtle tonight. There was no way Leroy The Lion-Hearted in His Final Challenge Season was going down against the second season layup who pissed off three-quarters of the house. Not with the Hero (tm) music and build-up anyway.

I love how much Devin hates Big Brother contestants. He's like a grumpy old man yelling at overgrown man-children to get off his lawn.

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I think Josh should have gotten kicked off the show for shoving Devin. Fuck that, you don’t lay hands on people. I don’t like Devin, but I would have laughed so hard if he had instigated Josh into getting himself kicked off.

Bummed to see Jay go. I like him even though he was playing stupidly.

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This was probably the best episode of the season thus far for me.

1) I dislike when they repeat the same elimination games even when there is a minor change. Leroy did this same elimination in season 26 when he was partnered with Nia and he completely smoked Nany and Johnny. You blinked and you missed half of Leroy's round at the time. Nice to see he can still pull it off.

2) Jay... you got stuck with a person that think she's good at the game when she isn't.

3) LOL @ Aneesa still stuffing her face while trying to prevent the fights right behind her.

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Tonight's episode was a tough one. The guys punked out n the mission, Devin kept needling Fessy and Josh, and Jay was sent packing. I know that he probably bears some responsibility in regard to last week, but he's so damn adorkable. Yes, I imagine he caused Jeff Probst's cargo shorts to get tighter a few times, but he's funny. This is from when Leroy came down to the Crater floor: “Welp, I have an angry boyfriend on my hands, he’s coming down into the Crater. This isn’t the first angry boyfriend I’ve had chase me before because of, y’know, things I’ve done. Hot girls!” How can you not love him?

On the other hand, I'm glad Leroy is still in the game. He could renege about this being his final Challenge, and I wouldn't hold it against him that much.

Theresa is usually just a name to me. A lot of the regulars don't register for me right away, and she's one of them. Well, she made moves tonight, they got Jay eliminated, and now she's got Cory as a partner. Fun fact: he's had three partners before her, and they're all out of the game. I'd make more jokes, but one of those women was Natalie, and she didn't exactly leave under traditional means.

Mission had the potential for awesomeness, but the guys ruined it by staying in place. The only one I can't really hate is Darrell. He had issues with heights and water before Tony went kamikaze on him in Dirty XXX. Mechie got eliminated . . . did he try to win? TJ striking the guys' votes was nice, but it felt like it was done just to solidify his status as "The Dirtiest Player In The Game."

Devin continues to suck copious amounts of ass. I don't like Big Brother, but he's clearly getting on people's nerves, and that's a dick move. One of the guys offended is Josh, and he's just the easiest target. There's no effort required to wind him up. He's that dumb and that easy to trigger. Fessy gets mad, Josh overreacts, and Devin basically spanks it in his interviews. It's not pretty at all.

ETA for @AntFTW . . . I think prior Craters will be repeated, with the genders flipped from the previous ones.

Edited by Lantern7
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1 minute ago, Lantern7 said:

Yes, I imagine he caused Jeff Probst's cargo shorts to get tighter a few times, but he's funny.

Nah, Jeff pretty much had nothing but contempt for Jay. He won two immunity challenges, but wasn't the season's challenge beast, and went out on a series of bone-headed moves and unforced errors. His last two episodes are him being led around by the nose and tricked over and over. He basically ended up as the season's court jester. So, I think Jeff disliked him for ironically the exact opposite reason TJ likes him so much: Jeff thought he didn't take it seriously. And compared to others on that season, he didn't. He wasn't a gamebot who ate, slept and breathed Survivor and he did have a pretty laid-back strategy.

The thing is, Jay is not great at strategy, but he's a competitor and he excels at reading people. Which he did here. He read his own demise perfectly. And I guess not a lot of people can say that.

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Sorry to see Jay go. I’ve never like Theresa in past seasons but it’s hard not to root for her because I really dislike Kam on a power trip. 

I just love Devin. For tv purposes only because he would be exhausting to be around in person. Josh and Fessy are so damn dumb that it’s fun to watch Devin wind them up. 

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22 minutes ago, Eolivet said:

Nah, Jeff pretty much had nothing but contempt for Jay. He won two immunity challenges, but wasn't the season's challenge beast, and went out on a series of bone-headed moves and unforced errors. His last two episodes are him being led around by the nose and tricked over and over. He basically ended up as the season's court jester. So, I think Jeff disliked him for ironically the exact opposite reason TJ likes him so much: Jeff thought he didn't take it seriously. And compared to others on that season, he didn't. He wasn't a gamebot who ate, slept and breathed Survivor and he did have a pretty laid-back strategy.

The thing is, Jay is not great at strategy, but he's a competitor and he excels at reading people. Which he did here. He read his own demise perfectly. And I guess not a lot of people can say that.

In my defense, his season aired in Fall 2016. That feels like forever ago, and I can't keep up with names and faces. From your description, it sounds like Jay came off smarter than Jason Siska on Fans vs. Favorites, but not by much. Also, I found this old post of mine on the MvGX finale thread:

On 12/14/2016 at 11:21 PM, Lantern7 said:

Jay has to be among in the top tier of dummies. Between falling for the fake idol and not covering up his answer, I laughed hard at his fall. The puzzles should've had different answers, but he's still a dope. Like I said when Jason got similarly tricked . . . the only thing missing was Carlos Mencia leaping out of a bush, shouting, "DEE DEE DEEEEEEE!!!!!"

Well, I like him now. He can say "super dope" and not look like a total asshole. And I'm glad he didn't get a concussion this season.

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Theresa being mad at Amber B for not throwing the Challenge was all kinds of ridiculous! This is why I was hesitant to give Theresa props last week for making a move. She acts just as indignant as everyone else when things don’t go her way. I still remember that Challenge when she convinced her team to vote Laurel in, and then she punked out and voted otherwise after her team had voted in Laurel. She’s always plays a sneaky game and never in a particularly clever way.

I like Jay, so I’m sad to see him go, but I like Leroy better so I’m glad he won. 

I can tolerate Fessy, but I can’t stand Josh or Devin AT ALL so seeing an extended amount of time devoted to them is torture. Im ready for both to be gone. 

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Is Amber B not part of the Big Brother alliance?  Because nobody seems to mention her when talking about Big Brother players and I remember her from BB.  Hard to forget her (Well because she's beautiful but that's not my point) because she had Caleb stalking her all season long.

As @shantown said, I love how the canceled votes meant absolutely nothing in the grand scheme of things.

I remember really disliking Jay on Survivor.  But I have become a fan since seeing him on this show.  My dislike of Natalie will never change though.

I love how CT point blank said he hated Josh when he (CT) was talking to Kyle about the water tossing ordeal. 

 

 

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TJ:  You guys f---ing suck.

Then he warned them about the shoving back and forth last night.  See they're inconsistent.  In the past they would have zero-tolerance.

Now they do whatever suits them.

The cancellation of the votes didn't change the outcome, so why even bother.

Yeah Leroy must have recognized what the elimination was going to be.  Still impressive because it takes rhythm and coordination but that's something to be developed by practice.  Presumably they didn't get to practice so it was all adrenaline probably.

The helicopter cargo thing might have been good if they competed.  But they saw how Cam got in trouble being the aggressor.  To try to pry someone else off, they only hang on to the cargo net with one hand and as the helicopter swings that thing back and forth, it's easier to lose your grip if you're hanging on with just one hand while trying to pull opponents off with the other hand.

So there is really no incentive to try to be aggressive.  Better to allow others to get exhausted trying to pull others off.

Nobody wanted to go into that water.  Imagine if there's any kind of distance swimming in the Final.  I assume they won't do that because hypothermia must be a real risk.

 

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I can why people dislike Devin but I hope he stays on. I enjoy his snarky commentary. He's much better tv than Josh.

I hope there are no more challenges where people just don't try. It certainly takes away any interest in the challenges.

I felt bad for Jay but things going poorly for Theresa works for me. She just seems awful. So glad Amber B didn't throw things for her.

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7 hours ago, aghst said:

So there is really no incentive to try to be aggressive.  Better to allow others to get exhausted trying to pull others off

"Boring" as it might have been, it almost seemed like this was better suited for an endurance challenge and not a physical throw them off challenge. Keep moving that helicopter around and dip periodically and see who can hang on the longest.  I was thinking the same about trying to force someone off, with everything else that just seemed too hard. 

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I’m curious to see who gets the last gold skull for the men. No matter who it is, Devin is about to be a sitting duck. Between him, Leroy, Fessy, and Kyle, he is definitely the one that the other men will want to Challenge for a skull, and there aren’t many other men left who I think would be a bigger target than him in eliminations  (Mechie, I guess; Josh - but he’s big so that’s always risky; maybe Cory).

It’s wide open for the women though. I wonder if they’re going to keep letting the rookies slide on through. 

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8 hours ago, BK1978 said:

Is Amber B not part of the Big Brother alliance? 

I've been wondering about that, too. Since she has never once been mentioned as part of it, I guess she isn't. Maybe it's because she's a rookie. She seems to be aligned with the rookie girls/Big T.

As always, Devin ends up reminding me that he is actually a completely dick. I'm so over his 'needle people and gaslight them until they snap' schtick. I was hoping someone would punch him in the face. Devin is in desperate need of being punched in the face. Josh should have actually went for that instead of that stupid push. Also, why the fuck wasn't Josh kicked off for that? You can't just decide not to enforce your rules because you're losing people left and right and don't wanna have to lose another one.

Fessy going all Texan or something with his accent while drunk and ranting had me rolling.

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On Vevmo people are saying that Fessy said the n word when he was yelling. I didn't notice when watching but some people seem convinced he said it.

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Last week's episode was great, and this was even better, probably the best episode so far. I feel bad for Jay, because he got stuck with Theresa and basically took the fall for her dirty work. As much as the girls were mad at Theresa, they are secretly happy that her work got Ashley out of the game because she is strong with finals. I am so happy that Leroy got his skull. I was worrying about him for a while. He always plays a nice, straight up game, especially when his bff Johnny is there, but I like him on the seasons where he is alone. When I saw what the elimination was, I knew he had it. I remember when he last did this elimination with Nia and completely smoked it. I love how they tried to slow it down and make it more dramatic, with TJ saying that it was twice as long, showing Leroy getting stuck, but the whole thing lasted under a minute. Probably the quickest elimination so far. 

I always roll my eyes when Josh talks. Casting his vote and saying yeah maybe I'll be the one to take you out. Please. I think Devin is great for TV, and I thought it was funny that he admitted that he was a layup. Thanks Devin. I'm interested to see the next girls elimination and who will get a skull. I think in past seasons Josh might have been kicked off for shoving Devin, however with them being isolated, and being so so drunk, they probably decided to just let it go. 

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It turned out to be nothing but I loved TJ dumping the votes from the guys who didn't even try in the game. The guys have sucked this year so much,

If Leroy didn't go down to the elimination after talking all that junk about how dare Theresa and Jay send in his girl who still got her fucking skull I would have been so mad. And to talk about sending in Nam?

I hope Jay comes back next season and never teams up with Theresa again.

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Well, I guess my assumption that after a marriage and kids and several years Theresa is probably much more mature than she was when last on the show was wrong.

So many political errors tonight! CT becoming wildly defensive when Theresa accused him was basically an admission of guilt. Theresa was a mess all around. Fessy and Josh both fell victim to Devin issuing an insult last heard at recess when the ten year olds were playing. What is everyone even doing?

14 hours ago, AntFTW said:

1) I dislike when they repeat the same elimination games even when there is a minor change. Leroy did this same elimination in season 26 when he was partnered with Nia and he completely smoked Nany and Johnny. You blinked and you missed half of Leroy's round at the time. Nice to see he can still pull it off.

Johnny actually never even got to do anything because Nany just got stuck and hung there while both Nia and Leroy completed their laps. I heard a couple of the challengers say last night that Leroy had done that elimination before “against Bananas” and eh, not really. That said, I think the experience was likely a big advantage here.

14 hours ago, Eolivet said:

The thing is, Jay is not great at strategy, but he's a competitor and he excels at reading people. Which he did here. He read his own demise perfectly. And I guess not a lot of people can say that.

Oh, Jay. We all saw this one coming. Including him. If only he had thought it through before making the move.

11 hours ago, aghst said:

Then he warned them about the shoving back and forth last night.  See they're inconsistent.  In the past they would have zero-tolerance.

Now they do whatever suits them.

They probably asked Devin if he wanted Josh sent home, and Devin probably declined since Josh is a big oaf who is good to have around as a layup. That’s historically how they handle “smaller” aggressive offenses. 

3 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I've been wondering about that, too. Since she has never once been mentioned as part of it, I guess she isn't. Maybe it's because she's a rookie. She seems to be aligned with the rookie girls/Big T.

That threw me, also. Upon reflection, I think it’s probably because she’s a quietish rookie paired with quietish Darrell, as opposed to the other three who are vets with more political impact. 

 

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I totally thought Jay had that.  They were neck and neck for most of the first leg, and right at the end of it, Leroy pulled ahead. And then he fucking took off! It was amazing. But kudos to both of them for doing all of that in under a minute. I would still be hanging there. Despite being a fan of Leroy, a small part of me was hoping he'd lose to Jay. I'm so tired of all the entitlement from so many of them. 

Me when TJ announces that the guys who DQ'd wouldn't have their votes counted:

tenor.gif?itemid=14308435

Me when I realized that it meant absolutely nothing for the outcome of the vote:

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Next time save a twist like that for when it's gonna have maximum impact, Teej!

Jay the entire episode to Theresa:

giphy.gif

Jay just figured out way too late that none of this was going to end positively for him. 

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Didn’t Kaycee say in the first episode that Amber was part of the BB alliance? I remember it because I didn’t watch whatever season of BB that Amber was on, so I was surprised that Kaycee included her at the time. She doesn’t seem to have been part of any discussions with them since however. 

I definitely didn’t hear Fessy say the n word, but I haven’t researched it. Aneesa was right there, so I have to think that she definitely would’ve reacted if she heard it. 

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2 hours ago, LaurelleJ said:

I think Devin is great for TV, and I thought it was funny that he admitted that he was a layup.

2 hours ago, TiffanyNichelle said:

The guys have sucked this year so much

I'll take "layups" like Devin who are semi-decent in challenges and give interesting/funny commentary over doofs like Josh or Fessy any day. I also really can't stand Cory who is apparently a vet, but seems to be worse at this game than anyone else there. The guys haven't really shown to be worth much this year in challenges and haven't provided much in the way of entertainment in the house (getting in fights about Big Brother doesn't count as entertainment). 

Also - is "layups" a new term this year? Back in the day it was always "trim the fat" but now they seem to want to keep some easy people around. Funny how strategy changes over time in this game!

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16 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

Mechie got eliminated . . . did he try to win?

My assumption was that he just wasn't strong enough to hang on, didn't start with a good grip anyway (didn't the women laugh when he kind of sprang onto the net almost last minute?), etc.  Which made me wonder if TJ included him in the "didn't try" or not.  I think "tried but sucked terribly" still should get a vote!  

It's such a strange dynamic, and I'm sure I've seen it before on these shows, that the person who is "holding back" their friend in a close-to-physical fight (as Josh was holding Fessy back) suddenly becomes the one who needs to be held back.  It's so foreign to me as a non-confrontational, doesn't-drink-much, cis female (though the women on these shows do this too, but not as much as, say, Josh) on a fundamental level.

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1 hour ago, luckyroll3 said:

They were neck and neck for most of the first leg, and right at the end of it, Leroy pulled ahead.

I don't know, I think that was clever editing. Jay is short and small, so he's going to have to work twice as hard at those challenges as someone bigger and taller, I think. I noticed Leroy's clips were slowed down, while Jay's were played at normal speed. I think that was to give the illusion it was closer than it was.

Here's the thing: Jay will never make a final. Maybe I'll go back and eat my words in a couple years, but not with this system. He would've been perfectly positioned for pre-skull Challenges, where it seems you could fly under-the-radar on the strength of your social game and maneuver not to get thrown into elimination if you had numbers. But once Jay has to see elimination, he's toast. Even if he wins one or two, he's going to be far too tempting a target for bigger guys who need skulls in a physical challenge.

So, TJ can like him all he wants, but TJ's rule changes (if they were in fact TJ's rule changes) that people can't just "skate by" and get to a final mean that undersized competitors like Jay will likely never see one. Don't get me wrong, I like this new system and I really didn't like people coasting through a season. But it does mean Jay may keep getting invited back, only to be an early, easy boot every season whenever a physical elimination rears its head.

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1 hour ago, Eolivet said:

I don't know, I think that was clever editing. Jay is short and small, so he's going to have to work twice as hard at those challenges as someone bigger and taller, I think. I noticed Leroy's clips were slowed down, while Jay's were played at normal speed. I think that was to give the illusion it was closer than it was.

Here's the thing: Jay will never make a final. Maybe I'll go back and eat my words in a couple years, but not with this system. He would've been perfectly positioned for pre-skull Challenges, where it seems you could fly under-the-radar on the strength of your social game and maneuver not to get thrown into elimination if you had numbers. But once Jay has to see elimination, he's toast. Even if he wins one or two, he's going to be far too tempting a target for bigger guys who need skulls in a physical challenge.

So, TJ can like him all he wants, but TJ's rule changes (if they were in fact TJ's rule changes) that people can't just "skate by" and get to a final mean that undersized competitors like Jay will likely never see one. Don't get me wrong, I like this new system and I really didn't like people coasting through a season. But it does mean Jay may keep getting invited back, only to be an early, easy boot every season whenever a physical elimination rears its head.

Yeah he at least has a chance in these contests of agility and coordination.  He could do well hanging something, only holding up his body weight.

But then the staples like Hall Battle, he doesn't have a chance.

That is why this whole thing about "fifth national sport" is a joke because there are big disparities in weight.

If they had a better balance of strength and endurance (something involving distance) then it would be a more level playing field.  But for MTV, those distance events or those that don't involve people crashing into each other aren't as entertaining to watch.

Oh that and transparent scoring and rules.

 

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3 hours ago, shantown said:

I'll take "layups" like Devin who are semi-decent in challenges and give interesting/funny commentary over doofs like Josh or Fessy any day. I also really can't stand Cory who is apparently a vet, but seems to be worse at this game than anyone else there. The guys haven't really shown to be worth much this year in challenges and haven't provided much in the way of entertainment in the house (getting in fights about Big Brother doesn't count as entertainment). 

Also - is "layups" a new term this year? Back in the day it was always "trim the fat" but now they seem to want to keep some easy people around. Funny how strategy changes over time in this game!

Absolutely. Josh is the worst type of layup. He tries to act like he is one of the big threats when he will easily fold. If the elimination has a weight advantage, that's his only move. Otherwise he wouldn't make it far. I still think back to when he tried to make a rivalry with Wes and Wes shut him down. 

I also don't understand Theresa, she acted surprised when the girls were not into her plan to let her win. It was clear the move wasn't about their alliance, it was about saving her teammate. She did her dirt and made Jay pay the price. She would probably eventually try to get one of the smaller rookies thrown in to try and have an easier go at her skull. I can tolerate a lot of things, but not someone coming for Darrell!! 

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23 hours ago, Michichick said:

I was also hoping there’d be a switcheroo and it would have been another women’s elimination. Keep those contestants guessing.

Ohhhh I wanted a surprise women’s elimination SO BADLY when it was going to be Kaycee and Theresa.

Amber’s giant rainbow of hair in the compromised agents photoshop cracks me up.

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Actually, I don't think Theresa's plan was a bad one, she just executed it poorly.  If all 5 of the women were in the same alliance (I can't keep track) and 4 fell quickly, they would be assured a win because the other women had already gone. If Amber  wanted to win so badly, Theresa should have let her, with the understanding that either Jay wouldn't be the house vote, or if he was, he could pick his own opponent from the other alliance.  

I really hope that once all 10 skulls are won, the game continues.  People who have been hanging back would have to go after the people who already have skulls, and those people who got their skulls against weak players would be challenged by the strong ones.  I don't really like Devin or Kyle, but I relish the idea that one of them takes away Fessy's skull the day before the final.

 

I'm not sure Theresa knows what "receipts" means

Edited by Fretful
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9 hours ago, Fretful said:

Actually, I don't think Theresa's plan was a bad one, she just executed it poorly.  If all 5 of the women were in the same alliance (I can't keep track) and 4 fell quickly, they would be assured a win because the other women had already gone. If Amber  wanted to win so badly, Theresa should have let her, with the understanding that either Jay wouldn't be the house vote, or if he was, he could pick his own opponent from the other alliance.  

I really hope that once all 10 skulls are won, the game continues.  People who have been hanging back would have to go after the people who already have skulls, and those people who got their skulls against weak players would be challenged by the strong ones.  I don't really like Devin or Kyle, but I relish the idea that one of them takes away Fessy's skull the day before the final.

 

I'm not sure Theresa knows what "receipts" means

Agreed on Theresa's plan. She seemed to assume everyone should organize around her. 

I hope the opposite on the 10 skulls though I know it won't happen. I think it would be funny if when 5 guy skulls are allocated, TJ just tells the rest of the guys "good bye" and we just finish out with getting the 5 women skulls. The game sure would be different the next season. I would like for a winning strategy to be you keep the person you want out of the final from ever getting the chance to get a skull.

I so agree on the receipts thing. Saying you have them does not mean you have anything different from anyone else who remember what was said and then repeats it to people. I wanted someone to respond either with "ok, show them." or "yeah, me too. I remember conversations also."

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9 hours ago, Fretful said:

I'm not sure Theresa knows what "receipts" means

 

18 minutes ago, RedbirdNelly said:

I so agree on the receipts thing. Saying you have them does not mean you have anything different from anyone else who remember what was said and then repeats it to people. I wanted someone to respond either with "ok, show them." or "yeah, me too. I remember conversations also."

Except Theresa's "receipts" were the cameras. Which would be fine if this was a reunion, but totally ineffective while currently on the show because we all know the producers ain't pulling out tape in the middle of an argument to prove anyone right when they could just save it for the actual airing where they can edit it to suit their needs. So were her receipts real? Absolutely! But just like everything else Theresa's done the past couple of episode, a total fail on the execution.

Edited by luckyroll3
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I like Leroy and I'm glad he won but I can't with Kam. The way she and Leroy were acting after that elimination was just ridiculous. You would think Kam lost and went home. I wish that every time they said "you blindsided me and threw me in", Theresa would respond with "You got your skull, so what's the issue?" Getting a skull is the whole point of the game. It seems like a lot of the vets have this mentality from older games when you don't want to get thrown into elimination and you seek revenge on who send you in. Kam didn't want to get blindsided, which ok fair. But dirty plays and blindsiding and lying to people is what they all do. What was Kam hoping to do? Did she want to win a daily challenge so she can decide herself if she wants to go in and who she goes in against? Because there are no guarantees of that. Or someone in her alliance would win and would throw her in. I do get that she wanted to have choice but you're not always guaranteed that in this game and she should know that. Plus her partner Kyle already has a skull. He may act nice and offended on her behalf, but we all know Kyle only looks out for himself and has no incentive to fight for Kam to get a skull. At least they don't have to go against Ashley in a final but they don't seem to realize that's a good thing. 

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56 minutes ago, luckyroll3 said:

 

Except Theresa's "receipts" were the cameras. Which would be fine if this was a reunion, but totally ineffective while currently on the show because we all know the producers ain't pulling out tape in the middle of an argument to prove anyone right when they could just save it for the actual airing where they can edit it to suit their needs. So were her receipts real? Absolutely! But just like everything else Theresa's done the past couple of episode, a total fail on the execution.

agreed. She kept saying it like she had something special in the game--not just "wait for the reunion." If she'd said it once, it would have not stood out. But she seemed to think she really had something she could use in the game. 

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59 minutes ago, RedbirdNelly said:

I hope the opposite on the 10 skulls though I know it won't happen. I think it would be funny if when 5 guy skulls are allocated, TJ just tells the rest of the guys "good bye" and we just finish out with getting the 5 women skulls. The game sure would be different the next season. I would like for a winning strategy to be you keep the person you want out of the final from ever getting the chance to get a skull.

I feel the same way, it would be so glorious to behold! I love CT and Darrell but neither of them have skulls; I would be sad to see them booted in that fashion, but love it at the same time. But given that the men have 4 skulls to the women's 2, it will go the other way I'm sure. 

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2 hours ago, RedbirdNelly said:

I hope the opposite on the 10 skulls though I know it won't happen. I think it would be funny if when 5 guy skulls are allocated, TJ just tells the rest of the guys "good bye" and we just finish out with getting the 5 women skulls. The game sure would be different the next season. I would like for a winning strategy to be you keep the person you want out of the final from ever getting the chance to get a skull.

 

I agree there would be a satisfaction to that, but it doesn't leave much room for strategy.  Once those 10 skulls are out there, the real fight for the skulls begins.  If you're Fessy and Aneesa and you win, do you throw in 2 strong players (say CT and Darrell) hoping to get one out of the mix and knowing that whoever wins that battle STILL doesn't have a skull and is coming for you?  Or 2 medium players like Kyle and Cory who might come after you but probably can't beat you?  Do you hold on to the weaker players like Mechie so if you do get thrown in you have someone to go against?

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2 hours ago, RedbirdNelly said:

agreed. She kept saying it like she had something special in the game--not just "wait for the reunion." If she'd said it once, it would have not stood out. But she seemed to think she really had something she could use in the game. 

And not only that, but her “receipts” prove that SHE brought up Darrell’s name! Sure, CT agreed with her, and he lied when he denied it, but I don’t see how the receipts helped her that much. For a part of the episode, she was pretending like Darrell and Amber were wrong to think she wanted to throw them in. They weren’t - which makes Theresa’s anger that Amber wouldn’t throw the competition to her all the more ridiculous. 

 

Edited by Jess14
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1 hour ago, Jess14 said:

And not only that, but her “receipts” prove that SHE brought up Darrell’s name! Sure, CT agreed with her, and he lied when he denied it, but I don’t see how the receipts helped her that much. For a part of the episode, she was pretending like Darrell and Amber were wrong to think she wanted to throw them in. They weren’t - which makes Theresa’s anger that Amber wouldn’t throw the competition to her all the more ridiculous. 

 

agreed-she can prove that CT heard her bring up Darrell's name! that's it. so proposing to toss someone in is fine; it's repeating that you said it is worse? who would agree with that besides Theresa

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20 hours ago, Jess14 said:

And not only that, but her “receipts” prove that SHE brought up Darrell’s name! Sure, CT agreed with her, and he lied when he denied it, but I don’t see how the receipts helped her that much. For a part of the episode, she was pretending like Darrell and Amber were wrong to think she wanted to throw them in. They weren’t - which makes Theresa’s anger that Amber wouldn’t throw the competition to her all the more ridiculous. 

 

Totally! Also, the “receipts” work both ways. They’ll show CT was a part of that conversation, but they’ll also show that Theresa did in fact try to orchestrate the girls throwing the challenge to her, which she denied. Kam and Leroy mentioned in their patreon recap that after the challenge she was telling the girls they should have fallen faster. I feel like Theresa has NEVER been as good at this game as she thinks she is. It’s too bad that Jay had to take the fall for her this time, but he had every opportunity last week to make this end differently for himself. Also, is anyone else distracted by Theresa’s hollow cheekbones?

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34 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

Absolutely. I can't remember if they were always like that or not.

They weren’t. At least, to me they weren’t.

Theresa was always a skinny girl but she managed to get more skinny after popping out babies.

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I feel like Theresa should in theory be a great contestant for The Challenge, but she has always rubbed me the wrong way and annoyed the everliving shit out of me. Her only elimination wins that I can recall were against a checked out Camilla in Free Agents and against Nany (who isn't good at eliminations herself) in Battle of the Exes II. I feel like she buys into her own hype a lot.

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I actually like Theresa, but this episode was a very bad look for her. The sunken cheeks are definitely distracting. 

Jay quickly became a favorite of mine last season, so I was very sad to see him go.

I do like Leroy, and hope he gets a W.  I don't see that happening if there's any swimming or complicated puzzles in the final though.

I used to like Kam, but she is really rubbing me the wrong way this season. 

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Theresa: “Jay, just coast. Lay low. People will forget...”

Also Theresa: *spends entire episode not coasting*

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Theresa just baffles me.  I'll admit I'm not a fan, but she seems more intelligent than most of the yahoos who show up for this, but she has an inexplicable inability to follow things to their logical conclusion, like she's always brand new.  In a past season, she didn't say Laurel's name when she should have since it didn't change the outcome, but then she got all butthurt when things went EXACTLY as anyone could have predicted.  She  she told Cam one thing and did another and then got all butthurt when Cam reacted EXACTLY as anyone could have predicted.  She decided to try to throw CT under the bus and then got all butthurt when he reacted EXACTLY as anyone could have predicted, and that one didn't even have the benefit of being arguably a good move.  No, she would have been better off lying and targeting someone else than trying to tell the truth with CT, because OF COURSE he is going to turn immediately and start shouting you down.  And I think part of what CT was saying to Theresa was that the truth really doesn't even matter, because even if most people actually believe her, they're still going to stick with him.  I just don't understand how she never sees any of this coming, and then says she is so "misunderstood."  

Theresa looks more hollow in the cheeks because she is leaner now, even though she's about the same size-looking.  She's older now and has had children.  120lbs when you are 20 looks far different than 120 does later on.  When you're younger, you can be 120lbs and still be soft or soft-ish.  As you get older, you have to work harder and harder to keep that weight, and you have to replace that softness with leaner muscle, if you want to stay the same size.  If I tried to get down to my weight from when I was 20 at my now 46, A) that's way more work than I would ever care to do, and B) I would look absolutely frightful at that weight now.  It would be far, far too thin for me now, even though I looked fine (and soft!) at that weight 20 years ago.  (All of this is a general rule; I'm no expert.  But I definitely believe that's what's behind Theresa's sharper facial lines.)

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20 minutes ago, lasu said:

Theresa just baffles me.  I'll admit I'm not a fan, but she seems more intelligent than most of the yahoos who show up for this, but she has an inexplicable inability to follow things to their logical conclusion, like she's always brand new.  In a past season, she didn't say Laurel's name when she should have since it didn't change the outcome, but then she got all butthurt when things went EXACTLY as anyone could have predicted.  She  she told Cam one thing and did another and then got all butthurt when Cam reacted EXACTLY as anyone could have predicted.  She decided to try to throw CT under the bus and then got all butthurt when he reacted EXACTLY as anyone could have predicted, and that one didn't even have the benefit of being arguably a good move.  No, she would have been better off lying and targeting someone else than trying to tell the truth with CT, because OF COURSE he is going to turn immediately and start shouting you down.  And I think part of what CT was saying to Theresa was that the truth really doesn't even matter, because even if most people actually believe her, they're still going to stick with him.  I just don't understand how she never sees any of this coming, and then says she is so "misunderstood."  

Theresa looks more hollow in the cheeks because she is leaner now, even though she's about the same size-looking.  She's older now and has had children.  120lbs when you are 20 looks far different than 120 does later on.  When you're younger, you can be 120lbs and still be soft or soft-ish.  As you get older, you have to work harder and harder to keep that weight, and you have to replace that softness with leaner muscle, if you want to stay the same size.  If I tried to get down to my weight from when I was 20 at my now 46, A) that's way more work than I would ever care to do, and B) I would look absolutely frightful at that weight now.  It would be far, far too thin for me now, even though I looked fine (and soft!) at that weight 20 years ago.  (All of this is a general rule; I'm no expert.  But I definitely believe that's what's behind Theresa's sharper facial lines.)

If I recall correctly, the thing with Laurel was in Free Agents. I think she had rallied votes for Laurel, and when the time came, she left everybody high and dry, and did not vote for Laurel. She took the shot, which was what she was supposed to do. However, that left her with less allies and no political capital to target Laurel again in the event that Laurel won the elimination (which Laurel did win).

...and that’s the part about Theresa’s game I never liked. She makes a move and leaves herself vulnerable with no one to run to. Did the same thing this season.

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16 hours ago, AntFTW said:

I recall correctly, the thing with Laurel was in Free Agents. I think she had rallied votes for Laurel, and when the time came, she left everybody high and dry, and did not vote for Laurel. She took the shot, which was what she was supposed to do. However, that left her with less allies and no political capital to target Laurel again in the event that Laurel won the elimination (which Laurel did win).

Targeting Laurel wasn't a bad move.  Burning her vote and her allies at the last second was beyond dumb, and it obviously gave the other people who voted for Laurel a reason to turn on Theresa, and point Laurel's wrath in her direction.  It was worse than if she had voted with her allies. And then she gets confused and upset when she makes what she feels is a "good move" and people aren't happy about how she made the move.  It's like she thinks if it's a "good move" to lie to Cam about putting her in since it resulted in her goal of getting Ashley out, then Cam and everyone else isn't allowed to be mad about it, and she gets super confused when they DO get mad about it.  That's what I don't understand about her - her complete inability to see what seems obvious.  If she were a rookie, I would get it.  But Theresa is a vet, and what's more, I think she's actually an intelligent vet, so I just don't get it.

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