S06.E20: The Last Leg

[Beden]

Throw the leg=jump the shark.

 

Works for me.

[ScoobieDoobs]

Here's Alex McCord's take-

 

http://thestir.cafemom.com/entertainment/175114/Aviva_Drescher_throws_leg_RHONY

 

I wonder if Veevs took acting lessons.  If she didn't, she needed to.  She sorta channels Faye Dunaway in Mommie Dearest -- all rage & over-the-top lunacy one minute & then phony sweetness & fakes smiles the next.  Eeek!

 

Now she looks like angry bees just finished with her.  Very very angry bees.

 

I'm not sure what is going on with Carole recently.  She clearly is doing something to her face that isn't flattering & it's looking even worse on camera.  Maybe turning 50 prompted her to do more aggressive stuff to her face.  Anyway, looks are really not all that important in the high society crowd.  What's respected is how one behaves & dresses.  Veevs loses out on both of those -- at least from observing her on the show.  Ugh, too many Century 21 blazers.  But I did kinda like Veevs' necklace.  Anyone else notice it?  Lu's jewelry has been looking really nuts.

Edited July 23, 2014 by ScoobieDoobs

[Midnight Cheese]

That's interesting, ryebread - I think the distinction is that we don't know whether Aviva has legitimate mental health issues or is merely a greedy, self-centered, pathetically manipulative gross asshole.  I'm not saying you wrote this at all, but it seems incredibly unrealistic to think Carole would've responded to the probably spurious ghostwriter accusations with, 'Well, Aviva has never processed her PTSD and integrated herself into truly independent adult life, so it's natural on some level that she wants to take me down because I simply had a conversation about finding *her* a ghost writer.'  It just seems like such a stretch to me.  In my own life when I've had the unfortunate and rare encounter with a woman has been grossly competitve with me I have never reacted like, 'Well, I guess she has a very tough time with herself and her own self-esteem.'  Instead, I'm thinking, 'Fuck you, you sad-sack ho.  I'm going to enjoy describing your antics, attempting to diagnose you with zero psychology degrees, and tearing up everything else about your messy ass to the people that love me.'  And then I won't deal with her at all unless absolutely required. 

Edited July 23, 2014 by Midnight Cheese

[shoegal]

I don't think either Carole or Heather's faces need 'fixing'.   On the other hand, I have no idea if Aviva needs mental help or she's just a famewhore.  I wouldn't put her in the same catagory as Kelly on Scary Island and have no problem with the other women confronting her about her behavior.

 

 

I agree, I don't see what needs "fixing".  It's like the difference between saying 'you're mean' and 'you're ugly'.  One is a behavior that you choose, the other is not. 

 

FTR, I don't think Aviva has mental health issues other than she is an attention seeking famewhore who wants to be known for #leggate as a vain attempt to keep her spot on the show. 

Edited July 23, 2014 by shoegal

[Miss February]

A person can't help how they look. Carole seems like a good person and a great, loyal friend. I'd prefer that over a beautiful woman who slams others looks.

 

I think Carole is pretty, but that isn't what's important to me about her (or anyone).  She seems kind and good-natured.  And, while I greatly enjoy commenting and reading comments about the housewives' behavior, I have never liked reading negative comments about anyone's looks.

[shoegal]

I think Carole is pretty, but that isn't what's important to me about her (or anyone).  She seems kind and good-natured.  And, while I greatly enjoy commenting and reading comments about the housewives' behavior, I have never liked reading negative comments about anyone's looks.

 

I find a difference between commenting on things like plastic surgery or say, weight gain (or loss) or even hairstyles/clothing choices because I feel like those things are choices and you have some control over them, but I don't enjoy comments about things that people are born with, like their nose or their overbite...to me, that's like skin color.  Maybe it's because I am a pale, freckly person and I was always teased for being so pale..., I am sure I could "fix it", but in the end, who the fuck cares?  I don't expect Heather to undergo unnecessary surgery to "fix" her nose so that I think she's prettier, or for Carole to have her jaw broken to "fix" her overbite, it's not like it's a freaking cleft palate or something. 

 

Of course, after all the snarking on natural looks, if anyone decides to "fix" it with surgery and it goes badly, it's just time for more snarking.  It's pretty much a lose-lose situation.

 

In fact, maybe I won't snark on bad plastic surgery anymore.  Only bad outfits. 

[Grneyedldy]

Actually, I thought Ramona said it was a guy who looked like Fabio.  I don't think she was talking about Fabio, although Andy said later on WWHL something about Ramona dating Fabio.

On WWHL Ramona said "he" (when the pic of Fabio and Ramona photoshopped was up) had brown hair when she knew him.

Now who knows what is what with Ramona, but if it hadn't been the same man, I hope she would have said same thing.

[shoegal]

On WWHL Ramona said "he" (when the pic of Fabio and Ramona photoshopped was up) had brown hair when she knew him.

Now who knows what is what with Ramona, but if it hadn't been the same man, I hope she would have said same thing.

 

I thought Ramona said at the lunch with Carole that the guy looked like Fabio except that he had dark brown hair.  I will have to check it out on rewatch.

Edited July 23, 2014 by shoegal

[Lola16]

Yea, that was amazing. Ramona really didn't seem to understand why it wasn't OK to say that this gal had a whole host of medical issues on TV.

 

The other interesting thing was when they were showing all the crap that Ramona has said about Lu. Lu asked Andy (and Ramona) if in the 6 years that they had been filming, Ramona had ever said anything nice about Lu. Ramona complimented her dress, but then said something like she had been nice all these years, because there was so much more that she could have revealed about Lu but didn't. Again, why in the world she had to go to a place where she made it sound like Lu was this terrible person was beyond me. All the time she is talking like this she is laughing and acting like she and Lu are friends. Lu said that is the problem with Ramona. She will say horrible things, then lean over and ask her if she wants to go get a drink later. 

LuAnn puts up with a lot of nastiness from Sonja and Ramona.  I wonder if she didn't need the paycheck, would she?

 

I don't expect the cast of the housewives to be flawlessly beautiful - that's not why they are on TV.  If they were models, beauty queens, etc, then perhaps looks would be fair game.  What I find free to criticize are outfits, make-up, etc --- things the women choose.

[Grneyedldy]

I thought Ramona said at the lunch with Carole that the guy looked like Fabio except that he had dark brown hair.  I will have to check it out on rewatch.

Ok let me know. I try to be under the influence while watching all housewife shows, so my memory could be wrong. :-)

[islandgal140]

Alls I can say (tm the Countess) is thank goodness Aviva's ailment wasn't uterine fibroids  or else she would have slapped pap smear results and transvaginal ultrasounds on the table and heaven knows what she would have pulled off or out and thrown on the floor. Be thankful for the little things.

 

I felt like the leg throwing (good Lord, what kind of world do we live in it when starting off a sentence like that makes total sense??) it was one of those situations when the trailers and the previews pretty much spoiled and showed it all because really there wasn't much more to it than what was already shown in the 30 sec commercial spots that have been airing since before the season even began. I just was left with the thought and feeling that this was a lackluster season at best. Combine this season ender with the Montana trip and I've come to the conclusion that the dismal ratings were definitely earned. I still won't quit this show but I have to see the hole in the emperor's clothes. I shudder to think how they plan to wring a 3 part reunion out of this season.

 

I started off liking and seeing potential in Kristen but her over the top reactions and facial expressions have come to bug me! Her getting the bird's eye seat next to Andy at the reunion is not making me happy. Her arm waving singing 'delusional' at Aviva made her look like one of those giant inflatable dancing tube men you see outside car dealerships.

 

Where they billing Carole's apartment as a renovation or redecorating? I didn't see any structural changes, no kitchen redo so it looked more cosmetic  tto me. Anyway, it looked good. I loved all the seating areas they created in the large living/great. That corner sofa with the butterfly coffee table was a great. I especially liked the entryway - it had kind of a sexy and masculine flair. The ceiling came out a lot better than I thought it would. When Carole was describing it, it kinda sounded like it would be tacky but it isn't. What terrificly high ceilings.

 

Color me shock that Andy seems to be the one that goes there about Ramona's marriage. If it were anyone other than Ramona I might feel like it was a bit of an intrusion since no part of her marital woes were featured on the show. However, she has dished out so much vitriol, some of which were unprovoked over the years that I think she deserves to swallow her dose of bad medicine. She has only gotten worse over the years. Her and Sonja's treatment of Luann this season has been downright mean and uncalled for. They took so many petty jabs at Luann for no reason. All that showed is that they were bitter and felt lacking. Frankly, I don't see how the Countess could sit and laugh at or with Ramona during WWHL. I would be seething from all the shit talking the did this season. 

[archer1267]

I don't think either Carole or Heather's faces need 'fixing'.

 

 

It's interesting to me that the two women most criticized for their looks seem to be the two most comfortable in their own skins.

 

I've seen a lot on various message boards about Heather's nose and Carole's teeth, along the lines of if Heather can afford a liver transplant and ear surgery for her son, why doesn't she spring for a nose job? I can't help but think of Barbra Streisand, who has a very distinctive nose and has refused to "fix" it. And I'm sure Melissa McCarthy could afford to do whatever is needed to slim down - sleep-away spas, plastic surgery, whatever - but chooses not to. Heather and Carole have each had plenty of time now to see themselves on TV, and if they didn't like what they saw, they'd change in the way HWs often do after their first season. (Heather's made cracks about her small breasts - I'm sure she would've sprung for implants by now if it was really important to her.) Maybe they both feel that their imperfections make them look distinctive.

Edited July 23, 2014 by archer1267

[ryebread]

That's interesting, ryebread - I think the distinction is that we don't know whether Aviva has legitimate mental health issues or is merely a greedy, self-centered, pathetically manipulative gross asshole.

I think if someone is a greedy, self centered, pathetically manipulative gross asshole - there probably are some mental health issues going on there.

 

I'm not saying you wrote this at all, but it seems incredibly unrealistic to think Carole would've responded to the probably spurious ghostwriter accusations with, 'Well, Aviva has never processed her PTSD and integrated herself into truly independent adult life, so it's natural on some level that she wants to take me down because I simply had a conversation about finding *her* a ghost writer.'

Agreed. 

 

In my own life when I've had the unfortunate and rare encounter with a woman has been grossly competitve with me I have never reacted like, 'Well, I guess she has a very tough time with herself and her own self-esteem.'  Instead, I'm thinking, 'Fuck you, you sad-sack ho.  I'm going to enjoy describing your antics, attempting to diagnose you with zero psychology degrees, and tearing up everything else about your messy ass to the people that love me.'

I've reacted both ways, depending on the person.  Although in the 'Fuck you, you sad sack ho' scenario, I might have added 'ugly' into the description before the sad sack ho part. ;-)  

 

For me, adding the 'ugly' in is just the cherry on an already unkind, although possibly well deserved, thing to say.

[lunastartron]

Because they're paid by the season, not by how many scenes they film. So when you're getting paid x amount of dollars, and your co-worker, who makes the same amount, doesn't show up for work but still gets paid, you resent it.

Well, she actually stood to make more than Heather and Carole per the numbers circulated during the pre-season boycott for higher salaries. But items after that stipulated she had only signed a six-week contract. If terms were renegotiated after that point and she was "fired"/removed from the credits for x amount of episodes, I find it unlikely she was raking in the same bounty.

 

And dressing up that discontent in medical speculation ad nauseum was still inane, in my opinion.

[parisprincess]

I don't think Luann puts up with Sonja and Ramona because she needs the paycheck.  She's been around them long enough to just shrug her shoulders at their crazy behavior and consider the source.  That's just the way they are and, when she interacts with them, she has learned not to let their antics get to her. 

 

Personally, I find Carole cute in an unconventional way.  Of course, her self confidence, sense of humor, quirky and outgoing personality add to her appeal to me.  If someone is a good friend and fun to be around, I don't notice any of their physical flaws, since we all have them.  The friendship forged between Heather and her is much more enjoyable to watch than anything Aviva brings to the table, and more entertaining than Ramona's rudeness and Sonja's delusions.  And, as for Carole's wardrobe, if she feels comfortable in the eclectic outfits she wears, more power to her.  I'd love to hang out with her and hear about all of the adventures she's had in her career.  

[ryebread]

I don't think either Carole or Heather's faces need 'fixing'.

I agree, I don't see what needs "fixing".  It's like the difference between saying 'you're mean' and 'you're ugly'.  One is a behavior that you choose, the other is not. 

Carole apparently thought she needed fixing because a valiant attempt was made.  Countdown to Heather's fixing in 3...2...1....  She says she won't, but she will.

 

My original point was: sometimes it's easier to fix a face than to fix a personality.  Someone's personality is often not a choice.  I love someone who is painfully shy.  He would do ANYTHING to 'fix' it, to better his life he says. He's tried his whole life but can't.  But if he wanted to have the unsightly mole removed from his shoulder, boom, it's done.  I know we're talking about Aviva and not a shy, sweet man so all bets are off.

 

But imo, dogging someone's looks and/or personality on this forum is equal in it's dog like behavior.  Kristen will be happy to know that I own it.  Woof.

[LotusFlower]

Well, she actually stood to make more than Heather and Carole per the numbers circulated during the pre-season boycott for higher salaries. But items after that stipulated she had only signed a six-week contract. If terms were renegotiated after that point and she was "fired"/removed from the credits for x amount of episodes,.

That doesn't make any sense. She filmed with everyone on day one, and she filmed with everyone on day last (TM Heather).

[shoegal]

My original point was: sometimes it's easier to fix a face than to fix a personality.

 

 

 

Apparently not, because as you point out, perhaps Carole has tried to "fix" her face, and yet, she's still "dogged" about it.  So, no, it does not seem easier to "fix a face" than it is to not be a crazy bitch. 

 

Unless, I guess, if you were born a crazy bitch.  If so, then I hope you have a perfect face!

[ryebread]

My original point was: sometimes it's easier to fix a face than to fix a personality.

Apparently not, because as you point out, perhaps Carole has tried to "fix" her face, and yet, she's still "dogged" about it.  So, no, it does not seem easier to "fix a face" than it is to not be a crazy bitch. 

That's why I said "sometimes". 

 

Born a crazy bitch but with a perfect face?  The closest I got is Brandi.  Possibly Tamara.  I think their face structures are beautiful.  Before they got to all the 'fixing'.  

[heebiejeebie]

 

It's interesting to me that the two women most criticized for their looks seem to be the two most comfortable in their own skins.

 

Heather i would agree with just by what we know.  But she is also in the business of selling women fixes for their bodies.  So mixed messages there in my opinion.

 

Carole on the other hand hasn't had so many short term different looks like say Patti Stanger or the RHOOC's Tamra Barney but she clearly is choosing to do something and has done more than one something since previous season ended.  Now maybe that is actually a sign of being comfortable in your own skin to the point of having it professionally sloughed off for you.  Maybe the ultimate self confidence is caring so little about your looks you waltz into the Cosmetic Surgery school as tell a first year student "do whatever you like".  Okay that is an exaggeration since I don't want fellow posters thinking how horrible I am for suggesting she is grotesque.  I want you to find me a horrible person for far more important matters. 

 

But I find it sad since i think she looks worse than she did naturally.  Which as pointed out was how she was born (I presume -- maybe this is but a recent step in a long long journey of letting someone play with her face)  I do though find Carole puts on an over the stereotype persona for the show that might be rooted in her own but is strongly based on the exaggerated tropes pop media has melded.  From her silly contrived sexy single woman overdone bit last season to now her reminding us over and over again she is an author this season, truths can still be wrapped in determined imagery.  And she takes it as far as she can in some ways and wraps herself in a slicker smoother yet swollen face that does not fit her.  Or any other woman.  Or man.  Maybe a Cabbage Patch Kid Doll.  Nothing else I can think of off the top of my head.   She hasn't reached "frightened cat" stage yet (Almost Royal).  But it is still rather obvious she went to someone and paid to have that done to herself.  More than once.  If that is being comfortable in her own skin, I'll take my own insecurities any day. 

[zoeysmom]

Well, she actually stood to make more than Heather and Carole per the numbers circulated during the pre-season boycott for higher salaries. But items after that stipulated she had only signed a six-week contract. If terms were renegotiated after that point and she was "fired"/removed from the credits for x amount of episodes, I find it unlikely she was raking in the same bounty.

 

And dressing up that discontent in medical speculation ad nauseum was still inane, in my opinion.

I do believe Aviva was docked for not attending the trips and probably for more damaging to her ego was being the removed from the credits.  What it felt like is these women who embarked on this 20 episode journey didn't have anything left to crab about and needed to bring up Aviva.  When Aviva beat them to the punch with a medical excuse they continued to crab and speculate.  Would they have rather Aviva said, "I am not going to Montana because I have pretty much been alienated and don't want to have any more sit downs discussing my personality flaws."

 

The ones who came off looking like hypocrites were Heather, Carole and Kristen who delighted in Aviva being relegated to an outsider and then still felt the need to confront her about her absences.  It came off sounding, " we don't like Aviva and we would like to repeatedly tell her what an awful person she is."

 

Aviva did herself no favors with her semi-scripted behavior, be that her line producer's suggestion or her own and having her father back was just a bad idea.  Of course Carole and Kristen attending George's engagement  party just fed the Aviva strategic behavior.   

[aradia22]

Can we just admit that no one in this ridiculous cast is a "girl's girl"? Seriously, they're so annoying with that. And another thing... stop embodying the worst stereotypes about women and then going on about empowering women and all of your charity work. You're all terrible.

 

Maybe, it's the leg she helped "I dunno remember her name" to choose ! As in "What ?!? No, I was not available, I was helping "I dunno remember her name" to choose her prothesis, and here it is !!!!

I'm pretty sure her name was Heather. I remember because I thought "how are we already running out of names?"

 

Well, the really huge problem for the producers is Veevs has almost no fans.  She's just soooo unlikable.

I'm probably the closest thing she has to a fan in that I don't like the other women either and I think she helps expose the hateful things about them. But yeah, she doesn't do anything that's really entertaining to watch. I'd much rather see a replacement that the other women can't discount and diminish by calling her crazy (you're all real girl's girls) who can take down Carol as the big phony she is (not a comment on the ghostwriter thing).

 

Also, am I the only one who finds it creepy that they kept harping on Aviva's weight? She was already very thin and losing 10 pounds at her size does not seem healthy. I mean, what the hell? Did they think she was just going on a diet? I don't know. I got a weird vibe from it.

 

 

This is exactly how Heather, Carole, Kristen & even the Moaner are reacting to Veevs now.  Can Veevs change this?  No, she can't.

To be fair, they always have these power plays. Ramona threw a glass at her face and Kristen is still filming with her. These people are weird. It's hard to know where the line is that you can't come back from.

 

I also actively want whiny Kristen and her douchebag hubby gone. I have gone from actually thinking she might, possibly, be a good addition to the show, in  spite of her poor taste in BFF's to thinking I cannot stand one more crying Kristen scene.

I realized watching the finale just how little we got from Kristen and Josh. Think about it. All the way back with Heather and Jonathan's anniversary party Kristen was talking about therapy. And it just happened now. One session. And now they seem to be done with it because she's on a billboard. That's not a freaking arc! All we got was them periodically fighting and calling each other. Cop out.

[Mozelle]

All of this is being spoken with such authority that I'm curious: What is that Carole supposedly had done to her face?

[LotusFlower]

So the ratings went up: 1.5 million viewers, .6 in the 18-49 demographic. Still low compared to the other HW franchises, but up considerably from the last few weeks. Who knows what that means.

[MatildaMoody]

 

I don't think Luann puts up with Sonja and Ramona because she needs the paycheck.  She's been around them long enough to just shrug her shoulders at their crazy behavior and consider the source.  That's just the way they are and, when she interacts with them, she has learned not to let their antics get to her.

 

I agree. Watching Lu and Ramona on WWHL has reminded me how much I love their frenemy status. They both constantly poke at each other. They both say nasty things or imply nasty things about each other. But, when they are together they do try to have a good time together. Granted, they usually try to have a good time with each other when their status on the show isn't a factor - like on WWHL, or during upfronts. But, that dynamic is so "New York" to me. It's not a matter of them just not being able to stand each other. It's more that they get that they don't like each other and actually enjoy pushing each other's buttons. And, they can laugh about it when questioned.

 

 

I just was left with the thought and feeling that this was a lackluster season at best. Combine this season ender with the Montana trip and I've come to the conclusion that the dismal ratings were definitely earned. I still won't quit this show but I have to see the hole in the emperor's clothes. I shudder to think how they plan to wring a 3 part reunion out of this season.

I actually loved this season. I thought it was much closer to the first seasons in that there were no real "teams," even though Aviva tried to create one with Sonja and Ramona. If they can get away from so many staged events - keep the trips, but have them actually do really good trips (St. Bart's Morocco, London), I think this dynamic really works. If we can get more of a focus on the women's individual lives and fewer contrived ways to bring the women together, this show really would be getting back to it's roots.

 

If they lose "he who must not be named," I would even be fine if they kept Aviva. They would just need to let Ramona, Aviva and Sonja know that the show is not about teams so that they wouldn't be so quick to make it about alliances and more about friendships, I think they really could get back to the show's roots. Show us more about the women's individual family lives and careers and fewer producer instigated get togethers. Show us the women interacting at ACTUAL events, like Fashion Week, and focus less on secondary characters like "he who must not be named" and random "image consultants" and fake boyfriends. That's all the show really needs, and I saw the seeds of that this season. Maybe Aviva should go if she can't get that message, but I liked the overall cast dynamic. 

 

In my opinion the biggest problem with the show's ratings over the past two seasons is a combination of things. There was the major recast, which I think would have been an issue no matter who they added to the cast. There was Housewives fatigue, because there were so many franchises trying to utilize the same formula. But, for this franchise, I think the biggest thing was that they waited so long after the wrap of filming to bring it back and when they did they changed up what night and time it aired.

 

I absolutely HATE what Jill did to this and all of the franchises with her teams and "icing out" of cast mates. And, I love seeing this franchise get away from that. I think if the producers of the show actually look at what made the series so great, they actually have the cast in place to make that happen again. This, of course, assumes that the women have people in their personal and business lives that would be willing to go out on that limb and be filmed for television the way they did in the first 3 seasons.

[LotusFlower]

I want to know what Sonja whispered to Aviva in the heat of the moment at the table. It seemed like she was escalating what she had done or was about to do, rather than de-escalating it. Anyone?

She said: "keep it together." It was hilarious because Aviva had practiced her lines for ages, started the scene, and then Sonja interrupted her, throwing her off. And since she's a terrible actress, she recalibrated, and delivered take two in a more hushed tone.

[Gracie]

I generally agree with this, except Aviva seems to act like she is some ambassador for amputees everywhere. At least that's the impression that I get.

Since I'm the token representative of the amputee contingency here, I'll step out there and say that I don't want her representing me! ha!

 

.

I hate group politics. While Aviva is no friend of mine, she doesn't have to go around worrying "representing" some group just because she is an amputee. She is an individual. Her behavior reflects on her, and her alone.

Unfortunately, she seems to have gladly stepped into those shoes on her own. Its as if she decided that she would be the perfect spokesperson for amputees. Sweetie, you're a drama queen at a 3rd rate reality show. You're not even on the best of the housewife franchise.

 

To give a little perspective on artificial legs, there are a few ways to keep them on.  Her's looks to be below the knee? while mine is mid-thigh.  When I put my leg on (now there's a sentence you don't hear every day), I put on a liner that has what looks like a 2" pin at the bottom of my stump.  Then, I slide the leg on, the pin goes inside a hole inside the prosthetic that locks it in place.  To take it off, all I have to do is push a button and I slide it off.  Easy peasy.  It's not a struggle.

 

I'm so over Aviva.  Oh!  One last thing.  When I had a bout of bronchitis, I was given the same huge inhaler to use.  I don't have asthma.  Just sayin'

Edited because I realized I had much more to say....

Edited July 24, 2014 by Gracie

[Rhetorica]

Oh, and plus one for Carole for, in the midst of all that ridiculousness, picking up Aviva's prosthetic leg and giving it back to her.

I'm glad the Richards sisters weren't there. They may have hid it.

[Bronzedog]

A viva was lucky she didn't put someone's eye out when she threw the leg. That was the best scene ever! If Sonja gave the other dog away, I will hate her forever. But, that's not much of a stretch. I might just hate her forever no matter what.

[aradia22]

 

I Totally envied Carole's apartment makeover. I would happily move in there right now-minus Carole.

That reminds me... I would need side by side comparisons to tell for sure but I don't think there were major changes in Carole's apartment. The color palette stayed very similar. White, black/dark woods, and a bit of warmth from those horrid animal print furnishings. I couldn't tell for sure as they showed it quickly but I think either the animal print pillows and couches and the dark wood shelves stayed the same or she chose new ones that looked almost identical.

 

Heather confirmed everything we thought about Aviva. It's all planned acted out. I agree with Heather that Aviva has been waiting for a moment to pull that stupid stunt. As for Aviva's illness, that is very real. It's called silent reflux. I know 2 people recently diagnosed with it. It can go undiagnosed and not properly treated for years and cause a lot of damage. So yeah, I do really think she's been sick, but she's still fucked up.

 

As Heather said on WWHL, notice how Aviva's outburst towards her had nothing to do with what she had just said. Heather never said the words "fake" or "artificial," but Aviva had the speech in her back pocket and was looking for a moment to use it. It was so calculated.

 

Yup. I agree that Aviva is very histrionic but I also think that she has health issues and I find it so disturbing that the other castmembers just brush it off. Especially with Carole's Munchausen thing. Shut up. You are not a doctor. To be fair to Aviva, they have been calling her a liar and saying that her asthma and her other illnesses are fake so it's not unreasonable for her to make the connection to her leg being the only fake thing about her. I don't know. Maybe I'm just annoyed at them acting like Sonja and Aviva are so incomprehensible. Yeah, Sonja wrote a bad speech but it wasn't impossible to follow. Yes, Aviva says some heinous things but it doesn't invalidate everything else she says. For me it's like a combination of bad Gaslighting and a bully who doesn't get a joke. Pretending you don't understand something doesn't make you better than that thing, it just makes you look stupid. YMMV.

 

The best part of the night was that it seemed clear to me that Heather, Carole and Luann all saw right through the dramatic "reveal" as overly contrived and pre-planned and it was their horror that Aviva would go to such effort for that.  Not stunned shock at Aviva's bold "impromptu" moment of honesty.

I guess I'm not ready to be outraged when everything on these shows is pre-planned. Especially Carole's stupid segments that often having nothing to do with anyone else.

 

I'm so sick of the other housewives' reactions to Aviva. They've all talked about how she's crazy, nuts, insane, and "needs help." I don't know any decent people who make fun of and scream at people who have mental health issues! The more negative things they say about her the more I wonder why they are so cruel to her.

Regardless of how they feel about Aviva, it's ableist.

 

Heather has a line of leggings called Bossy Pants??

It would never happen. I don't even know how it could happen. But in my head I imagine a world where Tina Fey sues her. It makes me happy.

 

I still hate Heather, though.  Loved her yelling at Carole to shut up.  (There's more from where that came from, Radzi.  You can bank on that.)

Ha! I forgot all about that. It was great. That's the kind of thing they should be having fights over.

[ryebread]

Heather i would agree with just by what we know.  But she is also in the business of selling women fixes for their bodies.  So mixed messages there in my opinion.

Indeed.

Okay that is an exaggeration since I don't want fellow posters thinking how horrible I am for suggesting she is grotesque.  I want you to find me a horrible person for far more important matters.

Owning your horribleness, I see.  Awesome.

And she takes it as far as she can in some ways and wraps herself in a slicker smoother yet swollen face that does not fit her.  Or any other woman.  Or man.  Maybe a Cabbage Patch Kid Doll.  Nothing else I can think of off the top of my head.   She hasn't reached "frightened cat" stage yet (Almost Royal).  But it is still rather obvious she went to someone and paid to have that done to herself.  More than once.  If that is being comfortable in her own skin, I'll take my own insecurities any day.

I laughed my leg off at the first part and shook my head in agreement at the last.

[Sun-Bun]

Where they billing Carole's apartment as a renovation or redecorating? I didn't see any structural changes, no kitchen redo so it looked more cosmetic tto me. Anyway, it looked good. I loved all the seating areas they created in the large living/great. That corner sofa with the butterfly coffee table was a great. I especially liked the entryway - it had kind of a sexy and masculine flair. The ceiling came out a lot better than I thought it would. When Carole was describing it, it kinda sounded like it would be tacky but it isn't. What terrificly high ceilings.

I absolutely adore Carole's apartment, so I was practically drooling during that entire segment---total highlight of the show for me, even over the ridiculous leg-tossing moment. Then again, I'm an interior design geek/HGTV-hyperviewer, so I live for gawking at posh home porn.

Actually, what a lovely scene between her and Heather and Kristen overall---it's nice to see how much Carole also appreciates her "sanctuary" and how much fun she always seems to have just entertaining friends there.

That said, WOW, what a gorgeous loft-style home she's whipped up for herself! I just love how it's the perfect mixture of masculine elegance with quirky doses of whimsy within an upscale palace of understated feminine allure.

I live in a similarly-structured loft myself, so I was taking mental notes for a potential revamp of my own around here.

I do believe it was a partial renovation, since she turned that former upstairs office into a huge walk-in closet with shelves/hanging space and had her older counters knocked out to add a desk/drawers/shelves and things for her new office area in the kitchen. She also added window jams and new AC unit along with all the different paint/wall treatments.

(she detailed all this progress on her Instagram)

There's an article about her pad featured on this site, but she's obviously added some key elements in there even since this was posted:

http://thedesigndaredevil.com/2014/04/carole-radziwills-nyc-apartment/

[motorcitymom65]

Carole's blog is up and it is awesome.

Carole mentions that she would like to reveal how she knows that Aviva's medical issues do not prevent her from traveling when she wants too, but that there is a gag order. I wonder if she is serious?

She also says that earlier in the evening Aviva asked Harry if he would carry her out of the event if necessary. Apparently he said "no". He is clearly well aware she is nuts. The most disturbing thing in all of this to me is that I think that this what Aviva really wanted - for folks to get a glimpse of poor Aviva minus her leg, left to crawl, or be carried away from those terrible people who brought her to such a level.

http://www.bravotv.com/the-real-housewives-of-new-york-city/season-6/blogs/carole-radziwill/carole-waiter-were-done?cid=related_blog

[lunastartron]

I've realized I feel similar sentiments about Aviva to those others have expressed about Heather Dubrow on the OC: she's flawed and frequently unlikeable in her conduct, but she's perhaps the only cast member on her respective franchise with whom it might be possible to have a relatively normal, culturally informed conversation. Maybe I'm less inclined to find her particularly offensive and predatory because she lacks the social adroitness to be truly manipulative or harmful, and because her cast mates are way more uncouth and viperous/malicious in their own right than the Orange County women. Say what you will about Alexis Bellino spitting out pate at the dinner table in front of the chef who made it; I believe she would never be in danger of leading a bartender she just met out into the bushes on camera in order to fuck so that all of her children's friends could watch her escapades. I also never really thought Aviva's freakout in St. Barth's was especially gasp-worthy. She sure sounded comical with her ranting about banners, but, well, Sonja and Ramona *are* trash per their behavior and they did create a ridiculous and unnecessary controversy about Reid's presence. Ultimately, though, she's kind of one-note from what we've seen. One could ascribe the same criticism to most of the other women, however. They all seem to have their respective schticks more so than the ladies on other franchises. I just wish someone had equipped Veevs with her own plastic champagne flute at the reunion in preparation for Kristen's "delusional" grandstanding if production is going to be okay with assault anyway.

[motorcitymom65]

I've realized I feel similar sentiments about Aviva to those others have expressed about Heather Dubrow on the OC: she's flawed and frequently unlikeable in her conduct, but she's perhaps the only cast member on her respective franchise with whom it might be possible to have a relatively normal, culturally informed conversation. Maybe I'm less inclined to find her particularly offensive and predatory because she lacks the social adroitness to be truly manipulative or harmful, and because her cast mates are way more uncouth and viperous/malicious in their own right than the Orange County women. Say what you will about Alexis Bellino spitting out pate at the dinner table in front of the chef who made it; I believe she would never be in danger of leading a bartender she just met out into the bushes on camera in order to fuck so that all of her children's friends could watch her escapades. I also never really thought Aviva's freakout in St. Barth's was especially gasp-worthy. She sure sounded comical with her ranting about banners, but, well, Sonja and Ramona *are* trash per their behavior and they did create a ridiculous and unnecessary controversy about Reid's presence. Ultimately, though, she's kind of one-note from what we've seen. One could ascribe the same criticism to most of the other women, however. They all seem to have their respective schticks more so than the ladies on other franchises. I just wish someone had equipped Veevs with her own plastic champagne flute at the reunion in preparation for Kristen's "delusional" grandstanding if production is going to be okay with assault anyway.

Do you think that Aviva would be the only one on the NY show that one could have a relatively normal, culturally informed conversation with? I certainly agree that Heather Dubrow on the OC show is, but not Aviva. I guess I come to that conclusion because I am unconvinced she can actually engage in normal conversation, as I have never seen her do so. I would think that this task would be easier to pull of with Heather, Carole or Lu.

[breezy424]

Carole's blog is up and it is awesome.

Carole mentions that she would like to reveal how she knows that Aviva's medical issues do not prevent her from traveling when she wants too, but that there is a gag order. I wonder if she is serious?

She also says that earlier in the evening Aviva asked Harry if he would carry her out of the event if necessary. Apparently he said "no". He is clearly well aware she is nuts. The most disturbing thing in all of this to me is that I think that this what Aviva really wanted - for folks to get a glimpse of poor Aviva minus her leg, left to crawl, or be carried away from those terrible people who brought her to such a level.

http://www.bravotv.com/the-real-housewives-of-new-york-city/season-6/blogs/carole-radziwill/carole-waiter-were-done?cid=related_blog

 

Loved her blog.  The conversation Carole reveals about asking Harry to carry her out is priceless. 

 

She also brought up something I was questioning myself.  Asthma is not diagnosed with an xray.

[For Cereals]

I'm not snarking on looks per se BUT Carole's neck looked scary at that purse boutique and natural or not, she's too thin IMO. I liked the apt redo, but with her looking so frail (hell, even if she weren't thin), it looks like bones would break if you took a fall on those scary stairs.

[ginger90]

If a doctor suspects something other than asthma, they would order a chest x-ray.

Aviva asking Harry if he would carry her out if she needed him to, was an interesting bit of information. As was the fact that Sonja's chasing after Harry did not happen the way it was told by Sonja.

[LotusFlower]

Carole's blog is up and it is awesome.

I agree. She really is a great writer. I enjoy her style. She really has Aviva's number, which doesn't surprise me, but also goes pretty hard on Sonja and her "team" and her lies and delusions. It's a fun read. I wonder if she'll blog the reunion.

[ScoobieDoobs]

Also, am I the only one who finds it creepy that they kept harping on Aviva's weight? She was already very thin and losing 10 pounds at her size does not seem healthy. I mean, what the hell? Did they think she was just going on a diet? I don't know. I got a weird vibe from it.

 

No, I didn't think it was creepy, but I did think it was intrusive, rude & bordering on cruel to point out someone's weight loss.  None of them meant it as a compliment.  She was quite thin to begin with, so a loss of 10 pounds for her had to mean some type of health problems were going on -- and they all had to know that.  

 

Why didn't any of them offer even the slightest concern -- just outta basic human kindness?  Sure, Aviva is horrible, but NONE of the others are so great either.  I'm gettin' the feeling they all actually liked having Veevs on the show so they could feel superior -- like they're all such better people than she is?  Eh, not really.

 

In fact, maybe I won't snark on bad plastic surgery anymore.  Only bad outfits

.

And what about hair?  No snarking on bad hair?  Sorry, I have to do that.  But everyone's hair on here mostly looks pretty good.  OK, maybe Veevs has the same hair she had in 1986 & Moaner's blowouts kinda look just OK at best, but everyone else looks good.  

 

I only caught a glimpse of Carole at the reunion & I didn't get the blonde hair at all.  Ugh, not good.  It kinda looked like she was channeling Carolyn Bessette, her bestie, the wife of JFK, Jr.  Except she's been dead for 15 years & certainly Carolyn, who was a very, very stylish gal, would not have that hair now, if she were alive.  Anyhoo, the blonde does NOT suit Carole at all.  Not everyone is meant to be a blonde.  I think she needs to try a shorter style.  She doesn't have to go really short, but her hair is too long now.  It's just not flattering..

To be fair, they always have these power plays. Ramona threw a glass at her face and Kristen is still filming with her. These people are weird. It's hard to know where the line is that you can't come back from.

 

Well, I think Aviva has reached that point she can't possibly redeem herself to any of them.  Sonja seems to be the only one willing to film scenes with her.  And their scenes together mostly make no sense or seem fake or forced.  Moaner has already expressed she doesn't think much of Aviva.  So Veevs' campaign in the beginning of the season to win Moaner's favor really led to nothing.  

 

And all of the rest of them have absolutely no patience for her nonsense & clearly don't want to interact with her.  Apologies won't change that cuz she won't be believed anymore.  And she doesn't seem to think she needs to apologize to anyone anyway -- so she wouldn't do that.  So she has boxed herself into a corner.  She has no future on the show.  The fact that she has badly pissed off the producers by making demands as to when she'd appear would seem to guarantee she's finished.

Edited July 24, 2014 by ScoobieDoobs

[breezy424]

No, I didn't think it was creepy, but I did think it was intrusive, rude & bordering on cruel to point out someone's weight loss.  None of them meant it as a compliment.  She was quite thin to begin with, so a loss of 10 pounds for her had to mean some type of health problems were going on -- and they all had to know that.  

 

Why didn't any of them offer even the slightest concern -- just outta basic human kindness?  Sure, Aviva is horrible, but NONE of the others are so great either.  I'm gettin' the feeling they all actually liked having Veevs on the show so they could feel superior -- like they're all such better people than she is?  Eh, not really.

 

.

And what about hair?  No snarking on bad hair?  Sorry, I have to do that.  But everyone's hair on here mostly looks pretty good.  OK, maybe Veevs has the same hair she had in 1986 & Moaner's blowouts kinda look just OK at best, but everyone else looks good.  

 

I only caught a glimpse of Carole at the reunion & I didn't get the blonde hair at all.  Ugh, not good.  It kinda looked like she was channeling Carolyn Bessette, her bestie, the wife of JFK, Jr.  Except she's been dead for 15 years & certainly Carolyn, who was a very, very stylish gal, would not have that hair now, if she were alive.  Anyhoo, the blonde does NOT suit Carole at all.  Not everyone is meant to be a blonde.  I think she needs to try a shorter style.  She doesn't have to go really short, but her hair is too long now.  It's just not flattering..

 

Well, I think Aviva has reached that point she can't possibly redeem herself to any of them.  Sonja seems to be the only one willing to film scenes with her.  And their scenes together mostly make no sense or seem fake or forced.  Moaner has already expressed she doesn't think much of Aviva.  So Veevs' campaign in the beginning of the season to win Moaner's favor really led to nothing.  

 

And all of the rest of them have absolutely no patience for her nonsense & clearly don't want to interact with her.  Apologies won't change that cuz she won't be believed anymore.  And she doesn't seem to think she needs to apologize to anyone anyway -- so wouldn't do that.  So she has boxed herself into a corner.  She has no future on the show.  The fact that she has badly pissed off the producers by making demands on when she'd appear would seem to guarantee she's finished.

 

Just because Carole goes blond, she's channeling Carolyn Bessette?  So, she can never be a blond?

[RedheadZombie]

God forbid SonJa uses a regular old towel to hold her ice pack. Nope, it has to be the French dish towel. She really is high maintenance and ridiculous.

 

You know, I think I'm just really through with Sonja.  It's not because of the fake promise ring and relationship with Harry.  It culminated in that bedroom scene.  Sonja laying there and demanding she be attended to, followed by a "Not you, Pickles!" as she practically slaps the girl away from her.  And her inability to "esthetically handle" the plain dish towel - a dish towel, by the way, that's wrapped around an ice bag on her fucking foot, not one being used in any sanitary way.  I just cannot handle how she treats that girl.  It makes me think of things I don't want to.  It makes me remember that a black woman in her courtyard must be interpreted to be a drug dealer.  It makes me wonder why the only black intern (that I've seen) has a name Sonja is incapable of remembering, and thus is given the name of a food.  She has surpassed my limit of sympathy. 

 

She is a stupid, vapid, selfish woman.  She is moments away from affecting a southern accent and saying, "I've always depended on the kindness of strangers".  Or perhaps this - "I'm ready for my closeup Mr. Demille".  She'll take to calling herself Big Sonja, while turning her daughter into an insecure balding mess - psychologically holding her hostage so she won't be alone.  Maybe they can make a documentary of them in their crumbling urine-scented home. Sonja can hold court in bed (she's already doing that) while reminiscing of the good old days.  The problem is, Sonja doesn't have a niece named Jacqueline Kennedy - maybe Carole can use her connections.

 

Just saw a preview of the reunion on Bravo's site.  Carole's hair looks like fried ass. Kristen and Ramona are sitting next to Andy.  Aviva and Lulu are at the ends.  What does this mean in Sofa Speak?

 

 

That's usually extremely significant.  I guess it's possible that Andy is just relishing the potential fight.  If I remember correctly, didn't Aviva sit next to Andy at the last reunion?

 

Wow, we musta seen a different ep cuz I was bored silly.  Wonder what everyone else will think & how the ratings will go.  

I think Moaner's theory that Veevs just didn't wanna be away from her husband is most likely.  But they all comment on Veevs losing weight.  She's very thin to begin with, so she musta looked really frail.  That may have had to do with her being sick or maybe she has some kind of severe eating disorder -- which I've always suspected bout her.  

 

Aviva seems to have a lot of food hang ups.  That may be a sign of disordered eating, or just a part of her neuroses.  Women who are highly neurotic with anxiety issues tend to be thin.

 

When Sawn-ya was scooting down the steps because her right ankle was so badly sprained, she stood and put her full weight on the right ankle when Pickles handed her the crutches. I don't think you would wear tight, black hooker boots if your ankle is sprained and swollen either. I think the sprained ankle was an act.

 

I caught that too.  She forgot which foot was supposedly the injured one.

 

I believe it could be easy, and she's capable of doing it quickly, but I have a hard time believing she could do it in a moment.  She had to be prepared to do it.  And I do think Lu is knowledgeable from her nursing education alone

 

I'm a nurse, but I have absolutely no experience with a prosthetic as high quality and expensive as Aviva's.

[ScoobieDoobs]

From Carole's Bravo blog-

 

I did have to laugh when Sonja outed Aviva's boob job.

 

Wait a minute -- so Sonja really was serious that in looking at the stupid x-ray she could see Veev's boob job?  Really?  Oh. My. God.  I am loving Carole again.

Just because Carole goes blond, she's channeling Carolyn Bessette?  So, she can never be a blond?

Er, she went blonde so I guess she can.  Just sayin' it's not flattering.  It does look very Carolyn Bessette 1998.

[lunastartron]

Do you think that Aviva would be the only one on the NY show that one could have a relatively normal, culturally informed conversation with? I certainly agree that Heather Dubrow on the OC show is, but not Aviva. I guess I come to that conclusion because I am unconvinced she can actually engage in normal conversation, as I have never seen her do so. I would think that this task would be easier to pull of with Heather, Carole or Lu.

In the context of, say, attending a museum benefit and having some fluency in the art housed therein or discussing current events/politics, perhaps, my personal sense is that Aviva would be much more equipped to do that than Heather, Carole, or Lu. Or even talking about a popular but literary-ish book like The Goldfinch or Gone Girl. I think Aviva can function normally in superficial social situations, as her "charming" persona at the amends dinner with Ramona illustrated. My interpretation is that the HCL triumvirate is intelligent enough to manage the same, but I don't really get the impression that any are especially interested in culture in a way that requires erudition. Heather seems invested in pop (the ghostwritten music biographies she mentioned) and her business. Lu has her society doyenne affectations and is certainly witty when she wants to land a dig (the Herman Munster shoes and "go back into whatever cabinet you came out of") but strikes me as more of a master of airy banter. To Carole I'll extend the benefit of the doubt- she was an accomplished news producer, after all. Her faux pensive field trip to the Occupy protests in season 5 were eye-roll-inducing for me, however, and I just cannot take the giggly personality quirks that somehow wed "teenybopper" with "too cool for school hipster." But her book did include a number of tongue-in-cheek references, so I'm sure she could probably have a serious back-and-forth about books. It's just a dimension of her character that I don't think we've seen so far, which is unfortunate because it would be a nice balance to the facets we've had the chance to observe. Actually, stray bits of commentary- like Adrianna de Moura mentioning a Basiquiat or kinetic art, or Camille invoking The Prince- beyond that intended to serve the narrative would be a nice element for the franchise at large.

[Pollock]

No, I didn't think it was creepy, but I did think it was intrusive, rude & bordering on cruel to point out someone's weight loss.  None of them meant it as a compliment.  She was quite thin to begin with, so a loss of 10 pounds for her had to mean some type of health problems were going on -- and they all had to know that.  

I respectfully but wholeheartedly disagree with your assessment of the situation. I think, as I think they thought, Aviva lost 10 pounds to fake futhermore her asthma problems or any kind of disease she had that particular week. That's why they adressed it in such manner.

When somebody lies every second about something, it's really hard to take anything seriously. It's the boy who cried wolf syndrome. Even if her weight loss was the result of something serious, it would be lost on everybody.

 

When the best case scenario about you become "she's hypochondriac" (the real mental illness, not the manner of speaking) and the worst case "famewhore who lies through her teeth", and everybody finally chose the later only a year after meeting you, the problem isn't how your castmates approach your issues...

[aradia22]

 

When the best case scenario about you become "she's hypochondriac" (the real mental illness, not the manner of speaking) and the worst case "famewhore who lies through her teeth", and everybody finally chose the later only a year after meeting you, the problem isn't how your castmates approach your issues...

Yeah but don't they call Ramona an alcoholic every other episode? I feel like these women don't take things seriously. Then they take everything too seriously. Then they forget about it. And then they want me to take everything seriously. Sorry, it doesn't work that way. Maybe that's my problem with this show. 

[ScoobieDoobs]

To give a little perspective on artificial legs, there are a few ways to keep them on.  Her's looks to be below the knee? while mine is mid-thigh.  When I put my leg on (now there's a sentence you don't hear every day), I put on a liner that has what looks like a 2" pin at the bottom of my stump.  Then, I slide the leg on, the pin goes inside a hole inside the prosthetic that locks it in place.  To take it off, all I have to do is push a button and I slide it off.  Easy peasy.  It's not a struggle.

 

Thanks for sharing your experience.  I would hope a prosthetic leg is made so it is easy to take off.  But can it be taken off in a second or 2 & without looking down at it?  Cuz that's what it looked like Aviva did.  Alex McCord's theory on what really went down is making more sense to me. She said everyone saw Aviva coming into the restaurant with a ginormous bag & she was sitting at the table, refusing to get up once she sat down & had the table cloth covering her bottom half.  

 

Suspicious behavior?  Well, yeah -- if what she really did was bring an extra leg in the bag she was carrying & just had that extra leg ready to throw, rather than taking the time to remove the one she had attached.  Could this have been the way it happened?  Sheesh, I feel like I'm trying to figure out a JFK conspiracy theory.  Eh, it's only Veevs & her silly nonsense.

Edited July 24, 2014 by ScoobieDoobs

[Pollock]

Yeah but don't they call Ramona an alcoholic every other episode? I feel like these women don't take things seriously. Then they take everything too seriously. Then they forget about it. And then they want me to take everything seriously. Sorry, it doesn't work that way. Maybe that's my problem with this show.

 

The last one who did bring Ramona presumed alcoholism if I remember correctly was Aviva. Heather and Carole are just mocking her Ramona Pinot Grigio schtick. (Note that Heather is one to talk with her constant yummie tummie pimping during her first season but she tone it down this season).

For the past two seasons, the ones taking everything seriously, illnesses, alcoholism, non invitation... are Sonja, Aviva and Ramona.

 

 

Yet again, it draws me to the same conclusion as other posters stated here : those three are not in the same show that the other three ladies imho. Kristen, being her non-entity self, oscillating between the two worlds. She wants to be "cool" but she wants to stay in the show so "drama".

 

I'm no doctor but the diagnosis seems simple enough : this show suffers from a severe case of schizophrenia right now !

It needs its balance back between social calendar and drama. I wouldn't ever think I'd say that but I miss "this isn't the time and place to adress that" when they were in a social event and someone began to act over the top. Now, it's always time and place because they are literally interacting with no one else around. Is that a coincidence that the leg toss occured during a party for "the help" (no offense, I'm one of "the help" irl) ? I think not. None of those women, even delusional Sonja, would allow Aviva to do that in front of people that really matter. There is a limit to what they want to be guilty by association of.  

 

Treatment : Sonja and Ramona need to tone the crazy down in order for Ramona (where are her real friends we saw during season 1 ?), LuAnn, Heather and Carole to inject back their socialite life into the show. Give us the goods Ladies !

For example : it would have been cool to see Carole real birthday party but after the debacle of the book party last season, when she mixed her real friends with those crazy ladies, I don't blame her for getting paid extras and a fake one !

[aradia22]

 

 

The last one who did bring Ramona presumed alcoholism if I remember correctly was Aviva. Heather and Carole are just mocking her Ramona Pinot Grigio schtick. (Note that Heather is one to talk with her constant yummie tummie pimping during her first season but she tone it down this season).

For the past two seasons, the ones taking everything seriously, illnesses, alcoholism, non invitation... are Sonja, Aviva and Ramona.

Granted, it's been a ridiculously long season and I don't know how I've lasted this long (this may be the first and last time I watch a whole housewives season) but don't you remember the whole... oh, I think Ramona might have a problem with talking about both her drinking and abuse/anger issues with the whole Kristen thing starting with the splashing of water and then the glass being thrown and the (basically) intervention they had at the restaurant where they wouldn't let her out of the booth? That's a terrible run-on sentence but I'm too tired to rewrite it.

[Pollock]

Lord ! Indeed, I totally forgot about that. It involved Kristen so I blanked it. My bad !

That being said, I remember Kristen assuming Ramona has a drinking problem, but sincerelly I don't recall the other women saying that, but my memory is swiss cheese when it come to those shows so there is no doubt if you recall it went down like that you are right about it. I just remembered the intervention was about the lie she was caught in when she flew out of the Berkshires and LuAnn blocking her which made me laugh (and still makes me laugh) but nothing much ! 

 

Again, my bad !