S12.E09: Ascension of the Cybermen (Part 1)

[formerlyfreedom]

Quote

In the far future, the Doctor and her friends face a brutal battle across the farthest reaches of space to protect the last of the human race against the deadly Cybermen.

Airing Sunday, February 23, 2020.

[DanaK]

Note: It appears this episode is the usual 49-50 minutes, starting at 7:10pm on the BBC (8pm ET on BBC America). There was speculation it would 60 minutes as part of the 2 part finale (part 2 is said to be 65 minutes)

Longer synopsis:

The aftermath of the Great CyberWar. The Doctor arrives in the far future, intent on protecting the last of the human race from the deadly Cybermen. But in the face of such a relentless enemy, has she put her best friends at risk? What terrors lie hiding in the depths of space, and what is Ko Sharmus?

Guest cast:

Ravio: Julie Graham

Ashad: Patrick O'Kane

Feekat: Steve Toussaint

Written by Chris Chibnall

Directed by Jamie Magnus Stone

Next-time trailer from BBC:

 

Next-time from BBC America:

 

 

Edited February 17, 2020 by DanaK

[marina to]

This is what Jack warned about. So will we get to see him?

[DanaK]

6 minutes ago, marina to said:

This is what Jack warned about. So will we get to see him?

Chibnall says no more this season so I don't think so, but it's hard to say with absolute certainty given the surprises this season

[DanaK]

https://m.facebook.com/DoctorWho/posts/4039822986031698?refsrc=http%3A%2F%2Fgallifreybase.com%2F

More promo pics from the Doctor Who Facebook page

ETA: a few more pics from Cultbox https://cultbox.co.uk/news/doctor-who-ascension-of-the-cybermen-new-images-released

Edited February 18, 2020 by DanaK
Added addl images from Cultbox

[DanaK]

New trailer

 

Sneak peek from Entertainment Weekly

https://ew.com/tv/2020/02/20/doctor-who-finale-jodie-whittaker/?utm_campaign=entertainmentweekly_ew&utm_term=B5CD03E6-541B-11EA-B9FE-1EC64744363C&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social&utm_content=link&__twitter_impression=true&__twitter_impression=true

[Llywela]

Well, there was some good location spotting in this one! All those Ireland scenes were filmed at St Fagan's Folk Museum, just up the road from me, and I'm focusing on that because I have no idea (yet) what that sub-plot was all about.

I enjoyed this one. I have nits I could pick, but I'm not going to because I enjoyed watching it, rollicking space shenanigans that I now need to go away and digest for a bit.

[John Potts]

OK, I really liked that Graham did not say it would definitely work. And I liked the Doctor losing her cool with "The Fam" - I'm sure some will hate it, but I like her showing her some emotion.

So, the abandoned baby is totally going to be the Lone Cyberman, right?

It's Barristan Selmy! As soon as he said "I got away" I was sure it was going to be a trap. And when is Captain Jack showing up?

CRASH THE CYBER SHIP! Ideally get out first but you are bringing an army to a (supposedly) safe place.

[Joe Hellandback]

Watching in the UK so spoilers for the US/Commonwealth;

1. Yep, I was right about the Garda element, Doctor Who finally making it to Ireland. Toon bad it's the Free State and not NI, Greenham Fort and the Giant's Causeway would have been perfect locations. Of course so would Newgrange.  

2.  Shades of Highlander, a foundling being adopted and turns out he cannot die (although he obviously does age). 

3. Nice to see the old style Cyberman again.

4. Especially as the scenes where they march along are very reminiscent of Earthshock (as a kid I remember watching it and thinking how intimidating they were, when I finally bought it on VHS they just seem to dawdle along). 

5. Nice to see the Cyberman being referenced as allergic to gold, thought everyone had forgotten about that. 

6. As the Master says, quite an entrance.

7. At least no wokeness this week.

 So next week? Maybe the Timelords thought the only way to avoid defeat by the Daleks was to get all Cyber? And our friendly Garda is some form of anchor as the Master was in The End of Time?

7/10

Edited February 23, 2020 by Joe Hellandback

[PWHCHCH]

So why did Brendan age but his father did not?

im guessing the Ireland scenes could be set on Mondas rather than earth. Would make for an interesting twist. 

[HauntedBathroom]

Fiddle-de-dee!! Will all Cybertoys be sold with a Cyberpig tucked under its arm in the future?

Didn't care. About any of it.

[AudienceofOne]

3 hours ago, Joe Hellandback said:

7. At least no wokeness this week.

You mean attempts to make a narrative point? Yeah I hate when TV does that. Themes and subtext and having something to say are so SJW. 

Also, there was one if you were paying attention and it was about refugees.

While I found the way in which everyone ended up where they were clumsy, I did appreciate the idea of putting companions out of their comfort zone in this way. Following the Doctor around is like being a tourist on a cruise ship. All you have to do is show up and someone is there to make sure nothing goes wrong. Having them completely cut off from the Doctor and not knowing if she will find and save them in time was a nice piece of existential disquiet. Still have no idea why the Doctor couldn't take the Cyber vessel she ended up on to find the TARDIS but I guess that's the story for you. 

Apropos of nothing, why have Graham and Ryan ditched the grandson/grandpa thing? I liked that. 

[gonzosgirrl]

I know I'm going to feel dumb, but I didn't get the whole aged Brendan getting zapped at the end.

[Suzysite]

5 hours ago, Joe Hellandback said:

7. At least no wokeness this week.

 

And I was super thankful for that.  I didn't need Chibnal's wokey-woke preaching.  Just tell the story.

2 hours ago, AudienceofOne said:

You mean attempts to make a narrative point? Yeah I hate when TV does that.

No, not narrative points.  Preaching.  Messages for us unwashed masses.  Chibnal loves doing that.  

[Rhetorica]

I love all incarnations of The Master... This one is delicious!

[DanaK]

I really liked it. It was tense and exciting and lots to worry about. It had a pretty epic feel and yet was a view of a small number of humans fighting for their lives against the Cybermen. I fully expected the Master to return in the last minute or so, but not quite like that and not with a view of Gallifrey. Heck of a cliffhanger. Obviously Part 1 of 2, so it's unfinished, but it's a heck of a start

That Ashad/Cyberleader sure is a zealot nut, isn't he?

I loved seeing Graham and Yaz working together and figuring things out and pushing the others not to give up. Yes, Graham has certainly come a long way. They sure were able to shine away from the Doctor. I'm not sure Ryan had as much of a chance to shine with the Doctor leading things but it was good to see them pair up. I thought Jodie did really well here, especially zig zagging with the Doctor's emotions between bravery and despair

I'm not sure I really understand what the thing with Brendan was all about

Edited February 24, 2020 by DanaK

[QuantumMechanic]

So why didn’t Ashad just go to that ship years ago and wake up the Cyber soldiers? Or if he needed the Cyberium to know about it, why not go right there?

[Leia1021]

What a jumbled, incoherent mess. Couldn't even finish watching it. Like most of this Doctor's episodes.

[QuantumMechanic]

Hmm. Interesting thought from someone on GB:

”There were lots of hints that it might be something close to the doctor. All these thernes about being a policeman, the police building doors looking like the Tardis doors, a humanoid that ages but cant die. They seem to be going in the direction of the doctor was a policeman in a past life, the memories of which have bled through which is why the tardis is a policebox. Sonething along these lines.”

And someone else wondering if Brendan was a Timeless Child somehow being drained to keep others young.

[DanaK]

The Brendan stuff, though confusing, was pretty intriguing. I have no idea what that particular plot all means at the moment; hopefully it will become clear next week

[Linderhill]

I can't be the only one that is completely tired of The Master showing up.  I don't care who is playing the character, I'm tired of the idiot Master bolluxing things up.  I'm still pissed that the Doctor helped Missy escape execution that time.  The Cybermen are enough of a dangerous foe without the Master sticking his/her annoying foot in.

[DanaK]

I loved the cold open. It was very chilling with Ashad's narration. And to repeat, the guy is a total nut!

@Linderhill I'm actually ok with the Master showing up as much as they do, especially if a different actor from the last time is playing them as it makes for a different vibe and performance

I'm totally looking forward to next week, but sad it will be the end of the season

Edited February 24, 2020 by DanaK

[Lantern7]

I have no idea what's going on.

I will give Chibnall credit for going big. It's just that there was a lot of stuff in his episode that I couldn't wrap my head around. Basically, this was a time where the Cybermen have made humanity all but extinct, the Doctor got as angry as I've seen since her regeneration (fitting given the situation, and Jodie pulled off the "I'm the Doctor, that's why!" thing very well), Graham was extra quippy, and we learned about a boy who grew up to be a man, and he survived a bullet and a fall from a cliff at the same damn time. And, apparently, he's become the Head Cyberman. That's unique, right? I don't think the Cybermen have had anything approaching a leader like, say, Davros. Maybe Mercy from "The Next Doctor"?

Oh, and apparently, the deus ex machina warp thing connects to Gallifrey, for reasons where I don't think I'll be satisfied with the answer. And the Master pops out before he menaces the Doctor in next week's finale. And with all that, there's still the matter of Ruth. If she doesn't show up, the earliest we could get any sort of closure with her is on Christmas. That's ten months away . . . and that's if Chibnall and the BBC agree to that.

I'm ready for next week. I honestly don't swing to either extreme in terms of tone. I just want to have a good time watching. This season has upped the ante higher than the previous season, but I fear the results might be lacking in the larger picture.

[phalange]

I guess Brendan is the Lone Cyberman. It sounded like he said he volunteered for it, but why would anyone do that? And the other two men don’t age for some reason. Are they Time Lords? 

And if a ship full of Cybermen isn’t bad enough for them to deal with, the Master is back. I really want to know how this is all connected to Ruth!Doctor and the Timeless Child. 

[futurechemist]

This episode was overstuffed. Besides the Master and Jack and Ruth there were 2 teams fleeing Cyberman. And the Brendan/Ireland subplot. It was too much. The Brendan plot was confusing and didn't connect. It could (and imo should) have been removed to let the other plots breathe.

I'm fine if Ruth gets punted to next year. After introducing River Song, the show waited a few years before bringing her back. But if Jack doesn't come back more substantially next week, then the show is just trolling us.

[Llywela]

9 hours ago, Joe Hellandback said:

Watching in the UK so spoilers for the US/Commonwealth;

1. Yep, I was right about the Garda element, Doctor Who finally making it to Ireland. Toon bad it's the Free State and not NI, Greenham Fort and the Giant's Causeway would have been perfect locations. Of course so would Newgrange.

The Irish scenes weren't filmed on location at all, they were filmed around Cardiff and south Wales. The garda station is the Oakdale Workmen's Institute at St Fagan's Folk Museum, which has appeared previously in Doctor Who as the village hall in the Family of Blood two-parter.

6 hours ago, AudienceofOne said:

Apropos of nothing, why have Graham and Ryan ditched the grandson/grandpa thing? I liked that. 

Graham did introduce Ryan as his grandson earlier in the season, so it hasn't been completely dropped. I think, though, they have settled into a comfort zone with their relationship so it isn't being pushed as much.

3 hours ago, QuantumMechanic said:

Hmm. Interesting thought from someone on GB:

”There were lots of hints that it might be something close to the doctor. All these thernes about being a policeman, the police building doors looking like the Tardis doors, a humanoid that ages but cant die. They seem to be going in the direction of the doctor was a policeman in a past life, the memories of which have bled through which is why the tardis is a policebox. Sonething along these lines.”

We already know why the TARDIS is a policebox, we've known since 1963. There is no big existential mystery about it. It took that form as a disguise in 1963 and then the chameleon circuit broke, leaving it stuck in that shape.

2 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

I have no idea what's going on.

I will give Chibnall credit for going big. It's just that there was a lot of stuff in his episode that I couldn't wrap my head around. Basically, this was a time where the Cybermen have made humanity all but extinct, the Doctor got as angry as I've seen since her regeneration (fitting given the situation, and Jodie pulled off the "I'm the Doctor, that's why!" thing very well), Graham was extra quippy, and we learned about a boy who grew up to be a man, and he survived a bullet and a fall from a cliff at the same damn time. And, apparently, he's become the Head Cyberman. That's unique, right? I don't think the Cybermen have had anything approaching a leader like, say, Davros. Maybe Mercy from "The Next Doctor"?

I think we've seen Cyber Leaders before, but nothing like Davros or this Lone Cyberman, no.

I'm tired of the show repeatedly going, "All Daleks/Cybermen have now been wiped out, this was their final defeat," followed by, "Actually, it wasn't, look they're still around!" And I'm also tired of seeing so many final destructions of humanity. Show always goes for the hyperbolic and then has to walk it back later. There's no need to go that big in the first place, it doesn't add anything to the story, in fact makes it less believable because we already know it will be undermined later! Sometimes, less is more.

[AnimeMania]

I don't understand why the Cybermen would go to Earth and destroy all of the humans. You think they would protect all of the humans. If all of the humans are dead, they can't make any more Cybermen and how can they continue to expand there conquests throughout the galaxy?

[AudienceofOne]

18 minutes ago, AnimeMania said:

I don't understand why the Cybermen would go to Earth and destroy all of the humans. You think they would protect all of the humans. If all of the humans are dead, they can't make any more Cybermen and how can they continue to expand there conquests throughout the galaxy?

It's because they are being driven by the Lone Cyberman who is motivated by a deep loathing of humanity. As the Doctor said, his behaviour is irrational since he's a Cyber extremist while simultaneously behaving entirely like a human. 

[AnimeMania]

4 hours ago, AudienceofOne said:

4 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

I don't understand why the Cybermen would go to Earth and destroy all of the humans. You think they would protect all of the humans. If all of the humans are dead, they can't make any more Cybermen and how can they continue to expand there conquests throughout the galaxy?

It's because they are being driven by the Lone Cyberman who is motivated by a deep loathing of humanity. As the Doctor said, his behaviour is irrational since he's a Cyber extremist while simultaneously behaving entirely like a human. 

I thought the Lone Cyberman was being driven by the Cyberium, a computer that would be smart enough to realize that if there are no more humans there will be no way to make more replacement Cybermen in their quest to conquer the universe. They already lost the majority of their Cyberman army in their fight to eradicate the Human Race. 

[QuantumMechanic]

6 hours ago, Llywela said:

We already know why the TARDIS is a policebox, we've known since 1963. There is no big existential mystery about it. It took that form as a disguise in 1963 and then the chameleon circuit broke, leaving it stuck in that shape.

Yes, we knew all that. But that was before Chibnall got his hands on the show. It will be totally unsurprising if he totally ruins the Doctor’s backstory.

[Llywela]

Just now, QuantumMechanic said:

Yes, we knew all that. But that was before Chibnall got his hands on the show. It will be totally unsurprising if he totally ruins the Doctor’s backstory.

Like Moffat claiming that the word 'doctor' only came into existence because of the Doctor, you mean? The Doctor's backstory has already been comprehensively trampled over in multiple ways. I hated that, too, and am very wary of where Chibnall is going with this season's arc, but I can't see the police box form of the TARDIS being relevant in any way, there really haven't been any hints related to that and the season's arc has enough loose plot strands to wrap up without adding another. And honestly, it would be ridiculous to try to make the police box shape into something ~deep and meaningful~ better to just let it be what it is. Not everything has to be an existential mystery, and it would be ridiculous to try to spin one out of a question that was answered on-screen in the very first story-arc of the show.

[QuantumMechanic]

FWIW, in the scene where Brendan is sick as a child, the closed captions say that if he gets worse “we’ll call the Doctor” — with a capital D rather than a lower-case one.

Now to be fair, it’s not like captioners never make mistakes.

[Llywela]

18 minutes ago, QuantumMechanic said:

FWIW, in the scene where Brendan is sick as a child, the closed captions say that if he gets worse “we’ll call the Doctor” — with a capital D rather than a lower-case one.

Now to be fair, it’s not like captioners never make mistakes.

Brendan is clearly related to a much wider mystery. I just think it highly unlikely that mystery has anything to do with the reason the TARDIS looks like a police box (which we already know anyway) - whichever poster at GB came up with that theory was stretching further than Elastigirl!

[libgirl2]

2 hours ago, Llywela said:

Like Moffat claiming that the word 'doctor' only came into existence because of the Doctor, you mean? The Doctor's backstory has already been comprehensively trampled over in multiple ways. I hated that, too, and am very wary of where Chibnall is going with this season's arc, but I can't see the police box form of the TARDIS being relevant in any way, there really haven't been any hints related to that and the season's arc has enough loose plot strands to wrap up without adding another. And honestly, it would be ridiculous to try to make the police box shape into something ~deep and meaningful~ better to just let it be what it is. Not everything has to be an existential mystery, and it would be ridiculous to try to spin one out of a question that was answered on-screen in the very first story-arc of the show.

Yes, can the TARDIS shape just be what it is! No need to make it something different. Its just one of the quirks of the TARDIS. Just like it wouldn't always end up where the Doctor was planning to go. THough I noticed that has changed. 

Edited February 24, 2020 by libgirl2

[Eulipian 5k]

Were any clue spotted that may indicate what the man who wouldn't die with the non-aging father has to do with anything?

How can somebody who has no clearance, or is even from the same planet, just take control of the Cyberman troop carrier while the Cyber leader is on board? Sheesh, a 20th century automobile has better anti-theft protection than this Cyber ship!

[Llywela]

2 minutes ago, Eulipian 5k said:

Were any clue spotted that may indicate what the man who wouldn't die with the non-aging father has to do with anything?

How can somebody who has no clearance, or is even from the same planet, just take control of the Cyberman troop carrier while the Cyber leader is on board? Sheesh, a 20th century automobile has better anti-theft protection than this Cyber ship!

re: your first question, I got nothing. Part 2 had better have some good explanations for this particular sub-plot.

re: your second point...maybe because the Cybermen are Just That Arrogant and didn't think they needed extra security, because obvs no puny humans would ever make it that far?

[angora]

I'm with others wondering why the Cybermen were so trigger-happy with the humans. I guess you can say that, with the Cyberium, the Lone Cyberman knew that the troop carrier was out there and their numbers weren't as low as it first appeared, but still. They can't make new Cybermen without people, and if there aren't many humans left, all the more reason to capture instead of kill. Plus, the Doctor was afraid that the Cybermen would convert the companions, but the Cybermen went straight to shooting at them, less body horror and more killer robot - not as interesting.

I'm not even going to try to figure out how it all hangs together - the Cybermen, Brendan, the Master, Gallifrey, the Timeless Child, and maybe Jack and/or Ruth too. I'm not seeing any big clues at this point, and I just HOPE it comes together somehow next week. Also, I want to know what the Lone Cybermen were doing to the Cybermen on the ship.

I did like Yaz and Graham on the escape ship, doing what they could to carry on when they were separated from the Doctor. Both were clever and capable, holding their own and helping the survivors maintain a spark of hope. Unfortunately, Ryan was more in duckling mode, just following the Doctor here. Fingers crossed that he gets more to do in the finale!

This one is reminiscent of Spyfall: Part One for me. Interesting threads, but kind of messy and unfocused, with the Doctor being more reactive, but then the Master shows up and gets me all excited for Part Two. Whatever my issues with Chibnall as a writer, he knows how to play me when it comes to a cliffhanger.

[gonzosgirrl]

50 minutes ago, angora said:

I'm with others wondering why the Cybermen were so trigger-happy with the humans. I guess you can say that, with the Cyberium, the Lone Cyberman knew that the troop carrier was out there and their numbers weren't as low as it first appeared, but still. They can't make new Cybermen without people, and if there aren't many humans left, all the more reason to capture instead of kill.

Maybe the Cyberium has some secret to creating Cybermen without the men part?

I keep feeling a disconnect with this Lone Cyberman. His whole persona (for want of a better word) is pretty much the polar opposite of what we know of Cybermen. He's not only not emotionless, he's practically all emotion. If he didn't have the famliar-if-rudimentary headshape of a Cyberman, I would think he was just another alien life form.

[DanaK]

7 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Maybe the Cyberium has some secret to creating Cybermen without the men part?

I keep feeling a disconnect with this Lone Cyberman. His whole persona (for want of a better word) is pretty much the polar opposite of what we know of Cybermen. He's not only not emotionless, he's practically all emotion. If he didn't have the famliar-if-rudimentary headshape of a Cyberman, I would think he was just another alien life form.

Well, as the Doctor basically said, he's not like a typical Cyberman. He wasn't fully converted and he hates his humanity but that seems to fuel him further. He's a nut who's on a "religious" or maybe messianic campaign. You could say he's trying to remake the Cybermen in his own image or bending them to his will and his particular mission. I think something was said, maybe by Chibnall, that these Cybermen, or maybe just this guy, just want to wipe out the humans for good after so much fighting

Not fully knowing the lore of the Cybermen, why are they always going after just humans? Have they ever tried to convert other races? Ashad seemed to suggest when he was talking to the Doctor that he intends to start converting other races (or wipe them out, it wasn't clear) as part of his crusade for the Cybermen to rule over all

[Jenniferbug]

11 hours ago, Llywela said:

I'm tired of the show repeatedly going, "All Daleks/Cybermen have now been wiped out, this was their final defeat," followed by, "Actually, it wasn't, look they're still around!" And I'm also tired of seeing so many final destructions of humanity. Show always goes for the hyperbolic and then has to walk it back later. There's no need to go that big in the first place, it doesn't add anything to the story, in fact makes it less believable because we already know it will be undermined later! Sometimes, less is more.

Exactly. Once they go big with the hyperbole, I know they're going to end up walking it back eventually. And it takes me out of the story significantly too. All of earth has 7 human beings left. That's it. No more human race. Ok, then where has the Doctor (any regeneration) been that he/she allowed the Cybermen to win for so long? I'm supposed to believe the Doctor didn't notice or wasn't aware that the Cybermen were winning this war? It mystifies me why he/she wouldn't have intervened and put a stop to it far sooner. And that's the case pretty much anytime this show does an end of the world/end of the human race high stakes plotline. 

38 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Maybe the Cyberium has some secret to creating Cybermen without the men part?

I keep feeling a disconnect with this Lone Cyberman. His whole persona (for want of a better word) is pretty much the polar opposite of what we know of Cybermen. He's not only not emotionless, he's practically all emotion. If he didn't have the famliar-if-rudimentary headshape of a Cyberman, I would think he was just another alien life form.

I agree. I'm not feeling connected to this Lone Cyberman. I don't really get the point of the Cyberium or why he needed it or why he's so hell bent on recreating the Cybermen while also killing the humans that could be converted to Cybermen. 

I understand that this was just part 1 and so answers and clarity may well be coming with part 2. But this episode felt lackluster to me. Too much time spent on Brendan without any real clues who he is (the Lone Cyberman? The guy on Ko Sharma? The Doctor/Master/other Time Lord?). And while the portal to Gallifrey was an exciting surprise, the Master popping out of it really wasn't shocking at all. I think for this episode to really work for me, it needed a big Ruth type reveal at the end. As it is, I'm underwhelmed but willing to revise that opinion when part 2 airs and I can see it as a whole plot (hopefully). 

[DanaK]

8 minutes ago, Jenniferbug said:

Exactly. Once they go big with the hyperbole, I know they're going to end up walking it back eventually. And it takes me out of the story significantly too. All of earth has 7 human beings left. That's it. No more human race. Ok, then where has the Doctor (any regeneration) been that he/she allowed the Cybermen to win for so long? I'm supposed to believe the Doctor didn't notice or wasn't aware that the Cybermen were winning this war? It mystifies me why he/she wouldn't have intervened and put a stop to it far sooner. And that's the case pretty much anytime this show does an end of the world/end of the human race high stakes plotline. 

I don't think the planet they were on was meant to be Earth, it was some planet in the far future. And it wasn't the last 7 humans of the entire race. They were the last humans, as far as they knew, in that part of that galaxy. There were others before who had supposedly made it to the barrier and went through. As to the point about the Doctor not stopping the Cyber War, I think she was fully aware they were winning at that point in the far future (she even said it to the companions when they first show up). It's possible she couldn't win against them in the past; I guess we don't know the details. It's also possible that the history was changed. I don't know what the show has said before about the Great Cyberwar, if it said anything, so it's possible I'm missing details

[AudienceofOne]

7 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

I thought the Lone Cyberman was being driven by the Cyberium, a computer that would be smart enough to realize that if there are no more humans there will be no way to make more replacement Cybermen in their quest to conquer the universe. They already lost the majority of their Cyberman army in their fight to eradicate the Human Race. 

The Cyberium is just a tool he's using for his genocidal rampage. 

[Eulipian 5k]

1 hour ago, Jenniferbug said:

Ok, then where has the Doctor (any regeneration) been that he/she allowed the Cybermen to win for so long? I'm supposed to believe the Doctor didn't notice or wasn't aware that the Cybermen were winning this war?

They went directly from her first meeting with the Lone Cyberman to the coordinates Shelley wrote on his walls. Otherwise she would have to make infinite guesses as to where/when she would find and stop Ashad. (Maybe all the future doctors will join her in the Finale Part 2 ala the 50th?) lol.

[Llywela]

2 hours ago, DanaK said:

Not fully knowing the lore of the Cybermen, why are they always going after just humans? Have they ever tried to convert other races? Ashad seemed to suggest when he was talking to the Doctor that he intends to start converting other races (or wipe them out, it wasn't clear) as part of his crusade for the Cybermen to rule over all

No, the Cybermen haven't always gone after humans like this. They have had a long and varied history. In their very first story, they  wanted to conquer Earth because their home planet was dying - mankind was just in the way and it was the planet they wanted, although they 'kindly' offered to make mankind like them and couldn't understand why this suggestion was met with such abhorrence. Other times they have wanted to conquer Earth for the raw materials (i.e. people) needed to make more Cybermen. Some Cybermen stories have been nowhere near Earth, so the only people in danger are the handful that happen to stumble upon a nest of dormat Cybermen. In one adventure they were hell bent on destroying the last remnants of a race called the Vogans, whose home planet (now reduced to little more than a barren rock) was rich with gold, to which the Cybermen were deathly allergic...

Actually, if this is meant to be the same Cyber War that the Fourth Doctor talked about in that adventure, back in the 70s, then we already know how it ends - when humanity invents the glitter gun to fire gold particles at the Cybermen!

Edited February 24, 2020 by Llywela

[CatWarmer]

Very minor point, but how did human hands work the controls/doors/etc. on the cyber troop carrier?  Why would they even register?

[Chyromaniac]

I’ve been thinking about it, and I feel I’m coming down on the “slightly disappointed” side.  Mostly because this didn’t really feel like an episode on its own- pretty much everything felt like setup for the finale.  Personally, I feel like any episode of a show, even one half of a two-parter, should at least have some element of its story that comes to some kind of conclusion.  And I thought they maybe could have done that with either the Doc/Ryan story or the Graham/Yaz story- but instead they both ended in these weird cliffhanger states.  Same goes for Brendan too, actually- I think we needed to get some sort of concrete clue as to how that ties into the main story.  As it is it just doesn’t make sense, and as terrible as the stuff that happens to him is, it’s just hard to care about it all without context.  That being said, I am interested in how this all shakes out next episode- I guess we’ll have to see if it will be worth the setup.

Still liking the Lone Cyberman as an adversary though.  I honestly prefer when the show gives us the “last of the...” characters - I’ll take one villain with an agenda over waves of cannon fodder Daleks or Cybermen any day.

[Gimmick Genius]

Nobody's addressed my complaint about this and several other stories of the 13th Doctor: Why do they park the freaking TARDIS so far away!? The Fam had to schlep all that anti-cyber gear at the start some uncomfortable distance. Similarly in the one with the dying birds they parked it a hundred yards down the beach from the lab. In the Villa Diodata ep they left it far out in the woods. The point of the TARDIS (it's smaller on the outside) is that you can bring it into a building or a ship - even a pretty small one. Now, I know this can be a Deus ex Machina answer to problems but it's dumb to ignore it. When all cyber-heck broke loose, they had to flee the planet in two different ships - abandoning the TARDIS! They could have piled all the refugees inside while working out a plan of survival. If all the running around is supposed to be more 'dramatic'....? Bad writing I call it.

Edited February 25, 2020 by Gimmick Genius
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[DanaK]

In this case, I did wonder if the Doctor wants to keep the Tardis away from the Cybermen. What have previous Doctors done with the Tardis in confrontations with Cybermen? I know 12 parked it way too far away in World Enough and Time and only the return of puddle alien Heather allowed him to united with the ship 

I really liked the music Segun used this episode , especially the theme he used for the Cybermen. I also appreciated hearing 13’s theme at the end

[Llywela]

1 hour ago, DanaK said:

In this case, I did wonder if the Doctor wants to keep the Tardis away from the Cybermen. What have previous Doctors done with the Tardis in confrontations with Cybermen? I know 12 parked it way too far away in World Enough and Time and only the return of puddle alien Heather allowed him to united with the ship 

I really liked the music Segun used this episode , especially the theme he used for the Cybermen. I also appreciated hearing 13’s theme at the end

I'm trying to remember...I don't recall it ever being an especial concern, though, unless someone else remembers any different?

[Sakura12]

This one was definitely a set up episode. But I felt it had enough of it's own story by letting us know about the remaining humans and that the Lone Cyberman is more religious zealot than a Cyberman. He's running on human emotions of anger and resentment. 

I liked seeing Yaz and Graham on their own and using what they learned from the Doctor to keep giving everyone hope. Ryan is still getting lost in the shuffle. 

is Brenden a timeless child and is that how the Timelords got their regenerations ablities? The cop and the father not aging made me think they were Timelords and poor Brenden was an experiment.