S01.E09: Where You Belong

[ohjoy]

Jo and Chris must evade the FBI as they investigate an elusive group of cyber terrorists. Ed’s presented with a cancer treatment that seems too good to be true, and a mysterious woman’s attempt to reach Piper puts the entire Evans family in danger.

Original air date: December 10, 2019

[possibilities]

Holy shit.

[KaveDweller]

That was a good twist at the end. I was already surprised that the reporter turned on Jo, so when he started talking about how Jo would never understand Piper I realized what they were doing and my jaw literally dropped. Now I want to rewatch and see if it has been planted all along.  I remember him encouraging Jo to let Piper "die" early on, and I guess maybe that was a test?

But I have to say, were Jo's dad and Mia really dumb enough to think they had to go to the station for protection, but Piper could go off alone with the reporter.

I totally knew that Alex was not really turning on Piper though. I love how no one really cared about the AI reveal, they just think of Piper as family.

[djsurrey]

Hmm.

Todays ending has me reminiscing about another series. Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles.  S1 E9 of that ended with a memorable scene

Today we had a big reveal. Makes one wonder what might happen next.

Edited December 11, 2019 by djsurrey

[Lily H]

Wow. I did not see that coming at all. I'd been thinking for a while that of the reporter and the FBI guy, one was a bad guy and the other was a red herring, but that was a great twist.

[CarobCake]

Well played show. Well played. Loved the twist, looking forward to where it goes next.

[ottoDbusdriver]

I'm a little confused -- so what happened at the meet by the ferry docks with Helen ?  Did Alex not meet Helen ?   Wouldn't Jo be more concerned if things went south at the meet, and Agent Brooks didn't make the collar ?  


The ending was a great twist.  So, Benny has been playing the long con all this time.

Heck, he took a beating at one point, never would have guessed he was also an AI.

Edited December 11, 2019 by ottoDbusdriver

[Paloma]

3 hours ago, Lily H said:

Wow. I did not see that coming at all. I'd been thinking for a while that of the reporter and the FBI guy, one was a bad guy and the other was a red herring, but that was a great twist.

I didn't see it coming either, especially after getting a bad guy vibe from the FBI agent during his encounter with the reporter at the motel (or apartment building? not sure which). But I'm not sure the Benny reveal makes sense in light of everything we have seen previously. If he is an AI (that's what the light in his hand meant, right?), how could he have had a career as a reporter all these years (unless he is just impersonating the real reporter)? If he was working with the female AI who coldly killed Wilkis in the motel room for taking what belonged to her (which seemed to refer to Piper), why couldn't Benny have killed him all the time that Benny was with him in the motel supposedly keeping him safe for Jo. And these are just the big things about Benny as AI that don't make sense to me. Maybe if I rewatch I will notice clues, but for now I am worried that this is a huge retcon.

Aside from whether Benny as AI is believable, I am curious to see what they want with Piper. Are they creating an AI community and protecting her (and themselves) from humans? After seeing her murder Wilkis and try to deceive Jo's dad and Alex to get Piper, it's hard to see the female AI as anything but nefarious. 

Edited December 11, 2019 by Paloma
Confused character's name with actor's name, which I also got wrong

[AnimeMania]

Next episode, I would like to see Jo walk up to Helen, Benny, and Piper and say "You all are nothing but a bunch of AI's". Helen and Benny explode into a piles of goo, but Piper survives! Or is that not a thing anymore?

[shapeshifter]

Holy Battlestar Galactica "All Along the Watchtower," Batman!

.

2 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

Next episode, I would like to see Jo walk up to Helen, Benny, and Piper and say "You all are nothing but a bunch of AI's". Helen and Benny explode into a piles of goo, but Piper survives! 

Yes, please.

[saber5055]

Well, this episode was a roller coaster. I thought the FBI guy was all creepy when he kept touching Benny during that convo, and thought FBI guy had to be an AI. Then Alex goes to turn in Piper and I'm all hating Alex. Then it was a con! and I like Alex again. Then FBI guy turned into Jo's partner and I liked him again. Then Benny turns out to be the bad guy AI and I'm all WTH.

I was thinking of you guys here, very few of you liked Benny. I guess you were right all along. But I, too, wonder how he had all those stories/articles published if he were AI, unless he took over someone else's identity.

The car chase was pretty awesome and Jo sure knows how to drive for a small-town cop, and the same for Chris or Agent FBI, whomever was in that second car. I guess AIs can survive big falls off of bridges, plus can swim pretty well.

The ending was all kinds of WTH, and I wanted Piper to run into the woods, but I guess the Magic Bracelet kept her from doing that. It maybe kept her from making the cars flip over or her captives' heads from exploding too.

The crab was still on the fridge! And Piper got taken before she could cure dad's cancer. Another WTH.

Great episode though. I love this show. It's well written and doesn't have to rely on romantic triangles or quadrangles as do so many other shows.

[Dowel Jones]

Everyone in the police station is staring, open mouthed, at Jo as she explains that Alex took Piper.  They get it, we get it, but the deputy says "I don't understand."  SOMEbody in that office needs some intelligence, artificial or not.

I was surprised that the meet at the docks went as far as it did.  A tech-savvy group such as Splinter would likely have spies and cameras everywhere, including in Jo's house, so that they would be one up on the Scooby Squad.  But no, they were surprised.  And why can't an AI drive as well as a human?

Well, good luck, Gramps.

[Paloma]

25 minutes ago, Dowel Jones said:

I was surprised that the meet at the docks went as far as it did.  A tech-savvy group such as Splinter would likely have spies and cameras everywhere, including in Jo's house, so that they would be one up on the Scooby Squad. 

My husband and I were saying the same thing during this scene. But I am confused about what kind of group Splinter is and whether the female AI (Helen? I don't remember her name) and Benny are actually part of that group or part of some other group. I think that Jo was blaming the bombings on Splinter, but what was the purpose of the bombings? Maybe to destroy the facilities that could build more Piper-type AIs?

[shapeshifter]

Jo says:

Quote

Everyone tells me that she's code, that she's a machine, but that's just not what I see.
It's not what any of us see.
So, I can't explain it.
But we're not wrong.

--which makes me think that the AIs are making the humans see them in a human form, but they really look like circuitry and motherboards and other computer tech.

Essentially, though, this seems to me to be a Pinocchio story in that Piper (who has told a few lies) will become a real girl --which, IRL, would be astounding for so many reasons.

.

12 minutes ago, saber5055 said:

It's well written and doesn't have to rely on romantic triangles or quadrangles as do so many other shows.

And, as I said in the first episode's thread: Great casting!

13 minutes ago, saber5055 said:

I was thinking of you guys here, very few of you liked Benny. I guess you were right all along. But I, too, wonder how he had all those stories/articles published if he were AI, unless he took over someone else's identity.

Hopefully Benny's not so evil that he would casually kill a journalist to assume his identity. 😞
I would think that the hardest part for an AI being a journalist would be to either (a) write like a culture-savvy human, or (b) not write too well and attract too much attention. 

[tennisgurl]

Hear that sound? Its my jaw, hitting the damn ground! Its amazing that this show can surprise me so often, I so did not see that ending coming! I was surprised when Benny apparently was giving Piper away to the sketchy people, but I was shocked when I realized that he was a robot too, as is the woman who has been trying to find her! Cylons everywhere! I suspected for awhile that Benny would be a bad guy, then I thought that the FBI would be a bad guy, but that Benny is a robot? And possibly part of a community of AI people? 

I love that Jo caught on right away to the robot ladies plan to tempt her with curing Eds cancer in exchange for Piper, and that Alex was actually NOT betraying them but working with Jo to flush out the bad guys! Oh my God guys just get back together! I also loved how excited Alex seemed to be to be a part of this whole spy mission thing, taking the fight to them!

Its actually pretty great that no one is totally losing it over Piper being a robot, and are just like "well thats weird...but it does explain a lot..." and Piper is still very much a member of the family. Poor Piper, run away from the robot lady! Stranger danger! 

I hope that Ed really can find a cure, especially now that he actually wants to try and get better! His scenes with Jo were really touching, one of the best things about this show is how they manage to put so much humanity and realism in the characters and their interactions despite all of the ridiculous science fiction stuff going on. 

[SunnyBeBe]

I haven't been an avid viewer, but, enough to know that that was a huge shocker last night. I still have some catching up to do, but, I so like this series.  I thought about doing a drinking game, so that every time you hear the word "Piper" you take......well, naaay.  Decided against it. lol 

[Zoe]

I think I would buy the twist more if there hadn't been that side plot with his hacker friend.

[Enigma X]

I just think Benny and Helen have been living undetected among humans for years. I get it. Yes, long enough for Benny to have a successful career. There is probably many of them. We are yet to know if they are "bad." Benny did not try to convince Piper that Jo treated her poorly and that she was only pretending to be nice. He, for some reason, just feels as if Piper should be with her own kind (a phrase that I even hate writing). This story is far more interesting to me than what we had with Emily's. 

UO (I think), I hope it does not travel into new BSG territory. I think it can tell a new yet still compelling story. If not new, a different one.

[Bulldog]

I just watched and I have to echo what others said.  Its not often that a show genuinely surprises me, but Benny doing the long con (and an AI to boot!) was something I did not see coming.  Well played, show.  

[djsurrey]

Well one thing that seems more plausible with a community of AI is the development of the technology needed to pull something like Piper off. AI but still flesh and blood. How was the technology developed and how was it kept secret and why give Piper those special abilities? It would seen there is some secret AI society quietly experimenting and developing androids/synthetic life and I don't think it was done by any of the humans we have seen although they have perhaps been used and played some role in it. Once the AI gets rolling and making improvements on itself perhaps it can develop technologies that seem impossible.

[Paloma]

10 hours ago, Zoe said:

I think I would buy the twist more if there hadn't been that side plot with his hacker friend.

Yes, that is part of what bothered me and made me think "retcon." He seemed to have a history with her, though I guess it's possible that if he was AI all that time he was cultivating friendships that would be useful. But it still feels off.

[Johnny Dollar]

While this twist was definitely out of left field, it makes you think back to all of the interactions that Benny had with Piper. He had more than ample opportunity to slip that bracelet on her wrist and whisk her away when Jo wasn’t around. Just a couple of eps ago he was alone with Piper and Ed. If he also has some powers, it doesn’t seem that Ed would’ve been able to stop him. And he could’ve effectively framed Emily or Augur for this and his group never would have had to come out of the shadows. 

[Tyro49]

I must say this show has a knack for springing unexpected, stunning twists!

(Will Piper insist they still save Grandpa?)

[shapeshifter]

9 hours ago, djsurrey said:

Well one thing that seems more plausible with a community of AI is the development of the technology needed to pull something like Piper off. AI but still flesh and blood. How was the technology developed and how was it kept secret and why give Piper those special abilities? It would seen there is some secret AI society quietly experimenting and developing androids/synthetic life and I don't think it was done by any of the humans we have seen although they have perhaps been used and played some role in it. Once the AI gets rolling and making improvements on itself perhaps it can develop technologies that seem impossible.

They have already had Piper state that she is able to reprogram herself. And IIRC, the guy that got stabbed to death wanted to destroy Piper for that reason (for the good of humanity because the robots would rise up etc.).  

Speaking of "not human," I don't think that ending shot of the stars in the night sky was for nothing. 
Oh, dear, writers: Be very careful adding an extraterrestrial element into to the show because I'm old and I've seen too many shows brought down by throw-in-everything-including-the-kitchen-sink plot development. 

Edited December 12, 2019 by shapeshifter

[Zoe]

2 hours ago, Johnny Dollar said:

While this twist was definitely out of left field, it makes you think back to all of the interactions that Benny had with Piper. He had more than ample opportunity to slip that bracelet on her wrist and whisk her away when Jo wasn’t around. Just a couple of eps ago he was alone with Piper and Ed. If he also has some powers, it doesn’t seem that Ed would’ve been able to stop him. And he could’ve effectively framed Emily or Augur for this and his group never would have had to come out of the shadows. 

The only way I can justify it is that they wanted to take down Augur first, but then that means they didn't care about the people they harmed/got killed along the way.  That tilts the group more towards "evil" than "grey" in my book.

[Squeaky Mouse]

5 hours ago, Paloma said:

Yes, that is part of what bothered me and made me think "retcon." He seemed to have a history with her, though I guess it's possible that if he was AI all that time he was cultivating friendships that would be useful. But it still feels off.

Maybe the AIs are creating something like the Stepford Wives, and Wilkis was part of it. So the Benny we originally saw was a normal human, but then once he was keeping an eye on Wilkis, WIlkis killed him and created an AI Benny (outlandish theory, I don't really think this is the case).

I do wonder if Benny and Helen are human/AI hybrids, and Piper is the first fully synthetic AI, and that's why they are so anxious to get her back. She represents the next step in their evolution.

[possibilities]

I am certain they are evil, because if they weren't, they would be more honest with Jo. They see that Jo is on Piper's side. The use of violence as first resort is never a good sign.

[djsurrey]

3 hours ago, possibilities said:

I am certain they are evil, because if they weren't, they would be more honest with Jo. They see that Jo is on Piper's side. The use of violence as first resort is never a good sign.

We don't really know what they are up against, how many there are and if they have factions.

[djsurrey]

8 hours ago, Johnny Dollar said:

While this twist was definitely out of left field, it makes you think back to all of the interactions that Benny had with Piper. He had more than ample opportunity to slip that bracelet on her wrist and whisk her away when Jo wasn’t around. Just a couple of eps ago he was alone with Piper and Ed. If he also has some powers, it doesn’t seem that Ed would’ve been able to stop him. And he could’ve effectively framed Emily or Augur for this and his group never would have had to come out of the shadows. 

Okay, but are there are two of them or more?  There could be more and a yet to be revealed parallel story. Perhaps the urgency in putting that on Piper is a result of changing circumstance that will only be revealed later.

Got to wonder back in episode 1 when the van came to a dead stop how could that happen. It looked like it hit an invisible barrier. How is that consistent with what Piper can do. Perhaps she had help or perhaps it was silly writing.  One can try to suspend disbelief for a while and see if some explanation is eventually relieved (or not). If there are others perhaps there will be an explanation.

Edited December 12, 2019 by djsurrey
punch

[MisterGlass]

Blindsided is definitely the word of the week.

As others have commented this feels strongly like a retcon, or like original Benny was body snatched.  The latter makes more sense to me.  Maybe Wilkis killed original Benny with the blow to the head, the AIs found the body, and are taking advantage of his role in Jo's circle.  However, I can see an argument for Benny's strong anti-Piper stance being an early attempt to get Jo to give her up.

If there is an AI cabal, it could be that Wilkis came across some of their code, stole it, and used it in Augur.  Perhaps AI cabal only found out about it recently, and while Jo took down Augur, they are cleaning out any remaining information that could be used to create another Piper.  That's why they're blowing up buildings.

It just occurred to me that Augur Industries is A.I.

The part that doesn't square with me is kidnapping Piper like this.  If this has been AI Benny all the time, then he should know 1) Jo is resourceful beyond her station, 2) Jo is relentless, and 3) Jo is accepting of an AI as more than a machine.  The way to get Piper without Jo tearing the state apart was to tell Jo the truth.

[shapeshifter]

10 hours ago, Squeaky Mouse said:

Maybe the AIs are creating something like the Stepford Wives, and Wilkis was part of it. So the Benny we originally saw was a normal human, but then once he was keeping an eye on Wilkis, WIlkis killed him and created an AI Benny (outlandish theory, I don't really think this is the case).

6 hours ago, djsurrey said:

Okay, but are there are two of them or more?  There could be more and a yet to be revealed parallel story.

1 hour ago, MisterGlass said:

As others have commented this feels strongly like a retcon, or like original Benny was body snatched. 

11 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Speaking of "not human," I don't think that ending shot of the stars in the night sky was for nothing. 
Oh, dear, writers: Be very careful adding an extraterrestrial element into to the show because I'm old and I've seen too many shows brought down by throw-in-everything-including-the-kitchen-sink plot development. 

So.

Should I/we/anybody start a theories thread with these?

[CarobCake]

7 hours ago, MisterGlass said:

As others have commented this feels strongly like a retcon, or like original Benny was body snatched.  The latter makes more sense to me.  Maybe Wilkis killed original Benny with the blow to the head, the AIs found the body, and are taking advantage of his role in Jo's circle.

Either that or we have a situation like Leo in Humans, where he was perhaps at death's door and got turned into a cyborg as a last resort....

[blixie]

Great twist, I knew the lady who killed Wilkis was probably a robot, but are we sure they ARE robots, tho? The fact that there are others than Piper and Wilkis "stole" the tech, makes me think they are something else, like aliens or humans who have tech augmentations. 

[saber5055]

13 hours ago, MisterGlass said:

Maybe Wilkis killed original Benny with the blow to the head, the AIs found the body, and are taking advantage of his role in Jo's circle. 

Okay, this is the only theory that makes sense to me given that Benny showed no inclination to steal Piper before. Wasn't he with Jo when they went to the Stepford Housing Development, and wasn't he all verklempt when the cool Hacker Lady Friend got killed. None of his past appearances jive with his being part of the AI Gang.

Speaking of the Stepford housing Development, that was a pretty big neighborhood to be undiscovered and with a landing strip. People walking their dogs come across dead bodies IRL, wouldn't SOMEONE have spotted those houses and inquired about realtor prices? I'm assuming the AI Gang is paying property taxes, which should be a nice chunk of money given the location.

Obviously, I'm overthinking ...

p.s. There was a show a while back where aliens were already here, living among us. I hope this show isn't ripping off that plot.

[AnimeMania]

3 hours ago, blixie said:

Great twist, I knew the lady who killed Wilkis was probably a robot, but are we sure they ARE robots, tho? The fact that there are others than Piper and Wilkis "stole" the tech, makes me think they are something else, like aliens or humans who have tech augmentations. 

What! a robot killed a human! Their mama ain't programmed them right!

[Dowel Jones]

1 hour ago, AnimeMania said:

What! a robot killed a human! Their mama ain't programmed them right!

Well, you know how them robot kids are.  Playing violent videos all the time, hanging out with the "bad crowd" at the mall, and hacking each other till all hours of the night.  Just because they finished their homework on the bus is no excuse.  They need some tough love, all right.

[atlantaloves]

KNEW IT KNEW IT KNEW IT....I LOVE THIS SHOW THOUGH.

[possibilities]

16 hours ago, luvenan said:

Either that or we have a situation like Leo in Humans, where he was perhaps at death's door and got turned into a cyborg as a last resort....

Which would be how Grandpa gets saved....

[Johnny Dollar]

I’m willing to buy that this could be Benny 2.0, particularly with how the OG character reacted to the death of his hacker friend. There would have been no reason for AI Benny to visit her daughter after she died.  However, this turn of events bugs because there were plenty of opportunities for just about any of the bad guys to snatch Piper since Jo had the habit of leaving her alone with a cancer patient in his sixties and a 13 year old girl. They could’ve just send in a team of guys armed with magic wristbands. There wouldn’t be enough picture frames to take them all out. 
 

Also, will they ever revisit the plane crash from the first episode or are we just supposed to forget it ever happened?

Edited December 14, 2019 by Johnny Dollar

[shapeshifter]

4 hours ago, Johnny Dollar said:

Also, will they ever revisit the plane crash from the first episode or are we just supposed to forget it ever happened?

I guess the 86 of the crash remains was also symbolic of that plot point. 😉

[perkie1968]

6 hours ago, Johnny Dollar said:

There would have been no reason for AI Benny to visit her daughter after she died.

This is what we were saying as well.  We're guessing that Benny is a sleeper agent and got "activated" when he got the call to bring everyone to the police station.

The one thing I didn't care about was the idea that Grampa and Maia were fine with Piper going with Benny while they sepearated and went to the station on their own.  It's a plot point but on a show that's so tightly written that you dont' see a huge twist coming, it seemed like  a glaring boo boo.  

[MisterGlass]

9 hours ago, Johnny Dollar said:

They could’ve just send in a team of guys armed with magic wristbands. There wouldn’t be enough picture frames to take them all out. 

Heh.

For that matter, couldn't Benny have gifted the wristband to Piper?  "I know you've been feeling scared about what you can do, so I got you this wristband to make you feel better."

[Jacks-Son]

Outstanding twist.  I had read where the episode contained a twist, so I waited to see what the twist was.  Thought it was the fake cancer trial for Dad; then I thought it was Alex selling the family out (horrifying); the reveal that the Alex thing was a sting was a welcome sigh of relief. Then the weird meet and greet with all at the police station EXCEPT Benny and Piper!  Shit!! Where did they go? Then came the best twist of all. Benny and Helen are thieving A.I.'s and potential "I, Robot" instigators.  Well, when I saw that:

Edited December 17, 2019 by Jacks-Son

[possibilities]

I like the theory that Benny being AI is a new thing. Maybe after Wilkis knocked him out, the AI people grabbed him and retrofitted him. And maybe that's what they could do to save Grandpa, too.

[shapeshifter]

Maybe an AI needs a human body to be booted. Maybe an almost dead human body.

[Jacks-Son]

I can't subscribe to the abduction/replacement of Benny. I know his earlier behavior was admitedly un-A.I.-like and definitely human-ish, but we don't know how long he was an A.I. and what specifically an adult A.I. is capable of. Perhaps, as replacements for humanity, they are quite capable of showing empathy and compassion or even emotions and may I dare say, even more capable than some humans.

 If Piper is an example of what a child A.I. is capable of (especially when they have mastered their "fatal exceptions") then an adult A.I. that has broken their restrictions, is capable of unimagined power. Put them all together we're talking extinction of the human race. 

[Paloma]

7 hours ago, Jacks-Son said:

 If Piper is an example of what a child A.I. is capable of (especially when they have mastered their "fatal exceptions") then an adult A.I. that has broken their restrictions, is capable of unimagined power. Put them all together we're talking extinction of the human race. 

Which, IIRC, is what Wilkis was so worried about.

[AG921]

9 hours ago, Jacks-Son said:

I can't subscribe to the abduction/replacement of Benny. I know his earlier behavior was admitedly un-A.I.-like and definitely human-ish, but we don't know how long he was an A.I. and what specifically an adult A.I. is capable of. Perhaps, as replacements for humanity, they are quite capable of showing empathy and compassion or even emotions and may I dare say, even more capable than some humans.

I agree. I don't see how Benny being scared or upset when his friend was killed earlier this season or him checking up on her daughter is in any way at odds with him being AI in this show. If something happened to Jo or Mia, I can imagine Piper acting much the same way and searching out Grampa Ed in the aftermath. 

The only thing that makes this feel like a retcon to me is that if they had been dropping clues about Benny being an AI the whole time, people here would've been calling it out for weeks! Lol! That's the only way I usually pick up on upcoming plot twists- from reading someone much smarter than me figure it out here 🙂

[peachmangosteen]

4 hours ago, AG921 said:

The only thing that makes this feel like a retcon to me is that if they had been dropping clues about Benny being an AI the whole time, people here would've been calling it out for weeks! Lol! That's the only way I usually pick up on upcoming plot twists- from reading someone much smarter than me figure it out here 🙂

I honestly did wonder if Benny was AI himself back when we first found out that Piper was AI. His reaction to it made me question him being an AI. But I kinda let that go immediately afterwards.

[possibilities]

But if he was in Team AI, why didn't he just abduct Piper sooner? She trusted him, it would have been easy.