Episode Discussion II: The TFGH

[Cheyanne11]

45 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

I hope Michael and Willow fucking during their stupid son's birthday party gets its day in the sun. And their general terrible behavior while Chase was sick. That's not too far off the level of Nina not telling anyone about Sonny.

I would love it.  Also, how does Willow think she "did everything to compromise" with Nina?  All I recall is her telling Nina to back off and *maybe someday* Michael *might* deign to let her see Wiley.  That is not compromise.  God, the smug on those two is off the charts. 

Also, gotta love Carly asking Sonny if his love life is why maybe/possibly/who knows other criminals think he's gone soft.  Do they gossip about this at the beauty salon after they've finished reading the latest US Weekly?

Also, part two: go fuck yourself, Phyllis.  You encouraged Nina and "Mike" to get together even when you knew there was a wife in "Mike's" forgotten past.  Your moral high ground is made of quicksand.

 

[TeeVee329]

So Laura is actually totally fine with Lucy dating Tad Martin Grey, that's kinda boring.  I had actually forgotten that Lucy and Tad Martin Grey are supposed to be hiding their relationship from Valentin, which might be because they haven't shared a scene in months.

And of course Lucy believes in spirits, Aiden, she's a former vampire slayer whose cousin was an angel and who has experience with magic candles!

And finally, Laura thinks it would be improper as mayor to invest in a private company, but her very public friendship with the local mob kingpin is totally fine?  Whatev.

Edited April 15, 2022 by TeeVee329

[ciarra]

So, did they hire the same guys that did the Nixon Fails robbery to do the one at Charlie's? 

[Desperado]

I got nothing except that I really like Nina’s dresses - the navy and pink ones. Lucy looked good too.

[FilmTVGeek80]

4 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

I hope Michael and Willow fucking during their stupid son's birthday party gets its day in the sun. And their general terrible behavior while Chase was sick. That's not too far off the level of Nina not telling anyone about Sonny.

It is pretty far off. Willow and Michael lied to Chase to spare his feelings. And the only one who got hurt was Chase. Nina lied, at first to get back at Carly (which I don't blame her for that necessarily) then to selfishly hold on to Sonny for herself. Her lies didn't just hurt Sonny, but his whole family - including small children. People can come up with all kinds of justifications and reasons why it wasn't so bad, but objectively, it was.  The justifications I find kind of hilarious considering the gnashing of teeth at the time of the Nixon Falls storyline and how so many people declared how Nina was wrong, wrong, wrong no ifs, ands, or buts, and now it's basically "yeah what she did wasn't so great, but here's how Carly, Michael, and Willow are worse."

Why would them fucking at the birthday party come up at a custody trial? They didn't fuck in front of the guests or their child. I'm pretty sure, in the real world as well, no one is losing custody of their kids because they have sex at a party or with their kid/s in the next room (which in Michael and Willow's situation wasn't even the case since they had sex in the gatehouse away from the main house.) Children's birthday parties are mind-numbing. I'm not going to knock anyone who finds an enjoyable way to pass the time that doesn't emotionally scar any kids.

4 hours ago, Daisy said:

but it's different. 
they were saving Chase's feelings.  because knowing the truth would have killed him faster apparently. 

It is different. Motivations and rationales make a huge difference. Willow and Michael made stupid decisions, but they didn't really do it out of any sense of malice. Knowing the truth wouldn't have killed him faster necessarily but Chase and others did tell Willow how great her being there for Chase was and how the marriage was giving him something to live for and later that it would give him motivation to walk again. People might want to ignore that because it doesn't fit into their Willow and Michael are devils narrative, but it was stated onscreen. Nina's decision was started because she wanted to get back at Carly (and while Nina had a good reason to hurt Carly, she hurt more than her.) And, even though she went back to PC and saw the devastation of Sonny's family, she still stayed silent for months (doesn't matter if it was six months versus nine months, it was a long time.)

Quote

I would love it.  Also, how does Willow think she "did everything to compromise" with Nina?  All I recall is her telling Nina to back off and *maybe someday* Michael *might* deign to let her see Wiley.  That is not compromise.  God, the smug on those two is off the charts. 

Also, gotta love Carly asking Sonny if his love life is why maybe/possibly/who knows other criminals think he's gone soft.  Do they gossip about this at the beauty salon after they've finished reading the latest US Weekly?

Also, part two: go fuck yourself, Phyllis.  You encouraged Nina and "Mike" to get together even when you knew there was a wife in "Mike's" forgotten past.  Your moral high ground is made of quicksand.

 

She did offer to compromise with her at first. It was only later that she asked Nina to back off so she could try and reason with Michael. Nina seemed pretty smug in her scenes today, too. Guess Willow gets it honestly.

It wasn't about his love life, per se. It was about Nina wronging him and Sonny not going scorched Earth like he normally does. People are going to know about that.

What did Phyllis do to earn a "go fuck yourself?" So what she encouraged Nina and Sonny. While Sonny had a wedding ring, she didn't know he was married. Like people keep saying over and over, Sonny was the one who had no interest in finding out anything about his old life. That's not on Phyllis. I don't remember her getting on a moral high ground about anything, especially not today. All she said to Carly was that she loved Nina but couldn't argue with anything that Carly said about her. Which I think is a pretty diplomatic and generous way to deal with the situation. What Nina did was wrong and Phyllis may love her, but she's not going to defend it.

Edited April 16, 2022 by FilmTVGeek80

[mostlylurking]

6 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

If Neil never used drugs, even when he was experimenting as a kid, what exactly was he experimenting with?

I was wondering about that too! Experimenting with….what?

[Cobalt Stargazer]

3 hours ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

The justifications I find kind of hilarious considering the gnashing of teeth at the time of the Nixon Falls storyline and how so many people declared how Nina was wrong, wrong, wrong no ifs, ands, or buts, and now it's basically "yeah what she did wasn't so great, but here's how Carly, Michael, and Willow are worse."

Aren't they? In all seriousness, if you knew nothing about the characters aside from Carly being what amounts to a mob moll and Michael her insanely spoiled spawn, wouldn't that be enough to make them worse? Willow by herself is IMO not that bad, but she has married into the Corinthos cult, and as a result she's the equivalent of Michael's handbag. If she was allowed to question him without being squashed, it would be different, but she isn't.

 

3 hours ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

 It is different. Motivations and rationales make a huge difference. Willow and Michael made stupid decisions, but they didn't really do it out of any sense of malice. Knowing the truth wouldn't have killed him faster necessarily but Chase and others did tell Willow how great her being there for Chase was and how the marriage was giving him something to live for and later that it would give him motivation to walk again.

I would argue that's just typical bad writing. What, they're going to acknowledge that golden boy Michael could do something sleazy like have sex with someone else's wife/girlfriend when he's supposedly the guy's friend? They did the same thing when poor stupid Morgan was still alive, painted him as some kind of devil because he wouldn't step aside and let his brother "win". Not that Kiki was ever some great prize, but Morgan loved her, and because all storylines involving Michael begin with, "How can Michael triumph?" he had to be protected. If that simultaneously shields Willow, that's just a side effect. It's no different here, the names have just been changed.

[statsgirl]

1 hour ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Why would them fucking at the birthday party come up at a custody trial?

It's adultery. And it's weak, or selfish. Or both.

Michael and Willow's argument is that they are the virtuous guardians of Wylie and Nina is a bad influence on him. The adultery knocks them off their sanctimonious stand  levels the playing field.

Deliberately trying to create a media scandal about Nina to influence the judge lowers them even farther on the righteousness scale.

1 hour ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Nina lied, at first to get back at Carly (which I don't blame her for that necessarily) then to selfishly hold on to Sonny for herself.

I remember at least twice when Sonny specifically stated that he did not want to know who he was before the amnesia. When Sonny wanted to sleep with her, Nina was the one who pulled back and said that she wouldn't until he found out who he was.  So no adultery, unlike Willow and Michael.

Phyllis did everything she could short of setting out flowers and candles to get Sonny and Nina together even though Sonny was wearing a wedding ring. Sympathizing with Carly now that Sonny had feelings for Nina when he might not have had them without Phyllis' encouragement is rank hypocrisy.

[Daisy]

45 minutes ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

Aren't they? In all seriousness, if you knew nothing about the characters aside from Carly being what amounts to a mob moll and Michael her insanely spoiled spawn, wouldn't that be enough to make them worse? Willow by herself is IMO not that bad, but she has married into the Corinthos cult, and as a result she's the equivalent of Michael's handbag. If she was allowed to question him without being squashed, it would be different, but she isn't.

 

I will say I have always said that Carly has every right to be upset with Nina I never blamed her for being upset. What I've also said was that Carly never not once said "How did i end up here? What was my role in this?"  Where Nina is doing her best to portray Jesus, complete with carrying her own cross for everything - even the bits that aren't all her fault. 

Where Nina has flat out said she would change back time and do everything different even if it mean she didn't get Sonny - Carly is all "hell yeah I lied, and didn't tell you something that profoundly impacted your life and I'll do it again. "
 

I've said it before, and I'll say this again. from my pov this is more 80% Nelle/20% Nina vs. 100 percent Nina. They want to delete Nelle, and Nina won't let that be, so thus '"Nina is a threat, Nina can't be around Wiley." when her only crime was saying the kid well I'm your other mommy's mommy." 

I am actually surprised that Nina hasn't clapped that truth to Michael but they are soo forcing the Nina hates Willow/Willow hates Nina spread, so it's like DUH DUNN DAHH. (or at the very least the next time someone bemoans how Sonny lost 9 months, that it was his own damned fault. 

[nilyank]

1 hour ago, mostlylurking said:

I was wondering about that too! Experimenting with….what?

Witchcraft?

46 minutes ago, Daisy said:

Where Nina has flat out said she would change back time and do everything different even if it mean she didn't get Sonny - Carly is all "hell yeah I lied, and didn't tell you something that profoundly impacted your life and I'll do it again. "

Nina may have said it, I just don't believe her. And even if it is the truth, I don't care about her to see if she wins or loses.

It is also my unpopular opinion here that I don't care if Michael and Willow are being petty and refusing to allow Nina in Wylie's life. They are his parents and they get to make that decision. Nina had no relationship with Wylie prior to the stupid Little Orphan Annie Necklace reveal and it was only because Michael allow her to meet Wylie that she ever her foot in the door. On her second visit with Wylie, she said something that upset Willow and to a lesser extent Wylie, and she lost access to him. Then rather than trying to make amends with them, she to Nixon Falls and spent six months in Nixon Falls in snoozefest of a storyline. Wylie was never her top priority even when Jax blackmailed Michael into allowing Nina back in Wylie's life. One quick visit and she was back to the emptiest bar in the United States.

And for all that, I think that what annoys me the most about Nina is when she told Sonny that she found the purest love in the world when he was suffering from amnesia/head trauma as Mike. Not her unknown missing child. Not her dead brother "J." Not little James. Or most especially not her supposed only grandson (won't believe it until they conduct a dna test).

[Daisy]

4 minutes ago, nilyank said:

Nina may have said it, I just don't believe her. And even if it is the truth, I don't care about her to see if she wins or loses.

that's fair.  i mean you don't like her so you don't care. I don't really care about her either, but her actions - up to and willing to go to jail so sonny and carly could be together proves otherwise that yeah she felt bad about it and would change it if she could. 

 

6 minutes ago, nilyank said:

Nina had no relationship with Wylie prior

but why would she? she didn't know she was related. when she did she wanted one. When Michael said give them space, she did. and when they said don't push, she didn't. it wasn't until they basically went "no you can't have anything to do with Wiley, because of what you did to Carly," that she started to get pissed off and fight for her rights
 

7 minutes ago, nilyank said:

They are his parents and they get to make that decision

yeah they are. the only thing here for me is - Michael has lived being used as a weapon by his parents vs. the Q's. and that's what he is doing with his son against his grandmother.  yeah if it was simply. "i don't want you in his life when he's 18, come see him" and left it at that - then sure. that's their decision. but barring her from his life because she did the exact same thing Carly  (lied about a love one) and Millow did (had committed adultery and broke Chases's marriage. but it's okay if they all do it but Nina can't see her grandkid?

On top of all of that Michael himself said that it did cost him knowing Alan better, and AJ and that he wish that hadn't been the case. (being barred from knowing his birth paternal family - so why is he so hell bent on doing it to Nina, where she had been willing to bend over backwards to do whatever he and Willow wanted. 

as Coach Herman said in Remember the Titans. "I'm a mean ole cuss, but I'm the same mean ole cuss to everyone."  if i felt Michael's claim was a good reason and not done out of spite, i'd totally support that claim and be all "just wait until they age the kid." but when Michael is using the kid as a cookie for Nina i'mma gonna call him out on it just like i did with Sonny, Jason and Carly when they did it to AJ, Alan and Monica  

 

[Cobalt Stargazer]

3 hours ago, nilyank said:

On her second visit with Wylie, she said something that upset Willow and to a lesser extent Wylie, and she lost access to him.

Maybe if Michael wasn't so hell-bent on erasing Nelle as Wylie's mother, there wouldn't have been anything for Willow or Wylie to get upset about. It's not Nina's fault that Michael had sex with Nelle and made a baby, and it doesn't matter what kind of lunatic she may have been. Did he not know that she was insane, and if he did, he's either trying to cancel out his own mistake by pretending that she never existed or.......what? It's not for Wylie's benefit, because he's two, and at two your entire life is Ow, there's that damn coffee table again! Willow knows (I think) that Wylie is not the child she lost, and she knows that Michael banged Nelle, and she doesn't care. So who is the deletion of this woman for other than Mop Head?

[nilyank]

12 minutes ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

Maybe if Michael wasn't so hell-bent on erasing Nelle as Wylie's mother, there wouldn't have been anything for Willow or Wylie to get upset about. It's not Nina's fault that Michael had sex with Nelle and made a baby, and it doesn't matter what kind of lunatic she may have been. Did he not know that she was insane, and if he did, he's either trying to cancel out his own mistake by pretending that she never existed or.......what?

I am wondering would this also apply to Maxie and Bailey and the subject of Peter. Would Nina encourage Maxie to talk about Peter as Bailey gets older? If a not dead Alex shows up and gets rid of any pesky charges, and demands to see her grand-daughter, that would be totally okay.

Btw, I would support Bailey knowing about her father because I believe that he (crazy as he got) loved her and Maxie, and she was probably the last good thing that Peter was able to achieve.

With Nelle, I think once she tossed her kid in Brad's arm and grabbed the dead baby without a second look back at the child she gave birth to literally minutes earlier, that any doubts that I had of Nelle loving her child were gone. She didn''t. Wylie has always been a tool that she used to hurt everyone.

[FilmTVGeek80]

2 hours ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

Aren't they? In all seriousness, if you knew nothing about the characters aside from Carly being what amounts to a mob moll and Michael her insanely spoiled spawn, wouldn't that be enough to make them worse? Willow by herself is IMO not that bad, but she has married into the Corinthos cult, and as a result she's the equivalent of Michael's handbag. If she was allowed to question him without being squashed, it would be different, but she isn't.

 

I would argue that's just typical bad writing. What, they're going to acknowledge that golden boy Michael could do something sleazy like have sex with someone else's wife/girlfriend when he's supposedly the guy's friend? They did the same thing when poor stupid Morgan was still alive, painted him as some kind of devil because he wouldn't step aside and let his brother "win". Not that Kiki was ever some great prize, but Morgan loved her, and because all storylines involving Michael begin with, "How can Michael triumph?" he had to be protected. If that simultaneously shields Willow, that's just a side effect. It's no different here, the names have just been changed.

No, in all seriousness, that's just your IMO. Carly is worse, I'll agree. And the way you put it seems odd to me. Because I do know more about the characters than just that. Mental illness or not, Nina once tore a baby from a mother's womb. That is way, way, way worse than anything Michael and WIllow have done. And Willow is allowed to question Michael without being quashed.

It's all bad writing, basically, so I'm not sure what your point is. The point was whether what Nina did was the same as what Michael and Willow did, and my argument is, no. And, yes, they did acknowledge what Michael and Willow did was wrong. They admitted it when they apologized to Chase and Chase and Michael talked about it during their last scenes together.

2 hours ago, statsgirl said:

It's adultery. And it's weak, or selfish. Or both.

Michael and Willow's argument is that they are the virtuous guardians of Wylie and Nina is a bad influence on him. The adultery knocks them off their sanctimonious stand  levels the playing field.

Deliberately trying to create a media scandal about Nina to influence the judge lowers them even farther on the righteousness scale.

I remember at least twice when Sonny specifically stated that he did not want to know who he was before the amnesia. When Sonny wanted to sleep with her, Nina was the one who pulled back and said that she wouldn't until he found out who he was.  So no adultery, unlike Willow and Michael.

Phyllis did everything she could short of setting out flowers and candles to get Sonny and Nina together even though Sonny was wearing a wedding ring. Sympathizing with Carly now that Sonny had feelings for Nina when he might not have had them without Phyllis' encouragement is rank hypocrisy.

So, what, it's adultery. In most custody cases, adultery is not necessarily a dealbreaker. And why not just say adultery instead of making it seem like the issue was them having sex at the party? And if you want to talk weak and selfish, look at Nina's actions. Nina is the one who wants to take this to court. So, Michael and Willow should just sit back and take it? Nina is the one who wants a fight - even boasted about it - so now she's got one. People always used to complain that Michael and Willow were so boring and were never allowed to do anything wrong or play dirty. Now that they are somehow that makes them the scum of the Earth. Michael and Willow's argument is not that they're perfect. But as Wylie's parents they don't think Nina should be in Wylie's life and they get to make that decision. 

Nina pulling back - once - from having sex with Sonny doesn't somehow put her on a level playing field with Willow and Michael or somehow make her better. That was one time where she told Mike she wouldn't go further until he looked into his old life. Which she basically forgot about and continued her romance with him. If Jax didn't come along and browbeat her into confessing, she would have happily went along with the lie and probably eventually slept with him. 

Phyllis, unlike Nina, did not know for sure Sonny was married. That was a good guess since he had the wedding ring, but it wasn't something she knew for certain. Yes, she was persistent to see Mike and Nina together but she didn't force Sonny to have feelings for Nina. So, no, her sympathizing with Carly (after apologizing for her role in Mike and Nina's relationship) is not hypocritical. I think it's ridiculous to see Phyllis get more hate for matchmaking than Nina gets for knowingly lying.

1 hour ago, Daisy said:

I've said it before, and I'll say this again. from my pov this is more 80% Nelle/20% Nina vs. 100 percent Nina. They want to delete Nelle, and Nina won't let that be, so thus '"Nina is a threat, Nina can't be around Wiley." when her only crime was saying the kid well I'm your other mommy's mommy." 

That's her only crime? It might not have been a literal crime but what she did with Sonny was pretty bad. In real life, if someone had done that to me, I wouldn't want them in my kid's life either. After her mistake the last time, Nina promised not to bring Nelle up again, so Nina not letting Nelle be forgotten is not the issue driving Michael's anger. Though he was blackmailed into it, Michael and Willow let Nina see Wylie after that incident. If she hadn't kept his father away from him for months, Nina would still be visiting him.

[FilmTVGeek80]

23 minutes ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

Maybe if Michael wasn't so hell-bent on erasing Nelle as Wylie's mother, there wouldn't have been anything for Willow or Wylie to get upset about. It's not Nina's fault that Michael had sex with Nelle and made a baby, and it doesn't matter what kind of lunatic she may have been. Did he not know that she was insane, and if he did, he's either trying to cancel out his own mistake by pretending that she never existed or.......what? It's not for Wylie's benefit, because he's two, and at two your entire life is Ow, there's that damn coffee table again! Willow knows (I think) that Wylie is not the child she lost, and she knows that Michael banged Nelle, and she doesn't care. So who is the deletion of this woman for other than Mop Head?

Nelle being a lunatic does matter. Trying to pretend something like that doesn't matter doesn't make sense to me. I don't blame Michael one bit for not wanting Wylie - right now - to know about Nelle. He's said if Wylie has questions about her when he's older, he'll talk about her.

10 minutes ago, nilyank said:

I am wondering would this also apply to Maxie and Bailey and the subject of Peter. Would Nina encourage Maxie to talk about Peter as Bailey gets older? If a not dead Alex shows up and gets rid of any pesky charges, and demands to see her grand-daughter, that would be totally okay.

Btw, I would support Bailey knowing about her father because I believe that he (crazy as he got) loved her and Maxie, and she was probably the last good thing that Peter was able to achieve.

With Nelle, I think once she tossed her kid in Brad's arm and grabbed the dead baby without a second look back at the child she gave birth to literally minutes earlier, that any doubts that I had of Nelle loving her child were gone. She didn''t. Wylie has always been a tool that she used to hurt everyone.

Exactly! Nelle never cared about that kid. After she slashed Brook-Lynn's throat, as we had to watch her endlessly talk to Wylie, did she ever once talk about how grateful she was to have a chance to be his mother and love him and how excited she was to build a life with him? No. It was all about how gleeful she was to win over Carly. All Wylie ever was to Nelle was a tool to get back at Carly. 

[statsgirl]

Wylie is just a tool to Michael and Carly that they lay claim to and win.. If they really cared about him, they would have let him transition slowly from Lucas instead of Lucas disappearing from Wylie's life for months and all the scenes we got when Wylie woke up crying and someone had to go up and soothe him.

Never once has there been a scene where any of Carly, Michael or even Bobbie said "I don't want to do this but it's what's best for Wylie so I will."

1 hour ago, nilyank said:

On her second visit with Wylie, she said something that upset Willow and to a lesser extent Wylie, and she lost access to him. Then rather than trying to make amends with them, she to Nixon Falls and spent six months in Nixon Falls in snoozefest of a storyline. Wylie was never her top priority even when Jax blackmailed Michael into allowing Nina back in Wylie's life. One quick visit and she was back

Nina went back because 'Mike' phoned her and said that Lenny was dying and he and Phyllis needed her. Phyllis had helped Nina and Nina felt that she owed her.

Wylie wasn't upset, just curious. He even ran to Nina when he accidentally encountered her in the park because he like her.

Willow was upset because she's utterly delusional that she is Wylie's only mother and the only person (other than Michael) who can take care of him. That's very unhealthy and Michael should have been taking her to a therapist instead of encouraging it.

4 minutes ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

So, what, it's adultery. In most custody cases, adultery is not necessarily a dealbreaker. And why not just say adultery instead of making it seem like the issue was them having sex at the party?

Michael and Willow are claiming the moral high ground. That they were committing adultery takes that away from them. That they were having sex in the middle of Wylie's birthday party where their guests were waiting for them instead of waiting till the guests had gone home makes them even more cheap.

6 minutes ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

And if you want to talk weak and selfish, look at Nina's actions. Nina is the one who wants to take this to court. So, Michael and Willow should just sit back and take it? Nina is the one who wants a fight - even boasted about it - so now she's got one. People always used to complain that Michael and Willow were so boring and were never allowed to do anything wrong or play dirty. Now that they are somehow that makes them the scum of the Earth.

They are playing dirty while acting as if they are the purest of the pure. That's what makes them hypocrites.

Wylie is Nina's only descendent and the only one she will ever have as far as she knows. Why wouldn't she want to have a relationship with him? She has more right to it than Willow, who is the mistress of Wylie's father.

Every reason that Michael and Willow have to keep Nina from Wylie is selfish: she didn't tell Sonny who he was while Sonny was saying that he doesn't want to know, she slept with Sonny after Carly kicked him to the curb, she told Wylie that she is his grandmother. These are all reasons about Michael, Carly and Willow, none of them are about what is truly best for Wylie himself who is fond of Nina.

[nilyank]

Okay, has Harmony had scenes with Carly.

Harmony was a nurse and her name used to be Lorriane Miller?

Well here is a very quick clip Lorraine and Carly:

 

[nilyank]

9 hours ago, statsgirl said:

Wylie is Nina's only descendent and the only one she will ever have as far as she knows. Why wouldn't she want to have a relationship with him? She has more right to it than Willow, who is the mistress of Wylie's father.

 

What? Willow is Wylie's mother and has been in his life since Brad and Lucas invited her to be involved in knowing him. She has legally adopted him. She has loved that boy and fought for him and protected him. Nina is nothing to him in comparison to Willow is to him.

Edited April 16, 2022 by nilyank

[Cheyanne11]

5 hours ago, nilyank said:

Okay, has Harmony had scenes with Carly.

Harmony was a nurse and her name used to be Lorriane Miller?

Well here is a very quick clip Lorraine and Carly:

 

Carly and Harmony  have had scenes, so I really don't think this is supposed to be the same Lorraine.  Harmony was referred to as a home healthcare worker a couple times, not a nurse.  I think it's just the writers being oblivious to the name. 

ETA: Of course, now that Carly-In-All-Storylines is getting involved they may suddenly have her ~remembering Lorraine, because Carly must be not only involved in every story, but somehow a central character.

Edited April 16, 2022 by Cheyanne11

[YaddaYadda]

Nobody needs to bring up the adultery. Puff Fish slugged a court officer, who mind you did not press charges when he should have, and paid bribes to the Pennsylvania DA to take Nina to court, and slugged a "journalist" in front of law enforcement, then bribed him with a story so that he would drop the charges against him.

Nina's gravest sin was inducing Ava and stealing Avery. But that was also a complete mental collapse on her end and IIRC, that's how it was looked at at the time, not to mention all the nasty history between Ava and Nina that predated either of them being on canvas. She and Ava are good friends, and if Nina has been running around town to get character references, then I'm sure she also asked Ava. 

The interesting thing with Nina is that every completely bonkers thing that she's done can be traced directly back to what her mother did to her and the loss of her child. The writing has at least been consistent with that.

[CeChase]

5 hours ago, nilyank said:

Okay, has Harmony had scenes with Carly.

Harmony was a nurse and her name used to be Lorriane Miller?

Well here is a very quick clip Lorraine and Carly:

 

OMG it's Ayna!  I had no idea she was ever on GH.  I love her. 

Edited April 16, 2022 by CeChase

[CeChase]

Yesterday's show was Bor-Ing. I literally kept nodding off trying to watch it on Hulu, it was terrible.   The show is making a huge mistake with these Carly keeps confronting Sonny and whines scenes.  Stop them.   "Sonny of course the rest of the mob thinks you lost your mojo, you  didn't murder Nina!"  Oh my God.  Seriously?  This is our lead?  She is disgusting.  And what in hell was she wearing?  I don't even remember what else happened other than Chase got out of the shower, which was the only good scene.  I hope he and Liz bang.   I am not a teen and yet, somehow, in my view, when the college set are off screen, the stories are pretty boring.  Do they have different writers for them?  

Edited April 16, 2022 by CeChase

[dubbel zout]

10 hours ago, nilyank said:

the emptiest bar in the United States

Hee. Charlie's will soon have that title, I'm sure.

9 hours ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

I don't blame Michael one bit for not wanting Wylie - right now - to know about Nelle.

Sucks for Michael, but the fact is that Nelle is Wiley's mother. Wiley deserves to know that without prejudice from anyone. What's the harm? Michael is acting as if Nina is going to give a detailed account of Nelle's life to a toddler. He's such a drama queen.

[lala2]

Granted, I’m not a grandmother, but what is with this idea that Nina is not genuine about wanting to see Wiley unless she wants to spend every waking moment with him?!? I don’t get that, and I see this argument on other forums too. Are grandparents not supposed to have lives?! Are they supposed to want to see their grandchildren  24/7, esp young grandparents like Nina?!?

Nina was told she could go visit that brat. She did. Her friend was dying - which trumps seeing a healthy grandson she could presumably see later - so she left. What’s the problem? Why is that an issue? How does that speak to her wanting to see the kid? She got what she wanted, which was to visit with the kid. Nina doesn’t want custody. She just wants to be able to visit from time-to-time. And with them allowing that visit, Nina probably thought she could visit another time with no issue. 

IMO, Nina wants to see Wiley in a reasonable way. She’s not trying to visit every single day and spend all day with him, which is normal to me. Her leaving to visit a DYING friend does not call into question the sincerity of her request for visits. It’s crazy to think it does. Visit my grandson who I can presumably see later or visit my dying friend?!? That’s not even a question for me. I’m visiting my dying friend. I’ll see the kid later. 

I also strongly agree with those who feel Millow has no legitimate reason why Nina cannot visit. It’s all been stated really well, but I do not think either actually think Nina would harm Wiley. They just hate Nina for personal reasons - none of which have to do with Wiley. They are selfish, and I hope they lose in court but knowing this show, they won’t. 🙄

Edited April 16, 2022 by lala2

[Cheyanne11]

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

Sucks for Michael, but the fact is that Nelle is Wiley's mother. Wiley deserves to know that without prejudice from anyone. What's the harm? Michael is acting as if Nina is going to give a detailed account of Nelle's life to a toddler. He's such a drama queen.

Children of adoption don't need to be shielded from the fact.  Willow is Wiley's mother--his adoptive mother.  There's nothing wrong with him knowing that, yet Michael and Willow act like that will traumatize him to the point he's going to run away and never come back. 

Edited April 16, 2022 by Cheyanne11

[dubbel zout]

They're also acting like knowing Nelle is his birth mother will traumatize him. That whole situation is so screwed up. WYLIE IS A TODDLER. He doesn't care about nuance at this point. 

[Cheyanne11]

4 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

They're also acting like knowing Nelle is his birth mother will traumatize him. That whole situation is so screwed up. WYLIE IS A TODDLER. He doesn't care about nuance at this point. 

"Oh, Daddy, my real Mommy died?  Can you please tell me all about her?  What was your relationship like?  Was she nice?  Tell me all about her." - the conversation Michael and Willow think will occur if Wiley--a THREE YEAR OLD CHILD--finds out about his birth mother. 

[lala2]

5 minutes ago, Cheyanne11 said:

"Oh, Daddy, my real Mommy died?  Can you please tell me all about her?  What was your relationship like?  Was she nice?  Tell me all about her." - the conversation Michael and Willow think will occur if Wiley--a THREE YEAR OLD CHILD--finds out about his birth mother. 

Right?!!! It is all so overly dramatic and stupid! “Well, your bio mommy came to town to ruin Grandma Carly’s life . . . . “

Come on!!! Why would they even say anything beyond she passed away. That’s all they have to say. 

The writers treat the audience like morons! I wish soap writing would mature and get with the times! 

[Daisy]

1 minute ago, dubbel zout said:

They're also acting like knowing Nelle is his birth mother will traumatize him. That whole situation is so screwed up. WYLIE IS A TODDLER. He doesn't care about nuance at this point. 

like i said in a recap they are very much clutch the pearls WE CAN'T LIE to WYLIE. and it's like so are you going to tell him there's no Santa, or Easter Bunny and shatter every world view he has for blunt honest truth? of course not.

They retconned it in the show (like they do everything else) but i mean. i remember it. none of them told Nina what not to/to say to the kid. Nina is just babbling to the kid about how they are related. (and I'm sorry. i can buy a TONNE of things. but i refuse to believe a 2 year old heard all of that babbling, then was able to digest it and tell willow "you are not my mommy." and say it came from Nina. refuse).  then Michael was basically all we weren't going to tell him about Nelle ever, then they all decided on this random age of 22  and with a therapist they would spill the tea and Nina agreed. 

like I said, Nina has jumped through every hoop these two put up in front of her for Wiley's sake, except giving up her grandparental rights like Willow wanted because Col Tad was right. if you give them up, you don't get them back. she didn't want to go to court, she doesn't even want lawyers, she's begged them to just work something and they don't want to because then Nina would win. 

parents of the year, these two. 

[Daisy]

5 minutes ago, lala2 said:

The writers treat the audience like morons! I wish soap writing would mature and get with the times! 

these writers. 
Honestly. I'm not putting AMC/OLTL on any pedestals here, they had a lot of stinkers but fo the most part they were on the ball.. Bianca on AMC flat out told people that she would never lie to Miranda (her daughter) about how she came to be (a product of rape) - but she had been loved and wanted by her mother (which was always so powerful because Eirika had always struggled with Kendall about it. and Bianca wanted to break that circle).

all these people have to do is listen to what they write sometimes. 
"Nina didn't tell me she slept with Sonny, when she said she and Carly would never have peace, so she'll manipulate Wiley the same way." okay? that's a big leap there.

[CanaryFan98]

19 hours ago, Daisy said:

i know this is each their own. but i still don't think Willow loves Michael for Michael. She love Michael because he come w/Wiley - and that she still hasn't truly come to terms with her kid that died. 

I think this too and if they were to ever split the character this should be the reason why. 

 

I also liked the Laura/Aiden/Lucy scenes although I don't see the point in Lucy/Laura's scene because they have barely interacted these days. 

I never knew I needed a Lucy/Aiden ghost adventure story between them because I think personality wise they fit as buddies.

Edited April 16, 2022 by CanaryFan98

[Blackie]

5 hours ago, CeChase said:

I don't even remember what else happened other than Chase got out of the shower, which was the only good scene.

 

Wait that did happen yesterday??  I thought when it was mentioned , it was for the next show lol. I ffd through most of yesterday so somehow I missed it. I guess I missed the very beginning too so maybe it was then. Hahaha  here I thought I had something to look forward to on Monday.

[dubbel zout]

7 minutes ago, CanaryFan98 said:

I never knew I needed a Lucy/Aiden ghost adventure story between them because I think personality wise they fit as buddies.

Yes! Make it a harmless summer story. This show could definitely use some lighter plots.

[YaddaYadda]

50 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

They're also acting like knowing Nelle is his birth mother will traumatize him. That whole situation is so screwed up. WYLIE IS A TODDLER. He doesn't care about nuance at this point. 

Eh. Michael is doing exactly what Carly did to AJ. He's trying to erase Nelle from Wylie's life and pretend she didn't exist. 

Nelle was a psycho. I think there was a small part of her that may have cared for Wylie, but she's dead and buried (so far) and that's that. The day will come when Wylie will ask questions about his biological mother. This is Port Charles, where everyone knows everyone and everyone is up in everyone's business.

Edited April 16, 2022 by YaddaYadda

[ffwbe]

1 hour ago, Cheyanne11 said:

Children of adoption don't need to be shielded from the fact.  Willow is Wiley's mother--his adoptive mother.  There's nothing wrong with him knowing that, yet Michael and Willow act like that will traumatize him to the point he's going to run away and never come back. 

When those scenes aired, it was clearly not even about that. Willow has issues and got upset because she hadn’t dealt with her baby’s death. We heard her unload on Chase about it the following day since of course she couldn’t mention it to Michael. Willow and Michael acted unreasonable during that scene. Wiley asked if Nina was Willow’s mother and how else was Nina supposed to explain how she was Wiley’s grandmother but not Willow’s mom? 

[Mirabelle]

5 hours ago, CeChase said:

OMG it's Ayna!  I had no idea she was ever on GH.  I love her. 

She gave Carly the nickname Snarly. 

[ffwbe]

41 minutes ago, Daisy said:

"Nina didn't tell me she slept with Sonny, when she said she and Carly would never have peace, so she'll manipulate Wiley the same way." okay? that's a big leap there.

I’ve said it before but the parallels between Wiley/Nina and young Michael with the Qs is so glaringly obvious. Carly and Sonny hated AJ so they had his parental rights (illegally) stripped away and kept him away from the Qs with the exception of Jason and Emily. We heard Carly pat herself on the back for years about how Michael was better off being raised away from that family. 

If this show ever allowed the Corinthos’ to lose, they would have Michael asked if he thought being kept away from the Qs and only hearing that same one-sided, extremely biased opinion of his father and family for his entire childhood was better for him.

I wish I had access to clips from 2012 but when AJ returned, we constantly heard Carly and Sonny freaking out about how AJ was the devil and would manipulate Michael and wanting him to stay away from AJ, almost word for word what Millow saying about Nina now. Obviously Michael’s opinion of AJ didn’t match his parents views since they were close until he died. I also can’t see him admitting that it was better that he was kept away from Monica and it’s nice that they have a relationship now but the same can’t be said for Alan since he died before Michael became an adult and could choose for himself. 

[statsgirl]

I think that the LucyéLaura scene was to set up Lucy talking to Aiden about people coming back from the dead. They pull Lucy out for all things supernatural.

1 hour ago, lala2 said:

Right?!!! It is all so overly dramatic and stupid! “Well, your bio mommy came to town to ruin Grandma Carly’s life . . . . “

And while we're talking, Grandma Carly came to town to ruin Great-Grandma's  life (and succeeded in ruining her marriage) and Grandpa Sonny took Daddy Michael away from your bio Grandpa AJ by hanging him on a meat hook and later he murdered Grandpa AJ .....

1 hour ago, Daisy said:

then they all decided on this random age of 22  and with a therapist they would spill the tea and Nina agreed.

Now there's a way to traumatize Wiley: "Hey Wiley, you know everything that we told you about your birth? Well it's all a lie. Your birth mother was called Nelle and she was a psychopath so we lied to you.  Good luck with having inherited those genes.

12 hours ago, nilyank said:

What? Willow is Wylie's mother and has been in his life since Brad and Lucas invited her to be involved in knowing him. She has legally adopted him. She has loved that boy and fought for him and protected him. Nina is nothing to him in comparison to Willow is to him.

The reason Brad and Lucas invited Willow to be involved because of a lie. She was not Wylie's biological mother as Lucas thought. She married Michael as a trick to keep Nelle from having access to her son. She did legally adopt  him, in my opinion because Michael wanted her and that was the way to keep her from Chase.  Then as now, the courts are just something for Michael and Willow to manipulate to get their own way.

Opinions on Willow differ but right now, I don't have any faith in her protecting Wylie if Michael wanted to do something that hurt him.  She's not protecting Wylie right now from losing his maternal grandmother.

Nina was prevented from forming a relationship with her grandson because she didn't know who he was. And if Carly had had her way, Nina would never have known that Wylie was her grandson. Interesting how Carly was so friendly with Nina when she wanted Nina to get dirt on Nelle for the court case and soon as Nina was competition for Wylie, that door got slammed.

Had Brad and Lucas known that Nina was Wylie's biological grandmother, I don't doubt that they would have involved her in his life.

57 minutes ago, ffwbe said:

If this show ever allowed the Corinthos’ to lose, they would have Michael asked if he thought being kept away from the Qs and only hearing that same one-sided, extremely biased opinion of his father and family for his entire childhood was better for him.

Exactly.

And while we're at it, they also contributed to brain-damaged Jason being estranged from his birth family too.  Either Jason was too damaged to be able to make his own decisions or he wasn't, they can't have it both ways.

[ciarra]

Carly's twin?

[30 Helens]

16 hours ago, mostlylurking said:

22 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

If Neil never used drugs, even when he was experimenting as a kid, what exactly was he experimenting with?

I was wondering about that too! Experimenting with….what?

Various flavors of gummi bears? I think Sonny had introduced a new red hot chipotle version around that time. Hurt a bunch of kids, as I recall.

20 hours ago, KittyQ said:

People from Port Charles should always stay away from cliffs and bridges. No good ever comes of it. 

Maybe he’ll find Nelle down there.

[sacrebleu]

On the GH in my head, Chase staying with Liz at his brother's request would turn in to a steamy love triangle. Liz and Chase is an awful lot of pretty, and the show is just gonna let it go to waste so Chase and Brooklyn can act like 12 year olds. 

 

 

[Maelstrom]

2 hours ago, 30 Helens said:

Maybe he’ll find Nelle down there.

Maybe he’ll end up on the Pennsylvania side of the river, too. 🙄

[Blackie]

1 hour ago, sacrebleu said:

On the GH in my head, Chase staying with Liz at his brother's request would turn in to a steamy love triangle

 

Too bad Liz already did that with Lucky and Nicolas and now there are 3 teenage boys in the house so unlikely she could find free space, other than that I would be into it!

 

2 hours ago, statsgirl said:

They pull Lucy out for all things supernatural.

 

Thats funny since we just got to rewatch the Women's Vote episode and Lucy had some kind of woo woo candles  hahaha!

[Katy M]

1 hour ago, sacrebleu said:

On the GH in my head, Chase staying with Liz at his brother's request would turn in to a steamy love triangle.

I don't know if I can handle Liz hooking up with more brothers.  She's already had both Lucky and Nicolas, and AJ, Jason, AND Drew.  She even married her own brother's brother.

[Lugal]

17 hours ago, nilyank said:

19 hours ago, mostlylurking said:

I was wondering about that too! Experimenting with….what?

Witchcraft?

Well, Laura did talk to Aiden about some harmless teenage necromancy.

4 hours ago, CanaryFan98 said:

I never knew I needed a Lucy/Aiden ghost adventure story between them because I think personality wise they fit as buddies.

Count me in and I'll give credit to the show if they go the Liz's-house-is-haunted route instead of a DID story.

23 hours ago, TVbitch said:

And finally, WTF that they are standing two feet from a deadly cliff!

Makes you wonder why she even brought the syringe.  Seriously, don't mess with Harmony.

[Blackie]

1 hour ago, Katy M said:

AJ, Jason, AND Drew

 

Liz and AJ, I don't remember that one.

 

Ya the giant syringe is so hilarious considering it takes such a small amount of fentanyl to kill someone.

[Katy M]

5 minutes ago, Blackie said:

Liz and AJ, I don't remember that one.

I'm 90% sure I'm not making it up.

[nilyank]

24 minutes ago, Katy M said:

I'm 90% sure I'm not making it up.

It was right after AJ and Carly (played by LW) 

[30 Helens]

2 hours ago, Lugal said:

Count me in and I'll give credit to the show if they go the Liz's-house-is-haunted route instead of a DID story.

Franco’s ghost! I mean, the actor is right there. And we all know how RoHo loves to ham it up.

Hmm. On second thought, maybe not.

[Melgaypet]

2 hours ago, Katy M said:

I'm 90% sure I'm not making it up.

The refusal to do Quiz seriously is on my list of GH-related grudges.