Past Seasons: Where The Bodies Are Buried

[poeticlicensed]

I also think it bugs Caroline when Teresa declares that she and the others are only part Italian, because  in Teresa's mind unless your parents are off the boat and you still have relatives in Italy, you are not really a full blooded Italian. The cookbook thing and how Teresa used it make comments about the others really drove Caroline crazy. Plus, when Teresa gets called on something, she won't admit anything, she just denies, denies, denies, even when shown proof. For all her faults, Caroline is not dumb. It must be exasperating to be around Teresa, who is both stupid and wrapped in a cloak of denial. 

[mwell345]

 

I've been enjoying watching the reruns of past seasons.  It makes me realize how much I liked this franchise before the Gorgas joined the cast.  They totally ruined it for me just like Tamra ruined the OC for me.   I'd much rather watch Danielle and Kim G than the Gorgas.

Amen.  The Gorgas, along with Richard Wakile totally ruined what was once such a fun show to watch.   I stopped watching totally midway through last season because I just couldn't watch Joe Gorga or hear Richie's mouth one more time.  The comments he made were disgusting. 

 

I may watch again now that the Wakiles have been demoted - but I still saw Joe Gorga in the preview giving talking heads.   Why?  He has more TH's than all of the husbands on all of the other franchises combined.   They might as well just put him in a dress and showcase him at the opening as one of the HWs.

[StevieRocks]

This is how I feel, too. It is very telling that in the first seasons, everyone in the cast got the biggest kick out of Teresa and just thought, "Oh, isn't she just so funny?!" And then everything changed. I still believe that a lot of Teresa's reaction to both Melissa and Kathy was based on utter frustration and aggravation about their glomming on to Teresa's show, and quite frankly, I don't blame her for being annoyed. But Joe Gorga and Richie Wakile are just the worst--so vulgar, scheming, and gross.

[mwell345]

Yesterday Bravo re-aired the episodes about the restaurant intervention with Ashley, Jac, Chris, Ashely's father and his wife.  I was never a Jac fan but I felt really bad for her - that Ashely is one ungrateful piece of work.   It was also the episode where she was supposed to do the shirts for Lauren, and waited until the last minute.  

 

I think the reason I felt so bad for Jac is that while I don't think Nicholas was diagnosed with Autism at this point, she and Chris probably knew that he was not progressing as he should.  And on top on that, that rude, obnoxious and hateful Ashley. Ugh.

 

This is how I feel, too. It is very telling that in the first seasons, everyone in the cast got the biggest kick out of Teresa and just thought, "Oh, isn't she just so funny?!" And then everything changed. I still believe that a lot of Teresa's reaction to both Melissa and Kathy was based on utter frustration and aggravation about their glomming on to Teresa's show, and quite frankly, I don't blame her for being annoyed. But Joe Gorga and Richie Wakile are just the worst--so vulgar, scheming, and gross.

 

This may or may not be relevant, but there is a person on Twitter, Heather MacLean, who is very close to Teresa and I believe co-authored her books.  Heather was tweeting quite a bit  during "We Hate Teresa" festival last season.   She claimed that the contracts these women have with Bravo are air-tight and that when the Gorgas and Wakiles signed on, Teresa knew where it was headed, and begged Bravo to let her go, and Bravo refused. Teresa never wanted anything to do with the infighting, mostly because of her parents. 

[StevieRocks]

Yesterday Bravo re-aired the episodes about the restaurant intervention with Ashley, Jac, Chris, Ashely's father and his wife.  I was never a Jac fan but I felt really bad for her - that Ashely is one ungrateful piece of work.   It was also the episode where she was supposed to do the shirts for Lauren, and waited until the last minute.  

 

I think the reason I felt so bad for Jac is that while I don't think Nicholas was diagnosed with Autism at this point, she and Chris probably knew that he was not progressing as he should.  And on top on that, that rude, obnoxious and hateful Ashley. Ugh.

 

This may or may not be relevant, but there is a person on Twitter, Heather MacLean, who is very close to Teresa and I believe co-authored her books.  Heather was tweeting quite a bit  during "We Hate Teresa" festival last season.   She claimed that the contracts these women have with Bravo are air-tight and that when the Gorgas and Wakiles signed on, Teresa knew where it was headed, and begged Bravo to let her go, and Bravo refused. Teresa never wanted anything to do with the infighting, mostly because of her parents. 

Wow. I don't know why, but I always had the impression that Teresa was very resistant to all the in-fighting, but it appeared that the others just pushed and pushed and refused to relent. I guess it was the primary stipulation of their contracts. How revolting. We all have family members with whom we have differences, but I don't know many people who would agree to something so heinous--but then, I don't know a bunch of famewhores--thank goodness.

[movingtargetgal]

 

This is how I feel, too. It is very telling that in the first seasons, everyone in the cast got the biggest kick out of Teresa and just thought, "Oh, isn't she just so funny?!" And then everything changed. I still believe that a lot of Teresa's reaction to both Melissa and Kathy was based on utter frustration and aggravation about their glomming on to Teresa's show, and quite frankly, I don't blame her for being annoyed. But Joe Gorga and Richie Wakile are just the worst--so vulgar, scheming, and gross.

 

Melissa admitted to feeding information about Teresa to Danielle.   Danielle is a dangerous kind of crazy and if my sister-in-law worked against me with her I would NEVER forgive her for potentially endangering my family in order to push her way onto a TV show.

 

As far as Caroline and Jacqueline turning on Teresa, I think it is a case of jealousy.   Caroline saw her and her family (Dina, Jacqueline, the husbands and kids) as the stars of the show with Teresa being a supporting player. They viewed Teresa as being their comic relief.  But Teresa became the breakout star and Caroline and Co. resents Teresa because of it. 

 

 

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[motorcitymom65]

 

This may or may not be relevant, but there is a person on Twitter, Heather MacLean, who is very close to Teresa and I believe co-authored her books.  Heather was tweeting quite a bit  during "We Hate Teresa" festival last season.   She claimed that the contracts these women have with Bravo are air-tight and that when the Gorgas and Wakiles signed on, Teresa knew where it was headed, and begged Bravo to let her go, and Bravo refused. Teresa never wanted anything to do with the infighting, mostly because of her parents. 

I have read those tweets from Heather, but I never believed them. Oh, I do believe that Teresa had a contract she probably could not get out of, but I don't believe she tried. What would she have done? This was around the same time she was getting the news that the BR judge had ruled there was fraud in their filing, and she was on the hook to the tune of around $10 million.  How would she have paid any of it off (not that she tried to pay down her debt even with her salary from Bravo) without the show? There would have been no more cookbooks if she wasn't on the show anymore, no crappy wine to sell. 

 

The one thing everyone seems to agree on with Teresa is that she is competitive. She has said it and those around her have said it. I don't think she would have walked away and let Melissa and Kathy have "her" show anymore than I think she was unaware of the illegal dealings going on under her roof. If they had been on the show first, she would be been scratching and clawing to get on. 

Edited July 9, 2014 by motorcitymom65

[poeticlicensed]

I don't believe for a second that Teresa wanted out of her contract. It became abundantly clear several seasons back that the Bravo money was the only money coming in, and Teresa would do anything to generate more income. The first cookbook might have been a fun project, the subsequent ones, along with the bellini drinks and the haircare lines were all attempts to generate income. That's why we saw Teresa attending any public event she was invited to. Since Joe's house of cards collapsed and Teresa has no marketable skills, Bravo is their best bet. I also firmly believe the Bravo money is behind Joe Gui taking a more active role in filming. If you look at the first couple of seasons, although Tre talked about him all the time, he barely had any camera time and acted like the whole series was stupid. Once the bottom fell out financially, suddenly he was willing to be filmed in the bathtub, in bed, whatever keeps the money flowing

[FozzyBear]

I don't believe for a second that Teresa wanted out of her contract. It became abundantly clear several seasons back that the Bravo money was the only money coming in, and Teresa would do anything to generate more income. The first cookbook might have been a fun project, the subsequent ones, along with the bellini drinks and the haircare lines were all attempts to generate income. That's why we saw Teresa attending any public event she was invited to. Since Joe's house of cards collapsed and Teresa has no marketable skills, Bravo is their best bet. I also firmly believe the Bravo money is behind Joe Gui taking a more active role in filming. If you look at the first couple of seasons, although Tre talked about him all the time, he barely had any camera time and acted like the whole series was stupid. Once the bottom fell out financially, suddenly he was willing to be filmed in the bathtub, in bed, whatever keeps the money flowing

Co-sign. I also always wondered if their lawyer was hoping they could avoid jail time by arguing they needed to be available to film the show so they could make restitution.

Does anyone know why Jaq is leaving the show? Caroline got her own show. But why is Jaq gone? Quit or fired?

[Almost 3000]

Definitely fired.

[motorcitymom65]

Co-sign. I also always wondered if their lawyer was hoping they could avoid jail time by arguing they needed to be available to film the show so they could make restitution.

Does anyone know why Jaq is leaving the show? Caroline got her own show. But why is Jaq gone? Quit or fired?

I read an interview the other day where she said she quit. I tend to believe this because she is apparently on Caroline's new show.  Kathy admitted that she wasn't asked back in a FT capacity, so stepping down wasn't her choice. 

[Jennifersdc]

I call total bullshit on the "contract" too. Though I think it's funny Teresa has a mouthpiece to speak for her. Never been on Twitter myself. Instead of Tweets my husband calls them Twats (sorry if offends but we're proud South Park fans).

One - I don't think these "multi-year" contracts exist, although I can believe a non-compete clause. Two - Dina "No More Drama" Manzo (nice try honey seeing you're back for more) pretty much debunked that before when she quit halfway through Season Two. Three - I think Teresa loves being a "star" (double quotes on that). Four - Teresa has been known to lie (see BK filing).

Edited July 10, 2014 by Jennifersdc

[tulip555]

Co-sign. I also always wondered if their lawyer was hoping they could avoid jail time by arguing they needed to be available to film the show so they could make restitution.

Does anyone know why Jaq is leaving the show? Caroline got her own show. But why is Jaq gone? Quit or fired?

what kind of show has Caroline gotten?....another one with those idiot kids of hers or is it the same one? I can't figure out why Bravo thinks this family is that interesting or "charming"

Edited July 10, 2014 by tulip555

[shoegal]

Add me to the list of those who don't believe for one second that Teresa "begged" to be let out of her contract because she just didn't want to subject her parents to all the fighting.  I suspect what happened is that when Teresa found out that Melissa and Kathy were joining the cast, she threatened to quit in a them-or-me kind of thing and Bravo didn't play along.  I know Teresa claimed that she didn't want any of the fighting because of her parents, but that sure as hell didn't stop her from jumping in with both feet and getting down and dirty with the fighting, did it?  I think what Teresa really didn't want is for Kathy and Melissa to have anyone on "their side" and she is all about image, so she wanted to maintain the façade of a wonderful Italian family that is happy and all about love, love, love. 

[StevieRocks]

what kind of show has Caroline gotten?....another one with those idiot kids of hers or is it the same one? I can't figure out why Bravo thinks this family is that interesting or "charming"

Honestly! That family is revolting. In watching the other seasons, I see a loveliness to Teresa's family--I know they had a reversal of fortune that was mostly free will, but also a little fate--like all reversals, but I saw Teresa's family as newly immigrated people who struggled to find their way and made a LOT of mistakes. Caroline's 'fambly' of nitwits are a bunch of entitled, shiftless losers--with the exception of Christopher, whom I believe would be the real 'golden child' in this brood of morons if everyone would take the head out of Albie's useless behind. Unlike many, I NEVER saw the appeal of Albie. Christopher has outshone him on a number of occasions. 

Edited July 10, 2014 by StevieRocks

[shoegal]

While I truly believe the Manzo's are the biggest fans of the Manzo's, I do believe the Manzo's are head and shoulders above the Giudice's.  While the Manzo children might be a tad spoiled and/or unmotivated, at least the Manzo family was built on a legitimate business/source of income and some real hard work (although mostly by Al, but it seems the kids were working, too, until the promise if Bravo easy money came into the picture).  The Giudice family is the family I consider to be a bunch of entitled, shiftless losers, with Joe and Teresa being Thing 1 and Thing 2 in that scenario.  I believe that Teresa felt she and her "four beautiful daughters" were entitled a marble and onyx, fur and diamond covered designer lifestyle and her shiftless, loser husband figured out it was easier to scam and steal than actually work.  Teresa has no moral center that doesn't involve a dollar sign, and she went along with it to acquire her shiny, tacky, Juicy Couture filled life.  They are truly useless people.  I don't see a reversal of fortune, I see a couple of criminals facing the fact that the jig is up.

Edited July 10, 2014 by shoegal

[LuckyBitch]

Caroline and her family are.just.not.interesting. Period. That's why it's boring to watch them. Caroline is so blinded by her love of her children it is impossible for her to see their shortcomings. I felt for her with Albie and law school, but it wasn't the school's fault. I used to work in a law school and at orientation, the dean would tell all the students to look to the person to the left and to the right. One of you three won't be here in a year. And he was right. Law school is incredibly rigorous WRT reading and more reading. If a kid struggles with reading, law school might not be the best fit. That doesn't mean it's the fault of the school if a student can't hack it. I always felt that there were so many missed opportunities for life lessons with those kids. People just got tired of Caroline and her oohing and aahing every time they took a dump. 

 

I was going to bring that up last week when I read the Albie law school discussion. That's a pretty standard line and has been for a very long time. The dean said the same exact thing during first year orientation on my first day of law school over twenty years ago. In my case, the person to my left ended up dropping out, but thankfully the person to my right ended up being my best friend and we never would have made it through without each other.

 

As far as reading, I can't imagine having issues with that and even attempting law school. I'm a very fast reader, but the amount of material you need to read and absorb every night is unbelievable. Many hours, late into the night. 

Edited July 10, 2014 by LuckyBitch

[FozzyBear]

I never really minded the Manzo kids. I didn't think they were spectacular humans, but I don't know that I've ever had that thought about any Bravolebrity. They seemed like decent kids with a few issues. When we met them they were what? 23, 22, and 20. Or close to that. 1 had graduated from Fordham (for some reason I thought he did his undergrad at Rutgers too, but Fordham is mentioned in S3). Lauren and Christopher were working in the family business. I don't remember any really significant amount of time going by when they weren't trying to do something outside of being a reality star (businesses, school, other jobs). Compare that to any of the OC kids or even Ashley on NJ. I'm not saying I loved them, but I didn't hate them. Except for maybe Lauren a few times when she was trying so hard to become the next housewife.

[badbolocolo]

The more I think of the ungodly mess Dina made of Caroline's home in the name of "decorating it" the more of a heel I think Dina is for the way she treats her family and sides with Teresa.  In my book, birds of a feather!

 

ETA: Caroline and Jacq seem to be the only two housewives who didn't spend outrageously, not even in the first season.  Danielle was broke, by her own admission, and couldn't spend wildly.  Dina and Teresa seemed to love to spend or talk about spending.  Dina's phony househunt? Sheesh.  Teresa's unlimited spending?  Pathetic.

Edited July 10, 2014 by badbolocolo

[movingtargetgal]

 

While I truly believe the Manzo's are the biggest fans of the Manzo's, I do believe the Manzo's are head and shoulders above the Giudice's.  While the Manzo children might be a tad spoiled and/or unmotivated, at least the Manzo family was built on a legitimate business/source of income and some real hard work (although mostly by Al, but it seems the kids were working, too, until the promise if Bravo easy money came into the picture).

 

 

The Manzos business dealings have not always been legitimate.  There are numerous reports that Albert's father Tiny Manzo was connected to and an enforcer for the Gambino mob family.  He was murdered and found naked in the trunk of his car allegedly for skimming from one of their casinos..  Albert defrauded the people of NJ when he lied about his place of residence to obtain an appointment to Water Commissioner, which he was paid about $7000 a year, not a lot of money but the job came with state benefits including a pension.  Albert and Caroline are also best friends with Bernie Kerik.  Kerik was the NYC police commissioner who went to federal prison for fraud and was also alleged to have mob connections.  If you google Tiny Manzo, Albert Manzo fraud, and Bernie Kerik it will be an interesting read. 

[shoegal]

The Manzos business dealings have not always been legitimate.  There are numerous reports that Albert's father Tiny Manzo was connected to and an enforcer for the Gambino mob family.  He was murdered and found naked in the trunk of his car allegedly for skimming from one of their casinos..  Albert defrauded the people of NJ when he lied about his place of residence to obtain an appointment to Water Commissioner, which he was paid about $7000 a year, not a lot of money but the job came with state benefits including a pension.  Albert and Caroline are also best friends with Bernie Kerik.  Kerik was the NYC police commissioner who went to federal prison for fraud and was also alleged to have mob connections.  If you google Tiny Manzo, Albert Manzo fraud, and Bernie Kerik it will be an interesting read. 

 

I don't hold Albert accountable for what his father did (or didn't do, I don't know that the reason he was killed has ever been proven or alleged, only that it was a mob hit....nor do I want to play six degrees of Kevin Bacon and hold him accountable for what his friend Bernie Kerik did), I don't believe that Al has been anything but hard working and on the up and up with the Brownstone, when his dad died, Al stepped up and I believe that he has worked hard and built a legitimate business.  As far as the water commission thing, in the end Al was vindicated in that area, he did not lie or cheat, he actually did have residence at the Brownstone and that was known at the beginning.  He did not defraud anyone.  Here is the info on that:  http://www.northjersey.com/news/politics/documents-show-ousted-water-commissioner-had-valid-paterson-address-1.470451

Edited July 10, 2014 by shoegal

[LuckyBitch]

Interesting article about the water commission situation. I had no idea about any of that. Why on earth would Albert want to be water commissioner when he was supposedly so busy with The Brownstone? That article says he and Caroline got medical benefits from the commission, so I guess it's that. Plus, the pension. What a joke, as if they don't have enough money between the business and the show.

Edited July 10, 2014 by LuckyBitch

[badbolocolo]

I don't believe for a second that Teresa wanted out of her contract. It became abundantly clear several seasons back that the Bravo money was the only money coming in, and Teresa would do anything to generate more income. The first cookbook might have been a fun project, the subsequent ones, along with the bellini drinks and the haircare lines were all attempts to generate income. That's why we saw Teresa attending any public event she was invited to. Since Joe's house of cards collapsed and Teresa has no marketable skills, Bravo is their best bet. I also firmly believe the Bravo money is behind Joe Gui taking a more active role in filming. If you look at the first couple of seasons, although Tre talked about him all the time, he barely had any camera time and acted like the whole series was stupid. Once the bottom fell out financially, suddenly he was willing to be filmed in the bathtub, in bed, whatever keeps the money flowing

 

I agree.  Teresa wold never walk away from this show and if she wanted to avoid conflict, she could have easily done it by making peace with her family off camera and moving on.  Teresa gave worse than she got, IMO.  She found a way to be confrontation and dishonest with everyone around her.  I think Teresa does a good job of trying to paint herself innocent of something.  I just don't buy it given her actions.

[FozzyBear]

I'm starting in S4. Mother of God, Ashley looks awful! She looks bloated and her skin is bad and the blond dye job and puffed up lips makes her look like Lindsay Lohan after a bender. I think she was getting involved in some hard drugs.

Jaq is still an asshole. Sitting there playing with Nicholas, signing in a baby voice "make the right choice!" as they kick her out. God, could you possibly hate your first born more? Or be less sincere in your desire to help her?

[StevieRocks]

I'm starting in S4. Mother of God, Ashley looks awful! She looks bloated and her skin is bad and the blond dye job and puffed up lips makes her look like Lindsay Lohan after a bender. I think she was getting involved in some hard drugs.

Jaq is still an asshole. Sitting there playing with Nicholas, signing in a baby voice "make the right choice!" as they kick her out. God, could you possibly hate your first born more? Or be less sincere in your desire to help her?

It is reprehensible, and it totally reads as, "Get out of here, so I can have my new life with my new husband and family." I may be overly sensitive to it because my mom married my dad, (not my biological father) when I was five, and I was totally accepted into the family. We weren't even allowed to say the words, 'stepfather' or 'stepchild' in our house. I realize it's different since Ashley's father is in the picture, but it is very clear that Ashley is in no way a member of this "fambly." Even dingbat Albie seemed extremely condescending and insensitive. And when Chris was talking about plane crashes on the way to the airport? Who does that? I know they are fed up with Ashley--but that's imbecile Jaq's fault for not knocking her teeth down her throat the FIRST, (second, and third) time Ashley acted disrespectfully. As dreadful as Ashley is, her 'fambly' members look even worse. And then Jaq with all that elated "Bye bye! Bye bye!" What a hateful old, IMMATURE shrew.

[tulip555]

Honestly! That family is revolting. In watching the other seasons, I see a loveliness to Teresa's family--I know they had a reversal of fortune that was mostly free will, but also a little fate--like all reversals, but I saw Teresa's family as newly immigrated people who struggled to find their way and made a LOT of mistakes. Caroline's 'fambly' of nitwits are a bunch of entitled, shiftless losers--with the exception of Christopher, whom I believe would be the real 'golden child' in this brood of morons if everyone would take the head out of Albie's useless behind. Unlike many, I NEVER saw the appeal of Albie. Christopher has outshone him on a number of occasions. 

Yep, and I agree about Christopher; he appears to be more understated and deliberate in his comments and actions....and maybe just a tad embarrassed by the others....not sure, but I do detect something in his manner. 

While I truly believe the Manzo's are the biggest fans of the Manzo's, I do believe the Manzo's are head and shoulders above the Giudice's.  While the Manzo children might be a tad spoiled and/or unmotivated, at least the Manzo family was built on a legitimate business/source of income and some real hard work (although mostly by Al, but it seems the kids were working, too, until the promise if Bravo easy money came into the picture).  The Giudice family is the family I consider to be a bunch of entitled, shiftless losers, with Joe and Teresa being Thing 1 and Thing 2 in that scenario.  I believe that Teresa felt she and her "four beautiful daughters" were entitled a marble and onyx, fur and diamond covered designer lifestyle and her shiftless, loser husband figured out it was easier to scam and steal than actually work.  Teresa has no moral center that doesn't involve a dollar sign, and she went along with it to acquire her shiny, tacky, Juicy Couture filled life.  They are truly useless people.  I don't see a reversal of fortune, I see a couple of criminals facing the fact that the jig is up.

Good points

I never really minded the Manzo kids. I didn't think they were spectacular humans, but I don't know that I've ever had that thought about any Bravolebrity. They seemed like decent kids with a few issues. When we met them they were what? 23, 22, and 20. Or close to that. 1 had graduated from Fordham (for some reason I thought he did his undergrad at Rutgers too, but Fordham is mentioned in S3). Lauren and Christopher were working in the family business. I don't remember any really significant amount of time going by when they weren't trying to do something outside of being a reality star (businesses, school, other jobs). Compare that to any of the OC kids or even Ashley on NJ. I'm not saying I loved them, but I didn't hate them. Except for maybe Lauren a few times when she was trying so hard to become the next housewife.

I just get the impression that they believe they are superior to the others, and while they certainly are to the Guidices, in many ways, they

have made fun of them, and that, to me, is not acceptable behavior. 

[tulip555]

The Manzos business dealings have not always been legitimate.  There are numerous reports that Albert's father Tiny Manzo was connected to and an enforcer for the Gambino mob family.  He was murdered and found naked in the trunk of his car allegedly for skimming from one of their casinos..  Albert defrauded the people of NJ when he lied about his place of residence to obtain an appointment to Water Commissioner, which he was paid about $7000 a year, not a lot of money but the job came with state benefits including a pension.  Albert and Caroline are also best friends with Bernie Kerik.  Kerik was the NYC police commissioner who went to federal prison for fraud and was also alleged to have mob connections.  If you google Tiny Manzo, Albert Manzo fraud, and Bernie Kerik it will be an interesting read. 

It certainly is an interesting read....especially Tiny Manzo

[FozzyBear]

Yep, and I agree about Christopher; he appears to be more understated and deliberate in his comments and actions....and maybe just a tad embarrassed by the others....not sure, but I do detect something in his manner.

Good points

I just get the impression that they believe they are superior to the others, and while they certainly are to the Guidices, in many ways, they

have made fun of them, and that, to me, is not acceptable behavior.

That is really true. I'm on S4 now and...yeah. They're starting to bug. I only watched S4 and S5 sporadically (TM Clueless) so most of my previous impression came from S1-3 went they seemed ok. By S4, Lordy they think highly of themselves. And what the fuckity, fuck happened with Lauren's business? She opened it and didn't feel like she was getting the respect she deserved so she closed it the next day? What. The. Fuck. What does that even mean? Plus I hate the overuse of "respect". When did everyone wake up and decide they needed ass kissing just for existing? The whole Manzo clan takes a turn for the very bad in S4, but Lauren is out of control. She pouts in every scene for no reason and is so desperate to insert herself in the drama. I really think she thought she would get offers a spot as a Housewife and was becoming increasingly pissy as the seasons went by and it never happened.

[tulip555]

That is really true. I'm on S4 now and...yeah. They're starting to bug. I only watched S4 and S5 sporadically (TM Clueless) so most of my previous impression came from S1-3 went they seemed ok. By S4, Lordy they think highly of themselves. And what the fuckity, fuck happened with Lauren's business? She opened it and didn't feel like she was getting the respect she deserved so she closed it the next day? What. The. Fuck. What does that even mean? Plus I hate the overuse of "respect". When did everyone wake up and decide they needed ass kissing just for existing? The whole Manzo clan takes a turn for the very bad in S4, but Lauren is out of control. She pouts in every scene for no reason and is so desperate to insert herself in the drama. I really think she thought she would get offers a spot as a Housewife and was becoming increasingly pissy as the seasons went by and it never happened.

YES, YES, YES

[Midnight Cheese]

I watched a little of whatever season is leading to tonight's premiere (season 4?  Trip to Arizona where everyone has to harass a poor horse and scrape dung out of his hoof?).  The Giudices are awful, the Manzos are worthless, Jacqueline Laurita is an affront to all parents, but....the Wakile family shkeevs me so much.  I can't even watch or hear Richie, Rosie seems to have delays or serious emotional issues or both, and Kathy is so desperado panting thirsty for attention.  I can't stand them!

[Abmis]

I can't stand the Wakiles either.   I gag every time the I see Kathy running her gloved hands through her hair at Dylan's Candy Bar.  If she doesn't know any better than that she has no business handling food.  Her hair must have been full of cannoli filling by the end of the day and the cannoli must have been covered with hair. I can understand why she wouldn't want to wear a hairnet in public, but she could have tied her hair back or at least worn a cute headband to keep it from falling forward.  She's supposed to be a hair stylist so she should have been able to come up with an attractive way to keep her hair back.  

[tulip555]

I watched a little of whatever season is leading to tonight's premiere (season 4?  Trip to Arizona where everyone has to harass a poor horse and scrape dung out of his hoof?).  The Giudices are awful, the Manzos are worthless, Jacqueline Laurita is an affront to all parents, but....the Wakile family shkeevs me so much.  I can't even watch or hear Richie, Rosie seems to have delays or serious emotional issues or both, and Kathy is so desperado panting thirsty for attention.  I can't stand them!

I agree...and I think Rosie has a drinking problem

I can't stand the Wakiles either.   I gag every time the I see Kathy running her gloved hands through her hair at Dylan's Candy Bar.  If she doesn't know any better than that she has no business handling food.  Her hair must have been full of cannoli filling by the end of the day and the cannoli must have been covered with hair. I can understand why she wouldn't want to wear a hairnet in public, but she could have tied her hair back or at least worn a cute headband to keep it from falling forward.  She's supposed to be a hair stylist so she should have been able to come up with an attractive way to keep her hair back.  

Yeah, rather disgusting

[Emme]

Hmmm.. Meant to quote Fozzybear's earlier post...

I couldn't stand Danielle, but her girls were so pretty. The older one was just model gorgeous, and the younger one so cute with her big eyes and freckles. They seemed amazingly well-adjusted for having such a batshit crazy mother (Gucci model anyone?).

Edited July 14, 2014 by Emme

[Satchels of gold]

I also think it bugs Caroline when Teresa declares that she and the others are only part Italian, because  in Teresa's mind unless your parents are off the boat and you still have relatives in Italy, you are not really a full blooded Italian. The cookbook thing and how Teresa used it make comments about the others really drove Caroline crazy. Plus, when Teresa gets called on something, she won't admit anything, she just denies, denies, denies, even when shown proof. For all her faults, Caroline is not dumb. It must be exasperating to be around Teresa, who is both stupid and wrapped in a cloak of denial.

Caroline should be a politician . On the reunion shows she NEVER answers anything she doesn't want to answer. For example ( paraphrasing here)

Andy: viewers were concerned when Al spoke so harshly to you, is everything ok?

Caroline: do I look like the kind of woman who would put up with abuse?

And then

Andy: you talked about Al possible being un faithful after these years, are you saying he has cheated?

Caroline: oh yes Andy he's introduced me to all his baby mommas.

As a person who is an over explainer I admire that. On paper Caroline is everything I don't want in a friend. She's suspicious ( I don't like you before I like you), too wrapped up in her children, bossy and a know it all. But damn if I don't like her. She's the kind of friend that if you left your husband she would take you in, feed you , and arrange for someone to break your husbands legs. I like that in a gal!

[ButterQueen]

I'm watching the Punta Cana reruns. I laughed hysterically at Caroline's headache during Teresa's bathing suit fashion show. God Teresa is so immature.

[StatisticalOutlier]

Thank you...Punta Cana; I never remember the name, lol

 

"Punta Cana" always sounds like a vulgar slur to me, like "Get away from me, you punta cana."  Having these clowns vacation there doesn't help.

 

I used to work in a law school and at orientation, the dean would tell all the students to look to the person to the left and to the right. One of you three won't be here in a year. And he was right.

 

I was going to bring that up last week when I read the Albie law school discussion. That's a pretty standard line and has been for a very long time. The dean said the same exact thing during first year orientation on my first day of law school over twenty years ago. In my case, the person to my left ended up dropping out,

 

I went to law school in the 1980s.  Maybe a top 10 school; definitely top 15.  We didn't have an orientation, but it was generally known that 1 person out of each section of 100 students wouldn't make it past the first year, and that's pretty much how it worked out. 

 

Too bad Albie didn't go there--Caroline could have soothed his ego by pointing out that he was one of the one-percent.

[motorcitymom65]

I'm watching the Punta Cana reruns. I laughed hysterically at Caroline's headache during Teresa's bathing suit fashion show. God Teresa is so immature.

One of the all-time great scenes in this franchise. Teresa's narcissism was on display at it's fullest. Here she was with a bunch of gals - who all had body issues to one degree or another - and she is flaunting her cute body first thing in the morning.  Before some of them had even eaten or even brushed their teeth. It was just priceless how without a clue she was to the fact that others would not be interested in helping her plan her beach attire for the day. The look on Caroline's face said it all. If memory serves, Greg had the greatest line: "I bet Melissa's bathing suit is going to be awesome". Yea, it was all about Teresa's need to look sexier than her brother's wife. Sick. Beyond sick. 

[tulip555]

One of the all-time great scenes in this franchise. Teresa's narcissism was on display at it's fullest. Here she was with a bunch of gals - who all had body issues to one degree or another - and she is flaunting her cute body first thing in the morning.  Before some of them had even eaten or even brushed their teeth. It was just priceless how without a clue she was to the fact that others would not be interested in helping her plan her beach attire for the day. The look on Caroline's face said it all. If memory serves, Greg had the greatest line: "I bet Melissa's bathing suit is going to be awesome". Yea, it was all about Teresa's need to look sexier than her brother's wife. Sick. Beyond sick. 

I agree.  But it also reminded me of how little girls like to model new clothes they particularly like....IMO, childlike. behavior.

[Carolyn15]

There will be a story about Danielle on Oprah's Where Are They Now this Sunday. It is on the OWN network. Sorry not sure of the time.. 

[LuckyBitch]

I'm going to start my own show: Does Anyone Give a Crap Where They Are Now?

 

 

ETA:  @Carolyn15, just in case, I just want to clarify that my comment was in no way directed toward you. It was directed at Oprah, (can't stand her, her network, or her shows), but mostly toward Danielle, who I really despised and try not to think about anymore.

Edited August 9, 2014 by LuckyBitch

[zoeysmom]

Yesterday Bravo re-aired the episodes about the restaurant intervention with Ashley, Jac, Chris, Ashely's father and his wife.  I was never a Jac fan but I felt really bad for her - that Ashely is one ungrateful piece of work.   It was also the episode where she was supposed to do the shirts for Lauren, and waited until the last minute.  

 

I think the reason I felt so bad for Jac is that while I don't think Nicholas was diagnosed with Autism at this point, she and Chris probably knew that he was not progressing as he should.  And on top on that, that rude, obnoxious and hateful Ashley. Ugh.

 

This may or may not be relevant, but there is a person on Twitter, Heather MacLean, who is very close to Teresa and I believe co-authored her books.  Heather was tweeting quite a bit  during "We Hate Teresa" festival last season.   She claimed that the contracts these women have with Bravo are air-tight and that when the Gorgas and Wakiles signed on, Teresa knew where it was headed, and begged Bravo to let her go, and Bravo refused. Teresa never wanted anything to do with the infighting, mostly because of her parents. 

Dina seemed to waltz out of her contract.  Andy said Teresa signed her contract after the Gorgas and Wakiles so I call BS on Teresa's hired mouthpiece.

 

Nothing forced Teresa to act like an ass.  She could have reached out instead of continually attacking her family-granted her brother is a bit of a dipstick but Kathy really did nothing wrong.  It really isn't Teresa's show.

[Carolyn15]

I'm going to start my own show: Does Anyone Give a Crap Where They Are Now?

 

 

ETA:  @Carolyn15, just in case, I just want to clarify that my comment was in no way directed toward you. It was directed at Oprah, (can't stand her, her network, or her shows), but mostly toward Danielle, who I really despised and try not to think about anymore.

No worries LB- I am not a huge fan of the O nation myself.. I did watch the Danielle story. OMG she looks like she had a ton and half of work-very plastic. It looks like she had a bodyguard at her Daughters Sweet 16. She is just a flipping joke.   

[LuckyBitch]

LOL, @Carolyn15 now you're making me sorry that I didn't watch it.

 

Danielle looked plastic before. I can't even imagine more work on her. Where the hell does her money come from these days? Does she still live in that house, or did she sell it? I haven't followed her in years. Damn it, I guess I should have watched it after all, ha ha.

[LilaFowler]

Is Danielle's oldest daughter still modeling?  I thought she was very beautiful.

[leisawoo]

This is from Enty so take it with a grain of "saawlt". I kinda think it could be true just cuz....

ENTERTAINMENT LAWYER 08/10 **#8**
This C+ list celebrity who is a former reality star hooked up with the boyfriend of one of her daughters. He dumped the daughter for the mom who thinks he is cute but she is more into the men who can give her a good life. Danielle Staub "Real Housewives of New Jersey"

 

I see mods reprimanding awwwllll over the board (lol can't stop with my southern drawl,  Jersey ripoff accent) so if this is the wrong place for this, lo siento. I'm kinda new at posting, veteran reader though :)

[Persnickety1]

Okay, I just posted this link in the Guidice Trial thread but it's far more encompassing than the Guidices.

 

I don't know how many posters here might have seen this but it is without a doubt the most revealing expose into this gang of fraudulent thieves I've ever read.  ALL of them, Guidices, Gorgas, Lauritas, Manzos...I'm gobsmacked.

 

For anyone who didn't see this when it was originally published, here ya go...It's a LONG read but totally worth it.  Grab your drink and dive in...CHEERS!

 

http://friendlydish.com/2013/07/26/shocking-real-housewives-of-new-jersey-expose-all-is-revealed-explained/#comments

 

(ETA:  Just to clarify I don't know that everything in this expose is true, maybe it's not...but it certainly does explain a lot about various people on the show and their situations).

Edited October 4, 2014 by Persnickety1

[sunflowers83823]

Caroline should be a politician . On the reunion shows she NEVER answers anything she doesn't want to answer. For example ( paraphrasing here)

Andy: viewers were concerned when Al spoke so harshly to you, is everything ok?

Caroline: do I look like the kind of woman who would put up with abuse?

And then

Andy: you talked about Al possible being un faithful after these years, are you saying he has cheated?

Caroline: oh yes Andy he's introduced me to all his baby mommas.

As a person who is an over explainer I admire that. On paper Caroline is everything I don't want in a friend. She's suspicious ( I don't like you before I like you), too wrapped up in her children, bossy and a know it all. But damn if I don't like her. She's the kind of friend that if you left your husband she would take you in, feed you , and arrange for someone to break your husbands legs. I like that in a gal!

I am right there with you. I would much rather hang with someone who is a little overly attached to their family than with someone who screams at their family at a kid's christening no less...I am looking at you Gorga/Guidices...I don't necessarily WANT to be a Caroline fan, but to me she is the most genuine person out if this bunch of crazies.

[archer1267]

I watched the first three seasons when they aired, and have been re-watching Seasons 1 and 2. I agree that things really went downhill once Teresa's family joined the cast, and the christening became something out of a Russian novel with Joe Gorgon wailing "you're my fucking FATHER" at his dad. (Why? I don't remember.) I remember liking the NJ franchise because these women seemed more down to earth, and their interactions with their kids seemed genuine and not staged. I remember liking Teresa and Joe and thinking that even if they weren't the brightest bulbs, they'd probably be fun to hang out with. And it's kind of poignant to see Joe showing Teresa the pizza parlor and joking around about they'd live above it in an apartment if they got kicked out of their house. I always got the vibe that Joe would have been happier with a much simpler life. 

 

I couldn't help but wonder, though, what the show would have been like without Danielle. Yeah, she added the drama, but in S2 it just became ridiculous. The women wanted nothing to do with her and it was disturbing to watch Danielle create this fantasy of how the Manzos wanted her dead, to the point where she needed bodyguards and "protection" and self-defense classes (because Jackie or Caroline was apparently going to accost her in the bathroom of the Brownstone or wherever). I felt sorry for her daughters, thinking that they must suspect how delusional Mom is, but didn't want to say anything to set her off. In S2 it really did seem like Danielle was in a different show entirely - like she was auditioning for an episode of a Sopranos knock-off, referring to herself as a matriarch, the heavy "you disrespected me and there are consequences" statements, and hanging with a former con. I felt a little badly for Danielle in S1 - I figured she was socially awkward and just wanted to be accepted, and the other women were being cliquey - but that all dissipated in S2. Everything became a diss to Danielle. Posche's sales associate was on the phone when Danielle walked in? Diss. And Kim D put the woman up to it (wait, what?). 

 

I do think it's funny that Danielle's mocked Dina's return to the show, saying that she now "has to" since she doesn't have a husband or career. What is it exactly that Danielle does for work?

[Angelsmom1009]

So thanks to the snowstorm that never was in Northern NJ area where I live, I actually sat down and re-watched the first two seasons of the NJ housewives, and some of season 3. I forgot how much I enjoyed them the first two seasons. They just seemed like normal, upper middle class women, in normal high end but attainable(i.e. Nordstrom's) clothes and natural makeup, living financially comfortable lives. Not super rich, but not poor either. Especially now that I'm relatively new to the area, and want to check out the restaurants and venues that they go to on the show. A lot of places they went to are closed now, but the places where the "major" shit happened are still open. Like the restaurant Lunello's, where the infamous table flip happened. 

 

Danielle..I agree that the show took a dark turn during/after season 2, and it turning into The Ho-wives vs Danielle. However in hindsight, seeing how Jac and Ashley and Dina have acted on the past couple of seasons, their tweets, and all of the pettiness that they spew, it's not that far fetched that they were harassing her a la Mean Girls. Not at the level that she created in her head mind you, but when you are tickey-boom boom (™ Wendy Williams) like Danielle, it's pretty expected that she blew it up bigger than what it was. Whether she quit or she was fired, leaving that show was the best for her, because clearly she was not mentally stable enough to handle the drama, manufactured or not. She told Oprah that she was contemplating suicide after she left the show, but she didn't want that to be the last memory her daughters had of her. Someone asked upthread if she ever sold her house; I looked it up because I floved her house (I'm a sucker for a turret), despite that it clearly hadn't been updated since the 90s. From what I read she actually surrendered it back to her ex-husband and it sold this year for $700,000. She lives in the West New York/Union City area now (a friend of mine who lives there has seen her in the park on Bergenline that runs next to the river), and I have no idea what she does for money cause that area is more expensive (it's super close to Manhattan), than where she used to live in Wayne. Maybe she finally got that settlement.

 

The Guidices…oh, how the mighty have fallen. Watching the adorable airheadedness of Teresa and the fuggedabouditness of Juicy Joe and all of their opulence, and to now know what was going on behind the scenes…I really don't understand why they even agreed to do this show. I really, truly believe that they didn't think they were going to get caught, and all of their scandal started out like any other financial crime…small and easy. A forged signature here, a stolen credit card there. If they had just stayed relatively modest, they probably would have gotten away with it. But they got greedy and it caught up with them. I also believe Teresa knew more than what she let on, but not that much. 

 

Jac and Ashley/Ashlee…I tell you, I've never seen such a dysfunctional mother/daughter relationship play out on reality TV before. And in hindsight…yeah, Ashley is a spoiled lazy brat, but most teenage girls are. Jac handled it all wrong, and honestly, you can't parent an 18 year old, if you never parented them before. Molding discipline and respect with your kids starts young, not when they are a teenager. And I totally believe that she wanted Ashlee to disappear and be someone else's responsibility while she lived her "new life" with Chris and the boys. Conversely, I think Ashley was the only one who really had her mother's number, saw her exactly for the immature brat that she was, and had no issue calling her out on it on numerous occasions. Messy all around.

 

Dina…I haven't watched the recent seasons with Dina, but I did recently see that "My Big Fat Fabulous Wedding" she did with her  (ex?)husband. Because of that, I don't buy "bad bitch, no drama tolerated"  persona she tried to put across in Seasons 1 and 2. It was uncomfortable to watch, because he was such an ass to her throughout the entire episode, and she just took it timidly and through tears. And why the hell would you want to marry someone who was an admitted serial cheater? He was just a douche. And it's just sickening how much money was spent on that sham wedding. I totally believe that this was an arranged marriage so that way Dina could live a lavish lifestyle and play the "housewife" role, while he had a wife on paper and did whatever the hell he wanted. I also believe that it was Dina's choice for him not to be filmed, because she knew he would blow her "perfect wife" persona out of the water with his behavior. I also will never understand how she can be separated, and yet still live together, and occasionally hook up, knowing that he's dipping it in everything (yuck). I did miss the Bohemian tackiness of her house. Stuff like that is nice in small doses, but she overdoes it. Dusting all of those chachkies (sp?) has to be a nightmare. If her house is any indication of how she did her client's homes, I don't think she was as successful as an interior designer as she claimed to be.

 

The Manzos: By comparison, the Manzos are pretty boring in a good way, I don't have a problem with them. Caroline season 1 v Caroline of whatever season she left, I think it was a combination of being a woman of a particular age, plus a waning tolerance of the drama, plus plain old menopause. I think she is who she is and never pretended to be otherwise. Her kids are nothing out of the ordinary and seemingly got caught up a bit in the reality TV fame, but once their fame starts dissipating (if it hasn't already), they won't crash from lack of attention. Mom and Dad will keep putting them on a pedestal no matter what they do. I do hope marriage will help Lauren's resting bitch face, she hasn't been happy since season 2. But maybe she's not trying to get wrinkles (thank you, Kim K!).

 

The Gorgas/The Wakiles: I'm midway through Season 3, but I don't know how much further I'll go, the family drama was just sad. I don't think Teresa was an innocent party in all the drama, but Melissa is a little shit stirrer and takes EVERYTHING as a personal attack. It really is a classic take of "we're so much alike, that's why they don't get along." And Melissa truly is a younger, hotter version of Teresa, down to the naturally curly hair and the squealing when she talks. It's a little bizarre, honestly, that Teresa married a version of her brother, and Joe Gorga married a version of his sister. The Wakiles are whatever, Kathy is a shit stirrer too and clearly trying to get camera time, but I did enjoy seeing her desserts.

 

Sorry this is so long, I've been stuck in the house for two days and haven't had any adult interaction, LOL!

 

 

 

[Daisy head]

I just subscribed to Hulu Plus & am finally watching the early seasons. I began watching when season 4 started, so I hadn't seen their *history*.

I just finished season 2, and I have loved every minute of it. The Guidice girls, who make me cringe in real time were some of the highlights of the first 2 seasons. Gia's acting was just so bad! Teresa was truly delusional regarding that kid's talent. I loved the scene where Juicy took them to the martial arts class. "Beat 're up and I'll get ya a nice hot dog" followed by "Yay, hot dog!" struck me as so funny! The utter tackiness with which Tre outfitted those girls, especially the get ups they wore - custom made!- to the family dinner in Italy! Leopard print, hoop skirts, velour pants underneath??? Someone chose that?! Only Tre :) Caroline & Al babysitting on the ship - hilarious!

I am in the minority here, because I actually really like the Manzos. Maybe my opinion will change in the next season, but to me, they seem very real. I come from a big Irish/Italian family & I find their interactions to be very genuine. I love the way the kids tease Caroline. The scene where they were getting dressed up for some event - I can't remember what - & Christopher screamed "How about a tie over here!" When they were giving her a hard time about fussing over them made me laugh. Caroline and Albie both have million dollar smiles, IMO. I know a lot of mothers who treat their kids the way Caroline does. She beams with pride at her handsome son Albie, appreciates the humor of Christopher & wants her daughter to be happy & set in a career. So far I haven't seen the lazy, shiftless behavior that some here have indicated. But like I said, I'm only on season 2.

Danielle is so over the top crazy! The way she twists everything into an affront is fascinating to watch. I so wish she hadn't left, but I guess when no one will film with you, your value is limited. While I don't argue the fact that her daughter is a pretty girl, something about her gives me the creeps. I mean, I feel sorry for both of those girls, since they seemed a lot more aware than their mom, and were privy to way too much info, but it seemed like her intense gaze would go right thru to my soul. And the younger one - I felt sorry for the fact that she had to always listen to everyone fawn over her sister while she was usually overlooked, but I hope they aren't still trying to make her music career happen, because that show at the sweet 16 was no bueno. That said, Danielle obviously loves her kids tremendously. Too but she's so insane.

I so enjoyed the dance lesson in season 1. It was just so fun to see them all have such a good time together. Jacq spanking Christopher, Danielle acting like a fool, Caroline looking on as she danced with Albie... Loved it all. I so root for the drama now, I was surprised at how much I enjoyed the lighthearted scenes of the early seasons.

The drama, though, is a thing of beauty. Of course the table flip, with Tre's tirade which preceded it, is classic. The country club throw down, I could watch for hours on a loop. As well as Tre explaining it to Juicy afterward. Heaven!