S06.E05: The Other Thing

[paigow]

Sarge has May; Altarah has Daisy, Enoch and Simmons; two planets need saving.

Airdate: 6.14.19

[janeta]

I want Snowflake to get sucked into a black hole or something. 

[MisterGlass]

I liked May bating her into a mistake, and then taking them both down.

Haven't decided how I feel about the Chronocom Fitz-Simmons plot.  I did like that Daisy, Davis, and Piper made it home, and got a fond reception.

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

Never trust a robot. What have you done Enoch 

The Earth scenes bore me. Maybe it'll get better now that some of the outer space crew is back. 

[Raja]

With the monolith connection it is all but certain that Sarge is after the killer of the Chronocom's world. 

I do wonder how the genetic twin with Coulson will play out. For a moment earlier in the season I was thinking Captain Marvel's time, but I guess that is out

[rmontro]

Sarge is using a lot of the same phrases that Coulson used.  Even the title of the episode refers to it.  Wonder what that will develop into? 

[swanpride]

I am really getting annoyed by now….stop torturing Fitzsimmons!!!! Enok better helps them to escape!!!! Next episode!!!!

I guess Sarge thinks that he is doing a good thing but I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out that there is more to the story than even he knows.

[thuganomics85]

I guess I now know what a fight between too robot-type exes would be like, thanks to Enoch and his former "superior" bickering.  Thanks, guys!  I can also see Enoch's logic over revealing that Simmons would be good leverage over Fitz, because he is all about saving his "bestie."  Still, totally I understand why everyone else was pissed (although, of course, Simmons would be the one who comes around because, well, she gets it!)

Surprised that Melinda already outmaneuvers Sarge (and Crazy Snowflake Lady), and now the entire team has been captured.  Of course, that likely means something big and bad is going to come out of it.  Sure seems like Sarge truly thinks they're actually doing the right thing, so I'm guessing the true villains will be the same group that killed the Chromicons.

Other than that, I just want to once again reiterate that I would watch the hell out of a "Lower Decks"-type episode that just follows Piper and Davis around as they snark on one another and find themselves forced into dangerous situations due to the action of the regulars.  Throw in Dr. Benson too!

Hey, that was Lou Diamond Phillips behind the camera!  Thought he did a good job.

[Affogato]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperion_Canto

this is reminding me of Dan Simmon’s hyperion Cantos. The term ‘the shrike’. The spiky weird things coming out of people, in Retrospect the chromicons, The intent to time travel. 

I’m currently operating on the assumption that there is a homage going on. 

Edited June 15, 2019 by Affogato
Typos

[silverstream]

6 hours ago, rmontro said:

Sarge is using a lot of the same phrases that Coulson used.  Even the title of the episode refers to it.  Wonder what that will develop into? 

Yes, I noticed that too. Maybe there's some sort of time travel loop where FitzSimmons already developed time travel and the Chromicons built a Chromicon Coulson (why him I haven't managed to think of yet) and sent him back with the mission to defeat the big bad and for some reason he can't remember that, only that he needs to defeat the big bad? That would explain why he's got a longer life span than a normal human, and his apparent amnesia. Could be that it's even one of those time loops where trying to fix the problem caused the problem (=the big bad) in the first place. Maybe in a future episode a hole opens up in time/space and evil/insane!timetravelled!FitzSimmons step through or something.

I am intrigued that they're bringing back the stones - I hadn't though we'd see those again, much less get an explanation of what they actually are after so long (at least that's the way it seems to be shaping up?).

[mxc90]

I thought Deke killed the "squirrelly kid" ( as Yo-Yo put it) when he emptied his gun in him last episode?

Mack had a long stare as Yo-Yo walked away and I don't blame him.

I wanted Mack to punch Khan after he made the "sedate" crack about Deke. 

Good luck finding a way to cope "responsibly" in this stressful business.

I hope Mack check the Quinjet's flight records when it returns. On the way to the Yucatan, there will be a stop at a convenience store for some beer.

[Raja]

7 minutes ago, mxc90 said:

I thought Deke killed the "squirrelly kid" ( as Yo-Yo put it) when he emptied his gun in him last episode?

It was a non lethal icer. Good thing it doesn't work like a real less than lethal weapons or a Stargate ZAT where multiple shots kill.

[bethy]

I thought Simmons's good-bye to Daisy was very sweet, but did she at all acknowledge that Davis and Piper were right there and had been with them the whole time, too?

When they said that the monoliths were space and time, I wondered if there might be a connection to the infinity stones.

[Raja]

I would think that like most connections after the Age of Ultron they are following  similar themes, space and time travel but no direct connection 

[tennisgurl]

I would totally watch a whole lower deck style episode with Piper and Davis as the view point characters with the usual leads just showing up every now and from their perspectives. 

[bethy]

On 6/15/2019 at 8:37 AM, mxc90 said:

I wanted Mack to punch Khan after he made the "sedate" crack about Deke. 

I loved the dead-eyed stare Mack gave Kahn at that crack. Though I guess it's a, "I can put my brother down, but you better not," kind of thing given that the team is pretty intolerant and grumpy toward Deke themselves. 

Edited June 22, 2019 by bethy

[MisterGlass]

Mack is the master of expressive stares.  I was glad to see Kahn still around, though.

Sarge was dodging May's questions about exactly what he remembers and what he knows about himself.  I have thought up to this point that his crew jumps between dimensions, but with the Chronicom planet destruction, perhaps they are actually chasing the shrike across planets in the same dimension.  That could argue for him being a Coulson clone of some sort.

[VCRTracking]

Clark Gregg and Ming Na were both incredible in this episode.

[bethy]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

I would totally watch a whole lower deck style episode with Piper and Davis as the view point characters with the usual leads just showing up every now and from their perspectives. 

I still want to know how Davis lived after being attacked by AIDA. We never found out, did we? I loved that Davis was all, “Those guys have no interest in my amazing story,” talking about the main team. 

I actually liked that we got a taste of this with the AoS team’s POV of the fall of SHIELD and the Winter Soldier story. 

Um, back to this episode. Davis and Piper insisting they could have escaped on their own was cute. 

[rmontro]

1 hour ago, MisterGlass said:

Sarge was dodging May's questions about exactly what he remembers and what he knows about himself.  I have thought up to this point that his crew jumps between dimensions, but with the Chronicom planet destruction, perhaps they are actually chasing the shrike across planets in the same dimension.  That could argue for him being a Coulson clone of some sort.

Even better if he actually was Coulson somehow, and the Coulson that died with May was a clone they had sent back.  I've still never forgiven Marvel for not bringing Coulson back in the movies.

[mxc90]

2 hours ago, bethy said:

I loved the dead-eyed stare Mack gave Kahn at that crack. Though I guess it's kind of a, "I can put my brother down, but you better not," kind of thing given that the team is pretty intolerant and grumpy toward Deke themselves. 

Also, Mack must have seen Sequoia's instagram and was none too pleased with his agent "stabbing" Deke in the back and now joking about him. Afterall, he is trying to rebuild S.H.I.E.L.D's  integrity.

Edited June 15, 2019 by mxc90

[Raja]

2 hours ago, bethy said:

I loved the dead-eyed stare Mack gave Kahn at that crack. Though I guess it's kind of a, "I can put my brother down, but you better not," kind of thing given that the team is pretty intolerant and grumpy toward Deke themselves. 

I thought it has more to do with Agent Khan playing the game and not reporting back about the Daisy fantasy award, being a virtual sex toy. In the AoS world she is perhaps the world's most famous Inhuman. And seeing S.H.I.E.L.D  saving Chicago and becoming big again she is probably right behind a presnapture  Avenger in MCU public image 

[Enigma X]

Does anyone in the Seattle area know when this episode will air locally? A local special was on last night in its slot.

[Wishing Well]

9 hours ago, Enigma X said:

Does anyone in the Seattle area know when this episode will air locally? A local special was on last night in its slot.

It aired at 10pm instead 

[Enigma X]

2 hours ago, Wishing Well said:

It aired at 10pm instead 

Thanks. My dvr did not pick it up. As I write this, I remember that what Hulu is for.

[blueray]

First off I can see why Enoch did what he did. He essentially saved Daisy, Piper, Davis and Jemma from being killed right then, they had no use for them. It ended up leading to the first 3 making it home. I'm not sure why he gassed him at the end though. I guess we'll find out next episode.

For the earth stuff, I'm still not really loving the story. I don't like evil-coulson and the rest of his crew bore me. Also I didn't realize until now how much I dislike the trope of having "flashbacks" while some one is being tortured. Were those her actual memories? The whole time I was thinking no reason to pay attention to these they aren't real anyway. But then it never tied into what was going on in the present. So that was Coulson's last moments?

Anyhow, I didn't trust evil-coulson for a second and was glad when May captured him.

Edited June 16, 2019 by blueray

[krankydoodle]

On 6/15/2019 at 2:26 PM, bethy said:

I thought Simmons's good-bye to Daisy was very sweet, but did she at all acknowledge that Davis and Piper were right there and had been with them the whole time, too?

It seemed like Simmons included Davis and Piper too by looking at each of them in turn while she was saying goodbye.

[bethy]

4 hours ago, krankydoodle said:

It seemed like Simmons included Davis and Piper too by looking at each of them in turn while she was saying goodbye.

Oh, good - thanks! I honestly had missed that and hadn't had time for a rewatch. 

[tennisgurl]

The thing about the monoliths each having a special function (time, space) very much reminds me of the Infinity Stones. How many ultra powerful weirdly specific doohickeys have they got laying around the galaxy anyway?! 

At least Fitz and Jemma are together, even if its under pretty crappy circumstances. I am going to need that big dramatic reunion hug though. So will Jemma actually tell this Fitz about what future Fitz got up to? Probably not during this most recent mess, but after its all sorted?

Hey, its Lena from The Fosters as the head robot alien!

Mack has such expressive eyes, love watching him react to stuff. Poor Yoyo is going through some shit, I wonder if anyone was like "So, any particular reason you didnt save your boyfriend with your super speed or robot hands?" and she went even further into a misery cycle. 

I kind of suspected that Sarge and his team might not be here to just do evil stuff, considering that they dont exactly go out of the way to kill people (even if they dont mind collateral damage) and they seemed to be hunting those creatures, so thats going to be interesting. Whats their deal, and especially Coulson Clone?! Clark Gregg and Ming Na were just at their top of their games the whole episode.

[swanpride]

I can see how monoliths which allow you to travel space, time and reality can work, but I don't see there being monoliths for mind, power and soul. Well, I guess you could travel into a mind and maybe a soul, but how do you travel into power?

[Affogato]

2 hours ago, swanpride said:

I can see how monoliths which allow you to travel space, time and reality can work, but I don't see there being monoliths for mind, power and soul. Well, I guess you could travel into a mind and maybe a soul, but how do you travel into power?

Spoiler

In 2001 a space odyssey one monolith increases the intelligence and maybe aggression of the base population  when said population develops space travel they are lead to the monolith that brings them into the larger community  

Example from 2001

Edited June 17, 2019 by Affogato

[Mellowyellow]

12 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

At least Fitz and Jemma are together, even if its under pretty crappy circumstances.

Will they be together or are they gonna be mean and have them skype each other while they are forced to build whatever 😂

***

Loved the scene between Daisy and Jemma and the big hug Mack gave Daisy. 

Mack's face when he didn't see FitzSimmons after hugging Daisy pulled at my heartstrings too. Mack is so sane and yet has so many feels. I kind of adore the man😍😍😍😍😍

Good on May for subduing Evil Coulson, cuffing him and then taking a moment to be sentimental. That is how you be a sensible, badass agent!

Agent Khan is still hot 😍😍😍

[Orbert]

I'm confused by who or what the Chronicoms are.  When we first met Enoch, he was mysterious and clearly not human and probably a bad guy, though they kept it vague enough that when he turned out to be a not-bad guy it still worked.  They observe, and do not interfere unless it's to address an "extinction-level event".  From the name "Chronicom" I'd assumed "chronos" = time, so something to do with documenting all of time and space?  But "observe, don't interfere" seemed like their main thing.  Also, he introduced himself as a "sentient Chronicom", implying that most Chronicoms are not sentient, or there are at least enough non-sentient ones that it makes sense to make the distinction.

So who are the Hunters?  The most dangerous type of Chronicom.  So there are different types.  They don't seem interested in just observing.  Or are they hunting down Fitz and Enoch because they are acting (in their own way) to prevent an extinction-level event, that of their own species?

But they said they're hunting Fitz and Enoch for interfering with the fabric of the universe or something.  I'm confused.  Oh, I said that already.

[swanpride]

I suspect that they are send to specifically observe places and get involved whenever an extension level event is happening in order to hopefully learn something which might help rescuing their own planet....

hopefully the writers of AoS are aware that changing the past can't change the present.

[Raja]

I think that Enoch and the other Chronicom who blew up with the monoliths last season were supposed to be on earth a lot longer a lot longer than Sarge thinks that he has lived. Their function in the society were basically anthropologist with their own Trek like Prime Directive. The hunters were just another job within their society, perhaps who gained greater power after the destruction of Chronicom II which Enoch had no ideal that happened. So while Enoch has been collecting data he seems to be like Odo of DS9 and needed to go home to actually publish his findings to his people.

3 hours ago, swanpride said:

hopefully the writers of AoS are aware that changing the past can't change the present.

Only the Agents already changed the past, being Graviton no longer wins and cracks earth with "Quake, destroyer of worlds", getting the blame. So a change in the past was made to change the present when the time monolith looped them back and Coulson gave up the last centipede serum which presumably would have saved his life. Thus changing their present, even if Flint and his present of rebuilding earth still exist. And as "only my reality matters" as Teal'c of Stargate so proudly said in that franchise's time travel. Meaning the present where the earth did not crack do to that change in the past of a different person getting the serum

[swanpride]

They didn't change their own past, they changed their future. That is not the same as changing your past.

[Raja]

7 hours ago, swanpride said:

They didn't change their own past, they changed their future. That is not the same as changing your past.

However the Agents while they didn't change the "past" of the individual characters who went through the loop they did know of the "past" of all of humanity that didn't make it to the lighthouse and they changed that "past", having lived in the future, as they were in a historian from the future travelling back to save them.

So while in Infinity War/Endgame the snapture still happens, with people supernaturally brought back to life in AoS the Graviton crack of the earth no longer happens. People are not brought back to life, they are never killed in the first place in the last  loop of time changing the past.

For the Chronocoms, while the survivors may retain knowledge of what happened in their past like the agents did, they are not looking to bring back the Shrike dead but to prevent a Shrike victory, changing the past of the greater community, in the first place. Just as Quake did, changing the past by finally beating Graviton when she used the serum meant to save Coulson's life.

[swanpride]

They didn't change the past of Deke, Tess aso. All those characters still experienced the same history. They only changed their own future. So if the Chronicon uses timetravel to change the fate of their planet in the past, it won't change the current timeline in which they life. They can only create a new timeline, but they won't be part of it unless they stay in said timeline.

[Raja]

6 minutes ago, swanpride said:

They didn't change the past of Deke, Tess aso. All those characters still experienced the same history. They only changed their own future. So if the Chronicon uses timetravel to change the fate of their planet in the past, it won't change the current timeline in which they life. They can only create a new timeline, but they won't be part of it unless they stay in said timeline.

Which obviously seems to be their goal, as Teal'c says only my reality matters.  And to touch on the other ongoing debate, stay with their loved ones in the good timeline like a ten years older Steve Rogers finding a younger Peggy Carter.

To be the heroes of Chronicon II that Tony Stark is to earth. Assuming the rest believe the data provided by the Shrike refugees/fighters. Enoch's ex seem real quick to throw out liar accusations 

[Chaos Theory]

The Sarge/May stuff was made of so much win.  Too bad the outer space stuff has gotten increasingly boring.   I just don’t care about the Fitz/Simmons plot which makes me sad.  

I am really looking forward to what Daisy does when she sees Sarge.   

Edited June 19, 2019 by Chaos Theory

[Lantern7]

I want the Sarge stuff resolved. The fact that his crew might be the good guys is a nice swerve. Even the kill-happy harpy?

Oh, Enoch. You still have a lot to learn about the [metaphysical] human heart. "But I have reunited the 'FitzSimmons'. Surely, the fans would praise my name up and down the World Wide Web. Are they that cynical that they are critical of me?"

[rmontro]

On 6/19/2019 at 12:39 PM, Chaos Theory said:

The Sarge/May stuff was made of so much win.  Too bad the outer space stuff has gotten increasingly boring.   I just don’t care about the Fitz/Simmons plot which makes me sad.  

I wouldn't go so far as to say I don't care about FitzSimmons' story, but I agree the outer space stuff is getting boring.  It doesn't help that the places they choose to visit in space are some of the bleakest places I've ever seen.  They even make a casino look dank.

Hopefully the space stuff is finally coming to an end.

[swanpride]

I am sure they are back on earth by the end next episode. It's time to reunite the team.

[Jack Shaftoe]

Time travel again? Noooooooooooooooo!

A civilization dedicated to observing other civilizations and they can think of no one better than Daisy and Jemma to ask for help with time travel? Isn't Earth supposed to be a galactic backwater? Atarah came to talk to Daisy and Jemma and was wary of Daisy's powers, then promptly forgot about that and ordered everyone to be killed, then remembered that she had a bunch of other ships ready to blow the Zephyr out, so there wasn't much point threatening to kill Fitz or visiting their ship in person. But it's not like the writers have ever given a damn about details like plot mechanics when the goal is, wait for it, more FitzSimmons angst. They are about to hug but... he is a hologram. How clever this was not.

May was great from start to finish but I am finding it hard to care about Not!Coulson. He has such an important mission, why does his team consist of so few people, one of them a knife-wielding maniac? You would think more people would care about these planet-destroying bats. And I am really not a fan of bringing dead characters back. But hey, it could have been worse, they could have brought Ward back once again. 🙂

Edited March 29, 2020 by Jack Shaftoe