S09.E09: Adaptation

[SamBeckett]

9 minutes ago, OoohMaggie said:

To be fair to the ‘end of the world’ shows, if they are attempting to reflect what reality would be like, then animals will be hurt, any animal, even those one would never consider eating in normality, is fair game when all stored, prepackaged food has been consumed.

Growing food is not an easy thing to do to those used to visiting the supermarket, if a protein, vitamin source presents itself in front of someone who is starving then it is going to die, no matter whether it looks cute or can fetch a ball.

In a ZA situation, the breeding of dogs, cats, chickens, rats for consumption would become the norm as long as it prolonged human life. Only once people reached a ‘Hilltop’ level of existence would they then begin to revert to keeping dogs as pets or working members of the society.

I’m not talking real life. I know most of us would die a lot quicker than we would like to think. And I know most animals (except domestic animals) would have a much better chance at survival than humans, even the Dwayne Johnson types. All I’m saying is that — IMO — the use of children and animals in danger is a trite way to enhance suspense.

[Gobi]

Speaking of animals, I know of cases where people have been kicked by horses, that weren't defending themselves, and they can do some serious damage, up to and including death. Yet in this show, horses just allow themselves to be brought down by zombies who have no concept of protecting themselves from being kicked.

[rhygirl720]

17 minutes ago, Gobi said:

Speaking of animals, I know of cases where people have been kicked by horses, that weren't defending themselves, and they can do some serious damage, up to and including death. Yet in this show, horses just allow themselves to be brought down by zombies who have no concept of protecting themselves from being kicked.

Zombies would have no chance against my mare who I believe could take out a herd  of walkers...lol. The horse thing makes me crazy. who is training all these perfectly trained horses? calm as can be. They did show Maggie once but that was six years ago. I want to know who the horse whisperer is.

[AngelaHunter]

46 minutes ago, SamBeckett said:

And I know most animals (except domestic animals) would have a much better chance at survival than humans, even the Dwayne Johnson types. 

The Rock would probably go early, as that massive burden of unwieldy, chemically created muscle would make him not agile or fast at all.

1 hour ago, OoohMaggie said:

To be fair to the ‘end of the world’ shows, if they are attempting to reflect what reality would be like, then animals will be hurt, any animal, even those one would never consider eating in normality, is fair game when all stored, prepackaged food has been consumed.

that is of course very true, but even cave people who were probably hungry a lot of the time, saw the benefit of dogs hanging around, not as pets but they would alert to danger, help hunt and defend the cave people who incidentally provided them with food in the form of bones or scraps thrown out from whatever animal the people had eaten. Of course in times of starvation, dogs (and yes, rats, bugs and anything else that walks, swims, crawls or flies) would be on the menu as they were for CDB. That's understandable and acceptable - people will eat other people if they're hungry enough - but no one seemed to be anywhere near starving at Hilltop or the Kingdom when we met them. For sure Jerry wasn't going without. They were actually doing so well they were able to provide food so the King could feed his 500lb "pet" tiger, which couldn't have been dining on the rotted flesh of walkers alone. Even if so, how many relatively "fresh" walkers would have to be rounded up by people who had more pressing issues to care for and fed to Shiva each week to keep her in that superb, sleek condition so the King could look "cool"? Comic book - fine. Live action - not so fine.

1 hour ago, mightysparrow said:

The writers at TWD are so incompetent, they don't even know the basic rules of writing.  A show like this needs anchor characters. characters that audience relates to and sees the world through their eyes.

Yep. I really think they feel "We have the best show ever in the history of televison (sorry - NOT!) that we can do whatever we please no matter how dumb and anyone who doesn't like it can piss off."

I'm still watching this but I feel like someone who has fallen for a Nigerian scam email and started sending so much money that I feel I have to send more simply because I've already invested so much I need a payoff - one which is promised but never comes. So yeah, I'm the idiot who keeps watching this.

[iMonrey]

Can somebody remind me why Henry was in jail?

[raven]

40 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Can somebody remind me why Henry was in jail?

He got drunk and did something naughty, I don't remember what though.

[One4Sorrow2TooBad]

That episode was so forgettable, I don't remember why either.

[AngelaHunter]

1 hour ago, raven said:

He got drunk and did something naughty, I don't remember what though.

I wish they had put him in the cell with Negan.

[Gobi]

1 hour ago, AngelaHunter said:

I wish they had put him in the cell with Negan.

2 hours ago, raven said:

He got drunk and did something naughty, I don't remember what though.

I think it had something to do with a zombie in a pit, but I forget what happened. 

[oakville]

3 hours ago, raven said:

He got drunk and did something naughty, I don't remember what though.

He got drunk with the other kids & ended up in a walker pit.

[AngelaHunter]

1 hour ago, Gobi said:

I think it had something to do with a zombie in a pit, but I forget what happened. 

I wish I could forget. I was never a big Carl fan, but his pallid, annoying replacement is making me miss him fiercely.

[Nashville]

5 hours ago, raven said:

He got drunk and did something naughty, I don't remember what though.

After the rest of the Hilltop Juvie Crew ran off and left Henry in the pit with the re-deceased walker, Henry was able to get out of the pit under his own power; having gotten out, though, Henry was apparently too trashed to remember how his partners in crime had gotten out of Hilltop unseen - meaning he couldn’t figure out how to re-enter by the same method.  End result being the gate guards got treated to the spectacle of drunk-off-his-ass Henry banging on the gates hollering to be let back in.  

Add to that the fact that Henry (a) chose not to rat out his shine-guzzling compatriots but (b) couldn’t satisfactorily explain how he got out in the first place, and it’s small wonder he got his ass thrown in a cell.

[Kdawg82]

19 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

Rick raised her after he killed Shane, that is where she got her "soft as a pillow" instinct

Yes.. but what makes even LESS sense is that Carl was the one that "changed" Rick not to be a killer. The same Carl with the "trust no one" approach. The same Carl who snuck off (with Jesus tailing him) to kill Negan personally.  Carl was bad ass too! Wtf did they do to that boy??! It was bewildering and seemingly out of nowhere.

[Smad]

Btw was there no one but Judith in Alexandria in this episode? How is it possible for Negan to walk all around town during the night and morning and no one notices? Do they still have no one on guard/watch? How are these stupid people still alive????

[AngelaHunter]

18 minutes ago, Smad said:

Do they still have no one on guard/watch?

Guards? They don't even bother locking their doors at night. Stay in the house, Judith!

[Nashville]

1 hour ago, Smad said:

Btw was there no one but Judith in Alexandria in this episode? How is it possible for Negan to walk all around town during the night and morning and no one notices? Do they still have no one on guard/watch? How are these stupid people still alive????

Maybe THAT’S why everybody seems so terminally pissed off at Michonne - she ran everybody else out of Alexandria and is hogging it all for herself and the kids.  😄

[JusLaugh]

This episode was equivalent to Star Trek doing an entire season opener about the red-shirts.

Yes, I'm that old.

[mightysparrow]

1 hour ago, Nashville said:

Maybe THAT’S why everybody seems so terminally pissed off at Michonne - she ran everybody else out of Alexandria and is hogging it all for herself and the kids.  😄

Even Daryl is stuck living in a tent in the woods with Dog, outside Alexandria.  And he's the best judge of character she knows!

[AngelaHunter]

4 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

Even Daryl is stuck living in a tent in the woods with Dog, outside Alexandria.  And he's the best judge of character she knows!

Oh, excellent point. The only time I can remember Daryl having anything resembling a conversation with anyone was last season when he reamed out Rick - at the bottom of a hole I might add -  for being a selfish asshole, period. I remember no other conversations, so I'm not sure where the opinion that he's an astute judge of character comes from?

1 hour ago, icemiser69 said:

When it comes to writing, this series has always had a continuity problem.

One of many, many problems.

[meep.meep]

On 2/11/2019 at 10:21 AM, Mahamid Frauded Me said:

I have to admit, the trailers for the new season with the Whisperers was creepy AF... oh and Rosita is a ho

I don't know why this shit bugs me so much, but no, she isn't.  She is a woman with normal sex drive in a world with no birth control.

[AngelaHunter]

46 minutes ago, meep.meep said:

I don't know why this shit bugs me so much, but no, she isn't.

Thank you. I said nothing about that but now that you bring it up, yeah it bugs the shit out of me too. That women on this show - Lori, Andrea and now Rosita - are labelled "whores" annoys me greatly. They are and were mature, single women over the age of consent and having sex with more than one man does not equal "whore." I guess in the circumspect TWD world grown women are expected to stay chaste and virginal until they take marriage vows.

Rosita told Sasha about guys she'd hooked up with because the union was mutally beneficial. That does not make her a whore. It makes her pragmatic, smart and a survivor. Having never been in this situation, I certainly would not judge her.

[Nashville]

At the very least, Rosita is no more a “ho” than either Siddiq OR FPP - takes two to tango, donchaknow.

Come to think of it, Siddiq should feel privileged; he’s the first man in living memory with whom Rosita has had a relationship, who didn’t end up dead pretty quickly thereafter....  ;>

[iMonrey]

What do we really know about Rosita, anyway? She's been around for years and about all I know is that she used to be Abe's main squeeze. We've had next to no background info on her. She's a prime example of how the show really stopped developing characters. I can tell you a lot about original Camp Dinner Bell members but characters introduced in the last four seasons are so are all enigmas, more or less. 

[mightysparrow]

If a woman who owns her sexuality is a 'ho', doesn't that mean Carol's a ho too?  She's been with more than one man since the ZA started.

I believe it's been at least 8 years since Rosita and Abraham broke up and she's had two lovers in that time.  That makes her a whore?

[Nashville]

2 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

I believe it's been at least 8 years since Rosita and Abraham broke up and she's had two lovers in that time.  That makes her a whore?

Three, actually; don’t forget Spencer Monroe - the one Negan gutted between eight-ball shots.

[AngelaHunter]

3 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

I believe it's been at least 8 years since Rosita and Abraham broke up and she's had two lovers in that time.  That makes her a whore?

Yes, A grown woman who enjoys sex is a whore, in this show anyway. The worst whore was Andrea, a woman who I judged was supposed to be well over 30 and had sex with *gasp" two men! One of those men was Shane, who also had sex with Lori, but strangely he was never labelled a whore. If this show were more realistic and not pearl-clutching and swooning about s-e-x, everyone would be screwing like bunnies and so what if they did?

Yeah, Rosita had sex before Abe, and with Spencer and then FPP and Saddiq too. While I might question her taste in men, she can get it on with whomever she pleases. Why not? She hasn't taken any vows of fidelity that I know of.

[Ohwell]

I do't think Rosita's a whore either, but maybe she gets that moniker because there wasn't that much time between when she had sex with Saddiq and then with FFP?  I don't know, I haven't been watching that closely this season. 

[mightysparrow]

11 minutes ago, Nashville said:

Three, actually; don’t forget Spencer Monroe - the one Negan gutted between eight-ball shots.

 Three?  Well, in that case...what a whore!

[AngelaHunter]

45 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

 Three?  Well, in that case...what a whore!

Yeah, she went and screwed Spencer after Abraham dumped her a really callous way so he could go screw Sasha. What a whore Abe was. Oh, I mean, "what a stud." Rosita is the whore.

[theredhead77]

3 hours ago, meep.meep said:

I don't know why this shit bugs me so much, but no, she isn't.  She is a woman with normal sex drive in a world with no birth control.

2 hours ago, AngelaHunter said:

Thank you. I said nothing about that but now that you bring it up, yeah it bugs the shit out of me too

1 hour ago, Nashville said:

At the very least, Rosita is no more a “ho” than either Siddiq OR FPP - takes two to tango, donchaknow.

Thank you. It really, really bothers me that slut shaming or calling a woman a ho is A-OK on this board. It wouldn't be OK if it was a man being called a ho either but it's always the women being shamed. 

[raven]

*****MOD NOTE*****

Let's get back to talking about the episode, please.

[OoohMaggie]

18 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

The people that wander off and get caught (like the two dudes that are with The Whisperers) won't be missed if something happens to them.

I was just beginning to warm to Alden, not so much Trout-Pout yet, these secondary characters should be given a reasonable amount of time with which to tickle our fancy, I think Aaron is a good example of this, he has managed to work his way up to, in my opinion, a much loved and important character, who’s promise I hope doesnt get wasted in the same manner that befell Jesus.

Edited February 15, 2019 by OoohMaggie

[heisenberg]

I don't have much to say,   nothing really makes sense, starting with the motorcycle.   My lawnmower is stored for the winter and it will take new fuel and few adjustments to be able to start it...  If it goes well.   

maybe next week I will have an opinion.  

[Nashville]

1 hour ago, heisenberg said:

I don't have much to say,   nothing really makes sense, starting with the motorcycle.   My lawnmower is stored for the winter and it will take new fuel and few adjustments to be able to start it...  If it goes well.   

maybe next week I will have an opinion.  

Don’t forget - this is the world of MagicGas® !  ;>

[AngelKitty]

This show sat on my DVR for a few days before I made myself watch. It's too bad because it didn't use to be this way. I just have too many questions about these whisperers that makes it harder to suspend my disbelief for the whole thing. Plus, as much as I like the actor, Negan should not be alive.

[AngelaHunter]

3 hours ago, AngelKitty said:

This show sat on my DVR for a few days before I made myself watch. It's too bad because it didn't use to be this way.

I hear that. I have all the eps of my 3 most-loved shows on DVD. I've seen every ep 3 times at the very least. Now, with TWD, I miss a lot of what's happening, including the dialogue because I prefer to pay more attention the Live Chat than the show. I see by the episode comments just how much I did miss and I  don't even care. I tried to rewatch a couple of times, but after 5 minutes thought, "Nope. Can't do."

3 hours ago, AngelKitty said:

Plus, as much as I like the actor, Negan should not be alive.

His being alive is irksome enough, seeing as how many other characters are and were ditched or put on the sidelines so TPB can focus on him. What is most annoying is that they are trying to push on us that he's really a nice guy, deep down. Awww, look how fond he is of Judith! So sweet. He loved his wife so much he named a spiky, blood-soaked bat after her.  Look at his sadness and nostalgia for the good ol' days in the place where he committed murder, torture and rape. He's not a bad guy- he's just misunderstood. Got it? Good.

Oh, and the MagicGas doesn't really bother me when so many other things are much worse. I did kind of wonder how he found some old motorcyle that had been lying around for 6 years, gunned it up and took off like Marlon Brando in the "The Wild One", but then thought, "Why not?"

Edited February 15, 2019 by AngelaHunter

[OoohMaggie]

3 hours ago, AngelaHunter said:

Oh, and the MagicGas doesn't really bother me when so many other things are much worse. I did kind of wonder how he found some old motorcyle that had been lying around for 6 years, gunned it up and took off like Marlon Brando in the "The Wild One", but then thought, "Why not?"

Magicgas is somewhat reliant upon other products from the Magic range, namely Magic ForEver Charged Batteries and  Magic Never Deflate Tyres!

[OoohMaggie]

11 hours ago, Nashville said:

Don’t forget - this is the world of MagicGas® !

Where the hell do you find the Registered symbol on an IPad?

[Gobi]

22 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

I think there is a tipping point in this series where a suspension of disbelief goes out the window.  I can buy into only so much bullshit.  I can handle only so much idiot behavior.

The two dudes following the arrows into an area of Whisperers is one of those things for me.

Why were those dudes following those arrows?  Did they think they were left by one of the newbies at the Mountain Top? 

How did the Whisperers get all of those arrows in the first place?

Negan knocking down a brick wall and getting out his motorcycle is another.  The magical gas is another.

Negan going into a store and finding a jacket in his size (extra douche bag)  doesn't surprise me.

Negan heading back to Alexandria doesn't surprise me.  He is a broken man.

The arrows had been made by one of the guys they were looking for, according to the musician guy. Why they would leave a trail like that was never pondered.

[Persnickety1]

On 2/13/2019 at 2:05 PM, AngelaHunter said:

Oh, excellent point. The only time I can remember Daryl having anything resembling a conversation with anyone was last season when he reamed out Rick - at the bottom of a hole I might add -  for being a selfish asshole, period. I remember no other conversations, so I'm not sure where the opinion that he's an astute judge of character comes from?

One of many, many problems.

Especially when last season, he, Maggie, and Jesus were all conspiring to overthrow Rick.

One would think anyone plotting to overthrow Rick wouldn't be considered an astute judge of character in the Book of Michonne and would instead be a sworn enemy.  

For the sake of fan wanking, I'm going to assume she never knew of the plot the three of them were conjuring up last season.

[AngelaHunter]

53 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

I don't know why Negan would even need it.  Surely he must know the way from Alexandria to Sanctuary.

Would he? IIRC, he didn't know Alexandria existed until he decided to set up elaborate roadblocks for Rick&CO. No one at Alexandria mentioned him collecting tributes before that, did they?

1 hour ago, Persnickety1 said:

Especially when last season, he, Maggie, and Jesus were all conspiring to overthrow Rick.

Oh, yes - that big, huge major plot point, complete with eerie, suspenseful music that resulted in... well, nothing, as usual.

56 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

At least it isn't "Copacabana". 

Oh, crap.

Oh, crap, indeed. An earworm I did not need.

[Nashville]

6 hours ago, AngelaHunter said:

Oh, and the MagicGas doesn't really bother me when so many other things are much worse. I did kind of wonder how he found some old motorcyle that had been lying around for 6 years, gunned it up and took off like Marlon Brando in the "The Wild One", but then thought, "Why not?"

Well, they did actually show that part on the show.  Back in his bad old Sanctuary days, Negan had apparently stashed a cycle by hiding it behind a fake sheetrock wall (I guess even back then he had concerns about keeping his quick getaway options open).  After Negan got back to Sanctuary he went directly to the wall, bashed some holes in it, and the bike was revealed.

Anyway - so much for where Negan got the bike.  Now what it’s running on, other than maybe piss and prayers...?  Your guess is as good as mine.

3 hours ago, OoohMaggie said:

Where the hell do you find the Registered symbol on an IPad?

Type left parenthesis + lowercase ‘r’ + right parenthesis, then check your Autocorrect options.

FYI - typing out the word ‘copyright’ works for © as well.  🙂

[Pixiebomb]

So it takes over a day to get from Alexandria to Hilltop via horse. Yet Carl and Enid rollerskated there in an afternoon?

Alexandria’s scouts never even suspected the existence of the Sanctuary or its satellites yet Negan can walk there in a day. While stopping to shop for a new leather jacket even. 

I really need a map of this world. 

Edited February 15, 2019 by Pixiebomb

[AngelaHunter]

1 hour ago, Nashville said:

Well, they did actually show that part on the show.  Back in his bad old Sanctuary days, Negan had apparently stashed a cycle by hiding it behind a fake sheetrock wall (I guess even back then he had concerns about keeping his quick getaway options open).  After Negan got back to Sanctuary he went directly to the wall, bashed some holes in it, and the bike was revealed.

Oh. Thank you. It all makes sense now. So Negan's special escape bike was hidden behind a wall, much like Dexter's emergency escape suitcase? Except a suitcase doesn't need 6-year old gasoline. I really need to watch this ep again. Maybe tomorrow.

42 minutes ago, Pixiebomb said:

So it takes over a day to get from Alexandria to Hilltop via horse. Yet Carl and Enid rollerskated there in an afternoon?

Alexandria’s scouts never even suspected the existence of the Sanctuary or its satellites yet Negan can walk there in a day. While stopping to shop for a new leather jacket even.

I think that sums it up pretty well. As for the map? I think it would shift and fluctuate according to plot need, like a Harry Potter page, but I'd like to see it too.

[CletusMusashi]

6 hours ago, AngelaHunter said:

So Negan's special escape bike was hidden behind a wall, much like Dexter's emergency escape suitcase? 

Valid comparison. But wrong genre... and, therefore, flawed analogy.

"Dexter" was a deep, serious drama. 

The Negancycle was playing more by Adam West rules, methinks.

[Gobi]

4 hours ago, CletusMusashi said:

Valid comparison. But wrong genre... and, therefore, flawed analogy.

"Dexter" was a deep, serious drama. 

The Negancycle was playing more by Adam West rules, methinks.

More like Roadrunner and Coyote rules.

[OoohMaggie]

12 hours ago, Pixiebomb said:

I really need a map of this world. 

On the old AMC forum we kept asking if they could do an official map but met with little interest, I haven’t even seen a decent fan made one.

Although it’s not the fictional WD world, the WD Google Map is interesting to nose around,

https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1x5Ed-nylk7BF2nlk0qjAW_GoNso&hl=en&ll=33.7582919%2C-84.38759429999999&z=8

[AngelaHunter]

8 hours ago, CletusMusashi said:

Valid comparison. But wrong genre... and, therefore, flawed analogy.

"Dexter" was a deep, serious drama. 

Well, not flawed if you compare it to Se08 "Dexter."

Also, Dexter had many laugh-out-loud moments, because the earlier show-runners understood the need for humour even in darkest moments. TWD showrunners are so pompous and clueless they think humour would ruin their artistic vision.

Edited February 16, 2019 by AngelaHunter

[AngelKitty]

Oh, no. Don't talk about Dexter. I just started season 4.😁

[diebartdie]

18 hours ago, Nashville said:

Anyway - so much for where Negan got the bike.  Now what it’s running on, other than maybe piss and prayers...?  Your guess is as good as mine.

I have a question that will show my complete ignorance of all things mechanical I guess BUT do any motorcycles run on diesel? If so, veggie oil works, old restaurant grease works (once filtered). "Diesel engines were originally designed to run on a variety of fuels, including peanut oil and vegetable oil." so, artisinal motorbikes could be diesel, right?