Hoarders - General Discussion

[3girlsforus]

 I just started watching this but wow - Donna is a grade A bitch. Sure we only see the one part but it seems like Jenny is in recovery and doing much better. Is she just trash for the rest of her life? How dare Donna talk to her like that. Jenny has admitted she made lots of mistakes and she’s gone through a lot. Guess Donna’s shit don’t stink.  Donna seems like she has a serious superiority complex while being a horrible human being.

[CrazyInAlabama]

I didn't see most of the BSOJ at the end.   I imagine it was a bunch of garbage about how Patricia is working with aftercare, or will be, and a bunch of bull about the rest.     Even if the codes enforcement backed off at the filming, I bet the 4 million phone calls and emails to them, and the city council members this morning ended that too.    

[funky-rat]

3 minutes ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

I didn't see most of the BSOJ at the end.   I imagine it was a bunch of garbage about how Patricia is working with aftercare, or will be, and a bunch of bull about the rest.     Even if the codes enforcement backed off at the filming, I bet the 4 million phone calls and emails to them, and the city council members this morning ended that too.    

She's still picking stuff up and selling it.  She is supposedly working with therapy.  They supposedly got all 3 houses clean enough for code enforcement to back off.

[enoughcats]

3 hours ago, Pepper Mostly said:

Those yellow chairs Bill smashed up were cute. I would have grabbed them for my yard sale if I saw them curbside....

I agree about the yellow chairs, except at least one was missing the seat.  They were at the end of their design potential with that coat of flat yellow paint.  (I can see the color the kitchen was that they were in ....lots of sun and floral prints and live plants. 

I had a brief covetous  thought. 

4 hours ago, nytonc said:

I wonder why the counselors don’t suggest that the hoarder move to the country and open a junk yard

Except this is south Florida and the water table is VERY shallow and (I hope) TPTB restrict land use that could contaminate the water.  Dumps do contaminate and these folks weren't going to put down an impervious liner.

She close to Ft. Lauderdale and there's a great store there for used boat parts.  (We almost found the replacement propeller we needed there). Some of the stuff might have been sold to them.

There is a unmentioned problem, though.  Florida is where people go to retire.  After they retire they die.  Their families might take their bodies back north, but their stuff stays there. 

We had a friend who was a collector of colored pressed glass who retired there, rather than to his second house in the French Quarter.  He knew other pressed glass collectors and when he got terminal cancer, he contacted those collectors and sold the parts of his collections to them that they wanted. 

He talked about the surprising value of those TV sets that had the picture tube up on a stalk. 

Someone had sold one for $45 and it didn't work, so word went out to 'antique' mega store stall holders that someone in Miami was looking for one that did work.  After finding four more that didn't one finally turned up in working order.   

eta The TV is a Philco Predicta, and according to Google and ebay they are worth more now. If you were willing to store them for 15+years.

Because....south Florida when furniture goes to retire.

Edited March 27, 2019 by enoughcats
finally remembered the name of the TV. My brain is a hoard

[funky-rat]

18 minutes ago, 3girlsforus said:

 I just started watching this but wow - Donna is a grade A bitch. Sure we only see the one part but it seems like Jenny is in recovery and doing much better. Is she just trash for the rest of her life? How dare Donna talk to her like that. Jenny has admitted she made lots of mistakes and she’s gone through a lot. Guess Donna’s shit don’t stink.  Donna seems like she has a serious superiority complex while being a horrible human being.

I have a feeling she's cleaned up a lot of her mom's messes over the years (not just the junk, but other stuff too).  I also see she's very clearly one who cares about their standing and appearances, which makes her somewhat of a narcissist.  Bad combination.

[CrazyInAlabama]

I bet Donna was the one who had to take care of things when the mother divorced, and went off the rails, acting like a teenager, dating young guys, and becoming a hoarder.     I bet she was the one who took care of her younger sisters too.     I also suspect that Patricia, Bill, and the sister's back up plan when the city seizes all three houses for the $100k plus in fines, and forecloses on them, is to show up at Donna's door.     From what Jenny said, she does see her daughter, but her plan for her mother to clean up, and move her daughter into that house full of arguments, and second hand smoke, with strangers showing up at the house constantly will never happen.     

I know people like Donna that never leave the house without full makeup, jewelry, and dressy clothes.   It's just what they do.      I always thought it was a little over the top, but I suspect if Donna showed up in work clothes, with work gloves her mother would have said she was going to trash everything.   

I thought it was interesting that the three sisters seemed so different, but all were accused by Cory, Zasio, and Patricia of trashing useless garbage.      

The whole show this week was a joke.   Even if the woman had let them shovel everything in the house and yard into trucks, they couldn't have emptied three houses, including one two-story one, in a day each.   

Edited March 28, 2019 by CrazyInAlabama

[Pepper Mostly]

I would rather go to a homeless shelter than spend one night under Donna's roof. She may be the one who cleaned up the messes, but she does it so venomously, every act of kindness has a price tag attached, and served up with a spoonful of vinegar. (Heavy sigh)"Well, I guess you'll have to bring your useless, mooching ass to MY house, then. I guess I can add some more water to the gruel so we can all get a spoonful".

[3girlsforus]

37 minutes ago, funky-rat said:

I have a feeling she's cleaned up a lot of her mom's messes over the years (not just the junk, but other stuff too).  I also see she's very clearly one who cares about their standing and appearances, which makes her somewhat of a narcissist.  Bad combination.

I agree. I suspect she enjoys her status as the “good daughter” who rescued her screwed up sister’s kid and dealt with her completely messed up mom. It allows her to feel superior. Jenny and her opinions have no value because ‘she messed up’. No forgiveness or understanding. I would be far less charitable to Jenny if she was still on drugs, but being clean for 4 years is a significant accomplishment. She isn’t perfect and probably not even in a position to take her daughter back, but her sister should be celebrating that achievement with her instead of denegrating her. Frankly grinding her under her shoe and reminding her that she’s crap is the quickest way to help her back into addiction. 

[msrachelj]

On 3/20/2019 at 2:25 AM, MoldySpiceGirl said:

Watching this episode made my skin crawl and my blood boil.  Animal cruelty's a crime; she's a repeat offender.  Why aren't they tossing this nasty, demented, gaslighting abuser in the klink for that, at least?  

And how much are they paying the 800JUNK guys?  I can't imagine it's enough. 

it's crazy how many people get away with animal abuse. especially older people. they do that right here where i am. they get a friggin pass just beause they are elderly. it makes my blood boil also.

Edited March 27, 2019 by msrachelj
add

[msrachelj]

On 3/25/2019 at 10:20 AM, AZChristian said:

It was disgusting enough that the kids smelled when they went to school.  

those kids would have been better off in foster care until their mother got out of jail. what the fuck was cps and the kids mom thinking. now they are scarred for life. will never get over being shamed at school for smelling like shit. you can see they need therapy. should have stayed with a strange family instead of animal abusing nut case grannie.

[msrachelj]

On 3/20/2019 at 2:20 PM, Jennv said:

I don't get how they managed to put her back in the house without the city getting involved and condemning it. In my neighborhood if your grass grows a half inch to tall you have a citation the next day. And I live in the hood, y'all. 

agreed. pretty shoddy work by the city/town govt/ the neighbors must be LIVID. it was mentioned you could smell the house before you even got there. it is not fair to the other homeowners to have that nasty bitch living there. a contractor condemned it on national tv! wtf! the neighbors should be starting a petition and haul their asses down to the mayors office.

[3girlsforus]

Ok - I’m evil but I was cheering Bill smashing this stuff to bits. Looked like nice therapy to me. He gets his rage out and he makes sure she can’t claim she’s going to sell the stuff since now it’s smashed. 

[CrazyInAlabama]

I'm surprised Patricia wasn't out there with Gorilla glue putting things back together.     

[camom]

I agree that Donna was a total bitch to everyone (especially her sisters).  I think if Patricia was my mother, I would have been out of there after day 1.  There comes a point where you know you can't help, so you don't even try.  

[3girlsforus]

I don’t understand why all of these hoarders are catered to. It’s always about them. Bill lives in that house too but nothing can be thrown away until Patricia says so. Lack of progress is Bill’s fault because it’s done arguing over mildewed crap. Lack of progress is the daughters’ faults because they are throwing things away trying to utilize their last hope. But nothing is Patricia’s fault. Poor Patricia. Let’s all feel sorry for Patricia. This is a continued pattern with a lot of these shows. Everyone has to tip-toe around while Rome burns. 

[enoughcats]

6 minutes ago, 3girlsforus said:

This is a continued pattern with a lot of these shows. Everyone has to tip-toe around while Rome burns. 

I may be totally misremembering this, but I think it was on one of the US hoarder shows: one of the Dr's explained how fragile hoarders can be because if suddenly their stuff disappears, some have committed suicide. 

I am not a patient or understanding person so this sounded like so much crap to me, but if I remember that correctly, I can see a TV show pussyfooting around a mentally fragile person.  

Maybe we were better off in a peasant based agricultural economy when people had to work hard to eat.  No work=no eat= no roof over head in rain if you 'forgot' there were holes in your hovel's roof. 

[cpcathy]

My husband and I decided we want to start a company called "We're Going To Throw Your Shit Out, Lady."

That said, I watch every week having organized about 98% of spaces in my house, and I worry my MIL will end up like a version of Patricia. She used to sell antiques and still goes to thrift stores to look for stuff. A lot of stuff in her home are alleged antiques. She will bring us things for our home from hers because I know she feels better about where it's going. I was particularly reminded of this when Pat insisted the basketballs go to neighborhood kids and not be thrown out. What was the difference?

[mamadrama]

1 hour ago, enoughcats said:

I may be totally misremembering this, but I think it was on one of the US hoarder shows: one of the Dr's explained how fragile hoarders can be because if suddenly their stuff disappears, some have committed suicide. 

I am not a patient or understanding person so this sounded like so much crap to me, but if I remember that correctly, I can see a TV show pussyfooting around a mentally fragile person.  

Maybe we were better off in a peasant based agricultural economy when people had to work hard to eat.  No work=no eat= no roof over head in rain if you 'forgot' there were holes in your hovel's roof. 

My mom's a hoarder.  My therapist has compared it to taking away an addict's drug stash, yet leaving them with more than enough cash to buy more. This isn't a cleaning issue-these people are mentally ill. Reasoning doesn't work. Throwing everything out doesn't work. The idea is to curb the behavior and that, unfortunately, takes a shit ton of time. That's one of the main reasons they're handled with kid gloves. 

[DC Gal in VA]

20 hours ago, Giant Misfit said:

I just can't with that stuffed banana with the dreadlocks on the porch only because I know it was the final, sad chapter to this already sad (yet hysterical) story:

Tee hee GiantMisfit I knew from the gifs and videos that accompany your M600PL Live Chat posts that you were a "special" type of person, but you really outdid yourself with this one!😆 That was simultaneously sad, pathetic and hilarious.

The poor slob spent $300 on a carnival game trying to win an Xbox Kinect and then went home and took out his last $2300 to keep playing and all he got was that Reggae banana!?😱 I had to look this thing up since I had no idea what an Xbox Kinect was -- an old add-on to an Xbox -- which they don't even make anymore but eBay is full of them for about $30. Even brand new years ago, they were about $100. The scariest thing about this guy, if that was his child in the baby carriage, is that he procreated.

BTW, I totally missed that poor Patricia had one of these on "one" of her three porches, LOL!

[atlantaloves]

I really really really want to know the story on Billy Boy.....you guys know that guy doesn't have a job right? Man, this episode was freaky. But hey, at least no one was crapping on the floor, but this show has gone to hell. That was another fast forward special.   

[Minivanessa]

1 hour ago, mamadrama said:

My mom's a hoarder.  My therapist has compared it to taking away an addict's drug stash, yet leaving them with more than enough cash to buy more. This isn't a cleaning issue-these people are mentally ill. Reasoning doesn't work. Throwing everything out doesn't work. The idea is to curb the behavior and that, unfortunately, takes a shit ton of time. That's one of the main reasons they're handled with kid gloves. 

I'm so sorry that this illness has impacted you and your family. I've had to deal with it a bit in my so-called real life, but have not had it in my family. That's so hard.

I recently listened to a podcast of an interview with Cory Chalmers, who explained hoarding the same way as your therapist. He said something like, just going in and clearing out a hoarder's house, is like taking an addict's drugs and needles away and saying, "There, we've solved your problem. You're welcome." 

Edited March 27, 2019 by Jeeves

[CrazyInAlabama]

I wonder how much of the screaming, and smashing, the neighbors were treated to during the filming?      I bet living near Patricia and her hoards is horrifically bad for the neighbors.   She did say it had been a very long time since she had even been to the third, two story house.   

Whenever they've had follow ups on the hoarder shows, virtually no one has kept things clean, but is back to rehoarding almost immediately.     I bet whatever Patricia gave up has been replaced many times over, and I bet city hall in her town is going bonkers with the phone calls and visits from citizens about the authorities refusing to force clean ups, and keep the fines going.   

Honestly, this show has jumped the shark for me.    They may pretend to be helping people, but none of the hoarders really clean up, and whatever goes off on the trucks, is definitely coming back.    This season is just two hours each of sick people, who will never get better, or change.     

Edited April 2, 2019 by CrazyInAlabama

[terrymct]

17 hours ago, enoughcats said:

I may be totally misremembering this, but I think it was on one of the US hoarder shows: one of the Dr's explained how fragile hoarders can be because if suddenly their stuff disappears, some have committed suicide. 

I am not a patient or understanding person so this sounded like so much crap to me, but if I remember that correctly, I can see a TV show pussyfooting around a mentally fragile person.  

Maybe we were better off in a peasant based agricultural economy when people had to work hard to eat.  No work=no eat= no roof over head in rain if you 'forgot' there were holes in your hovel's roof. 

The other point is that if the hoarder doesn't agree that stuff should be thrown out, he or she will feel victimized by the clean up and immediately replace what was removed.

[funky-rat]

Another point is for the doctors to try to get to the root of what is causing this behavior, and try to make the hoarder see things differently.  Sometimes it works, but most of the time they just don't have the length of time it will take to figure it all out.  Letting them touch stuff is supposed to aid in their making better decisions, but breaking hoarding patterns is often a very lengthy process that the show just doesn't have time to do.

[ChicagoCita]

On 3/27/2019 at 9:13 AM, Pepper Mostly said:

No one could open his or her mouth without Donna pushing in with her two cents.

I can tell you exactly how she got that way, and I can't believe it's going to come across like I'm defending her, but here we go...

My dad remarried later in life, and had three kids. When they were tweens, my dad (who was the authority figure in the family) got very ill and pretty much checked out. My stepmother was a very passive woman who couldn't make a decision to save her life. So the oldest kid still at home, who was around 12 at the time, had to step into the role of family decision maker. Someone had to be in charge, and it fell to her. Poor kid. (I was living 2000 miles away and didn't know what was going on.) She had to bully her parents, and be in charge of the younger siblings. To this day, three decades later, that's her personality. She's known as "The General" to her family. She still bullies everyone and tries to herd us along. But that's what her dysfunctional family life created. That's how she coped. And going back on topic, that's what happened to Donna. Dad abandoned the family in 1986 - Mom went crazy trying to be a teenager again - someone had to be in charge and that was Donna, the oldest. And as mean and controlling as she is, that's what her dysfunctional family made her.

[Cherry Cola]

I felt like I needed a nap after all the talking and talking and talking of Donna and Pat and Pat's energy was exhausting!! It was nice to see what I imagine a hoard to be and not just someone who doesn't throw away their garbage and poopy diapers.  

I enjoy Cory Chalmers.  I think Zazio is nice, but she coddles the hoardee too much. 

[funky-rat]

21 minutes ago, ChicagoCita said:

I can tell you exactly how she got that way, and I can't believe it's going to come across like I'm defending her, but here we go...

My dad remarried later in life, and had three kids. When they were tweens, my dad (who was the authority figure in the family) got very ill and pretty much checked out. My stepmother was a very passive woman who couldn't make a decision to save her life. So the oldest kid still at home, who was around 12 at the time, had to step into the role of family decision maker. Someone had to be in charge, and it fell to her. Poor kid. (I was living 2000 miles away and didn't know what was going on.) She had to bully her parents, and be in charge of the younger siblings. To this day, three decades later, that's her personality. She's known as "The General" to her family. She still bullies everyone and tries to herd us along. But that's what her dysfunctional family life created. That's how she coped. And going back on topic, that's what happened to Donna. Dad abandoned the family in 1986 - Mom went crazy trying to be a teenager again - someone had to be in charge and that was Donna, the oldest. And as mean and controlling as she is, that's what her dysfunctional family made her.

I agree - I said something similar above, that it was clear she's cleaned up a lot of her mom's messes over the years (literally and figuratively).  But she also has a touch of narcissism, and that makes her a wee bit less sympathetic in my eyes.  I also fear she doesn't treat the niece in her care the best.  Bare minimum, I'm pretty sure that she trash-talks her sister to the girl.

[Pepper Mostly]

I don't dispute that Donna is the product of her wildly dysfunctional family dynamics. She's had to do a lot of cleaning up and damage control. Sadly, she's learned no kindness or compassion. She is the only one who is allowed to be right. The way she attacked her completely quiet and passive sister Gayle, for having the personality she has, froze my blood. And Jenny's been off drugs and trying to get some control over her life for four years now. She deserves her sister's support, not her derision. Donna is an adult and should be able to recognize that she is not a pleasant person and take steps to change her behavior. She chooses not to because she can be the queen bee, or it feeds her ego to be the only "functional" member of her fucked up family. And yes, she probably bullied Jenny into letting her take custody of her daughter, and I do not doubt for a minute that she trashes Jenny to Megan all the livelong day. "You don't want to end up like your foolish, drug addled mother" "like mother, like daughter" (with huge eyeroll) or "careful, that's how your poor mother got started". I still think she's a beast.

[ChicagoCita]

3 hours ago, terrymct said:

he or she will feel victimized by the clean up and immediately replace what was removed.

I had a controlling (now former) friend housesit for me over the summer a few years ago, and -without notice and certainly without my asking or consenting - she completely overhauled my house. She threw stuff out and reorganized everything from silverware drawers to cabinets to closets to changing my brand of cat litter. The feeling of being victimized was overwhelming. I can only imagine how that would feel to someone mentally ill, who drew no distinction between themselves and their stuff. I can see people committing suicide over it.

[funky-rat]

19 minutes ago, Pepper Mostly said:

I don't dispute that Donna is the product of her wildly dysfunctional family dynamics. She's had to do a lot of cleaning up and damage control. Sadly, she's learned no kindness or compassion. She is the only one who is allowed to be right. The way she attacked her completely quiet and passive sister Gayle, for having the personality she has, froze my blood. And Jenny's been off drugs and trying to get some control over her life for four years now. She deserves her sister's support, not her derision. Donna is an adult and should be able to recognize that she is not a pleasant person and take steps to change her behavior. She chooses not to because she can be the queen bee, or it feeds her ego to be the only "functional" member of her fucked up family. And yes, she probably bullied Jenny into letting her take custody of her daughter, and I do not doubt for a minute that she trashes Jenny to Megan all the livelong day. "You don't want to end up like your foolish, drug addled mother" "like mother, like daughter" (with huge eyeroll) or "careful, that's how your poor mother got started". I still think she's a beast.

Yep.  I feel badly that she had to clean up the mess over the years, but she needed some compassion, and less "This hurts our standing in this community!  This is a GOOD neighborhood - what will people think?" crap.  Trust me, people know her mom is BSC and don't hold her responsible.

[Mrs. Hanson]

21 hours ago, cpcathy said:

My husband and I decided we want to start a company called "We're Going To Throw Your Shit Out, Lady."

That said, I watch every week having organized about 98% of spaces in my house, and I worry my MIL will end up like a version of Patricia. She used to sell antiques and still goes to thrift stores to look for stuff. A lot of stuff in her home are alleged antiques. She will bring us things for our home from hers because I know she feels better about where it's going. I was particularly reminded of this when Pat insisted the basketballs go to neighborhood kids and not be thrown out. What was the difference?

That is funny because my husband wants to start a company called "1-800-Light-A-Match."

[3girlsforus]

36 minutes ago, Pepper Mostly said:

I don't dispute that Donna is the product of her wildly dysfunctional family dynamics. She's had to do a lot of cleaning up and damage control. Sadly, she's learned no kindness or compassion. She is the only one who is allowed to be right. The way she attacked her completely quiet and passive sister Gayle, for having the personality she has, froze my blood. And Jenny's been off drugs and trying to get some control over her life for four years now. She deserves her sister's support, not her derision. Donna is an adult and should be able to recognize that she is not a pleasant person and take steps to change her behavior. She chooses not to because she can be the queen bee, or it feeds her ego to be the only "functional" member of her fucked up family. And yes, she probably bullied Jenny into letting her take custody of her daughter, and I do not doubt for a minute that she trashes Jenny to Megan all the livelong day. "You don't want to end up like your foolish, drug addled mother" "like mother, like daughter" (with huge eyeroll) or "careful, that's how your poor mother got started". I still think she's a beast.

You put this so much better than I did. This is exactly what I was thinking. I wanted to reach through the TV and smack Donna and give Jenny and Gayle (Jenny especially ) a hug.

[Pepper Mostly]

22 minutes ago, 3girlsforus said:

I wanted to reach through the TV and smack Donna and give Jenny and Gayle (Jenny especially ) a hug.

Me too. Both of them were on the verge of tears when Donna lit into them. It must happen all the time. Gayle is a "pleaser" (Donna spit that word out like it was poison) probably because she's just trying to get along without bloodshed. Jenny has dealt with more tragedy in a lifetime than befalls most people. That she has found the resources to try to rebuild her life and stay off drugs is to be commended and supported. But Donna cannot let it go. I'd love to get a load of her husband. Is he the living embodiment of a Caspar Milquetoast, "yes dear" stereotype? Or is he a brawling manly man who expects his supper on the table and the kids clean and quiet when he gets home?

[LucyEth]

I don't think I have ever seen Dr. Zasio have to tell a family member to shut up.  Between Patricia and Donna I don't know who was worse.  I felt bad for the boyfriend he was trying to be tough and get things done and genuinely seemed to care for Jenny.  Pat seems the type to me to revert back because she views all this hoarding of crap as her livelihood.  

[cpcathy]

She will TOTALLY revert. She argued over every single item and had an excuse not to get rid of anything.

[CrazyInAlabama]

It dawned on me why the aftercare is always a separate item at the end of the show.   

Being a licensed psychologist doesn't entitle you to work with patients in states that you aren't licensed to practice.    So like a certain TV shrink with his own talk show, unless they're licensed in that state, they are just doing entertainment, not counseling. 

Six truck loads going to the dump, was not even a decent start.     I think the city only backed off to look reasonable for TV, and I hope they have thousands of messages and phone calls after this show to get them moving against three hoards of total garbage.      I knew everything that I needed to about Patricia when she was selling stuff right in the beginning of the 'clean up' process, and when she said she hadn't been to the third, two-story house in several years.  

The only way the neighbors will have their endless nightmare of Patricia and her junk end is when the fines mount so high, that the city forecloses on all three properties, cleans them out, and probably guts them, and resells to  contractors  or flippers.

Edited March 29, 2019 by CrazyInAlabama

[readheaded]

17 hours ago, 3girlsforus said:

You put this so much better than I did. This is exactly what I was thinking. I wanted to reach through the TV and smack Donna and give Jenny and Gayle (Jenny especially ) a hug.

I understand that Donna wasn't particularly nice, but I've seen a similar dynamic with my mom and aunt, with my mom in the Donna role.  My mom took care of my cousins over and over and over again with kindness, generosity, and patience because she felt horrible about how my aunt couldn't ever get her life together.   She never spoke unkindly about their mother to them, instead she took them to the library, cooked for them, bought them clothes, gave them a safe space to play in, etc.  My parents tried and tried and tried to help my aunt, who promised several times, to stop doing the things that made her and most significantly, her children's lives harder, but she didn't.  I can remember going to my aunt's apartment to get her infant son and there were roaches crawling in his crib.  Or, picking up her little toddler daughter from "daycare" where she laid on the floor in a dark apartment all day watching soap operas.  My aunt's kids suffered, her house was foreclosed on, etc., etc.  It's easy to feel sorry for Jenny when you don't have to keep cleaning up her messes, and if it were just her hurting herself, then it might be easier to let it go, but when her kid suffers, that's a whole different situation.  My guess is that Donna's been bailing Jenny out forever and is just done.  And, just because Jenny says she's clean now, that doesn't mean it's true.

Anyway, I get why people think Donna was unkind, but there are always two sides and in this case, Jenny put herself and her child at risk.  Whether Donna's nice or not, she's providing a home for her niece, which given the state of foster care in many places, is a gift to Jenny.  I'd be curious to see what Jenny's actively doing to make a sustainable life for herself and her child.   

Donna was probably put into the role as caretaker and "mom" when she was a kid and has been trying to hold everything together, which looks like she's being controlling.  It may be that she's a nasty person, or it could be that she's fulfilling the role she got put on her as a little kid and she's desperately trying to keep things from falling apart.  I see Donna panicking in the episode because she knows that if her mother doesn't listen, she'll probably be the person who'll ultimately be on the hook for all of it.  Unfortunately, kids who get put into that caretaker role grow up to be adults who are resented for doing what they were expected to do.

Edited March 29, 2019 by readheaded

[readheaded]

23 minutes ago, readheaded said:

Edited March 29, 2019 by readheaded

[ams1001]

On 3/26/2019 at 8:14 PM, Julyolo said:

He looks 20 years younger!

lol...I just started watching on demand, and when he said he was her boyfriend I said the exact same thing.

[ams1001]

On 3/27/2019 at 2:25 PM, 3girlsforus said:

Ok - I’m evil but I was cheering Bill smashing this stuff to bits. Looked like nice therapy to me. He gets his rage out and he makes sure she can’t claim she’s going to sell the stuff since now it’s smashed. 

Maybe they should start a "smash" business (like those places you can go and throw plates and pottery and such). 

Did they say how it came to be that she has three houses? A retired nurse who now sells junk? How much can she possibly make doing that?

Also, I was surprised how clean that pool looked.

Edited March 30, 2019 by ams1001

[enoughcats]

1 hour ago, ams1001 said:

On 3/26/2019 at 8:14 PM, Julyolo said:

He looks 20 years younger!

lol...I just started watching on demand, and when he said he was her boyfriend I said the exact same thing.

OTOH, we may be totally overestimating her age.  

The Florida sun is not kind and at some point the tanned women look as if they were tanned as in worked leather taken off corpse animals. I've been at marinas in South Florida and that weathered look is common.  IF the significant other spent his working life indoors five days a week, it could explain why he doesn't share her swarthy look.  

[ams1001]

1 minute ago, enoughcats said:

OTOH, we may be totally overestimating her age.  

The Florida sun is not kind and at some point the tanned women look as if they were tanned as in worked leather taken off corpse animals. I've been at marinas in South Florida and that weathered look is common.  IF the significant other spent his working life indoors five days a week, it could explain why he doesn't share her swarthy look.  

I just finished watching; toward the end one of the daughters mentions that she's 75.

[7788BeaconHighway]

Regarding Patricia's show, I was thinking about why the show felt unsatisfying. If I were the therapist, I would have appealed to her greed. I would have said, "Look, you're spending $250 a day, now to be $750 a day, for the privilege of re-selling stuff. Wouldn't it make more sense to stop acquiring stuff for right now and focus on selling the stuff you have? That way you avoid the fines and still make money." Then do CBT with her to practice controlling her urge to go out and acquire. That way, the yards get cleaned up and the garage starts to empty, and she's still spending 24/7 selling stuff.

I wonder if a different therapist, who specializes in CBT like Dr. Renardi or Dr. Tolin, would have handled this differently.

[DC Gal in VA]

On 3/28/2019 at 3:06 PM, Pepper Mostly said:

Me too. Both of them were on the verge of tears when Donna lit into them. It must happen all the time. Gayle is a "pleaser" (Donna spit that word out like it was poison) probably because she's just trying to get along without bloodshed. Jenny has dealt with more tragedy in a lifetime than befalls most people. That she has found the resources to try to rebuild her life and stay off drugs is to be commended and supported. But Donna cannot let it go. I'd love to get a load of her husband. Is he the living embodiment of a Caspar Milquetoast, "yes dear" stereotype? Or is he a brawling manly man who expects his supper on the table and the kids clean and quiet when he gets home?

ITA and sorry (not sorry) but I absolutely am not going to give Donna a pass on her nasty shitty behavior. I don't care if she stepped in as the take charge person years ago because plenty of people have done so and are still filling that role in their families but manage to do it with compassion and grace. Donna has none of those qualities.

Donna is a bully period. She also has the air of a sociopath to me. I recall a psychiatrist saying that one mark of a sociopath is their feeling that they can say or do whatever they want, to whomever they want but no one is allowed to do that to them. Case in point, does anyone remember the scene where she was being belligerent to Patricia and Patricia went completely ballistic on her ass? If you recall, she backed the Hell up with this shocked look on her face with eyebrows raised and mouth agape and she, like all bullies, shut up and backed down.

One thing that really pissed me off was that awful scene where she lit into Penny with that nasty remark about her choosing her boyfriends over her daughter. Totally hateful and uncalled for. The so-called therapist didn't even bother to intervene or even console Penny who definitely seems in need of a lot of mental health counseling. Nope, the therapist just went on like nothing happened. She should have nipped Donna's behavior in the bud right then and there but instead let it go on and on until way late in the show when she finally laid down the law by telling her to keep her mouth shut because she was not helping the situation. Useless.

In my younger years I was a much more meek and mild person and definitely a target for bullies. However, I guess that as I got older I got tougher and meaner 'cause that bitch Donna would have ONE TIME to speak to me the way she spoke to her family since I would hit her with a mega dose of D.C. on her disgusting ass or, as I like to say, "Please don't make me act like where I came from" LOL!😆

[CrazyInAlabama]

My view is the therapists who aren't really helpful at all on this show, and everyone else is devoted to getting the most drama possible, and doing anything to get enough film to have it air.   I don't think anyone actually thinks the clean up will be total, and will last for any time at all.     I wonder about the rosy picture the production company paints to get all of the relatives to wade through the muck , and participate?    So many of the family members haven't been inside the hoard houses in years, so dragging them back for the filming is pointless.      I also wonder what is said to get the relatives, and friends who walk away to come back?    

I don't care how much they clean out, the hoarders have one goal in life, and it's to have as much stuff in their house and property as they can get in there, and show that no one can tell them what to do.    

Edited March 31, 2019 by CrazyInAlabama

[Mothra]

13 hours ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

My view is the therapists who aren't really helpful at all on this show, and everyone else is devoted to getting the most drama possible, and doing anything to get enough film to have it air.   I don't think anyone actually thinks the clean up will be total, and will last for any time at all.     I wonder about the rosy picture the production company paints to get all of the relatives to wade through the muck , and participate?    So many of the family members haven't been inside the hoard houses in years, so dragging them back for the filming is pointless.      I also wonder what is said to get the relatives, and friends who walk away to come back?    

I don't care how much they clean out, the hoarders have one goal in life, and it's to have as much stuff in their house and property as they can get in there, and show that no one can tell them what to do.    

Yep.  The goal of Hoarders is to show us horrifyingly overstuffed properties and the sickening conditions some people live in not how people who hoard can be helped.  I don't think there is any belief at all among the therapists that they are doing any good forcing the hoarders to "make good decisions."   The hoarders don't learn anything from the experience because their problem isn't one of learning; it's a serious mental illness that deserves serious treatment, probably including medication to lower their anxiety levels.  I went through stages watching this show:  at first I thought they should take the hoarder away on a little vacation and clean it all up while they were gone; then I bought into the idea that it was important for the hoarder to feel she has control over what's thrown out or kept; now I'm back to get the hoarder out of there and clean it up, if only for the sake of family and the neighbors.  Of course the hoarder will have it back to the way it was as soon as possible, but at least there would be a break from fines and the families could see just how sick their relative is and make plans to put them into some kind of residential treatment.  But the way it's being done exacerbates bad feelings among family members and causes unnecessary pain to everyone involved.

And shame on me for watching.

[Taeolas]

So A&E shows older episodes on Sunday morning. Today, they showed a half episode; a repeat of Episode 83. It was the Fuzzy and Fredd part of the episode, not the Nancy part. I was confused watching it because it felt very choppy compared to other episodes, and then I realized I only had 30 minutes and a second hoarder was missing.

Did A&E just cut it down to fit their gap in the schedule? Or is there some other reason the Nancy story would have been cut from the episode? I'm drawing a blank on the Nancy hoard and the Wiki description isn't really helpful. 

As for Fuzzy and Fredd, they really needed to cash in the reality checks they were getting. The screens at the end seemed to imply they were starting to finally mature a little, but I don't know if it would last. Still if their warehouse was cleared out and out of their hands, it would probably be considered a win for their situation. 

[Stillhere2.0]

On 3/26/2019 at 6:14 PM, Julyolo said:

She looks like she should have hoarded some serious sunscreen. Is that her husband? He looks 20 years younger!

20 ? I say 30...

Bill clearly likes haggard old women.

[AZChristian]

3 minutes ago, Stillhere2.0 said:

20 ? I say 30...

Bill clearly likes haggard old women.

Who had enough money at some point to buy THREE houses in Florida, and then buy enough crap to fill them all to the rafters.

[xwordfanatik]

2 hours ago, AZChristian said:

Who had enough money at some point to buy THREE houses in Florida, and then buy enough crap to fill them all to the rafters.

I wonder if a previous spouse died and left her a small fortune?  Surely her working salary wouldn't have been enough to buy three houses, and as you said, fill them with all that stuff?  

That blue eye shadow was just garish.  No doubt, too much sun and cigarettes aged her prematurely.