Instinct - General Discussion

[Guest]

This topic replaces the old Instinct forum which has been vaulted at the location below:  http://forums.previously.tv/forum/3263-instinct-v/

[AnimeMania]

Instinct Season 2 premire       June 16        9 p.m.     CBS

https://deadline.com/2019/03/elementary-premiere-date-instinct-blood-and-treasure-cbs-summer-1202582851/

[shapeshifter]

9 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

Instinct Season 2 premire June 16 9 p.m. CBS

https://deadline.com/2019/03/elementary-premiere-date-instinct-blood-and-treasure-cbs-summer-1202582851/

I'm still annoyed about last season's plagiarized episode being pretty much shrugged off by all parties:
https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/news/bones-instinct-scene-copied-plagiarised-s01e03-s05e03-secrets-and-lies-amish-a8289476.html
and:
http://thesmudge.com/shapeshifter/Roswell/plagiarism-instinct.html
Maybe I should take this up with my therapist since no one else seems bothered.

Anyway, like a moth to a flame and like a viewer to Alan Cumming, I'll be watching if I still can.

Edited March 27, 2019 by shapeshifter

[Clanstarling]

3 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

I'm still annoyed about last season's plagiarized episode being pretty much shrugged off by all parties:
https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/news/bones-instinct-scene-copied-plagiarised-s01e03-s05e03-secrets-and-lies-amish-a8289476.html
and:
http://thesmudge.com/shapeshifter/Roswell/plagiarism-instinct.html
Maybe I should take this up with my therapist since no one else seems bothered.

Anyway, like a moth to a flame and like a viewer to Alan Cumming, I'll be watching if I still can.

I don't even remember the episode, though I do remember the discussion. I guess I wasn't particularly bothered (maybe I was in a forgiving mood).

Speaking of Alan, I listened to his memoir "Not My Father's Son" after eye surgery a few months ago. I was expecting funny, but it was far from it. But exceedingly compelling.

[Trey]

Per TVline, the show will be back on Sunday, June 16 at 9 pm.

[Trey]

Apparently, here in Canada, Global is not airing the show until June 30 at 9 pm. 

From what I could find online, June 16 is still good for US viewers.

[UncleChuck]

On 6/7/2019 at 12:21 PM, Trey said:

From what I could find online, June 16 is still good for US viewers.

On Sunday, June 16, CBS is broadcasting the Tony Awards all evening.

Edited because I cannot read a tv schedule (or a calendar, apparently).

Edited June 9, 2019 by UncleChuck

[weathered1]

According to the actors on social media, it premieres on June 30.

[Trey]

I think the Tony awards are on tonight.

[Misslindsey]

Like @weathered1 said it is June 30th. According to this CBS is airing The Good Fight on June 16th with two episodes the first two weeks, which pushed back this show.

[Trey]

I apologize if I misled anyone.   They changed things and didn't send me a memo.🙄

[AnimeMania]

6 hours ago, Trey said:

I apologize if I misled anyone.   They changed things and didn't send me a memo.🙄

Yeah, I know Tony as well, he's not great at communicating.

Edited June 9, 2019 by AnimeMania

[possibilities]

I watch this show because I like Alan Cumming, and I like that his character on this show is gay and I like his show-husband. I also like that they showcased how dangerous and horrible malignant narcissism is.

But... I really think this is not a very well written or executed show. It's so thinly plotted, acted, and written, I feel embarrassed watching it.

Was it this bad last season? I had been looking forward to its return, but...????

[rhys]

4 minutes ago, possibilities said:

I watch this show because I like Alan Cumming, and I like that his character on this show is gay and I like his show-husband. I also like that they showcased how dangerous and horrible malignant narcissism is.

But... I really think this is not a very well written or executed show. It's so thinly plotted, acted, and written, I feel embarrassed watching it.

Was it this bad last season? I had been looking forward to its return, but...????

Yes to everything you wrote! It's funny as I feel exactly the same.

[shapeshifter]

7 minutes ago, possibilities said:

Was it this bad last season?

yes

[LisaM]

Quote

I watch this show because I like Alan Cumming, and I like that his character on this show is gay and I like his show-husband. I also like that they showcased how dangerous and horrible malignant narcissism is.

But... I really think this is not a very well written or executed show. It's so thinly plotted, acted, and written, I feel embarrassed watching it.

Was it this bad last season? I had been looking forward to its return, but...????

100% agree. I watched it last night and remembered why I stopped watching last season. It is just not good. I can't believe that this got a second season. 

[Trey]

You all make valid points - it is not a particularly good show and I too wondered how it got renewed.

And yet...I enjoyed it last night, maybe because I didn't have high expectations for it, or because nothing else was on anyway.  I think the two leads and their love interests have a great deal of charm and chemistry. When it comes right down to it, I mostly like shows because of the main characters, not the plots which, even on the best shows, are sometimes pretty thin.

And they've introduced what could be an interesting continuing story line so I will stay with it. Unless it gets really stupid:)

[meira.hand]

17 minutes ago, Trey said:

You all make valid points - it is not a particularly good show and I too wondered how it got renewed.

And yet...I enjoyed it last night, maybe because I didn't have high expectations for it, or because nothing else was on anyway.  I think the two leads and their love interests have a great deal of charm and chemistry. When it comes right down to it, I mostly like shows because of the main characters, not the plots which, even on the best shows, are sometimes pretty thin.

And they've introduced what could be an interesting continuing story line so I will stay with it. Unless it gets really stupid:)

This. I actually found this episode an improvement on last season. By making  Julian part of the team and creating the two couples dynamics with the partners being left out so often, it almost became a relationship dramedy at times. I just ignore the actual cases plots and enjoy it for what it is: a mental palate cleanser between the many complex/ heavy/dark/stressing shows that I also watch.

Edited July 1, 2019 by meira.hand

[shapeshifter]

I fell asleep watching last night, but I may try to catch it later.

I'm still bitter about the plagiarism issue with 1.3 "Secrets and Lies": Instinct: The Negligence in the Writing

[zoey1996]

Table for one please.  I really liked it last season, and I enjoyed last night's episode as well.  I started watching due to Alan Cumming, but kept watching because to me, it is a good show.

I never watched Bones, so had no idea that it was copied.

[shapeshifter]

Okay. I watched it. My thoughts:

• A little too "on the nose" that Dylan is talking about narcissists to his class and then that's what the episode is about
  --for examples of better use of parallel plot points, see any episode of Major Crimes (2012-2018).
   
• In the class, demonstrating narcissism, will Jenny choose
  • to get a B- for the course if it means all the other students get C's?
  • to get a B+ for the course if all the other students get A's?

         Jenny chooses the B- even though no student would do that
         since it would lower her overall GPA in relation to all students.

• The cryogenic chamber would have had a fail safe switch to turn off in the event of, say an earthquake causing something to block the door.
   
• "Killer's Remorse" is not a real Psyc term, but then neither are psychopath or sociopath (it's officially "Antisocial Personality Disorder") so I'll let it go, plus, it was cute when Lizzy used it. It just wasn't used in the best way (maybe they should hire more Bones writing alums).
   
• Best line was "Let it go. Let it go" in relation to the Frozen corpse, but it didn't work with the following lines, so: fail. 
   
• Hair:
  • Lizzy's new do is cute, but falls in her face, so not really good for tackling perps or skulking around corners; the old do worked better that way.
  • Dylan's gray is so. much. better. than the dyed black (and his suits this year are perfection)
  • Naveen Andrews' hair styling has always repelled me; can he please get a makeover too? I know. It's the actor's trademark. *sigh*  
     
• I would want Lizzy's sheets if my bedroom was as big.
   
• The flowers being delivered to work and the know-it-all colleagues asking what he did to be in the doghouse is so unoriginal that I heard it a few days ago on another show.
  And, BTW, not always true IRL.

Overall? I'll give it a B-

[TigerLynx]

I like Alan Cummings, Naveen Andrews, the premise of the show, etc., but the writers are weak on the delivery.  They have the elements.  They need to work on the presentation.

[EAG46]

I know this show is stupid, but I like it anyway. *Love* Alan Cumming and that his marriage is realistic and loving and no big deal that it's between two men. Love that Lizzie gets to be the one that beats up people. Looking forward to the Hot Nebraska Cop's story and if he breaks up Lizzie and Julian. [I sort of sense maybe her wanting him to share more of himself will end things between them. I could be wrong.] 

[AnimeMania]

2 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

• In the class, demonstrating narcissism, will Jenny choose
  • to get a B- for the course if it means all the other students get C's?
  • to get a B+ for the course if all the other students get A's?

         Jenny chooses the B- even though no student would do that
         since it would lower her overall GPA in relation to all students.

• The cryogenic chamber would have had a fail safe switch to turn off in the event of, say an earthquake causing something to block the door.

The difference from saying you got the highest grade in the class vs getting the worst grade in the class. Some teachers say they never give out A+ because there is always room for improvement.

If the killer is the person who makes the cryogenic chamber, then the fail safe can be overridden.

[Kelda Feegle]

14 hours ago, Trey said:

You all make valid points - it is not a particularly good show and I too wondered how it got renewed.

And yet...I enjoyed it last night, maybe because I didn't have high expectations for it, or because nothing else was on anyway.  I think the two leads and their love interests have a great deal of charm and chemistry. When it comes right down to it, I mostly like shows because of the main characters, not the plots which, even on the best shows, are sometimes pretty thin.

And they've introduced what could be an interesting continuing story line so I will stay with it. Unless it gets really stupid:)

I watched three serious shows that needed concentration prior to this so it was a welcome bit of lighter respite for me. Lizzie still annoys me tho.

[Mermaid Under]

Quote

Table for one please.  I really liked it last season, and I enjoyed last night's episode as well.

I'll join you if you want some company.   I guess it is matter of what is on offer.  I only have basic TV, so I have to be satisfied with what is on the major networks and PBS.   Compared to most of the drek that is on network TV (reality and game shows starring comedians who aren't charming at all) this is top notch.

[ALenore]

42 minutes ago, Mermaid Under said:

 Compared to most of the drek that is on network TV (reality and game shows starring comedians who aren't charming at all) this is top notch.

17 hours ago, EAG46 said:

Looking forward to the Hot Nebraska Cop's story

I enjoyed the show too, I need to watch some shows that are fairly light and easy to follow.  I also love Alan Cummings and Naveen Andrews.

One thing I noticed (since I always read the credits at the beginning of the show), is that the actor who plays the Hot Nebraska Cop is named Travis Van Winkle. And he's investigating the case involving a victim the New York cops are calling Rip Van Winkle (though he is calling his victim Sleeping Beauty).  Coincidence? I think not.

[AnimeMania]

4 hours ago, ALenore said:

One thing I noticed (since I always read the credits at the beginning of the show), is that the actor who plays the Hot Nebraska Cop is named Travis Van Winkle. And he's investigating the case involving a victim the New York cops are calling Rip Van Winkle (though he is calling his victim Sleeping Beauty).  Coincidence? I think not.

Are you saying he is a Coppy Cat Killer?

[12catcrazy]

Ok, so another vote for enjoying this as a light, easy to watch show, even though I'm not looking forward to seeing our hero and his husband be baby daddies (ugh for kids on these types of shows).  

I totally love Julian and Lizzy and hope they stay a couple, and I usually don't like romantic stuff on these types of shows either but I like both characters and like their chemistry.  I'm glad to see this show back! 

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, 12catcrazy said:

Ok, so another vote for enjoying this as a light, easy to watch show, even though I'm not looking forward to seeing our hero and his husband be baby daddies (ugh for kids on these types of shows).  

Actually, if the baby stuff is anything like we saw in this ep, bring it on! Total cuteness squared.

[possibilities]

I'm happy to have excuses for why I watch, and I do plan to continue watching. Alan C and his show-hubs are keeping me here.

I assumed Nebraska guy was the killer, and was surprised Dylan just accepted his cover story at face value. I could be wrong, though. I'm not actually that good at predicting even predictable cop show plots.

This show is definitely the cutest cop show I've seen. If they add a baby, it will have zero competition in that regard, because seriously-- no way are they going to dial back the cute if they pair Dylan's husband with a baby full time. I see him wearing that baby in a sling when he goes to court. And I WILL tune in to see it.

Lizzie making the tackles is a good element, as well. I have trouble believing it because to me she looks brittle and not athletic at all, but I'll take it over most of the things I have to suspend disbelief over.

Bones made the crime scenes gruesome. This show makes them look like all killers are interior decorators or window dressers. Again, quaint and cute.

But I'm watching. I'm not trying to convince anyone not to. I'm just kind of shocked that I'm still here, as this isn't the kind of show I'd usually go for.

I liked the malignant narcissism exposition. Seems like important info to put out there.

Edited July 2, 2019 by possibilities

[Driad]

6 minutes ago, possibilities said:

Lizzie making the tackles is a good element, as well.

Could you see her shoes?  I tried but couldn't.  If they are sensible for running and kicking, that's another point for this show.

[shapeshifter]

2 hours ago, Driad said:

Could you see her shoes?  I tried but couldn't.  If they are sensible for running and kicking, that's another point for this show.

Yes:

[OoogleEyes]

13 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Yes:

Awesome. Some great kicking ass shoes!

[12catcrazy]

I also think that there was something last season about Lizzie being a runner but I could be mixing that up with another show.  

The one beef I had about this episode was Lizzie's boss just showing up with her suitcase without a phone call or anything.  Something like that takes real gall.  I mean, I guess Her Majesty figures that Lizzie has no life or something and just assumes that all she has to do is show up and the guest room is waiting for her.   And I guess it's a way to keep Liz having to go the extra mile to keep her relationship with "Jules" a secret.  

[Trey]

20 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Actually, if the baby stuff is anything like we saw in this ep, bring it on! Total cuteness squared.

Yes, that was really cute. "Row, row, row your boat...".

[AnimeMania]

58 minutes ago, 12catcrazy said:

I also think that there was something last season about Lizzie being a runner but I could be mixing that up with another show.  

The one beef I had about this episode was Lizzie's boss just showing up with her suitcase without a phone call or anything.  Something like that takes real gall.  I mean, I guess Her Majesty figures that Lizzie has no life or something and just assumes that all she has to do is show up and the guest room is waiting for her.   And I guess it's a way to keep Liz having to go the extra mile to keep her relationship with "Jules" a secret.  

There was also that episode where she was exercising in the park and met a scammer.

Good to see Lizzie's home life since we got to see the sick dog everybody was worried about in the first season. I wonder if they are going to continue with that story line.

[Neurochick]

On 7/1/2019 at 11:51 AM, zoey1996 said:

Table for one please.  I really liked it last season, and I enjoyed last night's episode as well.  I started watching due to Alan Cumming, but kept watching because to me, it is a good show.

I never watched Bones, so had no idea that it was copied.

I'll sit at that table with you.  I like this show, it's not great but I like it.  I watched a few episodes of Bones, thought it sucked and never watched again.

[Tyro49]

As the door to the cryogenic chamber was blocked with a physical object a fail-safe button wouldn't have helped.

I also like light, simple shows this time of year.

[AnimeMania]

1 hour ago, Tyro49 said:

As the door to the cryogenic chamber was blocked with a physical object a fail-safe button wouldn't have helped.

The disabling the fail safe allowed the chamber to continue to remain cold even after the timer went off. I think there was a time fail safe where the chamber would be cold for a maximum of 3 minutes before it warmed back up and there was probably a lower limit fail safe on how cold the chamber could get.

[shapeshifter]

On 7/1/2019 at 11:25 AM, shapeshifter said:

The cryogenic chamber would have had a fail safe switch to turn off in the event of, say an earthquake causing something to block the door.

5 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

The disabling the fail safe allowed the chamber to continue to remain cold even after the timer went off. I think there was a time fail safe where the chamber would be cold for a maximum of 3 minutes before it warmed back up and there was probably a lower limit fail safe on how cold the chamber could get.

There was a Really Obvious sign on the door of the cryogenic chamber warning against staying in more than the maximum time, so I assumed that meant the onus was on the user to get out in time --rather than there actually being a fail safe shut-off mechanism, which there should have been, IMO.

[AnimeMania]

1 hour ago, shapeshifter said:

There was a Really Obvious sign on the door of the cryogenic chamber warning against staying in more than the maximum time, so I assumed that meant the onus was on the user to get out in time --rather than there actually being a fail safe shut-off mechanism, which there should have been, IMO.

That just like saying that if someone is in a tanning bed they should be the ones that have to get themselves out before they burn. Sometimes people fall asleep. There should be an automatic cut-off when someone stays more that the recommended time.

[possibilities]

She was shown setting the timer. I thought the problem was that the device was hacked, so the fail safe was defeated.

[AnimeMania]

4 hours ago, possibilities said:

She was shown setting the timer. I thought the problem was that the device was hacked, so the fail safe was defeated.

Yes, that is what happened.

[shapeshifter]

13 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

That just like saying that if someone is in a tanning bed they should be the ones that have to get themselves out before they burn. Sometimes people fall asleep. There should be an automatic cut-off when someone stays more that the recommended time.

Yes, that's what I was trying to say—and that the writers missed that point. Sorry if I'm still not being clear.
  
  

On 7/3/2019 at 7:37 AM, OoogleEyes said:

Awesome. Some great kicking ass shoes!

And, in case that was a body double, she's also wearing the same sensible shoes with the same outfit when she and Dylan are doing a walk'n'talk.

Edited July 5, 2019 by shapeshifter

[statsgirl]

On 7/1/2019 at 12:25 PM, shapeshifter said:

• In the class, demonstrating narcissism, will Jenny choose
  • to get a B- for the course if it means all the other students get C's?
  • to get a B+ for the course if all the other students get A's?

         Jenny chooses the B- even though no student would do that
         since it would lower her overall GPA in relation to all students.

It is a very narcissist move, though. Narcissists cannot stand anyone else to do better than they do and they are willing to take a worse situation as long as they're the top one (B- is better than the C's the others get).  Someone who tears down what the predecessor has done just because it was done by someone else. Especially if it was done better by someone else.

My question is how did he know that Jenny was a narcissist?

On 7/3/2019 at 11:19 AM, AnimeMania said:

Good to see Lizzie's home life since we got to see the sick dog everybody was worried about in the first season. I wonder if they are going to continue with that story line.

I was very glad to see that the dog is still around.

[shapeshifter]

21 hours ago, statsgirl said:

On 7/1/2019 at 11:25 AM, shapeshifter said:

• In the class, demonstrating narcissism, will Jenny choose
  • to get a B- for the course if it means all the other students get C's?
  • to get a B+ for the course if all the other students get A's?

         Jenny chooses the B- even though no student would do that
         since it would lower her overall GPA in relation to all students.

It is a very narcissist move, though. Narcissists cannot stand anyone else to do better than they do and they are willing to take a worse situation as long as they're the top one (B- is better than the C's the others get).  Someone who tears down what the predecessor has done just because it was done by someone else. Especially if it was done better by someone else.

My question is how did he know that Jenny was a narcissist?

Having thought way too much about this, and having taught college students, I decided Jenny is really a sharp team player who Dylan can count on to give the "right" answer. That is, she was just choosing the B- because it demonstrated his point about narcissists. She was playing along with the "joke." 
Maybe. 

[Arkay]

I am done with this show. I found it kind of cringe-inducing last year, but tonight was the end of the line for me. The acting is wooden (even Cummings, somehow), the plots are predictable, the dialogue is trite. They don't make as good a use of this supposed "instinct" as they could. If Lizzie hadn't found the car, then Dylan's endless rumination of why the victim's music had changed would have sputtered out. 

It was just boring. All well-worn tv tropes---are we ready for a baby? Will Hot Rube Cop find an important clue? Can Julian and Lizzie keep their love secret? And so on.

[AnimeMania]

Dylan says let's pick the way we want to get a baby and Andrew says you don't really want to pick the way we are going to have a baby. It left me confused and then the drama went on way too long. It only ended when Dylan said let's pick all the ways we want to get a baby.

[shapeshifter]

I can't disagree with either of the negative reviews above, but for now I'm still willing to Cringe Watch (I think that's a cousin once removed of Hate Watching).

Because the music was not cringey (IMO) I looked up and learned:

• The suicidal epileptic musician was played by Clyde Lawrence, who, with his real life sister, does perform (npr.org/2017/04/13/523759335/brother-sister-duo-lawrence-on-touring-and-the-meaning-of-home).
• And the actress who played his sister is Lizzy DeClement, but I can't readily determine if she is a real musician or was just acting the part, but it did seem she was really singing.