S06.E14: Sex, Lies & Facials

[imjagain]

I don't blame Carole for being interested in talking to the facialist. She says in her blog the woman admits that Sonja knew exactly what was going to be said. I'm sure Carole suspected as much.

Sonja is a nasty piece of work. She wanted Carole to think that this man, who was very important to Carole betrayed her. I don't know what Carole and Russ' relationship was, open or not but the idea that he would sleep with her friend is the part that would bother me and I'm sure Carole as well. Sonja sat there knowing what was being said and never corrected it because she wanted it out there.

[ryebread]

Considering all this I can certainly understand why Carole would be vested enough in things going on that actually involve her to do a little digging.

I understood asking Sonja.  Even asking Russ.  But the actions of booking an appointment and putting on sunglasses and a scarf to get the scoop from the facialist is a little weird, imo.

 

But to me, it actually sounds more like a lie.  Did she get the scoop from the facialist while wearing sunglasses and a scarf?  Who gets a facial wearing sunglasses?  Or, do we believe Satako didn't recognize Carol even after she took the sunglasses off?  Because it sounds like even after their nice chat and Carole passing on that cautionary tale, Satako still thought Carole was a manicurist.  Am I reading this right? Sounds fishy.  The reporter in her might have kicked in, but it sounds like so did the fiction writer.  Kind of a dumb story.

Then the reporter in me kicked in. I wanted to get to the bottom of this rumor so I paid a visit to the Satako. I booked the appointment under my maiden name hoping to get some info before she recognized me. Picture me with a scarf tied around my head and sunglasses. After this gig's up, I'll be a spy.

Satako was open and charming and we had a nice chat about friendship and gossip. She told me Sonja already knew what she was going to say and I told her the story of The Women. When she asked me in her charming broken English, "Am I manicurist?" I said yes and when she asked what happened to the manicurist I told her a white lie to make my point: "She was never heard from again." Her eyes got big, and I left her a great tip: "Don’t repeat gossip. It will hurt your business."

Really??

[Lucygirl2]

The smallest inkling of respect I had for Sonja vanished when she didn't seem to think there was anything wrong with sleeping with Russ while he was still involved with Carole.  It isn't cool even if Russ & Carole had been broken up. Where I am from you don't do shit like that to your friends/co-workers/ or anyone else you have more than a passing relationship with.  I gave Sonja (sorry that J has lost its sexiness) the side eye last season when she immediately jumped at Lu's sloppy seconds with the Pirate but forgave because Lu wasn't personally invested in him anyway.  But Carole & Russ had an actual relationship whether it was open or not.  I am completely against slut-shaming but even I was shaking my head at Sonja.

 

While I'm on my Sonja rant, I am so sick of hearing about her different "closets".  Go ahead, Sonja, & wear your St. Tropez underwear around NY! When you can barely afford to take a cab downtown, I doubt you'll be jet-setting off to St. Tropez anytime soon.

[Portae]

Because it sounds like even after their nice chat and Carole passing on that cautionary tale, Satako still thought Carole was a manicurist.  Am I reading this right? Sounds fishy.  The reporter in her might have kicked in, but it sounds like so did the fiction writer.  Kind of a dumb story.

 

No, Carole wasn't pretending to be a manicurist. The idea is that Satako recognized herself as the gossipy manicurist from The Women.

I don't think that Carole went to Satako to verify whether or not Russ and Sonja had slept together. I think that Carole already knew that it wasn't true, but wanted to get to the bottom of how the rumor got started and continued to circulate. So when she went to Satako, who confirmed that Sonja was the source of the rumor and knew that it would be revealed on camera, Carole realized that Sonja was an attention seeker who cared more about coming off as sexually desirable than the feelings of her friends.

[Midnight Cheese]

I'm not sure I follow this -- they were meeting at Sonja's house.  Where would Sonja have needed to be (other than her own house) relatively early in the day, dressed like a slob, to facilitate moving out of her house?

True, that -- I wasn't thinking when I passed along the theory that she was starting to spend nights at a rental, but wanted to maintain the facade that she would remain in the brownstone forever. 

 

 

Sonja is a nasty piece of work. She wanted Carole to think that this man, who was very important to Carole betrayed her. I don't know what Carole and Russ' relationship was, open or not but the idea that he would sleep with her friend is the part that would bother me and I'm sure Carole as well. Sonja sat there knowing what was being said and never corrected it because she wanted it out there.

Yes, 100%.  So either Sonja is fundamentally oblivious to other people's feelings, or she has been very angry at Carole, perhaps because of the 'buttfucking' TH about St. Barth's.  Neither is a good look.

 

 

I don't think that Carole went to Satako to verify whether or not Russ and Sonja had slept together. I think that Carole already knew that it wasn't true, but wanted to get to the bottom of how the rumor got started and continued to circulate. So when she went to Satako, who confirmed that Sonja was the source of the rumor and knew that it would be revealed on camera, Carole realized that Sonja was an attention seeker who cared more about coming off as sexually desirable than the feelings of her friends.

 

I really wonder where Sonja's head was when this stuff was being filmed, not just this season: in the Berkshires, she was sloppy, tactless, aggressive and tone-deaf with the 20-year old boat captain; in Saratoga, she had what looked like actual bed-head when she came in, drunk, ranting about 'bitches!'; last season, she was the pursuer and the flirter in St. Barth's with Thomas and Russ, not the reverse; the season before last, the guy she treated as her 'sexy boy-toy artist,' Brian, clearly had no respect whatsoever for her, and painted her in a ghastly, grey light - not the work of someone revering or really caring for his subject, especially knowing she was going to unveil the work at a party. 

 

None of that looks like a light-hearted, happy-go-lucky woman who just wants to have fun, never intends harm and only wants the best for everyone around her.

Edited June 14, 2014 by Midnight Cheese

[Talented Tenth]

 

I think she's extremely attractive and would have about as broad an appeal to men as any woman her age... except for the crazed behavior.  Sonja's looks and figure on a laid back, kind and gracious woman who didn't circle and dive bomb men like a bird of prey?  She'd be way ahead in terms of lining up the next retirement fund aka rich elderly husband.  Or even much younger men looking for a fling.  Or, god forbid, somebody age appropriate.

 

I think Sonja's problem is that she is nasty.  On the show we've seen her put her face in an ice-filled bidet, reach her bare hand in a toilet and clean out a toilet with her bare hands.  She seems unhygienic. 

[imjagain]

I think Sonja's problem is that she is nasty. On the show we've seen her put her face in an ice-filled bidet, reach her bare hand in a toilet and clean out a toilet with her bare hands. She seems unhygienic.

I have always wondered why Sonja has so many scenes around toilets? We have seen her cleaning them in the last couple seasons. If I knew I was filming that day I would make sure to scrub the bathroom the day before not on camera, Idk (shrug)I'm odd like that. Edited June 14, 2014 by imjagain

[zoeysmom]

I think the ship has sailed with these women sharing men.  Isn't Harry a Sonja, Aviva, Sonja, LuAnn, Sonja, LuAnn, Sonja kind of guy? . Wasn't it Heather and Carole who sought to point this out? Wasn't it Ramona who declared the subject of Harry tacky? Max was a Kelly/Sonja kind of guy.  So I really don't understand Carole's umbrage at the Russ discussion. Whose name was she clearing Russ', Sonja's or hers? I am certain Sonja and production knew exactly what the "facialist" was going to say-otherwise they would not have bothered to film her.  RHOBH has the tabloids RHONY has to enlist a "facialist" to spread gossip.  Production always has some sort of relationship with these bit players as they are required to sign releases and they will interview them to see what they can expect.  Filming is just too expensive to film random activities without return.

[Satchels of gold]

Carole is learning the hard way that reality tv isn't fun and games. I think she thought if she didn't act like a druken prostitution whore ,the show would not impact her real life. Sorry Carole, no one comes away unscathed. Bethenny almost did it, but then BEA took her down as well.

[zoeysmom]

No, Carole wasn't pretending to be a manicurist. The idea is that Satako recognized herself as the gossipy manicurist from The Women.

I don't think that Carole went to Satako to verify whether or not Russ and Sonja had slept together. I think that Carole already knew that it wasn't true, but wanted to get to the bottom of how the rumor got started and continued to circulate. So when she went to Satako, who confirmed that Sonja was the source of the rumor and knew that it would be revealed on camera, Carole realized that Sonja was an attention seeker who cared more about coming off as sexually desirable than the feelings of her friends.

Carole never wrote that Satako said that Sonja was the source of the rumor.  Carole said Satako said Sonja knew what she was going to say before she said it on camera.  So Carole really never found out the source of the rumor about Sonja and Russ.  I think Sonja point in her blog was valid as well she felt no need to tell Satako (actually Sonja said the beauty industry) to stop talking as it lends validity to their claim.

[Grneyedldy]

Yes, 100%.  So either Sonja is fundamentally oblivious to other people's feelings, or she has been very angry at Carole, perhaps because of the 'buttfucking' TH about St. Barth's.  Neither is a good look.

I don't think Sonja was upset about Carole's St. Barth comments. I think with Sonja, as long as Carole got the "fucking" part correct, the orifice used is irrelevant.

[ScoobieDoobs]

Sonja is a nasty piece of work. She wanted Carole to think that this man, who was very important to Carole betrayed her.

 

Just discovering Sonja is nasty?  I'll throw in -- silly, petty & self-absorbed for good measure.  Let's keep in mind the reason Sonja has a judgement against her for millions.  Er, she's a big ole con artist, so who knows what she's capable of.  Nobody should mistake her for being sweet & harmless.  She ain't.  Carole was poking at her & Sonja is biting back & it ain't pretty.

 

Oh, Carole thought she could stand to the side & just be an observer.  Yeah, right.  No fuckin' way, Carole.  That doesn't happen on a reality show.  She doesn't look too happy bout being dragged into the mud & dirt by Sonja.  Welcome to reality TV, hun.  You choose to do this shit, sweetie.  Enjoy.  Don't expect sympathy from us.

Edited June 14, 2014 by ScoobieDoobs

[CatMomma]

I'm not sure that Sonja would be mad at Carole regarding the implied "backdoor" comments.  Why would it bother her?  She's pretty open about her sex life.

 

But, I agree, Sonja does seem to have it out for Carole.  She pretty much took Aviva's side during bookgate, and now she wants it out there that she slept with Russ (supposedly. I don't buy it), while he was still with Carole.  She also seems to be gunning for Luann a bit, and I don't get it.  Even when Luann and Ramona were at each others throats, Sonja remained neutral.  

 

Either, a)Something happened between seasons to piss off Sonja, b) Sonja is just trying to cause drama for a story line, or c) she's fucking nuts.

 

I'm thinking c, personally.

[Portae]

I just think that Sonja likes attention and is also competitive with other women.

[Grneyedldy]

I'm not sure that Sonja would be mad at Carole regarding the implied "backdoor" comments.  Why would it bother her?  She's pretty open about her sex life.

 

But, I agree, Sonja does seem to have it out for Carole.  She pretty much took Aviva's side during bookgate, and now she wants it out there that she slept with Russ (supposedly. I don't buy it), while he was still with Carole.  She also seems to be gunning for Luann a bit, and I don't get it.  Even when Luann and Ramona were at each others throats, Sonja remained neutral.  

 

Either, a)Something happened between seasons to piss off Sonja, b) Sonja is just trying to cause drama for a story line, or c) she's fucking nuts.

 

I'm thinking c, personally.

Yes, Sonja has been definitely going after LuAnn this season. She's called her LuMan twice now. She said if Lu was with a jockey, she would roll over and kill him. And the rumor the manicurist was spreading sounded exactly like it came from Sonja......that Lu likes short French men so can dominate them during sex. That one has Sonja's name written all over it, especially considering that the French men that have been in Lu's life have been tall. Sonja is determined to try to make LuAnn out to be some gross Amazon woman.

[FozzyBear]

I'm not sure that Sonja would be mad at Carole regarding the implied "backdoor" comments. Why would it bother her? She's pretty open about her sex life.

But, I agree, Sonja does seem to have it out for Carole. She pretty much took Aviva's side during bookgate, and now she wants it out there that she slept with Russ (supposedly. I don't buy it), while he was still with Carole. She also seems to be gunning for Luann a bit, and I don't get it. Even when Luann and Ramona were at each others throats, Sonja remained neutral.

Either, a)Something happened between seasons to piss off Sonja, b) Sonja is just trying to cause drama for a story line, or c) she's fucking nuts.

I'm thinking c, personally.

I don't know. I thought the butt-fucking comment was pretty mean. It wasn't just the content, but the tone too. But then of all the bad behavior floating around St Bart's (Aviva, Sonja, Ramona. God that seemed like a hellish trip) I actually found Carol's the worst. Planning a dinner party for some but not all your guests was so rude in my opinion. Making fun of Luann was getting tiresome at that point and Carol was a little too excited to have more dirt. Letting Aviva blame Ramona and Sonjia for not getting a good greeting when Carol was the hostess was just chicken-shit. And Carol was beside herself with glee to tell the world that Sonjia took it up the ass. She just came across as such a bitch to me. An undercover bitch, but a bitch all the same. St Bart's was when I really came to the conclusion that Carol may make a good first impression (I don't think so but others do) but she is amazingly selfish and doesn't ever seem to think about other people until she's forced to.

Of course that does not excuse Sonja sleeping with Russ, if she did.

[CatMomma]

Fozzybear, I would agree with you, but Sonja seems to have forgiven Aviva, who went at her HARD last season.  Was the catty backdoor comment worse than the things Aviva said? If anything, Sonja seems to be kissing up to Aviva, who said horrible things about her last season.   She seems to be zeroing in on Carole and, to some extent, Luann.  

 

I mean, WTF did Luann do to Sonja?  It feels like we are missing something.  

 

 

I just think that Sonja likes attention and is also competitive with other women.

 

Portae, maybe it really is that simple.

Edited June 14, 2014 by CatMomma

[OFDgal]

quetzal:  I haven't clicked on the thread even once because I have a slight case of Carolenoia - I think Andy is stalking these threads and he's checking to  see how many hits George's thread is getting.   

 

I don't want him to think George is interesting enough for him to keep around for next season.  Assuming there is one.

 

Hi Andy!  /crazy

George is disgusting and I don't even want to look at his thread.  He won't be getting a hit from me either.

[FozzyBear]

Fozzybear, I would agree with you, but Sonja seems to have forgiven Aviva, who went at her HARD last season. Was the catty backdoor comment worse than the things Aviva said? If anything, Sonja seems to be kissing up to Aviva, who said horrible things about her last season. She seems to be zeroing in on Carole and, to some extent, Luann.

I mean, WTF did Luann do to Sonja? It feels like we are missing something.

Oh agree with you on that! Sonja is just all over the place projecting rage. Who knows why she's mad at people. I think a lot of it is probably about fairly innocent comments people have made about things she's sensitive about. And there seems to be little to no rhyme or reason.

My point was that taken alone, and not in relation to anything else anyone did, yes I think Carol's comment was bad. I was left with the worst impression of Carol of all the women after S1. She also seems to be one of the most reluctant to make an apology so maybe that's coming into play? As awful as Aviva is and as phony as her apologies seem, she has out in a decent amount of ass-kissing time trying to mend fences.

[Grneyedldy]

Andy doesn't give a shit about forums. Bravo has shut down 2 forums now, TWOP and Bravotv.com. Forums are passé. Andy only cares about trending on Twitter and Facebook. That is until the next new things come along.

There's some interesting stuff in the George thread. Both posts and links.

[RedheadZombie]

Carole is learning the hard way that reality tv isn't fun and games. I think she thought if she didn't act like a druken prostitution whore ,the show would not impact her real life. Sorry Carole, no one comes away unscathed. Bethenny almost did it, but then BEA took her down as well.

It's quite possible she's learning that being Andy Cohen's friend means very little. She had a good edit her first season. She's probably shocked at how she's being portrayed now.

Regarding Kelly, I never believed for a minute that Carole had watched this show. She's above that kind of thing. I think the comment she made about Aviva using Kelly's words was fed to Carole. Therefore, I think Carole treated Kelly like she would anyone she first met with nothing preconceived.

Regarding Sonja, I wouldn't be surprised if she and Russ had a drunken hookup. To me, Sonja is a skank who either screwed a friend's boyfriend, or simply lied about it to hurt the friend. I'm not sure which I consider worst.

[parisprincess]

Oh agree with you on that! Sonja is just all over the place projecting rage. Who knows why she's mad at people. I think a lot of it is probably about fairly innocent comments people have made about things she's sensitive about. And there seems to be little to no rhyme or reason

 

I'm trying to think of things Sonja is sensitive about.  She sure doesn't mind letting everyone know what an easy lay she is, and doesn't mind people seeing her drunken behavior.  And even though its probably not true, she has no problem bragging about sleeping with another woman's man, not to mention sharing with everyone when she's going commando.  I would imagine any sensitivity she has is about people knowing that she's not the rich Lady Morgan anymore and has entered Grey Gardens territory. 

[bosawks]

And the rumor the manicurist was spreading sounded exactly like it came from Sonja......that Lu likes short French men so can dominate them during sex. That one has Sonja's name written all over it, especially considering that the French men that have been in Lu's life have been tall. Sonja is determined to try to make LuAnn out to be some gross Amazon woman.

If that's the case I think Sonja had severely underestimated the viewers.

I think the majority of our responses are, "Luanne likes dominating short Frenchmen during sex, annnnnd who gives a fuck".

[OFDgal]

Just interjecting this here because I was shocked when I noticed it.

 

Did y'all notice that this episode's thread has almost 15,000 (FIFTEEN THOUSAND!!!) views?

 

PreviouslyTV, I'm duly impressed...I remember thinking the threads didn't look particularly active when I first joined but YOWZA!  

That's great.  I was a lurker on TWOP but decided to join in here to help the site grow.

[Grneyedldy]

If that's the case I think Sonja had severely underestimated the viewers.

I think the majority of our responses are, "Luanne likes dominating short Frenchmen during sex, annnnnd who gives a fuck".

Actually that would be a good story line for LuAnn. I can easily picture LuAnn as a dominatrix.

[MatildaMoody]

 

Well, as far as I can see, I don't know how anyone wouldn't be skeered to death of dealing with Kelly cuz her reputation now proceeds her, that she's a fuckin' crazy lunatic.  And the producers showed what a lunatic she is, just in case anyone could possibly not have known or had forgotten.  Wasn't that nice of those wonderful misogynist producers?  Mean streak much?  Is Lu really friends with wacko Kells?  Really?   Okaaay.  Still think Carole came off absolutely clueless.  She acts like she can read people so well.  Don't think so, Carole, hun.

But, her reputation only proceeds her based on what we have seen on the show. It's not like this is a show that has HUGE numbers. And, Carole wouldn't have had any pre-knowledge of what the producers were going to intercut during the filming of the episode. 

 

I do think that Luann has forged and is trying to maintain a friendship with Kelly. They have been photographed together when they weren't filming. That could totally be a media based friendship, but I don't think Carole would have anyway of knowing that a year and half ago. Kelly was introduced to Carole as a friend of Luann's. Kelly was well behaved and acted normal when they met. I just don't see how Carole should have thought anything other than, "She seems nice." I don't see how that makes her clueless.

[Rhetorica]

Looks like Bravo moved RHONY to 10:00. They put The People's Couch at 9:00. Are ratings that bad?

I also posted this on first looks. Wasn't really sure where it went. Don't scold me!

[ryebread]

Regarding Kelly, I never believed for a minute that Carole had watched this show.

Oh, I do.  She's Andy's bud.  He wanted her for the show so I can't imagine that she didn't watch prior seasons to see what she was getting herself into. 

 

But I agree with your first paragraph.  She's probably surprised Andy is allowing the edit she's getting.  Although, I don't think her edit is all that bad.  As bad edits go.

[ScoobieDoobs]

Kelly was introduced to Carole as a friend of Luann's. Kelly was well behaved and acted normal when they met. I just don't see how Carole should have thought anything other than, "She seems nice." I don't see how that makes her clueless.

 

Well, it makes her clueless to me cuz she obviously didn't watch Kelly when she was on the show & Carole clearly didn't even hear about how crazy & looney (and nasty as fuck, I might add, as she was to Alex) she has acted.  I'd say, as the experienced journalist Carole always claims to be, she's not getting the whole story & that would make her exceptionally clueless to me.  

 

See, that's the thing about Kells.  She can make sense for a few minutes.  Then she veers off into crazytown.  I have a friend who had to deal with her at her gig at AM New York & said she was very, very difficult.  She's capable of short, lite party conversations & not much more.  As a journalist, Carole stinks if she thinks Kells is nice & normal.  And yeah, I still think she's clueless if that's her conclusion on Kelly.  Can't convince me otherwise.  At least until Kells gets major psychiatric help -- which she won't cuz the fuckin' crazy ass lunatic doesn't think she needs it.

 

Andy doesn't give a shit about forums. Bravo has shut down 2 forums now, TWOP and Bravotv.com. Forums are passé. Andy only cares about trending on Twitter and Facebook. That is until the next new things come along.

 

Yeah, I agree he only cares about Twitter & Facebook, but he may have his peeps following some of the forums like this one.  It's a numbers game & Twitter & Facebook attract big numbers.  But given this thread alone has nearly 20 thousand views, it would be a mistake to ignore this forum.

 

Does any woman have a body like Kelly?  I recognized her right away & made the same just-smelled-poop face as Moaner.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2658206/Kelly-Bensimon-shows-toned-body-white-two-piece-Miami-vacation.html

Edited June 15, 2014 by ScoobieDoobs

[swankie]

Yes, Sonja has been definitely going after LuAnn this season. She's called her LuMan twice now. She said if Lu was with a jockey, she would roll over and kill him. And the rumor the manicurist was spreading sounded exactly like it came from Sonja......that Lu likes short French men so can dominate them during sex. That one has Sonja's name written all over it, especially considering that the French men that have been in Lu's life have been tall. Sonja is determined to try to make LuAnn out to be some gross Amazon woman.

 

 

Maybe Sonja tried to get with Johnny Depp Wannabe a second time and he turned her down for another tumble with Luann.  Sonja doesn't give me the impression that she's logical when it comes to being in a rivalry with other women for a man's affection.  I could see Fake Johnny Depp being more attracted to Luann than Sonja.  Luann comes off as having more money. lol

Does any woman have a body like Kelly?  I recognized her right away & made the same just-smelled-poop face as Moaner.

 

http://www.dailymail...i-vacation.html

 

 

Did anyone else get this vibe from seeing Kelly in her bikini?  https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQCrGboh-g-wHy8jJuexes4UFkjVlZav__FmXlZXE7ij9V6vO2DmQ

Edited June 15, 2014 by swankie

[MMLEsq]

... I am certain Sonja and production knew exactly what the "facialist" was going to say-otherwise they would not have bothered to film her.  RHOBH has the tabloids RHONY has to enlist a "facialist" to spread gossip.  Production always has some sort of relationship with these bit players as they are required to sign releases and they will interview them to see what they can expect.  Filming is just too expensive to film random activities without return.

Your point (which I agree with) raises another thought in my mind -- Sonja didn't just leave Kristen hanging when she strolled in late from her date from the night before -- she also must have known that she'd be arriving home to find Production there to capture her "walk of shame" on film. 

Edited June 15, 2014 by MMLEsq

[zoeysmom]

Your point (which I agree with) raises another thought in my mind -- Sonja didn't just leave Kristen hanging when she strolled in late from her date from the night before -- she also must have known that she'd be arriving home to find Production there to capture her "walk of shame" on film. 

It almost sounded to me as if  Sonja wanted to use a great line "victory lap" so production set up a scenario for her.  For someone who is so paranoid about the crystal being lifted it seems odd Sonja would allow a group of people in her home when she wasn't there.

[DeeplyShallow]

It almost sounded to me as if Sonja wanted to use a great line "victory lap" so production set up a scenario for her. For someone who is so paranoid about the crystal being lifted it seems odd Sonja would allow a group of people in her home when she wasn't there.

It's just all fake anyway. I agree, I bet she was miked up, dressed a fool and left before Kristen got there. Then, pretended to film a walk of shame/victory lap. Production stages crap all the time, I wouldn't doubt it here either. Plus, it fits with Sonja's storyline of being an unsanitary hooker- I mean, a desireable, carefree woman.

Edited June 15, 2014 by DeeplyShallow

[quaintirene]

Was that 'facialist' really a facialist?  Because if so, she just ruined her career.  No Real Real Housewife is going to head over to someone who gossips that freely with her clientele--on television yet!

 

As for the Beauty Queen and the allegations.  I have a horrible feeling she signed one of those can't-sue contracts thinking she'd get her face on tv and is now stuck with the result.  I wish something nasty would happen to Andy Cohen.  He is long overdue for a karma adjustment in my opinion.  I do think he cruises these boards.  So there is a certain appearance on this franchise that I don't think I'll comment on except to say that every time this cockroach appears on the show I fast forward through it.  

[aradia22]

Carole: She talks about sexual stuff because she thinks it's provocative and it makes her interesting. She is not interesting. She is a thumping bore. She is not fooling anybody...

 

Pot, meet kettle.

[Portae]

I don't think that the "walk of shame/victory lap" was a set up. I think that Sonja had scheduled shooting at her house for the next morning, which is why the production crew and Satako were there. When she realized that she wouldn't be home before Kristen, she probably called ahead and told the crew to go ahead and start filming and she would join in when she got there.

I know that there is little that happens organically on this show, but I don't think that it is 100% scripted, either -- more like "improvised." It would take way too much effort and energy to choreograph every single detail.

[Persnickety1]

I remember Carole stating either on the show or in her blog that she likes Ramona because Ramona is (my words) batshit crazy, which makes her interesting.

 

Maybe she felt the same way about meeting Kelly.  She was nice to her so as not to alienate her and be able to observe the crazy in its natural habitat.  I'd probably react the same way and sit back and wait for the bats to escape from her belfry right before my own eyes.  

 

I was glad I had this episode on the DVR.  The ability to watch Ramona's reaction to Kelly as the "surprise" guest was pure gold.  

Edited June 15, 2014 by Persnickety1

[MatildaMoody]

Oh, I do.  She's Andy's bud.  He wanted her for the show so I can't imagine that she didn't watch prior seasons to see what she was getting herself into. 

 

In the past when a housewife has said that they hadn't watched the show before, they always clarified that Production had them watch some of the past episodes so that they would at least have an idea of what they were getting into.

 

I would suspect that Carole fell into that group. But, which episodes BRAVO sent her to watch are the real question. Since Kelly and Bethenny weren't relevant by the time Carole signed on, there would be no reason for her to watch any of those episodes. I could see them sending Carole episodes of the season prior to her first appearance just so she had an idea of the women she would be working with.

 

And, if I recall, the editors went out of their way not to showcase too much of how crazy Kelly was in her final season. Of course to us long time viewers, the crazy was there because we had already seen Season 4. I, personally, was constantly on the lookout for any signs of "Al Sharpton" crazy to poke through in Kelly on her last season. 

 

But, Carole wouldn't have seen that. She was at a charity event that was being hosted by a friend, Luann. Luann is a friend who introduced Carole to her other friend Kelly. Carole would base her opinion of Kelly on what little she knows about her and her first impressions upon meeting her. 

 

And since Kelly works best in small doses and first impressions, it makes total sense to me that Carole would like her and think she was nice. I doubt it would occur to Carole to investigate some random past housewife to see if she is crazy before saying, "she seemed nice, I liked her." It's not like Carole was expecting to become instant besties with her or even hang out with her after this social/charity event.

 

In the end, I think Carole was simply being polite. Which is such an anomaly on these shows, that I kind of like her a little more because of it.

Edited June 16, 2014 by MatildaMoody

[jaync]

I hate the phrase walk of shame because I feel it is only ever used to describe women going home after a tyrst. So I loved Sonja calling it a victory lap!

Sing. If Sonja were a man, she'd be lauded as a stud, or a playboy. Also, LuAnn runs in the same peen circles (even whilst planning a baby with her boyfriend), yet she isn't considered a "slut" and/or "spiralling out of control".

 

Loved Sitako spilling the tea. I had Kristen-face when the Russ/Sonja gossip dropped, and don't even care if it was made up or not. More, please.

 

Notice LuAnn didn't deny that she likes to dominate her men, just that they're not small.

 

What was the point of Kelly returning for one scene?

[Higgins]

I would consider a man as promiscuous as Sonja a dog, not a stud.

[FozzyBear]

I can buy some of the housewives not having watched the show before they were cast or in negotiations, but after? That's just stupid. I would watch every episode of every season just so I could get an idea of how the editing works and what the schedule might be like. I'm not sure why so many women act like it's a badge of honor to have walked into a commitment like a reality TV show without having done any homework.

[aradia22]

I get that these women aren't going to quote each other exactly but I find it hard to pick sides when everyone is arguing in a way that's a little off. For example, Luanne is saying that Aviva was telling everyone the rumor about Miss USA. Aviva pointed out that she only told Heather. Heather says Aviva told her to pass it around. Really, it seems like Heather asked if she could and Aviva said fine. It doesn't seem like that big of a deal. Aviva could have said no but that would have been awkward and possibly stirred up some more drama. Heather clearly could have just kept it to herself. It's crazy how these women are all shitstirrers but they're so quick to shift the blame. Like, with Kristen spreading the rumors from the facialist. Oh, I guess I have to tell the girls even though I don't believe it... No. No, Kristen. You didn't have to tell anyone. 

 

And then there was Luanne telling everyone that Aviva said Avery's painting was phallic. No, she didn't. That wouldn't even make sense. It's a figure drawing. She said it was sexual. And it is, with the figure drawing containing other naked figures Gatsby eyes style. Or like the figures from the Dali photo in the Silence of the Lambs poster. Side note: really not that impressed with Avery's art.

 

Honestly, I think that either Luanne is lying about not having invited Miss USA or that someone involved didn't invite her or the RHONYC production team invited her. How could Aviva have invited Miss USA? That makes no sense. It was a weird thing to start.

[MatildaMoody]

 

I would consider a man as promiscuous as Sonja a dog, not a stud.

And yet, a man being called a dog is still not as shameful as a woman being called a slut. That sucks.

 

 

Sing. If Sonja were a man, she'd be lauded as a stud, or a playboy. Also, LuAnn runs in the same peen circles (even whilst planning a baby with her boyfriend), yet she isn't considered a "slut" and/or "spiralling out of control"

Right?! I think that because Luann did a better job of hiding her sexual relationships she somehow gets a pass. For me, it doesn't matter. Sex is sex, regardless of how public or private it is. 

 

 

I can buy some of the housewives not having watched the show before they were cast or in negotiations, but after? That's just stupid. I would watch every episode of every season just so I could get an idea of how the editing works and what the schedule might be like. I'm not sure why so many women act like it's a badge of honor to have walked into a commitment like a reality TV show without having done any homework.

 

I agree. But, at the same time, it comes down to whether or not this was my only gig. If I were trusting my friend, who was an executive producer of the show, while I was also finishing my very first fiction novel (while my friend was most likely telling me how much publicity I could get for said novel), while also working on spec for freelance articles, I would probably trust my friend not to screw me over. 

 

I understand Carole. I don't get any of the "princess" stuff. I've never married into royalty. But, I do get the whole journalist/writer thing that she has been doing most of her life. She doesn't know when a prime writing opportunity is going to fall in her life/lap. But, she will take it when it comes to her. I can understand that - especially since so many print publications are disappearing. 

 

I didn't like her last season because of how standoff-ish she was. But, I am enjoying her this season because of her willingness to roll around in the mud. I get her now. 

Edited June 16, 2014 by MatildaMoody

[OhGromit]

I understood asking Sonja.  Even asking Russ.  But the actions of booking an appointment and putting on sunglasses and a scarf to get the scoop from the facialist is a little weird, imo.

 

But to me, it actually sounds more like a lie.  Did she get the scoop from the facialist while wearing sunglasses and a scarf?  Who gets a facial wearing sunglasses?  Or, do we believe Satako didn't recognize Carol even after she took the sunglasses off?  Because it sounds like even after their nice chat and Carole passing on that cautionary tale, Satako still thought Carole was a manicurist.  Am I reading this right? Sounds fishy.  The reporter in her might have kicked in, but it sounds like so did the fiction writer.  Kind of a dumb story.

Really??

 

I took the comment about the scarf and sunglasses as tongue-in-cheek... as in, she didn't really put on a spy outfit, nor is she really going to be a spy someday... she's just saying it jokingly.  Like when you mix truth and exaggeration for fun.  Like if I was like, holy shit, guys, I met George Clooney at a party last night!  I mean, he's heartbroken today, b/c I wouldn't give him my number.  But yeah, I met him.  The first part is truth; the last part, exaggeration for fun.  (far as you know!!  ;)  

These shows are based on the nasty, catty behavior of women. We enjoy watching them so we can snark..

 

Occurred to me recently... it's WWF wrestling for housewives.  We all get into our favorite characters, see good and evil in each one of them, and behind the scenes, some producer decides who's going to win the match.  And we are the toothless chumps buying the tickets, arguing about who's the good guy, who cheated, who's the real deal... people tell us it's fake, but we just can't quit our real housewives!   

Carole is learning the hard way that reality tv isn't fun and games. I think she thought if she didn't act like a druken prostitution whore ,the show would not impact her real life. Sorry Carole, no one comes away unscathed. Bethenny almost did it, but then BEA took her down as well.

 

I think that's exactly right.  Carole maintained her distance first season and i think she placed a wall of irony between her and the rest of the girls.  Like her attitude was, holy shit, can you guys believe I'm actually doing this nonsense?  I mean, this is nonsense, right?  WTF am I doing here?  ... because it's kind of a crazy thing to do that she didn't volunteer for, but then Andy asked her, and she decided to do it to boost her book career.  This season, Bravo has taught her a lesson by making her its bitch.  It's a hard and shitty lesson to have to learn.  Yeah, she signed up for it, but she was under the mistaken impression she could make it work on her terms.  Sorry, girlfriend... if Bravo knows anything, it's how to pull the strings on its housewives.  That paycheck came with them strings attached.  

Edited June 16, 2014 by OhGromit

[aradia22]

 

I feel like Bravo should do a spin-off called The Help centered on the facialist (I didn't know that was a thing) who somehow knew everything about everyone.  That was a totally absurd scene right down to the bizarre stuff about placenta and how Sonja got that all over her body the night before.  I loved every second of it.

I'm really into Devious Maids and I think it would be great to have a show that isn't about vacuous ladies who don't do anything (the intelligent, career women we could be watching would never be on a reality show). However, the problem is always that the vacuous, rich women are the ones who own the homes. Thus we get Bravo trying to a locale or a focus where we can actually see "normal" people. So we get Below Deck, Eat, Drink, Love, and Vanderpump Rules. I watched EDL in my post Princesses: LI haze but I can't deal with the other two. A spa or nail salon would be a good idea in theory but I feel like it would just end up being so low rent and terrible. I don't want to see them fighting amongst themselves over stupid nonsense. I want to see them gossiping about their clients.

 

What I didn't understand was what the hell Veevs was doing with it.  So will having her piece shown here help Victoria in the long run?  Possibly.  All she needs is one of the "right people" (possibly a gallery owner or worker) to see it & wanna try to sell it & she can get a start.  It's a long shot, but it's possible.  If we noticed that it's good, I bet someone who knows art will too.

Apparently you're not allowed to mention production or the fact that you're on a TV show but I think the understanding was that the pieces would be shown during the episode and then they'd get further exposure if the show filmed at Aviva's house. Yeah, it's stupid to have an "art party" like that but that's because most people aren't filming a reality show at their cocktail parties.

 

I was giggling at Carole's mind games w/ Aviva.  I wish Carole outbid her then turned to Heather and said "I bought it for you!"

I hate Carole but even if I didn't already hate her, I would have rooted for Aviva to suddenly stop bidding and leave Carole with the overpriced dress. If this wasn't for charity I think I'd be done with Carole. That was the one saving grace for her actions. She's just so awful and petty and uninteresting but she refuses to acknowledge it! She thinks she's fabulous and all her attempts at self-deprecation never feel genuine. She's that girl who is insecure who makes self-deprecating comments so people will contradict her. While she lacks confidence in that sense, she's also smug and prideful enough that she doesn't really believe the things she says about herself. 

[ScoobieDoobs]

I would suspect that Carole fell into that group. But, which episodes BRAVO sent her to watch are the real question. Since Kelly and Bethenny weren't relevant by the time Carole signed on, there would be no reason for her to watch any of those episodes. I could see them sending Carole episodes of the season prior to her first appearance just so she had an idea of the women she would be working with.

 

Kelly's meltdown on Scary Island is one of THE most infamous episodes of this show.  And Bethenny has become a multi-millionaire & quite famous since appearing on the show.  They may not have been relevant by the time Carole joined the show, but if she knows nothing about either one of them, then she's unknowledgeable  & disconnected -- which (to me) would make her an absolutely piss poor journalist.  Could Carole really know completely nothing about Kelly's lunacy?  Really?  Wow, that speaks volumes about Carole.  Not good, Carole.  Not good at all, hun.

[DeeplyShallow]

I think, when Housewives say they hadn't watched the shows, they are definitely full of it. At the least, I would imagine they would've watched some just to see what they're getting into. I believe they are trying to make it seem as if whatever is happening on screen with them is "real." Pfft, whatever. Carole isn't the only one who has pulled this nonsense. I think OC's Heather and maybe somE BHers have said similar. The only "real" and non BS season was OC's first (with the exception of Jo & Slade).

Oh, and while I do often cringe with all the slut shaming & misogyny that goes on in the world in general, if a guy acted the same as Sonja, I'd call him a nasty, disgusting pig.

[ScoobieDoobs]

Yeah, is Sonja acting like a free spirit?  Or just plain sleazy -- and a continual embarrassment to her daughter?  My vote is for sleazy -- sleazy as hell, if ya ask me.

[Higgins]

 

And yet, a man being called a dog is still not as shameful as a woman being called a slut. That sucks.

It is to me. I can and do make judgment on men and women who behave that way. I'm from a generation who still valued and connected sex with love and meaning.

 

[zoeysmom]

In the past when a housewife has said that they hadn't watched the show before, they always clarified that Production had them watch some of the past episodes so that they would at least have an idea of what they were getting into.

 

I would suspect that Carole fell into that group. But, which episodes BRAVO sent her to watch are the real question. Since Kelly and Bethenny weren't relevant by the time Carole signed on, there would be no reason for her to watch any of those episodes. I could see them sending Carole episodes of the season prior to her first appearance just so she had an idea of the women she would be working with.

 

And, if I recall, the editors went out of their way not to showcase too much of how crazy Kelly was in her final season. Of course to us long time viewers, the crazy was there because we had already seen Season 4. I, personally, was constantly on the lookout for any signs of "Al Sharpton" crazy to poke through in Kelly on her last season. 

 

But, Carole wouldn't have seen that. She was at a charity event that was being hosted by a friend, Luann. Luann is a friend who introduced Carole to her other friend Kelly. Carole would base her opinion of Kelly on what little she knows about her and her first impressions upon meeting her. 

 

And since Kelly works best in small doses and first impressions, it makes total sense to me that Carole would like her and think she was nice. I doubt it would occur to Carole to investigate some random past housewife to see if she is crazy before saying, "she seemed nice, I liked her." It's not like Carole was expecting to become instant besties with her or even hang out with her after this social/charity event.

 

In the end, I think Carole was simply being polite. Which is such an anomaly on these shows, that I kind of like her a little more because of it.

I fall on the side of BS to any HW who claims she hasn't watched the show prior to coming on.  Carole fancies herself as an investigative journalist, writer, researcher and most of all friend of Andy Cohen.  I think they watch and study it.  Same with Heather Dubrow-an actress trying out for a part without thoroughly studying it?  BS.  After a RH makes this claim I doubt everything they say in connection with the show.  I also think it makes them look stupid in that they would take a job and not know what they are getting into.

 

As to Kelly-no harm no foul.  Carole was being polite, as was Kelly.  The engaged in civil discourse.  Kelly wasn't about to make a fool out of herself.

Edited June 16, 2014 by zoeysmom