Bethenny & Jason: The Divorce Showdown

[diadochokinesis]

11 minutes ago, ShawnaLanne said:

I grew up with a huge family. I love my family. I loved my husband's family, even though they drove me crazy and were judgemental AF. There is no way after the birth of my child I would go every weekend to their house hours away. Or my own families house for that matter. There is no way I would have let my husband take my child every weekend without me. This debate has been hashed and rehashed. Even if Bethenny came from a normal family this us unacceptable. This is smothering behavior. It is controlling behavior. It messed with their own family unit bonding time and likely contributed to the dissolution of their marriage. It was selfish and cowardly of Jason to not support his wife. 

Dude, after the birth of a child, nobody should expect you to leave your house for at least the first month or two.  I was a walking zombie after both of mine for the first bit. Forget going to an in-laws’ house (who should KNOW BETTER).  My husband’s parents are similar (but actually worse) than Jason’s family so I have empathy for B in this situation. Mama and Daddy Hoppy are way too involved in their grown son’s life and control him way too much. As a result, Jason is also super-controlling and manipulative (because you have to be manipulative when you grow up with controlling parents—it is the only way to survive). 

[RedDelicious]

I see it differently. I said above, I think Jason wanted to give Bethenny a home and a family and he wanted to give his parents back something they lost, the love of a firstborn. I don't think that was necessarily what Bethenny wanted or needed but I don't blame the guy for trying to put it all together the best way he knew how. I do not think his efforts came from a bad place. I think he thought getting away from the city would allow her to rest and give her peace. And when she didn't want to go, I didn't think allowing him to take the baby once or twice a month was a bad compromise. I don't see anything wrong with Jason wanting his child to experience his childhood home. Part of the joy in being a parent is seeing your child experience the same things you experienced as a child. Bethenny was selfish to want to deny Jason that joy. Make our own traditions my behind. She just wanted Bryn all to herself and I don't think that was right. Here we are 8 years later and she's still fighting for it.

[Celia Rubenstein]

1 hour ago, RedDelicious said:

Here we are 8 years later and she's still fighting for it.

Maybe Bethenny has good reason to still be fighting after eight years. The judge did just order that they will conduct a new custody trial. There must be a reason. I doubt the court just had some free time in March and decided to waste it on these bozos for the hell of it.

[RedDelicious]

Unfortunately it happens all the time, especially if the divorce was contentious. It's been happening to my dear friend from college for the last five years even though it was her ex who cheated with prostitutes and spent all her money. If one side wants to fight, they'll fight. It doesn't mean it's fair. Lawyers and the courts make a lot of money off these cases and Bethenny has financial resources to burn. I think the reason is she wants Bryn to herself and Jason to go bankrupt.

[Gem 10]

9 hours ago, RedDelicious said:

I see it differently. I said above, I think Jason wanted to give Bethenny a home and a family and he wanted to give his parents back something they lost, the love of a firstborn. I don't think that was necessarily what Bethenny wanted or needed but I don't blame the guy for trying to put it all together the best way he knew how. I do not think his efforts came from a bad place. I think he thought getting away from the city would allow her to rest and give her peace. And when she didn't want to go, I didn't think allowing him to take the baby once or twice a month was a bad compromise. I don't see anything wrong with Jason wanting his child to experience his childhood home. Part of the joy in being a parent is seeing your child experience the same things you experienced as a child. Bethenny was selfish to want to deny Jason that joy. Make our own traditions my behind. She just wanted Bryn all to herself and I don't think that was right. Here we are 8 years later and she's still fighting for it.

Again, I agree with you, only because we don’t know how many times they went to Pa.  who’s word are we going to take here, hers?  I think she exaggerated and made the whole visiting thing more than it was.  Nobody knows for sure.  One thing I remember is a party they had, and Jason’s Father made Bethenny something he restored and worked very hard on (something to put a dress on), and Bethenny didn’t give two shits about it.  I found her cruel at that moment.  I love Bethenny, but I don’t think she can get close to anyone, unless it’s on her terms.  She is making Jason and his parents monsters, which I don’t think they are.  I don’t think they had to go to Pa. every weekend.  That would be ridiculous.  Do we know if she sat everyone down and gave them visiting rules?  Is everything heresay?  I watched every episode of theirs, and those in- laws didn’t seem too bad to me.  In my day, I had both my parents and in- laws over my house often, as I knew that’s what makes parents happy.  What else did they have to do.  They were thrilled to come and see their grandchildren.  Now, in my older years, I love to see my kids and grandkids also.  I know how it feels to be wanted.  Bethenny doesn’t know from family ties, and that’s a sad thing.  She is missing out, and she will try to have Bryn miss out too.  Too bad.  Life is short.  I am so happy that my children were a part of their grandparents lives.  I have no regrets.

Edited August 20, 2018 by Gem 10

[QuinnM]

3 minutes ago, Gem 10 said:

 I don’t think they had to go to Pa. every weekend.

This was a disagreement that was aired between Bethenny and Jason. And it was Jason arguing for every weekend with his parents. 

Now that he has an 8 year old do you think he is still doing this?  It may be why Bethenny is going for custody - Brynn doesn’t want to spend every weekend I PA. 

[Gem 10]

7 minutes ago, QuinnM said:

This was a disagreement that was aired between Bethenny and Jason. And it was Jason arguing for every weekend with his parents. 

Now that he has an 8 year old do you think he is still doing this?  It may be why Bethenny is going for custody - Brynn doesn’t want to spend every weekend I PA. 

I thought I read somewhere that Jason’s parents moved to the city to give him a hand when he had Bryn?

[Rap541]

Quote

Now that he has an 8 year old do you think he is still doing this?

Considering how forceful and adamant he was on this argument, I am now genuinely curious if Bryn comes home from school every other Friday and Jason gets her in the car and drives her three hours to Hazelton for mandatory family time with his parents, spends all Saturday, and then gets Bryn in the car Sunday afternoon and drives 3 hours back to NYC. Every other weekend. Does Jason really do this?

[RedDelicious]

This is going to sound ridiculous, but I have a dog who is my hairy child.  I've had her home to the house we grew up in and I can't even tell you how happy it made/makes me to walk her on the same sidewalks we walked our family dog growing up.  I'm almost getting emotional just thinking about it.  Okay I am getting emotional thinking about it.  I don't think Jason is a bad person for wanting to take his child home.  It's just Bethenny didn't/doesn't want her to go there at all.  She's never wanted to have to share the child with anyone else and that is denying the child a lot of family love that she should be able to experience.  Because Bethenny's never had it, it doesn't count.

[AnnA]

11 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

 Now she wants to rip Bryn away from her father.  

When did Bethenny say she wanted to "rip Bryn away from her father?"  If anyone is trying to rip Bryn away, it's Jason questioning Bethenny's fitness because of Dennis's death.

I don't object to joint custody in terms of shared decision making, I.e., education, religion, medical treatment, etc.    However, I vehemently object to a shared living arrangement.  No child should be forced to move back and forth between their parents' homes on a predetermined schedule.    It's fine to spend time at both homes but actually living in two places isn't normal.  

My parents loved to take road trips.  As a child I hated being trapped in the car for hours.   If I was Bryn I wouldn't want to go to Pennsylvania every weekend.   It won't be long before an 8 year old Bryn is a teenager.  They have their own social needs which do not include going to grandma's every weekend.   If Jason forces Bryn to go, she'll resent it, him and them. 

Edited August 20, 2018 by AnnA

[RedDelicious]

3 minutes ago, Rap541 said:

Considering how forceful and adamant he was on this argument, I am now genuinely curious if Bryn comes home from school every other Friday and Jason gets her in the car and drives her three hours to Hazelton for mandatory family time with his parents, spends all Saturday, and then gets Bryn in the car Sunday afternoon and drives 3 hours back to NYC. Every other weekend. Does Jason really do this?

Does it matter if he does?  Bryn's a minor so we have no idea what she likes or wants to do with her father.  But if he does spend his time with her visiting his parents, how is that bad?

[nexxie]

1 minute ago, RedDelicious said:

This is going to sound ridiculous, but I have a dog who is my hairy child.  I've had her home to the house we grew up in and I can't even tell you how happy it made/makes me to walk her on the same sidewalks we walked our family dog growing up.  I'm almost getting emotional just thinking about it.  Okay I am getting emotional thinking about it.  I don't think Jason is a bad person for wanting to take his child home.  It's just Bethenny didn't/doesn't want her to go there at all.  She's never wanted to have to share the child with anyone else and that is denying the child a lot of family love that she should be able to experience.  Because Bethenny's never had it, it doesn't count.

Yes! And the last thing Bethenny wants is for her daughter to see the difference between normal loving and supportive care - and her brand of possessive, controlling “care,” and then start talking about it.

[AnnA]

There's nothing "normal" about a man nearly 50 years old driving from NYC to Hazelton, PA to spend every weekend with his Mommy.

[Rap541]

To be fair, this would be every other weekend. And there's really no indication that this is happening, which is why I was curious. 

Quote

Does it matter if he does? 

In that it was such a bitch point for him, yes. He was adamant that he wanted his daughter to be with his parents every weekend. He currently has custody every other weekend so is he committed to his plan? Where he spends every other weekend with his parents?

Quote

  Bryn's a minor so we have no idea what she likes or wants to do with her father. 

Bryn is a minor and frankly, she's eight so what she likes to do really isn't a factor. If Jason wants to take her to Hazelton every weekend he has custody, that is his *right* and Bryn does not get a say. Jason is the parent during his time. I'm just curious that, since this was so important to him as a loving parent, if he actually does insist on weekends being Grandpa and Grandma's time with Bryn. Remember, when this argument happened, Jason wanted EVERY weekend to be in Hazelton. I'm now genuinely curious if Jason is still this devoted to his parents.

Quote

But if he does spend his time with her visiting his parents, how is that bad?

At last check, I haven't said it was bad, now have I? I'm just curious if it actually still happens. 

[Gem 10]

We can go on and on with this subject and still not know the truth about this whole tabacle.  Good luck to the three of them, whatever they do.

[nexxie]

2 minutes ago, AnnA said:

There's nothing "normal" about a man nearly 50 years old driving from NYC to Hazelton, PA to spend every weekend with his Mommy.

Perhaps he wants his daughter to experience normal warmth from a grandmother as a counterbalance to the hyperactive, hypercontrolling, hypernarcissistic “mothering” she gets from B - could be the thing that saves his little girl from becoming Bethenny one day.

[AnnA]

[nexxie]

5 minutes ago, AnnA said:

Her quips are really just cover for being an empty creature who can’t relate emotionally.

[AnnA]

[Celia Rubenstein]

3 hours ago, RedDelicious said:

Unfortunately it happens all the time, especially if the divorce was contentious. ...If one side wants to fight, they'll fight. It doesn't mean it's fair. Lawyers and the courts make a lot of money off these cases and Bethenny has financial resources to burn. I think the reason is she wants Bryn to herself and Jason to go bankrupt.

This isn't just standard fighting between divorced parents who don't get along. It is a complete re-litigation of custody. And the judge is the one who decides if the matter should  proceed - you don't just walk into court and automatically get a new trial. There has to be something you can show the court that justifies such major action.  Apparently Bethenny met this threshold which suggests (in the opinion of the court, at least) her case is about more than just punishing Jason. 

I must add that the court is certainly not "making money" off the case the same way lawyers do. Courts don't charge hundreds of dollars by the hour or get a cut of a damages award, lol. Actually, the greater the number of motions and trials, etc. the harder everyone in a courtroom has to work. For the same pay. Judges don't get volume bonuses or earn overtime pay. From a financial standpoint, there is every reason For a court to limit the volume of cases heard, not increase them. 

[Rap541]

Quote

This isn't just standard fighting between divorced parents who don't get along. It is a complete re-litigation of custody. And the judge is the one who decides if the matter should  proceed - you don't just walk into court and automatically get a new trial. There has to be something you can show the court that justifies such major action.  Apparently Bethenny met this threshold which suggests (in the opinion of the court, at least) her case is about more than just punishing Jason. 

Yeah... correct me if I am wrong here, Celia, but the judge could have just said "No, there isn't enough here to reopen the custody" and that would be it. 

[RedDelicious]

I do not know if it is different in the state my girlfriend lives in, but I do know her ex petitioned to revise custody three times, and three times they went to trial, and three times he lost.  The judge finally said if he tried to petition again, he would be responsible for her legal fees in addition to his own.  So from my frame of reference, and from what I know to be true, it doesn't require much.

[Celia Rubenstein]

3 minutes ago, Rap541 said:

Yeah... correct me if I am wrong here, Celia, but the judge could have just said "No, there isn't enough here to reopen the custody" and that would be it. 

Absolutely. And then the judge mentally notes that Bethenny is a bringer of bullshit motions and remembers it every time she files something. 

Unfortunately for Jason, this time he is the one who earned a mental note, that being that he will portray himself as okay with how Bethenny is raising Bryn up to the point that things go against him, then suddenly she is a terrible mother who exposes their child to dangerous, unsavory people.  His credibility has taken a bit of a hit. A well deserved hit, in my opinion. 

[RedDelicious]

Mental notes are not a matter of record. Rulings that there will be consequences if one parent continues to make frivolous petitions are. Stopping here. 

[Rap541]

Sure, but this would be the first time (and not the third or fourth) that Bethenny has asked the court to revise custody and it is after several years so is it really going to be deemed frivolous? I mean, it's not like it was dismissed. 

[FozzyBear]

I don’t know nearly enough about family court to say anything useful about the court battle.

i think Bethany and Jason were always going to be a toxic mess. They are both people who want things they way they want them. My guess is if the pregnancy hadn’t happened so fast they would have hit a first big fight and broken up. To be honest I thought they were both sort of using each other, not intentionally, but all the same. I think Bethany liked the idea of Jason’s hometown boy thing and I think Jason liked the idea of Bethany’s glamorous TV star thing. They liked the idea. Neither one liked having to make any scarafices for what they both willingly signed up for. Bethany didn’t actually want to spend every weekend with Jason’s family (reasonable) and Jason didn’t want to move to LA for the talk show (reasonable). Neither was really right or wrong, but at the end of the day neither one really loved the other enough to get past how they wanted things to be. I’ve always thought they were like so many shotgun marriages. After the excitement of the whirlwind romance and new baby wore off they didn’t actually have a deep love for each other.

[Diane Mars]

Not sure if I have to post here, in Beth topic or on the preivous EP topic, so let's put it here...

So, it was 2 (3?) episodes ago, if I'm not mistaken, when Beth told Dorinda that she won't be speaking/talking/whatever with Dennis for 90 days and that's my take on it :  Beth and Dennis discussed regarding the engagement, etc. and Dennis went/was supposed to go for 3 months in rehab for substance abuse... Of course, it's only my take on it, but that's the only thing which connects the dots, for me, regarding a lot of info we got here or there...

Makes sense ?

Edited August 20, 2018 by Diane Mars

[AnnA]

5 minutes ago, Diane Mars said:

Not sure if I have to post here, in Beth topic or on the preivous EP topic, so let's put it here...

So, it was 2 (3?) episodes ago, if I'm not mistaken, when Beth told Dorinda that she won't be speaking/talking/whatever with Dennis for 90 days and that's my take on it :  Beth and Dennis discussed regarding the engagement, etc. and Dennis went/was supposed to go for 3 months in rehab for substance abuse... Of course, it's only my take on it, but that's the only thing which connects the dots, for me, regarding a lot of info we got here or there...

Makes sense ?

 

 I saw mention of a possible engagement but I didn't read anything about Dennis going to rehab.

ETA:  I think the Bethenny thread is a better place for this discussion.

Edited August 20, 2018 by AnnA

[crgirl412]

I am thinking about the loss of Dennis and how it will impact her view of Jason, the custody battle and things related.  Huge personal loss has different effects on people so I wonder if seeing Dennis's children miss their father will have her re-think her fight for full custody.  Will she see that children need their father in as many ways as possible?  Does she want to inflict any more damage on an already broken situation?  I hope the death of Dennis causes her heart to soften not become harder.   

[Gem 10]

2 hours ago, Rap541 said:

To be fair, this would be every other weekend. And there's really no indication that this is happening, which is why I was curious. 

In that it was such a bitch point for him, yes. He was adamant that he wanted his daughter to be with his parents every weekend. He currently has custody every other weekend so is he committed to his plan? Where he spends every other weekend with his parents?

Bryn is a minor and frankly, she's eight so what she likes to do really isn't a factor. If Jason wants to take her to Hazelton every weekend he has custody, that is his *right* and Bryn does not get a say. Jason is the parent during his time. I'm just curious that, since this was so important to him as a loving parent, if he actually does insist on weekends being Grandpa and Grandma's time with Bryn. Remember, when this argument happened, Jason wanted EVERY weekend to be in Hazelton. I'm now genuinely curious if Jason is still this devoted to his parents.

At last check, I haven't said it was bad, now have I? I'm just curious if it actually still happens. 

All I know is, when I was eight years old, I had no say in where I went, what I did, with who, etc.  you did what your parents said and that was it.  No choices, no arguments.  Bryn doesn’t seem to have it too bad.  She’s in Disneyworld at thr FOUR Seasons, she’s at Harry Potter, California Disneyland, etc.  Nothing missing for an eight year old.  Maybe a few days to chill out in Pa. is good for her.  The simple life.  Too much of good things are then expected all the time.

[Rap541]

Hilariously, there's utterly no evidence that she spends any time living that simple life in PA. That's why I am curious to know if Jason really has committed to that three hour drive with Bryn in the car every other weekend so that he has his family time. 

[Gem 10]

What does “ full custody” mean anyhow?  If Bethenny got full custody, what rights does Jason have, if any?  Does he get visitation rights?  Do you have to prove a parent “ unfit” to get full custody?

[biakbiak]

1 minute ago, Rap541 said:

Hilariously, there's utterly no evidence that she spends any time living that simple life in PA. That's why I am curious to know if Jason really has committed to that three hour drive with Bryn in the car every other weekend so that he has his family time. 

We don’t even know if his parents still live in PA. It’s been mentioned more than once that his parents moved to the city so maybe she gets plenty of family time without a drive, who knows.

[AnnA]

1 hour ago, crgirl412 said:

I am thinking about the loss of Dennis and how it will impact her view of Jason, the custody battle and things related.  Huge personal loss has different effects on people so I wonder if seeing Dennis's children miss their father will have her re-think her fight for full custody.  Will she see that children need their father in as many ways as possible?  Does she want to inflict any more damage on an already broken situation?  I hope the death of Dennis causes her heart to soften not become harder.   

Jason's remarks to the judge just made any "softening" impossible.

1 hour ago, Gem 10 said:

All I know is, when I was eight years old, I had no say in where I went, what I did, with who, etc.  you did what your parents said and that was it.  No choices, no arguments.  Bryn doesn’t seem to have it too bad.  She’s in Disneyworld at thr FOUR Seasons, she’s at Harry Potter, California Disneyland, etc.  Nothing missing for an eight year old.  Maybe a few days to chill out in Pa. is good for her.  The simple life.  Too much of good things are then expected all the time.

I didn't have any say when I was 8 years old either but my parents weren't divorced.    Kids are smart and when their parents are divorced they're capable of playing one parent against the other.     If Bryn doesn't want to spend her weekends in Pennsylvania but is forced to, she can make those weekends miserable for everyone. 

Edited August 20, 2018 by AnnA

[Gem 10]

2 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

We don’t even know if his parents still live in PA. It’s been mentioned more than once that his parents moved to the city so maybe she gets plenty of family time without a drive, who knows.

That’s what I heard, that they moved to the city to help him out.  I’m going to ask my I- pad where they live now.  I’ll keep yous posted.

[Gem 10]

37 minutes ago, Diane Mars said:

Not sure if I have to post here, in Beth topic or on the preivous EP topic, so let's put it here...

So, it was 2 (3?) episodes ago, if I'm not mistaken, when Beth told Dorinda that she won't be speaking/talking/whatever with Dennis for 90 days and that's my take on it :  Beth and Dennis discussed regarding the engagement, etc. and Dennis went/was supposed to go for 3 months in rehab for substance abuse... Of course, it's only my take on it, but that's the only thing which connects the dots, for me, regarding a lot of info we got here or there...

Makes sense ?

Yes.  I think he wanted to get married and wanted a commitment, but did he get a divorce yet?

[film noire]

41 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

We don’t even know if his parents still live in PA. It’s been mentioned more than once that his parents moved to the city so maybe she gets plenty of family time without a drive, who knows.

And even if they are still in PA, I don't get the travel issue here -- if it's okay for Bryn to spend hours on a plane traveling to beach resorts or Disneyland, how is it not okay spending 2.5 hours on a road trip to see her grands?

And maybe Bryn  (crazy idea) loves driving through the PA countryside with her Dad. Maybe she loves talking and hanging out and doing Dad/daughter road trip things (stopping at "their" place for lunch along the way, visiting roadside stands, etc). Maybe it's a ritual for them both. Hopefully (dear god, hopefully) this kid isn't a celeb-brat who only wants to party like it's 1999 in high end hotel rooms -- hopefully, she still likes normal kid things, like going to visit your grands and being spoiled rotten and feeling a deep sense of connection to the people whose last name she carries.

Once her grandparents are gone, she has no non-parental relatives to turn to;  if Hoppy (for all his emotional fuckery) is trying to give his child a lifelong sense of family -- a sense of place and tradition while his parents are still alive -- then he's doing the right thing, imo.

@Diane Mars -- I thought Bethenny said Dennis didn't know she wasn't talking to him for ninety days -- did I mishear that? (If I did, then you've got a great theory on your hands ;)

Edited August 20, 2018 by film noire

[breezy424]

Hazelton is about 130 miles from the city.  It's a little over two hours.  Bridgehampton is about 95 miles and the drive time is the same as Hazelton during the week.  Weekends are horrific on the island.  Sure.  Beth probably takes a helicopter but it still involves getting to the helicopter, half hour ride, then getting to the house.

I remember back when, there was a discussion that Jason had other relatives out there including aunts, uncles and cousins.  That's good for Bryn.

[AnnA]

55 minutes ago, Gem 10 said:

What does “ full custody” mean anyhow?  If Bethenny got full custody, what rights does Jason have, if any?  Does he get visitation rights?  Do you have to prove a parent “ unfit” to get full custody?

Yes Jason gets visitation.  They agree to a schedule but Bryn would live with Bethenny.   Jason would get visits on weekends, holidays, vacations, summer, etc.    

A parent does NOT have  to be unfit for the other parent to get full custody.    That said, the fact that Jason was arrested for stalking and Bethenny was able to get a restraining order against him doesn't make him look like father of the year.

 

55 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

We don’t even know if his parents still live in PA. It’s been mentioned more than once that his parents moved to the city so maybe she gets plenty of family time without a drive, who knows.

I hope that's true.   If they did move to NYC, Jason has  to be paying for it (with $ he got from Bethenny). 

Edited August 20, 2018 by AnnA

[Mrs peel]

2 hours ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

This isn't just standard fighting between divorced parents who don't get along. It is a complete re-litigation of custody. And the judge is the one who decides if the matter should  proceed - you don't just walk into court and automatically get a new trial. There has to be something you can show the court that justifies such major action.  Apparently Bethenny met this threshold which suggests (in the opinion of the court, at least) her case is about more than just punishing Jason. 

I must add that the court is certainly not "making money" off the case the same way lawyers do. Courts don't charge hundreds of dollars by the hour or get a cut of a damages award, lol. Actually, the greater the number of motions and trials, etc. the harder everyone in a courtroom has to work. For the same pay. Judges don't get volume bonuses or earn overtime pay. From a financial standpoint, there is every reason For a court to limit the volume of cases heard, not increase them. 

I don't practice in NY, but the first part of this isn't true.  Unless the petition to change custody did NOT claim a substantial change in circumstances, the Court is actually obligated to hold a hearing.  That's what's happening here.  The court delayed things a bit by ordering the evaluations, etc., but unless B withdraws her petition, there will be a hearing. THAT'S when the court will decide whether her case has merit.  Not before.  Nothing that's happened so far is any indication of how the Court will decide.  The only hint is that apparently the evaluation apparently suggested the Jason get therapy; and if he's getting it (as his lawyer claimed), then I would bet its unlikely to be a determining factor in any decision.  Of course, we don't know what's in the evaluation, or what Bryn said about her situation (though under NY law apparently until she's 12 they won't formally take her opinion into account).

Yeah, the court doesn't make money from the hearings, but it's not like they're working overtime (believe me, they don't work overtime!).  The hearing is in March 2019 because that's the first available date from the August hearing.  Which says the court has tons of cases.  But they are limited in how they can limit the volume.  The Judge here indicating the parties should talk settlement is one of the ways they try to limit the volume of hearings.  Judges sometimes talk to the lawyers in chambers, with no court reporter so it's more informal, and provide "advice" about whether to settle, how to settle, etc.  Sometimes that "advice" is good, sometimes it's bad.  Sometimes the parties listen, sometimes they don't.....

Nor do the lawyers technically make more money just because the case was scheduled for next March; these things often take time and have status/hearing dates months apart.  It's possible (I'm guessing less with B than Jason) that the attorney doesn't work much on the case in between court dates.  Of course, preparing for the custody hearing is an exception to that.

On Jason and his parents - I don't care or think one way or the other about an only child seeing his parents every weekend or every other weekend. it's not good or bad to me.  On Jason and Bryn seeing his parents every/every other weekend - I'm not sure we should extrapolate from what he said when she was a baby to what he thinks/does now.  She's 8, she has friends and likely weekend events she wants to attend with those friends.  I'd like to think both parents take that into consideration when planning her activities for the weekends.  NO Jason, you shouldn't go to PA with Bryn if it's her best friend's birthday party or there's a school event (assuming there's not some major family event/wedding/funeral).  NO B, you don't take Bryn to - wherever - if it's her best friend's birthday party or there's a school event (I'd say assuming its not some major family event but she doesn't have those).  Both of these are of course hypothetical - I have no idea if either parent has failed to take Bryn's activities into account.

On the news reports of the custody hearing - who knows?  But if B wants to claim a limit to her involvement with Dennis, she should take off that honking large diamond on her left hand.  Just sayin.....

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

13 minutes ago, breezy424 said:

Hazelton is about 130 miles from the city.  It's a little over two hours.  Bridgehampton is about 95 miles and the drive time is the same as Hazelton during the week.  Weekends are horrific on the island.  Sure.  Beth probably takes a helicopter but it still involves getting to the helicopter, half hour ride, then getting to the house.

I remember back when, there was a discussion that Jason had other relatives out there including aunts, uncles and cousins.  That's good for Bryn.

This.  I grew up in a rural place. Many people had to travel for the jobs---- out of town. Weekends were spent back at "home" especially bringing the kids, growing up with cousins, playing in creeks, riding horses, berry picking, hiking mountains, going to church together on Sundays and family meals before going back to work Monday - Friday. I do not find Jason's pattern of going home to Hazelton on the weekends unusual at all. I feel the opposite that it is healthy and commonplace from my world view. 

It is my opinion that when he and Bethenny married they would have to find a compromise or mutual agreement on how to take Jason's existing traditions and likes on the weekend as well as HERS to merge with hers and blend for their marriage and children.  But namecalling Jason for his existing traditions is puzzling to me. That does not make one a mama's boy. Maybe he is one, but that does not make you one.  Leaving NYC on the weekends to chill out sounds perfectly fine to me! 

[Natalie68]

4 hours ago, nexxie said:

Perhaps he wants his daughter to experience normal warmth from a grandmother as a counterbalance to the hyperactive, hypercontrolling, hypernarcissistic “mothering” she gets from B - could be the thing that saves his little girl from becoming Bethenny one day.

To be fair, how much actual parenting have we ever seen her do minus the time Bryn was a small baby?  How do we know how she is with her daughter?  She isn't on the show so all anyone ever sees is a pic here and there.  

[Rap541]

46 minutes ago, film noire said:

1 hour ago, biakbiak said:

city so maybe she gets plenty of family time without a drive, who knows.

And even if they are still in PA, I don't get the travel issue here -- if it's okay for Bryn to spend hours on a plane traveling to beach resorts or Disneyland, how is it not okay spending 2.5 hours on a road trip to see her grands?

Absolutely no one is complaining about the trips - I am simply wondering if they are actually happening since Jason does have Bryn every other weekend and seemed so committed to the idea that he and Bryn were going to make that three hour drive to PA EVERY weekend.

I'm just curious - since this is what Jason believes a family does - if he actually has been practicing what he preaches and every other Friday, come hell or high water, he's got Bryn strapped in the car seat for the three hour drive so she has her family time.

For the record, I did an admittedly amateur look thru the internets and it appears the Hoppys may now live in Drums PA, not NYC. But I still wonder if Jason really does spend every other weekend with his parents. 

[Mozelle]

1 hour ago, Gem 10 said:

What does “ full custody” mean anyhow?  If Bethenny got full custody, what rights does Jason have, if any?  Does he get visitation rights?  Do you have to prove a parent “ unfit” to get full custody?

My understanding was that Bethenny was seeking sole custody. I think that's different from full custody? Full custody would include visitations and the like, and, most importantly, Jason would still have legal say over what happens with Bryn. Sole custody, which is what Bethenny is looking for, could still include visitation, but Bethenny would be the only parent to have any legal say over what happens with Bryn. 

[Diane Mars]

1 hour ago, film noire said:

 

@Diane Mars -- I thought Bethenny said Dennis didn't know she wasn't talking to him for ninety days -- did I mishear that? (If I did, then you've got a great theory on your hands ;)

No, your heard correctly, she said it :) but... that didn't make sense at this time and still doesn't for me... And if we imagine that she's chosen the rehab where contact will be forbidden for x days... Wait and see, but she's been caught on lying / twisting the truth so... :)

[AnnA]

I looked for types of custody in New York State  and it was broken down into three categories:

1) sole physical and sole legal

2) sole physical and joint legal

3) joint physical and joint legal

[AnnA]

9 minutes ago, Diane Mars said:

No, your heard correctly, she said it :) but... that didn't make sense at this time and still doesn't for me... And if we imagine that she's chosen the rehab where contact will be forbidden for x days... Wait and see, but she's been caught on lying / twisting the truth so... :)

Nothing I've read mentions rehab.

I think we should take this discussion to the Bethenny thread.

Edited August 20, 2018 by AnnA

[biakbiak]

30 minutes ago, Rap541 said:

Absolutely no one is complaining about the trips - I am simply wondering if they are actually happening since Jason does have Bryn every other weekend and seemed so committed to the idea that he and Bryn were going to make that three hour drive to PA EVERY weekend.

Since I am pretty sure that it was mentioned at the time that when he was single he went to PA every other weekend seems easily likely or maybe the experience of being a parent made him change his mind. He eventually compromised when he was with Bethenny so maybe he changed his mind long ago.

Edited August 20, 2018 by biakbiak

[Sunfield]

On 2018-08-19 at 1:24 AM, RedDelicious said:

"Six weeks is six weeks. No tip." Gina was the MVP. 

It's hard to say. I do think the affection and emotion in the hospital scenes was real. But before that I think Bethenny made up her mind that she wanted a child whether she truly loved Jason or did not. I thought that from the second they showed her in the bathroom with the test. I never thought Jason saw her as a meal ticket - I don't think she was *that successful yet when they met. I do think Jason loved her and he wanted really badly to give her the "home" and family she never had. That's what I think the trips to Hazelton were rooted in. I think he tried too hard to show her another way of life that she just could not accept/understand and didn't want to be a part of. And he couldn't understand why she wanted nothing to do with it. And then it just blew up in their faces. I think she could have loved him, but she wanted everything 100% her way. It really wasn't fair to him or her. At the end of the day, I really do believe she is/was far too damaged to accept the kind of love and more traditional type of relationship he had on offer. And perhaps the more non-traditional relationship, like with Dennis, was what she wanted. One where she could shut him out when she wanted to, but could call any time. I think everything went really fast after she got pregnant and they never had a chance to evaluate if they truly wanted the same things. 

I watched back then and agree with this up until Bethenny being framed as far too damaged.

 

They were very different but they didn’t know how different because Jason was way more attached to his parents than anyone knew. She was a freer spirit and he was so not but there wasn’t clear signs of it going in. Once they married, Bethenny started figuring herself out in relation to his family issues and then, he threatened her. I forget what he said but she shared it when their split was in early days. It was lights out on the relationship once he did that because that’s a psychotic unsafe person and she knew it. So she did what most women know now to do - bolt asap. She got rich during the marriage and credited him in early days.

 

B is an independent woman who had horrific parents of her own. From day one she has been someone who holds herself accountable and seeks therapy to work on her issues. She’s got new issues now but given what she’s experienced with Jason, it’s no wonder. Also her career has been hot since it took off. That’s a lot all at once and it’s showing. She wants out, he needs to let her go and let her parent in her way just as he will in his way when he has Bryn. I don’t like him tho and agree with Bethenny.

 

I'm sticking up for her because she tries and never stops trying. She falters, messes up, etc but she always takes responsibility and usually when nobody else does. There are psych diagnoses being thrown around here, with attending cruel statements about people who have them, and it’s blowing my mind so adding my two cents. 

 

Bryn is a product of her parents. However she turns out is up to her. Bethenny will not raise a person who isn’t accountable. Bryn will be who she really is, good or bad, because Bethenny will want that for her even if it hurts Bethenny.  

[Celia Rubenstein]

1 hour ago, Mrs peel said:

I don't practice in NY, but the first part of this isn't true.  Unless the petition to change custody did NOT claim a substantial change in circumstances, the Court is actually obligated to hold a hearing.  That's what's happening here.  The court delayed things a bit by ordering the evaluations, etc., but unless B withdraws her petition, there will be a hearing. THAT'S when the court will decide whether her case has merit.  Not before. 

According to the article linked a few pages back, the court has set a trial date, not a hearing date. Which means the court has apparently already held the hearings you describe and determined there is merit to B's case. 

 

3 hours ago, RedDelicious said:

Mental notes are not a matter of record. Rulings that there will be consequences if one parent continues to make frivolous petitions are. Stopping here. 

Judges are human and they form opinions of the people in front of them just like anyone else does. Ideally they are able to set those opinions aside when they rule, but we don't live in an ideal world.

And I don't believe a judge is required to rule/warn a party not to make any more frivolous motions before they nail them for it. I believe they can zotz you for it whenever you do it, even the first time.