S01.E05: Plum Tuckered

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Quote

In the final stage of The New Baptist Plan, Plum experiences the harsh reality of dating; Jennifer shocks with an unexpected target.

[formerlyfreedom]

And the preview (misnumbered in the header);

[SimoneS]

Damn that was painful. I was glad when Plum found out about Dominic and made him tell her the truth. He has treated her worse than any of those men. It is too bad because I think that he really does like her. I wish that Plum would date Ben. He genuinely likes her and doesn't have a secret family, I think.

I thought that Julia was involved in Jennifer, but now I don't think so.

Kitty is so freaking repulsive.

Edited June 26, 2018 by SimoneS

[peridot]

I was expecting for "Mr. Nice Guy" to start a relationship with Plum.  What a shithead!  I felt so bad for Plum after she had the confidence to diss those assholes who tried to whisper about her.

I wanted Kitty to have some moral growth, but looks like that won't happen.  So Plum can only have an office and officially exist if she's skinny?  Screw that!

That fetish guy was creepy as hell and I'm glad she got out.  It's weird Dominic was following her around though.

It looks like Dominic may have helped pushed Plum to the dark side.

[ichbin]

This is now giving me a Live and Loves of a She-Devil vibe.  

[HunterHunted]

You know the deep levels of awful you must be hiding if you can't even have the decency to spend 20 or 30 more minutes with a human and then just not have another date. An Aiden the human rights guy didn't want to be a good guy. He wants to be thought of and seen as a good guy. He doesn't want to actually be a good person deep in his soul.

Kitty is just terrible.

The fetish guy was so creepy.

I think Dominic legitimately cares about Plum as a human being, but he has been lying to her and using her. And their relationship is built on that and it is fundamentally unfair and unequal.

[voiceover]

Such ugliness.  I guess I'm in it until season's end, but as someone who drives by accidents with eyes firmly fixed on the road ahead, it's tough.

I will say that Joy and Adam have great chem -- even better than he had with Myanna Buring in their Ripper Street days.   I could wish to pluck them out of this nastiness & set them down in a Broadchurch-type series, where she's a newspaper editor and he's a cop and they solve crimes.

[voiceover]

3 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

 

I think Dominic legitimately cares about Plum as a human being, but he has been lying to her and using her. And their relationship is built on that and it is fundamentally unfair and unequal.

Eh. Been musing over it, and frankly, the same could be said of Verbena (as I've come to think of her) & the denizens of Calliope Inc., AND Kitty, AND her weird little follower.  In fact, except for her mom and her friends at the coffee shop, no one is showing Plum their real selves or explaining their real motivation.  They're all fucking with her head.

[Iguessnot]

2 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

You know the deep levels of awful you must be hiding if you can't even have the decency to spend 20 or 30 more minutes with a human and then just not have another date. An Aiden the human rights guy didn't want to be a good guy. He wants to be thought of and seen as a good guy. He doesn't want to actually be a good person deep in his soul.

Kitty is just terrible.

The fetish guy was so creepy.

I think Dominic legitimately cares about Plum as a human being, but he has been lying to her and using her. And their relationship is built on that and it is fundamentally unfair and unequal.

It was so unnecessarily cruel that I'm now wondering if it was a setup by Veranda. The actress doesn't look like the old Mama June, so I find it hard to gauge some scenes. The way that everyone in that restaurant eyeballed Aiden & Plum made no sense.

Likewise with the last date. Plum already talked about guys with fetishes. Old news, yet this guy can't make it past two food trucks before becoming a complete stereotype. How is it that Veranda can't vet these guys better if she isn't complicit?

[izabella]

I don't understand what happened at the end.  Plum went to Verona's place and told her she was ready.  For what?

[BooBear]

7 hours ago, SimoneS said:

Damn that was painful. I was glad when Plum found out about Dominic and made him tell her the truth. He has treated her worse than any of those men. It is too bad because I think that he really does like her. I wish that Plum would date Ben. He genuinely likes her and doesn't have a secret family, I think.

That was painful. When we started and some people were taken aback by how horribly Plumb was treated I think this episode was exhibit A in the -- I don't know if that is realistic - argument.  It was too much.  Perhaps done to make Plumb break.  I agree I am suspicious of Veranda and her choices here. If I were Plumb I would be too after I stopped smarting. 

[JudyObscure]

7 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

You know the deep levels of awful you must be hiding if you can't even have the decency to spend 20 or 30 more minutes with a human and then just not have another date. An Aiden the human rights guy didn't want to be a good guy. He wants to be thought of and seen as a good guy. He doesn't want to actually be a good person deep in his soul.

That's what I couldn't grasp.  How hard is it to finish a meal with someone and take her home?  Still, the people watching and whispering never ring true to me.  Aidan wasn't particularly good looking so I'm surprised the mean girls noticed him in the first place, and I see couples out together where one is large and the other small all the time.

The  fetish guy was weird, but I couldn't get as angry at him as I did at the deliberately mean men.  His fetish brings up a whole question for me about what exactly constitutes an unacceptable  fetish. If a boyfriend wants you to wear spike heels is he off limits? Was Plum's feeder any weirder than men who are so fixated on the secondary sexual characteristics of breasts that their ideal woman is one who has had her breasts surgically altered and exaggerated?  How are they different than the Chinese men who couldn't desire a woman with normal feet, but only got off on those tiny deformed feet?   At least hamburger man was enjoying something that was a natural process and didn't require surgery.  I didn't find him ugly either and was surprised Plum sunk to that level of cruelty. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

For me, the difference between the date at the food trucks and other fetishes is that everything is about consent and compatibility. If you are into XYZ and your partner accepts and is into the fact that you are very into their XYZ to the point where it is arousing, then it's fine. But Jack was pushing her to eat after she said she was getting full, which was already a huge red flag because she was trying to set a boundary and he ignored it. When he admitted that watching her eat made him hard, it didn't make her feel sexy. It made her feel used and dirty and gross.

[SunnyBeBe]

I agree about the possibility that the dates were setups and they acted just the way they were told to act, in order to hurt Plum.  Recall that Plum was told that she was supposed to feel, not think about things.  And it was so over the top.  I mean, what are the odds, but it's tv.  I have to buy it.  I haven't read the book, but, have an idea of what is actually happening. 

It happened really fast, but, didn't Plum hit that guy on the street first?  She got food on him, then spit on him, then he called her a name, then she slapped him and then he slapped her.  So, why couldn't he press charges against her too?  

I thought it was amazing that with all the good food that Plum has passed up and she decides to indulge on hamburger and fries.  I don't get it. 

So, was the girl who answered the door with the burned face, connected to the burning of the porn star in the cemetery? One of the caretakers was engulfed in flames too, right? 

I will say it was the liveliest episodes yet.  I'll definitely follow it though. 

[SimoneS]

It never occurred to me that Calliope House set up Plum with horrible dates. It is possible. However, I could believe Plum had a bad dating night. We never like to believe that people are as awful as they are in real life, but they are even worse.

Ultimately, I think that it was Dominic's deceit that broke Plum and I think that would have happened no matter what. As much as he likes her, it occurs to me that he was willing to put her in danger to solve his case and that is not good at all.

Edited June 26, 2018 by SimoneS

[tennisgurl]

So, now I wonder if this show actually takes place in a universe where every single (straight) guy is an irredeemable asshole, so therefore Jennifer is totally right to kill them. I mean, I know the world is filled with assholes (I have Twitter), but, wow, they really do seem to be everywhere here. But, still not on Team Jennifer. Especially killing the porn star women, who, from their standards, hasn't actually victimized any women. You can make a case that her staring in rape fetish porn normalized abuse, but you could also say that she was a victim of this culture too. 

That leads to me strongly suspecting that Veranda sent those crappy guys to Plum on purpose. I mean, they were all so over the top awful, and played right into her worst issues, it made me think that she was manipulating her into being vulnerable enough for her to fully join her cult. Of course, Dominic was the straw that broke the camels back, and he had nothing to do with her. Its sad because I do think he cares about her, but he still lied to and manipulated her for his own means. Just like everyone else besides her mom and her coffee house BFF. 

Kitty really is awful, but I kind of love watching how terrible she is. And I like seeing how much of her is real (I do buy her anger at the patriarchy) and how much is bullshit for ratings and money. 

[HunterHunted]

5 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

I didn't find him ugly either and was surprised Plum sunk to that level of cruelty.

4 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I think Plum took out all of her frustrations on him.  She's a mess, which leads me to believe that her problems are more psychological than physical.  Her mental state isn't of her own making.  She has been treated like a doormat for so long, that I think she is starting to believe that the world hates her. 

 

You know when someone who is kind of racist is wronged by someone who is a minority, the first words out of his or her mouth tend to be a racist epithet. Plum is like that about appearances. Plum is really damaged. She's fixated on looks-how she looks, how the world looks at her, how others look, and how she looks to the world. It's actually not surprising that she would immediately go for an appearance based insult.

[SunnyBeBe]

7 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

You know when someone who is kind of racist is wronged by someone who is a minority, the first words out of his or her mouth tend to be a racist epithet. Plum is like that about appearances. Plum is really damaged. She's fixated on looks-how she looks, how the world looks at her, how others look, and how she looks to the world. It's actually not surprising that she would immediately go for an appearance based insult.

Interesting.  I've always been super sensitive about ridiculing a person due to their appearance. It bothered me a lot when one of my childhood friends would get it. She was super skinny and had freckles.  She got a lot of teasing. I defended her a lot and made it a point to never go there with people.  With some folks, it seems to be sport for them. I don't understand why it's so culturally accepted.  One of my pet peeves are people who tease bald men.  I'm not bald nor a man, but, it just sets me off.  It seems to be a very accepted insult.  I disagree. 

Edited June 26, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[HunterHunted]

19 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Interesting.  I've always been super sensitive about ridiculing a person due to their appearance. It bothered me a lot when one of my childhood friends would get it. She was super skinny and had freckles.  She got a lot of teasing. I defended her a lot and made it a point to never go there with people.  With some folks, it seems to be sport for them. I don't understand why it's so culturally accepted.  One of my pet peeves are people who tease bald men.  I'm not bald nor a man, but, it just sets me off.  It seems to be a very accepted insult.  I disagree. 

The physical attractiveness stereotype is as old as our oldest myths and fairytales. It's the idea that outer beauty reflects your inner goodness. And so often in those stories the villains are supposed to be ugly to represent their villainy and inner ugliness. It's really very modern for us to not treat people who look differently terribly.

[JudyObscure]

10 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

So, was the girl who answered the door with the burned face, connected to the burning of the porn star in the cemetery? One of the caretakers was engulfed in flames too, right? 

One of the (male) caretakers was in intensive care with burns, but the girl who opened the door at Calliope house was  already there in the first episode.  It's been a long time since I read the book,

Spoiler

so don't quote me on this, but I believe a man had thrown acid on her many years earlier.

10 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

For me, the difference between the date at the food trucks and other fetishes is that everything is about consent and compatibility. If you are into XYZ and your partner accepts and is into the fact that you are very into their XYZ to the point where it is arousing, then it's fine. But Jack was pushing her to eat after she said she was getting full, which was already a huge red flag because she was trying to set a boundary and he ignored it. When he admitted that watching her eat made him hard, it didn't make her feel sexy. It made her feel used and dirty and gross.

I agree about the consent part, but the difference for me is that I think ,after he admitted that watching her turned him on, it was time for her to tell him that was too bad because she didn't enjoy (consent to) eating for his pleasure.  No need to go wild with anger.  Men don't ask beautiful women, or blonde women, or women with large breasts, if they have their permission to be turned on by them, they just are, but if the man starts dating such a woman and she figures out that XYZ-quality is what turns him on about her, then it's her choice to stay with the relationship or not, because as @HunterHunted just said, we humans have long been attracted to people by external qualities and it's rare to find someone who is only concerned with what we're like on the inside.

Edited June 26, 2018 by saoirse
Tagged book spoiler

[SunnyBeBe]

4 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

One of the (male) caretakers was in intensive care with burns, but the girl who opened the door at Calliope house was  already there in the first episode.  It's been a long time since I read the book,

Spoiler

so don't quote me on this, but I believe a man had thrown acid on her many years earlier.

I agree about the consent part, but the difference for me is that I think ,after he admitted that watching her turned him on, it was time for her to tell him that was too bad because she didn't enjoy (consent to) eating for his pleasure.  No need to go wild with anger.  Men don't ask beautiful women, or blonde women, or women with large breasts, if they have their permission to be turned on by them, they just are, but if the man starts dating such a woman and she figures out that XYZ-quality is what turns him on about her, then it's her choice to stay with the relationship or not, because as @HunterHunted just said, we humans have long been attracted to people by external qualities and it's rare to find someone who is only concerned with what we're like on the inside.

Right. I knew the girl who answered the door had facial injuries that were old.  I was just wondering if that injury was related to the porn woman and other man who were burned in the cemetery.  

[Madding crowd]

4 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

One of the (male) caretakers was in intensive care with burns, but the girl who opened the door at Calliope house was  already there in the first episode.  It's been a long time since I read the book,

Spoiler

so don't quote me on this, but I believe a man had thrown acid on her many years earlier.

I agree about the consent part, but the difference for me is that I think ,after he admitted that watching her turned him on, it was time for her to tell him that was too bad because she didn't enjoy (consent to) eating for his pleasure.  No need to go wild with anger.  Men don't ask beautiful women, or blonde women, or women with large breasts, if they have their permission to be turned on by them, they just are, but if the man starts dating such a woman and she figures out that XYZ-quality is what turns him on about her, then it's her choice to stay with the relationship or not, because as @HunterHunted just said, we humans have long been attracted to people by external qualities and it's rare to find someone who is only concerned with what we're like on the inside.

I think liking someone because they are blond is different than being turned on by watching a fat woman eat. Being blond is not an activity, it is just a physical attribute. An example: If I put on a pair of stiletto heels and my husband says it turns him on it’s ok-if he expects me to wear them 24/7, has no interest in me beyond the heels, it isn’t ok.

I barely remember the book but I’m sure the dates were set up specifically to make Plum angry. Much like the rest of the story, it is magnified and over the top. Plum does need therapy and most of all she needs to love herself. Whether or not she gets the surgery is immaterial if she doesn’t have love and respect for herself.

5 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Interesting.  I've always been super sensitive about ridiculing a person due to their appearance. It bothered me a lot when one of my childhood friends would get it. She was super skinny and had freckles.  She got a lot of teasing. I defended her a lot and made it a point to never go there with people.  With some folks, it seems to be sport for them. I don't understand why it's so culturally accepted.  One of my pet peeves are people who tease bald men.  I'm not bald nor a man, but, it just sets me off.  It seems to be a very accepted insult.  I disagree. 

 

Fat shaming is also an acceptable insult and in my opinion, awful.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

6 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

It happened really fast, but, didn't Plum hit that guy on the street first?  She got food on him, then spit on him, then he called her a name, then she slapped him and then he slapped her. 

She was standing still in front of the cart eating her hot dog when that guy walked right into her and then told her to watch where she was going instead of staring at her food. He also threw in a fat insult. After that, she threw her hot dog at him or rubbed it on him and then spit on him. He said something to her that now escapes me and that’s when she slapped him with an open hand. Then he straight up punched her with a closed fist. 

[SunnyBeBe]

That's what I thought.  But, technically, throwing food on someone is an assault and/or battery and in some states spitting on someone is a crime too.  Not saying that he was justified in punching her.  That was over the top and exceeded any force necessary to protect himself, but, I'd be concerned with him pressing charges too.   

Edited June 26, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[Ottis]

So the show opens by skipping right past 6th graders forming their own Jennifer group, and instead focusing on the fact that men, who apparently have a poor description of Plum, bail when they see her because ... she’s fat, I guess? Which of those should we be more concerned about?

Dominic, if he is truly only using Plum for info, is really good at also being more of a friend. I have a heavy female friend who I’ve known for 30 years, and our relationship is a lot like their exchange as they walked to get ice cream. We didn’t date 30 years ago because she wasn’t my type more due to her personality than her weight. But she is a great, smart, funny friend. 

Kitty making women a victim. For money. Ugh. And then Kitty having to feel important over Plum. And BTW, Kitty can be as bad as men. And Plum? There are tons of other writing outlets. 

Aiden should have immediately recognized Monty Python. And what a dick. But, as a guy who 30 years ago had a woman ditch me to “go to the bathroom,” it goes both ways. Always has. 

And Plum has no idea that the guy who wasn’t eating while she was eating had a fetish? And then a dude hits her? Are you kidding me? What kind of city does she live in?

I thought for sure the show was going to say men killed Stella Cross in retribution, per the comment earlier about battle of the sexes. Which would have made no sense. BTW, the groundskeepers didn’t smell gas?

I posted before that this show is feeling like Westworld... everyone’s an asshole. 

[BooBear]

Ha sorry about that first post 

Quote

I posted before that this show is feeling like Westworld... everyone’s an asshole. 

Ha I was going to say I am wondering ah la Westworld are characters we aren't thinking about being involved with Jennifer, involved? Such as Kitty and Dominic? Now I am seeing twists everyplace. 

With regard to the guy who left Plumb at the resturant I thought I heard the woman say Plumb must be his mom. I assumed he ran after he realized the other patrons were making fun of him / them. Seems odd that he would run right then after he had stuck out most of the date. Unless he didn't want to pay the bill.  I had some sympathy for him..  typically on such dates the guy sleeps with the large woman and then never talks to her again. 

This does take place in New York City right? I can imagine both a plethora of jerky white guys and also a guy smacking Plumb in New York.

Ultimately I think Plumb could have handled all the dates but for Dominic. She was already motivated to stay in the Baptist plan to help him out. She was interested. 

Edited June 26, 2018 by BooBear

[formerlyfreedom]

Please remember, this is not the topic to discuss the book; tag any book related talk if you have it here. Thank you.

[Token]

Wow, this episode was really hard for me to watch.  As a morbidly obese woman, who hasn't dated in years, I've been though what Plum went through on those dates.  It was painful and horrific.  I have no plans to ever do it again!  I would even tell men I met online that I was obese, huge, massive.  I would use those exact words and they would still seem surprised when they met me.  It was so demoralising that looks were so important to people.  So I just stopped altogether and have never dated again.  No thanks.

[Lava VaVoom]

1 hour ago, Token said:

Wow, this episode was really hard for me to watch.  As a morbidly obese woman, who hasn't dated in years, I've been though what Plum went through on those dates.  It was painful and horrific.  I have no plans to ever do it again!  I would even tell men I met online that I was obese, huge, massive.  I would use those exact words and they would still seem surprised when they met me.  It was so demoralising that looks were so important to people.  So I just stopped altogether and have never dated again.  No thanks.

I completely concur.  Hard to watch, hard to talk about.  I've also met those guys, and knew a lot of feeders from years being involved in the size acceptance movement.  Over the years I watched my friends who got into relationships just get larger and larger.  We'd go to our-size dances where we could dance without being laughed at.  The women would be on the dance floor and the men would be on the sidelines watching.  I also doubt I'll ever date again.  Plum, you break my heart, but you piss me off too.  I cheered when you hit that jackass who insulted you, saw red when he hit you back, and got angry when no one came to your rescue except the cop who was conveniently nearby.  I hope you restyle your hair and wear more red dresses.

[txhorns79]

Quote

I didn't find him ugly either and was surprised Plum sunk to that level of cruelty. 

I am not.  It's one thing to be with someone who enjoys whatever you are into and wants to be a part of that.  It's another to be on a date with someone who is trying to force his fetish on you.  From what I saw, Plum became uncomfortable once it became clear he was getting off on feeding her.  He either missed or ignored her discomfort and tried to continue something she was not into.  Add that with Plum's insecurity regarding her appearance, two terrible blind dates and I see exactly why she went off.   Though I'm sure that was Verbena's plan all along. 

[BooBear]

7 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

I am not.  It's one thing to be with someone who enjoys whatever you are into and wants to be a part of that.  It's another to be on a date with someone who is trying to force his fetish on you.  From what I saw, Plum became uncomfortable once it became clear he was getting off on feeding her.  He either missed or ignored her discomfort and tried to continue something she was not into.  Add that with Plum's insecurity regarding her appearance, two terrible blind dates and I see exactly why she went off.   Though I'm sure that was Verbena's plan all along. 

I was confused about that scene. Did she really say those things to him or was that what she was thinking. You'll notice when she says it he is gone at the end and she is starting at a pile of dirt. Not sure that wasn't one of those fanciful moments. 

[Madding crowd]

She wasn’t dating before, it is all part of the ‘baptist’ plan she is doing to get the $20,000.

[Ottis]

56 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

There are no winners there.  The dude was a jerk, Plum was a jerk.  The conflict kept escalating until he hit her.  It never should have gotten that far.  They both should have backed off. 

Except ... you never hit a woman, if you're a man. Ever. To defend yourself you can hold them, push them away from you or just leave. But hit a woman like that? Plum could be stabbing at me with a knife and I would never think to hit her. Maybe I'm just old. And I don't think you were stepping in it. Just adding to your comment.

Sometimes I wonder if this show were about prematurely balding men, how would it be different.

3 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

As for her dating, I think she is trying way too hard.  She should do volunteer work and take up hobbies.    Learn yoga, meditation, go for walks in the park.   Adopt a pet.  Do things to get her mind off of dating, and yet still put herself out there and meet other people.  Develop friendships and perhaps more.  Her approach to dating makes her look desperate and that is a complete turn off.

Yeah, that's the classic advice, isn't it. I'm amazed that Plum even tries anymore given all the jerks she keeps running into (I know these particular dates were arranged, but I mean in general). It would be a relief almost to not try dating, and instead focus on enjoying your life.

[spankydoll]

On 6/25/2018 at 11:22 PM, ichbin said:

This is now giving me a Live and Loves of a She-Devil vibe.  

That movie was terrible but the book was divine.

I had so many dates like that when I was on Match. Posted real photos and I was a size 12 at the time so pretty normal looking and the men would just go pale and look downcast when I met them. A couple of the were honest about my weight being an issue but some of them were just awful about it. 

Edited June 30, 2018 by spankydoll

[mjc570]

It never occurred to me that the dates may have been set ups (i have no idea what the movement is that Plum is ready for at Calliope House, if it isn't Jennifer) because I thought they were all pretty realistic. 

The episode was pretty brutal for Plum (not just the humiliation, but also getting fired, getting knocked down etc), so I appreciated the small humorous moments, like when the cemetery guy inadvertently set himself on fire.  There was just something about the timing that made me laugh.

[ichbin]

3 hours ago, spankydoll said:

That movie was terrible but the book was divine.

I totally agree.  The British mini-series wasn't too bad though.  

 

3 hours ago, spankydoll said:

I had so name dates like that when I was on Match. Posted real photos and a I was a size 12 at the time so pretty normal looking and the men would just go pale and look downcast when I met them. A couple of the were honest about my weight being an issue but some of them were just awful about it. 

I'll bet those guys were far from Adonis too.  Sadly, this doesn't surprise me though.  I've read enough comment sections online where guys have talked about any woman larger than a stick figure anything other than flattering terms.  

[SunnyBeBe]

22 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I  know i am going to end up "stepping in it", but I will give it a shot anyway.

Plum and the dude collide.  She stains his shirt with her hotdog/bun.  Plum apologizes.  He gets pissed and mouths off.  She gets pissed spits the hotdog/bun out of her mouth on to him and then squishes the hotdog/bun that was in her hand into his shirt.  He gets pissed and punches her..  The detective then decks him.  I think I have that all right.

There are no winners there.  The dude was a jerk, Plum was a jerk.  The conflict kept escalating until he hit her.  It never should have gotten that far.  They both should have backed off. 

ETA:  Yes, the dude should have accepted Plum's apology and just let it go.  If he had it would have ended there.

 

Earlier in the series I thought Veranda gave Plum the opportunity to cash the check without having to go out on all of the dates?   My memory isn't the greatest, I could be wrong about that.

 

One more thing.  Plum slaps the man, after he curses her for squishing the food on him and spitting on him.  So, even though she didn't intentionally put the food on him at first, she bumped into him, then squishes the food on him on purpose, then spits on him, then slaps him, (correction, she didn't slap him) and then he finally hits her.  

Edited June 28, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[BooBear]

2 hours ago, ichbin said:

I'll bet those guys were far from Adonis too.  Sadly, this doesn't surprise me though.  I've read enough comment sections online where guys have talked about any woman larger than a stick figure anything other than flattering terms.  

I was just reading about the incel community and all the articles describe it as men that don't believe they can find a woman.. incel stands for involuntarily celibate. But really it is men that don't believe they can find the woman they want - like Giselle Bunchen. 

Quote

So, even though she didn't intentionally put the food on him at first, she bumped into him, then squishes the food on him on purpose, then spits on him, then slaps him and then he finally hits her.  So, actually, she assaulted him more than he did her.  Granted, he hit her harder, but, one could argue that she was escalating.  

Yes she was in the wrong and reckless... though he didn't have to punch her in the face. Geeze. I bet part of what Dominic was thanking his friend for was not taking action against Plumb.

Quote

Earlier in the series I thought Veranda gave Plum the opportunity to cash the check without having to go out on all of the dates?   My memory isn't the greatest, I could be

She did. I think Plumb isn't taking it because she wants to help Dominic and now perhaps is fully on board herself.

[mrsbagnet]

1 hour ago, SunnyBeBe said:

One more thing.  Plum slaps the man, after he curses her for squishing the food on him and spitting on him.  So, even though she didn't intentionally put the food on him at first, she bumped into him, then squishes the food on him on purpose, then spits on him, then slaps him and then he finally hits her.  So, actually, she assaulted him more than he did her.  Granted, he hit her harder, but, one could argue that she was escalating.  

Plum didn't slap the guy. I just re-watched the scene. He bumped into her, she apologized. He then calls her Fat Ass, at which point she squishes food on him and spits on him. He says "Are you kidding me?" Then she screams "Stop!" to the sky, and then he punches her. There is an element of imagination here (there's thunder and lightning when she screams), but there was no slap.

Edited June 28, 2018 by mrsbagnet

[I-Kare]

A couple of things: 

• Was Officer Bob played by Marc Blucas? I checked both his IMDb page and the episode's and he's not credited but I swear that was him. 
• I found it believable that her date left while she was in the bathroom, but I didn't get the women speculating that he was her brother. He wasn't THAT good looking that it wouldn't be believable that they were together. 
• I totally get Plum being turned off by being fetishized. I agree with everyone who details above how there's a line that can be crossed. I haven't dated for more than a decade (by choice, I've had a lot of folks ask even though I'm about Plum's size) but back when I did I was always concerned that I'd be someone's fetish. Total turnoff. It's dehumanizing (in my opinion). Just like I don't want to be judged negatively based solely on what I look like, I don't want someone to be attracted to me based solely on what gets them off. 
• I also was asked several times to go to FA meet-ups. That weirded me out as well. 

Edited June 28, 2018 by I-Kare
took out random "the"

[formerlyfreedom]

34 minutes ago, I-Kare said:

• Was Officer Bob played by Marc Blucas? I checked both his IMDb page and the episode's and he's not credited but I swear that was him. 

Yes, he was. This article shares a bit more, but it has more casting stuff that hasn't shown up yet, so don't go if you don't want to know more!

[HunterHunted]

14 hours ago, spankydoll said:

I had so name dates like that when I was on Match. Posted real photos and a I was a size 12 at the time so pretty normal looking and the men would just go pale and look downcast when I met them. A couple of the were honest about my weight being an issue but some of them were just awful about it. 

My all time favorite date where a guy blew me off was someone I met through Match. I posted real pictures that were full body. I'm a Black woman. I'm 5 feet  9 inches and at the time 120 pounds. The guy rejected me because my hair was in an afro. In all of my other pictures, my hair was straight or in braids. He just said "I can't do the hair" and left. He had the same freaked out look you described. I've never seen some shit like that over something that was truly superficial. Like this is a guy who might dump Giselle Bundchen for cutting her hair short, not that I have supermodel looks or anything. 

[JudyObscure]

2 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

My all time favorite date where a guy blew me off was someone I met through Match. I posted real pictures that were full body. I'm a Black woman. I'm 5 feet  9 inches and at the time 120 pounds. The guy rejected me because my hair was in an afro. In all of my other pictures, my hair was straight or in braids. He just said "I can't do the hair" and left. He had the same freaked out look you described. I've never seen some shit like that over something that was truly superficial. Like this is a guy who might dump Giselle Bundchen for cutting her hair short, not that I have supermodel looks or anything. 

Back in my college days (1964 y'all!) the boys weren't allowed in the women's dorm past the lobby so if they wanted to see you they asked the guard dog house mother at the desk to call your room and you would go down to meet whoever.  I got the call and walked down the stairs.  All the boys in the lobby would watch as the girl came down.  No one approached me so I just stood like a fool for a minute and then went back up stairs.   Now at that time I weighed 110 pounds, all the senior frat boys were dating me and telling me I was the best looking freshman girl ( I wasn't really  all that, I just had a good Marlo Thomas flip going on) but I was in demand and this guy had come over to ask me out, but didn't recognize me, although he had just called for me, because I had my glasses on. 

Since grade school, I've been a living social experiment about how differently men-- and women -- treat you, because of my thick glasses.  It was always night and day, I could barely get waited on at the cosmetics counter with them on and the clerks would be all over me, asking if I was a model, when I had my contacts in.  Then at age 45 I quit smoking and my weight soared from 110 to 180 in six months and continued to rise.  My own brother didn't recognize me, my father was ashamed of me, and people I could have sworn were friends for life dropped me.  I applied for a job that I was way over qualified for, and, as I walked out, I saw the reflection of the manager making a face and dropping my resume in the trash.  Fortunately my glasses had prepared me for just how superficial people are.  Now I'm old and invisible so that's cool.

That afro story just takes the cake, though.  I love a big afro.  The boy I crushed on through high school -- dead ringer for Troy Donahue -- married a beautiful African American woman and when he first told me about her, he was raving about her afro and how soft it was.

[SunnyBeBe]

11 hours ago, mrsbagnet said:

Plum didn't slap the guy. I just re-watched the scene. He bumped into her, she apologized. He then calls her Fat Ass, at which point she squishes food on him and spits on him. He says "Are you kidding me?" Then she screams "Stop!" to the sky, and then he punches her. There is an element of imagination here (there's thunder and lightning when she screams), but there was no slap.

Sorry if that didn't happen.  Another poster thought it did and so did I.  I'll rewatch it later, so I'm sure I have it right. Thanks. 

[SunnyBeBe]

3 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

Thank you for adding that.  I totally forgot about Plum slapping him.  I am surprised that she wasn't arrested along with the guy.  They both should have been arrested.

They both behaved badly.  On a different day, that altercation probably doesn't happen.  Plum was having a bad day.  She clearly is a a stress eater.  Perhaps the dude was having a bad day, or perhaps he is always a jerk.

Another poster said that she didn't hit the man. That she only put the food on him and spit on him.  I'm going to check it out again, though, it will be painful, to ensure that I have it straight in my mind.................okay.  I rewatched and she's right. Though, Plum squished the food on the man and spit on him, she didn't hit him.  He hit her.  So, it was more force than necessary, even with the spitting, imo.  

Edited June 28, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[Mumbles]

So I agree with everyone that Kitty is awful. But she’s awful to everyone a la Miranda Priestley in The Devil Wears Prada. She’s not singling Plum out.  And in a weird way, she respects Plum’s writing skills. I am buying into the theory that Verena or Verona or whatever her name is was setting Plum up on those horrific dates to psychologically manipulate her. If that holds up, she’s a thousand times worse than Kitty. Well, a hundred times worse. Okay, ten times worse.

[film noire]

On 6/26/2018 at 9:06 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

 When he admitted that watching her eat made him hard, it didn't make her feel sexy. It made her feel used and dirty and gross.

Yes - she was a masturbatory toy, not a person with desires of her own. (Which connects Plum with Stella; both of them turned into orifices  - Plum's mouth and Stella's plastic vagina -  for the sole purpose of male pleasure).

Edited July 5, 2018 by film noire

[Red Bridey]

Plum was standing on the sidewalk near the curb eating a hotdog.  The guy barreled into her and then yelled for her to get out of HIS way even though he could have moved around her.  He was a jerk and though he was no Adonis, yelled that she was a fat ass.  He blamed her for existing.  And then punched her in the face.