S08.E23: Bitter Baby Mama

[druzy]

On 6/5/2018 at 1:37 PM, Calm81 said:

I loved watching Kailyn read her correspondence with Briana to Jo and Vee where she clearly started that argument by saying “have my ex sloppy seconds there’s enough to go around” non-verbatim...she seems so confused on why Briana went from 0-100? Jo and vee had a look of “you did this shit to us, puta!”

Edited June 7, 2018 by druzy

[geauxaway]

1 hour ago, druzy said:

 Vee is beautiful.  Kail should be jealous (I’m sure deep down it kills her).  Even Javi’s new baby mama appears to be cute.  Kail has ruined herself with all the alterations to her #lovetheskinyourein.  She is a pig.

[IDreamofJoaquin]

I am happy to read all of the other posters calling out Nathan for his hypocrisy.  

 

I hate that I keep defending the Hulk but Brianna is so trashy to be sending those texts.  She's such a bored loser with nothing better to do.  I don't remember who said it but they hit the nail on the head when they said Brianna is only with Javi to rub it in the Hulk's face.  Couldn't be more true!!!

[BitterApple]

3 hours ago, IDreamofJoaquin said:

 

I hate that I keep defending the Hulk but Brianna is so trashy to be sending those texts.  She's such a bored loser with nothing better to do.  I don't remember who said it but they hit the nail on the head when they said Brianna is only with Javi to rub it in the Hulk's face.  Couldn't be more true!!!

I agree. I know Kail shares part of the blame because the more she blathers on saying she doesn't care about Javi and Briana, the more it's obvious she does care, but why does Briana keep needling her? There's absolutely no reason for them to talk or sort out issues or be best friends. As long as Kail isn't interfering with Javi's time with Lincoln, there's nothing to discuss. 

[Scarlett45]

17 hours ago, ghoulina said:

I just don't know where that woman gets off. "Grow up"??? What exactly is Chelsea doing that comes across as immature? Protecting her child? Not letting that deadbeat POS skate on his financial obligations? Honoring the fact that her daughter IS part of the DeBoer family? Yea, so immature. 

 

 

Me being me (wait for it).........

 

I would guess that Chelsea is immature in Ms Lund’s world because she had not accepted that the patriarchy rules supreme and because Adam is Aubree’s sperm donor he can do no wrong, and actually expecting him to contribute to the welfare of his child is just SILLY as Chelsea was the “dumb girl” who had sex out of wed lock so her family must support Aubree and how dare she MOVE ON with her life and have an emotionally healthy/stable relationship with a guy that treats Aubree well. That’s such a FANTASY! Once you’ve procreated with an asshole you’re branded and tainted in the eyes of society and have to put up with his abuse and mistreatment until you DIE. Adult women understand this. 

 

Yup that’s what I think. 

[BitterApple]

Given Adam's narcissism, it wouldn't surprise me if the Linds have coddled, babied and excused their son's behavior over the course of his entire life. If he got into a fight at school, it was probably the other kid's fault. Bad grade in a class? The teacher didn't like him. Beats up his girlfriend, well she must have done something to set him off. Adam never takes accountability for anything and that sort of entitlement mentality isn't created overnight.

[Cherry Cola]

On 6/6/2018 at 3:26 PM, druzy said:

Nathan is a hypocrite.

Sure...but we all are at times.  No? Not defending hin in any way!

[SPLAIN]

2 hours ago, Cherry Cola said:

Sure...but we all are at times.  No? Not defending hin in any way!

It is the hypocrisy and the double standards as well as him not being genuine. 

Nathan is using camera time for his platform to put David on blast. If David had made negative comments about farmers in Kansas, you can bet Nathan would have stood on his soap box and defended farmers. His stance against gay slurs is not sincere and is filled with deceit. Why else would he then ask for an MMA challenge? How does that help the LGBTQ community? He wants it to happen so he can legally assault David.

[lovesnark]

2 hours ago, SPLAIN said:

It is the hypocrisy and the double standards as well as him not being genuine. 

Nathan is using camera time for his platform to put David on blast. If David had made negative comments about farmers in Kansas, you can bet Nathan would have stood on his soap box and defended farmers. His stance against gay slurs is not sincere and is filled with deceit. Why else would he then ask for an MMA challenge? How does that help the LGBTQ community? He wants it to happen so he can legally assault David.

I agree with you. But, I would spring for Pay Per View to watch Nathan kick the ever loving shit out of Lurch. Lurch is a complete weenie and only picks on women and little kids. Watching him run away from the beat down he was getting would make my day.

[missy jo]

Man, Leah way overshared about Gracie's therapy sessions. There is a reasonable expectation of privacy during therapy for adults - this was a defenseless kid who had her privacy violated. 

[kira28]

I can't stand kail. She lies she cheats she uses everyone around her and takes no responsibility nor does she have any remorse for the way she treats and hurts others.  However I loved that she didn't allow Lincolns party to be filmed. It was totally petty and uncalled for but the look on javis face was so worth it to me. When the crew announced  what kail had done Briana was unfazed and just shrugged it off and said they would still have a lot of fun whether it was filmed or not. However Javi practically started hyperventilating and bitched about how it wasnt fair and was such a desperate famewhore about it. I'm sorry but ur child's birthday party does not need to be filmed!! Lincoln doesn't need cameras there to have fun but apparently Javi seems to need the attention.

[lexsaysso]

On 6/4/2018 at 9:44 PM, TexasGal said:

If there is some inside joke about Brianna’s sister saying Javi with a hard J, I wish they’d tell us.  Otherwise, I caaaaaaaaaaan’t.

??in the Spanish, there are two ways to say Javi , one for a boy , one for a girl . When Brittany says Javi w. the hard J , that’s how you would pronounce it if it was a female w. that name . So she’s playing on the names , that’s all . Just pronouncing it as if he was a girl .  

[IDreamofJoaquin]

5 hours ago, kira28 said:

I can't stand kail. She lies she cheats she uses everyone around her and takes no responsibility nor does she have any remorse for the way she treats and hurts others.  However I loved that she didn't allow Lincolns party to be filmed. It was totally petty and uncalled for but the look on javis face was so worth it to me. When the crew announced  what kail had done Briana was unfazed and just shrugged it off and said they would still have a lot of fun whether it was filmed or not. However Javi practically started hyperventilating and bitched about how it wasnt fair and was such a desperate famewhore about it. I'm sorry but ur child's birthday party does not need to be filmed!! Lincoln doesn't need cameras there to have fun but apparently Javi seems to need the attention.

So true!!!!

[Rebecca]

16 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

Me being me (wait for it).........

 

I would guess that Chelsea is immature in Ms Lund’s world because she had not accepted that the patriarchy rules supreme and because Adam is Aubree’s sperm donor he can do no wrong, and actually expecting him to contribute to the welfare of his child is just SILLY as Chelsea was the “dumb girl” who had sex out of wed lock so her family must support Aubree and how dare she MOVE ON with her life and have an emotionally healthy/stable relationship with a guy that treats Aubree well. That’s such a FANTASY! Once you’ve procreated with an asshole you’re branded and tainted in the eyes of society and have to put up with his abuse and mistreatment until you DIE. Adult women understand this. 

 

Yup that’s what I think. 

I wonder if this is what Mrs Lind did herself and what Mr Lind is like. Maybe she’s trying to justify her own shitty life. Or she’s just an asshole enabler. Does Adam have siblings?

16 hours ago, BitterApple said:

Given Adam's narcissism, it wouldn't surprise me if the Linds have coddled, babied and excused their son's behavior over the course of his entire life. If he got into a fight at school, it was probably the other kid's fault. Bad grade in a class? The teacher didn't like him. Beats up his girlfriend, well she must have done something to set him off. Adam never takes accountability for anything and that sort of entitlement mentality isn't created overnight.

True but I’ve seen kids turns out like Adam even with parents who weren’t so much like that. I can think of two right now and they both have multiple brothers and sisters without the attitude that are ‘normal’ (no arrests, good jobs, not abusers, etc) citizens. I think it’s rarer but assholes are sometimes just born assholes, imo. Though seeing this side of Adam’s mom definitely sheds new light. I really wonder about his dad too. And just the overall dynamic in their home. It’s annoying he’s gotten so much money for being a shit dad and it’s all a mystery about his home life.

7 hours ago, lovesnark said:

I agree with you. But, I would spring for Pay Per View to watch Nathan kick the ever loving shit out of Lurch. Lurch is a complete weenie and only picks on women and little kids. Watching him run away from the beat down he was getting would make my day.

I don’t even like violence or anything close but I’ll make an exception for David getting his ass kicked. Wouldn’t feel bad. Do it for Kaiser though, not the LGBTQ, they don’t want ya and we don’t believe your intentions. 

4 hours ago, lexsaysso said:

??in the Spanish, there are two ways to say Javi , one for a boy , one for a girl . When Brittany says Javi w. the hard J , that’s how you would pronounce it if it was a female w. that name . So she’s playing on the names , that’s all . Just pronouncing it as if he was a girl .  

Interesting! I wonder if that’s her way of acknowledging he’s a drama queen. Love if so.

Edited June 8, 2018 by Rebecca

[zenme]

On 6/5/2018 at 12:27 PM, Mkay said:

I’m not excited about watching anymore.  I groan. I do get excited about reading here, though. 

 

 

IKR? This show used to be one that I could not miss. Now, I still watch, but I'm okay if I watch the recording the next day.  I'm still of the opinion that because if the MTV money, we don't get a true reflection of what it's like to be a young single mom. 

[zenme]

That little Aleeah has no no soul or something. No conscience. Did you see the way she was fiddling around with her cup, straw, etc.? She couldn't have cared less about what her mom had to say. She had zero respect for her. When I was that age, I remember wanting to soak up every bit of my mom's attention and just basking in it when I actually had a few moments alone with her. Hopefully, Leah got Aleeah to the therapist in time, and that she's not too far gone. 

[kira28]

20 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

Me being me (wait for it).........

 

I would guess that Chelsea is immature in Ms Lund’s world because she had not accepted that the patriarchy rules supreme and because Adam is Aubree’s sperm donor he can do no wrong, and actually expecting him to contribute to the welfare of his child is just SILLY as Chelsea was the “dumb girl” who had sex out of wed lock so her family must support Aubree and how dare she MOVE ON with her life and have an emotionally healthy/stable relationship with a guy that treats Aubree well. That’s such a FANTASY! Once you’ve procreated with an asshole you’re branded and tainted in the eyes of society and have to put up with his abuse and mistreatment until you DIE. Adult women understand this. 

 

Yup that’s what I think. 

You may be on to something. I have a cousin who has three kids with a guy who lives with his parents even tho he's almost 40. He's had one job in his life and that was only for a few months. He rarely sees his kids and he's never paid a dime to support them. My cousin has a very good career and she is, raising four kids on her own and pays for everything they want and need. She's very involved in their sports and schooling. R

The mother of the deadbeat that fathered three of her kids (she adopted one) puts her down all the time. Tells her that a real woman would stay at home and take care of her kids and not pawn them off on babysitters or daycare (while she works!!) makes me so angry because her own son refuses to work so how in the hell is my cousin suppose to support their kids If her own son won't contribute and she's not supposed to work?? She tells her she's not a real mother because others are raising her kids

He's also an abusive piece of crap like Adam but mommy thinks the mother of his kids is the problem. 

I feel bad for Chelsea because Adam is 100 percent in the wrong and his mom attacking her isn't fair at all. Adam is such a deadbeat he is not a parent to Aubrey at all. 

[Scarlett45]

@kira28 yes everything is always the woman’s fault, and if a woman makes a mistake and tries to make it right/make better choices in the future she’s still a failure.

But a man can be a piece of shit and not lift a finger to contribute to his family or society and it’s because a woman kept him down. 

SURE.....

Their (the Linds) POS son attacked Stacia and broke her arm! But I’m sure that’s Stacia’s fault somehow, and if Chelsea cannot see that she’s immature....?

Edited June 8, 2018 by Scarlett45

[lezlers]

On ‎6‎/‎5‎/‎2018 at 9:27 PM, Kazu said:

 

The other thing about Nathan and his stance on the "F" slur, I have a feeling he is only bothered by it because DF#2 has used it when describing Kaiser's behavior. How many times have we heard DF#2 refer to Kaiser and Jace as being non-masculine such as the time he called out Jace for wearing "sissy" clothes? No doubt whatsoever he has called Kaiser a f*ggot on more than one occasion. Nathan posted how his son is perfect. He doesn't need eyeglasses. He is a "decent" of the line of Griffin. He is using the opportunity to "school" people on DF#2 being homophobic and to steer more negativity in his direction. This is more about it being personal than Nathan being offended on behalf of the LGBTQ community.

Nathan is ridiculously transparent.  I started cracking up when he was stumbling over the word "pejorative."  Was that the word?  I watched it a few days ago.  You could tell he'd clearly been practicing how to exploit David's atrocious behavior to bolster his own popularity.  Jeremy has done a much better job likely because he's actually genuine about it. We all know Nathan has neo Nazi tendencies and is clearly just taking this stance now for self serving reasons. His faux outrage is ridiculous.  It was also concerning how upset he was that Jenelle wasn't there at drop-off.  He was clearly looking for a confrontation (on camera of course) and was livid he wasn't going to get his emmy award winning scene as a crusader of LGBTQ rights. 

[Mkay]

6 hours ago, Rebecca said:

I wonder if this is what Mrs Lind did herself and what Mr Lind is like. Maybe she’s trying to justify her own shitty life. Or she’s just an asshole enabler. Does Adam have siblings?

True but I’ve seen kids turns out like Adam even with parents who weren’t so much like that. I can think of two right now and they both have multiple brothers and sisters without the attitude that are ‘normal’ (no arrests, good jobs, not abusers, etc) citizens. I think it’s rarer but assholes are sometimes just born assholes, imo. Though seeing this side of Adam’s mom definitely sheds new light. I really wonder about his dad too. And just the overall dynamic in their home. It’s annoying he’s gotten so much money for being a shit dad and it’s all a mystery about his home life.

 

Yes, he has two brothers. 

[Brooklynista]

14 hours ago, kira28 said:

I can't stand kail. She lies she cheats she uses everyone around her and takes no responsibility nor does she have any remorse for the way she treats and hurts others.  However I loved that she didn't allow Lincolns party to be filmed. It was totally petty and uncalled for but the look on javis face was so worth it to me. When the crew announced  what kail had done Briana was unfazed and just shrugged it off and said they would still have a lot of fun whether it was filmed or not. However Javi practically started hyperventilating and bitched about how it wasnt fair and was such a desperate famewhore about it. I'm sorry but ur child's birthday party does not need to be filmed!! Lincoln doesn't need cameras there to have fun but apparently Javi seems to need the attention.

But they got matching t-shirts!!!  That was a master move by kail.  Hit Javi where it hurts and unfazed as Briana LOOKED she was tight.  Her main goal is to irk Kail and annoy people. 

[Kazu]

4 hours ago, zenme said:

That little Aleeah has no no soul or something. No conscience. Did you see the way she was fiddling around with her cup, straw, etc.? She couldn't have cared less about what her mom had to say. She had zero respect for her. When I was that age, I remember wanting to soak up every bit of my mom's attention and just basking in it when I actually had a few moments alone with her. Hopefully, Leah got Aleeah to the therapist in time, and that she's not too far gone. 

I beg to differ. That child's soul has been damaged due to the years her mother was dick-hopping and addicted to pillses. She has also dealt with two divorces in her short life. Children of divorce can be scarred.

The way I see it, Gracie is not hearing what Leah has to say because the stuff that Leah doles out is not interesting to her child. I am an adult and I wasn't interested in hearing it. It came off like lip service. The other problem I saw was, Leah dishes out way too much for her child to soak in. It is blabbering. I was informed by my child's therapist a few years ago that my husband and I need to keep things simple. Keep it short and sweet. A child's attention span is not like an adult's and they have a different way of comprehending what they are being told. Leah is the one who needs to learn how to read her child's body language and demeanor. She needs to stop talking AT her and talk with her child. There is a lot Gracie has had to deal with in her short life. Just my view.

1 hour ago, lezlers said:

Nathan is ridiculously transparent.  I started cracking up when he was stumbling over the word "pejorative."  Was that the word?  I watched it a few days ago.  You could tell he'd clearly been practicing how to exploit David's atrocious behavior to bolster his own popularity.  Jeremy has done a much better job likely because he's actually genuine about it. We all know Nathan has neo Nazi tendencies and is clearly just taking this stance now for self serving reasons. His faux outrage is ridiculous.  It was also concerning how upset he was that Jenelle wasn't there at drop-off.  He was clearly looking for a confrontation (on camera of course) and was livid he wasn't going to get his emmy award winning scene as a crusader of LGBTQ rights. 

Yes, Jeremy's stance was more genuine and sincere. You could feel the anger within him, especially when he mentioned he has friends who are gay. It wasn't one of those claims like people throw out after making a racist comment -  "I have black friends." Jeremy also doesn't have a history with DF#2 the way Nathan does. Nathan seeking to fight DF#2 is more about his own personal agenda.

Edited June 8, 2018 by Kazu

[druzy]

9 hours ago, Rebecca said:

Though seeing this side of Adam’s mom definitely sheds new light. I really wonder about his dad too. And just the overall dynamic in their home. It’s annoying he’s gotten so much money for being a shit dad and it’s all a mystery about his home life.

This is a good point @Rebecca and in my opinion it speaks volumes about Chelsea. I'm sure she has dirt on that family but chooses to remain silent because it is in the best interest of Aubree. 

[ghoulina]

6 hours ago, zenme said:

That little Aleeah has no no soul or something. No conscience. Did you see the way she was fiddling around with her cup, straw, etc.? She couldn't have cared less about what her mom had to say. She had zero respect for her. When I was that age, I remember wanting to soak up every bit of my mom's attention and just basking in it when I actually had a few moments alone with her. Hopefully, Leah got Aleeah to the therapist in time, and that she's not too far gone. 

I think it's unfair to say that such a young child has "no soul" or "no conscience". Especially based on the limited view of her life we have. She didn't care about what her mom was saying, because she's been listening to Leah prattle on like that for years. Leah is all talk and no walk. Gracie knows the score. That kid has carried more on her shoulders than most adults; she practically WAS the adult in the house when Leah was hard on the pillses. 

I do think Leah is trying, but she's still ignorant in a lot of ways and lost respect is hard to get back. The shit Leah was saying was also VERY private. Gracie might have felt embarrassed or disappointed, that her mother was revealing all that for the cameras. She was probably internalizing her anger in that moment. 

She can be bratty sometimes, but she's just a little girl. 

[AirQuotes]

6 hours ago, zenme said:

That little Aleeah has no no soul or something. No conscience. Did you see the way she was fiddling around with her cup, straw, etc.? She couldn't have cared less about what her mom had to say. She had zero respect for her. When I was that age, I remember wanting to soak up every bit of my mom's attention and just basking in it when I actually had a few moments alone with her. Hopefully, Leah got Aleeah to the therapist in time, and that she's not too far gone. 

I didn't see it that way at all.  This is a good example of why this show should end.  These kids are being used as pawns by these sick producers and it is disgusting.  Now "storylines" are being written for these kids but they don't understand it so they don't go along with it properly.  That girl's current story is that she is having trouble coping because of her sister's disabilities which may be a part of it, but I'm betting it has more to do with Leah's issues than either of the girlses.

I did take issue with her kicking the back of the seat in the car, but it does go back to these kids should not be filmed or used in these story lines.

2 hours ago, Kazu said:

I beg to differ. That child's soul has been damaged due to the years her mother was dick-hopping and addicted to pillses. She has also dealt with two divorces in her short life. Children of divorce can be scarred.

The way I see it, Gracie is not hearing what Leah has to say because the stuff that Leah doles out is not interesting to her child. I am an adult and I wasn't interested in hearing it. It came off like lip service. The other problem I saw was, Leah dishes out way too much for her child to soak in. It is blabbering. I was informed by my child's therapist a few years ago that my husband and I need to keep things simple. Keep it short and sweet. A child's attention span is not like an adult's and they have a different way of comprehending what they are being told. Leah is the one who needs to learn how to read her child's body language and demeanor. She needs to stop talking AT her and talk with her child. There is a lot Gracie has had to deal with in her short life. Just my view.

This!  All this!  Leah and the producers have made up this storyline for her and force feeding it to her isn't working.

16 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

I think it's unfair to say that such a young child has "no soul" or "no conscience". Especially based on the limited view of her life we have. She didn't care about what her mom was saying, because she's been listening to Leah prattle on like that for years. Leah is all talk and no walk. Gracie knows the score. That kid has carried more on her shoulders than most adults; she practically WAS the adult in the house when Leah was hard on the pillses. 

I do think Leah is trying, but she's still ignorant in a lot of ways and lost respect is hard to get back. The shit Leah was saying was also VERY private. Gracie might have felt embarrassed or disappointed, that her mother was revealing all that for the cameras. She was probably internalizing her anger in that moment. 

She can be bratty sometimes, but she's just a little girl. 

This too!  All this!

So many aspects to how messed it is to be dragging the kids into this bullshit in this way.

[Kazu]

9 hours ago, Rebecca said:

I wonder if this is what Mrs Lind did herself and what Mr Lind is like. Maybe she’s trying to justify her own shitty life. Or she’s just an asshole enabler. Does Adam have siblings?

True but I’ve seen kids turns out like Adam even with parents who weren’t so much like that. I can think of two right now and they both have multiple brothers and sisters without the attitude that are ‘normal’ (no arrests, good jobs, not abusers, etc) citizens. I think it’s rarer but assholes are sometimes just born assholes, imo. Though seeing this side of Adam’s mom definitely sheds new light. I really wonder about his dad too. And just the overall dynamic in their home. It’s annoying he’s gotten so much money for being a shit dad and it’s all a mystery about his home life.

Though seeing this side of Adam’s mom definitely sheds new light. I really wonder about his dad too. And just the overall dynamic in their home. It’s annoying he’s gotten so much money for being a shit dad and it’s all a mystery about his home life.

Word!

We don't even know what the Linds look like after all these years. We don't know anything about the Linds except what an asshole son they have. He has gotten paid while declining to film for the most part. A majority, if not all, that MTV money has gone towards his own benefit, not that of the child he helped bring into the world. Cole has been in Aubree's life for such a short amount of time and has given so much of himself in so many ways that exceeds and will continue to exceed anything Adumb and his parents will ever give to Aubree.

[guilfoyleatpp]

One (ONE) positive thing I can say about Adam is that he said he was done with MTV bullshit and he quit. He didn't keep going for the sake of the dollars or the limited notoriety.

And also, he got a vasectomy. He does seem to have moments of clarity. Two demonstrable ones. 

All these other a-holes keep threatening to quit and bitching and moaning about whatever, but who else has actually done it? Jeremy? Corey? Sort of.

Having said that, Adam is still an addict and an abuser. The reason he quit was likely his narcissistic rage at not being able to control how he was portrayed. 

[lezlers]

On ‎6‎/‎6‎/‎2018 at 8:40 AM, ghoulina said:

I agree with you about David and Adam's mom. I'm just not sure about Nathan's. I thought she seemed like a nice woman, but that she makes sure to follow the rules and doesn't coddle Nathan. I didn't watch his special, though - so maybe I missed something. We haven't seen much of her on the regular show. I'm just curious, what is it about Doris that makes you think she condones and enables Nathan's bad behavior? 

I see her more as a Barb. Someone who isn't perfect, but tries to do the right thing and put the kids first. 

David's mom seems just as dysfunctional as the rest of his family. 

We've never seen Adumb's mom, but the fact that's she shaming CHELSEA in court, and violating court orders while putting Aubree's safety at risk, tells me all I need to know about her. 

Is Barb really trying to do right by Jace, tho?  Hear me out before everyone attacks:  I was listening to the feathers in my hair podcast and she went on a little rant that got me thinking.  Barb has the ability to pull Jace from the show.  Jace is now suffering from some serious issues which Barb is laying out on television for the whole world to see.   She went on tv and told the world how he was melting down, throwing things, ect.   Jace is old enough to where he and his friends and his friends' parents can watch this show.   And she's fine with airing the whole family's dirty laundry.  She's got legal custody of him.   She is able to keep him off the show but elects not to.  Why?  Because she stays on the show so long as he's filmed.  And THAT is clearly not in Jace's best interests.  In BARB'S best interests, yeah.  But not Jace's.  So everyone who is taking issue with Leah interrogating Gracie and putting her issues on TV for everyone to see, comment on and judge, should have that same criticism towards Barb right now.  She's got the power to stop it but doesn't.   That is shitty parenting.

Edited June 8, 2018 by lezlers

[hottesthw]

42 minutes ago, guilfoyleatpp said:

One (ONE) positive thing I can say about Adam is that he said he was done with MTV bullshit and he quit. He didn't keep going for the sake of the dollars or the limited notoriety.

And also, he got a vasectomy. He does seem to have moments of clarity. Two demonstrable ones. 

All these other a-holes keep threatening to quit and bitching and moaning about whatever, but who else has actually done it? Jeremy? Corey? Sort of.

Having said that, Adam is still an addict and an abuser. The reason he quit was likely his narcissistic rage at not being able to control how he was portrayed. 

That's the one and only thing I give Adam the slightest bit of credit for. We saw lots of bad actions from him while filming, but obviously there was good going on because Chelsea allowed the visits to happen and I'm sure even some were filmed. And Aubrre seems ok with her dad. Yet most of what was shown  was him fighting with producers, or showing up to an event with Chelsea or Randy narrating of how he's late, or what latest bad thing he did. Towards the end the guy was really damned if he did and damned if he didn't. So he sort of had a point. All they show is bad , so he was done.

As for his mom, I think that's unfair to judge. They aren't on t.v. and they obviously love Aubrre if they're still getting visits with her. I'm not naive enough to believe Chelsea has been Ms Perfect in all of this and hasn't made snide remarks off camera (based on what her and her father share on camera). So we don't know what his mom is dealing with being between Chelsea and her son. And IME, dealing with an addict is no fun. Throw in a baby mamma and young kids and it's a nightmare.

And this takes me back to comments I made during S1. He didn't want Chelsea or his kid. Chelsea and Randy fought to make Adam something he wasn't. He didn't deceive her, he just didn't live up to what they thought he should be when she became pregnant. I'm quite sure he treated her poorly before she laid down with him. She should have marched down to court on the way home from the hospital, got custody/support/visits in place from the start and been done with it. Instead those first years were her whining over him being mean. Why today his behavior is shocking to any of them is beyond me. 

All these girls need to realize when you have unprotected sex with a jerkoff, chances are he'll still be a jerkoff and you'll be stuck with a kid . You don't need MTV to tell you that . 

[Mkay]

2 hours ago, Kazu said:

Word!

We don't even know what the Linds look like after all these years. We don't know anything about the Linds except what an asshole son they have. He has gotten paid while declining to film for the most part. A majority, if not all, that MTV money has gone towards his own benefit, not that of the child he helped bring into the world. Cole has been in Aubree's life for such a short amount of time and has given so much of himself in so many ways that exceeds and will continue to exceed anything Adumb and his parents will ever give to Aubree.

I posted their Facebook way, way, way back in the day.  I remember being afraid it was against the rules.  Even his brothers profiles.  Now I can’t find any of them. 

 

Edited to add add that I found his parents on Facebook again. Don’t know the rules here so..... ? Maybe I can send a message if you want to look them up. 

Edited June 8, 2018 by Mkay

[Scarlett45]

1 hour ago, hottesthw said:

That's the one and only thing I give Adam the slightest bit of credit for. We saw lots of bad actions from him while filming, but obviously there was good going on because Chelsea allowed the visits to happen and I'm sure even some were filmed. And Aubrre seems ok with her dad. Yet most of what was shown  was him fighting with producers, or showing up to an event with Chelsea or Randy narrating of how he's late, or what latest bad thing he did. Towards the end the guy was really damned if he did and damned if he didn't. So he sort of had a point. All they show is bad , so he was done.

As for his mom, I think that's unfair to judge. They aren't on t.v. and they obviously love Aubrre if they're still getting visits with her. I'm not naive enough to believe Chelsea has been Ms Perfect in all of this and hasn't made snide remarks off camera (based on what her and her father share on camera). So we don't know what his mom is dealing with being between Chelsea and her son. And IME, dealing with an addict is no fun. Throw in a baby mamma and young kids and it's a nightmare.

And this takes me back to comments I made during S1. He didn't want Chelsea or his kid. Chelsea and Randy fought to make Adam something he wasn't. He didn't deceive her, he just didn't live up to what they thought he should be when she became pregnant. I'm quite sure he treated her poorly before she laid down with him. She should have marched down to court on the way home from the hospital, got custody/support/visits in place from the start and been done with it. Instead those first years were her whining over him being mean. Why today his behavior is shocking to any of them is beyond me. 

All these girls need to realize when you have unprotected sex with a jerkoff, chances are he'll still be a jerkoff and you'll be stuck with a kid . You don't need MTV to tell you that . 

What ever Chelsea did or didn’t do, she isn’t a drug addict who laid hands on another person and hurt them. ADAM did that. Adam broke Stacia’s arm. Adam’s mom defending him?! Oh I judge her for that!

Whatever side remarks Chelsea or Randy made about Adam and his character 1. Are probably true, 2. Are not in the same league as domestic violence. Chelsea not wanting unsupervised visits after Adam attacked Stacia, a woman who he claimed to have feelings for and had shown kindness to Aubree (it wasn’t as if he got drunk and got in a fight with some guy at a bar, that of course isn’t okay either) shows to me Chelsea has a lick of sense. 

The Linds Love Aubree but they will always put their POS son first. Chelsea making the mistake of getting involved with Adam doesn’t mean she or Aubree have to be subjected to him when he’s a confirmed violent drug addict. This isn’t a personality difference or Chelsea just not liking Stacia. He broke her arm! I would be scared. 

Edited June 8, 2018 by Scarlett45

[Kazu]

1 hour ago, lezlers said:

Is Barb really trying to do right by Jace, tho?  Hear me out before everyone attacks:  I was listening to the feathers in my hair podcast and she went on a little rant that got me thinking.  Barb has the ability to pull Jace from the show.  Jace is now suffering from some serious issues which Barb is laying out on television for the whole world to see.   She went on tv and told the world how he was melting down, throwing things, ect.   Jace is old enough to where he and his friends and his friends' parents can watch this show.   And she's fine with airing the whole family's dirty laundry.  She's got legal custody of him.   She is able to keep him off the show but elects not to.  Why?  Because she stays on the show so long as he's filmed.  And THAT is clearly not in Jace's best interests.  In BARB'S best interests, yeah.  But not Jace's.  So everyone who is taking issue with Leah interrogating Gracie and putting her issues on TV for everyone to see, comment on and judge, should have that same criticism towards Barb right now.  She's got the power to stop it but doesn't.   That is shitty parenting.

 

To be fair, many of us have posted the same thing about Barb. Barb hasn't gotten off easy or been ignored. She has been criticized and the same thing has been said that it would be better for her and Jace to remove themselves from the show, especially when his own therapy sessions were being mentioned by Jenelle and Barb.  For the most part, Barb does give it her best when it comes to Jace. Is there room for improvement? Sure, there always is with any parent.

Currently, Leah has made her child's therapy her story line. She will now go through the wringer. That doesn't exclude the fact that Leah loves her children or that she isn't doing right by them, but there is a lot of room for improvement particularly with the motorized wheelchair issue.

I will judge the fuck outta Adumb's mom for eternity. There is no defense or excuse whatsoever for someone to side with anyone, even their own child, for being an abusive prick. Breaking a girlfriend's arm and violating a restraining order more than once? Yeah, fuck that shit. Adumb's mom is a POS.

@guilfoyleatpp yes, the vasectomy and removing himself from the show is a plus. It doesn't negate the fact he is an abusive asshole and always has been in my eyes regardless of what some people seem to think. Domestic abuse doesn't happen overnight. Adumb was always abusive to Chelsea. Just not in the way that most people think of domestic violence. It was verbal and mentally abusive. He did the same to Aubree, and is still doing it in various forms. 

Edited June 8, 2018 by Kazu

[Scarlett45]

I also wanted to say, in my mind there’s a difference between “having to deal with a jerk because you had a kid with them” and “having to deal with addiction, abuse, coercion, threats to your safety and property.”

People can be jerks (men and women). Being a jerk is not a crime, perhaps they aren’t nice, kind, polite or emotionally engaged with you. Perhaps you just hate the look of them now but you have a child together- that’s one thing. An addict will sell out their own MOTHER for their next fix and cannot be trusted until they accept treatment. Someone who would knowingly and willingly break another person’s arm is a criminal and an awful human being- if that person is your child/spouse/Parent you can love them but NOT defend what they did, or enable them to continue to do things like that.

 

The Linds have most certainly enabled Adam and then blamed everyone else (like Chelsea) for the consequences of HIS choices.....

[hottesthw]

Unless I missed something I was referring to the mother telling Chelsea to grow up. None of us know what that was in response to. I didn't see anything on this episode where the mother defended her son's actions breaking the girls arm. And again, none of us know how Chelsea has acted with cameras off. 

But if this is all true about Adam, WTF is Chelsea going to court NOW for? The kid is 8. Did she think she would change him again? I woulda shut those visits down or my storyline year after year woulda been me in court yet again trying to keep my child away from her father AND his parents. Not supervised visits,  NO visits. Yet all I've seen is happy pregnant Chelsea stories. 

Something about all these folks make me wonder. I think MTV needed at least one chick that appears normal, and Chelsea is the best they got to work with. 

14 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I also wanted to say, in my mind there’s a difference between “having to deal with a jerk because you had a kid with them” and “having to deal with addiction, abuse, coercion, threats to your safety and property.”

People can be jerks (men and women). Being a jerk is not a crime, perhaps they aren’t nice, kind, polite or emotionally engaged with you. Perhaps you just hate the look of them now but you have a child together- that’s one thing. An addict will sell out their own MOTHER for their next fix and cannot be trusted until they accept treatment. Someone who would knowingly and willingly break another person’s arm is a criminal and an awful human being- if that person is your child/spouse/Parent you can love them but NOT defend what they did, or enable them to continue to do things like that.

 

The Linds have most certainly enabled Adam and then blamed everyone else (like Chelsea) for the consequences of HIS choices.....

Well we don't know what his parents have or have not supported. So theres that . 

I wouldn't be around a person like that so I can say for certainty my child wouldn't either. I'd sleep on the courthouse steps before letting someone like that around our kid. Chelsea didn't feel that way and is now dealing with the repercussions.

Edited June 8, 2018 by hottesthw

[hottesthw]

31 minutes ago, Kazu said:

 

@guilfoyleatpp yes, the vasectomy and removing himself from the show is a plus. It doesn't negate the fact he is an abusive asshole and always has been in my eyes regardless of what some people seem to think. Domestic abuse doesn't happen overnight. Adumb was always abusive to Chelsea. Just not in the way that most people think of domestic violence. It was verbal and mentally abusive. He did the same to Aubree, and is still doing it in various forms. 

ITA which is why I have always wondered why Chelsea and Randy wasted years just trash talking Adam instead of letting him go and taking his child support. Aubrre would havr been a lot better off not having any father at all vs what they have always portrayed Adam to be.

Don't get me wrong, I make no excuses for the scum Adam is, but I am not one who cheers "poor Chelsea" either. Her actions make me roll my eyes quite a bit and she's enjoying her good edit. Cole is the only true winner in the history of this show. But the baby-voice does him no favors. 

[zenme]

2 hours ago, AirQuotes said:

I didn't see it that way at all.  This is a good example of why this show should end.  These kids are being used as pawns by these sick producers and it is disgusting.  Now "storylines" are being written for these kids but they don't understand it so they don't go along with it properly.  That girl's current story is that she is having trouble coping because of her sister's disabilities which may be a part of it, but I'm betting it has more to do with Leah's issues than either of the girlses.

I did take issue with her kicking the back of the seat in the car, but it does go back to these kids should not be filmed or used in these story lines.

This!  All this!  Leah and the producers have made up this storyline for her and force feeding it to her isn't working.

This too!  All this!

So many aspects to how messed it is to be dragging the kids into this bullshit in this way.

Yes. Obviously my comments were hyperbole. The kid's got a soul, I'm sure. Even had I not seen the show it would be glaringly obvious that she's been poorly parented. Obviously Corey and Miranda try, but she's primarily with Leah, and Leah may think she's trying her best, but along with the drug problems and a lack of parenting skills, it's a mess. Ali and Aleeah are two separate personalities, and the clusterfuck that is Leah's lifestyle, along with Aleah's natural personality--well, no bueno. I believe Leah could use therapy herself.

[Kazu]

@hottesthw

Chelsea did go to court numerous times.  The courts didn't see Adumb as a danger to Aubree. The courts have to have something egregious in order to determine a parent is unfit. A parent just can't walk into a courtroom and demand a parent's rights be stripped or denied without something tangible that a judge would deem is a safety issue. Adumb also had the money to hire an attorney. If he didn't have that going for him, the circumstances would have been different, I am sure. It was only recently that a judge finally ordered Adumb was to have SUPERVISED visitation. Still, his rights as a parent remain intact. 

Also, the Linds (who have their own rights) have violated the court order by allowing Adumb to be alone with Aubree, something that was ordered long ago. Chelsea has made this an issue, but again, the courts have control. So with that, I continue with my stance that Adumb's parents are POS.

Chelsea did take Adumb for child support. She even went to court when he didn't pay it. Excuse me for asking, but do you watch the show? Not being snarky, I am truly asking because the things you ask and mention have been discussed in length on the show and here. Maybe you are asking because you forgot?

Edited June 8, 2018 by Kazu

[guilfoyleatpp]

1 hour ago, Kazu said:

@guilfoyleatpp yes, the vasectomy and removing himself from the show is a plus. It doesn't negate the fact he is an abusive asshole and always has been in my eyes regardless of what some people seem to think. Domestic abuse doesn't happen overnight. Adumb was always abusive to Chelsea. Just not in the way that most people think of domestic violence. It was verbal and mentally abusive. He did the same to Aubree, and is still doing it in various forms. 

Yes. I won't EVER forget that text he sent to Chelsea right after Aubree was born calling her "a fat, stretchmarked bitch" and calling Aubree "a mistake" and telling them he would be sign the papers to relinquish his parental rights.

He was a dumb teenager then, but there are lines that even dumb teenagers don't cross, and that's one of them. The guy has never had character and anything he has done "right" probably turned out that way by mere coincidence and was done for the wrong reasons (like the vasectomy and quitting TM). 

[Kazu]

16 minutes ago, guilfoyleatpp said:

Yes. I won't EVER forget that text he sent to Chelsea right after Aubree was born calling her "a fat, stretchmarked bitch" and calling Aubree "a mistake" and telling them he would be sign the papers to relinquish his parental rights.

He was a dumb teenager then, but there are lines that even dumb teenagers don't cross, and that's one of them. The guy has never had character and anything he has done "right" probably turned out that way by mere coincidence and was done for the wrong reasons (like the vasectomy and quitting TM). 

Absolutely.

He also called Aubree a bastard. I am fuming just thinking about it. 

[Scarlett45]

57 minutes ago, hottesthw said:

Unless I missed something I was referring to the mother telling Chelsea to grow up. None of us know what that was in response to. I didn't see anything on this episode where the mother defended her son's actions breaking the girls arm. And again, none of us know how Chelsea has acted with cameras off. 

But if this is all true about Adam, WTF is Chelsea going to court NOW for? The kid is 8. Did she think she would change him again? I woulda shut those visits down or my storyline year after year woulda been me in court yet again trying to keep my child away from her father AND his parents. Not supervised visits,  NO visits. Yet all I've seen is happy pregnant Chelsea stories. 

Something about all these folks make me wonder. I think MTV needed at least one chick that appears normal, and Chelsea is the best they got to work with. 

Well we don't know what his parents have or have not supported. So theres that . 

I wouldn't be around a person like that so I can say for certainty my child wouldn't either. I'd sleep on the courthouse steps before letting someone like that around our kid. Chelsea didn't feel that way and is now dealing with the repercussions.

According to our knowledge the attack on Stacia is the first time Adam was most certainly violent with someone. (Where they filed a complaint and made it public knowledge) After he was convicted of his drug offenses Chelsea did go to court and get supervised visits. The Linds have supported Adam financially (he lived in their home) and they knowingly disregarded the court order and allowed him to have unsupervised visits with Aubree in their home- that’s supporting and enabling him. 

 

48 minutes ago, Kazu said:

@hottesthw

Chelsea did go to court numerous times.  The courts didn't see Adumb as a danger to Aubree. The courts have to have something egregious in order to determine a parent is unfit. A parent just can't walk into a courtroom and demand a parent's rights be stripped or denied without something tangible that a judge would deem is a safety issue. Adumb also had the money to hire an attorney. If he didn't have that going for him, the circumstances would have been different, I am sure. It was only recently that a judge finally ordered Adumb was to have SUPERVISED visitation. Still, his rights as a parent remain intact. 

Also, the Linds (who have their own rights) have violated the court order by allowing Adumb to be alone with Aubree, something that was ordered long ago. Chelsea has made this an issue, but again, the courts have control. So with that, I continue with my stance that Adumb's parents are POS.

Chelsea did take Adumb for child support. She even went to court when he didn't pay it. Excuse me for asking, but do you watch the show? Not being snarky, I am truly asking because the things you ask and mention have been discussed in length on the show and here. Maybe you are asking because you forgot?

Yes Ditto. Chelsea has been in court for years to get things officially handled regarding Adam’s parenting. 

[druzy]

This is the Producer's Tell All for this episode. About halfway through they talk about Barb and show clips of Barb's classic scenes.

[kira28]

Maybe slightly off topic but I feel the need to stick up for barb here. Is had a perfect parent? Hell no! But she is light years ahead of the majority of the mothers on this shit show including kail Janelle Briana etc. It has to be difficult to be in your sixties and raise young children. I had kids in my mid thirties and it was tough. You just don't have the energy of a 20 yr old lol. Plus barb doesn't appear to have any help or a support system. She doesn't have a partner to help her so everything is on her shoulders. Barb doesn't have a revolving door of men, she doesn't do drugs and she doesn't dump Jace off on everyone else to go in vacations. I don't think barb gets much "me time"  plus Jace has behavioral problems. Kail is lucky her kids have good fathers and they probably don't witness what jace does. He didn't learn to punch holes in walls on His own. I'm sure he saw violence when Janelle was with Nathan and now at David's house. 

 

Barn makes sure. Jace is safe and taken care of she has him in therapy and extra curricular activities. She still works at Walmart and in all honesty proly doesn't stop jace from being filmed because the money really helps and if she did stop she woijdnt have money for an attorney to fight Janelle when she drags her back to court for custody and that's a huge problem. And filming jace at his egg donors house ensures his safety. And she has a record of all the dumb irresponsible stuff Janelle does and says when jace is with her. 

[lezlers]

2 hours ago, hottesthw said:

Unless I missed something I was referring to the mother telling Chelsea to grow up. None of us know what that was in response to. I didn't see anything on this episode where the mother defended her son's actions breaking the girls arm. And again, none of us know how Chelsea has acted with cameras off. 

But if this is all true about Adam, WTF is Chelsea going to court NOW for? The kid is 8. Did she think she would change him again? I woulda shut those visits down or my storyline year after year woulda been me in court yet again trying to keep my child away from her father AND his parents. Not supervised visits,  NO visits. Yet all I've seen is happy pregnant Chelsea stories. 

Something about all these folks make me wonder. I think MTV needed at least one chick that appears normal, and Chelsea is the best they got to work with. 

Well we don't know what his parents have or have not supported. So theres that . 

I wouldn't be around a person like that so I can say for certainty my child wouldn't either. I'd sleep on the courthouse steps before letting someone like that around our kid. Chelsea didn't feel that way and is now dealing with the repercussions.

If I recall correctly, Chelsea has been to court numerous times to restrict visitation.  Adam has contested it.  As Aubree's father, he has a right to do that.  Chelsea elected not to go the visitation center route because she said it was depressing and she didn't want AUBREE to have to go through that.  So she did it for her daughter.  At this point, with the new information about Adam breaking Stacia's arm, she had no choice, so she did what she had to do.  I'm not sure what more she could do to protect Aubree.

[Rebecca]

6 hours ago, guilfoyleatpp said:

Having said that, Adam is still an addict and an abuser. The reason he quit was likely his narcissistic rage at not being able to control how he was portrayed. 

This. And I’m sure he got the vasectomy so “no more dumb bitches” could “get him” for child support. I’m sure it wasn’t him sitting there thinking, “gee, I already have two kids I don’t parent or take care of so obviously I should ensure I don’t have any more!” But whatever selfish shit got him there still results in him not having more kids and being off my TV so adios!

6 hours ago, lezlers said:

Is Barb really trying to do right by Jace, tho?  Hear me out before everyone attacks:  I was listening to the feathers in my hair podcast and she went on a little rant that got me thinking.  Barb has the ability to pull Jace from the show.  Jace is now suffering from some serious issues which Barb is laying out on television for the whole world to see.   She went on tv and told the world how he was melting down, throwing things, ect.   Jace is old enough to where he and his friends and his friends' parents can watch this show.   And she's fine with airing the whole family's dirty laundry.  She's got legal custody of him.   She is able to keep him off the show but elects not to.  Why?  Because she stays on the show so long as he's filmed.  And THAT is clearly not in Jace's best interests.  In BARB'S best interests, yeah.  But not Jace's.  So everyone who is taking issue with Leah interrogating Gracie and putting her issues on TV for everyone to see, comment on and judge, should have that same criticism towards Barb right now.  She's got the power to stop it but doesn't.   That is shitty parenting.

 

This applies to every parent on the show. They’re all choosing to put their kids on the show still. Plus, Barb is getting up there in years, raising someone else’s kid with no support and doesn’t have nearly the future earning potential as the rest of the cast in their 20s and early 30s. I think she’s one of the few who is actually doing the show in attempt to set Jace up for a decent future. We don’t see her going off on vacations without him, especially with a new flavor of the month. She didn’t use the show as an excuse not to work. She didn’t use all the money to buy pillses. It seems like she uses the money to better Jace’s life. I don’t think ANY of these kids should be on TV any longer and at the very least their personal issues shouldn’t be storylines, but I don’t hold Barb any more culpable than any other parent on the show. BTW, Annoying Liz (she annoys me sooo much I can no longer listen) from FIMH has always had shit to talk about Barb for some reason.

5 hours ago, hottesthw said:

That's the one and only thing I give Adam the slightest bit of credit for. We saw lots of bad actions from him while filming, but obviously there was good going on because Chelsea allowed the visits to happen and I'm sure even some were filmed. And Aubrre seems ok with her dad. Yet most of what was shown  was him fighting with producers, or showing up to an event with Chelsea or Randy narrating of how he's late, or what latest bad thing he did. Towards the end the guy was really damned if he did and damned if he didn't. So he sort of had a point. All they show is bad , so he was done.

As for his mom, I think that's unfair to judge. They aren't on t.v. and they obviously love Aubrre if they're still getting visits with her. I'm not naive enough to believe Chelsea has been Ms Perfect in all of this and hasn't made snide remarks off camera (based on what her and her father share on camera). So we don't know what his mom is dealing with being between Chelsea and her son. And IME, dealing with an addict is no fun. Throw in a baby mamma and young kids and it's a nightmare.

And this takes me back to comments I made during S1. He didn't want Chelsea or his kid. Chelsea and Randy fought to make Adam something he wasn't. He didn't deceive her, he just didn't live up to what they thought he should be when she became pregnant. I'm quite sure he treated her poorly before she laid down with him. She should have marched down to court on the way home from the hospital, got custody/support/visits in place from the start and been done with it. Instead those first years were her whining over him being mean. Why today his behavior is shocking to any of them is beyond me. 

All these girls need to realize when you have unprotected sex with a jerkoff, chances are he'll still be a jerkoff and you'll be stuck with a kid . You don't need MTV to tell you that . 

MTV gave Adam MANY chances to film “positive things,” even kissing his ass to try and do so and he was still a total asshole about it and drove away after making them wait hours. Rewatch those scenes, there was no way to portray him better. They should’ve fired his ass. 

Chelsea was a stupid teenager, I can’t blame her for not having the maturity to see it all as clearly back then. I’m not sure why Chelsea being unable to totally cut off Adam somehow makes his actions her own fault. It’s also not her choice if he has visitation or not. They kept expecting him to grow the hell up, like most people eventually do, I don’t think even Randy knew what a true sociopathic narcissist Adam would show himself to be as a grown man. I don’t even particularly like Chelsea but I think it’s insane to suggest it’s her fault and she should’ve known Adam would continue to suck into adulthood and that somehow gives him a pass. Chelsea had to grow up and become a mother, why the hell is Adam not held to that standard? She’s the one who chose NOT to be a loser deadbeat parent and she’s getting the blame for the one who is? This kind of reminds me of people blaming Barb (aka the parent who STAYED to parent) for how Jenelle has “turned out” but they never say anything about Jenelle’s father, who was abusive and then abandoned the family, or his role in all of this. 

5 hours ago, Mkay said:

I posted their Facebook way, way, way back in the day.  I remember being afraid it was against the rules.  Even his brothers profiles.  Now I can’t find any of them. 

Edited to add add that I found his parents on Facebook again. Don’t know the rules here so..... ? Maybe I can send a message if you want to look them up. 

 

I don’t see why there would be a rule against it but please send me a link if you could! The fact they won’t show their faces kind of says it all to me but I’d like to learn SOMETHING about these mysterious people.

4 hours ago, Kazu said:

@hottesthw

Chelsea did go to court numerous times.  The courts didn't see Adumb as a danger to Aubree. The courts have to have something egregious in order to determine a parent is unfit. A parent just can't walk into a courtroom and demand a parent's rights be stripped or denied without something tangible that a judge would deem is a safety issue. Adumb also had the money to hire an attorney. If he didn't have that going for him, the circumstances would have been different, I am sure. It was only recently that a judge finally ordered Adumb was to have SUPERVISED visitation. Still, his rights as a parent remain intact. 

Also, the Linds (who have their own rights) have violated the court order by allowing Adumb to be alone with Aubree, something that was ordered long ago. Chelsea has made this an issue, but again, the courts have control. So with that, I continue with my stance that Adumb's parents are POS.

Chelsea did take Adumb for child support. She even went to court when he didn't pay it. Excuse me for asking, but do you watch the show? Not being snarky, I am truly asking because the things you ask and mention have been discussed in length on the show and here. Maybe you are asking because you forgot?

 

All of this. It’s just not that easy to remove parental rights. One of my friends was beaten up by her baby’s father several times when we were teens and finally dumped him and pressed charges. She got a restraining order (for 5 years, so it was taken seriously). The guy also had several other charges for beating up other people. She still had to allow him to take their baby son for visits, his rights were not changed in any way because the judge said just because he was abusive to her and others it didn’t mean he would be abusive towards his kid ?. He was but not overtly and luckily lost interest after a few months and never saw his son again. (He’s 17 now.) It was horrifying for my friend to have to allow her son to go and a form of psychological abuse, imo.

1 hour ago, lezlers said:

If I recall correctly, Chelsea has been to court numerous times to restrict visitation.  Adam has contested it.  As Aubree's father, he has a right to do that.  Chelsea elected not to go the visitation center route because she said it was depressing and she didn't want AUBREE to have to go through that.  So she did it for her daughter.  At this point, with the new information about Adam breaking Stacia's arm, she had no choice, so she did what she had to do.  I'm not sure what more she could do to protect Aubree.

Right and I think she recognizes that Aubree does have a lifelong relationship with her grandparents and that cutting off all contact, even if she could, would hurt Aubree. Now things have gotten so much worse she had no choice but to try and change things.

Edited June 9, 2018 by Rebecca

[Calm81]

All this talk about Grace and Jaces therapy sessions has got me thinking, are the kids being asked by attorneys and producers if they in fact want to be airing their lives on teen mom? Or is it solely the parents decision?

I ask because, Leah talking about Gracie’s private therapy sessions or Jenelle talking  about Jaces private therapy sessions on Tv could be VERY humiliating for them now that they are old enough to get picked on in school. It’s not like they’re babies or toddlers anymore. I remember when I was 8/9 and kids picked on me for many things out of my control (cheap sneakers, my dad having “a poor mans car” etc) that I’m sure personal therapy sessions is fair game for hazing. I bet my bottom dollar that Jace and Gracie’s school mates parents’ all watch this shit show.

I mean, if I knew my 6 year old sons classmates were on a reality show and that I saw their parents at the pick up and drop off at school I’d be nosy enough to watch their show to see what they’re up to.

Then my child would “accidentally” catch a few clips (hypothetically speaking as I would never allow my young child to watch this show lol — not judging any of you if your kids watch this show...just my personal preference — not judging) where his friend from home room was on his television screen talking to his mom about wetting the bed the night before or sharing is personal feelings about therapy could open a door to harassment. Kids in middle school are insufferable — I still have insecurities from all of the teasing I suffered at that age.

What I’m getting at it... I hope the kids are being asked permission to be filmed. I hope they’re not just being told “you’re a kid I’m the adult, you will do as I say, talk when the cameras are rolling!!!” You know?

The kids will have so much to deal with in middle school and high school due to their parents actions, they DON’T need to be ridiculed for moments about them that were caught on film during a time they didn’t have the wherewithal to understand the ramifications of having personal things shared for world consumption. 

If I were 4 years old like Kaiser I would have no wherewithal to know strangers were on social media zooming in on part of my pull-up seeping out of my shorts and talking about whether or not I was too old to be wearing protection from bowel movements. I just feel sad for Kaiser and the other kids. When Kaiser is 15 boys might taunt him. 

I’m rambling...I just think these kids are being exploited and see it as a minor form of child abuse. Children deserve more rights. They may think it’s cool to be on TV now but they don’t understand what this will mean for their future. 

ETA:

TL; DR

It’s time to get these kids off this show.

Edited June 9, 2018 by Calm81

[DangerousMinds]

19 hours ago, AirQuotes said:

I didn't see it that way at all.  This is a good example of why this show should end.  These kids are being used as pawns by these sick producers and it is disgusting.  Now "storylines" are being written for these kids but they don't understand it so they don't go along with it properly.  That girl's current story is that she is having trouble coping because of her sister's disabilities which may be a part of it, but I'm betting it has more to do with Leah's issues than either of the girlses.

I did take issue with her kicking the back of the seat in the car, but it does go back to these kids should not be filmed or used in these story lines.

This!  All this!  Leah and the producers have made up this storyline for her and force feeding it to her isn't working.

This too!  All this!

So many aspects to how messed it is to be dragging the kids into this bullshit in this way.

Exactly. All of these kids are too old for this show now and all of the parents need to realize this and stop exploiting them for money.

19 hours ago, lezlers said:

Is Barb really trying to do right by Jace, tho?  Hear me out before everyone attacks:  I was listening to the feathers in my hair podcast and she went on a little rant that got me thinking.  Barb has the ability to pull Jace from the show.  Jace is now suffering from some serious issues which Barb is laying out on television for the whole world to see.   She went on tv and told the world how he was melting down, throwing things, ect.   Jace is old enough to where he and his friends and his friends' parents can watch this show.   And she's fine with airing the whole family's dirty laundry.  She's got legal custody of him.   She is able to keep him off the show but elects not to.  Why?  Because she stays on the show so long as he's filmed.  And THAT is clearly not in Jace's best interests.  In BARB'S best interests, yeah.  But not Jace's.  So everyone who is taking issue with Leah interrogating Gracie and putting her issues on TV for everyone to see, comment on and judge, should have that same criticism towards Barb right now.  She's got the power to stop it but doesn't.   That is shitty parenting.

I have the same criticism of ALL of these parents at this point. Give these kids their privacy.

[lezlers]

14 hours ago, Rebecca said:

 

This applies to every parent on the show. They’re all choosing to put their kids on the show still. Plus, Barb is getting up there in years, raising someone else’s kid with no support and doesn’t have nearly the future earning potential as the rest of the cast in their 20s and early 30s. I think she’s one of the few who is actually doing the show in attempt to set Jace up for a decent future. We don’t see her going off on vacations without him, especially with a new flavor of the month. She didn’t use the show as an excuse not to work. She didn’t use all the money to buy pillses. It seems like she uses the money to better Jace’s life. I don’t think ANY of these kids should be on TV any longer and at the very least their personal issues shouldn’t be storylines, but I don’t hold Barb any more culpable than any other parent on the show. BTW, Annoying Liz (she annoys me sooo much I can no longer listen) from FIMH has always had shit to talk about Barb for some reason.

 

I definitely don't agree with everything Liz says (I actually like her voice, it's better than the Bish Sesh women who, while funny, turn me off with their constant giggling through every sentence they utter) but I think she definitely had some valid points about Barb.  Her strange distain for Chelsea turns me off, as does her love for the Coven (something tells me she's very much like the Coven from the stuff she's said so that makes sense) but as a person who went through similar issues with a child and knows how it felt when her own mother put her on blast in public, I think she had valid points when it comes to Barb.  And she says what I've been saying for years: Jenelle and her siblings were not created in a vacuum.  We've seen Barb emotionally abuse Jace on the show.  Is she lightyears better than Jenelle?  Of COURSE.  But she's far from the sainthood many people try to bestow on her.  I don't think it's like every parent on the show because every child on the show isn't dealing with mental health issues that are out on display for the entire world to see.  With Issac and Lincoln, we see their trashbag parents and all of their low end drama but the children's issues aren't on display.  With Chelsea we see Adam's horrificness but we're not hearing all about Aubree's emotional issues.   There's a difference.  I could see her having him on the show in past seasons but now that his behavioral issues are elevating to the point where 911 is being called, it needs to stop.  She's damaging him. 

[lezlers]

2 hours ago, Calm81 said:

All this talk about Grace and Jaces therapy sessions has got me thinking, are the kids being asked by attorneys and producers if they in fact want to be airing their lives on teen mom? Or is it solely the parents decision?

I ask because, Leah talking about Gracie’s private therapy sessions or Jenelle talking  about Jaces private therapy sessions on Tv could be VERY humiliating for them now that they are old enough to get picked on in school. It’s not like they’re babies or toddlers anymore. I remember when I was 8/9 and kids picked on me for many things out of my control (cheap sneakers, my dad having “a poor mans car” etc) that I’m sure personal therapy sessions is fair game for hazing. I bet my bottom dollar that Jace and Gracie’s school mates parents’ all watch this shit show.

I mean, if I knew my 6 year old sons classmates were on a reality show and that I saw their parents at the pick up and drop off at school I’d be nosy enough to watch their show to see what they’re up to.

Then my child would “accidentally” catch a few clips (hypothetically speaking as I would never allow my young child to watch this show lol — not judging any of you if your kids watch this show...just my personal preference — not judging) where his friend from home room was on his television screen talking to his mom about wetting the bed the night before or sharing is personal feelings about therapy could open a door to harassment. Kids in middle school are insufferable — I still have insecurities from all of the teasing I suffered at that age.

What I’m getting at it... I hope the kids are being asked permission to be filmed. I hope they’re not just being told “you’re a kid I’m the adult, you will do as I say, talk when the cameras are rolling!!!” You know?

The kids will have so much to deal with in middle school and high school due to their parents actions, they DON’T need to be ridiculed for moments about them that were caught on film during a time they didn’t have the wherewithal to understand the ramifications of having personal things shared for world consumption. 

If I were 4 years old like Kaiser I would have no wherewithal to know strangers were on social media zooming in on part of my pull-up seeping out of my shorts and talking about whether or not I was too old to be wearing protection from bowel movements. I just feel sad for Kaiser and the other kids. When Kaiser is 15 boys might taunt him. 

I’m rambling...I just think these kids are being exploited and see it as a minor form of child abuse. Children deserve more rights. They may think it’s cool to be on TV now but they don’t understand what this will mean for their future. 

ETA:

TL; DR

It’s time to get these kids off this show.

EXACTLY THIS.  That's why I'm getting pretty pissed at Leah and Barb right now.  They're really not doing Jace or Gracie any favors with this.  At this point they're doing it for themselves, not the kids and I can't respect that.

[druzy]

Who is Liz?

[BARISTA]

16 hours ago, hottesthw said:

Unless I missed something I was referring to the mother telling Chelsea to grow up. None of us know what that was in response to. I didn't see anything on this episode where the mother defended her son's actions breaking the girls arm. And again, none of us know how Chelsea has acted with cameras off.

I completely agree, we can't possibly judge that comment out of context, we don't know what it was in response to,  and anything to do with visitation and custody of children in court is a tension filled stressful environment for everyone concerned.

In case anyone missed what was really going on here, Chelsea was trying to cut Adam's parents entirely out of the picture ,while using her control over Aubree to get back at Adam, as per. Adam's visits up to this had been taking place at his parents house, and in more recent times the court had imposed supervised visitation at their house, and rightly so. Chelsea does seem to realise that Adam is entitled to visits with Aubree, but her application here was to move those visits from his parents house to a visitation centre. That greatly affects the quality of the visitations between Aubree and Adam, but Adam deserves no sympathy, he did this to himself. The other consequence however, is that there would be no court scheduled visits between Aubree and her grandparents at their house anymore, so Chelsea would be in full control of when/if Aubree would ever get to see her grandparents going forward. 

So ya, if I was Adam's mom who seems to care about Aubree and wants those visits to continue, I'd be pretty pissed at Chelsea trying to cut me out like that. Why? Because she didn't feel Adam's parents were supervising the visits adequately?  If he was taking Aubree out of the house alone then that's not ok, but say if the grandparents left him and Aubree to play in the next room, or while they ran next door for something, Chelsea could have been dramatizing those incidents for her own advantage. 

The reality is that, Aubree has been going to Adam's parents house on a regular basis for the past 8 years and seems to have a good relationship with them. Sometimes Adam was there, sometimes he wasn't. Chelsea knew Adam was doing drugs for years. But at no stage was there ever a suggestion that Aubree was ever in danger there. There has been no suggestion that Adam would ever physically harm Aubree, and if there was even a remote likelihood of that happening, the courts would outright refuse Adam visitation, period.

Chelsea used Adam's (then recent) drug use and incident of domestic violence to plump up a case to curtail Aubree's involvement with Adam and his family even further. The more she craved completeness in her "perfect world" with Cole, the more she wanted Adam and his family out of the picture. Her sole aim has been to wave a magic wand and have Aubree be Cole's biological daughter and play like Adam never existed. And while she has good reasons to wish that, IMO it's the height of immaturity, and if Adam's mom sees what I see, I sure don't blame her for telling Chelsea to grow up! That comment was about Chelsea's actions, not about Adams.