Season 1-5 Discussion

[J-Man]

On 9/11/2023 at 5:40 PM, MMEButterfly said:

I hope Hayley Mills isn't the killer. 

If she is, it will be in the persona of her American cousin.

[sugarbaker design]

10 hours ago, possibilities said:

All the suspects look guiltier this week, except the heroin addict/son. Do they usually rule anybody out so soon?

 

I personally ruled him out because he was 12-13 when the crime was committed.

I'm having a difficult time in the dating scene, yet Little Miss Crackhead with the unfortunate bangs and scabby mouth found a replacement for her incarcerated beau in a NY minute!

[Mermaid Under]

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And I got the definite impression that Sunny was not enthusiastic,

He already has an ex-wife and two children, correct?  I kind of think a convenient miscarriage and Sal realizing he's just not into her would make Sunny's story more interesting. 

I was not surprised to find out that the codependent crack addict was the son of the murder victim and grandson of the abusive alcoholic.   His age and circumstances seemed to telegraph his eventual role in this story.

[susannot]

Am I crazy, or did the replacement guy for Little Miss Crackhead girlfriend look like the twin brother of incarcerated boyfriend?  Is there a storyline that I missed?

I think Karol, the ex-social worker, is not the killer.  But I think he stumbled upon the bloody murder scene and that is why he resigned the next day and fled the country.

[Mermaid Under]

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Am I crazy, or did the replacement guy for Little Miss Crackhead girlfriend look like the twin brother of incarcerated boyfriend?

no, I thought the same thing.  It just seemed so preposterous though, I couldn't imagine the writers introducing a storyline about a previously unknown twin.

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I think Karol, the ex-social worker, is not the killer. 

I would agree with you, but the writers are definitely telegraphing a latent anger management problem.

Edited September 18, 2023 by Mermaid Under

[possibilities]

Maybe the social worker is the father. He seems to be really angrily fixated on having a baby. It's one thing to want one, and another to be raging at your partner about it, in public at her job, no less. He's not even able to strategically hide his crazy. 

[Milburn Stone]

10 hours ago, buckboard said:

Sunny's fiancee is pregnant and he's promised to be home that night to discuss whether they both want to continue the pregnancy. IIRC, he's already avoided speaking with her. 

Instead, he heads off to interview a suspect in Paris.  This couldn't have waited until morning?  It's not as if Karol, the suspect, was about to flee.

This is the first season in which I'm souring on Sunny. I can understand his ambivalence about the pregnancy. But I can't understand his not catching the next train back to London when his fiancee thinks she is miscarrying. Saying "If you want me to come back, I will" does not cut it. You come back. And then go to Paris tomorrow or the next day.

I mean, it's believable. He's conflicted. But I don't like it.

[proserpina65]

13 hours ago, possibilities said:

Jess gets a tiny bit more likable this week.

Well, she apologized for being an asshole about how long everything was taking when she knows damned well things take the time they take.  Didn't really make her any more likeable to me.  But does show a little bit of self-awareness, I guess.

[zoey1996]

I love how this show is constructed. We were introduced to a number of characters in the first episode, and who they are and how they relate to the case is slowly being revealed. I like that slow burn.

Lord Hume being rejected after trying to do a good thing was satisfying. I'm curious about his involvement in the case and how he relates to the house where the body was found. He clearly was lying about knowing the victim, but what is his involvement with the murder/coverup?

So sad for Sunny and Sal. Whether or not she miscarries, his absence will have repercussions for their relationship. 

Interesting phone call from the prison from Precious's son. His girlfriend is so easily manipulated and weak. What will happen with her? At this point, it's hard to care, but how it all fits together is a question.

[magdalene]

As a new viewer I already did not like Sunny all that much but now I am actively disliking him. Even if ex-social worker turns out to be the killer there was no immediate need to travel to this interview.  So his girlfriend comes maybe third on the importance scale in his life, behind his obsession with his dead ex-boss and the investigation. That must make his lover feel really good.

I am suspecting both the lord and the social worker.

[possibilities]

57 minutes ago, proserpina65 said:

Well, she apologized for being an asshole about how long everything was taking when she knows damned well things take the time they take.  Didn't really make her any more likeable to me.  But does show a little bit of self-awareness, I guess.

I said a tiny bit. Not a lot. And she does for the first time seem to actually want to solve the case, instead of burying it. A low bar, not previously passed.

[MMEButterfly]

1 hour ago, zoey1996 said:

I love how this show is constructed. We were introduced to a number of characters in the first episode, and who they are and how they relate to the case is slowly being revealed. I like that slow burn.

Lord Hume being rejected after trying to do a good thing was satisfying. I'm curious about his involvement in the case and how he relates to the house where the body was found. He clearly was lying about knowing the victim, but what is his involvement with the murder/coverup?

So sad for Sunny and Sal. Whether or not she miscarries, his absence will have repercussions for their relationship. 

Interesting phone call from the prison from Precious's son. His girlfriend is so easily manipulated and weak. What will happen with her? At this point, it's hard to care, but how it all fits together is a question.

This show has become a must-see more than once because I also appreciate how it is constructed. Liking the series regulars is now secondary. 

[12catcrazy]

12 hours ago, buckboard said:

Season 5 Episode 3

Sunny's fiancee is pregnant and he's promised to be home that night to discuss whether they both want to continue the pregnancy. IIRC, he's already avoided speaking with her. 

Instead, he heads off to interview a suspect in Paris.  This couldn't have waited until morning?  It's not as if Karol, the suspect, was about to flee.

I think that the bottom line here is that Sunny is married to his job.  The fiancee will always come second (as will any children) to the job unless Sunny decides to not make it that way.  

I'm wondering where this soap opera is going - Sal miscarries and she decides that Sunny isn't going to be the guy for her, or the pregnancy is saved and Sunny and Sal have a long talk about what they both expect and what the relationship is going to be.   My guess is that the pregnancy will come to term and the baby will be named after Cassie but that's because that seems to be the TV show cliched way of doing things.  Maybe this show will surprise me but I doubt it.   And what is the deal with the woman cop who volunteers to lend Sunny an ear when he needs to grieve - why am I spacing on who she is? 

[Mermaid Under]

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And what is the deal with the woman cop who volunteers to lend Sunny an ear when he needs to grieve - why am I spacing on who she is? 

I don't recognize her either;  I read a review that said she is the pathologist, but if she has been in previous episodes she went unnoticed, at least by me.

[One4Sorrow2TooBad]

Any possibility that Lord Hume and his old political cronies  had a connection with a sex ring in the past?? 

[susannot]

29 minutes ago, One4Sorrow2TooBad said:

Any possibility that Lord Hume and his old political cronies  had a connection with a sex ring in the past?? 

It has not been unknown in British political history.

[MaryHedwig]

17 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

I'm having a difficult time in the dating scene, yet Little Miss Crackhead with the unfortunate bangs and scabby mouth found a replacement for her incarcerated beau in a NY minute!

I thought the same thing. Never discount 'heroin chic'.

[SnapHappy]

DAMN, are all these men just stupid, vindictive or nuts?  I've had about enough of Sunny and his whining.  If he doesn't want the head job, he needs to STFU or leave.  Going behind Jessie's back about HIS team.  Asshole.  Then doesn't even bother to call his partner that he's going out of town.  Poor Sal, she needs to dump him. 

And Karol the ex social worker trying to force his girlfriend to have his baby out of SPITE for her soon-to-be-ex husband?  Who the hell DOES that?

And Sir Tony, trying to throw guilt money at the poor folks he deigns to spend a few hours with out of charity.  Making up for something nasty, no doubt.

Oh, and we also have the toxic Ebele, blaming men for doing terrible things to women.  And SHE'S been the violent one, beating people up including her own family. Bitch.

*grrr*  This show has made me very grumpy. 

 

[proserpina65]

2 hours ago, SnapHappy said:

Going behind Jessie's back about HIS team. 

To be fair, it needed to be done because she was doing a shit job of running the team.

[magdalene]

6 hours ago, SnapHappy said:

grrr*  This show has made me very grumpy. 

It says something about the various characters that I don't find the crackhead robber/aka son of victim the most unlikable of the bunch.

The hair trigger temper of the ex social worker rings big alarm bells for me and as for abusive mommie dearest her woe is me attitude is not sympathy inducing to me and I haven't ruled her out as the killer.

[Mermaid Under]

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I'm having a difficult time in the dating scene, yet Little Miss Crackhead with the unfortunate bangs and scabby mouth found a replacement for her incarcerated beau in a NY minute!

Quote

I thought the same thing. Never discount 'heroin chic'.

Never discount the bizarrely unexplainable appeal of a woman who needs to be "rescued". 

Quote

for abusive mommie dearest her woe is me attitude is not sympathy inducing to me and I haven't ruled her out as the killer.

Ebele is definitely still a suspect in my mind. No reason to disbelieve the social worker who said that Precious suffered from fetal alcohol syndrome, and that the mother refused to accept it.  Whenever the police get too close to something she doesn't want to talk about, she starts to boil.  She can't blow up and smack them like she does her boyfriend (what's up with him?) but it must take everything  she has to hold herself back. And when she told New Guv that "they" was men - no, misleading the police is standard operating procedure for the perp.  I wonder if Precious's father was the Tory?

Edited September 20, 2023 by Mermaid Under

[susannot]

Assuming that victim was killed during a drug party gone wrong scenario I think the most likely killers in order are:

Lord Hume

Lady Hume (Lord Hume does cleanup) (Going by the usual scenario that the best known guest star is the killer)

ex-social worker

Mother

a random druggie whom we have not yet met  (unfair and unsatisfying)

[dleighg]

8 hours ago, Mermaid Under said:

Never discount the bizarrely unexplainable appeal of a woman who needs to be "rescued". 

well, I think her need to get a regular fix gives her a big incentive to offer something of value..... to some men anyway.

[SnapHappy]

3 hours ago, dleighg said:

well, I think her need to get a regular fix gives her a big incentive to offer something of value..... to some men anyway.

My first thought was he was pimping her out while she was wasted and couldn't object.  Some scumbags will just settle for a live body in exchange for cash or crack.

[sugarbaker design]

On 9/19/2023 at 8:56 PM, Mermaid Under said:

I wonder if Precious's father was the Tory?

While we have met Lord Hume, his wife and grandson, we have not met the grandson's parent (Lord Hume's kid).  That character would most likely be the same age as Precious.

And there's still the matter of the identity of the person Lord Hume called on the cellphone.  "What did you do?"

Edited September 21, 2023 by sugarbaker design

[OlderThanDirt]

I thought the replacement guy living with the meth head girlfriend was the guy he sold the phone and credit cards to. 

I forgot to watch the extra features on episodes 2&3. Glad I didn't delete them because I knew I'd have to rewatch for details at the end of the season.

They must not have much crime in the area if they can have the whole squad working on the death of a squatter found years after the crime.

[laredhead]

I'm a new watcher of Unforgotten.  I don't know how I managed to miss it when it was aired on PBS for the past few years, but I'm glad I found it.  When I began watching it on Amazon I watched 2-3 episodes at once, and that helped me keep track of the many, many characters that are always introduced during the first episode, and it was easier to follow the story line and remember who was who.  Now that the newest season is being shown on PBS on a weekly basis, it's hard to remember what happened the week before.  I think I'm going to stop watching and wait until Amazon airs the entire season so I can sort of binge watch it.  Too many characters and too many subplots to keep track of and remember for 7 days - lol. 

[AZChristian]

8 hours ago, OlderThanDirt said:

They must not have much crime in the area if they can have the whole squad working on the death of a squatter found years after the crime.

I think they were originally created to be a cold-case squad.  Jess seems to want to look at "still warm" cases, given her initial reluctance to look into what they originally thought was an OLD cold case.  When they brought it up to the 21st century, she finally got on board with this case.

[dleighg]

40 minutes ago, laredhead said:

I think I'm going to stop watching and wait until Amazon airs the entire season

If you're willing you can also donate $5 a month to your local PBS station to get Passport, which allows you to binge from the beginning.

[One4Sorrow2TooBad]

Still a bit pissed about PBS taking off EastEnders a couple of years ago,what were they thinking???

[SoMuchTV]

23 hours ago, dleighg said:

If you're willing you can also donate $5 a month to your local PBS station to get Passport, which allows you to binge from the beginning.

And the full current season is already on Passport.

[susannot]

Is Joseph Lord Hume's son?  Is Lord Hume actually David Bell, the cult leader?  Looks like next week we travel into Wales to the cult.

Edited September 25, 2023 by susannot

[AZChristian]

12 hours ago, susannot said:

Is Joseph Lord Hume's son?  Is Lord Hume actually David Bell, the cult leader?  Looks like next week we travel into Wales to the cult.

I wondered the same thing.  

Best two words of dialogue in this season:  "You win."

ETA:  After that scene, I turned to Mr. AZC and said, "That whole scene reminds me of every episode of 'Chopped.'  When the four contestants are lined up for judging after the first round, the judges always ask something like, 'Why do you want to win Chopped today?'

"It's like they all have sob stories.  'My dog needs a c-section so she doesn't die giving birth.' Or 'My mother has sacrificed everything so I could go to culinary school, so I want to take her on a cruise.' Or 'I had a double mastectomy 4 years ago, and I want to prove to my daughter that you can overcome adversity.' Then one of the contestants says, 'My daughter is blind and only has one leg, and we were turned down by the Make-A-Wish Foundation.  I need the money to take her to Disney World.'

"All of the other contestants look at the last one and the look on their faces is, 'Crap.  Your story is sadder than the rest of them.  You win.'"

Sometimes life is NOT a competition.  More than one person at a time can have a crisis.  No one has to win.

But that line in the context of "Unforgotten" was perfect.

Edited September 25, 2023 by AZChristian

[dleighg]

4 hours ago, AZChristian said:

Best two words of dialogue in this season:  "You win."

That scene was priceless

[sugarbaker design]

5 hours ago, AZChristian said:

Best two words of dialogue in this season:  "You win."

 

26 minutes ago, dleighg said:

That scene was priceless

Hands down best dialogue in the best scene!

[Mermaid Under]

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Jess seems to want to look at "still warm" cases, given her initial reluctance to look into what they originally thought was an OLD cold case. 

As unlikable as they've made her I have to agree with her on this.  Because of expensive genetic testing (and TV shows about cold cases) there seems to be an expectation that all cases should be solved, including 50 year old cases were the perpetrator and all close relatives to the victim are long dead. With so much other crime going unsolved, it does seem like an unwise waste of money and manpower.

And despite the lovely scene between her and Sunny (I give him the credit for that) I still think the character is supposed be inflexible, hard, and cold.  I forget the words her mother used in a previous episode, but it was something like that.  Telling her mother that she should no longer speak to the other daughter was over the line.  I don't doubt Jess would cut her own sons out of her life if they displeased her. 

[Milburn Stone]

4 minutes ago, Mermaid Under said:

And despite the lovely scene between her and Sunny (I give him the credit for that) I still think the character is supposed be inflexible, hard, and cold.  I forget the words her mother used in a previous episode, but it was something like that.  Telling her mother that she should no longer speak to the other daughter was over the line.  I don't doubt Jess would cut her own sons out of her life if they displeased her. 

I think you're right about this. It's one of the things that makes her interesting to me. I don't "like" her. But I do like the season in part because of her.

[12catcrazy]

I can't understand why the sister actually blabbed to Jess that she was the "other woman" in the affair with Jess' husband.  Especially if you know that your cheated-on sister is hard-nosed and not exactly likely to forgive you and that it will cause a riff in your family.   And yeah, it was over the line telling your mother that she should no longer speak to her other daughter because of the affair.  Talk about putting Mom in a hard place.  But it also seems that Jess is somebody who wants to call the shots with those around her.  

The case is certainly interesting.  I'm usually good at calling out whodunnit but there are so many possibilities here that I'm thinking that the son didn't do it (but saw who did) and that Lord Hume had something to do with it.   And still, his wife is the sister of the person who had owned the house and even though we don't see much of the wife, knowing who is playing her, still makes me wonder...

[magdalene]

When I jokingly theorized that the affair might be with the sister I didn't really believe it might be true, ha.

I still haven't narrowed it down to one suspect for the killer.

I did feel intense dislike for Precious when we learned that she had blocked her son's adoption by a worthy family that would have changed his life for the good.  I find him to be a tragic figure, the scene with his girlfriend alone gave me the feels.

[buckboard]

I like that after their talk where they opened up to each other, Jess and Sunny are getting along and working well together.   It's funny to watch the reaction of the other members of the squad, who don't understand what changed. Jess is thanking officers for their work and Sunny is no longer complaining about her all the time.

[sugarbaker design]

2 hours ago, 12catcrazy said:

I'm usually good at calling out whodunnit but there are so many possibilities here that I'm thinking that the son didn't do it (but saw who did) and that Lord Hume had something to do with it.

I think the kid saw the Lord putting the body up the chimney, I also think the Lord was covering up for someone else.

2 hours ago, 12catcrazy said:

And still, his wife is the sister of the person who had owned the house and even though we don't see much of the wife, knowing who is playing her, still makes me wonder...

Me too.

1 hour ago, magdalene said:

When I jokingly theorized that the affair might be with the sister I didn't really believe it might be true, ha.

But you called it, nonetheless!

1 hour ago, magdalene said:

I did feel intense dislike for Precious when we learned that she had blocked her son's adoption by a worthy family that would have changed his life for the good.  I find him to be a tragic figure, the scene with his girlfriend alone gave me the feels.

After listening to that litany of horrors that Joe had to go through I couldn't help but feel for him.  Tragic figure, indeed.

 

1 hour ago, buckboard said:

 It's funny to watch the reaction of the other members of the squad, who don't understand what changed.

I am living for those furtive looks across the office.

[proserpina65]

3 hours ago, 12catcrazy said:

I can't understand why the sister actually blabbed to Jess that she was the "other woman" in the affair with Jess' husband.  Especially if you know that your cheated-on sister is hard-nosed and not exactly likely to forgive you and that it will cause a riff in your family. 

I think it was eating at her and she couldn't keep it in any longer.  Yeah, it wasn't smart but I understand it.  Plus, it sounds like the sister has been struggling with mental health issues so that is probably part of it.  While I absolutely get Jess being angry with her (she should be), I hated her calling the sister weak for saying it.  (That's the one thing I really hated about the last season of Happy Valley, Catherine telling her sister she was weak.)

I'm glad Sunny and Jess cleared the air, so to speak, and have come to a kind of detente.  He's right about it being better if they can work together rather than having that giant wall in between them.

[possibilities]

Part of what I like about this show is that it does keep me wondering, without making me feel strung along needlessly.

 

[magdalene]

I understand the sisters need to unburden herself, selfish as it is. I also understand if she will never be forgiven.  I am very doubtful if I could forgive a betrayal of that magnitude.

[seacliffsal]

Am enjoying the new season-so many possibilities of who murdered Precious.  I am still suspicious of her mother as we saw how quickly she can become violent in the scene in which she hit her husband.  I really can't figure out the social worker who is now living in Paris.  So many questions-looking forward to how everything will connect.

However, I am very dissatisfied with how little screen time Hayley Mills has (kind of kidding...)-I loved her movies when I was young so was super excited when I realized she was going to be featured during this season.  

[SnapHappy]

This episode was ok.  Sunny didn't make me want to punch him in the throat.  I still don't know what Sal sees in him, he'll always be obsessed with his work.  And he DOES expect Jess to be Cassie.  

No surprise Miss Drunk got drunk & no surprise Miss Crackhead is still doing crack.  The story didn't really move much.  All we verified is that the anger and substance abuse issues are 3 generations deep in Joseph's family.  Poor kid never had a chance.  His foster dad seemed kind & might have really stopped the cycle with him.

Oh, and Jess's sister Debbie is a flat-out skank.  People that confess like that ARE weak, I totally agree.  They just want to spread their selfish misery around to make themselves feel less guilty.  I wouldn't forgive her, that's a absolute deal-breaker for me.  

This seemed like a "filler" episode.  That's fine when you have a season of 10-12 episodes, but with only 6 total, 2 left to go, I'd prefer a little more substance.  The "reset" agreement was fine.  There's just not enough personality or dynamics with the support staff.  I think the guy's name is Murray?  I don't remember the others.

Sad part is I don't care about any of them, really.  This is the last season for me, even if they decide to push for another. 

In this show, Nicola W. is really the one that's unforgettable. And unreplaceable. 

Edited September 26, 2023 by SnapHappy

[J-Man]

On 9/24/2023 at 9:50 PM, AZChristian said:

Best two words of dialogue in this season:  "You win."

ETA:  After that scene, I turned to Mr. AZC and said, "That whole scene reminds me of every episode of 'Chopped.'  When the four contestants are lined up for judging after the first round, the judges always ask something like, 'Why do you want to win Chopped today?'

"It's like they all have sob stories.  'My dog needs a c-section so she doesn't die giving birth.' Or 'My mother has sacrificed everything so I could go to culinary school, so I want to take her on a cruise.' Or 'I had a double mastectomy 4 years ago, and I want to prove to my daughter that you can overcome adversity.' Then one of the contestants says, 'My daughter is blind and only has one leg, and we were turned down by the Make-A-Wish Foundation.  I need the money to take her to Disney World.'

"All of the other contestants look at the last one and the look on their faces is, 'Crap.  Your story is sadder than the rest of them.  You win.'"

Sometimes life is NOT a competition.  More than one person at a time can have a crisis.  No one has to win.

You would have LOVED Queen for a Day.

[AZChristian]

7 hours ago, J-Man said:

You would have LOVED Queen for a Day.

I'm old enough to have watched it, and young enough to remember doing so.

[Milburn Stone]

On 9/27/2023 at 10:04 PM, AZChristian said:

I'm old enough to have watched it, and young enough to remember doing so.

Me too. And I'm adapting this phrase for use in everyday life.

[AZChristian]

As with every season of "Unforgotten" . . . it's all starting to come together.