S30.E07: All's Fair in Love and War! (1) S30.E08: All's Fair in Love and War! (2)

[BarneySays]

On 2/7/2018 at 11:01 PM, Lady Calypso said:

I guess Evan really rubbed people the wrong way and the episodes are giving her a better edit? I mean, she has to be a real nasty person in order to have almost every single team hate just her. It has to be more than her just being controlling and the fact that she doesn't want to work with other teams. 

I don't get the sense the other teams hate evan. They targeted yale because they thought they were a strong team.  Only Jessica has a problem with evan because she's an immature insecure princess who is understandably threatened by evan.  i get the sense jessica did not get an education, has no skills, and works (if at all) as a clerk (not that there's anything wrong with that).  Evan has things she doesn't and my guess is jessica responds to all women who have things she doesn't in this same puerile manner.  Personally, I find jessica execrable, a throwback to the old standard reality fame whore- self-absorbed, entitled, and bitchy.  She reflected the classic reality whore behavior this episode- when she withholds information to make sure she has an advantage or u-turns a team, it's just a smart move  When someone else does it, it's the dumbest mocve in the world, a high crime and an indication of low character (a projection on her part).  And her teammate appears to have some serious maturity issues, too.  This makes them perfect for each other in their stunted states. 

Edited February 10, 2018 by BarneySays

[lexington11]

18 hours ago, Mumbles said:

If you’re equating privilege with money, maybe, because those schools do offer financial aid. But going to an Ivy League school is probably the most privileged you can get in this country, as it relates to opportunities presented to the alums upon graduation. And boy is that uppity little pig proud of it, with her Yale hat. Her imperious tone and attitude toward the other teams are insufferable. I can barely look at that smirky mug of hers with its big snout when watching this show. 

For real. Money aside, the fact that she's constantly bringing up having gone to an Ivy League school as somehow being superior to the other racers definitely gives off that attitude of entitlement that she's had going on this entire race.

[lexington11]

1 hour ago, BarneySays said:

I don't get the sense the other teams hate evan. They targeted yale because they thought they were a strong team.  Only Jessica has a problem with evan because she's an immature insecure princess who is understandably threatened by evan.  i get the sense jessica did not get an education, has no skills, and works (if at all) as a clerk (not that there's anything wrong with that).  Evan has things she doesn't and my guess is jessica responds to all women who have things she doesn't in this same puerile manner.  Personally, I find jessica execrable, a throwback to the old standard reality fame whore- self-absorbed, entitled, and bitchy.  She reflected the classic reality whore behavior this episode- when she withholds information to make sure she has an advantage or u-turns a team, it's to make sure she has the advantage.  When someone else does it, it's a high crime and an indication of low character (a projection on her part).  And her teammate appears to have some serious maturity issues, too.  This makes them perfect for each other in their stunted states. 

Jessica's actual work title is VIP Concierge, and I think we're all aware of what that stands for. And I echo what a previous poster said about missing Rob & Amber, because they got that it was a race and didn't get bent out of shape when the other teams dared to target them.

[dgpolo]

1 minute ago, lexington11 said:

Jessica's actual work title is VIP Concierge, and I think we're all aware of what that stands for

I think that comes from the BB bio, I think her TAR bio says she is unemployed.

Hometown: Los Angeles
Current occupation: Unemployed

Three words to describe you: Loyal, honest, and outrageous.

Favorite hobbies: Yoga, hiking, and boxing.

What is the accomplishment you are most proud of?
Getting through seven weeks of hell on Big Brother.
 

[BarneySays]

On 2/8/2018 at 1:11 AM, blackwing said:

When Phil said on the mat that they overcame a U Turn, she looks over and glares at Indy.  She should just stuff it.  Conor says it's a race, and she's all, oh of course, we understand.  Except it was obvious that she didn't.   

I didn't read her response as a glare, but more as, okay, boys, what do you have to say now?  People forget that evan and henry have probably spent the past eight years competing- against smart people.  As freshmen they would have been competing againt more experienced seniors.  They learned long ago how to compete fiercely, but still remain friendly with and respect their competitors.  They learned to view competition analytically- understanding when they have been bested and when they have bested others.  It's odd to me to think that she didn't understand being u-turned when she was the one who didn't want to spend even a moment talking about why they were u-turned when it actually occurred.

As for evan being entitled, I think that is mere projection.  Perhaps it's the age old anxiety about a confident and smart woman not needing the approval of others, of having a strong sense of agency.  I would bet this is a quality that henry respects and loves in her. 

I thought yale would be goners when they found themselves against bb and the tasks were so physical, especially after henry's ordeal in the mud.  But they remained calm and barreled through the tasks methodically, just as they did the tent-making challenge.  Who would have expected them to finish third at that?  But they looked closely at the example and got it done.  And henry was a beast on the winching.  He looked awkward at first, but buckled down and got it done (his teammate of course also did his share).  They're turning into one of my favorite teams.  I like the no muss, no fuss teams who stay focused, like the cowboys, the skiers, and yale. 

As for the episode, I thought it was a big miss.  The traveling was great to bring on killer fatigue and the closeness of the teams was good, but the design not so much.  The trucks/mud task allowed for that one free bite where it was a bit more solid, but certainly not after the first team drove through it.  The ordering at the end of the poacher task was okay, but only the dimwitted failed to get it on the first try.  I think the swap teams who came in last should have been forced to do an extra task (what's that called again?) after the non-elimination leg.  This could have really made the second leg chaotic- with a double uturn and the added task.  As it happened, the swap was a competitive bust. 

It's always tough when the terms of completing a task aren't clear.  I could discern no standard in the singing task.  The only one of the lot of them who seemed to get it was brittany.  As a side note, I have always assumed that there is an unwritten rule that after so many tries, the judge just passes them along if they make an effort.  (Of course, if you can't even stay under water, there's nothing they can do- ugh beekman boys.)  Note that we saw very little of the winning performances.  With the lifeguards, the guy was completely cut out of their final run.  Hmm.

As for the teams, I thought brittany really shone this episode.  She seemed to glow from the respect and admiration she got from indy and took the lead in their joint effort.  I don't mind the references to her ring.  She's been waiting a long, long time for that (i think it's been something like 9, or is it 127, years?).

The blond skier lost some shine this episode.  She always seemed cool and mature.  It was probably killer fatigue, but whingeing about another team not solving your problem for you is a really bad look- expecially for someone with her age and experience.   Still love her partner- who definitely is the miss congeniality of this season.

The non-indy winner is dead weight.  Why he sat in the truck when he has such a strong upper body seemed the height of laziness.  One would think the smaller person (if any) would sit in the truck.  That's probably why (it appeared) henry did more of the winching for his team.

The scenery, of course, was stunning.  If I were on TAR my one non-negotiable demand of my partner would be- we do the elephant task, no matter what, if one comes along.  Here they were lovely spectators. 

Edited February 10, 2018 by BarneySays

[ElectricBoogaloo]

4 hours ago, thegriswolds said:

Right? We've certainly seen other people on the race wear gear from their alma maters.  Is Evan not allowed to do the same just because hers is Ivy?  (I've gotten a lot more annoyed by all the UCLA gear shown over the years, but that's because it's our rival school)

Plus I'm guessing that the producers work to find a "hook" for all these teams, and in their case it's the Yale connection.  So I'm sure they're encouraged to play it up. 

I don’t find Evan’s Yale hat any more obnoxious than the bright yellow Ocean Rescue hats (Brittany/Lucas), the canouflage hats (Jessica/Cody), or the black/pink hats (Kristi/Jen) this season. The racers have limited room in their luggage so one hat with a brim per person is enough.

Evan and Henry graduated from college recently so wearing a hat from their alma mater is pretty common. Is that worse than alumni who graduated 10-20 years ago wearing shirts or hats with their school’s name on it? Over the years, I know we have seen racers who graduated more than a year ago wearing gear with their school’s name on it. Is school pride only considered acceptable, non-obnoxious, and not showing off if you went to a non-Ivy?

[BluishGreen]

21 hours ago, Mumbles said:

If you’re equating privilege with money, maybe, because those schools do offer financial aid. But going to an Ivy League school is probably the most privileged you can get in this country, as it relates to opportunities presented to the alums upon graduation. And boy is that uppity little pig proud of it, with her Yale hat. Her imperious tone and attitude toward the other teams are insufferable. I can barely look at that smirky mug of hers with its big snout when watching this show. 

Not for nothing, but (1) you don't know how this person paid for her education; (2) Just getting accepted to Yale , all by itself, is a huge accomplishment. Yale gets 20,000 applications from the smartest people in the world and accept about 8% of them; (3) So, that means she did a tremendous amount of hard work, both academic and otherwise,  to get admitted; (4) Once admitted, she and Henry competed with the rest of the brilliant young people there, and managed to distinguish herself in debate, which is as intellectually rigorous as it gets;  (5) I have yet to see the "imperious tone and attitude" you describe. ; and (6) even if she was proud of her school, why shouldn't she be?  I've watched this show since Episode 1 and plenty of racers were their college gear.  Only people who went to state colleges are do that?  Evan is treating TAR like a competition..... which it is. She is clearly an talented competitor or she wouldn't be where she is.  I like that she is in it to win it and the "hook" given to her and Henry --by the show and the other racers-- is that she and Henry are "Yale."  I say, Go Yale-ys Go! (PS. I did not go to Yale or any Ivy,)

[ElectricBoogaloo]

12 minutes ago, BluishGreen said:

I did not go to Yale or any Ivy

I didn’t either and despite my non-Ivy education, I think it’s silly that if you went to a prestigious or well known school you should hide it to avoid being labeled as uppity or stuck up. 

[green]

14 hours ago, amazingracefan said:

Pretty  much.  I never understand why people support teams who are boring but considered nice (partly because they hardly get shown).  A race full of them and nobody would watch.  And the edit clearly tries to make some into 'villains' anyway and it's just manipulating viewers, though some may like that even if they don't admit it.

Who do you think was boring?  If you are referring to the Firemen I didn't find them boring at all.  They were tenacious, funny and yes they were nice.  I NEVER find nice people boring.  I find them refreshing and interesting.  And I would LOVE to watch an entire season of TAR where every team was like that.  It is the entitled drama queen teams I can't stand because I find them and their stale soap opera crap boring as hell.

6 hours ago, lexington11 said:

For real. Money aside, the fact that she's constantly bringing up having gone to an Ivy League school as somehow being superior to the other racers definitely gives off that attitude of entitlement that she's had going on this entire race.

She doesn't bring it up except on voice overs.  Which is what she is required to do the same way the NFL Wives of Season 4 were forced to say "As wives of professional football players" or similar ilk at the beginning of every question they answered at the pit stop for the voice overs.  At the time of the broadcast there were a number of people upset at them for always mentioning they were "NFL wives" all the time but they had NO choice.  They were ordered to do that by production and cleared the record in post-Race interviews. 

Whatever "hook" production wants with a team for their storylines they force that team to compile if they don't voluntarily bring it up themselves.  In the case of Brittany I am sure they needed no force, heh.

3 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I don’t find Evan’s Yale hat any more obnoxious than the bright yellow Ocean Rescue hats (Brittany/Lucas), the canouflage hats (Jessica/Cody), or the black/pink hats (Kristi/Jen) this season. The racers have limited room in their luggage so one hat with a brim per person is enough.

Evan and Henry graduated from college recently so wearing a hat from their alma mater is pretty common. Is that worse than alumni who graduated 10-20 years ago wearing shirts or hats with their school’s name on it? Over the years, I know we have seen racers who graduated more than a year ago wearing gear with their school’s name on it. Is school pride only considered acceptable, non-obnoxious, and not showing off if you went to a non-Ivy?

TAR also tells racers basically how to dress themselves. The color coordination is pretty obviously coming from production the worst being the endless "pink" young female teams. 

And, again from the NFL Wives interviews, they said they were told they had to wear replicas of their husbands' Atlanta Falcons jerseys at the starting line.  They wanted to be themselves on the Race and so purposely "forgot" to pack them.  Production was not happy and forced them to have the jerseys Fed Ex'ed next day delivery so they would wear them at the starting line after all. 

So I am sure they told the debaters they had to bring some sort of Yale gear with them too since that was their "hook" and they had to dress appropriately.

Edited February 11, 2018 by green

[Fasio Verdant]

Wow.  I must be in a parallel universe, because I feel so many different things about this episode than others.

For starters, in what way was Jessica hypocritical about Evan?  Jessica may not have been totally truthful with Alex and Britney in Prague last week, but she still did help them when all was said and done.  She didn't have to.  But she did.  Considering she did offer help to others, it's not unreasonable to expect some help from someone else.

I am also in shock at everyone giving Evan credit for not helping Jessica and Kristi.  I would be able to agree with that if she gave them a firm no.  Despite everyone saying she did, she didn't.  She gave him a very half-hearted "we'll see."  In other words, a very soft maybe.  Like she was dangling the possibility of helping, but then snatched it away.  Frankly, I think that's what bothered them more than her not actually helping. She didn't just give them a firm no.  I think they would have respected that and understood that better if she had.

And Jessica is hypocritical, but not Evan? It's okay for ever not to help someone, yet she can expect someone to help her, like approaching Eric & Daniel at the mall?

Sorry.  Not buying that Jessica some monster while Evan is some saint.  Not a chance in hell.

And what is this about the other teams not really hating Evan?  In Saint-Tropez, Tim gave an interview in which he was giddy about the possibility of Phil having to go out and eliminate her when she was struggling with her boat.  Alex & Conor actually scoffed at them catching up to them in Arles.  And even after the race, Henry & Evan have stayed in touch with literally none of the other teams, as far as I've seen.  Plus, Trevor & Chris and Joey & Tim have both interviewed after the show and said that they really weren't liked that much on the race because they never talked to people in social periods.  Evan, in particular.  So yes, I think it's likely real that the other teams do dislike them.

[BarneySays]

20 minutes ago, Fasio Verdant said:

For starters, in what way was Jessica hypocritical about Evan?  Jessica may not have been totally truthful with Alex and Britney in Prague last week, but she still did help them when all was said and done.  She didn't have to.  But she did.  Considering she did offer help to others, it's not unreasonable to expect some help from someone else.

I am also in shock at everyone giving Evan credit for not helping Jessica and Kristi.  I would be able to agree with that if she gave them a firm no.  Despite everyone saying she did, she didn't.  She gave him a very half-hearted "we'll see."  In other words, a very soft maybe.  Like she was dangling the possibility of helping, but then snatched it away.

It might be perfectly reasonable to expect help from someone she helped during the race, but unreasonable to expect another competitor to save her from her inabilty to complete the task.  In the context of the race, it would be completely irrational to expect another team to come along and save you solely for your personal benefit.  Entitled and solipsistic is how I would describe that.  I don't think any contestant on the race has ever articulated the argument, I helped team B so team C (whom I've never helped) should feel obligated to help ME.  Personally, I dislike when teams help each other.  The globetrotters were carried through many tasks (not Kafka, of course) because other teams gave them answers.  I'd rather watch each team rise or fall on their merits.  There may be good strategy in helping a weak team in order to minimize competition, but that yields the beekman boys, the most undeserving winners in the history of the show IMO.

I don't think anyone is giving evan "credit" for not helping them, as that is standard practice in the race, especially when you think you might be in last place.  As evan and the twin entered the space, the two dummies said immediately "this is hard, do you want to work together?"  They clearly were not looking to work together, but to be saved.  evan responded, we'll see, we're going to try it first.  Which is what I would expect any racing team to say.  She didn't say it with an attitude.  They were ambushed before they even had a chance to see what they needed to do.  They would be morons to agree to work together before they knew whether they needed to work together with the dummies.  I don't agree that this was dangling anything and then snatching it away.  Quite rationally, they wanted to determine for themselves if it would be to their advantage to work with the dummies before agreeing.  I think you would have a point if she said yes, but let us try it once first and then ran off after completing it.  I think they did what any other person would have done in that situation.  I can't recall a situation in the history of the race where a team agreed to work with a struggling team before knowing what needed to be done.  Some of the TAR scholars however may recall an incident.

Recall that Brittany was also able to complete the task in one try.  So it wasn't as hard as they claimed.

37 minutes ago, Fasio Verdant said:

And Jessica is hypocritical, but not Evan? It's okay for ever not to help someone, yet she can expect someone to help her, like approaching Eric & Daniel at the mall?

I don't think asking for help is hypocritical.  It's complaining about someone not helping you, when you withheld information (albeit for a short time) when you agreed to work with others.  Also, they had just done the swap with the twins and had an extra task to complete, so it's not surprising the twins gave them some information (just as indy did to bb).  Also, you'll recall that evan worked with another team at the phones.  But that was for their mutual benefit.  There was no benefit to evan and the twin in rescuing the other two from their own inability to complete a task. 

[Whimsy]

Much of the discussion in this thread has moved from discussing the episode to discussing the teams in a more general way. This is a reminder to stay on topic.

Additionally, people are entitled to differing opinions about teams, etc. Feel free to state your opinion, but don’t debate your opinion. Even though Evan and Henry are debtors, this isn’t the place to hold a debate. You’re not going to change anyone’s minds if they don’t agree with you so let’s move on. 

[Falafel]

Following up on my inquiry about whether or not the song the racers had to sing had an unusual beat, which I think only I care about: A few music theory people in this thread think it is a mixed-metric song, which is harder to follow along than your usual pop song. The fact that there is no consensus answer tells me it's a complicated song. Again, you can listen to the song again here - it's been in my head for days now.

Edited February 11, 2018 by Falafel

[Netfoot]

1 hour ago, Fasio Verdant said:

Not buying that Jessica some monster while Evan is some saint.

I didn't see monstrous or saintly behaviour from either of them this episode.  Or any other.  I think Jessica is a bit stupid, and I don't particularly like Evan either, but not because either of them have appeared obnoxious to me in this episode or before.  

[eskimo]

9 hours ago, thegriswolds said:

Plus I'm guessing that the producers work to find a "hook" for all these teams, and in their case it's the Yale connection.  So I'm sure they're encouraged to play it up. 

That's what I'm thinking.  Some people still do it more than others, and sometimes if you're already annoyed by someone it really is amplified.  For me the first couple of episodes of the season it was the race car drivers.  I swear every TH had them reaching to relate a task with racing.  If they would have had a coffee bean sorting task, I imagine we'd have heard them say, 'As racers, we have to drink coffee to stay alert on the track, so I think we'll be able to use that to our advantage'.  Lol  But they already bugged me (I don't know why) so it was probably more pronounced for me personally. 

[jhlipton]

18 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I had to laugh because Jessica and Cody obviously chose the skiers because they thought they were a strong team and then those two teams ended up being the last ones checked in at the mat. Ahhhh, irony (the Alanis kind).

To be fair, Jen was a strong team-mate and helped Cody come in first.  So team BB was half-right!

[lexington11]

22 hours ago, Winston9-DT3 said:

Are you suggesting it's code for prostitute?  I think she said she gave up a summer of high-end travel for BB.  I think you do have to be pretty for that job but I don't think it's sexual.  

Considering that she did talk about having "dated" one of the guys from the Patriots at her job, and she did talk about charging extra stuff for herself on clients' credit cards, there's definitely some looks related stuff involved there.

On 2/10/2018 at 4:16 PM, dgpolo said:

I think that comes from the BB bio, I think her TAR bio says she is unemployed.

Hometown: Los Angeles
Current occupation: Unemployed

Three words to describe you: Loyal, honest, and outrageous.

Favorite hobbies: Yoga, hiking, and boxing.

What is the accomplishment you are most proud of?
Getting through seven weeks of hell on Big Brother.
 

I didn't read her TAR bio, so I didn't see that she was unemployed. And seriously? Surviving seven weeks on a reality show counts as her biggest accomplishment in life? I don't even know where to begin with that statement.

[Whimsy]

Remember, if you’re talking about a racer that is not related to the episode specifically, take it to their thread. 

[Blissfool]

On 2/9/2018 at 8:23 PM, Mumbles said:

If you’re equating privilege with money, maybe, because those schools do offer financial aid. But going to an Ivy League school is probably the most privileged you can get in this country, as it relates to opportunities presented to the alums upon graduation. And boy is that uppity little pig proud of it, with her Yale hat. Her imperious tone and attitude toward the other teams are insufferable. I can barely look at that smirky mug of hers with its big snout when watching this show. 

Ha! But how do you really feel about her?

Evan and Jessica don't like each other and, ironically, I think they have the same speech pattern. I frequently confuse the two when I hear their voices. 

 

On 2/10/2018 at 1:04 AM, elslattern said:

Conor, I'm sorry to say, seems kind of useless. Why wasn't he winching at all?

My assessment of him was established in the first few episodes when Alex said a couple of times, "He sleeps on my couch." I think Conor is a lazy stoner.

 

On 2/10/2018 at 4:34 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

in other words, when Jessica and Cody use the u-turn, it's a weapon that they're totally fine with using. When other people use the u-turn, it's baffling and must be because of personal issues. I'm pretty sure that at some point last week, Jessica and Cody also mentioned that u-turning the violinists wasn't personal so they think it's an impersonal strategy when they use the u-turn, but when someone else uses it, suddenly it's this petty bitchy thing that has nothing to do with wanting to win and everything to do with "she doesn't like you."

 

My opinion as to why.....

Cody/Jes U-turning the violinists was strategy:  both teams were neck-and-neck for last place (elimination).

Lucas/Brittany U-turning Cody/Jes was personal: L/B were in first place and had a substantial lead over C/J. L/B were not in danger of losing to C/J at this point. That AND Brittany has voiced her contempt of Jes several times.

[ProfCrash]

6 hours ago, Blissfool said:

My opinion as to why.....

Cody/Jes U-turning the violinists was strategy:  both teams were neck-and-neck for last place (elimination).

Lucas/Brittany U-turning Cody/Jes was personal: L/B were in first place and had a substantial lead over C/J. L/B were not in danger of losing to C/J at this point. That AND Brittany has voiced her contempt of Jes several times.

I partially agree with this. Jessica and Cody U-Turned the team that was right behind them which felt more urgent to them. And Brittney really doesn't like Jessica so there was a personal element to the U Turn. At the same time, there was a strategy in what teams were U-Turned. Big Brother and Yale have been doing well in the competition and are pretty well rounded. They are real threats. You could easily argue that the Skiers are more of a threat, they have won more individual legs then Yale or Big Brother. The Firefighters had not proven to be a threat so they were not a choice. Based on interviews on and off the show, I think that Yale is the outside team, it sounds like they chose to exclude themselves from the other teams at airports and the like. Big Brother is clearly feuding with Ocean Rescue. There is no indication that the Skiers have a problem with any other team. Ocean Rescue and Indy decided to work together to try and remove a team that they thought were a threat and chose the teams that are less well liked. I have no problem with that logic. Trying to remove a stronger team is valid game play, it simply didn't work because the firefighters were not a good team.

I have no problem with the singing task being were it was. The Firefighters had plenty of time to complete their one detour and the singing task before the U-Turned teams showed up. So Big Brother and Yale navigated to and completed two tasks, neither of which were easy, in the time that the Firefighters completed one. Yes, the firefighters sucked at the signing but it took them the same number of tries as Big Brother and Yale, so I don't think they were any worse then the other teams at the task. Were they failed was completing one task in a timely fashion.

Team Indy had the same problem. They barely beat Yale to the mat.

On top of that, Big Brother has clearly demonstrated that they are there to play the game. They used a U-Turn in a strategic fashion and Jessica did use information to her strategic benefit at the Kafka task. Both were legit game play but you cannot point to a single time that the Firefighters did something similar. So who would you want to keep in the race?

Any way you slice it, I would rather face the Firefighters and Indy in the finals then Big Brother or Yale. Big Brother and Yale are far more competent then Indy or the Firefighters.

The U-Turn was personal on Brittney's part but it was also strategic. It didn't work but it was a legitimate use of the U-Turn for Ocean Rescue. And Ocean Rescue was not burning any bridges, Jessica and Brittney already disliked each other. Indy's choice to U-Turn Yale was more interesting. It created some animosity, no matter how much both parties acknowledge that it was fair game play it is still going to feel personal to Yale. Indy is not likely to get much help from Yale in the future and that could hurt Indy.

[fishcakes]

Kristi has always seemed like a Debbie Downer to me, so I wasn't that surprised by her acting all put-upon this week. Jen is lovely, but Kristi seems like a trial to be around. Jessica is far worse, though, so I give Kristi points for the TH where she said, with Jessica sitting right next to her, something like, "we couldn't figure out how to balance my strengths with Jessica's weaknesses."

[eel2178]

7 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

On top of that, Big Brother has clearly demonstrated that they are there to play the game. 

Has Jessica ever done a road block where she didn't want another team to work with her?

[lexington11]

On 2/8/2018 at 3:29 PM, meep.meep said:

It's the judging part that I don't like.  Big Easy at the Kafka task, Lena with the hay bales - they had to find a finite answer.  The judged tasks are frequently very arbitrary - some people here were judged harshly on pronunciation, while others were passed through on that.  And Cody showed no more rhythm than either of the skiers, even in his successful try.

Lena's was a different situation, because that was (pardon the pun) a needle in a haystack task that came down to luck in finding the correct hay bale rather than requiring any specific skill set. And those tasks I hate, because it's all about who gets the luckiest in finding the clue rather than who can figure out the easiest way to solve the roadblock/detour. So for her case, there should've been a rule that said "after x amount of tries, you automatically get to run to the pit stop, or wherever the next location is."

[Jobiska]

There's a difference between "we [Evan and twin] have just finished the task and are ready to go; if we stop to help you, who are obviously stuck, we not only slow ourselves down a few minutes by doing so, but then you will leave at the same time as us, as opposed to being at least a little, and maybe a lot, behind" and "Hey, can you who are a lot further along on the task [Indy, Skiiers, Twins] give us a hint as to where to go?" The further-along people know exactly how much time, at minimum, it will still take the askers to complete the task.  They know they're still ahead.  It's not a straight up tit for tat exchange.  

And of course nobody has to help--it's just that racers, or viewers, are incorrect if they compare different types of help as being equal in effect.

[Netfoot]

4 minutes ago, Jobiska said:

And of course nobody has to help--it's just that racers, or viewers, are incorrect if they compare different types of help as being equal in effect.

Also, I see nothing wrong with asking for help on the one hand, and refusing to give help on the other.  This is a race, with a prize purse of a megabuck!  The idea is to gain any advantage you can, so as to increase your chances of winning that prize!  How ever you go about it, so long as you don't cheat or break the rules, is fine by me.

[green]

3 hours ago, lexington11 said:

Lena's was a different situation, because that was (pardon the pun) a needle in a haystack task that came down to luck in finding the correct hay bale rather than requiring any specific skill set. And those tasks I hate, because it's all about who gets the luckiest in finding the clue rather than who can figure out the easiest way to solve the roadblock/detour. So for her case, there should've been a rule that said "after x amount of tries, you automatically get to run to the pit stop, or wherever the next location is."

Maybe but it they had a rule like that then Lena vs The Haybales would not have gone down into TAR Lore and she would have long ago been forgotten.  But now she will always be part of TAR's legendary moments.  I'd rather have the lore myself.

[HawaiiTVGuy]

The hate for Evan (and byproduct Henry) smells a lot like the hate from last season for the blonde female/Asian guy team last year.  Just like last year, don't get it except for maybe they don't socialize with others like the others feel like they should.

Edited February 13, 2018 by HawaiiTVGuy

[mertensia]

6 hours ago, HawaiiTVGuy said:

The hate for Evan (and byproduct Henry) smells a lot like the hate from last season for the blonde female/Asian guy team last year.  Just like last year, don't get it except for maybe they don't socialize with others like the others feel like they should.

Ashton of the Ashton/Vanck team got the majority of the hate because of her mean-spirited belittling of Vanck while he was literally standing right next to her.  

[Special K]

My favorite part of this episode was watching the locals* crack up at the singing task.  I could watch that all day.

 

*including the band

Edited February 13, 2018 by Special K

[lexington11]

16 hours ago, HawaiiTVGuy said:

The hate for Evan (and byproduct Henry) smells a lot like the hate from last season for the blonde female/Asian guy team last year.  Just like last year, don't get it except for maybe they don't socialize with others like the others feel like they should.

That was two different scenarios. With Ashton/Vanck, the real hate seemed to be a general dislike for how Ashton constantly treated Vanck because she thought he was too nerdy for her and would rather have been paired with one of the athletic and more handsome guys. And with Evan/Henry, it does seem to be that most of the teams are threatened by how those two have consistently been a strong team.

[BarneySays]

1 hour ago, lexington11 said:

And with Evan/Henry, it does seem to be that most of the teams are threatened by how those two have consistently been a strong team.

That and- it just dawned on me- they are probably the only two racers left who have a college education.  I think that might be a first for TAR.  There may be a sense of otherness at play, too.  

[jhlipton]

On 2/12/2018 at 4:25 PM, green said:

Maybe but it they had a rule like that then Lena vs The Haybales would not have gone down into TAR Lore and she would have long ago been forgotten.  But now she will always be part of TAR's legendary moments.  I'd rather have the lore myself.

I am fairly certain that she would not.

[Special K]

18 hours ago, BarneySays said:

That and- it just dawned on me- they are probably the only two racers left who have a college education.  I think that might be a first for TAR.  There may be a sense of otherness at play, too.  

Interesting.  One of the firefighters mentioned something about how he got through college during the lecture task.  But of course they're not in the game anymore.

[chaifan]

19 hours ago, BarneySays said:

That and- it just dawned on me- they are probably the only two racers left who have a college education.  I think that might be a first for TAR.  There may be a sense of otherness at play, too.  

My guess is that Evan and Henry are used to being the nerdy kids not invited to sit at lunch with the cool kids, and are used to just hanging with themselves (or other nerds).  So, they could be purposely self-isolating themselves in this instance, or it just may be their norm.  Out of all the other teams, the FF's were on the dorky side (definitely not "cool kid" vibe), so it makes sense that that is the one team they sort of bonded with.

[Pallas]

4 hours ago, chaifan said:

My guess is that Evan and Henry are used to being the nerdy kids not invited to sit at lunch with the cool kids, and are used to just hanging with themselves (or other nerds).  So, they could be purposely self-isolating themselves in this instance, or it just may be their norm.  Out of all the other teams, the FF's were on the dorky side (definitely not "cool kid" vibe), so it makes sense that that is the one team they sort of bonded with.

Definitely. And I take with a grain of salt the defense that Evan and Henry isolated themselves from the other racers. They're each 22, and just now entering the amazing world of people not funneled through highly select education and experiences, all their young lives. They may not have learned how to easily or at least, facilely, find common ground with strangers. We don't know. But among the group, they are two and the others are many. Did anyone from the larger group -- it just takes one -- scootch-over at the lunch table?

[Netfoot]

6 hours ago, chaifan said:

So, they could be purposely self-isolating themselves in this instance, or it just may be their norm.

Or maybe the cool kids didn't want anything to do with Team Brainiac, but now want to paint them as antisocal to excuse their own behaviour.

[Lamb18]

I think it's a difference between people who are still in college (or just graduated) and people out in the workplace/supporting themselves. Henry and Evan are probably still dependents (tax purposes) while the others are not.

[lexington11]

7 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

I think it's a difference between people who are still in college (or just graduated) and people out in the workplace/supporting themselves. Henry and Evan are probably still dependents (tax purposes) while the others are not.

I'm questioning the supporting themselves part with Conor, because as far as I know, he's still living rent free with Alex, and didn't seem to be too willing to consider Phil's offer of using the 12K he won so far to save up and find a new place of his own.

[kdm07]

De-lurking because once again, TAR went to my home country! (I miss it a lot). Even though they mostly stuck to a lot of shots of the landscape and animals (which is fine because that's a big part of what makes Zimbabwe beautiful), I had a good chuckle once I realised the tasks they had to do in the main part of Harare or the CBD as they call it. That area is always full of people, to the point that it becomes almost difficult to drive through so I know that when they performed at Harare Gardens, by the time all the teams were there, they probably gathered quite the crowd. One of these days I'm going to need TAR to go to Kariba or the Eastern Highlands if they come back to Zimbabwe, there's a lot of neat challenges they could do there.

On 08/02/2018 at 7:37 AM, Brookside said:

How long do you think it took the producers to teach some of the team members how to say Zimbabwe correctly?

 

Longer than it took them to teach them how to say Harare...

On 09/02/2018 at 11:46 AM, etagloh said:

It's 4/4, but like a lot of sub-Saharan popular music, it's syncopated so the accents are on the "off" beats, which means that if you're attuned to songs where the phrasing lines up with the "on" beats, you're going to get out of sync very quickly. (There's also some triplet stuff there, I think.)

 

On 09/02/2018 at 6:25 PM, Shades of Scarlet said:

Yeah, no, it's straight 4/4 all the way, but as mentioned the beat is highly syncopated, and also, on the version you linked  (great find, BTW!!), the two different guitar parts are asymmetric and completely distinct from one another, which draws the listener's ear and confuses the beat.  But I think there was only one guitarist in the band and he wasn't that prominent in the mix, so the teams may not have had that excuse. 

 

On 09/02/2018 at 10:29 PM, etagloh said:

Yep. If you "1-and-2-and-3-and-4-and" the rhythm, then you need to recognise that the vocals go on the "ands" and adapt to that.

 

On 10/02/2018 at 9:49 PM, Falafel said:

Following up on my inquiry about whether or not the song the racers had to sing had an unusual beat, which I think only I care about: A few music theory people in this thread think it is a mixed-metric song, which is harder to follow along than your usual pop song. The fact that there is no consensus answer tells me it's a complicated song. Again, you can listen to the song again here - it's been in my head for days now.

 

Since I'm very familiar with the language and the music, if I was one of the instructors, I would've told them to focus on the cadence of the singer not so much the music/instruments. Usually the instruments, even the drums which usually give you the beat, are used as embellishments to what the singer is doing. Since the accents tend to drop on the off beats more than on the beat, listening to the lead singer the most would've been the easiest way to stay on track.

Edited February 18, 2018 by kdm07

[BarneySays]

On 2/14/2018 at 12:43 PM, chaifan said:

My guess is that Evan and Henry are used to being the nerdy kids not invited to sit at lunch with the cool kids, and are used to just hanging with themselves (or other nerds).  So, they could be purposely self-isolating themselves in this instance, or it just may be their norm.  Out of all the other teams, the FF's were on the dorky side (definitely not "cool kid" vibe), so it makes sense that that is the one team they sort of bonded with.

I doubt that.  Once you leave high school, you leave that kind of nonsense behind, especially in the path they have chosen- top tier school, moving into the professional class.  Of course, some people stay in that mentality, but I think it's more likely that they simply move in different circles than the rest of the teams and neither group relates easily to the other because of that difference.  The notion that they are somehow defensive around the rest of them seems laughable to me. 

[aradia22]

I don't dislike Cody/Jessica and I can't believe the show is playing up last episode's drama when she still GAVE THEM THE ANSWER. That said, it was a little weird when with the tent when she was content to be completely useless and then heap praise on him. I wasn't into it. 

Partner swap, huh? Definitely seems like something from another show. I do kind of like the idea of messing with teams who are inclined to work together and to mess with the dynamics now that everyone is feeling the pressure of there only being a few teams left. I figured it would only last one leg and was just to mess with their heads.

I thought this was a relatively interesting leg in Africa and I liked the focus on anti-poaching/conservation efforts. 

I was curious what the rules were for helping your teammate when you're technically on different teams.

I didn't think about a new team having two people who couldn't drive stick shift. Imagine if there had been a U-turn that leg.

I like how one of the firefighters was trying to say something gendered but Henry was like, nah, she's just better at that kind of thing. 

Brittany is insufferable.

I missed Well Strung this leg. Earnest words of encouragement!

I think the blond skier was such a strong personality that she seemed to really mess them up on the map. They almost had it aside from the last few clues and then she seemed to throw them off completely. 

I was thinking NEL but still, it was rough watching the top teams struggle like that. 

[aradia22]

First of all, they didn't HAVE to do anything with the double U-turn. That's a lie. But they made smart choices going for brawn and brains. 

Jen is too nice. It's a RAAACCE!

I don't love everyone helping each other. But what I realized is that there's been a lot less 'looking things up on phones/the internet' this season. And I'm super into that. 

I feel like there are actually a lot of complainers on the race this year. But they haven't really shown themselves until this leg (maybe it's that they're all showing that part of their personalities at once). And also after Brooke, it's hard to compare. 

Sigh... I wanted to see Well-Strung do the music challenge. Just because they play instruments it doesn't mean they sing well but still...

Ugh... I'm going to be so upset if the lifeguards win the race. 

I actually think Jen is a decent singer and Kristi isn't terrible. She just doesn't have rhythm. 

I honestly didn't see what was so bad about Cody and Jessica. He didn't seem to be getting any more frustrated that Kristi did at the singing challenge. Everyone is allowed a bit of KF.

Bye, firefighter twins! They were relatively likable but never the toughest racers so I don't feel that bad about them leaving. Like the NBA players, they were kind of on borrowed time.

Here's where the teams are for me right now. Brittany is without question the most annoying. Lucas is not great either but she just grates. Evan is sometimes too hard on Henry and a little fake but I like that as a team they're generally polite and positive. Cody and Jessica can be a little negative but I like that they're competitive. I also think they genuinely like each other and combined with them being aware of how they're coming across on camera, I don't think they ever get too bad. Jen seems like a sweetheart and Kristi suffers from being a little serious. I think she's also negative and she has kind of a hard edge and stubbornness but they race well in spite of that. Indy isn't as likable as I'd want but when the one guy isn't being negative, they're one of the most likable teams left. So basically, good and bad all around except the lifeguards who can leave at any time. Any time.

[Bouquet]

On 08/02/2018 at 3:01 PM, Lady Calypso said:

I WAS annoyed at Cody throwing open Indy Car's taxi's door to ask them where to go for the tire task, and then Indy Car TOLD THEM.

The audacity of Cody ripping open the van door and bullying intel out of Indy was breathtaking. The meek may inherit, but the audacity to ask is one key to success on this Earth. With no more U-Turns, and few teams left, it wasn't in Indy's interest. Despite Cody's thanks, I don't think they're going to get anything in return.

And I don't think "don’t debate your opinion. You’re not going to change anyone’s minds if they don’t agree with you" is a good rule for this forum. Debate changes my mind all the time.