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Athena

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Mittengirl
Mittengirl

I cannot believe that there are some journalists who are suggesting that US Figure Skating needs to be more like US Gymnastics in the training of young athletes.  The very idea is so - I don’t even kn

herbz
herbz

The Nassar situation isn't another discussion- Karolyi's methods and reign of intimidation directly created a world in which young girls pushed through injuries which sometimes permanently crippled th

Growsonwalls
Growsonwalls

Wow I feel bad for both girls.  There's Med, crying because at the ripe old age of 18 she's gotten dumped for the New Shiny Thing, and then there's New Shiny Thing, all of a sudden looking so childlik

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blackwing

blackwing

13 minutes ago, Dots And Stripes said:

 

I'm not saying NBC should avoid placing any pressure on athletes, but they should be a little more self aware. There are some athletes they hype when their event comes up. Nathan gets hyped constantly. They made him one of the faces of the games. If they want to talk about Nathan under pressure, fine, but it would be nice if their analysts realized that NBC is a big part of that pressure. 

I don't really agree... every top athlete in every sport feels pressure from their country's media, olympic committee and fans.  Look at Choi Min Jeong, heavy favourite in short track women's 1000, tearfully apologizing to the people of South Korea for letting them down.  I don't see why NBC is to blame.  They are just reporting about athletes because the public wants to know more.  

Some athletes rise to the challenge and respond well to pressure.  Nathan Chen does not.

If NBC didn't put such media scrutiny on him, no doubt everyone here would be clamoring about how they ignored him.  And really, I haven't heard that much from NBC about Chen    The only male skater that is seemingly in this Olympics according to NBC is Adam Rippon.  If anything, the overexposure of Rippon and the constant shoving of him in everyone's faces should have taken pressure and attention off Chen. 

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displayname

displayname

(edited)
3 minutes ago, Jeddah said:

I’d love for it to be Hanyu, Uno, and Jin. 

Me too! I would be lying if I said "any permutation", because Shoma's technique is just not good, but really as long as Hanyu wins, or Jin skates with the best PCS he ever has and wins, I'd be fine with the other two falling in any order. Shoma would be a good winner, but the other two always had a strong technical base fostered.

Edited by fan94
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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

(edited)

Not sure why everyone is blaming NBC for how Nathan performed. In some ways he got lucky that Adam has received all the attention the last couple weeks. Athletes from all different countries and past Olympics have had just as much pressure. Some athletes can handle and some can't. Hopefully this doesn't ruin his career. I'm happy Adam did well. I was worried he would be the one who bombed due to all the media attention he has received.

Edited by choclatechip45
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specialj67

specialj67

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I recall Evan Lysacek being in a similar, if less numerically dire, situation in the 2006 Olympics. He bombed—for him—and placed 10th in the short, had the skate of his life in the long, and finished in 4th (thanks in part to the mistakes of many ahead of him). And then he went on to win it 2010. There are worse paths to an OGM that Nathan could emulate.

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stealinghome

stealinghome

42 minutes ago, COESpiral said:

Well Nathan...look at it this way, you're following in the footsteps of pretty much every singles skater from the US since 2006.  Folding under the pressure of being a favorite.  What a shame.

Seriously. If they don’t already have one, the USFSA needs to get a sports psychologist on their payroll stat. If they already have one, they need to fire that person and hire like five new people.

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Snow Apple

Snow Apple

6 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

Not sure why everyone is blaming NBC for how Nathan performed. In some ways he got lucky that Adam has received all the attention the last couple weeks. Athletes from all different countries and past Olympics have had just as much pressure. Some athletes can handle and some can't. Hopefully this doesn't ruin his career. I'm happy Adam did well. I was worried he would be the one who bombed due to all the media attention he has received.

Even being the media's new darling, Adam still isn't expected to be on the podium so less pressure. He can have the fun that Nathan can't. IMHO.

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BitterApple

BitterApple

I feel horribly for Nathan, but performing under pressure is pretty much what the Olympics is all about. He's young and hopefully he takes this as a learning experience but he seems wound so tight. It's like he's incapable of relaxing and just letting himself go. Hopefully he can skate respectably tomorrow and go home with his head held high.

Regarding the others, I absolutely loved, loved, loved Javier's Charlie Chaplin routine. It had me hooked right from the start and I thought the choreography and music suited him perfectly. 

Just now, Snow Apple said:

Even being the media's new darling, Adam still isn't expected to be on the podium so less pressure. He can have the fun that Nathan can't. IMHO.

I agree, not to mention Adam's programs don't come anywhere close in terms of degree of difficulty.

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displayname

displayname

(edited)
26 minutes ago, blackwing said:

If NBC didn't put such media scrutiny on him, no doubt everyone here would be clamoring about how they ignored him.

Not in Figure Skating.

 

Everyone, or at least those who are even moderate fans, knows the kind of pressure that Yuna was under to make her say "If I falter, my country might turn their backs on me". We all know the kind of backlash Mao got after Sochi.

 

Everyone was aware how much potential Nathan had. But ever since National 2017 he has been hyped up as "America's hope". He's been interviewed about his dream with the child clip being shown repeatedly. He's been called Quad King since his senior debut. He has had injuries that made him underperform, and then when he finally recovered the media started hyping him up. Ads, interviews. Interviews, and ads.

FS stars practically are followed around like they're rock stars. Look at Yuzuru's and Boyang's and Shoma's fanbase today. They're young attractive men. The American media banked on that with Nathan, too.

 

No one has the mental fortitude of Yuna or Yuzuru. Add Evgenia, Boyang, and Shoma to that, too, though I think their mental fortitude is of a different kind. Nathan is like any other athlete, except with more prodigious talent. He has always been shown to be shy, but has been dragged into a constant spotlight by the media. They should recognize the body language and the personalities of athletes they hype up more, but that's very clearly asking for too much.

Edited by fan94
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specialj67

specialj67

4 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

Not sure why everyone is blaming NBC for how Nathan performed. In some ways he got lucky that Adam has received all the attention the last couple weeks. Athletes from all different countries and past Olympics have had just as much pressure. Some athletes can handle and some can't. Hopefully this doesn't ruin his career. I'm happy Adam did well. I was worried he would be the one who bombed due to all the media attention he has received.

Adam hasn’t been getting the kind of gold medal hype Nathan has. Even though Adam has worked incredibly hard to get where he is and is one of the most experienced competitors in this field of men, the tone of the media stories about him is decidedly not about his medal prospects here.

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Dots And Stripes

Dots And Stripes

2 minutes ago, fan94 said:

Everyone was aware how much potential Nathan had. But ever since National 2017 he has been hyped up as "America's hope". He's been interviewed about his dream with the child clip being shown repeatedly. He's been called Quad King since his senior debut. He has had injuries that made him underperform, and then when he finally recovered the media started hyping him up. Ads, interviews. Interviews, and ads.

 

I'm wondering how the international press has been treating Nathan. I remember after nationals, a lot of the big figure skating fans on this board were saying it was too soon to call Nathan the Olympic favorite, even though that became a popular refrain on NBC. My sense is that Nathan has the talent, but his ability to perform consistently was still a question mark for people who have watched him closely for a while. 

Growsonwalls

Growsonwalls

(edited)

I agree with those who say that I don't think we can blame the NBC hype machine for Nathan's meltdown. Figure skating in the U.S. is not anywhere near the popularity that it had during the 1990's. The pressure that Michelle Kwan, Tara Lipinski etc had to face was truly insane. If anything I don't really think the average figure skating fan really knew that much about Nathan Chen. It's not even close to the Gracie Gold hype machine in Sochi.

Nathan's looked tight and just not comfortable since the team competition, and I wonder if there's some kind of injury that he's not talking about. Nathan's also not one of those skaters who can land a jump even when it's all wonky in the air. He's not an Evgeny Plushenko who could rescue a quad from the jaws of death. But that's not really his fault.

Whatever Nathan's been doing hasn't been working, and whether that's an injury, or something else is yet to be determined. But I don't think the hype for him was that extreme.

Edited by Growsonwalls
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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

(edited)
28 minutes ago, Snow Apple said:

Even being the media's new darling, Adam still isn't expected to be on the podium so less pressure. He can have the fun that Nathan can't. IMHO.

Adam might not have the same pressure, but he's been actively giving quotes in articles and has had attention on him since he has arrived in the Olympics. Most of Nathan's stuff was done before he left for the games. I thought it was a huge red flag after the short in the team event when Nathan said competing in the morning threw him off.

Edited by choclatechip45
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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

15 minutes ago, Growsonwalls said:

I agree with those who say that I don't think we can blame the NBC hype machine for Nathan's meltdown. Figure skating in the U.S. is not anywhere near the popularity that it had during the 1990's. The pressure that Michelle Kwan, Tara Lipinski etc was truly insane. If anything I don't really think the average figure skater really knew that much about Nathan Chen. It's not even close to the Gracie Gold hype machine in Sochi.

Nathan's looked tight and just not comfortable since the team competition, and I wonder if there's some kind of injury that he's not talking about. Nathan's also not one of those skaters who can land a jump even when it's all wonky in the air. He's not an Evgeny Plushenko who could rescue a quad from the jaws of death. But that's not really his fault.

Whatever Nathan's been doing hasn't been working, and whether that's an injury, or something else is yet to be determined. But I don't think the hype for him was that extreme.

Exactly the pressure Michelle received was insane! Plus she was competing at home in 2002.

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displayname

displayname

5 minutes ago, Dots And Stripes said:

I'm wondering how the international press has been treating Nathan. I remember after nationals, a lot of the big figure skating fans on this board were saying it was too soon to call Nathan the Olympic favorite, even though that became a popular refrain on NBC. My sense is that Nathan has the talent, but his ability to perform consistently was still a question mark for people who have watched him closely for a while. 

I think both Japanese and Korean media cottoned on, and started hyping up a showdown between him and Yuzu.

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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

16 minutes ago, Cherpumple said:

Are athletes allowed to say "no interviews", or are they contractually obligated to give them, by either their national federation or IOC? I know they can't help the constant running of tv commercials and media commentary, but I would hope that they have some control over how many times they have to answer dumb questions.

Not sure. I remember after the first night during the 2016 gymnastic trials there was a whole controversy when John Orozco refused to do interviews because he didn't want questions about his mother who recently died.

Cherpumple

Cherpumple

5 minutes ago, Dots And Stripes said:

I'm wondering how the international press has been treating Nathan.

Probably very differently, with much less hype. I spent the last two Olympic cycles in the UK, and their press was much more interested in their own athletes, favorites or not. I loved watching the swimming in particular and seeing the interviewers get so excited about the few Team GB athletes who did well, and practically ignore Michael Phelps. They obviously had respect for his talent and accomplishments, but it wasn't anywhere close to the tongue bath given to him by NBC.

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Dots And Stripes

Dots And Stripes

8 minutes ago, Cherpumple said:

Are athletes allowed to say "no interviews", or are they contractually obligated to give them, by either their national federation or IOC? I know they can't help the constant running of tv commercials and media commentary, but I would hope that they have some control over how many times they have to answer dumb questions.

There are some interviews they are obligated to do. NBC mentioned Nathan left to train someone a few hours away but they knew he would be back for a mandatory press conference. There was another one that was optional and he skipped it.

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basiltherat

basiltherat

IT'S RAINING POOH, HALLELUJAH, it's raining Pooh . . . and that's a good thing!

  If Yuzu got the second highest short program score ever, who got the first?

I'm happy with the podium the way it is.  Also, kudos to Brian Orser -- I've been Team Orser since back in the Stone Age.

Russian Bellhop borrowed his costume from Alexei Urmanov.

Sorry, Nathan, go commiserate with Gracie Gold, another victim of Media Hype.  

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BitterApple

BitterApple

(edited)

Probably not the most P.C. thing to say, but I think most of the attention Rippon has received has been the result of his constant self-promotion. He's getting attention because he's seeking it, not because there were any great expectations for him to do big things skating-wise. He still had to go out there and nail his jumps, so I don't mean to diminish those accomplishments, but I feel like it's an entirely different ball of wax than what Nathan has dealt with. 

Edited by BitterApple
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doodlebug

doodlebug

(edited)

I believe there are press conference type events surrounding each competition that all the athletes are expected to make themselves available for; but, most other press activities are optional.  However, figure skating is darned expensive, all of these athletes have hundreds of thousands invested in their skating and there is no bigger showcase than the Olympics.  Therefore, many of them are encouraged by their team (parents, agents, coaches, etc) to make themselves available for interviews and such in order to take advantage of the free PR to help them obtain commercial opportunities that can help support them going forward.  That's part of the reason we're being treated to the Adam Rippon Show night after night.  He's 28; this is his first, last and only Olympics.  He is not going to be able to keep on competing after this, so he needs to line up some gigs to keep him from having to steal apples from the gym. Hence, he's mugging for the cameras every chance he gets. The US figure skating association also 'encourages' skaters to make themselves available  for interviews from the media and undoubtedly Chen was the most requested American skater this cycle.  He wouldn't want to appear ungrateful for USFSA's support and he wants to promote skating and himself; it would be hard to turn that down.

Edited by doodlebug
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Cherpumple

Cherpumple

Thanks for the info about the interview protocol. One of the many reasons why I couldn't cut it as an elite athlete is that I don't have the mentality to deal with the constant cameras and microphones in my face while I'm trying to focus on my sport. (The closeness of the cameras in the sidelines of gymnastics competitions seems particularly invasive to me.) I'm sure I would eventually either blow past the interviewers and be called "rude" or yell at a cameraman to back off.

I like Hanyu, but I gotta say that he is one of the most unassuming Olympic champions I've ever seen. Any time he's off the ice he just looks like a dorky little kid to me, who would get blown away in a strong gust of wind. Fantastic on the ice, but I wouldn't even notice him off the ice.

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AuntieDiane6

AuntieDiane6

(edited)
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I think both Japanese and Korean media cottoned on, and started hyping up a showdown between him and Yuzu.

Sorta doubt that as Shoma Una is also Japanese and has been a pretty consistent performer and is a world medalist. 

 

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Sorry, Nathan, go commiserate with Gracie Gold, another victim of Media Hype.  

No...Gracie Gold has something else in common with Nathan--a coach who can't get his skaters to Olympic gold.  Look at Brian Orser--same talented skaters, only his can deal with the pressure.  Let's see... Yuna Kim, Uzuru, Fernandez ... Mao wanted to work with Brian, but couldn't so she went to Rafael instead.  Nathan needs a new coach--he could go to Toronto.  So could Gracie if she comes back.

I know there are other connotations now, but US women's gymnastics couldn't produce winners until the Karolyis came to town.  When other coaches complained about him hogging the spotlight, his response was, "Gentlemen, produce!"   

Look at college football and Nick Saban at Alabama.  Other teams have had the talent (I'm looking at you, Notre Dame) but the coach makes the difference.

Quote

I think every athlete shouldhave a sports psychologist work with them. He is amazing but I don't know what's wrong. The media hyped him up. He did good in practice.

See:  Coach, New.

Edited by AuntieDiane6
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