SuperNormal: Public Appearances, Tweets, Media And Other Social Media Of The SPN Cast

[General Days]

22 minutes ago, TheGreenKnight said:

I'll be the rare voice of dissent on that point then, because I don't think there was anything wrong with what Padalecki said. He doesn't owe it to the Ackles to be professional any more than they owed it to him to involve him in a Supernatural-related project, apparently. And how the other actors choose to act is their business, but that's also an apples and oranges comparison. Sam and Dean were always the main leads across all fifteen seasons, not Castiel and Bobby.

Just a reminder. These tweets stood all night without further comment. It was only the next day after a night full of hate, that Jared reminded people not to send hate or threats. The older tweet of these two is on the bottom.

 

I get the first one (i.e. "Dude. Happy for you..." etc.), but it would have been better to have that convo privately (even for Jared himself).

That someone like Jared, who understands social media fandom well now, put "I'm gutted" out there, and let the reaction ferment all night, just doesn't sit well with me.

This tweet to Robbie Thompson was up for maybe an hour (maybe less, I didn't take note) before he deleted it. (I had to lower the quality of the image, because the board said the file was too big.

 

 

[Aeryn13]

31 minutes ago, TheGreenKnight said:

I'll be the rare voice of dissent on that point then, because I don't think there was anything wrong with what Padalecki said. He doesn't owe it to the Ackles to be professional any more than they owed it to him to involve him in a Supernatural-related project, apparently. And how the other actors choose to act is their business, but that's also an apples and oranges comparison. Sam and Dean were always the main leads across all fifteen seasons, not Castiel and Bobby.

Actors in one show, no matter how long it went on for are never "owed" to be involved in any way in a related project. Unless they hold the creative legal rights, their previous acting job entitles them to absolutely nothing. Jared has been in the buisness for 20 years, he can't not know this super-simple fact. 

[TheGreenKnight]

2 hours ago, General Days said:

Just a reminder. These tweets stood all night without further comment. It was only the next day after a night full of hate, that Jared reminded people not to send hate or threats. The older tweet of these two is on the bottom.

 

I get the first one (i.e. "Dude. Happy for you..." etc.), but it would have been better to have that convo privately (even for Jared himself).

That someone like Jared, who understands social media fandom well now, put "I'm gutted" out there, and let the reaction ferment all night, just doesn't sit well with me.

This tweet to Robbie Thompson was up for maybe an hour (maybe less, I didn't take note) before he deleted it. (I had to lower the quality of the image, because the board said the file was too big.

 

 

Yes, I know what the tweets said... (How would someone comment on them without reading them? They are the whole discussion for seven pages now.) No, I don't think anything he said was wrong. It's his prerogative to respond to the news genuinely if he chooses, whether or not the fandom likes reading it; he's not contractually obligated to post blase positive feelings about a development relating to Supernatural that excludes him.

[TheGreenKnight]

19 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

Actors in one show, no matter how long it went on for are never "owed" to be involved in any way in a related project. Unless they hold the creative legal rights, their previous acting job entitles them to absolutely nothing. Jared has been in the buisness for 20 years, he can't not know this super-simple fact. 

I never said they did? I actually said the opposite. But Jensen can take the consequences with the control, with Padalecki and the fandom giving him a thrashing. I'd be surprised if this project makes it to the air, or be successful if it does, at this rate with the view of unfairness much of the fandom and media have towards the show now. I think the show probably had a slim chance anyway, much less after dividing the fandom towards its existence.

Edited June 28, 2021 by TheGreenKnight

[Aeryn13]

6 minutes ago, TheGreenKnight said:

I never said they did? But Jensen can take the consequences with the control, with Padalecki and the fandom giving him a thrashing. I'd be surprised if this project makes it to the air, or be successful if it does, at this rate with the view of unfairness much of the fandom and media have towards the show now. I think the show probably had a slim chance anyway, much less after dividing the fandom towards its existence.

But you more or less said Jared having no obligation to be professional because Jensen apparently fell down on HIS obligation of not including Jared. If he had no such obligation, then what is the excuse for Jared`s public tantrum?

Of course he victimized himself in his favour again, he is very good at that. Maybe some day he will have to take the consequence and a good trashing for that. It`s certainly sorely needed for him to maybe grow up. Now I already know if it ever did happen, we couldn`t expect a classy reaction. 

Edited June 27, 2021 by Aeryn13

[ahrtee]

1 hour ago, TheGreenKnight said:

he's not contractually obligated to post blase positive feelings about a development relating to Supernatural that excludes him.

He's not "contractually obligated" to post *any* feelings.  Just like anyone involved in future SPN programs is not contractually obligated (or obligated in any way) to contact him in advance.  This is not "his" SPN.  

TBH, I would have accepted his original tweet: that he "wished" he'd heard about it some way other than Twitter to be a perfectly legitimate (and reasonable) way of expressing his surprise (with a little bit of dismay.)  But to go on to say he was "gutted" and his IMO unforgiveable tweet to Robbie went way too far, was way over the top and seemed to be  specifically intended to provoke a backlash among his fans.  It turned a "hey, I didn't know about that" to a "poor poor pitiful me, nobody considers me, nobody loves me,"  which leads to his fans rushing to prove their love by supporting him and attacking those who "hurt" him.  

If the idea was to replace him with a different Sam, I could see him (and his fans) being upset.  But any advance notification from anyone starting an entirely different show is a courtesy, not a right, and shouldn't even be an issue until there is at least one script written, much less a contract signed.  

Edited June 27, 2021 by ahrtee
Grammar. It's important.

[FlickChick]

27 minutes ago, TheGreenKnight said:

I never said they did? But Jensen can take the consequences with the control, with Padalecki and the fandom giving him a thrashing. I'd be surprised if this project makes it to the air, or be successful if it does, at this rate with the view of unfairness much of the fandom and media have towards the show now. I think the show probably had a slim chance anyway, much less after dividing the fandom towards its existence.

Regarding bolded: The only person who "divided the fandom" was the one who threw a tantrum on a public forum for all to see simply because he has no control over his anger and emotions. He apparently also doesn't concern himself with how his "friend who's like a brother" is, as you say, "getting thrashed". If this behavior if perfectly fine with you, then I hope you don't have any "friends" who also think the same and treat you accordingly.

[gonzosgirrl]

Jared might not have had a professional obligation but he sure as fuck had a moral obligation not to throw is friend and his new project under a bus. So maybe he reacted viscerally and 'in the moment', but he has taken zero steps to try an undo some of the damage he was party to. The very fact he had to post his weak-sauce plea not to threaten his friends with harm speaks to a disturbed fanbase. That he first thanked them for all the love in the same tweet is beyond the pale. Please, never let me have a friend like Jared.

Edited June 27, 2021 by gonzosgirrl

[Aeryn13]

6 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Jared might not have had a professional obligation but he sure as fuck had a moral obligation not to throw is friend and his new project under a bus. So maybe he reacted viscerally and 'in the moment', but he has taken zero steps to try an undo some of the damage he was party to. The very fact he had to post his weak-sauce plea not to threaten his friends with harm speaks to a disturbed fanbase. That he first thanked them for all the love in the same tweet is beyond the pale. Please, never let me have a friend like Jared.

Noone has friends like that because that is not a friend. 

[Myrelle]

55 minutes ago, FlickChick said:

Regarding bolded: The only person who "divided the fandom" was the one who threw a tantrum on a public forum for all to see simply because he has no control over his anger and emotions. He apparently also doesn't concern himself with how his "friend who's like a brother" is, as you say, "getting thrashed". If this behavior if perfectly fine with you, then I hope you don't have any "friends" who also think the same and treat you accordingly.

The post you've referenced is pretty much typical of what I've  been seeing from the JP fandom on Twitter; when they're not talking about going into The Boys fandom to warn Jensen's new castmates about what they can expect from him, that is.

And I have a lot of Sam/JP fans blocked,  but still this stuff is leaking through.

So yeah, not seeing much giving Jensen the benefit of the doubt in any of those. 

As for the prequel, if I were Jensen I'd now be wondering if I even wanted to share a network with JP,  nevermind another work environment.

So we'll see what happens with that. 

Personally, I think if he wants to proceed, it will go to Pilot, at least, but if he doesn't want to proceed, or wants to wait a bit, he should positively retain the rights that he now has, just to ensure that those rights won't go to someone else.

And hell, maybe Warner Bros. will let him put something out on HBO Max instead of the smaller pond of the CW.

Again, personally speaking, I'd like that so much better.

Edited June 27, 2021 by Myrelle

[Casseiopeia]

I don't care that this doesn't belong here....how about a happy moment.

 

 

[Myrelle]

3 hours ago, Casseiopeia said:

Who were all killed off when John was a child and John apparently knew nothing about them. I really think some memory wiping is going to be part of the story and I don't mean for the fans.

I really want this to be a success.  I'm a huge fan of Robbie Thompson. I think he should have been the show runner for SPN instead of Dabb.  For one he truly cares about the fans unlike Dabb and he truly loves the original story (before he wrote Slash Fiction he watched every single episode)....unlike Dabb.  I really am curious to see how he makes this all work.

Wasn't the Cuthbert Sinclair episode where he was hiding in the invisible fortress with the MOC blade made after we found out that the MOLs had all supposedly been wiped out?

If so, they already found a way around that "canon", didn't they?

A good writer can do anything, at that's tame compared the LOL! canon that we've been exposed to over the course of this series. 

And Jensen has already said that trying to stay/keep with show canon has been "the fun part"-so they are very aware. 

 

9 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

I don't care that this doesn't belong here....how about a happy moment.

 

 

Just stay out of the comments if you want to keep that happy feeling.

[Casseiopeia]

3 minutes ago, Myrelle said:

Just stay out of the comments if you want to keep that happy feeling.

No I still want to participate. I would rather talk about the spinoff so any time the conversation veer's in that direction I will pounce.

[BabySpinach]

Do you owe it to the person behind you to hold the door rather than let it slam in their face? No, but you should still do it. The world can't run on everyone submitting to their worst, most selfish impulses by default unless they "owe" it to someone to be nice. That's how you get obnoxiously entitled Karens running around.

On one side, Jared got his feelings hurt. On the other, practically everyone with even a tangential connection to the project got attacks and death threats and the funding for the project itself may have even been impacted. The latter was not a proportionate or reasonable consequence for the former. 

[Aeryn13]

14 minutes ago, BabySpinach said:

Do you owe it to the person behind you to hold the door rather than let it slam in their face? No, but you should still do it. The world can't run on everyone submitting to their worst, most selfish impulses by default unless they "owe" it to someone to be nice. That's how you get obnoxiously entitled Karens running around.

On one side, Jared got his feelings hurt. On the other, practically everyone with even a tangential connection to the project got attacks and death threats and the funding for the project itself may have even been impacted. The latter was not a proportionate or reasonable consequence for the former. 

But you see, they brought it on themselves. It's a version of "well, if she wouldn't have worn that skimpy dress...."

[ahrtee]

Maybe there's just been too much character bleed over the years, but it seems to me that Jared and Jensen are playing Sam and Dean IRL.   Jared is being Sam:  supremely self-involved and oblivious to his brother's feelings, only engaged when it's something that affects him.  And Jensen is Dean:  way too willing to forgive everything Sam/Jared does (and accept his complaints and rebukes) while always supporting even his stupidest moves.  And, of course, if he should happen to do something Sam/Jared perceives is against him, his brother is perfectly willing to cut him off/throw him under the bus, while Jensen just apologizes.  

Of course, Dean would have been more likely to deck Dabb years ago, but even he might be willing to listen to Jensen and instead play a long game for revenge.  

[Lastcall]

4 hours ago, TheGreenKnight said:

I never said they did? But Jensen can take the consequences with the control, with Padalecki and the fandom giving him a thrashing. I'd be surprised if this project makes it to the air, or be successful if it does, at this rate with the view of unfairness much of the fandom and media have towards the show now. I think the show probably had a slim chance anyway, much less after dividing the fandom towards its existence.

     I actually think this has a good chance of going to series in some form. I don't think it will be as it is described now in any shape or form but I think Jensen is going to get his show one way or the other. Before the drama it checked off a lot of boxes that gave it advantages the other spin-off attempts didn't. For what ever reason, the final season of Supernatural was their number one show. The are guaranteed a strong premier from the curiosity alone. This would have an original star in every episode even if its a voice over. They could get some mileage putting it on a night with Walker which could benefit both shows. The CW wants it to continue and the WB would love it if they could catch lighting again and repeat the show's success.  Jensen has a sterling reputation and very good relationships with the higher ups. And there is huge buzz over Soldier Boy and The Long Halloween. 

     On the downside, this has gotten off to a horrible start. Picking two of least popular characters in SPN right now is going to be a hard sell. Even though Jensen tweeted they have Canon covered, its going to have a long way to go to explain that. The CW and WB may not like the pitch and want it changed as drastically as the original show. Finally, the wild card, no one knows what Jared is going to do in the future. He says he's good now but there is a pattern that doesn't seem to ever go away. 

    So, huge up hill battle but I think Jensen is up to fighting it. If anyone can pull this off, I think it will be him.

[Myrelle]

3 hours ago, Casseiopeia said:

No I still want to participate. I would rather talk about the spinoff so any time the conversation veer's in that direction I will pounce.

I meant the comments under the tweets that you posted.

Sorry if I wasn't clear enough on that.

[7kstar]

14 minutes ago, Lastcall said:

So, huge up hill battle but I think Jensen is up to fighting it. If anyone can pull this off, I think it will be him.

I believe that Jensen knows who Jared is.  I wouldn't be surprised if he has pulled back on spending time with Jared, hence Jared being in the dark.

Jensen has weathered much worse when he was on Dark Angel.  Having a pilot doesn't mean it gets picked up.  So Jensen is fully aware of the business side as he has been in shows that ended after a few eps. 

He won't sling mud, which is why he looks better to me personally.  Personally I'm glad I'm off twitter and since I'm dealing with the death of my dad, I find this stuff to be so petty.  In the long run, I think this will backfire on Jared.  He's the one looking unprofessional.

Unless Jared was putting money into this project, he has nothing to do with it.  I find his tantrum on twitter to be childish and not worth backing. 

This will blow over.   I will keep a lookout for the spinoff.

[Hana Chan]

13 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

Actors in one show, no matter how long it went on for are never "owed" to be involved in any way in a related project. Unless they hold the creative legal rights, their previous acting job entitles them to absolutely nothing. Jared has been in the buisness for 20 years, he can't not know this super-simple fact. 

We don't know 99.9% of what was going on. For all we know, Jared and Jensen had a clear agreement between them that if they were to work on an SPN project, it would be as a team and Jensen went back on his word. But we don't know. All we know is Jared's tweet that he was supportive but hurt and feels a certain amount of betrayal that he 1) is not involved in the new project (at least at this point) and 2) was not aware that the project was moving forward (to the point where an official announcement was made).

We can paint Jared as problematic because he brought this into social media, but just because Jensen kept things to himself negate the possibility that he may be problematic too. Again, as fans we don't know what was happening behind the scenes. The fact that Kripke said that he thought that Jared was aware and wasn't participating because he was busy with his own series seems IMO to think that  there were at least some things left unsaid. It is possible that Jensen went back on an agreement between them? Sure. It is possible that Jared thought that he and Jensen had an agreement that really wasn't there? Equally possible.

We're all jumping to conclusions about who is to blame and making judgements on how things were handled when we only know what was going on through what was said at convention panels and a few tweets. The point is that we just don't know and I think that it's unfair to judge either Jared or Jensen over this little mess. Yes, Jared could (and should) have handled things better. And Jensen could (and should) have given Jared a clear heads up about the project before the announcement was made. I'm willing to give both of them the benefit of the doubt.

Again, as I and others said previously, just because you don't have to do something doesn't mean that it's not a good idea to do something. If only to avoid this kind of bad spillover. I will say this, though. If the shoe was on the other foot and Jared was launching an SPN series without Jensen, even if Jensen wouldn't say something on social media, his fans would be out with pitchforks and torches for Jared over his audacity for thinking that he owns SPN's legacy and shutting out Jensen. This fandom is one of the most toxic I've been involved in and as someone who likes both Jared and Jensen as actors, liked both Sam and Dean as characters (even if Jared/Sam were my favorites), it's hard to stay involved because the extreme fans of both actors can be so hard to stomach at times.

Edited June 28, 2021 by Hana Chan

[gonzosgirrl]

1 hour ago, Hana Chan said:

If the shoe was on the other foot and Jared was launching an SPN series without Jensen, even if Jensen wouldn't say something on social media, his fans would be out with pitchforks and torches for Jared over his audacity for thinking that he owns SPN's legacy and shutting out Jensen.

This is the crux of things, but probably not in the way you think. See, Jensen has never, and in my opinion,  would never, respond to something like this on social media, especially without at least attempting to talk to him first. Nor has he posted anything that even hinted at setting his fans on someone/something, except for charitable endeavours. Meanwhile,  Jared has a long history of mean tweets,  doxxing, being a  bully,  intentionally weaponizing his fans, etc. This is not hyperbole, this is well documented - there are receipts. Jensen has never done this. So yeah, he is going to get the benefit of any doubt from me, because he's earned it.

Edited June 28, 2021 by gonzosgirrl

[Hana Chan]

9 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

This is the crux of things, but probably not in the way you think. See, Jensen has never, and in my opinion,  would never, respond to something like this on social media, especially without at least attempting to talk to him first. Meanwhile,  Jared has a long history of mean tweets,  doxxing, being a  bully,  intentionally weaponizing his fans, etc. This is not hyperbole, this is well documented - there are receipts. Jensen has never done this. So yeah, he is going to get the benefit of any doubt from me, because he's earned it.

To me, the tweets are the least of things. If that is what Jensen's defenders are hanging their hats on, it's not a very strong argument in Jensen's favor. Jensen is not automatically the "good guy" just because he's not using social media as much as Jared does. Except for the tweet to Rob (which was totally out of line and Jared rightfully deleted it), what did Jared tweet in this case that was so terrible? That he didn't know that they were announcing the series and that he was hurt about that? That he was sad that his character would not be included? 

And Jensen doesn't need to weaponize his fans, because they are happy to mobilize with or without him and I've seen plenty of posts mocking Jared, calling him a "whiny bitch" and that he doesn't have any right to SPN since everyone knows that Jensen was the only thing important from the show. I don't agree with the basic premise that just because Jared posts his displeasures makes him the "bad guy" in this particular moment and that Jensen doesn't makes him the "good guy". I'm not going to go into a long debate about Jared's social media history, which is I agree is messy and he often doesn't exercise the descension that I would hope for. That doesn't necessarily change the foundation of this discussion. Some people will see this as a problematic pattern and others will see honesty. Both can be wrong and right.

As for speaking to Jensen before he tweeted, I and many others have agreed that he should have. But if Jensen deserved that kind of consideration, then shouldn't Jared have deserved Jensen reaching out before the announcement? I don't think anyone handled this well. Again, I don't think that Jensen deliberately meant to insult or hurt Jared and I don't think that Jared wants to sink Jensen's project. Things should have been handled better across the board. 

[Aeryn13]

1 hour ago, Hana Chan said:

We don't know 99.9% of what was going on. For all we know, Jared and Jensen had a clear agreement between them that if they were to work on an SPN project, it would be as a team and Jensen went back on his word. But we don't know. All we know is Jared's tweet that he was supportive but hurt and feels a certain amount of betrayal that he 1) is not involved in the new project (at least at this point) and 2) was not aware that the project was moving forward (to the point where an official announcement was made).

We can paint Jared as problematic because he brought this into social media, but just because Jensen kept things to himself negate the possibility that he may be problematic too. Again, as fans we don't know what was happening behind the scenes. The fact that Kripke said that he thought that Jared was aware and wasn't participating because he was busy with his own series seems IMO to think that  there were at least some things left unsaid. It is possible that Jensen went back on an agreement between them? Sure. It is possible that Jared thought that he and Jensen had an agreement that really wasn't there? Equally possible.

We're all jumping to conclusions about who is to blame and making judgements on how things were handled when we only know what was going on through what was said at convention panels and a few tweets. The point is that we just don't know and I think that it's unfair to judge either Jared or Jensen over this little mess. Yes, Jared could (and should) have handled things better. And Jensen could (and should) have given Jared a clear heads up about the project before the announcement was made. I'm willing to give both of them the benefit of the doubt.

Again, as I and others said previously, just because you don't have to do something doesn't mean that it's not a good idea to do something. If only to avoid this kind of bad spillover. I will say this, though. If the shoe was on the other foot and Jared was launching an SPN series without Jensen, even if Jensen wouldn't say something on social media, his fans would be out with pitchforks and torches for Jared over his audacity for thinking that he owns SPN's legacy and shutting out Jensen. This fandom is one of the most toxic I've been involved in and as someone who likes both Jared and Jensen as actors, liked both Sam and Dean as characters (even if Jared/Sam were my favorites), it's hard to stay involved because the extreme fans of both actors can be so hard to stomach at times.

But I do know what happens in terms of what I'm making the judgement for. Jared, once again, used social media to air personal grievances and weaponized his online fanbase, this time against a fan. 

His making the whole thing public so multiple headlines picked it up is no speculation. It is a fact. That he did this before is a fact. Noone has to speculate on half-truths when it comes to that.

And I judge him for that proven pattern of behaviour. And "maybe something something did something something first to provoke him" just is no excuse for me. He is an adult, he is responsible for his reactions. Which to me in this case was especially poor from start to finish. The "please don't send hate" after the fact is completely disingemous for me.

So I'm not judging anyone here for stuff I don't know how they handled, only for stuff I know exactly what they did because it's out for all to see. Nor do I think it's just a "well maybe it wasn't handled the best but..." matter or "everyone else shouldn't have triggered him because they know how he is" matter. Especially does it not fall under the umbrella of "honesty" for me.

Maybe noone will ever stop that coddling and make him grow up but that doesn't mean I can't judge the behavior nor do I have to blame other people for it. I think Jared's twitter shows no class, weakness and I have zero respect for how he handles himself.

Edited June 28, 2021 by Aeryn13

[gonzosgirrl]

1 minute ago, Hana Chan said:

To me, the tweets are the least of things.

This whole thing happened because of the tweets - Jared's tweets. All three of them. To take them out of the equation is not reasonable or a fair argument. Without Jared's response, there would still be the discussion about the premise of the proposed show, there would undoubtedly be backlash from Jared's fans over a perceived slight, but that's what they do. Where it went is on Jared. Period.

[MAK]

1 hour ago, Hana Chan said:

For all we know, Jared and Jensen had a clear agreement between them that if they were to work on an SPN project, it would be as a team and Jensen went back on his word.

If they really wanted to continue working together professionally, they would have formed a company together instead of Jensen and Daneel. They would have partnered up and pursued the rights for SPN together the minute the show ended. They have not done that. So at least one of them was not interested in doing that.

Also, I don't think Jared conceived of and developed Walker. It was given to him for consideration by the creator (Jeremy Carver's wife, I think). He can talk after the fact that he wanted to have it star Jensen but I don't think he ever verbalized it to anyone, even Jensen, at the time.

[gonzosgirrl]

27 minutes ago, Hana Chan said:

And Jensen doesn't need to weaponize his fans, because they are happy to mobilize with or without him

This is true of every celebrity or public figure with an online fanbase. The difference lies in whether or not that figurehead deliberately uses those fans for  their (negative) agendas. Jared does. Jensen doesn't.

Edited June 28, 2021 by gonzosgirrl
clarity

[PAForrest]

41 minutes ago, MAK said:

If they really wanted to continue working together professionally, they would have formed a company together instead of Jensen and Daneel. They would have partnered up and pursued the rights for SPN together the minute the show ended. They have not done that. So at least one of them was not interested in doing that.

Also, I don't think Jared conceived of and developed Walker. It was given to him for consideration by the creator (Jeremy Carver's wife, I think). He can talk after the fact that he wanted to have it star Jensen but I don't think he ever verbalized it to anyone, even Jensen, at the time.

I think Anna Fricke* was hired on as exec producer/showrunner, but the premise for Walker was found and the rights purchased by JP's then manager (before the whole sexual assault issues on Survivor) and JP. And when that was announced, Jensen Ackles's name was nowhere to be found because it had absolutely nothing to do with him.

Just as when it was announced that Jensen Ackles and Danneel Ackles had formed a production company under the WB's umbrella, Jared Padalecki's name was nowhere to be found, because he is not involved in any way, shape, or form.

The grasping "for all we know" fantasies are just that, fantasies. These things are announced by the trade outlets when they're official, with everything crossed and dotted on the contracts - there's no need to pretend or speculate. The Js do not have a production company together, period. And neither of them has ever even said they were working toward that goal.

*Fricke is now exec producer on the pre-production reboot of The 4400. I don't know what that means for her continued involvement in Walker. That was announced in the trades months ago.

Edited June 28, 2021 by PAForrest

[Myrelle]

4 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

This is true of every celebrity or public figure with an online fanbase. The difference lies in whether or not that figurehead deliberately uses those fans for  their (negative) agendas. Jared does. Jensen doesn't.

56 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

This is the crux of things, but probably not in the way you think. See, Jensen has never, and in my opinion,  would never, respond to something like this on social media, especially without at least attempting to talk to him first. Meanwhile,  Jared has a long history of mean tweets,  doxxing, being a  bully,  intentionally weaponizing his fans, etc. This is not hyperbole, this is well documented - there are receipts. Jensen has never done this. So yeah, he is going to get the benefit of any doubt from me, because he's earned it.

These two say it all for me.

Trying to "equalize" the blame by blaming the victim, in some way-any way, for that matter-is also a tried and true response from many in this toxic fandom also whenever JP decides that someone treated him "unfairly" or "wrong". Too many for my taste, for sure. I decided that a long time ago.

That was the thing that I found hardest to stomach in this fandom.

 

[TheGreenKnight]

4 hours ago, Hana Chan said:

As for speaking to Jensen before he tweeted, I and many others have agreed that he should have. But if Jensen deserved that kind of consideration, then shouldn't Jared have deserved Jensen reaching out before the announcement?

This. I think the fandom is under the misunderstanding that Padalecki and Ackles must really be these very close, dear friends. I'm willing to bet most of that has been an act, PR for a show where they play brothers, the way actors always put on to sell a concept. I'm sure they are friends in a casual sense, but close friends who call each other outside of work-related reasons? I doubt it. And if anything, this just proves it, since I doubt Padalecki would've been blindsided by a project that revolves around "Only child, Dean, tells story about his mom and dad..." or a writer from the main show's involvement being involved with a project that discludes him after turning down work on Walker if they had that kind of deep friendship. The reaction reads like a co-worker feeling like they're being "written out" of a property they had a key role in by the other star and feeling someone else from the show they thought they had a decent working relationship with over the years went along with it.

I don't believe the "pattern of behavior" claims about Padalecki either. Just going by how some things I do remember have been described over the past couple of pages, it sounds like fan histrionics to make Padalecki sound as evil as possible to clear Ackles entirely to me. LOL

[Katy M]

Here's my two cents on the whole thing (not that anybody cares).  This is Jensen and Jared's business.  Nobody else's.  I know Jared kind of brought everyone in a bit with his tweet(s). But, nobody has to engage.  Nobody (well not nobody, of course), knows these two people personally. Presumably they are two adults who can work out their own issues and don't need random strangers to be their champions.

[Aeryn13]

4 minutes ago, Katy M said:

Here's my two cents on the whole thing (not that anybody cares).  This is Jensen and Jared's business.  Nobody else's.  I know Jared kind of brought everyone in a bit with his tweet(s). But, nobody has to engage.  Nobody (well not nobody, of course), knows these two people personally. Presumably they are two adults who can work out their own issues and don't need random strangers to be their champions.

And maybe it wouldn't have been that blown up if not every blog and news outet hadn't picked it up and ran with headlines on "Jared Padalecki feels gutted yada yada". Which came after the tweets.

Maybe it's a super-slow newsweek thatbasically even the Sunday paper of Podunk Nowhere ran with a story about CW-level Drama but here we are.

I wish it had been a thing just between  them, no matter what it entailed but in this day and age it would be naive to believe once it's out on twitter like that, it won't lead to a huge blow-out.  

[ahrtee]

12 minutes ago, Katy M said:

Here's my two cents on the whole thing (not that anybody cares).  This is Jensen and Jared's business.  Nobody else's.  I know Jared kind of brought everyone in a bit with his tweet(s). But, nobody has to engage.  Nobody (well not nobody, of course), knows these two people personally. Presumably they are two adults who can work out their own issues and don't need random strangers to be their champions.

IA that it's none of our business, and with all the people who say that we don't know what went on BTS.   But your last sentence is, to me, the crux of the matter.  If they don't need random strangers to be their champions, then why bring simple hurt feelings to a very public forum?  The only reason I can see is to garner sympathy, and, knowing this fandom, know that they will "engage," very vocally and  potentially dangerously.  Jared may not be responsible for his fans' actions, but he *is* responsible for getting them worked up. 

If you wave a red flag in front of a bull, you may not intend for him to charge, but it is your fault for doing something that you know from past experience would cause him to react badly and it is your responsibility if anyone gets hurt because of your actions.  

Edited June 28, 2021 by ahrtee

[Katy M]

Just now, ahrtee said:

If they don't need random strangers to be their champions, then why bring simple hurt feelings to a very public forum?  The only reason I can see is to garner sympathy, and, knowing this fandom, know that that will "engage," very vocally and  potentially dangerously.  Jared may not be responsible for his fans' actions, but he *is* responsible for getting them worked up. 

If you wave a red flag in front of a bull, you may not intend for him to charge, but it is your fault for doing something that you know from past experience would cause him to react badly and it is your responsibility if anyone gets hurt because of your actions.  

That very well may be the reason behind doing things. I'm just saying you can't control other people's actions.  Only your own. Which is why I choose not to get dragged into others' fights.  Not just celebs, but also my friends. If two friends are having a problem that has nothing to do with me, I don't want to mediate. They're adults. So, yeah, kids might sometimes need a mediator, adults should be able to work out their own stuff. And if they do need help working it out, then I want them both there at the same time, no talking behind their backs.

People trying to drag other people into their drama is kind of a pet peeve of mine.

[Frost]

Is there anything else going on that we could talk about?  🙂  It feels like everyone has made their opinions well known.

[Casseiopeia]

28 minutes ago, Frost said:

Is there anything else going on that we could talk about?  🙂  It feels like everyone has made their opinions well known.

I'd like to talk about the spinoff and any possible theories on how they are going to make it work. Time travel...alternate universe...mind wipe....

There are enough fan fiction writers on this site any ideas?

[tessathereaper]

46 minutes ago, TheGreenKnight said:

This. I think the fandom is under the misunderstanding that Padalecki and Ackles must really be these very close, dear friends. I'm willing to bet most of that has been an act, PR for a show where they play brothers, the way actors always put on to sell a concept. I'm sure they are friends in a casual sense, but close friends who call each other outside of work-related reasons? I doubt it. And if anything, this just proves it, since I doubt Padalecki would've been blindsided by a project that revolves around "Only child, Dean, tells story about his mom and dad..." or a writer from the main show's involvement being involved with a project that discludes him after turning down work on Walker if they had that kind of deep friendship. The reaction reads like a co-worker feeling like they're being "written out" of a property they had a key role in by the other star and feeling someone else from the show they thought they had a decent working relationship with over the years went along with it.

I don't believe the "pattern of behavior" claims about Padalecki either. Just going by how some things I do remember have been described over the past couple of pages, it sounds like fan histrionics to make Padalecki sound as evil as possible to clear Ackles entirely to me. LOL

You mean the waitress, the concierge, the airline employee, the Live Nation person(can't remember her job, basically like a VIP handler I guess), now Jensen and Robbie Thompson.  Those are off the top of my head there may be others.  I believe that's enough for a pattern of behavior. Right down to the "benevolent"(aka legal disclaimer) "please be peaceful I don't want any harm to come to anyone" follow up tweet/post.

That doesn't count the twitter beefs with Justin Bieber(huh!?!), he added insulting Taylor Swift to one of his Bieber tweets as I recall, Sunny Hostin, insulting Phillip Seymour Hoffman for how he died.  I believe the twitter beefs happened before he started doxxing service workers and calling them horrible human beings, for very unspecified but very terrible soul destroying things they did to him. 

One thing is just "ok mistake, maybe a bad day" but not so much when, it's at leat 5 times if not more.  He knew the consequences of his actions.  Jensen and Danneel this was a first time thing for them, if they made a mistake in how they did their announcement well this is the first time they've had a production project to announce, they are beginners at that part of it, they deserve the benefit of the doubt, IMO.  BUT Jared?  Nope Jared knew darn well what he was doing and what would happen when he did it.

That is a pattern of behavior especially when the writing style of the posts frequently takes on the same weird, I can't explain it, speech pattern or wording whatever, where he sounds like he's in some competition to become "Jared the Martyr"

[tessathereaper]

3 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

I'd like to talk about the spinoff and any possible theories on how they are going to make it work. Time travel...alternate universe...mind wipe....

There are enough fan fiction writers on this site any ideas?

Not a fanfic writer but I think it'll basically be Dean or whoever else in heaven learning the story of his parents before he was born, the real story.

I don't think he or anyone else is going to be time traveling, I think it's just one of those things Heaven can do, show you history.  Which makes perfect sense.  Its outside of time, so you can see any time.

Honestly I think the basic idea was Sam living his life on earth and while driving around Heaven Dean makes a stop and learns his parents story.  We only saw Dean drive in the finale that doesn't mean he couldn't made stops along the way.  So I think the basic framing device would simply be he realizes he can see anything in history and he wants to learn more about his family BEFORE he was born, what really happened.

With regards to the events in their story, they can do all sorts of things, some Mary doing secret hunts, some supernatural interference in their lives that gets mind wiped, etc.

I actually think they could do some pretty cool stuff especially as they seem to be taking the idea of canon seriously and trying to find clever ways to remain within canon while expanding the story.

[Hana Chan]

17 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

There are enough fan fiction writers on this site any ideas?

The John and Mary story, IMO, has been done very completely on the show and I can't see much value about turning it into a soap opera story with the monsters and demons in the background. The best stories about John and Mary I've found still tie primarily into their roles as parents to Sam and Dean so trying to tell something original about them without that angle just don't feel all that interesting. We might get some filling in of the blanks, but as a writer, it feels like we'd be retracing old ground that we already know. They can try to turn things around, but that could conflict with the canon of the original series (not that the canon didn't contradict itself on a very frequent basis). 

I really wish that the first SPN spinoff would have gone into a totally new direction and broke away from the original characters. Hunters in the medieval era would have been a lot of fun. Or how about telling the story of Samuel Colt and the hunters that he designed weapons for? That would have been interesting and could have feed nicely into SPN canon lore.

[Katy M]

11 minutes ago, tessathereaper said:

I don't think he or anyone else is going to be time traveling, I think it's just one of those things Heaven can do, show you history.  Which makes perfect sense.  Its outside of time, so you can see any time.

Honestly I think the basic idea was Sam living his life on earth and while driving around Heaven Dean makes a stop and learns his parents story.  We only saw Dean drive in the finale that doesn't mean he couldn't made stops along the way.  So I think the basic framing device would simply be he realizes he can see anything in history and he wants to learn more about his family BEFORE he was born, what really happened.

Sounds as good as anything.  I'm not really interested in the retconning of the early John and Mary years, though.

1 minute ago, Hana Chan said:

The John and Mary story, IMO, has been done very completely on the show and I can't see much value about turning it into a soap opera story with the monsters and demons in the background. The best stories about John and Mary I've found still tie primarily into their roles as parents to Sam and Dean so trying to tell something original about them without that angle just don't feel all that interesting. We might get some filling in of the blanks, but as a writer, it feels like we'd be retracing old ground that we already know. They can try to turn things around, but that could conflict with the canon of the original series (not that the canon didn't contradict itself on a very frequent basis). 

I really wish that the first SPN spinoff would have gone into a totally new direction and broke away from the original characters. Hunters in the medieval era would have been a lot of fun. Or how about telling the story of Samuel Colt and the hunters that he designed weapons for? That would have been interesting and could have feed nicely into SPN canon lore.

I can't remember if I said it here or somewhere else, but I would have been totally on board with a Bobby/Rufus prequel.  I need to see that conjoined twins werewolf hunt that was mentioned in Devil May care (?).  We could see whatever happened in Omaha (?) that caused their rift.  It could start with Karen dying and end with Omaha.  

[gonzosgirrl]

Who wants to bet the ratings on W@lker tick up this week? Jared couldn't buy the free publicity and unfathomably sympathetic edit he got over this. Or maybe he did. Who knows. He sure does have good PR people. 

[PAForrest]

10 minutes ago, tessathereaper said:

... I think it'll basically be Dean or whoever else in heaven learning the story of his parents before he was born, the real story.

I don't think he or anyone else is going to be time traveling, I think it's just one of those things Heaven can do, show you history.  Which makes perfect sense.  Its outside of time, so you can see any time.

Honestly I think the basic idea was Sam living his life on earth and while driving around Heaven Dean makes a stop and learns his parents story.  We only saw Dean drive in the finale that doesn't mean he couldn't made stops along the way.  So I think the basic framing device would simply be he realizes he can see anything in history and he wants to learn more about his family BEFORE he was born, what really happened.

Yeah, this was my feeling too - Dean would be narrating the story from Heaven, because Chuck knows he has nothing else to do and he's already bored AF. But it would be the way to go if Dean learned of the story from talking with his parents during their endless days and discovering everything he never knew. It's not like he got a chance to really talk to them when they were alive, so in Heaven would be the time and place for new discoveries.

And in narrating, I would assume he'd be talking to someone, telling that someone the story. Could be Sam after he arrives, could be Cas, could be Bobby or Charlie, could be all of them together.

Danneel said they were taking them back to teen years, and if they're going to try and marry canon to the story, then we'd see teen John and Mary probably not liking each other at all until Cupid gets involved.

[Casseiopeia]

11 minutes ago, Hana Chan said:

Or how about telling the story of Samuel Colt and the hunters that he designed weapons for

I did read years ago that Kripke had entertained the idea of telling the story of Samuel Colt. I think it would have been great to explore Cowboys and Demons. 

I hope we aren't going to get a Bewitched kind of story where Mary does all of her hunting behind John's back while he goes to work at the garage.

[ahrtee]

14 minutes ago, Katy M said:

I can't remember if I said it here or somewhere else, but I would have been totally on board with a Bobby/Rufus prequel.  I need to see that conjoined twins werewolf hunt that was mentioned in Devil May care (?).  We could see whatever happened in Omaha (?) that caused their rift.  It could start with Karen dying and end with Omaha.  

I'd watch that.  Unfortunately, it's not the CW demographic.  ☹️

Edited June 28, 2021 by ahrtee

[Casseiopeia]

13 minutes ago, PAForrest said:

It's not like he got a chance to really talk to them when they were alive

But Dean grew up with John. They knew a lot about John's life even before he was a hunter. They met army buddies over the years. They know how John felt about Henry (now early MOL's would have been a fun spinoff). They know how John and Mary met. I just can't see what else there is to explore about him.  And Dabb pretty much ruined Mary's character for way too many fans to care anything about her.

Unless John goes on all kinds of hunting adventures with Mary and then at some point has his memories wiped I just can't wrap my head around what they could possibly do with these two that would fit with canon.

Edited June 28, 2021 by Casseiopeia

[Myrelle]

10 minutes ago, PAForrest said:

Yeah, this was my feeling too - Dean would be narrating the story from Heaven, because Chuck knows he has nothing else to do and he's already bored AF. But it would be the way to go if Dean learned of the story from talking with his parents during their endless days and discovering everything he never knew. It's not like he got a chance to really talk to them when they were alive, so in Heaven would be the time and place for new discoveries.

And in narrating, I would assume he'd be talking to someone, telling that someone the story. Could be Sam after he arrives, could be Cas, could be Bobby or Charlie, could be all of them together.

Danneel said they were taking them back to teen years, and if they're going to try and marry canon to the story, then we'd see teen John and Mary probably not liking each other at all until Cupid gets involved.

If he's in Heaven and it's before Sam got there, there would be all kinds of opportunities for cameos, too-even JDM, whose character might not be so well-loved by some in the online community, but the actor is still a big draw as we saw in the 300th and there ARE plenty of fans(both online and in the greater fandom who aren't online) who still love those two characters, especially when they're together.

 

 

 

[ahrtee]

2 minutes ago, Myrelle said:

If he's in Heaven and it's before Sam got there, there would be all kinds of opportunities for cameos, too-even JDM, whose character might not be so well-loved by some in the online community, but the actor is still a big draw as we saw in the 300th and there ARE plenty of fans(both online and in the greater fandom who aren't online) who still love those two characters, especially when they're together.

 

I didn't get the impression that Jensen would be onscreen, just a VO narrator. (Not that I would mind seeing him!)  

[Lastcall]

42 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

I'd like to talk about the spinoff and any possible theories on how they are going to make it work. Time travel...alternate universe...mind wipe....

There are enough fan fiction writers on this site any ideas?

    There is very early speculation popping up that Dean will be telling the story to Castiel in Heaven. I don't know if that's a minefield Jensen would want to walk through but I'm sure that's one of many controversies that will pop up if this thing actually gets made. Everyone putting their hopes into this so it's going to be interesting to see if they lean into nostalgia like the Dabb years or go for something more original. John as a mechanic holds no interest for me. Given the state of the CW now days there is a very good chance it will be a Mary Buffy type show keeping her life a secret from her boyfriend. 

     What I would like to see is a This is us or Arrow type show where there are flash back and flash forward type stories showing Mary's and John's hunts and how they and their relationship changed over time. There different hunting styles could be interesting and you could show a young Sam and Dean if you need to. A personal hope is that when Dean is watching or telling this story he discovers a problem and is sent back to guest for an episode or two maybe with Sam if things are patched up. I'm betting Jensen will direct an episode or two and also that the idea has been floated to help sell it. I could also see Jensen and Misha on camera as Dean tells the story. Of course, all of this depends on the show being picked up exactly as described now.

[MAK]

Perhaps they could explore the peripheral characters. 

In Supernatural, at least 3 MoL survived. Samuel Campbell's relatives survived. There is the history of the Colt. They could bring in Missouri. 

So much depends on if they write it romantic or angst-ridden. Like someone said, hope it's not like Bewitched, where John is the clueless husband. That would be boring.

Hope Dean isn't talking to Castiel. Why would he need to? Hasn't Castiel been observing and studying Dean and his past since at least S4? He would already know the details of John and Mary's story. Maybe he's talking to Jack, even though he would have absorbed all that information from Chuck? Or perhaps Sam's son Dean Jr.?

 

[gonzosgirrl]

21 minutes ago, Lastcall said:

There is very early speculation popping up that Dean will be telling the story to Castiel in Heaven.

And... as I spec'd yesterday, this is when the faction currently supporting Jensen in all this brouhahah will turn on him.

Dean has no reason to tell Cas the story - Cas already knows. I think the suggestion that it could be Dean relating it to someone while awaiting Sam's arrival in Heaven is the most likely. Or if he decides to ignore 15x20, narrating to a school of hunters or such.

[Myrelle]

Heh.

4 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

And... as I spec'd yesterday, this is when the faction currently supporting Jensen in all this brouhahah will turn on him.

Dean has no reason to tell Cas the story - Cas already knows. I think the suggestion that it could be Dean relating it to someone while awaiting Sam's arrival in Heaven is the most likely. Or if he decides to ignore 15x20, narrating to a school of hunters or such.

Heh. I would love it Dean's first ever VO started out with

"After Jack sent us back here..."

And wouldn't it then be great if we never see or know who he's talking to until the end of the series, when we find out that it's Dean's own son.

I'd love that.

And I'm sure that there would be plenty of spec concerning that, and spec is what made this show turn at the beginning, IMO.