S08.E07: Time For After

[Boofish]

I long for the days when Eugene was just a coward. Now Eugene is a coward and an asshole. My mother used to say "never be more than one struggle"

[AngelaHunter]

8 hours ago, heisenberg said:

Don't forget Rick/Jadis with the Polaroid wasting flash bulbs that comes from nowhere...   

The problem with those apocalypse tv shows is that technology ceased to exist in the 80's. 

Hardly surprising, since the apocalypse seemed to have created a time portal and sent everyone back to 1960s Mayberry. Every town they've entered looked as though Andy Griffith and Goober Pyle should have been there to greet them with a "Howdy!"

2 hours ago, ghoulina said:

But the insistence on Eugene embracing this clipped, southern accent and speaking as if he's reading a badly written instruction manual was just WRONG. It only works if he is a side character, and throws a funny quip out there once in awhile.

This is another thing that highlights these no-talent writers. They give supporting/secondary characters whole episodes of their own - Beth, Tara - why, I will never figure out -  and now Eugene, and the minor quirks or characteristics that make them interesting or funny in tiny doses become unbearable. Beth and Tara (their real names elude me ATM) just weren't and aren't nearly good enough actors or interesting enough characters to pull this off and Eugene is rendered even more ridiculous and cartoonish.

[ghoulina]

2 hours ago, JackONeill said:

I don’t think Father P died. I think Rick found another black guy who was acting as outlook/sniper, supposedly keeping any eye on Negan’s compound. Now, what killed him, I don’t know. I guess we are to believe that when Negan’s people bailed, one of them killed him on their way out of Dodge. (Which won’t look good on his “Outlook” resume.)

I don’t know any of this, of course. It’s just that I’ve gotten to the point that I write my own script. Things make more sense to me that way.

Oh gee, haha. Thanks. Shows you how engaging this story has become. Rick's reaction, to me, seemed like it was someone important. I don't even know who else was working with Morgan!!!

7 minutes ago, AngelaHunter said:

This is another thing that highlights these no-talent writers. They give supporting/secondary characters whole episodes of their own - Beth, Tara - why, I will never figure out -  and now Eugene, and the minor quirks or characteristics that make them interesting or funny in tiny doses become unbearable. Beth and Tara (their real names elude me ATM) just weren't and aren't nearly good enough actors or interesting enough characters to pull this off and Eugene is rendered even more ridiculous and cartoonish.

Yea, Emily Kinney and Alana Masterson are really not that strong of actors. I think Josh is actually probably pretty good; it's the ridiculous character quirks they've given him that really bog the character down. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

I didn't get the impression that it was Father G. who was killed. 

I do have the feeling, based on nothing but a hunch, that they're setting Eugene up for a major redemption arc, like he'll betray Negan at the last moment or something. 

[Boofish]

4 minutes ago, Superclam said:

I didn't get the impression that it was Father G. who was killed. 

I do have the feeling, based on nothing but a hunch, that they're setting Eugene up for a major redemption arc, like he'll betray Negan at the last moment or something. 

I personally think Eugene is too far gone for redemption. For him to basically say "F Glen, Maggie and their baby; what if I get a cold and need the doctor" I'm even willing to work with Dwight and Simon but Eugene spot is written in a sharpie on granite as far as my s%* list goes.

[Tony]

Michone backing out of the plan was bullshit. Does it have something to do with Rick not being there?

Eugene better die next episode.

[AngelaHunter]

48 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

If this crap came from the comics, then I am surprised that the comics were ever that popular.

Teenaged boys don't usually care too much for continuity, strong storylines, suspense, well-drawn characters or logic. They just want to see guts and gore and rocket launchers and shit being blown up. I have no doubt that's the audience that made the comics so popular.

 

1 hour ago, ghoulina said:

I think Josh is actually probably pretty good;

I never heard of him before this show, but I think so too. I started to like him when he was the only one - (IMO and at any rate the only one who touched me) - able to convincingly display extreme horror and grief when Abe and Glenn bought it. I still don't blame him fo going to Negan. There was nothing and no one to keep him in Alexandria. Morgan and Maggie are worse, I think - Morgan for letting the wolves go and arming them on their way out, and Maggie for bringing in the very people complicit in her husband's brutal murder. Why am I going on about this? None of it makes the least sense anyway.

[Spartan Girl]

Andrew Lincoln said in an interview that he wanted Michonne to show up and battle the trash pandas to save Rick. 

Now why couldn't THAT have happened instead of this shit?

[Nashville]

10 hours ago, FortKnox said:

I just want to know how much time has passed from the season premiere till this ep.  I'm thinking it's been one day AT BEST.

Pretty much guesswork, but as near as I can figure:

1. The assault on the Sanctuary took place about a week and a half after the ASZ battle (based on time needed to develop a plan, gather/make weapons, “armor” cars, and Rick/Michonne/Rosita’s current recovery levels).
2. The Sanctuary fight has been going on now for about 4 or 5 days, tops (based on guesstimates of Gabriel’s sickness progression, and Rick’s time in the Box).

 

37 minutes ago, Boofish said:

I personally think Eugene is too far gone for redemption. For him to basically say "F Glen, Maggie and their baby; what if I get a cold and need the doctor" I'm even willing to work with Dwight and Simon but Eugene spot is written in a sharpie on granite as far as my s%* list goes.

Eugene has a long and illustrious history of talking loud, walking soft, and not carrying any kind of stick big or otherwise.  Any type of forceful declaration on Eugene’s  part has never been anything but posturing, so I don’t put much weight in his words either way (positive OR negative).

 

Biggest goof I saw in this episode: the HAKs supposedly have the Sanctuary ringed with snipers ready to put a bullet in any head which so much as peeks up from behind a window.  So how is it Eugene and Dwight can stand unprotected on an open overlook to the walkers in the compound and argue for several minutes without anybody taking so much as a single shot?  MAJOR fail.

[Ouisch]

I was trying to figure out why Rick, stripped down to his boxer shorts, was perspiring as if he was locked in a sweat lodge. Every one else at the Dump was dressed like it's December in Anchorage. (Those looked like the same baggy shorts he was wearing the the pilot episode, when he first awoke from his coma. Must be using Woolite Extra Gentle or something that they're not threadbare by now.)

[ShadowSixx]

Don't take much stock in what thy wear. Negan thinks it's cool to wear leather out in the heat. I guess he wants to look more intimidating or something.

[iMonrey]

Quote

IDK why Rick is so persistent with wanting GPK's help when he knows about Oceanside.

Well, Rosita's objection to Daryl's plan was that if the Saviors manage to get out of the Sanctuary, they don't have the numbers to take them. Especially now that half the Kingdom has been killed. So there are apparently way more Saviors in that building than there are Alexandrians, Hilltoppers and Kingdomers combined. Hence the need for the garbage people.

That said, absolutely nothing about the garbage people and the scenes with Rick made a lick of sense. What was the point of putting Rick in the storage container? Was he on hold until they finished making a new gladiator zombie? And Rick may have taken out the zombie and a couple of the garbage people, but he was surrounded. Even if he'd killed Jadis, he was toast. I don't get why she agreed to his plan. The whole thing was just dumb and pointless. 

[meep.meep]

6 hours ago, Gobi said:

Let me see if I understand The Plan. Declare all out war on the Saviors, ignoring their allies the GPK - no lookouts, no snipers to keep an eye on a group that you know has some way of contacting the Saviors, maybe even by radio. Then, when all of your forces are committed, send your leader alone and unarmed to meet with the group that has betrayed him and tried to kill him, to ask if they want to be friends, for reals this time. Oh, and ignore the perfect opportunity to kill Negan (two, if you count FPP in the  trailer). The level of stupidity is staggering.

 

The plan was to lead the walker herd to the Sanctuary, take out the outposts, lose all the Kingdom folks while doing so, and then to just wander off two by two, or singly, to do other things without communicating anything back to the larger group.   The Saviors may be shits, but they are great at communication.  They are also great at planning, and at training everyone to know what to do in case of a problem.

This has turned into a tedious exercise.  

[JackONeill]

12 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Well, Rosita's objection to Daryl's plan was that if the Saviors manage to get out of the Sanctuary, they don't have the numbers to take them. Especially now that half the Kingdom has been killed. So there are apparently way more Saviors in that building than there are Alexandrians, Hilltoppers and Kingdomers combined. Hence the need for the garbage people.

That said, absolutely nothing about the garbage people and the scenes with Rick made a lick of sense. What was the point of putting Rick in the storage container? Was he on hold until they finished making a new gladiator zombie? And Rick may have taken out the zombie and a couple of the garbage people, but he was surrounded. Even if he'd killed Jadis, he was toast. I don't get why she agreed to his plan. The whole thing was just dumb and pointless. 

The only thing I I can think about the garbage group is that TPTB must feel like they are the Terminus group of this season. I think the audience liked the Terminus story-line better than most story lines, and it was because it was over and done quickly, and the people in Terminus were somewhat...different. Remember, Mary and the candles and the way she welcomed everyone. Very unlike Negan, the Governor, and the Wolves. The problem is A) NO story-line is over and done quickly anymore. Hell, someone getting a hangnail takes weeks to resolve. And B) the actors who portrayed the Terminus people were good and well-written. Watching the garbage dump kids is like watching some high school's performance of Alice in Wonderland with everyone stoned.

[Nashville]

This episode succinctly encapsulated my primary issue with the GPKs.  Negan makes his victims kneel defenseless while he takes a baseball bat to their heads, while Jadis makes her victims kneels defenseless while getting their faces gnawed off by Zombie-Chicken-On-A-Stick; how is one morally superior to the other?  Why would Rick want to partner with such people?

The only way this would remotely make sense would be if Rick’s plan was, two seconds after the Savior threat was exterminated, the HAKs immediately turn weapons on the GPKs and eliminate them as well.

[Ouisch]

19 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Well, Rosita's objection to Daryl's plan was that if the Saviors manage to get out of the Sanctuary, they don't have the numbers to take them.

....and apparently part of Rick's plan was to save the "workers" in the Sanctuary, those folks who are only there because they fear Negan. Now, if Negan is killed and they are "freed", they could join with Rick and the Alexandrians and/or Hilltoppers and they'd have the numbers again. However....just like with the prisoners they've already brought back to the Hilltop, there is only so much food to go around, there are only so many places to sleep out of the weather, etc. Alexandria, Hilltop, even the Prison (back in the day) are/were finite in the number of people they can accommodate and sustain. Too many people in cramped quarters with not enough water to bathe as well as drink or an overworked sanitary system means disease can quickly spread. And they're already running short of food at the Sanctuary, where they've been hoarding halfsies from other communities...imagine how much worse it will get at the Hilltop once they run out of turnips. 

 

In the long run, even though Rick's "plan" (if I'm understanding it) is more humane at first glance, eventually a lot of those people are going to starve to death or worse anyway.

[Macbeth]

I had no problem with Eugene this episode.  I understood his motivations.

Now Rick and his plan - WTF: 

            1.  This is shampoo and repeat with his initial encounter with GPK.

             2.  And according to Rosita - Rick going and looking for backup from the GPK was the actual plan and people were onboard?  I just thought he was without a car and ran into them first.

            3.  I am on Team Daryl on this one.  You have the Saviors surrounded.  You don't have the man power.  It is only a matter of time before the Saviors figure out a way to divert the herd.  2 plans were thwarted before Daryl rammed the compound with his truck.  And if your only hope is the GPK.... Ram away Daryl.

            4.  I am really pissed on how Michonne and Rosita were written.  They walk away because....  They know how dire the situation is.  This is a live or die situation, most of the Kingdom was killed, and they won't put their butts on the line.  No.

[Nashville]

18 minutes ago, Ouisch said:

....and apparently part of Rick's plan was to save the "workers" in the Sanctuary, those folks who are only there because they fear Negan. Now, if Negan is killed and they are "freed", they could join with Rick and the Alexandrians and/or Hilltoppers and they'd have the numbers again. However....just like with the prisoners they've already brought back to the Hilltop, there is only so much food to go around, there are only so many places to sleep out of the weather, etc. Alexandria, Hilltop, even the Prison (back in the day) are/were finite in the number of people they can accommodate and sustain. Too many people in cramped quarters with not enough water to bathe as well as drink or an overworked sanitary system means disease can quickly spread. And they're already running short of food at the Sanctuary, where they've been hoarding halfsies from other communities...imagine how much worse it will get at the Hilltop once they run out of turnips. 

 

In the long run, even though Rick's "plan" (if I'm understanding it) is more humane at first glance, eventually a lot of those people are going to starve to death or worse anyway.

Some people would rather starve free than eat as slaves.  That being said - from the worker bees’ acceptance of Savior domination, it’s probably safe to assume they fall on the other side of the living free / eating well fence. :)

 

1 minute ago, Macbeth said:

            3.  I am on Team Daryl on this one.  You have the Saviors surrounded.  You don't have the man power.  It is only a matter of time before the Saviors figure out a way to divert the herd.  2 plans were thwarted before Daryl rammed the compound with his truck.  And if your only hope is the GPK.... Ram away Daryl.

Daryl’s plan directly contradicts Rick’s, though - partly because each has disparate views of their targets:

•  Rick mentally divides the Sanctuary occupants into two groups, Saviors and workers. Rick wants to destroy the Saviors and save the workers on the assumption the workers are unwilling slaves who will peacefully join with the HAKs after the Saviors are gone. 
•  Daryl, on the other hand, makes no such distinction.  Daryl views the workers as Savior collaborators; regardless of  whether such collaboration is willing or unwilling, by doing the work their efforts support the Saviors and their atrocities.

A (large?) portion of Rick’s plan was to communicate through both word and action the Saviors were HAK’s target, not the workers - hopefully alienating worker support for the Saviors, and thereby significantly reducing the number of Sanctuary occupants directly opposing them.  Daryl’s garbage truck ploy directly contradicts Rick’s claims, however, by imperiling both Saviors and workers alike.  End result will be instead of fostering alienation between the Saviors and the workers, the Sanctuary occupants (Saviors and workers alike) will be united against both the immediate common threat (the walkers entering the Sanctuary) and its perceived cause (the HAKs).  

Which means Rick’s plan has just gone to shit, while Daryl’s plan has created its own justification.

[nodorothyparker]

I can only assume Daryl mentioned the Kingdom fighters all but being wiped out on their big truck drive back to the Sanctuary to have their second and third and fourth round of backtracking on their earlier resolve.  There was absolutely no reaction from any of our heroes when Daryl brings up to again justify forging on ahead instead of taking a look see and going home to hope it all somehow works out.  Seriously, Michonne and Rosita?  It might at least be worth hanging around long enough to see if it breaks the way Daryl wants it to because if it goes sideways you pretty much know where the now freed Saviors will be coming first.

The thing is if you took out the ridiculous walker on stick fight and everything else about this story made at least some degree of sense, I could kind of enjoy Rick and Dumpster Diva dickering on the price for her support.  Both actors were so completely deadpan after Rick going all rough and shouty had earlier had so gotten her attention.

[AngelaHunter]

1 hour ago, Nashville said:

So how is it Eugene and Dwight can stand unprotected on an open overlook to the walkers in the compound and argue for several minutes without anybody taking so much as a single shot?  

Why would they worry? Negan, after coming thisclose to murdering Carl, stood out there flapping his gums for what seemed like hours and Rick never even thought about shooting him.

[JackONeill]

9 minutes ago, AngelaHunter said:

Why would they worry? Negan, after coming thisclose to murdering Carl, stood out there flapping his gums for what seemed like hours and Rick never even thought about shooting him.

Hell, even when Rick shot at him with an automatic weapon, when Negan had practically no cover, Rick missed. But it wasn't Rick who missed—it was the writers who missed. I mean, God forbid they should have allowed Negan to die that early in this torture-fest.

And don't we love that Negan, last night, said, "Golly, we sure did use a lot of bullets!!!" And he's worried. So now that ammunition—or lack thereof—becomes a necessary plot-pointm we hear about all the crazy-ass shooting done by everyone. Hey, dimwit, tell your people they don't have to fire on AUTO. They can switch to single-shot, which actually allows for more accurate shooting.

I swear to God, for once in the life of TWD, I am looking forward to the new FTWD, and the end of TWD. I would have never thought it would come to that.

[Irishmaple]

I didn’t watch this one. I read the threads for 5 and 6 to motivate myself to watch in order to catch up. And I couldn’t. I think I’ll wait until the mid season finale airs and binge watch the four episodes over the hiatus. Honestly, and I never, ever thought I would say this, but I think I’m over this show.

[AngelaHunter]

12 hours ago, dwarmed said:

Oh, you’re making me sad to remember there was a time on this show with compelling and complex characters like Merle Dixon, amazing actors like Michael Rooker, and heartbreaking storylines like Merle’s Last Stand. What the hell happened to this show?

Compare the suspenseful, wrenching final meeting of the Gov and Merle to Rick and Negan's confrontations filled with empty threats ("I'm gonna kill you!") and Negan's scathing retort - "My dick is bigger than yours, Rick the Prick!") Wow, can this show deteriorate any further? Now Merle was someone who should have had his own episode. It would have been epic, unlike the "Loopy Adventures of Tara" or "Beth Meets the Lollicops and Eats a Guinea Pig" or the dread, "Dwight Takes a Stroll Down Memory Lane,"

[ghoulina]

10 minutes ago, AngelaHunter said:

Compare the suspenseful, wrenching final meeting of the Gov and Merle to Rick and Negan's confrontations filled with empty threats ("I'm gonna kill you!") and Negan's scathing retort - "My dick is bigger than yours, Rick the Prick!") Wow, can this show deteriorate any further? Now Merle was someone who should have had his own episode. It would have been epic, unlike the "Loopy Adventures of Tara" or "Beth Meets the Lollicops and Eats a Guinea Pig" or the dread, "Dwight Takes a Stroll Down Memory Lane,"

Amen. Merle was a great example of a character that was, for the most part, a terrible human being, but still incredibly entertaining. And then they were able to redeem him in a totally plausible way, without dragging the entire story out. 

The show has lost its touch. They can no longer craft complex and interesting characters, especially the "bad guys". It's all so over the top and underwhelming. The Claimers were in just a few episodes and they scared the shit out of me. I remember being completely on edge when Rick was trying to get out of that house. RICK. Who you KNOW isn't going to die. But that's how well done it was. Negan has never evoked the same sort of response in me. Not even close. 

[LadyArcadia]

WHY AM I STILL WATCHING THIS SHIT?

[DEL901]

2 hours ago, Ouisch said:

....and apparently part of Rick's plan was to save the "workers" in the Sanctuary, those folks who are only there because they fear Negan. Now, if Negan is killed and they are "freed", they could join with Rick and the Alexandrians and/or Hilltoppers and they'd have the numbers again. However....just like with the prisoners they've already brought back to the Hilltop, there is only so much food to go around, there are only so many places to sleep out of the weather, etc. Alexandria, Hilltop, even the Prison (back in the day) are/were finite in the number of people they can accommodate and sustain. Too many people in cramped quarters with not enough water to bathe as well as drink or an overworked sanitary system means disease can quickly spread. And they're already running short of food at the Sanctuary, where they've been hoarding halfsies from other communities...imagine how much worse it will get at the Hilltop once they run out of turnips. 

 

In the long run, even though Rick's "plan" (if I'm understanding it) is more humane at first glance, eventually a lot of those people are going to starve to death or worse anyway.

Rick is also assuming that the workers WANT to work with his group.  How can he be sure that they haven't been waiting for a chance to overthrow Negan and become tyrants too?   Once Rick starts ordering them around, but not having a Lucille or a group of thugs to enforce his orders, they're likely to rebel and say they've had enough of doing what they are told.

Edited December 4, 2017 by DEL901

[Gobi]

2 minutes ago, DEL901 said:

Rick is also assuming that the workers WANT to work with his group.  How can he be sure that they haven't been waiting for a chance to overthrow Negan and become tyrants too?   Once Rick starts ordering them around, but not having a Lucille or a group of thugs to enforce his orders, they're likely to rebel and say they've had enough of doing what they are told.

And another consideration - How do they tell the slaves from the true believers? I suppose Dwight could help with that; oh, wait, Tara and Darryl are going to kill Dwight.

[SnarkyTart]

The last we saw of Morgan was him storming off alone into the woods of Hilltop after realizing he's gone all Crazy Clear again after his Jesus beatdown.  "I'm not right, but I'm not wrong either".  Cut scene.  Now he's a sniper at the Savior compound and he's the walkie talkie leader of other snipers surrounding the place.  We never see the other snipers, we don't know who they are, where they came from, or how Morgan came to be leading them.  We'll never know, so we should just forget about it all because it doesn't matter anyway.

The Rick in a Box scene has been resolved.  So why did Jadis write the letter "A" on the container?  We'll never know, so we should just forget it all because it doesn't matter anyway.

This show's probably beyond the point of redemption for me when 12 hours after watching it these are the only things  I'm still thinking about.    

[TigerLynx]

I like Andrew Lincoln's idea of Michonne showing up to rescue Rick.  This SL would have worked for me if this is the way it played out:

Rick's group shows up at the Savior Compound, Negan is not walking around in the open being the easiest target ever to shoot, they draw the Walker horde to the Compound and leave the Saviors trapped.  They take out the Savior outposts.  Everyone and their dog does not have long pointless moral crisis conversations, and then wander off on their own.  Rick goes to the trash idiots because they know they need to get rid of this group as well.  Rick is on the inside, but Michonne and others are on the outside ready to attack.

Daryl, Tara, and Morgan crash the truck into the Savior Compound and the snipers take out any Saviors who try to escape, as well as previously taking out Dwight and Eugene when they were having their stupid pointless boring conversation on the roof.  This takes at most two episodes.

Shiva decides to go AWOL because these idiots aren't worth saving, and the women at Oceanside are feeding her and taking care of her.

This may sound mean, but since they were apparently out of ammunition for the rocket launcher and other weapons in the warehouse (I think that's what Tara said), what about setting the building on fire with arrows (when these people want to be they are all great sharp shooters) while the Walkers still surround the outside.  Death by fire, smoke inhalation or Walker, and it would also take care of the Walker horde in the process.

Edited December 4, 2017 by TigerLynx

[ttgreif]

19 hours ago, xaxat said:

 

Where the hell does Eugene find all of his retro tech? An Atari 2600, an Ipod, a battery powered cassette player. . . 

 

Courtesy of Garbage Kids playground maybe?

 

Am I the only one that thinks Dwight speaking  sounds too much "Rick" in his speeches versus Eugene or not?

btw Eugene talking is getting "it's all so greek to me" more and more every  week...

Edited December 4, 2017 by ttgreif

[AngelaHunter]

2 hours ago, ghoulina said:

Merle was a great example of a character that was, for the most part, a terrible human being, but still incredibly entertaining.

I didn't even find him all that terrible. He was just a product of his brutal environment, but he had a complexity and more than one dimension - not "pure evil" and not "good" - in other words, a humanity that removed him from the cartoonishness of "Ooh, look how badass I am! It's the IRON for you!" Negan. In the end, he had more fortitude than Rick as he let Michonne go which Rick would probably not have (and I could understand his dilemma too.) Of course, in my eyes Michael Rooker can do no wrong. Would Merle have been so riveting played by someone else? Maybe, but I don't know.

 

2 hours ago, ghoulina said:

I remember being completely on edge when Rick was trying to get out of that house. RICK. Who you KNOW isn't going to die. But that's how well done it was.

 Exactly. THAT is good writing. I can't remember the last time a movie or show had me roiled up to the extent that it was hard to breathe and got actual chills. I give credit not only to the writers for that amazing, tension-filled and gripping scene, but to Andrew Lincoln as well, for his portrayal of terror and desperation, all done without a word. I could cry thinking about that, and then looking at what this show has become - something that is more fun to mock than watch.

 

2 hours ago, ghoulina said:

The Claimers were in just a few episodes and they scared the shit out of me.

Totally. To me, Joe was unrelentingly terrifying, and in fact the more softly he spoke and the more pragmatic he was, the more terrifying he became, all wiith no bragging or dick-swinging.  He was like a "Deliverance" nightmare come to life. Where are the writers who created him and that whole scenario? Did they get fired in favour of post-pubescent boy-writers? I miss the former terribly.

[ttgreif]

15 hours ago, dwarmed said:

Oh, you’re making me sad to remember there was a time on this show with compelling and complex characters like Merle Dixon, amazing actors like Michael Rooker, and heartbreaking storylines like Merle’s Last Stand. What the hell happened to this show?

Merle's Last Stand with Motorhead's 'Fast and loose' blasting out from the loudspeakers...

Even the music was far better in those seasons

[dwarmed]

I thought it was Ace of Spades. 

ETA: @ttgreif You are right. I just rewatched that scene. Ah, TWD when it was still good. Merle offering his booze towards the walker on the other side of the window and the walker moving his mouth as if to drink it is pure gold. Not so far from my youth in the parking lot of a Motorhead concert. 

Edited December 5, 2017 by dwarmed

[jackjill89]

Eugene sucks and always has. He is a straight-up coward and a horrible friend. The only time he showed one ounce of having even half a ball was when he drove the RV as a decoy for the group when they took Maggie into the woods. Of course, he was caught in about 30 seconds, but it seemed like he finally understood what it meant to be part of a group. Well, he sold that out as soon as his butt was on the line. I don't care if he saves them all. I hate his character, always have and always will. What a sniveling waste of space. 

[Gobi]

I like Eugene as a character, but he's definitely better in small doses.

[Dodginblue]

That brief flashback of Sasha made me realize how much this show benefited from her presence and how much it's hurting with her absence.   She could pull off bad-ass in a way that say, Tara for example really can't.  I also think Eugene's reaction standing there in front of the casket showed that he's not as self-centered and focused solely on his own survival as he kept spouting.  Also that he didn't rat out Dwight.

I thought Jadis taking those pics of Rick was maybe for the new year's calendar, Dump Hunks or something.  No, really I thought well maybe she's taking them because she plans to get them to Negan to show that she's got Rick.   But no, that might actually make some sort of sense.  Instead, it's for a sculpture, which is the second time that's been a part of a random story line  (Jesse's owl in the garage).  And when they brought out the walker, I thought they can't really be doing this again, it's the exact same thing the writers came up the first time Rick encountered these people.  It's such an insult!  They just don't care.

Funniest moment of the night:  Rick leading the Jadis group out, picking up the walkie talkie and oh, yeah, there's nobody's on the other end.  Rick, you want to keep your people on task, maybe don't drop out of sight to go and recruit a bunch of treacherous d-bags.

[rr2911]

O.k., so everyone seems to have hated yesterdays episode. Anyone here want to share an idea of what they think should've happened?

[ttgreif]

43 minutes ago, dwarmed said:

I thought it was Ace of Spades. 

ETA: @ttgreif You are right. I just rewatched that scene. Ah, TWD when it was still good. Merle offering his booze towards the walker on the other side of the window and the walker moving his mouth as if to drink it is pure gold. Not so far from my youth in the parking lot of a Motorhead concert. 

I think this was one of the best moments of the show regarding soundtrack.. Totally in the mood of the scene, almost "glued" to Merle breaking loose...

I wish times like these came back again on our TV screens -and speakers- instead of boring dialogues and never ending unsuccessful plans.

 

PS. Lemmy's not around anymore, Malcolm's keeping him company, Rick Parfitt from Status Quo (one of my favs) absent as well... These are  bad times for RnR indeed

Edited December 5, 2017 by ttgreif

[Prairie]

1 hour ago, AngelaHunter said:

Exactly. THAT is good writing. I can't remember the last time a movie or show had me roiled up to the extent that it was hard to breathe and got actual chills. I give credit not only to the writers for that amazing, tension-filled and gripping scene, but to Andrew Lincoln as well, for his portrayal of terror and desperation, all done without a word. I could cry thinking about that, and then looking at what this show has become - something that is more fun to mock than watch.

I could also cry about how bad it's become. I got into this show later, and binged watched seasons 1-5 and was OBSESSED. The past two seasons make me sad; I don't think there's any way to recover from this awful Negan storyline and have the show return to being really good again. I'm attached to a few of the characters though so I'll watch it through. I think I will anyway, even Rick is losing me lately.

Edited December 5, 2017 by Apricotte

[Dodginblue]

43 minutes ago, jackjill89 said:

Eugene sucks and always has. He is a straight-up coward and a horrible friend. The only time he showed one ounce of having even half a ball was when he drove the RV as a decoy for the group when they took Maggie into the woods. Of course, he was caught in about 30 seconds, but it seemed like he finally understood what it meant to be part of a group. Well, he sold that out as soon as his butt was on the line. I don't care if he saves them all. I hate his character, always have and always will. What a sniveling waste of space. 

He also saved Tara and tried to lure the walkers away from the door where Glen and Noah were trapped, on that supply run with the ASZers, the episode where Noah got killed.  And he went out and joined the fight when the walkers invaded ASZ.  

Edited December 5, 2017 by Dodginblue

[peach]

4 hours ago, ghoulina said:

Amen. Merle was a great example of a character that was, for the most part, a terrible human being, but still incredibly entertaining. And then they were able to redeem him in a totally plausible way, without dragging the entire story out. 

The show has lost its touch. They can no longer craft complex and interesting characters, especially the "bad guys". It's all so over the top and underwhelming. The Claimers were in just a few episodes and they scared the shit out of me. I remember being completely on edge when Rick was trying to get out of that house. RICK. Who you KNOW isn't going to die. But that's how well done it was. Negan has never evoked the same sort of response in me. Not even close. 

One of my favorite episodes is when Daryl went off with Merle, and they had that confrontation in the woods about when Merle left home, and left Daryl to be abused by their father.  My God.  The characterization for both of them.  And in the end, Daryl went "home."  And Merle followed him for a change.   And Daryl was right about the Yellowjacket River for a nice little detail at the end. 

[Dobian]

Yay another episode built around Eugene, a character we all love.  With an extra dose of Tara thrown in.  Great job, show.  Please make the mid season finale a day in the life of Gregory.

 

"Okay Jadis, you betrayed me and then shot me, then you threw me naked into a shipping container, then you tried to feed me to a walker, then you tried to shoot me again.  For the last time, do we or do we not have a deal?"

 

This show's logic completely baffles me.  If Dwight wants Negan dead so much, he has a gun, go walk into his office and shoot him.  What does that have to do with stopping Eugene from TRYING TO SAVE ALL YOUR LIVES?

Edited December 5, 2017 by Dobian

[Iris987]

9 hours ago, AngelaHunter said:

This is another thing that highlights these no-talent writers. They give supporting/secondary characters whole episodes of their own - Beth, Tara - why, I will never figure out -  and now Eugene, and the minor quirks or characteristics that make them interesting or funny in tiny doses become unbearable. Beth and Tara (their real names elude me ATM) just weren't and aren't nearly good enough actors or interesting enough characters to pull this off and Eugene is rendered even more ridiculous and cartoonish.

Exactly. Alannah Mastersons acting makes me want to put my fist through a wall. I don't understand why they insist on keeping this character. She's useless. Her "very special episode" last year made me stop watching regularly. And yet she's been in almost every episode this season.

[FishyJoe]

So Rick singlehandedly beats the garbage people with his hands tied behind his back and he wants them to fight for him. They have to be the worst fighters ever.

And then he just takes their word for it after he makes a deal. Like they never betrayed them and they are completely trustworthy. You know, they people who say they take. These are the people you trust AGAIN.

[BetyBee]

2 hours ago, ttgreif said:

Am I the only one that thinks Dwight speaking  sounds too much "Rick" in his speeches versus Eugene or not?

btw Eugene talking is getting "it's all so greek to me" more and more every  week...

I think so too.  Dwight's actions and speech are so much like Rick's!

[Gobi]

10 hours ago, DEL901 said:

It's like they crossed with the show "24" and are playing things out in real time:  24-Walking Dead edition

I think it's two days, the prisoners at Hillside were kept outside the walls during nighttime of the first day.

[Dodginblue]

1 hour ago, Dobian said:

This show's logic completely baffles me.  If Dwight wants Negan dead so much, he has a gun, go walk into his office and shoot him.  What does that have to do with stopping Eugene from TRYING TO SAVE ALL YOUR LIVES?

I guess Dwight is as focused on surviving as Eugene is and if he did that one of the Negan lieutenants would take him out.  

[Dobian]

3 hours ago, Iris987 said:

Exactly. Alannah Mastersons acting makes me want to put my fist through a wall. I don't understand why they insist on keeping this character. She's useless. Her "very special episode" last year made me stop watching regularly. And yet she's been in almost every episode this season.

The Church of Scientology must be paying off Gimple lol.  What the writers fail to grasp is this is NOT a strong ensemble show.  MASH was a strong ensemble show.  Game of Thrones is a strong ensemble show.  TWD is a show with a few good characters and actors with a lot of second and third rate filler.

[AngelaHunter]

14 minutes ago, Dobian said:

TWD is a show with a few good characters and actors with a lot of second and third rate filler.

I don't even know who I would call a good actor. I thought Gregory was, until I saw he has only two affects and expressions - frightened and/or conniving. Andrew Lincoln is only really good when he's being threatening, domineering or crazy. When he's trying to be placating, cajoling or *shudder* romantic, he sucks big time. The worst example of this was his big cringe-worthy 'I don't want you to die" speech to Jessie. He actually sounded brain-damaged.

[Dodginblue]

9 minutes ago, AngelaHunter said:

I don't even know who I would call a good actor. I thought Gregory was, until I saw he has only two affects and expressions - frightened and/or conniving. Andrew Lincoln is only really good when he's being threatening, domineering or crazy. When he's trying to be placating, cajoling or *shudder* romantic, he sucks big time. The worst example of this was his big cringe-worthy 'I don't want you to die" speech to Jessie. He actually sounded brain-damaged.

I think given the genre, which is sci-fi/horror and the material, which of late has been pretty mediocre, there have been some fairly good performances.   But I think that mostly of the characters who have been ordinary people, especially in the earlier seasons, and not  so much the cartoonish ones, like Ezekiel and his henchmen or the dump crowd or Negan. 

 I think the best acting was turned in by Jon Bernthal (Shane) and it's no surprise to me that he's gone on to a lot of other projects, feature films, TV, etc.  He's featured on Netflix right now in The Punisher.    I think Herschel (Scott Wilson) was well done and of course Michael Rooker as Merle and I thought Tovah Feldshuh (Deanna) did a good job with her role.  Those are all established actors so it's probably not a surprise.   Some of the actors I didn't know before this show, like Sonequa Martin-Green (Sasha) and Steven Yuen (Glen) I think were very good with what they were given.