S08.R04: Surprise

[CaliforniaLove]

Quote

Jenelle at least treats her men well. She's not the world's greatest mom but she does seem to be the type of parent who her kids can talk to about anything when theyre older and the type that will be supportive of whatever they wanna do w/their life, instead of constantly nagging them with criticisms and demanding expectations.

Just curious...what have you seen that would lead you to believe any of this?

[GreatKazu]

2 hours ago, poopchute said:

I remember him being all pissed that Jo wanted to spend Father's Day with Isaac because they planned a vacation for the same time. And another time where they all met to discuss child support and I believe Jo said it didn't concern Javi and he got all rude saying how he was going to be involved in those decisions. Oh and when he forbid Kail from speaking to Jo on their own property. And wasn't he the one filming with a cell phone when Kail was screaming at Jo for wearing sweatpants in his own home? I could be wrong on that last one.  I'm sure there are more examples than this.

That vacation was earned by Kail for selling that Scentsy crap. The company was sending her to Bahamas for her sales, but it was set up at a particular time for all the Scentsy sales people who had earned that trip. It wasn't that Kail set up the trip. She had no control over the dates. Just wanted to clarify. 

Yes, Javi was a dick many times. I do believe a lot of that was because of Kail manipulating him. She told him bullshit stories about Jo the way Jenelle tells her dicks about Barb being a bad mother. Once someone startsup with that kind of manipulating behavior, the person starts to believe their partner is speaking the truth while at the same time they feel they better side with them or else face their wrath. 

3 hours ago, BitterApple said:

I agree with the comments about Javi. Kail is a miserable hosebeast and that PFA was bullshit, but if I were in her shoes I wouldn't want my ex showing up at my house and harassing me via text either. I understand Javi has every right to feel angry and betrayed, but there's not much he can do about it now. The divorce is final, and if Kail doesn't want to communicate with him beyond discussing Lincoln, then that's her right. 

I am deeply bothered that someone can accuse someone of harassing them via texts, get a restraining order on them, and then that same person can try and provoke that person. Snarking on him and dragging him into her social media pond scum is her way to try and instigate and harass him. She knows anytime she mentions Javi, her minions will gang up on him. She uses those minions to harass Javi. She is the one stalking and following his every move. It leads me to question who is the real perpetrator here. I don't appreciate bitches who cry abuse, acquire a restraining order, and then go harass the person they claim was abusive to them.  

I do think in these kind of cases it is best if people are restrained FROM EACH OTHER and should be ordered to only communicate about the children, nothing more. It is unfair to make it one-sided when clearly the real perpetrator and the abuser is abusing the system. 

24 minutes ago, SheTalksShit said:

 

Kail is a selfish bitch and got more and more distant and cold towards Javi with each passing season, but I think that's at least partly bc of how Javi reacts to her. 

I believe because he felt his wife was not being faithful to him. His reactions were based partly on what his wife was doing outside their home. 

[poopchute]

7 minutes ago, GreatKazu said:

That vacation was earned by Kail for selling that Scentsy crap. The company was sending her to Bahamas for her sales, but it was set up at a particular time for all the Scentsy sales people who had earned that trip. It wasn't that Kail set up the trip. She had no control over the dates. Just wanted to clarify. 

Ok I forgot about that piece.  They kept calling it "family vacation" as if it was a trip they planned in advance and Jo was ruining it.  I hate everyone involved.

[ReadMeLattice]

3 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

See - with this, I mean it was HIS HOUSE too until Kail pulled his whole life out from under him.  He went away for work and came home to no wife, no house, only seeing his son(s) here and there, at the whims of a crazy person.  Everything that is precious to him, everything he loves is snatched away.  I would flip the f out too, if for no other reason than the fact that my life has been emptied of everything I love.  Just because Kail wanted a new dude.  FUCK HER, he can pour a drink in his former house, from his former fridge.

I agree to an extent but there are kids involved. The drink pouring and hugs I totally get (and I think it's funny) but the showing up randomly is pretty strange imo. Isaac has to know something is wrong when that happens (and maybe Lincoln to a much lesser extent). I totally get the *impulse* to show up there and call her the fuck out, but actually doing it when children are around and you know there will be a fight makes it a lot more questionable from my perspective. Isaac is very sensitive and picks up on everything. Now Kailyn SHOULD be able to just meet up and talk maturely, but he knows by now that's simply not who she is. I agree with @GreatKazu that instead of "victims" and "perpetrators" when no abuse is going on, they should just not be meeting up or in contact except to discuss the children, ever.

Edited August 2, 2017 by Lm2162

[Snarky McSnarky]

On 8/1/2017 at 6:10 AM, ghoulina said:

There was a second episode on last night at 11E/10C. 

So they aired episode 3 at 8, that new Siesta Keys or whatever-the-fuck-it's-called at 9, and then episode 4 was at 10. 

 

It seems maybe a lot of people didn't realize there were two last night. 

Yea, me included.  Episode 3 had 1.6 million viewers.  Episode 4 only had 942,000.  My DVR didn't even record Episode 4, but that may be because it got bumped by something else.  Good thing they replay these shows a million times.

http://www.showbuzzdaily.com/articles/showbuzzdailys-top-150-monday-cable-originals-network-finals-7-31-2017.html

Edited August 2, 2017 by Snarky McSnarky
Added link.

[SimonSeymour]

That piece of crap "father" hasn't seen Nova since Christmas (I have no idea how long ago that was in terms of filming, but I would feel the same if he had seen her the day before), shows up six hours late, walks right past her  to plop down on the couch, WITHOUT EVEN STOPPING TO PICK HER UP TO HUG AND KISS HER?!!! 

RAGE!!!

Edited August 3, 2017 by SimonSeymour

[CaliforniaLove]

Quote

That piece of crap "father" hasn't seen Nova since Christmas (I have no idea how long ago that was in terms of filming, but I would feel the same if he had seen her the before), shows up six hours late, walks right past her  to plop down on the couch, WITHOUT EVEN  STOPPING TO PICK HER UP TO HUG AND KISS HER?!!! 

And the owl that he plopped down on the table wasn't that cute IMO. It looked like something off a Walgreen's clearance rack.

Was Devoid referring to Brittany or Nova as "shorty"? How stoned was he? Was he as stoned as Jenelle  & UBT appeared to be when they were on the couch (drink!) with Endtable?

[Mkay]

37 minutes ago, Snarky McSnarky said:

Yea, me included.  Episode 3 had 1.6 million viewers.  Episode 4 only had 942,000.  My DVR didn't even record Episode 4, but that may be because it got bumped by something else.  Good thing they replay these shows a million times.

http://www.showbuzzdaily.com/articles/showbuzzdailys-top-150-monday-cable-originals-network-finals-7-31-2017.html

I made a post to let everyone know. I expected them to be back to back, though. 

[MaggieG]

I don't care for the Dejesus coven, but Brittany gave me life with her epic stare to the camera as Devon walked in. I laughed and rewound it a few times. I also realized how much Nova resembles her father. 

[ghoulina]

19 hours ago, TexasGal said:

I was laughing so hard at Lincoln continuing to declare himself a genius.  "I don't want to be a shark.  I'm a genius" Dang Kail has some cute kids.

And then Kail said, "What am I going to do with you?" and Isaac offered, "Feed him to the sharks?" Bahahaha, totally something my kids would say. I LOVE Isaac and Lincoln together. 

 

19 hours ago, jenifaohjenny said:

Kail is giving Farrah and Jenelle a run for their money in the race for worst teen mom ever.

Oh, she's far surpassed Farrah in my eyes. Farrah can be a shitty mom, but she's only got one kid. Kail insists on bringing more and more kids into her shitty little world. 

 

13 hours ago, SheTalksShit said:

Jenelle at least treats her men well. She's not the world's greatest mom but she does seem to be the type of parent who her kids can talk to about anything when theyre older and the type that will be supportive of whatever they wanna do w/their life, instead of constantly nagging them with criticisms and demanding expectations. 

Are we even watching the same show? Jenelle has a record for getting into multiple physical fights with nearly all her boyfriends. She screams at them and accuses them of cheating. I don't feel any sympathy for the guys, they're all losers. But water seeks its own level. Jenelle and her dudes both treat each other like crap and are pretty abusive. 

I totally don't see her kids being able to talk to her about ANYTHING. Where would Jace get that impression, when he was handed over to his grandmother at only a few months old? Why would he think he can talk to her about anything, when she constantly asks him leading questions to illicit the answer SHE wants. And the fear in his eyes shows he knows he better do it. And Kaiser? That kid either has a hot dog in his mouth or is relegated to his crib. I don't know where HE would ever get the idea he can come to his mother with any of his problems. She IS his problem. 

[AbbyLee]

Not sure if anyone else feels this way - but I am so baffled as to why the mothers on the TM series always ask their 1, 2, 3, 4 year old kids what they should do... 'should mommy go back to school?' 'should we move to another state?' 'should mommy divorce daddy?' 'should mommy have more kids?'

Stop asking them these questions. They have no idea what you're asking and then you justify your actions by saying 'well the girlses said they would like a new house!' or 'Jace said he wants to stay with me' - no he doesnt have the heart to tell you he hates being at your crazy house, Jennelle. He goes home to Babs and is happy to have peace and routine. Stop putting your kids on the spot. Stop having them be your life coaches and therapists. Its hard to watch them talk to their kids about very adult situations and decisions when all they want is to have some normalcy. 

Please. Spare me. 

Edited August 2, 2017 by AbbyLee

[heatherchandler]

1 hour ago, CaliforniaLove said:

 

Was Devoid referring to Brittany or Nova as "shorty"? How stoned was he? Was he as stoned as Jenelle  & UBT appeared to be when they were on the couch (drink!) with Endtable?

I am LOVING this.

[ReadMeLattice]

44 minutes ago, AbbyLee said:

Not sure if anyone else feels this way - but I am so baffled as to why the mothers on the TM series always ask their 1, 2, 3, 4 year old kids what they should do... 'should mommy go back to school?' 'should we move to another state?' 'should mommy divorce daddy?' 'should mommy have more kids?'

Stop asking them these questions. They have no idea what you're asking and then you justify your actions by saying 'well the girlses said they would like a new house!' or 'Jace said he wants to stay with me' - no he doesnt have the heart to tell you he hates being at your crazy house, Jennelle. He goes home to Babs and is happy to have peace and routine. Stop putting your kids on the spot. Stop having them be your life coaches and therapists. Its hard to watch them talk to their kids about very adult situations and decisions when all they want is to have some normalcy. 

Please. Spare me. 

Also it makes no fucking sense!! All three DeJesuses were trying to convince Nova that adoption was the right choice for the new baby. She is FIVE. She has no idea what adoption even IS. What, is she going to debate the social, financial and political implications of adoption with you right now? She is in kindergarten!!! Apart from being creepy and traumatizing to the child, how is this useful to anyone? Let's ask her opinion on the election or the economy next and make our decisions based on what she says. 

Edited August 2, 2017 by Lm2162

[CaliforniaLove]

Quote

 

Was Devoid referring to Brittany or Nova as "shorty"? How stoned was he? Was he as stoned as Jenelle  & UBT appeared to be when they were on the couch (drink!) with Endtable?

I am LOVING this.

 

@Calm81 is responsible! I was too lazy to go back & find the source & I thought it was just what we were calling him now.  :-)

[Gyproselee]

I know this is nit picky but Janelle is wearing this thick, fur lined hooded coat on the coast! ! Even in December, Jan etc the average temp is 55 average low 35. Drives me nuts.

[SheTalksShit]

5 hours ago, GreatKazu said:

That vacation was earned by Kail for selling that Scentsy crap. The company was sending her to Bahamas for her sales, but it was set up at a particular time for all the Scentsy sales people who had earned that trip. It wasn't that Kail set up the trip. She had no control over the dates. Just wanted to clarify. 

Yes, Javi was a dick many times. I do believe a lot of that was because of Kail manipulating him. She told him bullshit stories about Jo the way Jenelle tells her dicks about Barb being a bad mother. Once someone startsup with that kind of manipulating behavior, the person starts to believe their partner is speaking the truth while at the same time they feel they better side with them or else face their wrath. 

I am deeply bothered that someone can accuse someone of harassing them via texts, get a restraining order on them, and then that same person can try and provoke that person. Snarking on him and dragging him into her social media pond scum is her way to try and instigate and harass him. She knows anytime she mentions Javi, her minions will gang up on him. She uses those minions to harass Javi. She is the one stalking and following his every move. It leads me to question who is the real perpetrator here. I don't appreciate bitches who cry abuse, acquire a restraining order, and then go harass the person they claim was abusive to them.  

I do think in these kind of cases it is best if people are restrained FROM EACH OTHER and should be ordered to only communicate about the children, nothing more. It is unfair to make it one-sided when clearly the real perpetrator and the abuser is abusing the system. 

I believe because he felt his wife was not being faithful to him. His reactions were based partly on what his wife was doing outside their home. 

Kail and Javi have long since put that behind them, tho and were apparently in contact and on good terms until recently, when Javi got a new gf who he seems to really like. So it's not like they haven't spoken since the PFA and Kail just stalks his social media and comments on him despite still claiming to be in fear of her life. 

Once Kail learned about Javi's plans to write that book, I think she did her best to make nice with him, especially after Chris ghosted her. And it worked...until Javi got a new gf. and I think anytime a new episode airs that brings back bad memories, that opens old wounds for Javi and makes Kail want to defend herself against the backlash she gets from fans. 

I agree that at least part of the way Javi behaved throughout the relationship is bc he believed Kail was being unfaithful to him. BUT at the same time, he tried to address this issue with her multiple times and she obviously didn't give a fuck. It didn't make her wanna put in more effort to make him feel secure, instead, it just further pushed her away (and to be fair, I think Javi's suspicions were more than likely correct). But it's like, if she doesn't give a fuck that you're insecure about it and basically just tells you "tough shit, this is who I am," you've got 2 options: accept it and stay or don't accept it and leave. Where Javi went wrong was he chose NOT to accept her shady and distant ways, but he still chose to stay, anyway, and continued to try to make her change her ways to his liking, thinking he could somehow make her eventually go back to the Kail he fell in love with at the beginning. But it was so obvious she was over it, I remember one episode where he went so far as to say he was done with her and leaving and going to a hotel and Kail didn't even try to stop him or get him to come home, she seemed relieved...until he came back a few hours later and announced he wants to work things out, without even bothering to ask if that's what she wanted, even tho the fact that she didn't ask him to come back or fight it when he left had to have been a hint to him. 

Javi was so caught up in trying to make things how he wanted them to be that he failed to see, face or accept the reality that was right in front of him. 

He couldn't accept that Kail was never going to be the wife and family-woman he wanted her to be.  He couldn't accept that she'd emotionally checked out of the relationship and kept trying to force her to check back in and relationships just don't work that way - you can't force someone to feel what you feel. He never got that. He had no respect or care for what she wanted or her feelings, it was all about what he wanted and what he felt. 

Edited August 2, 2017 by SheTalksShit

[BitterApple]

2 hours ago, AbbyLee said:

Not sure if anyone else feels this way - but I am so baffled as to why the mothers on the TM series always ask their 1, 2, 3, 4 year old kids what they should do... 'should mommy go back to school?' 'should we move to another state?' 'should mommy divorce daddy?' 'should mommy have more kids?'

Ugh, yes!!! Children should not be forced to weigh in on adult matters. Asking a child if she wants chicken or pork chops for dinner? Fine. Asking her if her unborn sister should be given up for adoption? Hell, no. It's so annoying because it's not like the kid's opinion has any real weight in the decision making, so why bother? It's especially horrible for Jace, who's constantly bullied about his living situation.

[CofCinci]

51 minutes ago, Gyproselee said:

I know this is nit picky but Janelle is wearing this thick, fur lined hooded coat on the coast! ! Even in December, Jan etc the average temp is 55 average low 35. Drives me nuts.

She is hiding bruises. 

[HeySandyStrange]

3 minutes ago, SheTalksShit said:

I agree that at least part of the way Javi behaved throughout the relationship is bc he believed Kail was being unfaithful to him. BUT at the same time, he tried to address this issue with her multiple times and she obviously didn't give a fuck. It didn't make her wanna put in more effort to make him feel secure, instead, it just further pushed her away (and to be fair, I think Javi's suspicions were more than likely correct). But it's like, if she doesn't give a fuck that you're insecure about it and basically just tells you "tough shit, this is who I am," you've got 2 options: accept it and stay or don't accept it and leave. Where Javi went wrong was he chose NOT to accept her shady and distant ways, but he still chose to stay, anyway, and continued to try to make her change her ways to his liking, thinking he could somehow make her eventually go back to the Kail he fell in love with at the beginning.

 Hindsight is 20/20, as they say. Javi was (and probably still is) hard-headed, immature and naïve. He had his blinders on in regards to Kail because of his love for his family and desire for the perfect home life. He didn't have the life experience or insight to know, as Kenny Rogers would say, when to hold 'em, when to fold 'em, when to walk away or when to run. If anything, their relationship is a case study in why you DON'T marry young to someone you hardly know. I hope that Javi at least learned from taking a trip through Kail's House of Horrors what he truly wants from a partner, what he can/should put up with and what he should and shouldn't do for his partner. I'm mostly relieved he hasn't rushed into another serious relationship or marriage, he can be pretty emotionally needy. I have hope, despite the fact he isn't the smartest or most confident, he'll wise up a bit and move on to better things.

[CofCinci]

RE: The PFA

When I was active duty, I knew of two couples that purposefully sought protective orders -- not because there was intimate partner violence -- but so that the deploying spouse would lose their security clearance and not be able to deploy.

I don't know what type of job Javi has in the Air Force, but it's interesting that he's worried about deployment -- this PFA happens and it doesn't look like he's deployed....

Just a thought. 

Edited August 2, 2017 by CofCinci

[MissMel]

6 hours ago, GreatKazu said:

I am deeply bothered that someone can accuse someone of harassing them via texts, get a restraining order on them, and then that same person can try and provoke that person.

I agree.  It's a lot more simple to just add the number to the block list if the texts bother you that bad.

[SheTalksShit]

On 8/1/2017 at 11:52 AM, Lm2162 said:

I will say that Aubree actually expressed herself pretty well and very clearly on *why* she was upset. She wasn't just throwing screaming fits. She was sad that Watson didn't smile at her and only smiled at her mom and Cole, so it's not only jealousy of her brother...she feels left out of the family. Then she pretty clearly stated that it hurts her that Chelsea and Cole sleep with Watson and she's by herself at night for bedtime, which absolutely must make her feel like a loner, all compounded by the fact that her bio dad doesn't live with them and this has made that extra "out there" and painful. It was all pretty transparent. I hope Chelsea got it together later or offscreen and empathized, because you can't get much more obvious than that. 

Yup, I think Aubreys smart and definitely more articulate than the average 7 year old. 

[nikita]

8 hours ago, SheTalksShit said:

that's the thing, tho. you can't dictate what's "nothing" to someone else, that's not for you to decide. 

Kail is a selfish bitch and got more and more distant and cold towards Javi with each passing season, but I think that's at least partly bc of how Javi reacts to her. He wants her to suck up her feelings for the sake of his feelings. Yes, it's nice of someone to do that for you, but you can't force them to or demand it. They either love and appreciate you enough to do it or they don't. Instead of getting that and either accepting it or leaving, Javi would try to force the situation to be what it wasn't and force her to be someone she's not. 

I think he fell in love with the Kail he was with at the beginning of their relationship and keeps trying to get that girl back, instead of just accepting that that's not who she really is, that's just how she seems until you get to know her. B/c i think he was in denial throughout most of the relationship and trying to force the situation to be what it once was. 

I can absolutely decide it's nothing when someone needed a spoon, I got them a spoon, and suddenly it was a HUGE fight because I gave them what they needed.

Also, it's not Javi's fault Kail misrepresented her entire self and personality to rope him in. Men in abusive relationships with cluster B women spend decades trying to get back "the real her," rarely getting to the point of understanding that wasn't the real her...that was a construct.

I get what you're saying, though. I just think we're coming at this from the flavor of very different experiences. If you've never had someone be abusive to you over nothing (and you know it's nothing), I'm glad. Because it sucks, and it's unfair.

And the "over nothing" thing isn't the worst part. It is the total inability to think of the other people in the situation and their work for and anticipation of the event. It's also the complete refusal to put the tantrum aside for the bigger picture.

Edited August 3, 2017 by nikita

[SheTalksShit]

I think Devon was brought back in to film to fill the token deadbeat Dad role, now that Adam's gone. 

I never watched teen mom 3, was he on it? 

[SheTalksShit]

1 hour ago, nikita said:

I can absolutely decide it's nothing when someone needed a spoon, I got them a spoon, and suddenly it was a HUGE fight because I gave them what they needed.

Also, it's not Javi's fault Kail misrepresented her entire self and personality to rope him in. Men in abusive relationships with cluster B women spend decades trying to get back "the real her," rarely getting to the point of understanding that wasn't the real her...that was a construct.

I get what you're saying, though. I just think we're coming at this from the flavor of very different experiences. If you've never had someone be abusive to you over nothing (and you know it's nothing), I'm glad. Because it sucks, and it's unfair.

And the "over nothing" thing isn't the worst part. It is the total inability to think of the other people in the situation and their work for and anticipation of the event. It's also the complete refusal to put the tantrum aside for the bigger picture.

I gotcha. I've never been abused the way Kail abused Javi, no. But I've definitely had guys who I feel coulda treated me better and made me feel like I just wasn't worth the effort to make it work. 

I do notice that the way I choose to respond to their hot-cold behavior greatly influences the amount of effort they make, tho. If I get all clingy when I feel them pulling away, they just pull further away and I end up feeling miserable and at the mercy of how much or little attention they give me. But if I respond by going cold and pulling away, too, they start to value me more and start making more effort. 

Bitching at them to pay more attention to me and sending them multiple texts in a row demanding they respond definitely doesn't give me what I want from them, tho. And it didn't give Javi what he wanted, either. 

[guilfoyleatpp]

7 hours ago, CaliforniaLove said:

And the owl that he plopped down on the table wasn't that cute IMO. It looked like something off a Walgreen's clearance rack.

Was Devoid referring to Brittany or Nova as "shorty"? How stoned was he? Was he as stoned as Jenelle  & UBT appeared to be when they were on the couch (drink!) with Endtable?

I thought he was stoned too.

And not even a damn hug.  What the hell?!

[SheTalksShit]

1 hour ago, guilfoyleatpp said:

I thought he was stoned too.

And not even a damn hug.  What the hell?!

True. He might be giving Adam a run for his money for the worst baby daddy of the franchise lol. 

did he grow up like that? Like was his dad a deadbeat, like he is? Bc it looked to me like he had no idea what to do with her. Like you said, he didn't even immediately greet her w a hug. Even Adam knew to do that. But I remember Chelsea saying Adam came from a good family, didn't grow up with a deadbeat Dad. So we know Adam knows better, was shown better. IDK if Devon does or was. 

& yeah I wouldn't be surprised if he was high. 

Edited August 3, 2017 by SheTalksShit

[Mr. Miner]

13 hours ago, Gyproselee said:

I know this is nit picky but Janelle is wearing this thick, fur lined hooded coat on the coast! ! Even in December, Jan etc the average temp is 55 average low 35. Drives me nuts.

Well, reptiles are cold blooded.

[Jeanne222]

11 hours ago, SheTalksShit said:

Yup, I think Aubreys smart and definitely more articulate than the average 7 year old. 

That was the sweetest conversation between Mother and Daughter.  Chelsea and Cole have given her lots of attention and you can tell Chelsea, of course, and Cole truly love her.  Aubrey IS loved but right now little Watson is in the way because he is a tiny baby and needs more.  I think as he grows Aubrey will get over this because he will steal her heart!   She's just doing attention getting things that siblings do when a new sibling enters the picture.

[CaliforniaLove]

Did Jenelle & UBT actually get engaged? All I heard was "Babe! Babe. Baaaaabe." "Babe????" "BABE!!!". It really highlighted how natural & unforced their relationship is. 

[heatherchandler]

15 hours ago, SheTalksShit said:

 

He couldn't accept that Kail was never going to be the wife and family-woman he wanted her to be.  He couldn't accept that she'd emotionally checked out of the relationship and kept trying to force her to check back in and relationships just don't work that way - you can't force someone to feel what you feel. He never got that. He had no respect or care for what she wanted or her feelings, it was all about what he wanted and what he felt. 

It's not like he started stalking her from afar, trying to force her to like him - she was his wife!  She told him she loved him, she was gaslighting him!  He wasn't delusional, she built a family with him and then one day decided to take it all away.  

He wasn't trying to force her to love him, he was confused about why she said she did love him one day and then did not love him the next.  

Kail's parents threw her out, treat her like trash, it is no wonder she does the same to other people.  

Edited August 3, 2017 by heatherchandler

[Mr. Miner]

The first time he got deployed and she had to watch the kids on her own, she bailed. She just wanted the military benefits anyway. Treated him like a total POS when he got home. She's disgusting to the core!

[CaughtOnTape]

So...while Kail has some issues and is extremely blind with regards to her own behavior, Javi gets no pass from me for his behavior.  He is not justified to demand answers and then show up at her house in order to have a screaming fight because she wouldn't answer.  In that respect, I agree with Kail's order of protection.  In so much as Javi has reacted like that in the past.  He gets pissed off and decides he's due answers and he comes over and bangs on the door in order to have it out with her with no thought for the fact that HIS CHILDREN are upstairs.  She's no paragon of virtue when it comes to parenting, but he's not much better.  Isaac is obviously understanding now that sometimes when Javi comes over it means an argument and it's scary for him.  For all Javi's "care" for "his boys" you would think he would recognize that and take it down to a 1 when his kids are around.

Javi is due some answers when it comes to who Kail has around his son, but he doesn't have the right to come over and scare the shit out of everyone while he yells and screams and pounds on the door.  Which he's done a couple times now.  There was a big difference between Jo's interaction with Kail where he seemingly got the answers he wanted and Javi's where she barely interacted with him and now has pushed a protection order.  Jo has learned to deal with her and Javi needs to do the same.  

I have no sympathy for Javi at all.  He saw what she did with Jo and he continued on without any trepidation thinking it was all Jo that was the problem.  He backed her up and in some instances pushed her into tweaking Jo's nose and now he wants to claim innocence?  Nope.  He needs to chill out, calm down and stop reacting to everything she does.  It's only causing her to dig her indignant heels in the sand and that's not healthy for his kids.

In some respects I get Kail's irritation towards him.  He's very entitled when it comes to her.  She could be nicer about it, sure.  But he walks in that house and starts grabbing at things and asking her questions and it's clear she's over it.  They aren't married anymore and they aren't friends.  There is still a lot of hurt and pain between them and it seems like he wants to go from 0-60 in six seconds with her.  Please with the "Javi just wants to know about who's around his kids" crap.  Javi wants to know so he can judge and insult.  If he was so damn worried about  who and what was going on around his kid he'd think twice before rolling up to her house and getting into screaming arguments in front of him.  Javi decides he's due answers so he sends her text messages one after another and then ends it with telling her he's coming over to her house.  I mean, Kail is rude as hell but she is a girl who lives alone with two boys she is responsible for.  Any male continuously text message me in anger like that and then show up at my door would be facing the face of my extremely protective and irritated German Shepard who doesn't let anyone near me unless he says so.  

From where I sit, Kail is within her rights to get a protective order against him.  He has no impulse control and he's about as self-aware as she is.  When Javi's pissed off, it doesn't matter who's around or who he humiliates.  He wants to rant and rave like a six year old in a grocery store who didn't get his candy bar.  Kail's behavior does not negate his.  He is an adult and a father and he needs to knock it off and start acting like it.

[MissMel]

10 hours ago, SheTalksShit said:

True. He might be giving Adam a run for his money for the worst baby daddy of the franchise lol. 

did he grow up like that? Like was his dad a deadbeat, like he is? Bc it looked to me like he had no idea what to do with her. Like you said, he didn't even immediately greet her w a hug. Even Adam knew to do that. But I remember Chelsea saying Adam came from a good family, didn't grow up with a deadbeat Dad. So we know Adam knows better, was shown better. IDK if Devon does or was. 

& yeah I wouldn't be surprised if he was high. 

Going off just memory, which might not be 100% these days, yes.  His dad was there.  They had a baby shower and the coven could not stop talking about how well off this family was and how much Bri did a good job by at least picking a financially stable family to get knocked up by.  It was gross.  Devoin is his own demon but these chicks saw dollar signs.  Again, it was gross in my opinion.  

And if these 3 fools really meant to play that card?  They went about it all wrong.  I got the feeling Nova could have been living like a rockstar and these 3 could sell her closet for cash, if they wanted to.  But no.  They had to be the man hating witches from jump and Devoin's family kicked them all to the curb.  I'm seriously sorry for the ridiculously cutie-batootie Nova.  She's surrounded by idiots and assholes.

[poopchute]

53 minutes ago, CaughtOnTape said:

he doesn't have the right to come over and scare the shit out of everyone while he yells and screams and pounds on the door.

He was probably confused because he witnessed Kail screaming and yelling and upsetting her kids when she was at Jo's door, so he probably didn't anticipate her having a problem with it since that is how she has communicated in the past.

[CaughtOnTape]

9 minutes ago, poopchute said:

He was probably confused because he witnessed Kail screaming and yelling and upsetting her kids when she was at Jo's door, so he probably didn't anticipate her having a problem with it since that is how she has communicated in the past.

Last time I checked, two wrongs don't make a right.  Javi is an adult and is responsible for his own behavior.

[SheTalksShit]

1 hour ago, heatherchandler said:

It's not like he started stalking her from afar, trying to force her to like him - she was his wife!  She told him she loved him, she was gaslighting him!  He wasn't delusional, she built a family with him and then one day decided to take it all away.  

He wasn't trying to force her to love him, he was confused about why she said she did love him one day and then did not love him the next.  

Kail's parents threw her out, treat her like trash, it is no wonder she does the same to other people.  

I didnt say he stalked her or was delusional. But I didn't see constant hot and cold from Kail to Javi. What I saw was someone who went from hot at the beginning to slowly but surely cooling off, getting colder and colder until it finally reached ice-cold. what I saw was, in one episode, someone who didn't even try to stop him when he said it was over and was going to spend the night in a hotel. When he changed his mind and came back 2 hours later, she did not seem happy to see him. She seemed disappointed and annoyed that she didn't have a way out anymore. 

1 hour ago, MissMel said:

Going off just memory, which might not be 100% these days, yes.  His dad was there.  They had a baby shower and the coven could not stop talking about how well off this family was and how much Bri did a good job by at least picking a financially stable family to get knocked up by.  It was gross.  Devoin is his own demon but these chicks saw dollar signs.  Again, it was gross in my opinion.  

And if these 3 fools really meant to play that card?  They went about it all wrong.  I got the feeling Nova could have been living like a rockstar and these 3 could sell her closet for cash, if they wanted to.  But no.  They had to be the man hating witches from jump and Devoin's family kicked them all to the curb.  I'm seriously sorry for the ridiculously cutie-batootie Nova.  She's surrounded by idiots and assholes.

Oh damn. So her family basically ruined it for her? 

[Kellyee]

Quote

Jenelle at least treats her men well. She's not the world's greatest mom but she does seem to be the type of parent who her kids can talk to about anything when theyre older and the type that will be supportive of whatever they wanna do w/their life, instead of constantly nagging them with criticisms and demanding expectations.

Long term, I suspect Jenelle will be the same type of mother as Kail's mother, and as Catelynn's mother from Teen Mom OG. It is all about Jenelle, all the time. You never see her stop and consider how her children feel or what is really best for them. The only time she defends her kids is when she's doing to it to screw with one of her baby daddies or with her mother. She has no patience for Kaiser. As creepy as David is, he appears to be more the primary parent to Kaiser than Jenelle is. If the cameras weren't around, I suspect Kaiser would be living with either Barb or Nathan's mom.

Of all the mothers on all the Teen Mom shows, I think Jenelle might really be the worst.

Does Breanna do anything, like go to school or work or anything?? We never see her actually doing anything or pretending to do anything.

[GreatKazu]

2 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

It's not like he started stalking her from afar, trying to force her to like him - she was his wife!  She told him she loved him, she was gaslighting him!  He wasn't delusional, she built a family with him and then one day decided to take it all away.  

He wasn't trying to force her to love him, he was confused about why she said she did love him one day and then did not love him the next.  

Kail's parents threw her out, treat her like trash, it is no wonder she does the same to other people.  

Thank you.

@SheTalksShit Let's not forget Kail was trying to get back with Javi back in November when she was with Chris Lopez. At the very least, she was playing the part as if they were working on their marriage per Javi's comments in an interview.  Talk about dicking someone around, Kail was lliterally and figuratively dicking around with Jav's emotions. This continued until the Christmas holidays. That was around the time she found out she was pregnant. Kail is such a gaslighting bitch, who knows what she was up to by doing that to Javi. This was before the filming of the marriage boot camp show, I believe. Some speculated she was trying to be nice to Javi just so he would do the marriage show. Some think she wasn't getting a commitment from Chris and she needed to have a back-up guy. Some have thought she was just playing both guys and trying to lock one of them down to be the father of her baby. Who knows. This is Kail. Anything she does, she does for altruistic reasons. Just like getting pregnant on purpose with this trap baby because she claimed her eggs were drying up. That shit still makes me laugh. 

Quote

Kail is within her rights to get a protective order against him

I saw many of these kind of people in my old days working as a paralegal. They'd get restraining orders and then they thought that gave them the right to instigate a situation because that piece of paper protected them while they could harass the other person. I understand where you are coming from with your comments, and I am the first one who will admit I couldn't wait for Javi to suffer the consequences and wrath of Kail when we declared Kail would one day divorce his ass. Javi couldn't see what he was doing to Jo and I wanted him to one day be in Jo's shoes. Well, that day has come. I just don't like that the poor children are caught up in the middle of this drama. It is not healthy for them. Kail is not healthy-minded for them. Javi needs to realize he is dealing with an irrational and quick-tempered person. That person is now stalking his social media for altruistic reasons. She is tweeting comments while tagging his twitter page. She is stirring the pot. She is trying to get him to react so she can then make that call when he snaps. 

Kail has always been the kind of person who just has to dig and dig until she gets a reaction from someone. She did that to Jo during sweatpantsgate. And for what? Kail did the same thing when she and Javi met up to discuss visitation. She began to criticize his choice of clothing. I am guessing Kail was mocked at school for her clothing choices and now she thinks she can do the same. I don't know. My point is, Kail is clearly the unstable one and Javi needs to realize that and not let her get the best of him. The best revenge is being happy and enjoying his life. That seems to be upsetting to Kail because why else bother with what the guy is doing in his private life? Let's see how long before she dictates that Isaac cannot be around Javi's girlfriend. Three, two, one...

[Mkay]

It may be my hatred for Kail blinding me (I'm no fan of Javi, trust me) but I don't remember Javi yelling at Kail in front of the kids once they have divorced.  Kail is the one yelling. I could see Isaac being upset when Kavi pulls up because he knows mom is going to start yelling again.  

[zenme]

Yeah.  I don't think Javi's doing too much of the yelling from what we've seen. 

Actually, I must make a confession.  I do find it rather irritating when Javi comes into the house and goes into the fridge to get a drink.  Don't get me wrong, I'm a gracious host, however, when Javi does it it's almost like he's trying to establish it's still his house and he can do whatever the hell he wants. Hmm...maybe he's trying to see if Chris lives there. Like, "Why are there lemon-lime gatorades in fridge, when Kailyn and I detest lemon lime gatorade?" "Whose are these bread and butter pickles?  We never buy these."  I wonder if Kailyn added that information as part of protective order, "...also, Javi comes in and goes into my refrigerator without asking." 

[GreatKazu]

I forgot to add, Kail's version of any events, ALWAYS gets a side-eye from me. No credibility.  I'd love to give her the benefit of the doubt such as editing or her having to deal with utter bullshit, but this is her pattern. We saw it play out with Jo when she accused him of DV when it was HER who put her hulk hands on him. She was the one who was eventually court-ordered to attend anger-management. We then watched her assault Javi on camera when there were minor children in the house who heard it all go down. Those children were her friends' children who happened to be visiting that day. 

Not to imply Kail made this whole thing up, I just have a hard time imagining she had no role in what went down during that texting. 

1 hour ago, Mkay said:

It may be my hatred for Kail blinding me (I'm no fan of Javi, trust me) but I don't remember Javi yelling at Kail in front of the kids once they have divorced.  Kail is the one yelling. I could see Isaac being upset when Kavi pulls up because he knows mom is going to start yelling again.  

Right. She also threatened to call the cops the first time. Isaac is scared FOR Javi, not out of fear for his mother being harmed. 

[Jeanne222]

Isaac has a very sensitive nature.  Lincoln is only starting to realize what is going on.  Jo says nothing because she is letting him off on the child support and he does not work.  Kail is a super slut with a big mouth and some MTV money.  Whatever did she see in Chris Lopez?  He's one ugly dude. 

Javi is the one I feel sorry for.  He always tried to tame the beast and he always treated Isaac as good as Lincoln.

Came home from deployment and found a very different Kail with Lopez in HIS bed and no longer able to have a home.  That's a lot for a guy.  I'm kind of surprised he didn't go crazier. 

[BitterApple]

2 hours ago, SheTalksShit said:

 

Oh damn. So her family basically ruined it for her? 

Devoin was a disinterested loser from the start. As awful as the Coven can be, they did give him the opportunity to be part of Nova's life and only went gangbusters on him when he refused to step up. IIRC, Roxanne was just asking him to help out with basic stuff, like baby supplies, and he couldn't even do that. They could've rolled out the red carpet for him and he still would've found an excuse to bail.

[GreatKazu]

12 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

Devoin was a disinterested loser from the start. As awful as the Coven can be, they did give him the opportunity to be part of Nova's life and only went gangbusters on him when he refused to step up. IIRC, Roxanne was just asking him to help out with basic stuff, like baby supplies, and he couldn't even do that. They could've rolled out the red carpet for him and he still would've found an excuse to bail.

Word. 

Even now, he can't even muster the energy or the love to hug his child after walking into her home. He just sits on his ass on her couch. 

@Jeanne222 Jo pays child support. That has never been an issue. What Kail wanted was MORE money so she could put Isaac in private school. Jo has the same job as Kail - 11th Street Productions. 

[Jeanne222]

15 minutes ago, GreatKazu said:

Word. 

Even now, he can't even muster the energy or the love to hug his child after walking into her home. He just sits on his ass on her couch. 

@Jeanne222 Jo pays child support. That has never been an issue. What Kail wanted was MORE money so she could put Isaac in private school. Jo has the same job as Kail - 11th Street Productions. 

Oh thank you.  I guess maybe I was wrong.  I remember she wanted something and I thought it was 'any' child support.  What will they all do when this gig is over?  I wonder how much the new gal Brianna is making compared to the salaries of the original four.  For some reason I always think the girls think they are really something and their demands might make them lose the show if the new gals catch on.

[ghoulina]

5 hours ago, CaliforniaLove said:

Did Jenelle & UBT actually get engaged? All I heard was "Babe! Babe. Baaaaabe." "Babe????" "BABE!!!". It really highlighted how natural & unforced their relationship is. 

Their double babes drive me nuts. Could you be anymore basic and unoriginal? 

[CaughtOnTape]

2 hours ago, GreatKazu said:

I saw many of these kind of people in my old days working as a paralegal. They'd get restraining orders and then they thought that gave them the right to instigate a situation because that piece of paper protected them while they could harass the other person. I understand where you are coming from with your comments, and I am the first one who will admit I couldn't wait for Javi to suffer the consequences and wrath of Kail when we declared Kail would one day divorce his ass. Javi couldn't see what he was doing to Jo and I wanted him to one day be in Jo's shoes. Well, that day has come. I just don't like that the poor children are caught up in the middle of this drama. It is not healthy for them. Kail is not healthy-minded for them. Javi needs to realize he is dealing with an irrational and quick-tempered person. That person is now stalking his social media for altruistic reasons. She is tweeting comments while tagging his twitter page. She is stirring the pot. She is trying to get him to react so she can then make that call when he snaps. 

Kail has always been the kind of person who just has to dig and dig until she gets a reaction from someone. She did that to Jo during sweatpantsgate. And for what? Kail did the same thing when she and Javi met up to discuss visitation. She began to criticize his choice of clothing. I am guessing Kail was mocked at school for her clothing choices and now she thinks she can do the same. I don't know. My point is, Kail is clearly the unstable one and Javi needs to realize that and not let her get the best of him. The best revenge is being happy and enjoying his life. That seems to be upsetting to Kail because why else bother with what the guy is doing in his private life? Let's see how long before she dictates that Isaac cannot be around Javi's girlfriend. Three, two, one...

From what I see he does as much digging as she does.  He knows damn well she doesn't like it when he walks into the house and starts asking her questions and raiding the refrigerator....yet, what does he do?  And when she makes a comment, he smiles because he got his little charge out of pissing her off.  He then sits down and asks her questions about where she's going and what she's doing.  Knowing full well how she's going to respond.  And I guess I'll need him to explain to me what his altruistic end game is for texting her to demand answers about who she's dating and then showing up at her house.  It was clear he didn't want to sit down and have a calm discussion about the pros and cons of this guy being around his kid.  He wanted to fight, tell her she was a slut for getting pregnant again and start making insults about her choices in men, hence the threat to show up at her house.  

I'm not defending Kail.  She's rude and mean for small reasons, but she's not the only one at fault in this relationship hitting the toilet.  I really don't see Javi as being the poor, put upon ex-husband who just doesn't understand why she's always so pissed off.  He knows what sets her off, he tweaks her nose constantly in an effort to get her to react.  They both do it.

Twitter has a blocking feature, as does every other social media platform (I've had an online stalker who tried to drag me into bullshit constantly.  I blocked her and kept my mouth shut until it stopped).  He enjoys the drama just as much as she does.  It's become a sick game of "Who can hurt the other one the worst?" between them.  

All I'm saying is I'm seeing a lot of feeling sorry for Javi and just....no.  Nope.  He's as much at fault for their back and forth as she is.  He needs to take a note from Jo.  Jo finally realized he wasn't going to win so he shut his mouth and stopped allowing her to drag him into the drama.  I think Jo thinks she's fucking insane, makes shitty choices and isn't the greatest mother...but the courts are involved in their relationship now and if he wants to see his son, then he needs to be a grownup.  Javi hasn't learned the lesson yet.  Hopefully he does soon.  Let her look like the asshole, stay out of it and keep your mouth shut.  

[mrsh]

On 8/1/2017 at 11:46 PM, SheTalksShit said:

Sometimes, I think ALL of the ppl on this show use the "it's concern for my child" or "it's what's best for my child" as an excuse for simply doing what they want to do and this episode, I think Javi did it. I can tell he truly loves his son and is genuinely a good dad - both on and off-camera, he's no Adam or Devon, he's no fake-family-man BUT he didn't send Kail 10 angry texts in a row and then angrily show up at her door, uninvited and unwelcome, bc he's concerned about his son. He did that because he was hurt and FURIOUS with Kail and felt insulted and betrayed that, after divorcing him AND telling him she didn't want anymore kids, she's now pregnant by this new dude. This was not about Lincoln, this was about Javi. I'm not even saying I blame him, Kail's selfish and fucked-up behavior is infuriating even to those of us who don't know her, so I can only imagine what it's like to be on the receiving end of it. But it's such an eye-roll to me when people use their kid or any other bullshit as an explanation that's so obviously not the real reason. Just own it, Javi, you were hurt, angry and felt betrayed, you're human...we understand. 

I do think there's a side of Javi that the cameras haven't fully seen yet, though. Not a violent side, but definitely a side of him that doesn't respect Kail's boundaries. I see it in little ways, like how he just comes in the house and goes through her fridge and laughs it off when she very clearly tells him to not to and continues to go through it and pour himself a drink, then proceeds to make himself at home, plops down on her couch, even though it's clear Kail wants him to leave. 

Another time I can think of, off the top of my head, is when they had a day trip planned and Kail got pissed at him and said, "Take me home," several times. Despite this, he did not turn around and continued to drive and said, "no, i'm not taking you home," and she said, "i really don't wanna do this today," and he said, "I don't care," and continued to drive on. It wasn't until she said, "I was never excited," and the tire blew out (so they were forced to go home) that he respected her wishes. 

And now, we hear that he shows up at Kail's door, despite being specifically told he's not welcome, to do or say god-knows-what, argue and yell at her?? 

He gets so caught up in his own feelings and is completely dismissive to what she wants or feels and just continues to try to force things to be how he wants and I think this drives Kail NUTS and that's why she's so harsh and blunt with him, sometimes, bc she feels like if she has to be in order for him to get through to him. 

I didn't get it before but after watching this episode, something clicked for me...I get it. 

He's not a bad guy, to be clear, but I can see why he and Kail weren't compatible at all. 

Did Javi really send her all those texts though? And did he really show up at her door? Where is the proof that any of this happened besides Kailyn saying that it did? She is a known liar and I can believe maybe Javi texted her once or twice asking to talk to her about her pregnancy, since it does impact Lincoln. Karl, as usual doesn't care about anyone except herself and felt attacked, so she made up this story to claim that she felt afraid and get the PDA. Just like she did to Jo, when she was mad at him for upgrading to Vee.

[poopchute]

4 hours ago, CaughtOnTape said:

Last time I checked, two wrongs don't make a right.  Javi is an adult and is responsible for his own behavior.

Oh I didn't say he wasn't responsible, just thinking of why he probably thought it was fine to yell and scream on someone else's property since he videotaped his own wife doing it first.