S06.E07: Episode 7

[Calvada]

6 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

I don't think so.  I thought it would have improved the story a great deal if they showed that Susan was just a generally normal, otherwise happy baby who happened to have deformities on her hands and feet.  Instead, she just sat there in most scenes with a blank look on her face.  Don't get me wrong, I understand they are dealing with infants who can't act on cue, but I think my comment stands. 

I thought it was good acting by the child!  Turned over to strangers to be poked and prodded - I wouldn't have been smiling much either.  Of course, if it had been really true to life, she probably would have kicked up a fuss about being taken from her parents.

[Kohola3]

Gosh, my first thought was what absolutely gorgeous blue eyes she had, so big!  And they certainly picked a laid back kid.  I would imagine a film set would be quite chaotic and she was calm and quiet.  I don't think her eyes were overly expressive but I think of dead eyes as quite evil  (think Kody Brown in Sister Wives).  

[MissLucas]

On 15.5.2017 at 2:39 PM, angora said:

Wow, what a difference another perspective makes!  I'd previously heard about the hospital in Roehampton in connection to thalidomide, in this poem/rap written by Mat Fraser, an actor/musician/writer who was affected by thalidomide, and his view of the hospital couldn't be more different.  In the poem, he talks about feeling like the artificial limbs were more about aesthetics than function, something to make the children look more "normal," and that limbs and fingers the kids could functionally use were sometimes amputated to help the (in his mind, all but useless) artificial limbs fit better.  As such, as soon as Dr. Turner said Roehampton to the Mulluckses, I was bracing myself and waiting for the other shoe to drop.

Yes, I remember documentaries about Contergan kids as adults on German tv (Contergan was the German name for thalidomide) and this was mentioned a couple of times. Many of them hated the prosthetic limbs, ditched them as soon as they were able to decide for themselves and found different coping skills, insisting that they wanted to accept their bodies the way they were and deal with them on their own terms.

But I wouldn't hold it against all people back then - they tried to help as best as they could* and for them that meant making these kids seem 'normal' instead of challenging the concept of 'normal' as we are more likely to do today. I'm sure in a generation or two plenty of things we think are beneficial will be frowned upon as well.

*At least I hope so and believe it was the case for the majority of people working in that field - but that does not mean that the cold-hearted bastards he describes in his poem who saw the kids as lab-rats did not exist as well.

Edited May 16, 2017 by MissLucas

[Kohola3]

4 minutes ago, MissLucas said:

But I wouldn't hold it against the people back then - they tried to help as best as they could and for them that meant making these kids seem 'normal' instead of challenging the concept of 'normal' as we are more likely to do today.

Nice perspective.  They were truly doing what they thought was best.  And, let's face it, people can be cruel and that continues to this day.  Even adults stare at anyone who doesn't fit what they feel is "normal" including fat people, little people, amputees, etc.

[PRgal]

31 minutes ago, MissLucas said:

 

But I wouldn't hold it against all people back then - they tried to help as best as they could* and for them that meant making these kids seem 'normal' instead of challenging the concept of 'normal' as we are more likely to do today. I'm sure in a generation or two plenty of things we think are beneficial will be frowned upon as well.

*At least I hope so and believe it was the case for the majority of people working in that field - but that does not mean that the cold-hearted bastards he describes in his poem who saw the kids as lab-rats did not exist as well.

Hell, people are like that even THIS CENTURY!  I once spoke with a woman who taught hearing impaired kids.  When I mentioned that I have 70% loss in one of my ears, she asked me why I wasn't wearing a hearing aid in that ear.  Well, because I compensate with my working ear?  And if I wore one, I'd probably feel like I'm hearing a metal band?  I was born that way, and I make it work, thank you very much. 

Note:  This was about 10 years ago.  I SURELY hope she's not like this anymore

[NeverLate]

1 hour ago, Kohola3 said:

Gosh, my first thought was what absolutely gorgeous blue eyes she had, so big!  And they certainly picked a laid back kid.  I would imagine a film set would be quite chaotic and she was calm and quiet.  I don't think her eyes were overly expressive but I think of dead eyes as quite evil  (think Kody Brown in Sister Wives).  

She was beautiful. Susan is beautiful. 

[txhorns79]

Quote

Hell, people are like that even THIS CENTURY!  I once spoke with a woman who taught hearing impaired kids.  When I mentioned that I have 70% loss in one of my ears, she asked me why I wasn't wearing a hearing aid in that ear.  Well, because I compensate with my working ear?  And if I wore one, I'd probably feel like I'm hearing a metal band?  I was born that way, and I make it work, thank you very much. 

I don't know.  It doesn't sound like the question was asked with the intent to offend anyone.  I think that is really the key in any situation.              

[SunnyBeBe]

My question about the car being driven by Sister Crane wasn't intended to focus on her just being cranky, but, her reasoning.  I was just wondering HOW she expected Sister Winfred to have driven the car to the call, IF THE CAR WAS ALREADY THERE.  It was sitting outside as they exited the apt building after the delivery of the baby.  So, since it was there, Sister Winfred couldn't have driven it to the call.  Sister Crane had already done that.  Did I miss something? 

Edited May 16, 2017 by SunnyBeBe

[Brattinella]

23 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

I don't know.  It doesn't sound like the question was asked with the intent to offend anyone.  I think that is really the key in any situation.              

True.  But some people will get offended at just about anything.  The iggy feature comes in handy at those times.

[jschoolgirl]

The child playing Susan was also wearing one hell of a costume, and she handled that really well!

[txhorns79]

Quote

My question about the car being driven by Sister Crane wasn't intended to focus on her just being cranky, but, her reasoning.  I was just wondering HOW she expected Sister Winfred to have driven the car to the call, IF THE CAR WAS ALREADY THERE.  It was sitting outside as they exited the apt building after the delivery of the baby.  So, since it was there, Sister Winfred couldn't have driven it to the call.  Sister Crane had already done that.  Did I miss something?

I don't think you did.  It wasn't clear to me what Nurse Crane was talking about, or how she expected Sister Winifred to drive anywhere when Nurse Crane is the only person with a car.  But I think that also goes back to what someone else mentioned about it not being clear why Sister Winifred needed to learn to drive when there is no car she can use.  And honestly, Phyllis doesn't seem like she would be keen on lending her car out to the other midwives. 

[Driad]

They may have chosen a laid-back child to play Susan because it would be easier on her and everyone else if she didn't get upset with the unfamiliar situations. When Susan was reunited with her sister and brother, I was a bit disappointed that she did not look pleased to see them. Wouldn't it be typical for the child actors to be introduced off screen and have a little fun together, so they would be glad to see each other again? (The sister and brother looked old enough to take direction, but Susan did not.)

[SunnyBeBe]

I thought the little actress playing Susan was so lovely.  I also thought that the actors who played the children's parents did an incredible job.  Just superb acting, imo. 

[SweePea59]

Were there any other deleted scenes other than the ones concerning bassoon love?

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

After Birth: She Doesn't Need To Go Anywhere Where We Can't Go Too

Rhoda Mullucks tries to help her daughter Susan start growing up, only to be obstructed by everyone from the local nursery school headmistress to Rhoda's own dumb husband.

[tljgator]

It wasn't the most engaging episode (I didn't even sniffle, much less sob, like I usually do), and I agree with those who found the Susan actor lovely, but slightly wooden in her performance. As a former oboe player, though, my greatest sadness is clearly the loss of the "bassoon love" scene.  (Also, I'm here for the repeated use of the term "bassoon love" -- for no other reason than it makes me smile. Double-reeds FTW, y'all.)

[AnnieBeez]

11 hours ago, Calvada said:

I thought it was good acting by the child!  Turned over to strangers to be poked and prodded - I wouldn't have been smiling much either.  Of course, if it had been really true to life, she probably would have kicked up a fuss about being taken from her parents.

But she didn't smile when she saw her family again either. I wouldn't say "dead eyes" but she did just have one expression. Kind of serious and glum. 

[Kohola3]

But they were not her family. They were actors. Perhaps if it had been her real parents she would have been more animated. It is pretty difficult to direct a small child. They do what they do!

[txhorns79]

Quote

But they were not her family. They were actors. Perhaps if it had been her real parents she would have been more animated. It is pretty difficult to direct a small child. They do what they do!

That's true.  The takes they got with her sitting there looking blank may have been the best ones they got.   

Edited May 17, 2017 by txhorns79

[AnnieBeez]

7 hours ago, Kohola3 said:

But they were not her family. They were actors. Perhaps if it had been her real parents she would have been more animated. It is pretty difficult to direct a small child. They do what they do!

I've seen "acting" babies and toddlers smile. I think a mom or someone might be off-camera. My Aged Parent also mentioned it when she called the other night. She was wondering why she was so inexpressive and just solemn-looking. 

[JudyObscure]

Perfectly fair comment,  but I imagine once Susan had her arms locked down by the plastic-arm-jacket, she was in a bit of a shock.  They may have needed to get her scenes done quickly before she started crying.

[Kohola3]

I can't imagine too many toddlers in lock down like that who wouldn't be raising the roof!  They are lucky they got what they got.

[OtterMommy]

On 5/16/2017 at 7:51 AM, jschoolgirl said:

The child playing Susan was also wearing one hell of a costume, and she handled that really well!

It almost looked to me like there was some element of CGI involved with her.

[Mrs Shibbles]

I thought this episode was touching, especially the parents of the thalidomide babies, but the auto accident was so heavily foreshadowed that it felt a little silly.  

Mom:  "make sure you only play on the play street with no cars"

I was just waiting for one of the kids the kid to run in front of the car, but figured it would be when Sister Winnifred was driving.

[kieyra]

5 hours ago, OtterMommy said:

It almost looked to me like there was some element of CGI involved with her.

I remember asking about it when it aired in the U.K. (Might be earlier in this same thread.) To my not-great eye it looks like a combo of CG and practical effects. I believe someone mentioned a behind-the-scenes thing about the practical effects (prosthetics/costumes) they used. 

I can go with the theory that they had to cast an uber chill kid who would tolerate the costume. IIRC you can tell she's in afull body costume in one scene because she turns her head to look at something, but everything from the neck down remains immobile. Like a little Dalek, heh.

[OtterMommy]

Just now, kieyra said:

I remember asking about it when it aired in the U.K. (Might be earlier in this same thread.) To my not-great eye it looks like a combo of CG and practical effects. I believe someone mentioned a behind-the-scenes thing about the practical effects (prosthetics/costumes) they used. 

I can go with the theory that they had to cast an uber chill kid who would tolerate the costume. IIRC you can tell she's in afull body costume in one scene because she turns her head to look at something, but everything from the neck down remains immobile. Like a little Dalek, heh.

For me, there was just something about her hands that just didn't match everything else on the screen--like they stood out a bit too much (you know, like it was CGI).  Who knows....maybe I was seeing things that weren't there....

[kieyra]

Just now, OtterMommy said:

For me, there was just something about her hands that just didn't match everything else on the screen--like they stood out a bit too much (you know, like it was CGI).  Who knows....maybe I was seeing things that weren't there....

If you mean her "real" in-show (affected by thalidomide) hands, and not the in-show wooden prosthetics--I don't know what respectful word to use here, "malformed" I guess? Differently-formed? It's way too late for me to be navigating these waters--ANYWAY, I believe the visible, thalidomide-affected *appendages* have been CG. Mostly based on the fact that I'm not sure how else they'd do it, and I assume basic CG is getting affordable even for the U.K. period drama industry. 

That took me way too long to type. If someone had warned me I was going to lose half my vocabulary in my 40s, I would have made better use of it in the past.

[OtterMommy]

11 minutes ago, kieyra said:

If you mean her "real" in-show (affected by thalidomide) hands, and not the in-show wooden prosthetics--I don't know what respectful word to use here, "malformed" I guess? Differently-formed? It's way too late for me to be navigating these waters--ANYWAY, I believe the visible, thalidomide-affected *appendages* have been CG. Mostly based on the fact that I'm not sure how else they'd do it, and I assume basic CG is getting affordable even for the U.K. period drama industry. 

That took me way too long to type. If someone had warned me I was going to lose half my vocabulary in my 40s, I would have made better use of it in the past.

Yes!  That is what I meant (and, yeah, the vocab is hard).  

[Hudson0325]

There's been a lot of talk about Sister MJ and those who love her and those she annoys. Me, I go back and forth on her. There are so many times - most times I have to say - when I get very frustrated with her and find her highly unlikeable. I particularly remember the incident I believe from season 2 where she decided she didn't want a TB shot and pretended to be locked in the bathroom. Poor Fred had to climb up on a rickety ladder on which he could have broken his neck. He still ended up tumbling head first through the bathroom window and was lucky not to have injured himself while MJ just sat there grinning like a Cheshire Cat. Damn I was angry at her then. There have been other times where she has come off like a greedy or petulant child. But every time I find myself really done with her, she shows a wise and understanding side of herself that touches me. One time was when Sister MC was attacked and MJ so gently and lovingly bathed her. Another time was this past episode when she understood Nurse Crane's fears and helped her get out to do her job. MJ can be a right pain in the arse most of the time but then she always seems to know when her better angel is needed.

[Driad]

Fred was fixing bicycles when Winifred needed to take the gas to Phyllis and the laboring mom. Did Fred have all the bicycles taken apart? Would have been better planning to fix one at a time, so there would be at least one available to ride.

[Fireball]

I thought this was one of the better episodes (Phillis's crisis & the Thalidomide story's were well done); however, saying that I also thought the episode had too much going on.

There was the Thalidomide story which had a number of parts to it (the Patrick & Shelagh scenes, the parents of Susan arguing scenes, the hospital scenes, the scenes between Rhoda & Lydia, & the support group scene) then we have Nurse Crane's crisis (police station scenes, Phillis feeling guilty scenes, Barbara & Tom trying to make Phillis feel better scenes, Sister MJ helping Phillis over come her fears scenes), Sister Winifred & the driving not wanting to drive scenes, Shelagh & her pregnancy scenes, the interracial couple and the racism that their kids had to endure scenes, Trixie's love woes scenes, Trixie's getting ready for her date scenes. It was all just to much. I honestly feel like we didn't need the Trixie drama in this episode. We could have had a scene showing that maybe the relationship wasn't 100% ok and then returned to the issue in the next episode, but for me it was just to many things going on in the episode. 

On ‎3‎/‎7‎/‎2017 at 2:58 PM, GinnyMars said:

Timothy's "bassoon of love" was a welcome addition to their storyline.

I'm disappointed they cut this scene which I know sounds odd considering I thought there was to much going on in the episode. But they could have gotten rid of one of Trixie's getting ready for her date scenes. The painting the nails and the picking out the dress scene both portrayed the same thing "Trixie's really into the dentist"!  

On ‎5‎/‎14‎/‎2017 at 10:37 PM, LittleIggy said:

Yeah, I wondered why a six year old would be wearing an expensive silk scarf and perfume! ;-)

I also was wondering about the scarf. The whole I have a daughter doesn't really explain the expensive scarf and perfume. I guess the mother could have let the 6 year old wear her scarf, but it doesn't really work for me.

On ‎5‎/‎15‎/‎2017 at 8:02 AM, BusyOctober said:

A very small point in such a good drama, but it's one of those nitpicks that makes my brain churn...Trixie always looks like a million bucks, but I need to know.  How does she afford so many of those dresses and fashionable clothes?  She isn't from a wealthy family. 

I don't really know how Trixie pays for all her dresses, make-up, hair products etc. I've also wondered why Trixie seems to have more disposable income compared to the other nurses. 

On ‎5‎/‎15‎/‎2017 at 0:21 PM, jschoolgirl said:

I've wondered about the clothes, too. Maybe Trixie is a good secondhand shopper.

If this was anyone else I'd agree that they could be good secondhand shoppers, but this is Trixie who doesn't like anything used. It was also implied that Trixie had Fred's cousin make her dresses for her. Barbara said something along the lines of Trixie highly recommended you when she was getting that blue dress made.

[anna0852]

The original book had Jennifer Worth referencing that gorgeous fabric could be bought for very cheap and that having clothing made was significantly less expensive than off the rack.

[Clanstarling]

On 3/6/2017 at 4:32 PM, OnceSane said:

Not the bucket of tears usually invoked, but I definitely teared up in spots.

Just the opposite for me. Well, more like, this one choked me up worse than usual.

On 3/7/2017 at 1:58 PM, GinnyMars said:

Valerie's comment about secrets that can get you prosecuted made me wonder if she could be a potential gay-lady replacement for Patsy if she doesn't come back (I avoid spoilers and casting news, so that's just speculation).

The thought passed my mind.

On 5/15/2017 at 5:25 PM, Brattinella said:

The thalidomide stories break my heart.  I was born approx the same time as these babies, and my mother took another drug, DES, due to having multiple miscarriages.  Turns out it can cause cancer and sterility in the babies born.  The FDA and I assume, NHS, do not do their due diligence even now.  They let new drugs be sold willy-nilly until they get sued for damages.  SMH.

Fortunately my mother was in the care of an old fashioned midwife, and didn't take Thalidomide or DES. On the other hand, she smoked like a chimney, as did everyone around her.

On 5/15/2017 at 6:23 PM, F. M. said:

I didn't see temper, I also think in her own way she's pretty fragile..

And if things go really well between them, she'd also be moving into a step-mother role which is pretty daunting for anyone, especially a recovering alcoholic. For all that Trixie's a wonderful midwife, I can't recall her being particularly into children in general.

Edited May 19, 2017 by Clanstarling

[dcalley]

On 5/16/2017 at 2:26 AM, Brookside said:

I think she eats fish because I believe in an earlier scene she told Celia she didn't think she could take any more fish. So, even though there were kippers, Celia kindly made her an egg.  (I think it was Celia not Trixie, but could well be wrong.

Sister Winifred made Nurse Crane the egg. I wouldn't have remembered who it was had it been anyone else,* but it was the only other person in the car at the time of the accident.

*Well, maybe Sister Monica Joan, because she should not be cooking!

[RedbirdNelly]

I loved the episode

*loved that they have returned to Susan's story more than once and with new angles--the dad reacting and realizing that was how others saw Susan, etc. Often we get one and done and I think the follow up here has been really wonderful. 

* Nurse Crane breaking down in the bathroom was just done perfectly. I agree with others that the acting her was top notch. You saw the life drain from her and I just felt for her so much. I loved Sr. Juliane going with her to the police station. It's exactly what she would do.

* Sr Monica Joan rocked in this episode. I loved her bit about "Nonnatus House. Not a midwife speaking" not being reassuring and her appropriate pushes to get Nurse Crane back at it. Offering to go with her etc. Just lovely. I love when they have her get what people are feeling. I also loved getting to see her assist with the birth. Just a bit of an insight to her past years as a midwife. 

* I also have wondered how Trixie has such nice clothes and never seems to repeat anything. It seems a bit off--If I didn't know her background I would assume that she grew up rich, unlike her coworkers. But I love what she puts together and will just go with she's a sharp bargain shopper who is very into clothes. 

I regret that they cut the Timothy scene. It sounded wonderful.