S05.E05: Dreams Die First

[Mick Lady]

Bates Motel Dreams Die First

Norman attempts to piece together Mother's movements. In Seattle, Dylan and Emma confront an ugly truth, while Sam's girlfriend, Marion, makes a spur-of-the-moment decision with far-reaching consequences.

[Chaos Theory]

Sometimes the best moments are watching Norman's reaction to the things Mother has done in his absence.  Apparently she likes bars and men.  Heh.

And we have Psycho sighting. Marion..Money and a stormy night.

[Calibabydolly]

I do not think Rhianna is a very good actress at all. I don't know why she was chosen for the part of Marion Crane? She doesn't seem to fit in with the quality of actors and actresses we have on this show. Anyone else have any feelings about her? I am underwhelmed to say the least!

[Evie]

So Mother has been picking up men in bars? I didn't see that coming.

Emma and Dylan's happy bubble burst hard. Cries. 

I would be excited about entering Psycho territory, but Rihanna as Marion didn't work for me.

[Mick Lady]

Rhianna was horrible! Such a let down considering the rest of the cast.

[DarkCrystal]

1 hour ago, Calibabydolly said:

I do not think Rhianna is a very good actress at all. I don't know why she was chosen for the part of Marion Crane? She doesn't seem to fit in with the quality of actors and actresses we have on this show. Anyone else have any feelings about her? I am underwhelmed to say the least!

I totally agree.  What a mistake to pick her for the part.  

[thuganomics85]

So, at long last, Rihanna is here as Marion Crane and she's....... honestly, not all that good.  Not the worst ever or anything, but there were definitely moments where I felt she was pretty rough, and it was obvious that she was inexperienced.  Especially whenever she interacting with other characters, where I thought Austin Nicholas and Raphael Sbarge (going against type and playing someone scummy!), easily outacted her.  I get that she is a fan and I like the idea of getting someone famous to play her, but I just wished they went with someone more experience.  Oh, well, assuming

Spoiler

this follows Psycho, she won't be around for much longer!

Loved seeing Dr. Edwards again.  I like that he really is concern about Norman, and wants to help him (even if that would end up very badly for him, I suspect!)  

So, Norman not only finds out that he is still becoming Norma, but he finds out that she has been going to bars and hooking up with men. That would definitely be a shocker for anyone!  Freddie Highmore continues to be killing it this season.

Oh, boy!  Dylan and Emma's fun family times has finally come to an end!  Dylan finally confesses that the earring actually belonged to Emma's mother and he is worried that Norman did something to her, which understandably freaks Emma out.  But then she goes snooping on the internet and finds out that Norma is dead!  This is so going to lead to them going back, right?!  Nooo!!  Stay it Seattle, you two!

No Romero, but Nestor Carbonell did directing duty again, which was cool.

New sheriff is so onto Norman.

Norman finally tells Madeline about Sam, which causes her to freak out at him, but then she confronts Sam at the end, so I'm sure she always suspected on some level that he was unfaithful.

[Cotypubby]

Marion works for R.A. Bloch Realty. Heh.

Add me as another who was let down by the quality of Rihanna's acting so far. Even if they really felt they needed to get a "name" to play the role, I'm sure there are numerous others who would have done it. She just did not seem to fit in with the rest of the show.

Norman-as-Norma hooking up with random guys at a gay bar, that I did not see coming!

I fear the new sheriff is going to take the place of Arbogast.

Edited March 21, 2017 by Cotypubby

[Mick Lady]

4 minutes ago, Cotypubby said:

Marion works for R.A. Bloch Realty. Heh.

Add me as another who was let down by the quality of Rihanna's acting so far. Even if they really felt they needed to get a "name" to play the role, I'm sure there are numerous others who would have done it. She just did not seem to fit in with the rest of the show.

Norman-as-Norma hooking up with random guys at a gay bar, that I did not see coming!

I didn't notice Bloch Realty! How cool? Thanks!

[RedMal]

I've been waiting for them to get to the Psycho portion of the story since the beginning. Even when Cuse and Ehrin stated that they wouldn't be remaking the film, I kept my hopes up. And if they wouldn't make it in the show, I hoped we would get a movie remake with the same cast and crew.

But now that they started to remake the film in a way, I'm not sure how to feel about it. It all just feels so tacked on and lacklustery. Or maybe it's just because of Rihanna. I was afraid she would be a disaster in the role, and even though she's much better than I expected, her acting was still just average at best. With a cast so strong, I don't see any reason they would get Rihanna to play such an iconic and important character.

[Spartan Girl]

So Norman finally realizes just how insane he has become. Too little too late.

Not sure how I feel about Rhianna but Sam is officially the biggest scumbag for leading Marion on. At least she doesn't know she's been hooking up with a married man, and she's about to die because of it.

[BooBear]

38 minutes ago, RedMal said:

But now that they started to remake the film in a way, I'm not sure how to feel about it. It all just feels so tacked on and lacklustery. Or maybe it's just because of Rihanna. I was afraid she would be a disaster in the role, and even though she's much better than I expected, her acting was still just average at best. With a cast so strong, I don't see any reason they would get Rihanna to play such an iconic and important character.

I wasn't happy. Rihanna was terrible and sorry she is not as pretty as Sam Loomis' wife. Sweety if you want to be taken seriously at work don't wear so much cleavage I have to worry about a wardrobe malfunction and also, don't wear clothing so tight that you have to keep pulling your outfit down. 

Also, not sure, but did they change the story so Marion didn't know that Sam was married? I thought in Psycho she did. 

Overall what concerned me is that the rain storm in Psycho was so tense and had something special to it. Here is was almost literally the most flat way it could be told and intrusive too because it was all in one episode (probably due to Rianna's requirements) where this story should have been spread out over the year in small bits. 

Everything about Norman was spellbinding. Sad for him when he was with the doctor and sad for him when it became clear he was living a double life. 

One quick question though -- who watches the motel when he is out? 

Dylan and Emma will totally be the ones that find Norma and end this whole thing. 

[Bec]

The actress playing Madeleine was totally channeling Norma when she yelled at Norman to "GET OUT!" of her car.

[skotnikov]

8 hours ago, Calibabydolly said:

I do not think Rhianna is a very good actress at all. I don't know why she was chosen for the part of Marion Crane? She doesn't seem to fit in with the quality of actors and actresses we have on this show. Anyone else have any feelings about her? I am underwhelmed to say the least!

Probably for the same reason Gaga was a part of the AHS. It's hype, fans who'll stream/buy/watch for her etc. 

[mwell345]

Little tidbit from the Vulture recap: "While Marion is fleeing the big city for a life with Sam Loomis, she’s pulled over by a cop, played in a cameo by Carlton Cuse himself."

The recap also refers to this being a sort of nod to Alfred Hitchcock who had cameos in many of his movies.

http://www.vulture.com/2017/03/bates-motel-recap-season-5-episode-5.html

[luna1122]

My heart broke for Norman as he sat with the doctor at the coffee shop. Poor, sick, murdering Norman--it's a hard thing to do to make you feel sympathy and sadness for a killer, but Highmore--who has improved so significantly over the years--sells it so well. He lets his eyes tell the story. That scene was kind of devastating. As was the scene at the bar, when he began to realize the extent to which Norma has taken over his mind and body---that he's picking up men in bars and having sex with them in parking lots, and apparently has been long enough for just about everyone in that bar to know him well, as "Norma"...he played it like he'd been gut-punched, which I'd imagine is what it would have felt like. I didn't actually see that one coming.

Also devastating was the pretty sparkly life of Emma and Dylan breaking. It's still hard for me to believe that neither of them had googled any info back home before now, but at least Emma finally did, and now it's all going to go to hell. I hated their fight, it was so hard to see.

I didn't hate Rhianna, but she's not a strong enough actor to be on this particular show. She looked good, but yeah, the almost constant 'reminder' of how hot she was by every male in her world was overkill, especially when Madeline is prettier than she is. Sam, who will always be weaselly Spencer from WD to me, is again such a weasel, but man, he's cute. It's weird, I didn't really find him attractive on WD, mostly cuz of his character or lack thereof, but he is just as big--more, actually--a douchebag here, but he's so handsome. Was Sam Loomis married in the movie? Can't remember.

I saw in the credits that Carleton Cuse was actually ON the show last nite, thanx for confirming he was the cop. Fun Hitchcockian thing to do.

[Chaos Theory]

Norman is at this point easy to feel sorry for.  Yes he is killing people but it is not out of any sense of malice.  He is sick not evil.   If he accepted the help that was offered to him just once.  If he allowed himself to heal even if he never accepted that he was the one who killed his mother.  Hell if he moved out of that damned motel.  

Bates Motel has always felt like a tragedy to me.  It's only this season where we are heading into the horror story.

[Chicago Redshirt]

On Rhianna, I know the name but wouldn't recognize her in a lineup. I thought she was meh, but then again, it's not like original Marion put on an acting clinic IMO. All the part requires is that an attractive woman steals a bunch of money, winds up at the motel, takes a shower and gets killed. I'm sure Rhianna can do that alright. Maybe her mediocrity stands out because pretty much everyone on the TV show is above average as actors to excellent, whereas really only Anthony Perkins was in the movie.  Marion's talk about replacing Janet and getting a promotion had to be a meta comment about people who are likely to be upset about Rhianna taking the part made famous by Janet Leigh.  

I don't remember if the original Psycho had escaping discrimination as one of Marion's motivating factors or what. I do think making Marion black gives her more reason to be nervous about being stopped by a cop. 

This is only like the second episode where Norma had no dialogue, right? She/Vera were missed.

My one wish for the show is that Emma survives. I'm operating under the assumption that she and Dylan are going to replace Marion's sister and whoever the guy was as survivors of Norman's rampage from the original.

[RedMal]

2 hours ago, skotnikov said:

Probably for the same reason Gaga was a part of the AHS. It's hype, fans who'll stream/buy/watch for her etc. 

Yeah, probably, but I find it to be little too late now, since it's the final season. They don't really need to pull wider audience at this point, since they can't be cancelled anymore.

4 hours ago, BooBear said:

Also, not sure, but did they change the story so Marion didn't know that Sam was married? I thought in Psycho she did.

Sam wasn't married in the film, or at least it wasn't mentioned if he was.

[FlickerToAFlame]

I didn't put it together until this episode that both Norman's father and Madeline's husband are named Sam. 

[OSM Mom]

The wheels are really coming off Norman's life now, aren't they?  You can see him struggling with everything and unable to help himself. 

I also thought Rhianna was meh. I've seen worse acting, but I think someone else would have been better in the role. 

And thanks to all for confirming my hunch that the policeman was Carlton Cuse. 

Poor Emma and Dylan. Just let it go, Emma. Stay with Dylan and be happy and raise your beautiful daughter. Don't go back to White Pine Bay. Just don't. 

Edited March 21, 2017 by OSM Mom

[Gizmo321]

I thought for sure the new sheriff gave Norman a real glass for his water was so she could run his prints and get some DNA as well.

Nestor did a great job directing this episode, he's got a good eye. 

And with each piece of new intel Norman collected I thought for sure Mother was going to show up. I think his first stop once inside the house is going to be the basement freezer to confront what else he knows to be true. Though I suspect Marion's arrival may delay that trip.

While we all know that at least Dylan comes back to White Pine Bay....I hope the rest of his new family stays put.

Only 5 more episodes. I will truly miss this show when it's over, but I am enjoying every minute of the journey til we get there.

Edited March 21, 2017 by Gizmo321

[peacheslatour]

2 hours ago, RedMal said:

Yeah, probably, but I find it to be little too late now, since it's the final season. They don't really need to pull wider audience at this point, since they can't be cancelled anymore.

Sam wasn't married in the film, or at least it wasn't mentioned if he was.

Sam was divorced in the film. In the scene where she and Sam meet in a hotel room, right before she goes back to the office they discuss marriage and he says he can't marry her until he pays off his father's debts and his ex remarries. When he mentions sending his ex alimony checks every month she famously says "I'll lick the stamps" which I kept expecting Rihanna to say.

[Peanut6711]

10 hours ago, Cotypubby said:

I fear the new sheriff is going to take the place of Arbogast.

Me too! I wished they'd have at least called her Sheriff Arbogast.

6 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

Not sure how I feel about Rhianna but Sam is officially the biggest scumbag for leading Marion on. At least she doesn't know she's been hooking up with a married man, and she's about to die because of it.

I'm still on the fence about Rhianna too. I'm also on the fence about the change in Sam's characterization from the film to the show. I guess I'll just have to see how it plays out if the change benefits the overall story.  What I'm not on the fence about is Carlton Cuse's cameo. Having just rewatched the original on AMC before last night's episode I can undoubtedly say he'd didn't pull off the role as well as the cop in the film. 

6 hours ago, BooBear said:

Also, not sure, but did they change the story so Marion didn't know that Sam was married? I thought in Psycho she did. 

She knew he was divorced in the film. 

2 hours ago, RedMal said:

Sam wasn't married in the film, or at least it wasn't mentioned if he was.

Sam was divorced in the film. His alimony payments were one of the reasons he didn't want to get married (to Marian) yet.

48 minutes ago, Gizmo321 said:

I thought for sure the new sheriff gave normal a real glass for his water was so she could run his prints and get some DNA as well.

Me too!

Edited March 21, 2017 by Peanut6711

[smorbie]

11 hours ago, Cotypubby said:

Marion works for R.A. Bloch Realty. Heh.

Add me as another who was let down by the quality of Rihanna's acting so far. Even if they really felt they needed to get a "name" to play the role, I'm sure there are numerous others who would have done it. She just did not seem to fit in with the rest of the show.

Norman-as-Norma hooking up with random guys at a gay bar, that I did not see coming!

I fear the new sheriff is going to take the place of Arbogast.

I hate to admit that it took me till this morning sometime to figure out the White Horse was a gay bar.

7 hours ago, BooBear said:

I wasn't happy. Rihanna was terrible and sorry she is not as pretty as Sam Loomis' wife. Sweety if you want to be taken seriously at work don't wear so much cleavage I have to worry about a wardrobe malfunction and also, don't wear clothing so tight that you have to keep pulling your outfit down. 

Also, not sure, but did they change the story so Marion didn't know that Sam was married? I thought in Psycho she did. 

Overall what concerned me is that the rain storm in Psycho was so tense and had something special to it. Here is was almost literally the most flat way it could be told and intrusive too because it was all in one episode (probably due to Rianna's requirements) where this story should have been spread out over the year in small bits. 

Everything about Norman was spellbinding. Sad for him when he was with the doctor and sad for him when it became clear he was living a double life. 

One quick question though -- who watches the motel when he is out? 

Dylan and Emma will totally be the ones that find Norma and end this whole thing. 

Norma takes care of things when he's away.

7 hours ago, Bec said:

The actress playing Madeleine was totally channeling Norma when she yelled at Norman to "GET OUT!" of her car.

Norma would have gotten out, walked around the car, and pulled him out.  She did it twice before.

[smorbie]

3 hours ago, RedMal said:

Yeah, probably, but I find it to be little too late now, since it's the final season. They don't really need to pull wider audience at this point, since they can't be cancelled anymore.

Sam wasn't married in the film, or at least it wasn't mentioned if he was.

It's been awhile since I've seen it, but I think he couldn't afford a divorce in the movie because of all the debt he had.  Remember, they were sneaking around in motels in the movie, too.

[Stringey]

11 hours ago, Cotypubby said:

Marion works for R.A. Bloch Realty. Heh.

Add me as another who was let down by the quality of Rihanna's acting so far. Even if they really felt they needed to get a "name" to play the role, I'm sure there are numerous others who would have done it. She just did not seem to fit in with the rest of the show.

Norman-as-Norma hooking up with random guys at a gay bar, that I did not see coming!

I fear the new sheriff is going to take the place of Arboga

Hey isnt it awkward when your mother  personality is the one in the driver seat and goes to bars and picks up random men. And then the Norman personality comes back and thinks oh no why is this guy pawing me. Lol that was a cool sub plot they added.

[Peanut6711]

Was anyone else perplexed by Marion driving an expensive looking red convertible sports car following a scene where she all but begs for a promotion or a raise? 

[Irritable]

The stunt casting of Rhianna really took me out of the story, I'm so sad to say.   She really tried, I know she did her best, but, no.  This series has been nearly perfection for me until that one casting decision.  It's so unnecessary on a show of this caliber, at the end of its run.  I like her work as a musical artist, and hoped she would be convincing enough here not to be a distraction, but alas.

My heart cracks a little more every week, and it's going to break all the way through when this is finally over.  Well done, everyone ... except for well-meaning and Rhianna and whoever hired her. 

Quote

Was anyone else perplexed by Marion driving an expensive looking red convertible sports car following a scene where she all but begs for a promotion or a raise? 

In the movie, Marion buys a new car so she can have a better chance at a getaway.  I can't remember if she traded in her own car for it, or used some of the stolen cash.  It was actually a very tense scene, she was a nervous wreck at the car dealership.  Not sure if that is what happened here, though, and they decided not to show the purchase, assuming we all knew from the movie how she got it.

Was the officer that pulled Marion over an actor that was from the movie?  He looked familiar to me, and I wondered if he was the man who had played the original Sam, or Arbogast.

Edited March 21, 2017 by Irritable

[RedMal]

7 minutes ago, Irritable said:

Was the officer that pulled Marion over an actor that was from the movie?  He looked familiar to me, and I wondered if he was the man who had played the original Sam, or Arbogast.

He was Carlton Cuse, the creator of the show.

[Peanut6711]

42 minutes ago, Irritable said:

In the movie, Marion buys a new car so she can have a better chance at a getaway.  I can't remember if she traded in her own car for it, or used some of the stolen cash.  It was actually a very tense scene, she was a nervous wreck at the car dealership.  Not sure if that is what happened here, though, and they decided not to show the purchase, assuming we all knew from the movie how she got it.

In the film, she traded in her own car and paid the difference ($700) with the money/cash she'd stolen.  Neither car was sporty though.   I'm assuming last night that the show didn't skip a trade-in scene since we saw Marion load up the car from her house. Plus, she'd have to be an idiot to buy a bright red, flashy sports car in an attempt to go unnoticed. LOL Not that I ever understood how Marion planned on getting away with stealing a boatload of cash easily trailing back to her.

Incidentally, gotta love inflation. In the original movie Marion steels $40,000. Last night it was $400,000.

Nice nod though to the original film when Norman is driving through town and his psychiatrist spots him and does a double take. This mimicked the scene with Marion leaving town and being seen by her boss. 

Edited March 21, 2017 by Peanut6711

[islandgal140]

Lawd Gawd! Norman in Norma drag must have been the life of the party down at the White Horse bar because half the place was like

  --- AAAA

 when he walked in.

Okay, so am I the only one who is clutching the pearls and still gasping over Norman in Norma drag busting it wide open to dudes in the back seat of his car? Looks like there was at least oral sex performed on Norm/Norma. Wonder if Norma returned the favor and if they went all the way.  Funny that Norman should go to a gay bar too. 

I wonder what he tells himself when he went shopping for that Norma wig?

Norman's scene with the good doctor was truly heart breaking. 

Anyone else notice that the house is not the mess it was the first few episode. I wonder if that was due to Chick helping around the house?

As a person who sat through 1/3 of that gawd awful Battleship I had very, very low expectations of Rihanna, so I thought she exceeded my basement level expectations, which is damning with fake praise. That scene where she went to notarize the document for her boss and lecherous client was a cringer. She doesn't have to worry about writing any award acceptance speeches. One thing I can admit is that she is a beautiful woman (I'd kill for her eyes and lips) with a great figure. That red hair and cut just are not cute to me on her.  

I find Madeline insipid.  

Things just got real for Emma and Dillon. 

[peacheslatour]

Quote

Incidentally, gotta love inflation. In the original movie Marion steels $40,000. Last night it was $400,000.

Gus Van Sant did the same thing in his remake.

[bc1795]

The movie was on  TCM last night  -  Watched it and then went right over to "Bates" at 10:PM  -  interesting viewing experience to say the least.

Rhianna...um.....no.

[Stringey]

1 hour ago, islandgal140 said:

Lawd Gawd! Norman in Norma drag must have been the life of the party down at the White Horse bar because half the place was like

  --- AAAA

 when he walked in.

Okay, so am I the only one who is clutching the pearls and still gasping over Norman in Norma drag busting it wide open to dudes in the back seat of his car? Looks like there was at least oral sex performed on Norm/Norma. Wonder if Norma returned the favor and if they went all the way.  Funny that Norman should go to a gay bar too. 

I wonder what he tells himself when he went shopping for that Norma wig?

Norman's scene with the good doctor was truly heart breaking. 

Anyone else notice that the house is not the mess it was the first few episode. I wonder if that was due to Chick helping around the house?

As a person who sat through 1/3 of that gawd awful Battleship I had very, very low expectations of Rihanna, so I thought she exceeded my basement level expectations, which is damning with fake praise. That scene where she went to notarize the document for her boss and lecherous client was a cringer. She doesn't have to worry about writing any award acceptance speeches. One thing I can admit is that she is a beautiful woman (I'd kill for her eyes and lips) with a great figure. That red hair and cut just are not cute to me on her.  

I find Madeline insipid.  

Things just got real for Emma and Dillon. 

It's interesting that you brought the Mother dressing up. I was assuming that Norman went to the bar dressed as himself. Yes he would have viewed himself as Norma and would have taken on her mannerisms but he would come across to everyone else as a gay man especially if norman/mother did not give out the name. Imagine the confusion when a man says his name is Norma. I do like the idea that Norman while in the Mother personality though not only goes out to bars and picks up men but is dressing up as Norma too. If this is a gay bar too then the dressing up as a woman but still unmistakably a man works. If Norman in the Mother personality is dressing up to do this you know he is not wearing the dress though that he wore in the basement in the third episode.  And that's right Norman found some sexy gown or something in the car. I guess mother already but some sexy stuff online.

[Fable]

I am wondering if next time we see Marion will be the shower death scene since Marion really did not have a big part in the movie.  I know the show runners said they aren't redoing the movie, but what is really left for Marion to do?  I assume Sam will go to the motel looking for her, and likely Norman will kill him too.    

I was glad to see Dylan and Emma again, although it was a little heartbreaking under the circumstances.  I wonder how Dylan will react to the news that Norma is dead. 

For the life of me, I cannot understand why Norman as Mother would be going to gay bars. Very strange!  

[Peanut6711]

6 minutes ago, Fable said:

I am wondering if next time we see Marion will be the shower death scene since Marion really did not have a big part in the movie.  I know the show runners said they aren't redoing the movie, but what is really left for Marion to do?  I assume Sam will go to the motel looking for her, and likely Norman will kill him too.    

I was glad to see Dylan and Emma again, although it was a little heartbreaking under the circumstances.  I wonder how Dylan will react to the news that Norma is dead. 

For the life of me, I cannot understand why Norman as Mother would be going to gay bars. Very strange!  

I feel bad for Dylan. He keeps getting pulled into a mess that isn't his own. 

I seem to recall Rhianna is slated for a multi episode arc.  From the previews for next week,

Spoiler

she's around long enough to smash up Sam's car and have a chat with Norman over food ala the scene from Psycho in the back parlar of the office. 

[tikirocker]

2 hours ago, Peanut6711 said:

Nice nod though to the original film when Norman is driving through town and his psychiatrist spots him and does a double take. This mimicked the scene with Marion leaving town and being seen by her boss. 

I noticed that. Norman waves and smiles sheepishly just like Marion did to her boss.

[Mick Lady]

8 hours ago, luna1122 said:

Also devastating was the pretty sparkly life of Emma and Dylan breaking. It's still hard for me to believe that neither of them had googled any info back home before now, but at least Emma finally did, and now it's all going to go to hell. I hated their fight, it was so hard to see.

That fight broke my heart!

4 hours ago, Gizmo321 said:

I thought for sure the new sheriff gave Norman a real glass for his water was so she could run his prints and get some DNA as well.

Nestor did a great job directing this episode, he's got a good eye. 

And with each piece of new intel Norman collected I thought for sure Mother was going to show up. I think his first stop once inside the house is going to be the basement freezer to confront what else he knows to be true. Though I suspect Marion's arrival may delay that trip.

While we all know that at least Dylan comes back to White Pine Bay....I hope the rest of his new family stays put.

Only 5 more episodes. I will truly miss this show when it's over, but I am enjoying every minute of the journey til we get there.

I never considered the glass being used for finger prints or DNA. Great point!

[luna1122]

1 hour ago, Stringey said:

It's interesting that you brought the Mother dressing up. I was assuming that Norman went to the bar dressed as himself. Yes he would have viewed himself as Norma and would have taken on her mannerisms but he would come across to everyone else as a gay man especially if norman/mother did not give out the name. Imagine the confusion when a man says his name is Norma. I do like the idea that Norman while in the Mother personality though not only goes out to bars and picks up men but is dressing up as Norma too. If this is a gay bar too then the dressing up as a woman but still unmistakably a man works. If Norman in the Mother personality is dressing up to do this you know he is not wearing the dress though that he wore in the basement in the third episode.  And that's right Norman found some sexy gown or something in the car. I guess mother already but some sexy stuff online.

Yes, Norman is dressing up as Norma and going to that bar to pick up men. They  all seem to know him as Norma, not Norman. One fellow customer told him they liked the new look on him when he went back in his own clothes, meaning not dressed up as Norma, but they still seemed to recognize him instantly. Clearly, he's at a gay bar because he as Norma could not really pass as a woman, and pick up straight men, but he could fit in okay at this place. What is pretty fascinating is that somehow then Norman must known this deep down, given it thought. He didn't try being Norma at a 'regular' bar--didn't try to hit on a straight guy and maybe get the shit kicked out of him. He must have chosen that bar as one where he could actually let Norma pick up men, but as far as we know, Norman is not gay--he has always had a  predilection for pretty girls. He most definitely seemed beyond shocked when the cute guy from the night kissed him. I would love to know just what did happen the night before--hot  bartender said the things had gotten a little out of hand. And just how did Norman get home? Did the cute guy bring him? It's a pretty interesting twist that actually did take me by surprise. 

[Stringey]

Ok that's right I could have sworn I heard the man in the bathroom say Norma and not Norman. I heard right.

25 minutes ago, luna1122 said:

Yes, Norman is dressing up as Norma and going to that bar to pick up men. They  all seem to know him as Norma, not Norman. One fellow customer told him they liked the new look on him when he went back in his own clothes, meaning not dressed up as Norma, but they still seemed to recognize him instantly. Clearly, he's at a gay bar because he as Norma could not really pass as a woman, and pick up straight men, but he could fit in okay at this place. What is pretty fascinating is that somehow then Norman must known this deep down, given it thought. He didn't try being Norma at a 'regular' bar--didn't try to hit on a straight guy and maybe get the shit kicked out of him. He must have chosen that bar as one where he could actually let Norma pick up men, but as far as we know, Norman is not gay--he has always had a  predilection for pretty girls. He most definitely seemed beyond shocked when the cute guy from the night kissed him. I would love to know just what did happen the night before--hot  bartender said the things had gotten a little out of hand. And just how did Norman get home? Did the cute guy bring him? It's a pretty interesting twist that actually did take me by surprise. 

I am pretty sure he got the red back from the guy too.  Mother likes it a little rough.

[Peanut6711]

It's interesting that Norman sees Norma as wanting to go to bars and pick up men. He thinks of her as "loose" or "easy" with men perhaps. I don't think we (the viewers) actually ever saw Norma do that. Norman's twisted impression of his mother is that she was into getting drunk and random hook-ups in bar parking lots.  In reality, we know she loved Romera in the end. Norman at times certainly seems to imply things of Norma that aren't accurate. For example in the previous episodes Norman assumed that Norma wanted Caleb dead, but just couldn't do it herself. Yet the viewers know from previous seasons that Norma protected Caleb from Chick. While she has her issues with Caleb and their past, she's never wanted him dead. 

[peacheslatour]

From the film:

"And because he was so pathologically jealous of her, he assumed that she was jealous of him. Therefore, if he felt a strong attraction to any other woman, the mother side of him would go wild."

I think when he met Madeline he was attracted to her, which made Mother jealous so "she" went out and acted the floozy because of Norman's deep guilt over his attraction to Madeline. Doe that make any sense?

[Chaos Theory]

The bar scene was awesome and I think it works well with Norman's psyche.  He was deeply jealous of Norma and either refused to see her as a sexual being or as someone who was overtly sexulized.  There was no middle ground.  So when Norman and Mother are at odds and Mother is in control I think it is an interesting interpretation to have her go to gay bars to pick up men.  

 

 

 

The show doesn't need to go by am exact play by play of "Psycho" or do I particularly want it to.  Besides the shower scene I don't really need (or for that matter want) the show to duplicate anything the movie did.  At this point "Marion sister" part could be reimagined to a lot of different things including Madeline Loomis.  The idea of Madeline investigating the motel because of her husband and Norman ultimately not being able to kill her because she looks so much like his mother would be an interesting take.

Edited March 22, 2017 by Chaos Theory

[seashell]

New Sheriff already has Norman's fingerprints and DNA. His fingerprints and a DNA sample were taken after the death of Cody's father. His DNA matched the DNA in the semen found in Blair Watson, resulting in him having to take a polygraph test.

[Gizmo321]

1 hour ago, seashell said:

New Sheriff already has Norman's fingerprints and DNA. His fingerprints and a DNA sample were taken after the death of Cody's father. His DNA matched the DNA in the semen found in Blair Watson, resulting in him having to take a polygraph test.

Only Sheriff Romero and the woman who was his eager beaver assistant at the time know that Norman Bates was the 2nd semen sample. She ran the DNA through the system without being told to which is a no no..so I'm sure that evidence was destroyed. But you make a valid point about Cody's father...if they took DNA at the time..it should still be on file..unless it was in Sheriff Romero's private files in which case was he left office / went to prison it would have gone with him and not entered into any official record. The polygraph was for Romero's peace of mind as to whether he framed an innocent man. Romero, Norma, Norman. and the guy performing the test are the only ones that were aware the test was being done.

Edited March 22, 2017 by Gizmo321

[Mick Lady]

2 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

From the film:

"And because he was so pathologically jealous of her, he assumed that she was jealous of him. Therefore, if he felt a strong attraction to any other woman, the mother side of him would go wild."

I think when he met Madeline he was attracted to her, which made Mother jealous so "she" went out and acted the floozy because of Norman's deep guilt over his attraction to Madeline. Doe that make any sense?

Okay, I'm putting it together now. We were a bit confounded by the whole bar scene, but this puts it in a good prospective. Still working through the gay bar, but this gives me something to ponder. Be back after Mick and I hash this out.

Thanks Peacheslatour!

[Dobian]

Great episode.  So creepy when the camera focused on Norman's eyes when his old psychiatrist was talking to him.  The bar segment was trippy.  You knew Emma was going to find out about Norma as soon as they showed her surfing the net.  Stunt casting Rihanna as Marion doesn't really bother me.  This is really a pretty minor role and its only purpose is to tie this prequel into the opening events of Psycho.

Edited March 23, 2017 by Dobian

[willco]

13 hours ago, mwell345 said:

Little tidbit from the Vulture recap: "While Marion is fleeing the big city for a life with Sam Loomis, she’s pulled over by a cop, played in a cameo by Carlton Cuse himself."

The recap also refers to this being a sort of nod to Alfred Hitchcock who had cameos in many of his movies.

http://www.vulture.com/2017/03/bates-motel-recap-season-5-episode-5.html

Wow, I didn't realize that was Cuse at all & I had just watch a Youtube clip the other day where he was interviewed about Lost. Guess I was tired last night.

[AlwaysWatching]

I don't know if someone has mentioned this yet, but..uh..Rhianna is supposed to have an "expanded part" on Bates Motel. I'm not crazy about her being Marion Crane either.  This simply wasn't the right part for her.  I don't dislike her or anything.  Fortunately for me, the rest of the show is still so freaking fantastic that I'm not going to let her ruin it too much.  Still, my mind goes to other people, even an unknown, that would have kept the same atmosphere for which we have become accustomed on Bates Motel.