S02.E12: Love Handles

[formerlyfreedom]

Lucifer and Chloe investigate a mysterious masked killer who is poisoning college students. They also try to make sense of their new relationship, after a long-awaited kiss. Meanwhile, Charlotte visits Linda for advice on a touchy subject.

 

[Rosiejuliemom]

Who put all this Saw in my Lucifer?

[gwhh]

I love how the bar had a photo still up from 35 years ago.  Great hole in the wall bar also!! 

Sounds like Chloe going to need some Cyclone special blood to heal that problem!

[HunterHunted]

18 minutes ago, Rosiejuliemom said:

Who put all this Saw in my Lucifer?

No kidding. Not only have I seen this same plot play out in less sensational versions, including the vastly superior Law & Order: Criminal Intent episode "Abel and Willing" there really wasn't a need for this to be as gory as it was. Up until the episode went Saw, I was enjoying Chloe's terrible attempts at flirting.

[FormerMod-a1]

Chloe's fantasy/dream about Lucifer included devil horns.  I wonder if that's her subconscious "knowing" he is the devil.

[Rosiejuliemom]

16 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

No kidding. Not only have I seen this same plot play out in less sensational versions, including the vastly superior Law & Order: Criminal Intent episode "Abel and Willing" there really wasn't a need for this to be as gory as it was. Up until the episode went Saw, I was enjoying Chloe's terrible attempts at flirting.

Hell, Sherlock did it just last week!

Her flirting was so awkward. I loved it.

 

14 minutes ago, aquarian1 said:

Chloe's fantasy/dream about Lucifer included devil horns.  I wonder if that's her subconscious "knowing" he is the devil.

He has told her...repeatedly.

Late 70's/early 80's Amenadude is my jam.

Really not looking forward to the upcoming 3 month hiatus. Enough with the choppy seasons, TV people!

Edited January 24, 2017 by Rosiejuliemom
Math is not my strong suit.

[ProudMary]

Oh my Dad, what an episode!

Right from the beginning, with love handles and hot foreplay that turns out to be a dream. Now that would normally tick me off but this was perfect and led into the funniest bit with Maze in Chloe's room! (I'm actually glad the writers didn't go straight into sex for them but the dream foreplay was fun to watch!)

Then, heading to the frat party when Chloe let her hair down and asked how she looked. “Beautiful.” I was expecting something completely different but that was “a moment.”

Lucifer at the party with the girls, “How do I turn this off?” Heh.

Mom and Linda.  "Doctor/devil confidentiality." :D 

Mom and Maze.

The wickedness in this made you remember that this is a DC show. That was some Joker caliber villainy! I was on the edge of my seat for much of the episode.

And the scene when Chloe ran back toward the lab to see if Lucifer was alright. That scene between the two of them was even better than last week's kiss! (And, I think there's a Pride & Prejudice fan in the writers' room.)

The ending, as Lucifer comes to realize that what he finally knew was real, truly isn't was absolutely heartbreaking.  As always, Tom Ellis did an amazing job.

Standing ovation from me for the writers tonight. IMO, they hit this one out of the ballpark with the bases loaded. I had faith that they were going to handle Chloe/Lucifer well and they did not disappoint. Bravo.

Edited January 24, 2017 by ProudMary

[thuganomics85]

I didn't recognize him in the first video, but as soon as I saw Tim Dekay's name in the credits and the second video I appeared, I was like "Yep, that's totally him!"  I guess Neal escaping really got to Peter (last White Collar reference, I swear!)  He was good, but part of me thought that if they wanted to go on all Saw on this, just go for broke and get Tobin Bell himself.  I'm sure he has time whenever he isn't voicing Alchemy on The Flash.

Pleasantly surprised over how they found ways to move forward from the kiss, by having Lucifer wonder if she really liked him or somehow got effected by his charms, and especially Chloe trying to "loosen up", thanks to Maze (you're the best, Maze!)  The ass-slap and her attempts at Lucifer-like puns were hilarious!  Lucifer's "WTF?!" reactions to all of that were perfect.  But I'm glad they're still good at their jobs too and can still get on each others' nerves.  Hopefully, they'll find the right balance going forward.

Linda having to deal with Charlotte was a fun little scene.  Poor Linda.  She deserves a gold star or whatever it is that they give therapists, for the lot she has to help.  You know, just a knife-wielding demon, a moody former angel, the goddess of life trapped in a Battlestar Galatica actress' body, and, of course, The Devil.

So, now Lucifer knows the truth that Chloe is a miracle baby, and is extremely pissed.  But that all changed once he found out that Chloe was poisoned after-all.  I know I should probably roll my eyes over Chloe's life being in danger again, but the way Lucifer's anger quickly subsided, once he realized what happened, was really well done.  Tom Ellis really is nailing every aspect of Lucifer down.

Wasn't a huge fan of the Saw-aspects (never got into that franchise), but I'm definitely curious to see where this heading next week with the Winter Finale.

[Miss Dee]

I have to say, I was really impressed with Tom Ellis tonight. He looked sick when it hit him what his mother and Maze meant, and change from euphoric to sick was mesmerizing slow. Great decision to have the actor and camera take its time there.

Lauren Graham (that's the actress for Chloe, right?) was great this episode. Her self-conscious flirting was the first time I've really felt endeared to her as a character, although I've liked her all along.

I would definitely surmise Chloe subconsciously understand Lucifer is exactly who he claims to be. I just assume most Los Angeles citizens sort of accept this is his shtick to market his business at Lux and that he's a poser who never knows when to drop the part.

Dan, you can call Lucifer a dick anytime you want. I really love Dan, I want him to be happy.

[ProudMary]

26 minutes ago, Miss Dee said:

Dan, you can call Lucifer a dick anytime you want. I really love Dan, I want him to be happy.

That was hilarious.  "Detective."  "Counselor."  "Douche."  "Dick."    :D

[Bobbin]

Miracle baby? Niece? Half sister? "Devil's Advocate"?

I recognized Tim Dekay right away. I'm not fond of no-win "Kobayashi Maru" / "Saw" scenarios. I'm glad they only had two with bad outcomes. How did Chloe get infected? During the take-down?

Loved the "love horns." I suspected that was a dream because one, I don't think Lucifer has ever sported horns before, and two, there is at least another season.

[Happy Harpy]

29 minutes ago, Miss Dee said:

Lauren Graham (that's the actress for Chloe, right?) was great this episode. Her self-conscious flirting was the first time I've really felt endeared to her as a character, although I've liked her all along.

Lauren German :) I've liked Chloe all along, too, and I'm glad she's allowed to become less guarded. Lucifer's WTF reaction at Chloe's poor attempts to loosen up was mirroring mine, except I laughed out loud afterwards. It was great.

The dream was a cop-out, although the writers acknowledging it by lampshading the "stalling" made it better. I'm not sure that I liked Lucifer doubting Chloe and thinking she was aware of the whole thing, because again the trust between them is the cement of their relationship for me, and why I like it. OTOH, Lucifer was still under a massive shock, and the reminder of his despise for Dad/how he hates being manipulated in an early scene of the episode made his reaction very understandable. Moreover, I feared that the writers would go for a Big Misunderstanding, Lucifer wrongly accusing Chloe, Chloe hurt and retreating in her shell, trust destroyed etc. and they seemingly killed that in the egg which would be an excellent, excellent thing. So I'm going to count my blessings, take the "It was only a dream" and stay carefully optimistic. But poor Lucifer, his heart was crushed once again.

I loved Chloe and Lucifer working together. Their being a good team is showed, not only told.

I didn't realize I was holding my breath for most of the episode until it ended and I went "phewww". The gradual change of atmosphere, from the usual peppering of hilarious moments like Dr Linda and Lucifer ("and the kid", LOL), Maze and Chloe, Dr Linda and Mom, the students Dear-Abbying for Lucifer etc. to a very thriller-like second part and an emotionally charged ending was really well done. I was truly shocked when the doctor destroyed her hand, until the last moment I thought that it could go either way, leaning toward "they won't go there". I don't think I'd like it if every week was "inspired by a horror movie" but trying new/different things for one episode or a two-parter here and there in order to avoid routine (even if the routine is routinely awesome) is a good thing imo, so I liked this one.

As always, everyone or almost had their moment (no Trixie, but a mention). In S1, I could leave or take Dan and wouldn't have been too upset had he died; I also thought that the Lucifer/Maze "friendship" wasn't believable and actually reflected poorly on them both for most of the season (YMMV). Now, Dan is for me an integral part of the show and I would hate to lose him *jinx*.  And this episode was a good illustration of a real friendship between Maze and Lucifer, because he trusts her quite blindly and she doesn't want him to get hurt. It's rare that a second season, imo, actually improves on the first. When I watch an episode of Lucifer, I feel that TPTB actually work hard on their show and perpetually try to improve it, and it isn't a feeling I get too often (many showrunners being imo too blinded by their ego).

[gwhh]

Maze watching Chole sleep.  Too funny.  And her whole idea to losses up and how badly she failed at it great.  But where maze and the vodka breakfast at??  

Edited January 24, 2017 by gwhh

[GaT]

I would have liked to see the professor enter hell, but other than that, they really need to get rid of mom. She's part of everything & I'm really bored with her, the show was a lot more fun before they brought her on, remember Lucifer's first conversation with Trixie? I want that show back.

[CheshireCat]

23 minutes ago, Bobbin said:

Miracle baby? Niece? Half sister? "Devil's Advocate"?

I recognized Tim Dekay right away. I'm not fond of no-win "Kobayashi Maru" / "Saw" scenarios. I'm glad they only had two with bad outcomes.

As if the damage a waste disposal can do doesn't freak me out already... I really did not need that scene.

 

23 minutes ago, Bobbin said:

How did Chloe get infected? During the take-down?

My guess would be that either the professor had it in his blood stream and she inhaled it or Lucifer had it on his suit and she inhaled it. The fact that the professor said that he had to do it and Chloe would understand soon make me suspicious though I don't really think that Dad would resort to those measures.  It just seemed like an odd thing to say and I would think that we haven't heard the last of it.

 

Despite some of the scenes I could have done without, there were also a ton of fantastic ones - I think this episode really highlights that they use the humor to balance the serious stuff. Dan was fantastic in all of his scenes, Maze and Mom was fun and Mom and Dr Linda was priceless! That reaction she had to Mom... brilliantly played!

Now, I wish we could have gotten some professor-devil interaction. After all, he did have a God complex, so I was looking forward to him meeting an actual celestial being. That could have been so much fun.

What are we supposed to make of Lucifer's reaction once he stepped into the contaminated lab?

[ProudMary]

1 hour ago, Bobbin said:

How did Chloe get infected? During the take-down?

I think when he punched her to get her off him, he may have had a needle in his hand.  I was watching closely as we knew Chloe was going to be infected by the previews we had seen and it looked to me like he stabbed her with something.  I wonder if they'll clear that up next week so we'll know for sure how she was poisoned.  I hope so.

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

1 hour ago, Bobbin said:

How did Chloe get infected? During the take-down?

Without having concrete evidence or knowing spoilers, I'm guessing she inhaled whatever fumes were soaked into Lucifer's suit during the hug when she found out he was ok. 

But that wouldn't make much sense (logically), since he was wearing the suit, which should mean that while within 'mortal' distance of Chloe, Lucifer was just as prone to infection and not to forget, he was actually in the poison gas itself for however long.

LSS, shallow surface thoughts provide the guess outlined above, even if it doesn't hold up long when applying any logic.

Edited January 24, 2017 by iRarelyWatchTV36

[NutMeg]

What does 'saw' mean? mentioned often at the top of this thread  but I don't get it -thanks

[wayne67]

6 minutes ago, NutMeg said:

What does 'saw' mean? mentioned often at the top of this thread  but I don't get it -thanks

Saw is a movie franchise which features lots of torture porn where people are forced to make terrible choices in order to survive a madman/men/women murder mazes. 

Maize and Linda is hilarious. 

[Rosiejuliemom]

5 hours ago, ProudMary said:

I think when he punched her to get her off him, he may have had a needle in his hand.  I was watching closely as we knew Chloe was going to be infected by the previews we had seen and it looked to me like he stabbed her with something.  I wonder if they'll clear that up next week so we'll know for sure how she was poisoned.  I hope so.

I think you've got it. They did put an odd emphasis on that particular blow. 

[NutMeg]

6 hours ago, wayne67 said:

Saw is a movie franchise which features lots of torture porn where people are forced to make terrible choices in order to survive a madman/men/women murder mazes. 

 

oh.... thanks for the explanation - not sure I see how that relates to Lucifer though, maybe in a meta way?

[Rosiejuliemom]

3 minutes ago, NutMeg said:

oh.... thanks for the explanation - not sure I see how that relates to Lucifer though, maybe in a meta way?

The movies have a lot of "maim/kill another person or you will die" traps in them, so that's where my mind went during the episode.

[johntfs]

9 hours ago, CheshireCat said:

Now, I wish we could have gotten some professor-devil interaction. After all, he did have a God complex, so I was looking forward to him meeting an actual celestial being. That could have been so much fun.

 

I don't think that ship has sailed yet.  Chloe's been hit with a designer poison.  The professor keeps the knowledge of how to cure it in his head.  Figure after murders and suicide, his soul isn't going to Heaven....

[Bruinsfan]

9 hours ago, GaT said:

I would have liked to see the professor enter hell, but other than that, they really need to get rid of mom.

Check out the previews for next week.

I really liked the relationship/partnership aspects, but the whole A plot with Tim DeKay's supervillain character was so cartoonish compared to the usual moral complexities of the show that I just couldn't get into it. I felt the sad lack of Chloe pointing out to him that he was a monster because he was choosing to harm or kill innocent people in a vain attempt to prove something to society.

I also wished that someone had the chance to point out to Lucifer that his father being responsible for Chloe doesn't mean what they feel for each other isn't real. If that were the metric, Mom would be the only thing that is real since Dad is responsible for creating everyone and everything but her. Including Lucifer himself.

[IOU Payne]

Quote

I also wished that someone had the chance to point out to Lucifer that his father being responsible for Chloe doesn't mean what they feel for each other isn't real. 

Exactly!  In Jewish thinking, we believe in the concept of finding your bashert (soulmate, with destiny having a strong hand in finding each other.).  If Chloe and Lucifer are bashert, this is a Good Thing according to how I was brought up.  Free will comes into play if you choose to ignore the signals, or if you screw up the relationship.  

FTR, I think Doritos are my bashert.  Oh well.

[Bobbin]

7 hours ago, NutMeg said:

What does 'saw' mean? mentioned often at the top of this thread  but I don't get it -thanks

In the movie "Saw", the reference is literal: a hacksaw blade, shackles and a limb are involved.

[ProudMary]

42 minutes ago, Bruinsfan said:

 

I also wished that someone had the chance to point out to Lucifer that his father being responsible for Chloe doesn't mean what they feel for each other isn't real. If that were the metric, Mom would be the only thing that is real since Dad is responsible for creating everyone and everything but her. Including Lucifer himself.

I think Lucifer will come to realize this on his own, with a nudge from Doctor Linda.  Looking forward to having the writers play this out.

[jcin617]

1 hour ago, Bruinsfan said:

I also wished that someone had the chance to point out to Lucifer that his father being responsible for Chloe doesn't mean what they feel for each other isn't real. If that were the metric, Mom would be the only thing that is real since Dad is responsible for creating everyone and everything but her. Including Lucifer himself.

I was just coming to post this;  Lucifer knows for a fact that humans have free will (Garden of Eden and apple and all that) - so just because Chloe is part of Dad's plan for Lucifer doesn't mean she doesn't still have real feelings for him.   (Plus, Dad has already intervened to save Chloe at Lucifer's request, so it's not like Lucifer doesn't know Dad is paying attention to their relationship).

Edited January 24, 2017 by jcin617

[CheshireCat]

1 hour ago, johntfs said:

I don't think that ship has sailed yet.  Chloe's been hit with a designer poison.  The professor keeps the knowledge of how to cure it in his head.  Figure after murders and suicide, his soul isn't going to Heaven....

Interesting point. I would love that! Unfortunately, Lucifer can hardly go back and forth between Heaven/Hell and Earth and I have my doubts that they're going to have the rest of the episodes play out in Hell. So, how would he get to Hell and back again? Yes, a one-way-ticket, but then there's the "what are they going to do with the rest of the season" question again.

I wondered if Mom was behind the crazy professor and put him to infecting Chloe because she wants Lucifer back in Hell and he'd probably go back in a heartbeat but again, I doubt that they're having him in Hell for the rest of the season.

I do wonder though if there'll be some sort of test. Maybe The professor infected someone else and there is only one antidote so Chloe has to make the choice of who she'll save?

 

9 hours ago, ProudMary said:

I think when he punched her to get her off him, he may have had a needle in his hand.  I was watching closely as we knew Chloe was going to be infected by the previews we had seen and it looked to me like he stabbed her with something.  I wonder if they'll clear that up next week so we'll know for sure how she was poisoned.  I hope so.

I hope so, too. And while that makes sense - what are the odds that the syringe won't break during a take down and he can actually administer the dose without breaking the needle during a struggle?

 

1 hour ago, Bruinsfan said:

 

I also wished that someone had the chance to point out to Lucifer that his father being responsible for Chloe doesn't mean what they feel for each other isn't real. If that were the metric, Mom would be the only thing that is real since Dad is responsible for creating everyone and everything but her. Including Lucifer himself.

Maybe it's not so much about the feelings but the orchestration. And if we go by "God has a plan" as was sort of established in S1 in the episode with the priest, wouldn't that mean that Dad knew that Chloe would fall for Lucifer? So, the feelings might be real but it wouldn't be a coincidence that they've crossed paths and it would be part of a plan and Lucifer would yet again have been a pawn in his Dad's game.

 

9 hours ago, iRarelyWatchTV36 said:

Without having concrete evidence or knowing spoilers, I'm guessing she inhaled whatever fumes were soaked into Lucifer's suit during the hug when she found out he was ok. 

But that wouldn't make much sense (logically), since he was wearing the suit, which should mean that while within 'mortal' distance of Chloe, Lucifer was just as prone to infection and not to forget, he was actually in the poison gas itself for however long.

 

I didn't think about that but you're right. I did wonder how the poison could not have affected Lucifer once he and Chloe were reunited but that can be explained with his celestial metabolism that also makes him immune to getting drunk. But yeah, if it had been the fumes on his suit he, too, would have to have been affected. Unless he's generally immune to poison for some reason or other.

[storyskip]

If you look at the previews, they show Lucifer in Hell and then later with the doctor.  So I think it's safe to assume he goes down into Hell and drags Doc back out for a little "chat".

Now, what sort of deals he has to make with either Dad, Mom, Amenadiel, etc to pull this off will probably provide the set up for when the show returns in May.

[FormerMod-a1]

24 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

So, the feelings might be real but it wouldn't be a coincidence that they've crossed paths and it would be part of a plan and Lucifer would yet again have been a pawn in his Dad's game.

Or dad wants Luci to be happy, to get the relationship he wants.  I'm not saying I think that, I truly don't know, but it is a possibility.

[CheshireCat]

31 minutes ago, aquarian1 said:

Or dad wants Luci to be happy, to get the relationship he wants.  I'm not saying I think that, I truly don't know, but it is a possibility.

It is, I was talking about how it would look from Lucifer's point of view though :-)

[tennisgurl]

Hehehe. Love Handles. I see what you did there, show.

Oh Lucifer. Just because Chloe is apparently his destined, Dad approved soul mate, doesn't mean your relationship isn't real! Good thing that pesky poisoning stopped Lucifer from accusing Chloe of being some kind of God Plant who was manipulating him. That could have been awkward. I have no idea what Dads long game is, but Lucifer will certainly be pissed about being manipulated.

Wow, Chloe attempting to flirt was amazing to watch. Maze seriously needs to give her some pointers. Her attempts at making Lucifer style comments was...sad. Endearingly so. What a dork. I loved when the sorority girl said how pretty Chloe was, and she got all flattered. Don't die on me know Chloe, I finally like you!

Speaking of finally liking characters, Dan is such a great part of the show. He`s good at his job, and his banter with Lucifer is hilarious, especially now that Chloe is warmer and less long suffering with him now. Dan can be the character who is often frustrated and annoyed with Lucifer, but not in an antagonistic was, more in a friendly annoyance kind of way. Now Dan just needs to have a session with Doctor Linda like everyone else!

"I don't care if your the Mother of Creation and the estranged wife of God the Almighty, doctor/devil confidentiality is sacred!" Dr. Linda is awesome. She deserves a medal or a raise or a bigger office or something.

I have to say, I don't think Evil Tim DeKay thought out his Saw wanna be plot very well. I mean, you want to prove your not a bad guy for saving your computer and not a college students and leaving him to die by...killing college students and forcing random people to mutilate themselves? You might want to rethink your PR strategy there doc, because your not really selling yourself on being an alright guy. Besides, his whole stupid plot that we`ve seen on a million shows and in a million movies before is totally faulty to his situation from the start. Pulling a guy out of a burning car instead of your paper is a pretty different scenario than forcing people to hack themselves to pieces. No wonder you never got tenure.

[HunterHunted]

3 hours ago, jcin617 said:

I was just coming to post this;  Lucifer knows for a fact that humans have free will (Garden of Eden and apple and all that) - so just because Chloe is part of Dad's plan for Lucifer doesn't mean she doesn't still have real feelings for him.   (Plus, Dad has already intervened to save Chloe at Lucifer's request, so it's not like Lucifer doesn't know Dad is paying attention to their relationship).

I can see why Lucifer would have doubts now that he has this information. Thirty-five years ago God interceded to create Chloe, who He knew would be perfect for Lucifer when Lucifer rebelled again and vacated hell. So if you're Lucifer, you have to realize that God knew about Lucifer's 1st rebellion, his 2nd rebellion to go topside and his working with Chloe before any of it happened and before Lucifer made those decisions. Lucifer is especially proud of his decision to vacate hell and live among humans. To know that God knew all about it and made plans 25 years before Lucifer made the decision has to irritate.

[dargosmydaddy]

Some of Chloe's flirting was cute, but at other parts I was rolling my eyes and wishing they wouldn't go there. She seemed like she was changing herself to appeal to him, which... please, no.

Speaking of eye rolling, I didn't quite get the whole poison gas part... Did evil doctor leave both an antidote for the poison being dripped into the kid AND for the poison gas? (Is there even an antidote for poison gas? I would think once you inhale something, your lungs would be toast...) Because Lucifer had to delay awhile before going in and rescuing the two guys, yet the guys appeared to be perfectly fine at the end, enjoying a moment on the bench together without any apparent medical attention while Lucifer and Chloe had their moment.

Also, while I appreciated the black humor of Lucifer having to continually cut himself while he waited for Chloe to be out of range, did he have to cut himself so hugely? Couldn't he just, like, nick his finger or something? The cuts don't automatically heal themselves once Chloe's out of range, right? (They didn't appear to, and besides, if they did he could have just cut himself once and waited for it to go away.) Those are going to be some interesting scars to explain later...

[theatremouse]

5 minutes ago, dargosmydaddy said:

Speaking of eye rolling, I didn't quite get the whole poison gas part... Did evil doctor leave both an antidote for the poison being dripped into the kid AND for the poison gas? (Is there even an antidote for poison gas? I would think once you inhale something, your lungs would be toast...) Because Lucifer had to delay awhile before going in and rescuing the two guys, yet the guys appeared to be perfectly fine at the end, enjoying a moment on the bench together without any apparent medical attention while Lucifer and Chloe had their moment.

Also, while I appreciated the black humor of Lucifer having to continually cut himself while he waited for Chloe to be out of range, did he have to cut himself so hugely? Couldn't he just, like, nick his finger or something? The cuts don't automatically heal themselves once Chloe's out of range, right? (They didn't appear to, and besides, if they did he could have just cut himself once and waited for it to go away.) Those are going to be some interesting scars to explain later...

On the gas issue, it looked like the two captives were inside a separate sort of...glass box... in the room. So the gas, I think, was outside, and not able to reach them. I'm assuming in some moment we didn't see Luficer was able to somehow turn on some mega-vent or something that would remove the gas, and thus after doing so could let the two guys out, and then they all leave. It was a lab so I kinda can buy they might have some venting system where you could suck up something toxic and it'd be sealed away somewhere somehow...something TV logic. Either that or he had both an antidote for the poison and for the gas and they were just clumsy about making it clear. So if psycho of the week released the gas by dropping a vial, Luci could counteract the gas with...some other vial en route to letting dudes out of the box. I still think there are holes in the logic of that scene, but the writing was sort of dancing around a way in which it could've made sense.

I think the cuts do heal automatically, but just not instantly (but still faster than a human would). So I'm thinking it was faster to cut again and see when it didn't work than to wait for the initial cuts to heal.

[dargosmydaddy]

OK, that (kind of) makes sense. I still thought it was hilarious that the two guys were just chilling afterwards. (I guess an ambulance could have been en route, but you'd think one could've been called a little earlier... maybe that should've been Luci's job in between cutting himself. And both guys looked so calm, like that hadn't just been though a harrowing ordeal.)

[Zipper]

I loved this episode.  I've not seen any of the 'Saw' franchise, so the idea of a dilemma to prove the point of the Nutty Professor's undoing was OK with me.  Except this:  how many damn times does a WOC have to sacrifice herself for a white girl before this trope is over?  Loved the actress who played Dr. Scott.

I've been holding out for Chloe since the beginning, and this episode brought all her shit together in ways that made me so TV happy.  That dream scene with Luci was HOT.  And, then she turned into her dorky self.  It was so charming-- and I've always thought LG had it in her, I just wasn't sure if the writers had the long game in mind.  But, oh boy, did they give her consistency.  When she called Luci on his "what is your desire" retread, then had her slap Luci on the ass?  I guffawed.  Then they followed up with the 'sex with friends line' and I was in love with Chloe.  Nice work, writers.  I finally buy into the idea that a Luci/Chloe pairing won't wreck the show.  Because she's honestly goofy enough to make this not sappy.  

To that end, inserting Maze as a viewer to Chloe's dream was a perfect "out of that" moment; her glee about Chloe's great dream sex was so cute.  For a demon.

Dr. Linda is The Best.  First, helping Luci understand the stalling is his mistrust; then telling the Mother of Creation to stick it.  

Charlotte is messing with fire.  And I'm glad about that.  I don't ship Luci/Chloe, but I want this show to be great for another several seasons.  And she is sucking the life out of it for me.  I love the actress, but I am DONE with this maternal manipulation BS.  It's hard enough watching Luci struggle against the concept of Fate and Destiny vis a vis his father.  I do not need a Mom fucking with her own kids for her personal gain.  Get the super-celestial some other way, Show.  

Finally, kudos to Ellis.  Lord, can this man show range-- doubt, happiness, fear, glee, rage, doubt, fear, love, machismo, and vulnerability.  You, sir, are fantastic!  

[sinkwriter]

Watching Chloe fumble through flirting and trying to loosen up around a man she's attracted to cracked me up and made me wonder how long it's been since she's dated. Especially since she probably hasn't been with anyone since she was married to Dan, and then separated from him but too broken-hearted and betrayed to even consider seeing someone else. She was behaving like it's been a long time and she's resorting back to her awkward teenager mode, which I thought was pretty adorable and hilarious.

Oh, Tim DeKay... love you and miss you on my TV, man. I just wish they'd given you something a little less over-the-top to do. Something more grounded and believable.

Dr. Linda is the real goddess. She's awesome. And so was Maze, trying to protect Lucifer's joy from being shattered by his evil mom.

[theatremouse]

I thought Dr. Psycho's premise was idiotic if the point he was trying to prove was "of course you'd save yourself/your livelihood" because he wasn't just asking people to choose "you or this innocent stranger", he was asking them to maim themselves. That's can be a very difficult thing to bring oneself to do, even if you do want to save the other person. Sure, yeah, cut off your own leg. It's not remotely the same as both are trapped and do you help someone else escape versus escaping yourself and fleeing. I mean, I get the point was he snapped, so of course the analog didn't make sense but it still annoyed me. The only choice that made sense was at the end with Chloe where he said I'll poison you or I'll poison them but even that was sort of stupid because if she had to poison herself to save them theoretically she might be prevented from actually saving them so it's a no win both ways.

Edited January 25, 2017 by theatremouse

[gwhh]

With Lucy knowing Chloe was made by team Dad. That going to stop any sort of romance type relationship between them for a long time or forever.  Thank God!! Literally!!

Good move writers of the show!  A different story line than normal on TV.  Now that good writing! 

Edited January 25, 2017 by gwhh

[sinkwriter]

I thought they did show his scars at one point during Chloe's dream love scene. I remember seeing Chloe touch them.

[quirkygal]

The scars were there. I remember being impressed with how they looked like feathers embedded in the skin .

 

Also, did anyone else catch what Chloe said when she woke up from the dream? I thought she said something like, "always the same" in reference to Lucifer having horns. I took this to mean that this was not the first sexy time dream and that her subconscious has been piecing together the whole really the devil thing from the beginning. 

8 hours ago, dargosmydaddy said:

OK, that (kind of) makes sense. I still thought it was hilarious that the two guys were just chilling afterwards. (I guess an ambulance could have been en route, but you'd think one could've been called a little earlier... maybe that should've been Luci's job in between cutting himself. And both guys looked so calm, like that hadn't just been though a harrowing ordeal.)

Lucifer is an Angel. A fallen Angel but still an Angel. I figured he put some kind of mental whammy on them to make them compliant.

[Lonesome Rhodes]

For all my misgivings about the show, fun asides like Chloe taking the bull (Devil) by the horns and Maze being all fierce in attitude, and especially in deeds, make it all worth it. 

[storyskip]

13 hours ago, gwhh said:

Did anyone else notice during the "love scene" at the start of the show. Lucy, did NOT have any scars on his back? They made a big deal about it because. They showed a close up that stayed on his back for a long time!

 

With Lucy knowing Chloe was made by team Dad. That going to stop any sort of romance type relationship between them for a long time. Thank God!! Literally!!

The scars WERE there.  Like noted above, they show Chloe touching them, and before the scene skewed into obvious dream sequence territory I was thinking the scars were going to be what broke the sexual tension.  Either with Chloe getting distracted by them and asking or Lucifer freezing up the way he did when she tried to touch them previously.

[sinkwriter]

That was my thought, too, storyskip. The second Chloe touched his scars, I thought the passionate moment they were having was going to shift into something else. Guess that should have been my clue that it was a dream, because usually that's a difficult subject for him and a curious one for her. Even if they were in the heat of the moment, that's something that would give both of them pause, I'd think.

[Mojeaux]

9 minutes ago, sinkwriter said:

That was my thought, too, storyskip. The second Chloe touched his scars, I thought the passionate moment they were having was going to shift into something else. Guess that should have been my clue that it was a dream

Color me third. That IS where I figured out it was a dream.

Although I WAS screaming at the TV "Ooooh, no, don't go there, please let it be a dream!!!" For whatever reason, because I am a fervent 'shipper, I cannot get behind this pairing. They work on a lovers-who-never-make-love level, not artificially fighting UST, not deliberately holding back, not being artificially kept apart, but some acknowledgment that having sex will damage the relationship irreparably.

[CheshireCat]

1 hour ago, Mojeaux said:

Color me third. That IS where I figured out it was a dream.

Although I WAS screaming at the TV "Ooooh, no, don't go there, please let it be a dream!!!" For whatever reason, because I am a fervent 'shipper, I cannot get behind this pairing. They work on a lovers-who-never-make-love level, not artificially fighting UST, not deliberately holding back, not being artificially kept apart, but some acknowledgment that having sex will damage the relationship irreparably.

Same. Probably because there's be a lot more restriction for Lucifer as a character if he were in a serious relationship. No more flirting, no more playboy, it would all be about Chloe. I don't know about anyone else but I don't really want to see that and I don't really believe that this is going to be as laugh-out-loud funny.

This show also lives from so much more than romance. Romance is like on the very bottom of that list. It's just not essential.  

By the way, I totally forgot about it but I thought that it was an interesting moment when Mom wanted to tell Lucifer about Chloe and Maze wanted to get him out of the bar because she saw how happy Lucifer is. She is, obviously, still protecting him, even though she says otherwise. I kind of like it, because I really liked the relationship Lucifer and Maze had in S1. I would really miss it if they changed it entirely.

Edited January 25, 2017 by CheshireCat

[gwhh]

I wonder what Chloe was doing in her sleep that maze found so amazing? I am taking that was not your average woman wet dream. More like a tsunami of a wet dream. Enough at least to make maze stop and watch. Which means it was very out of the ordinary even for maze. What do you think she was doing while maze was watching her?

Edited January 25, 2017 by gwhh

[Gigi43]

I had to rewatch not on cold medicine to fully enjoy it. Maze was Chloe with a snack cracked me up more the second time! 

 

They showed hints of Chloe being a bit cheesy last season  so her terrible  flirting was appropriate.  Her and Dan dating must have  been full of awkwardness. 

 

I'm not sure how I feel about  the bar happening to have a picture of Amenadiel and Penelope  all these years later. I know she's a c-list actress and maybe Dad wanted proof but it seems a bit too in place. I do like they're  not  dragging  out Lucifer finding out. Hopefully it won't take him too long to get Chloe is even more in the dark than he is.