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formerlyfreedom

By formerlyfreedom
in Current Events & Politics

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sistermagpie

sistermagpie

21 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

I see Hillary as Steve Martin's character in the episode of The Simpsons where Homer gets elected chief of the sanitation department and screws it up royally. Steve comes on stage to the Sanford & Son theme, tells the city they're fucked, and walks out.

The line I keep thinking of is the one from JAWS: "I’m not going to waste my time arguing with [people] who are lining up to be a hot lunch.”

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mamadrama
mamadrama

What's next? I keep hoping that, for once, promises made in the election campaign are not kept.I am hoping that things will NOT be as bad as I am afraid they will be-that my fears are as unfounded and

BookWoman56
BookWoman56

I have made a vow to myself, that if Trump and his administration try to force religious indoctrination into schools, I will not take it lying down. You want schools to teach Christianity? Fine, let's

Ocean Chick
Ocean Chick

So what do you think we should do with all our home-grown white male terrorists?  You know the ones - the Unibomber.  Timothy McVeigh.  The Columbine shooters.  The Sandyhook shooter.  The Aurora thea

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Ms.Moon

Ms.Moon

After reading up on the CNN Trump Voters interview you know what I am good.  These people are stupid, they think that the east coast liberals look down on them and then their words and actions confirm exactly what we knew all along (they are incredibly stupid).  There already are a great deal of Trumpregrets starting and it is going to get worse.  I am willing to sit back and wait for the wailing and gnashing of teeth when their hero Trump robs them blind and craters everything just like he always does.  My main worry is that I live in New York and he's probably going to rile up terrorists and we're always a target.  I don't care about North Carolina and neither does ISIL unfortunately.  Is it terrible to hope that people ticked off and radicalized by ISIL and Trump supporter actions find stuff to blow up or run over in Trump supporter states and please leave us poor suffering under this Vichy government in our blue states alone.  

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maraleia

maraleia

23 hours ago, VMepicgrl said:

Are there any phone calls we should still be making? If so, to whom and about what? I've been avoiding twitter for a bit again, as it was getting to be too much. But I still want to take whatever action I can.

Sign up for @MichaelSkolnik newsletter. He has marching orders for all of us and sends it out about every 5 days or so.

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stillshimpy

stillshimpy

16 minutes ago, Ms.Moon said:

 Is it terrible to hope that people ticked off and radicalized by ISIL and Trump supporter actions find stuff to blow up or run over in Trump supporter states and please leave us poor suffering under this Vichy government in our blue states alone.  

 

I really like your post but can't get behind this sentiment.  It's just, there's a lot of really good and decent human beings (at least in theory) in those states.  We should invite them over :-) 

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formerlyfreedom

formerlyfreedom

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Folks, just a reminder of what this topic is for - "A spot to talk about the latest news after the election, the transition, the future of politics, and of course calls to action! Please take Presidential appointments to the proper topic, and the rest can be talked about here."

Conversation on Trump-specific activities, such as rallies or twitter should happen over in his topic.

 

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Totale

Totale

4 hours ago, Padma said:

The "big part of it" is a particular windfall for the insurance companies.

And it's been that way since the conversation changed, way back when HRC was trying to get it done the first time 20+ years ago, from "health care for everyone" to "health insurance for everyone".  I want the first, not the second.  I say put the entire health insurance "industry" out of business. and hire all the people there who used to so efficiently guard the stones to keep them from accidentally giving up any blood to negotiate with the medical and pharma industries on behalf of everyone, to get the prices down for the everyone that then and now needs to be served with health care.

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AntiBeeSpray

AntiBeeSpray

5 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

Is Stephen Hawking an American? I fear that he might be deemed irrelevant as Somebody Who's Too Damn Smart For His Own Good. I have the same concern about Neil deGrasse Tyson. He probably has a spaceship buried underneath the Hayden Planetarium, so I shouldn't be too worried.

Nope. He's English. But I'm glad he spoke up.

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stillshimpy

stillshimpy

I really enjoyed the Hawking article, thank you for it.  

There's a little bit of a disconnect about having to learn humility, etc.  and having a lot of "we must" in there.  Not that I disagree with any particular point, he's just saying that liberals, in particular, must be prepared to encourage, help develop, etc. etc.  Hard to marry humility with a message that is very much in the spirit of Noblesse Oblige but he's not wrong.  

Florida is one of the states I can easily believe Trump just plain-old won.  He killed in the damned-near-dead demographic.  

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AntiBeeSpray

AntiBeeSpray

8 minutes ago, stillshimpy said:

I really enjoyed the Hawking article, thank you for it.  

There's a little bit of a disconnect about having to learn humility, etc.  and having a lot of "we must" in there.  Not that I disagree with any particular point, he's just saying that liberals, in particular, must be prepared to encourage, help develop, etc. etc.  Hard to marry humility with a message that is very much in the spirit of Noblesse Oblige but he's not wrong.  

Florida is one of the states I can easily believe Drumpf just plain-old won.  He killed in the damned-near-dead demographic.  

You're welcome.

Yea there is, but at least he took a chance, took a risk. Better that then to do nothing. And he himself said that he's part of the Ivory Tower too, so he didn't deny it. Just appreciated the fact that he was willing to speak up to try to get others in that area to step up and do something.

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Kromm

Kromm

(edited)
On 11/29/2016 at 11:52 PM, Lantern7 said:

My ideal civil disobedience would be to hang the president-elect's portrait upside-down. Why burn the flag? Rick Monday might come out of nowhere to grab it and tackle you.

 

On 11/30/2016 at 0:06 AM, stillshimpy said:

Because it is the ultimate test of civil liberties in this country.  What true freedom looks like in a free land.  It's not comfortable but that's the point, it's supposed to be the test of "You say we are free?  Are we?  We shall see."  

While I personally have always thought that the idea of flag burning is disgusting, I get your point shrimpy. I'm only closer to that mindset now because we're actually getting our country subverted by a foreign power and their stooges, so there's a good argument there that the protest is of that. It's different than in the Nixon administration years or the Reagan administration years, when as bad as some people were treated by our system, there still WAS a system behind it which was essentially working in many other ways, and burning the flag seemed to also spit in the face of that as well. But we're headed now into a Russian hacked and backed Presidency, of a mentally unbalanced tyrant, who's appointing people who are pretty much Neo-Nazis. What we are heading into won't be America anymore, quite arguably, and so what's communicated by burning the flag maybe changes context quite a bit. 

Even in those previous years I never would have supported criminalizing flag burning. Scorning it a bit, sure, but the Rubicon with this is criminalizing it. Part of the core DNA of our country's founding was to remove elevating symbols over rights (although ironically, when Francis Scott Key's. "Star Spangled Banner" was adopted as the anthem that kind of should have been a sign that those values were starting to unravel a bit, since the song glorifies the object... the flag itself).  

Making the flag the kind of symbol where it's handling is more important than a person's rights is pretty much akin to Idolatry. Which makes it doubly ironic that this strongly Judeo-Christian country (who you know... based their core doctrine, the Ten Commandments, in opposition to that) is headed down that path. 

Remember "Piss Christ" and how upset people got over that?  I'm half expecting someone to produce a "Piss Trump" sometime soon and if its after he's in power I suppose we will get our test of how free-speech tolerant the new regime will be (although no matter what Trump personally would tweet an attack at the person for doing it, even if he doesn't have them arrested). 

Edited by Kromm
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Duke Silver

Duke Silver

Fuck yeah....give the scumbag GOP a taste of their own medicine.  Dems aren't as good at it as the GOP, but they sure as hell need to at least try.  Fight, obstruct, derail, this fascist administration.

Clinton allies plot anti-Trump movement

Quote

“We’re going to throw everything at him that he threw at us,” said one longtime Democratic operative active in the effort.

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scriggle

scriggle

Not sure where to put this so I'll post it here.

Ahead of recounts, three states admit they “erred” in Trump’s favor by thousands of votes

Quote

There’s a reason why third party candidate Jill Stein demanded recounts in the states of Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania, and why Hillary Clinton subsequently signed on to the effort. It’s not simply because Donald Trump won the states in shocking fashion, and by such conveniently narrow margins. It’s because all three states in question have now acknowledged that they initially erred wildly in Trump’s favor, to the tune of thousands of votes each, in their initially reported numbers.

The latest revelation comes from Pennsylvania, where the state’s own voluntary revision of its vote totals – before any external recount has even gotten underway – now have Donald Trump’s winning margin plummeting from 70,638 votes to now just 46,938 votes. Again, this voluntary revision from the state is based on precincts correcting their own mistakes and adjusting their own numbers accordingly, and is not a result of the recount effort. It merely proves how wildly inaccurate (or possibly rigged) the vote counting was to begin with, and demonstrates the need for a statewide recount to catch all the other “errors” that have not already been corrected voluntarily. But Pennsylvania is not the only state trying to clean up its own mess.

Even before the current recount process in Wisconsin got underway, the state had already voluntarily reduced the size of Donald Trump’s victory by nearly five thousand votes. These revisions were made even more odd by the fact that they resulted in not only Trump’s lead shrinking, but his vote total shrinking. Trump now officially has around five thousand fewer votes in Wisconsin than he did the day after the election.

And in Michigan, where a recount is also about to get underway, the state has already voluntarily revised its vote totals such that the size of Donald Trump’s victory has dropped by more than two thousand votes.

So what we now know for certain is that all three states in question initially erred wildly in Donald Trump’s favor, to the tune of thousands of votes each, by their own subsequent admission. And the above shifts all occurred before any forced recounts. It’s not yet clear how many more “errors” the recounts may uncover as they get underway. But it is notable that all three states erred significantly in favor of the same candidate, who shockingly won each of them by tiny margins. It is a reasonable expectation that the recounts will uncover more such suspicious “errors” in Trump’s favor, further shrinking his lead in each state. By how much is another matter. For confirmation of the above numbers, please follow the embedded links to our earlier reporting, each of which includes the original supporting source links.

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Menrva

Menrva

59 minutes ago, scriggle said:

Not sure where to put this so I'll post it here.

Ahead of recounts, three states admit they “erred” in Trump’s favor by thousands of votes

But ultimately, will it matter? It's not like the electoral college will suddenly change their minds and vote for HRC. And Tang the Conqueror will just suppress everything, since the FBI is in his pocket, courtesy of Comey and Giuliani. But maybe I'm just being paranoid…

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Lantern7

Lantern7

Like I've said . . . if the president-elect consorted with Russia to win, he shouldn't get the office. Simple. I can see him selling us out to Putin to improve his lot in life. Or Kim. Or actual aliens. Bastard would have given the nation to the Dominators during "Invasion."

Good news: I lost weight. I don't go to the  gym as much as I should, and I felt that I was eating more in my post-election funk, but I was wrong.

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Padma

Padma

(edited)
3 hours ago, Menrva said:

But ultimately, will it matter? It's not like the electoral college will suddenly change their minds and vote for HRC. And Tang the Conqueror will just suppress everything, since the FBI is in his pocket, courtesy of Comey and Giuliani. But maybe I'm just being paranoid…

This is such an important story, thank you for posting it. We have to make it matter, and speak and write of it as being of great importance. Because, it IS.

 I mean, think of the Republicans, if the situation were reversed.  Thousands of votes for Hillary in her surprising victories that are now being "corrected" before the count even begins?  What's up with that?  How does that not suggest widespread voter fraud (beyond the widespread voter suppression we already knew was in place in places like NC and Florida)? One can only imagine what hand counts would be turning up, if they had been allowed.

And if results show that, in addition to losing the popular vote, Trump also lost the electoral college, then facts are facts. We need a presidency based on truth and honesty (in spite of Russians rigging it for Trump with their hacks, and the FBI interfering by spreading false innuendo in the crucial final week).

It's a democracy. If there was cheating, if an election was stolen (in ways other than those we already knew with the FBI and Russia and voter misdirection and suppression) then our institutions will have to find a way to address--and redress--it.  Fortunately, this will all occur before the Electoral College votes. We should not be afraid--not of chaos or change or uncertainty. Only of having a government forced on us by fraud and a stolen election (IF results show that was what happened).  If the results we were told are not true and Donald Trump really didn't win, then he shouldn't become the President of the United States. It's just that simple. No one should be afraid to insist on an honest election. We're (supposedly) not a country that needs to request UN monitors to guarantee that our democracy will not be stolen.

"So what we now know for certain is that all three states in question initially erred wildly in Donald Trump’s favor, to the tune of thousands of votes each, by their own subsequent admission. And the above shifts all occurred before any forced recounts."

These states should have to explain why there were so many votes incorrectly counted--but they only disclosed them when they realized they would be forced into a statewide recount.

No surprise there, apparently, that Trump was awarded thousands of votes he didn't actually receive--and which apparently in the case of Wisconsin, weren't even cast at all.

Why?

Edited by Padma
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Shannon L.

Shannon L.

49 minutes ago, Duke Silver said:

<shrug>  I mean....what can the rest of us do in the face of such apocalyptic feelings?  SMDH.

 
https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/status/805034908754345984
 
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And that, to me, sounds nothing like an economic issue, like all the news stories about where Dems went wrong are claiming. I'm sure economics has a little to do with it, but I believe it's much more about the social issues. 

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EyewatchTV211

EyewatchTV211

(edited)
3 hours ago, Shannon L. said:

And that, to me, sounds nothing like an economic issue, like all the news stories about where Dems went wrong are claiming. I'm sure economics has a little to do with it, but I believe it's much more about the social issues. 

There was an interesting thread on twitter by someone who seemed knowledgeable (forget who) regarding how those two things are actually very much linked. That there is evidence that when people feel threatened regarding their social issues (or feel like outsiders have taken over), they feel worse about the economy. And similarly, when people feel badly about the economy, they are more likely to have negative opinions and have more blame on the "outsiders," etc. There was a poll taken relatively soon after the election where either Trump voters or some similar group rated better feelings about the current economic climate. This despite the fact that President Obama is still in charge and nothing significant has changed since the election EXCEPT that these people probably feel better knowing Trump will be president and that those other social issues will be taken care of in ways they feel good about. Hopefully I am summarizing this accurately, but I think this was the gist of it. It seems to make strange sense regarding that population of our country who looks to everything besides facts.

Edited by VMepicgrl
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Padma

Padma

1 hour ago, scriggle said:

Wisconsin recount observers discover five vote counting machines with tampered seals

From the above: "Most notable among them: one observer who reports that five of the nine voting machines in her county had tampered seals – and she posted visual evidence to prove it.

....The observer, named Wendy, has been observing the recount in St. Croix County. According to the state’s official election website, that county is currently doing both a hand recount and a machine recount. That’s what makes it notable that Wendy spotted the broken seals on five of the nine machines in question. Based on the photographs she posted to Stein’s official campaign website, the broken seals themselves come with the warning label that “Removal of seal voids warranty.”

That is very interesting. 5 of 9 had broken seals.  More than half in that one county. The article speculated that someone could have tampered with the results or that poll workers could have "pried them open" for some other, unknown, reason.

Interestingly, although the judge said Wisconsin didn't need to do a recount by hand, it is up to individual counties and apparently 60 of them are doing that, by hand and by machine.  Of the 12 that are only doing machine recounts, 9 of them were won by Trump.  Stein may argue to the judge that the machine tampering gives reason for all of them to do hand counts.

This certainly should strengthen the case AGAINST Tubby stopping the recount at least in Wisconsin.

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Padma

Padma

Also re recount, from the above, there is this:

"But the fact that 83% of Wisconsin’s counties are now recounting by hand is a good sign for those who are hoping the recount can reverse the original vote tally, which handed the state to Donald Trump by the narrowest of margins. Before the statewide recount even began, Trump’s lead shrunk by nearly five thousand votes as various precincts took supposed Trump votes off the board which apparently never existed to begin with. And since the hand recount began, at least one Wisconsin county has discovered that some Presidential votes were not counted by the machines because they filled out in a nonstandard fashion."

How is this not big news?

This is not time for wimpitude, Democrats!  I hope you're preparing for what to do if this recount shows a win for Hillary (and the likelihood of fraud).

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NewDigs

NewDigs

49 minutes ago, Padma said:

How is this not big news?

There really is no such thing as a network "liberal media" ? And/or there's just so much shit right now there's not enough time in the day.

I think most get there info from teevee. They seem to be leaning right in order to not appear liberal. Or something. Though I am seeing glimmers of light at CBS.

I finally got an online NYTimes subscription. It's scarier than teevee. 

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AntiBeeSpray

AntiBeeSpray

2 hours ago, NewDigs said:

There really is no such thing as a network "liberal media" ? And/or there's just so much shit right now there's not enough time in the day.

I think most get there info from teevee. They seem to be leaning right in order to not appear liberal. Or something. Though I am seeing glimmers of light at CBS.

I finally got an online NYTimes subscription. It's scarier than teevee. 

I find some irony in that given that their boss seems to be ok with Drumpf.

Source: hollywoodreporter.com

aradia22

aradia22

Excerpts from the Kareem Abdul-Jabbar piece if you didn't have time to read the whole thing

Quote

We need a new civil disobedience in the American tradition of Thomas Paine, Henry David Thoreau and King. Our efforts must be organized, focused and coordinated with each other. Any action should be undertaken only when a clearly stated goal is publicly announced. For example, a reasonable first goal would be blocking Bannon from his White House job due to Breitbart’s racism and misogyny. [...]

One essential tool should always be legal challenges. Donate money to the American Civil Liberties Union, the NAACP and other organizations that are willing to fight corrupt laws in court, especially voter ID laws that have been imposed by Republicans to suppress voting by minority and poor constituents. The second step is to target the legislators who support any of Trump’s anti-Constitution policies by supporting their opponents in the 2018 elections. Eight Republican Senate seats will be open for Democrats or anti-Trump Republicans to take. All 435 House of Representative seats will be in play.

At the same time, we should begin laser-aimed boycotts. These should be undertaken only when there is reasonable hope of affecting those being boycotted. [...] having too many targets dilutes the effectiveness. Instead, we should focus on specific businesses — including everything with the name Trump on it, because the name Trump is now synonymous with racism, lying to the public, misogyny and xenophobia. And we need to boycott Bannon’s Breitbart. Boycott all the site’s advertisers [...] Target casino owner Sheldon Adelson, a major donator to Trump’s campaign and member of his inaugural committee; because of his enormous donations to Trump and other Republican candidates, he has more direct influence than other contributors. The Venetian resort complex in Las Vegas — which includes the Venetian Resort Hotel Casino, the Sands Expo Convention Center and the Palazzo Hotel and Casino Resort — is owned by Adelson. The resort complex is the best target, rather than Adelson’s other businesses, because it provides a large income and visitors to Las Vegas have many other choices where they can spend their money. People should refuse to stay there until a more suitable person than Sessions is proposed for attorney general.

That’s a start, but it’s not all we can do. We have to be prepared to go even further if necessary. During the early days of the civil rights movement, college students pushed for change by becoming Freedom Riders to ensure bus desegregation and register black voters. They were also a major force to end the Vietnam War. Now we need students to spearhead peaceful protests in Washington, D.C., and of local governments who follow the anti-American policies of a Trump administration. We also have to lend our financial, moral and physical support to Black Lives Matter as it continues to raise awareness of social inequities. Protests call attention to a problem and help educate those who may not be aware that there is a problem. This country has a long and effective history of boycotts, walkouts, marches and protests that have given power to those usually powerless.

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