S13.E01: Undo

[hendersonrocks]

I am already dreading the Meredith/Maggie storyline to come. It's so tired.

You know what I enjoyed most about this episode? The total lack of Owen & Amelia. Can they just keep dancing out of frame forever & ever? Please?

[preeya]

18 minutes ago, Chicken Wing said:

Unrealistic TV Trope #342: Character A commits an action. Character B walks in and misinterprets the action. Character B spends the entire episode maintaining this misinterpretation. Character A will actually engage in conversation with Character B over the situation but inexplicably make no attempt to speak a full sentence to explain the action and correct the misinterpretation. Multiple lives ruined as result.

Perfect - ITA

[choclatechip45]

17 minutes ago, hendersonrocks said:

I am already dreading the Meredith/Maggie storyline to come. It's so tired.

You know what I enjoyed most about this episode? The total lack of Owen & Amelia. Can they just keep dancing out of frame forever & ever? Please?

Same the episode was so much better without them. I will give the producers credit that was one of the better premieres Grey's has had.

[proserpina65]

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 Since it happened outside work I can't see how it would affect his career.

Doctors can lose their licenses for criminal actions which occur outside of work.  In real life.  In Shondaland, you can cut lvad wires, steal a transplant heart and basically kill someone, and you get a slap on the wrist and some frowny faces from the Chief of Surgery.

[Court]

Weber tried very hard to be there for Jo. She kept running away from him. I think she did try to make out with Deluca and he refused. I'm not placing blame on her at all but that's what I remember.

[Chicken Wing]

4 minutes ago, Court said:

Weber tried very hard to be there for Jo. She kept running away from him. I think she did try to make out with Deluca and he refused. I'm not placing blame on her at all but that's what I remember.

Not what happened at all. She was blathering on about Alex and her secret marriage and whatnot and she started to undress to go to bed and screw it all, DeLuca was very uncomfortable with her taking her clothes off, and as he tried to help her get in the damn bed and stop acting weird they tripped over each other and fell onto the bed together. And that's when Alex walked in.

[Joana]

The whole "You knew and you didn't tell me!!!!!1" is such a tired TV trope. Unless, of course, it comes from Monica Geller's mom in Friends, which was awesome! Here, not so much. So, shut up Maggie. And Nathan can shut up and GTFO too. It was so annoying how he kept popping up everywhere.

A lot of nonsense has happened on this show over the years, but at least we could say that it wasn't as bad as cutting the LVAD wire. Well, this IS just as bad. And it was 100% unnecessary. Alex didn't have to beat DeLuca up within an inch of his life. DeLuca's eyesight and career did not have to be in danger. A "regular", bar brawl kinda beating would have made for just as an intriguing storyline and would have been infinitely more believable. This was a total overkill, especially since you just know that Alex is not going to jail or losing his job and that DeLuca will be just fine, and that within a few episodes everything will be forgotten. 

And Jo. She had to speak up the moment the first punch landed on DeLuca's face. She does not come out of this looking good. I already had trouble relating to her BS retcon story, even more so now.

[Chas411]

When did she try kiss him? My memory of the finale is foggy but im pretty sure that didn't happen..

[Court]

2 minutes ago, Chas411 said:

When did she try kiss him? My memory of the finale is foggy but im pretty sure that didn't happen..

My fault. It's my memory that is foggy! 

[Chicken Wing]

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And Jo. She had to speak up the moment the first punch landed on DeLuca's face. She does not come out of this looking good. 

This. Which is why, like I said upthread, I was surprised when Alex arrived at the hospital with DeLuca still believing that he had walked in on him trying to hook up with Jo. How would that have not been cleared up before they even left the apartment with the paramedics? What the hell was Jo doing when Alex was beating DeLuca up, when he finally stopped beating him, when he or she called 911, when they were still around waiting for the ambulance? How, during all of this intervening time, did the truth not come out of her mouth?

[Primetimer]

In the aftermath of Alex's brutal beatdown of DeLuca, Jo is desperate to keep her secret, Meredith lies to everybody, and DeLuca needs surgery to save his eyesight, his career, and most importantly his pretty face.

View the full article

[Chas411]

Other then the writers wanting maximum drama I can't think of a reason really. He wouldn't listen to her at the hospital though so maybe she tried earlier as well. Or maybe she froze.. Or was drunk.. 

[Boton]

13 hours ago, SlovakPrincess said:

Am I the only one who thinks Maggie was being ridiculous: "you knew all day about Alex and you didn't tell me?"  It's not about you, Maggie! At all!  

 

Mr. Boton and I both thought that Meredith should have looked at Maggie and said, "OK, so the next time you screw something up royally, do you want me to run immediately to the authorities, or do you want a few hours to try to sort things out and get your head back in the game?"

Seriously, things seemed to have been handled in the right order, and there was no need for relationship drama among any but the primary participants (Alex, DeLuca, and Jo).  I know the cops had to focus on the crime first, but the people who were, oh, I don't know, DOCTORS, should in fact have been focusing on DeLuca until they knew he was treated and stabilized, and then figured out who needed to know what.

[Court]

That's an excellent question. Alex brought Deluca in. Jo called Mere when? After they were gone? Why at no point did she speak up?

I thought it was crappy of both of them to go to Deluca and be all don't tell on me!

[Biggie B]

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Am I the only one who thinks Maggie was being ridiculous: "you knew all day about Alex and you didn't tell me?"  It's not about you, Maggie! At all! 

And Meredith even SAID, "It's not about you," but that drew no response from Maggie. *sigh*

So, no Arizona in this episode. I'm curious to see what her next storyline will be. 

[Chicken Wing]

To be fair ... ish ... to Maggie, it's not so much that Meredith didn't tell her what she knew for the sake of being open and honest, but she flat-out asked Meredith and Meredith openly lied to her face. Meredith is right, the situation isn't about Maggie so it's not like Maggie is a person who needs to know, but there's a difference, albeit small in the grand scheme of things, between withholding private need-to-know information and outright lying about it.

Now, with this whole Riggs business, Meredith isn't specifically lying the way she lied about Alex -- Maggie didn't ask Meredith if she's interested in Riggs or if Riggs was interested in her -- but Meredith definitely knows Maggie is interested in him so her not being open about the fact that they hooked up and/or that they're interested in each other probably falls under that "lying by omission" rule. Or some girl code violation. Whatever. Either way, Maggie will be upset at Meredith for keeping that from her, too.

Edited September 23, 2016 by Chicken Wing

[preeya]

DeLuca's facial wounds are total overkill. He looked worse than Rocky Balboa after 12 rounds with Apollo Creed.

[Joana]

5 minutes ago, Biggie B said:

So, no Arizona in this episode. I'm curious to see what her next storyline will be. 

A preview for episode 3 says she's torn between her loyalties to Alex and DeLuca, or something like that, which makes sense. Let's not forget that DeLuca was there for her and testified on her behalf (doing a pretty good job, at that) when she was fighting to keep her daughter, while Alex couldn't be bothered as he didn't want to "pick sides", which I still call BS on. Now, I don't for a moment expect Arizona to be petty and vengeful about it (honestly, a character even remembering what happened 3 episodes ago is probably too much to ask at this point), but she's pretty much the only one who's invested with both Alex and DeLuca in any meaningful way and her position and take on things should certainly be interesting. 

I really wish she had been in this episode. I know it was beyond the writers' control and I can't blame them, but I think she would be the one pushing to find out what really happened out there the most. 

[DearEvette]

Maggie was annoying for sure.  But her little bit of selfishness does not deserve the outpouring of hate she seems to be getting.  I mean everyone was asking about what happened to DeLuca and Meredith knew.  No it isn't about Maggie but at the end of the day Meredith was willing to cover up an ass beating that could have made him lose his sight and he was someone Maggie cared about.  Also by making it about their family and relationship, Maggie's hurt wasn't necessarily about this particular situation so much is was about Meredith having no issue outright lying to Maggie's face. 

Meanwhile Alex beats a guy to shit.  Jo lies like it is a career that owes her a pension, and Meredith is busy covering stuff up and they get sympathetic understanding.

I don't completely blame Alex because after all he was working from a deluded assumption that DeLuca was forcing himself on Jo. But still he seemed to have little remorse even when he thought maybe it was consensual. Hey, I even like Alex quite a bit, but that is every kind of fucked up there is.  And remember this is the guy who basically shamed Chest Peckwell into not going to the police because no one would believe him. But at least in the end he took responsibility. 

I do 100% squarely blame Jo.  I know she is popular on this board but I can not stand her.  Her number one concern is keeping her secret and running away.  It is not like she is in imminent danger of being discovered by her husband right at this point.  So her instinct to run without clearing up what happened and leaving both Alex and DeLuca in the stew  of the mess she made is a total punk ass move. 

Edited September 23, 2016 by DearEvette

[choclatechip45]

9 minutes ago, Joana said:

A preview for episode 3 says she's torn between her loyalties to Alex and DeLuca, or something like that, which makes sense. Let's not forget that DeLuca was there for her and testified on her behalf (doing a pretty good job, at that) when she was fighting to keep her daughter, while Alex couldn't be bothered as he didn't want to "pick sides", which I still call BS on. Now, I don't for a moment expect Arizona to be petty and vengeful about it (honestly, a character even remembering what happened 3 episodes ago is probably too much to ask at this point), but she's pretty much the only one who's invested with both Alex and DeLuca in any meaningful way and her position and take on things should certainly be interesting. 

I really wish she had been in this episode. I know it was beyond the writers' control and I can't blame them, but I think she would be the one pushing to find out what really happened out there the most. 

Yeah I agree. They didn't really involve her when Shane hacked up  Jimmys heart. I think she will be super pissed at Alex though for throwing away his career over this.

I wont be surprised if Arizona was the one to get the truth out of Jo. 

Edited September 23, 2016 by choclatechip45

[Chicken Wing]

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A preview for episode 3 says she's torn between her loyalties to Alex and DeLuca, or something like that, which makes sense. Let's not forget that DeLuca was there for her and testified on her behalf (doing a pretty good job, at that) when she was fighting to keep her daughter, while Alex couldn't be bothered as he didn't want to "pick sides", which I still call BS on.

Arizona is indeed a common thread between Alex and DeLuca, but what loyalty, exactly, does she have to the latter? What connection do they have other than his renting a room in her house? Frankly, to me the only reason he was included in the custody hearing to testify on her behalf as her housemate was because he's a main cast member and has to be featured in an episode somewhere. I often forgot last season that they were housemates at all. I imagine Arizona will be very sympathetic to DeLuca, because, well, what happened to him was sympathetic, and because that's her nature, but she can't help but be there for Alex too because they've had a close connection for years. And then DeLuca will feel angry and betrayed at her seemingly taking Alex's side even though Alex is in the wrong and he'll move out of the house. I'm guessing.

[Greysaddict]

I liked the episode well enough.  Meredith and Alex and are my favorite characters so I am happy they were both heavily involved in this episode (Alex mostly since Meredith is always the focus).  But, reading this thread I think @windsprints nailed it pre-episode.  I feel like this situation is going to turn more into how does it effect Alex and Meredith's relationship than about Alex and Jo, which ugh, not really what I wanted from this.  I'm still going to stay optimistic Jolex will get a real storyline out of it.  I do like them together so I hope they can work though, or if not at least have a meaningful discussion of why they can't trust/be with each other.  Also since I do like Jo, I hope we learn more about her and her marriage situation.  It's about time Camilla got something good to work with.  

I'm not terribly bothered by the "misunderstanding the situation" trope because Grey's was pretty much built on TV tropes right from episode 1.  

I liked the few scenes we got with April/Jackson/Catherine, I thought it worked well within the episode and sets up the future for them.  

The sisters triangle seems right out of Hamilton so I'm kind of eh about it.  Maggie still annoys me on many levels.  I think they should have had her come in on a fellowship rather than the head of cardio.  I go back and forth how I feel about Meredith and Riggs but I think they have nice will they/won't they chemistry (yes another TV trope).  

This is episode was the perfect example of why the cast needs to be trimmed.  It worked so well without Owen, Amelia, Callie and Arizona.  Not to say those are the characters that I would want gone but we still had a huge ensemble of characters that were all included and those 4 were missing.  

[Evie]

9 minutes ago, Chicken Wing said:

Arizona is indeed a common thread between Alex and DeLuca, but what loyalty, exactly, does she have to the latter? What connection do they have other than his renting a room in her house? Frankly, to me the only reason he was included in the custody hearing to testify on her behalf as her housemate was because he's a main cast member and has to be featured in an episode somewhere. I often forgot last season that they were housemates at all. I imagine Arizona will be very sympathetic to DeLuca, because, well, what happened to him was sympathetic, and because that's her nature, but she can't help but be there for Alex too because they've had a close connection for years. And then DeLuca will feel angry and betrayed at her seemingly taking Alex's side even though Alex is in the wrong and he'll move out of the house. I'm guessing.

I constantly forget that DeLuca and Arizona live together. They should have done more with that last season instead of having DeLuca spend the majority of the season banging Maggie and then basically disappearing until they needed someone to testify for Arizona and be beaten up by Alex.

I hope the scenario doesn't go like that but it probably will. Personally, I'd like Arizona to tell Alex she's disappointed in him and he was wrong, wrong, wrong and then be Switzerland.

[Joana]

19 minutes ago, Chicken Wing said:

Arizona is indeed a common thread between Alex and DeLuca, but what loyalty, exactly, does she have to the latter? What connection do they have other than his renting a room in her house? Frankly, to me the only reason he was included in the custody hearing to testify on her behalf as her housemate was because he's a main cast member and has to be featured in an episode somewhere. I often forgot last season that they were housemates at all. I imagine Arizona will be very sympathetic to DeLuca, because, well, what happened to him was sympathetic, and because that's her nature, but she can't help but be there for Alex too because they've had a close connection for years. And then DeLuca will feel angry and betrayed at her seemingly taking Alex's side even though Alex is in the wrong and he'll move out of the house. I'm guessing.

 

Well, we can maybe assume that they have bonded off-screen. The last season was such a disjointed mess that it's basically impossible to tell where most characters stand with each other (Maggie second-guessing her breakup with DeLuca after not having acknowledged his existence for like half a season being an example of that), but it would make sense for Arizona to care more about DeLuca than she would about some other random intern. I'm not saying she should unconditionally side with him, but it would be natural if she could see his POV more than other characters would. It would make sense.

I really want someone to be there for him. The poor guy deserves it. He's literally the only one in this whole debacle who hasn't done anything wrong. 

[Chas411]

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  I know she is popular on this board

You're kidding yes? I'd call Jo many things but unfortunetly popular isn't one of them.

[Chicken Wing]

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Well, we can maybe assume that they have bonded off-screen.

Certainly we're supposed to assume that, but that's the entire point and problem. I can't care about, or take seriously, character development that takes place almost entirely offscreen. "Show, don't tell" and all that.

[Joana]

4 minutes ago, Chicken Wing said:

Certainly we're supposed to assume that, but that's the entire point and problem. I can't care about, or take seriously, character development that takes place almost entirely offscreen. "Show, don't tell" and all that.

I totally agree, but unfortunately that's how GA's been for a while now.

I'm fairly sure the previous season was supposed to go very differently, but then something happened and threw everything off. DeLuca in particular seemed to have two storylines building up (living with Arizona and hooking up with Maggie - and both were hyped by the writers as "hilarious" and "fun and sexy"), and then both were suddenly dropped like a hot potato. 

I suspect that the reason was that Sara Ramirez's departure wasn't really a last minute decision and they had to write a way out for her, hence all the Penny drama, but I guess we'll never know. 

[taanja]

I was pleasantly surprised that I enjoyed the episode. Well the Alex and Meredith parts anyway. I don't like that character --- whatshername-- that is Alex's girlfriend. and I never have. It would have been nice if Richard ad not talked her into staying. Whatever.

For the first time I didn't mind April.

I really liked the ending with Mere and Alex. The 2 left standing.

[dmc]

I was pleasantly surprised that I enjoyed the episode. Well the Alex and Meredith parts anyway. I don't like that character --- whatshername-- that is Alex's girlfriend. and I never have. It would have been nice if Richard ad not talked her into staying. Whatever.

For the first time I didn't mind April.

I really liked the ending with Mere and Alex. The 2 left standing.

I hate Jo too

[dmc]

Maggie was annoying for sure.  But her little bit of selfishness does not deserve the outpouring of hate she seems to be getting.  I mean everyone was asking about what happened to DeLuca and Meredith knew.  No it isn't about Maggie but at the end of the day Meredith was willing to cover up an ass beating that could have made him lose his sight and he was someone Maggie cared about.  Also by making it about their family and relationship, Maggie's hurt wasn't necessarily about this particular situation so much is was about Meredith having no issue outright lying to Maggie's face. 

Meanwhile Alex beats a guy to shit.  Jo lies like it is a career that owes her a pension, and Meredith is busy covering stuff up and they get sympathetic understanding.

I don't completely blame Alex because after all he was working from a deluded assumption that DeLuca was forcing himself on Jo. But still he seemed to have little remorse even when he thought maybe it was consensual. Hey, I even like Alex quite a bit, but that is every kind of fucked up there is.  And remember this is the guy who basically shamed Chest Peckwell into not going to the police because no one would believe him. But at least in the end he took responsibility. 

I do 100% squarely blame Jo.  I know she is popular on this board but I can not stand her.  Her number one concern is keeping her secret and running away.  It is not like she is in imminent danger of being discovered by her husband right at this point.  So her instinct to run without clearing up what happened and leaving both Alex and DeLuca in the stew  of the mess she made is a total punk ass move. 

I blame her Jo too. She had three years to be honest. Alex deserves so much better than her

[Deanie87]

As much as I really don't want to get into the role of Jo Defender, here I go I guess:

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It also frustrated the hell out of me that Jo was unable to get one complete sentence out of her mouth to anyone about anything. At this point, I just want her to type the following on an iPad and show it to ANYONE: "I was VERY drunk and upset. DeLuca took me home to make sure I got there safely. I was so drunk that as I started getting undressed, I fell and he tried to catch me. I was NOT trying to have sex with him. He was NOT trying to have sex with me. At all. For any reason. NO ONE WAS TRYING TO HAVE SEX." She doesn't have to divulge her big secret, but she DOES need to make it clear to SOMEONE that DeLuca was not trying to rape her, nor was it an attempt at consensual sex. It was neither. It was NOTHING. But of course, she won't say anything, so despite what DeLuca says, people will put two and two together and get five.

She did.  She told both Webber and Stephanie the truth about DeLuca trying to help her.  She should have said something earlier to Meredith or Alex or someone, but the whole episode took place in the span of a couple of hours and I don't fault people in a "crisis" situation for not handling things as maturely or calmly as they could.  We didn't see the aftermath of exactly what happened in the loft when Alex was done with DeLuca, but we heard Jo screaming for Alex to stop last season in the finale.  Maybe they actually took care of DeLuca and called an ambulance rather than rehash their relationship while he was bleeding out on the floor.  We saw what happened when Jo did try to set the record straight with Alex, he didn't listen and insulted her.  I guess she should have screamed at him to shut up right outside of DeLuca's door before anyone really knew that Alex was the culprit, but she didn't.  I guess I'm not seeing how she kept what happened a big secret or how Alex's predicament is her fault.  I get not liking her, but that isn't what played out onscreen. 

As far as why the beating was so severe, besides the fact that Grey's always goes to 11 when it would be fine at 5, I think it will come out that Alex being THAT violent shook Jo, hence why she won't be sending Alex cards in prison confessing to her secret husband.  She has seen him act out before, quite a few times in fact.  But this time is was severe enough to given even her pause and I think that will play out in the remainder of the storyline.

[Racj82]

Jo and Alex are meant for each other. First, Jo gets into a altercation with that guy she was dating. A lot of people assumed he was the aggressor and bear her including Alex. When it seemed more like he was defending himself. Now, Alex beats down a guy near death, some people assume it was the victims fault when it was all Alex. All these people need serious therapy for real.

[Gladrags]

2 hours ago, Chicken Wing said:

Unrealistic TV Trope #342: Character A commits an action. Character B walks in and misinterprets the action. Character B spends the entire episode maintaining this misinterpretation. Character A will actually engage in conversation with Character B over the situation but inexplicably make no attempt to speak a full sentence to explain the action and correct the misinterpretation. Multiple lives ruined as result.

Both Jo and Alex are to blame for their poor communication. Jo is so immature and messed up that she can't speak a coherent sentence when she's under stress, and Alex, both historically and in this episode, never lets anyone get a word in edgewise. 

She tried telling him more than once that DeLuca wasn't trying to hurt her, but he wouldn't let her finish a sentence; she kept tripping over her tongue, babbling incoherently to get him to listen. 

I'm pretty much over Jo and her secret, past wounds, yadda yadda yadda. She needs to grow the f up and figure out a way to move on that doesn't involve running, lying, whining, or whimpering. 

 

1 hour ago, DearEvette said:

I don't completely blame Alex because after all he was working from a deluded assumption that DeLuca was forcing himself on Jo.

Oh, I do. He didn't have to beat DeLuca to death to get him away from Jo, even if he was trying to force himself on her. A punch or two would have done the trick. But Angry Alex is and always will be a douche (his words) who acts before he thinks, lets his douchy temper get in the way of rational thought, and wildly overreacts. 

Edited September 23, 2016 by Gladrags

[DearEvette]

4 minutes ago, Deanie87 said:

She did.  She told both Webber and Stephanie the truth about DeLuca trying to help her

I know she eventually told Steph, but Steph had to practically beg it out of her.  Jo was packing to run away and quit the program when Stephanie caught up with her.

But the Webber thing in the beginning of the episode was really odd. She was "I don't know, I don't know"and wanting him to leave and then she ran out of her own house while he was still trying to get her to talk.  I know that she was drunk but damn, something like that should have sobered her up real quick.  And she had to realize people assumed that DeLuca was hurting her so the longer she stayed silent the worse it got.

Meanwhile her conversation with Alex where nobody could finish a sentence is just bad soap opera writing.  It is designed specifically to maintain the misunderstanding. 

[Chicken Wing]

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I guess I'm not seeing how she kept what happened a big secret or how Alex's predicament is her fault.  I get not liking her, but that isn't what played out onscreen. 

Not saying it's her fault, because it isn't, but it's just annoyingly illogical and unrealistic to me that she could not use words, like a person, and explain to Alex that he misunderstood the situation. What were they doing in between calling the ambulance and the ambulance actually arriving? She couldn't say anything then as they were tending to DeLuca while they waited? It's just an unrealistic TV trope to have people not say things or explain things or clear up misconceptions where they obviously normally would. And it got annoying to watch her go the whole episode without clearing up the misconception to the one person who needed to hear it. She tried to talk to him, yes, and he interrupted her and insulted her, yes, but that's part of the trope. A contrived way to force the misunderstanding to continue, because a normal person would yell at him to shut up and say what they had to say anyway, since he was so very, very, very wrong about this very, very, very serious situation.

Edited September 23, 2016 by Chicken Wing

[Joana]

I don't blame Jo for not telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth under those circumstances. It's pretty understandable she didn't. However, I do think there's very little excuse for letting Alex stay so long under the impression that DeLuca was basically trying to rape her. We did see her yelling at Alex to stop, but what by all accounts never happened was her saying "Stop it, HE DIDN'T DO ANYTHING WRONG". And it should have happened at some point, preferably before he got beaten to a pulp. Now, I get that she was in shock and froze, it can happen, but she still could have and should have done and said something much sooner. Plus the fact that she wanted to flee and leave everything behind before even trying to clean up the mess she partly caused doesn't speek well about her. 

[windsprints]

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Maggie is so annoying - is there anything she doesn't make about herself.

Must be part of the Ellis Grey genes that get passed down.

I'm not thrilled that I character I love did something horrible and will likely be run to the ground before being redeemed but I can't help but to be glad that Justin is finally getting a chance to have a big story. I'm totally on board. There will be tropes and plot holes for sure since those are there for probably 85% of Grey's storylines, lol. I also know the outcome is predictable (also typical for Grey's) but I'm going to do my best to enjoy the story since I've waited since at least S10 for Alex to have something big. My hope is that we will see some great scenes with the characters interacting. That's always been Grey's strength IMO and I think there's a lot of potential for this since this story can bring all the characters into it somewhat.

I don't think a bar-brawl type fight could have launched a big storyline that includes so many characters. There would be no court case (its in the promo) or Alex's medical license being in jeopardy because it would be a misdemeanor (if that) and not a felony charge. It would also be totally laughable for half of the characters to have any say about it at all given the history at the hospital. Examples: Derek fought Mark twice at the hospital with the COS asking him if he put his weight behind his punch the first time. Maggie punched a patient's family and got a high-five. Alex fought his brother, punched his father and was beating Shane in the face until he was pulled off him. Jackson punched Alex, shoved him through a coffee table then continued punching him in the face until he was pulled off. That's off the top of my head, I'm sure there are more. So, punching someone in the face never had much of a reaction or consequence before. It had to be something more IMO.

As for Jo not telling anyone what happened - she was drunk to the point of nearly passing out and given her background (I can also understand how it would give her the initial reaction to run) I'd say likely in shock . The ambulance (should have) arrived within minutes and Alex went with DeLuca.  Jo told Stephanie at the hospital.  I guess only Mary Sue Grey gets a never ending pass on her behavior due to her shitty childhood for twelve years,lol.  

Edited September 23, 2016 by windsprints

[Court]

When did Jo tell Weber? I know she told Steph but she told Weber she was drunk and didn't remember anything. 

[Ohwell]

1 hour ago, DearEvette said:

I don't completely blame Alex because after all he was working from a deluded assumption that DeLuca was forcing himself on Jo.

Oh I blame the hell out of him because that beatdown was unnecessary--a punch or two I could see, but not something that vicious.  Jo needs to think about what he'd do to her if he ever became really pissed at her.  Not that I care about her either.

[John M]

Even by Grey's standards this Alex plotline is a little too shark jumpy for me. What he did was criminal and inexcusable, he should be immediately terminated, jailed and  probably lose his license.

But we already know Justin Chambers signed a new contract because it was widely reported so he isn't going anywhere which means they will have to come up with some bullshit excuse on why he won't suffer any major consequences. Why would the writers do this to themselves?

[Joana]

5 minutes ago, Ohwell said:

Oh I blame the hell out of him because that beatdown was unnecessary--a punch or two I could see, but not something that vicious.  Jo needs to think about what he'd do to her if he ever became really pissed at her.  Not that I care about her either.

Yeah. The only way such a vicious beating is even remotely justified is if it's 100% unmistakably clear he was hurting her, aggressively forcing himself upon her while she's trying to defend herself. It's clear that wasn't what happened. Of course, we can't know how it looked in Alex's eyes, but if that's how he interpreted the situation, that also speaks about his own issues. 

Edited September 23, 2016 by Joana

[windsprints]

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Why would the writers do this to themselves?

Because its what they've always done, going back to season 2. Izzie should have been kicked out of the program and probably jailed.  I guess for me I see Grey's as a soap opera since S3. Its just another soap story.

Edited September 23, 2016 by windsprints

[Deanie87]

Also, lets say Jo did tell Alex.  Then he breaks up with her, she goes out gets drunk, DeLuca still takes her home, falls on her and Alex walks in.  Is it still Jo's fault, since she DID tell Alex her big secret?  There are two different scenarios here, but the outcome could have been the same whether or not Jo told Alex her big secret.  And that's on Alex. 

[izabella]

39 minutes ago, Ohwell said:

Oh I blame the hell out of him because that beatdown was unnecessary--a punch or two I could see, but not something that vicious.  Jo needs to think about what he'd do to her if he ever became really pissed at her.  Not that I care about her either.

Yes, this.  It doesn't matter what Alex was thinking when he viciously beat up DeLucca.  That he can so quickly and so easily become that vicious and unable to stop himself?  That's a character trait to RUN from, run fast and far.

34 minutes ago, Joana said:

Yeah. The only way such a vicious beating is even remotely justified is if it's 100% unmistakably clear he was hurting her, aggressively forcing himself upon her while she's trying to defend herself. It's clear that wasn't what happened. Of course, we can't know how it looked in Alex's eyes, but if that's how he interpreted the situation, that also speaks about his own issues. 

I'm not buying it.  Alex heard Jo laughing just before he saw them on the bed.  If anything, he would have thought Jo was having consensual sex, not forced.  And if he got pissed that Jo was cheating on him, it's her he should have been upset with, not DeLucca.  (Not that I think he should have beat Jo up instead!!  Going from zero to vicious rage is a huge problem, and Alex should be long past that at his stage of life and career.  Self-control is a thing, and Alex is far too old to be without any.)

Edited September 23, 2016 by izabella

[Ohwell]

10 minutes ago, izabella said:

I'm not buying it.  Alex heard Jo laughing just before he saw them on the bed.  If anything, he would have thought Jo was having consensual sex, not forced. 

Yeah, I forgot about that.  Alex didn't hear Jo sounding distressed or screaming in terror, he just heard her laughing.  Not the sound of a rape victim. 

[WhosThatGirl]

Yes to the two posters above. One, Jo was laughing when DeLuca fell on her. And the second point, Alex could have punched once or twice. Like I said in my earlier post, the fact that the show made it go this far is going to be a problem for me to get past, when like we all suspected, Alex won't get in trouble. DeLuca will have a change of heart. The way the show has made it sound though is that DeLuca is probably never going to be a doctor again- or at least not the way he wants to be a doctor again. Either way, the show didn't have to make it go this far. DeLuca could have gotten punched twice and still be considering pressing charges, but his injuries didn't have to be so extreme that his career is over. How does the show think Alex is going to bounce back that, character wise? 

And I'll say it again, I really hate that Alex and Mer's first instinct was to think DeLuca was taking advantage of Jo. And I also hate that when Edwards was trying to explain what happened, Mer was steadfastly trying to justify why Alex beat DeLuca. Shut Up Meredith. And shut up Alex too. 

[Chicken Wing]

Quote

And I'll say it again, I really hate that Alex and Mer's first instinct was to think DeLuca was taking advantage of Jo. And I also hate that when Edwards was trying to explain what happened, Mer was steadfastly trying to justify why Alex beat DeLuca. Shut Up Meredith. And shut up Alex too. 

Shut up to Alex, mostly.

The fact that Jo was giggling doesn't discount the logic of Alex thinking DeLuca was taking advantage of her -- because she was drunk. He's thinking Jo's drunk and, by definition, unable to give proper consent to any such activity, and DeLuca was taking advantage of her inability to think and assert herself clearly.

But there is nothing in DeLuca's character that either Alex or Meredith have gotten to know in the past year or whatever that would really suggest he would try to do such a thing. It would make more sense for Alex to think it was a consensual encounter before he'd think DeLuca was going to force himself onto his superior's girlfriend in said superior's own home. I think that is what he was thinking at first, in the actual beatdown. Perhaps it was afterward, when it was apparent that Jo was actually drunk, and Alex was thinking through the scenarios, that he thought maybe it was all DeLuca. Shame that at no point did he seriously consider that nothing at all was happening, but it was quite a suggestive position he walked in on.

When Meredith explained later to Alex that she wanted to believe Edwards was lying, though, I think it was more that she desperately wanted to believe that something did happen that would sort of justify Alex's actions, that her dear friend and "person" Alex did not just beat their colleague half to death over a total misunderstanding. She wanted to believe Alex's side, because the alternative -- the truth -- is devastating. He honestly could have killed DeLuca ... and it was all over nothing.

Edited September 23, 2016 by Chicken Wing

[flickers]

How did Alex even know Jo was drunk? He started whaling on Deluca before that ever came up.

[Chicken Wing]

He wouldn't know that. So I'm positing that his first kneejerk assumption to seeing them in that position would have been that they were fooling around, and later, after he realized Jo was stinking drunk, decided that DeLuca was actually trying to take advantage of her. But neither of those theories, really, make any sense given what they all by now must know of DeLuca as a person. He wouldn't do either of these things. Alex just didn't think.

[Nobodysfan]

Oh my, this episode was so disappointing on all fronts.

Except the cuteness of Japril baby.

The best thing was Nathan saying Omelia´s happiness won´t last. I had to laugh, so true.

The only scene I kind of liked was Jo/Deluca scene.

Edited September 23, 2016 by Nobodysfan