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Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

maraleia

By maraleia
in Counting On

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Cinnabon

Cinnabon

12 minutes ago, Zella said:

Yeah I refuse to believe he asks about or listens to her talk about her day in those phone calls. I still think about her letter to the judge that marveled at Josh calling the kids by name after work. Talk about the bar being in hell. 

And how she described Josh “helping” to clean up crumbs. 🤦‍♀️

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hoosier80
hoosier80

New show title: 10 to 20 Years and Counting 

MargeGunderson
MargeGunderson

Someone on Reddit just described Josh’s face as a glistening glazed ham. I am considering divorcing my husband and marrying that poster. 

doodlebug
doodlebug

Well, for many of us, it's the difference between 'imperfect' and 'non-PC' and being a criminal.  Josh is a child molester and his parents actively intervened in his situation to avoid him being punis

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Salacious Kitty

Salacious Kitty

I assume Anna is living off the proceeds from the sale of the Siloam Springs house. They bought it for something like $65k and sold it for something like $250k. There's also some land in her LLCs that she could sell. Living at the Duggars just helps her preserve the nest egg longer. 

I don't think she has enough to buy a decent house in the DFW metro area, even if she liquidated. She'd still need reserves for daily expenses. I just don't see that. 

tl;dr She'll likely stay put.

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

JB & Michelle would benefit from Anna living near the prison - their son would have support and with Anna and the kids gone they could engage out of sight out of mind more often. So I think JB would subsidize a move for Anna if that is what she wants to do. He could by a home in TX and sell it in 10 years. I think he would even pay utilities for her and the kids.

Anna would have Priss & Pecan, as well as Hilary around for support. And IMO, Anna has no interest in hearing any truths about Josh and if she did, she has plenty of inlaws in AR that could set her straight.

I wouldn't be surprised if she moved.

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Cinnabon

Cinnabon

16 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

JB & Michelle would benefit from Anna living near the prison - their son would have support and with Anna and the kids gone they could engage out of sight out of mind more often. So I think JB would subsidize a move for Anna if that is what she wants to do. He could by a home in TX and sell it in 10 years. I think he would even pay utilities for her and the kids.

Anna would have Priss & Pecan, as well as Hilary around for support. And IMO, Anna has no interest in hearing any truths about Josh and if she did, she has plenty of inlaws in AR that could set her straight.

I wouldn't be surprised if she moved.

That would cost him millions. I don’t see it.

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

4 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

That would cost him millions. I don’t see it.

The average family income in TX is around $60,000. $60,000 x 10 years is $600,000. A little more than half a million. Plus I think he's already subsidizing her now. So yes, it would cost him more if she moved, but like I said above, I think he would think its worth the money. And I'm sure he'd make a nice profit selling the home when they return to AR.

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Cinnabon

Cinnabon

18 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

The average family income in TX is around $60,000. $60,000 x 10 years is $600,000. A little more than half a million. Plus I think he's already subsidizing her now. So yes, it would cost him more if she moved, but like I said above, I think he would think its worth the money. And I'm sure he'd make a nice profit selling the home when they return to AR.

Plus the cost of the house?

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Salacious Kitty

Salacious Kitty

(edited)
12 minutes ago, Quilt Fairy said:

I swear I just read a piece of gossip somewhere (maybe Reddit?) that said JD just helped Anna sell one of her properties for $450K.  Take it with a grain of salt.

Well, that might buy a home outside of Dallas. But if it's like other big city markets, maybe not. Remember, Prissy and the Spiveys live outside of Fort Worth.

Edited by Salacious Kitty
crazy8s

crazy8s

(edited)
14 minutes ago, Quilt Fairy said:

I swear I just read a piece of gossip somewhere (maybe Reddit?) that said JD just helped Anna sell one of her properties for $450K.  Take it with a grain of salt.

Joe, the realtor, sold a house recently on a lot one of Anna's llcs owned. Jase and Co built a house on the lot and Joe sold it. Now do any of them see any actually money from that or does it all get lumped into the duggar pot of money and the llcs used for tax write offs, who knows.

Edited by crazy8s
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Cinnabon

Cinnabon

1 minute ago, crazy8s said:

Joe the realtor sold a house recently on a lot one of Anna's llcs owned. Jase and Co built a house on the lot and Joe sold it. Now do any of them see any actually money from that or does it all get lumped into the duggar pot of money and the llcs used for tax write offs, who knows.

Anna owned the lot but not the house? I’m so confused.

Notabug

Notabug

1 minute ago, Salacious Kitty said:

Well, that might buy a home outside of Dallas. But if it's like other markets, maybe not. 

Remember that JB and Meech lived in a 2 bedroom home with somewhere around 10+ kids and that Anna and her children currently live in a warehouse with no windows.

What JB and/or Anna would consider to be suitable housing for her and 7 kids is probably not what most of us would find acceptable.   They've got pretty low standards for a lot of things, housing is just one.  I could see JB/Anna buying a 2-3 bedroom shack someplace in Texas and thinking it was perfectly fine.

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crazy8s

crazy8s

(edited)
18 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

Anna owned the lot but not the house? I’m so confused.

Yes, anna's llc owned a vacant lot. This is the new duggar money maker. Most of the adult duggars llcs have been buying vacant lots in Bella Vista and Jase's build master construction has been putting up cookie cutter houses and Joe sells them.. All the lots have been cheap and the houses selling for $350,000 to $450,000.  Dwain Swanson is in this as well. In most all of realtor Joe's listings the lot can be traced back to a duggat llc or swanson properties llc.

Last time i looked Jason's Build Master construction owned about 15 lots. Dwian Swanson about 45. Josiah, Jeer and Jed! have had a few but Jason and Dwain seem the main players.

Josiah, Jason, Jer, Austin and Dwain all had contractors licenses that were valid last time i checked.

ETA - just checked and Jer's contractor's license, listed through Hometown Construction llc, expired in march 2022.

Edited by crazy8s
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CalicoKitty

CalicoKitty

1 hour ago, Cinnabon said:

Anna owned the lot but not the house? I’m so confused.

I still think that any property in any of the kid's LLCs is there in name only.  JB has to sign off on any sales.--or maybe the friendly attorney.  I think it is a tax thing.  Maybe some of the sons have some of their own property in a LLC, but I really think JB is the puppet master.

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farmgal4

farmgal4

20 hours ago, woodscommaelle said:

Sadly I don’t think Josh gives one shit about Anna’s (or their kid’s) day.

My thoughts exactly.  FF is a Level 10 narcissist IMO.

1 hour ago, Notabug said:

Remember that JB and Meech lived in a 2 bedroom home with somewhere around 10+ kids and that Anna and her children currently live in a warehouse with no windows.

What JB and/or Anna would consider to be suitable housing for her and 7 kids is probably not what most of us would find acceptable.   They've got pretty low standards for a lot of things, housing is just one.  I could see JB/Anna buying a 2-3 bedroom shack someplace in Texas and thinking it was perfectly fine.

Do David and Priscilla own their own home and if so, do they have any acreage along with the house?  If so, I could see Anna putting a double-wide trailer on their property and calling it home.

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crazy8s

crazy8s

another possibility for anna moving - Mr Spivey owns a construction business and SIL Justin and son Robby seem to work for him doing flips and remodels.

If Anna was inclined to move to tx and JB was in agreement it would happen. Anna would be under the umbrella of david waller, attend his church with like minded folks like the spiveys and others who attend big sandy family camp, etc. The M kids would have their waller cousins and other friends the know from family camp. It's not like anna would move there and put the kids in school and get a job in the evil world or anything.

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StaceyNotStacie

StaceyNotStacie

11 hours ago, lascuba said:

I'd be shocked if any of that were true, frankly. I won't go as far as to say that Josh doesn't care about his kids, but I just can't see him at all concerned about "outside influences." If he doesn't want Anna moving away from his family, it's because he doesn't want her moving closer to him.

This is what I was thinking. With him in Texas and Anna and the children living in Arkansas, he gets “peace and quiet” with her limited phone calls and visits. If she lives fairly close to the prison, the circus arrives more frequently and he loses his “freedom”. 

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Zella

Zella

55 minutes ago, StaceyNotStacie said:

This is what I was thinking. With him in Texas and Anna and the children living in Arkansas, he gets “peace and quiet” with her limited phone calls and visits. If she lives fairly close to the prison, the circus arrives more frequently and he loses his “freedom”. 

I am pretty sure he only gets 4 visiting hours a month, so it's not like her moving closer means she's dropping in daily. Though whether Anna actually understands that is up for debate. 

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satrunrose

satrunrose

If Josh doesn't want to deal with Anna, protecting children from "outside influences" is always considered a winning argument with these nutters (the hypocrisy! It burns!). 

I don't expect to see Anna making any moves to divorce FF as long as the money keeps rolling in the Duggar clan. But with some big money wasters (FF's defence fund and the weird theatre thing) and an ever growing list of dependent or semi-dependent spouses and grandchildren, I think the money's going to dry up eventually. 

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Zella

Zella

(edited)
8 minutes ago, satrunrose said:

If Josh doesn't want to deal with Anna, protecting children from "outside influences" is always considered a winning argument with these nutters (the hypocrisy! It burns!). 

I don't expect to see Anna making any moves to divorce FF as long as the money keeps rolling in the Duggar clan. But with some big money wasters (FF's defence fund and the weird theatre thing) and an ever growing list of dependent or semi-dependent spouses and grandchildren, I think the money's going to dry up eventually. 

If he really doesn't want to see her or talk to her, he doesn't even have to accept her calls or visit with her. It would be quite easy for him to dodge unwanted contact from the outside without making up excuses.

Edited by Zella
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Zella

Zella

(edited)
26 minutes ago, SMama said:

I think by now Anna has an idea of her fall from grace by association. JB and Pecan Thief didn’t even bother to walk with her after the sentencing. 

Honestly they all seemed in self preservation mode there.* I got the impression Jim Bob and Anna were both very pissed off about the results of the trial and also very uninterested in being photographed/filmed leaving. So, I don't really see them all scattering like rats fleeing a sinking ship as some great symbol of anyone's position or lack thereof in the family. 

I wouldn't be surprised if things are pretty tense and unpleasant in the family dynamic now, but I also think the family has a vested interest in not casting Anna off, even if it is just for the sake of appearance rather than any genuine sentiment. 

*Edited to add: it seemed to me that the family was also much more cagey and controlled in general when they were outside the courthouse after Justin's ill-advised thumbs-up moment.

Edited by Zella
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lascuba

lascuba

10 hours ago, Zella said:

I am pretty sure he only gets 4 visiting hours a month, so it's not like her moving closer means she's dropping in daily. Though whether Anna actually understands that is up for debate. 

He's probably hoping that with time she'll not be so willing to make the hours drive to see him regularly. Considering the books she's alleged to have sent him, I can imagine their conversations are driving him up the wall.

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cmr2014

cmr2014

Aren't all of their assets in Anna's name?

In order to move, Anna would need to cash out family assets. She'd need to cash out more to pay for food, utilities, etc. for the next 10 years since she can't work because of Jesus.

I don't think JB will pony up for a house in TX while she has a place to live and food on the table since he's already provided her with a luxe spread at the warehouse and she's probably eating the same canned Aldi food that he feeds his own family.

I think the issue is that Anna feels unwelcome at the TTH, and she probably is. I don't think J'chelle or the older daughters particularly like her; I doubt that JB and the older sons even notice her; I wouldn't be surprised if she was just lonely and uncomfortable there.

I do think JB'd consider it if David Waller was going to pick up some of the slack in supporting her. She'd still be in the Gothard fold with an acceptable headship and it would probably remove a significant source of stress from his household.

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StaceyNotStacie

StaceyNotStacie

35 minutes ago, lascuba said:

He's probably hoping that with time she'll not be so willing to make the hours drive to see him regularly. Considering the books she's alleged to have sent him, I can imagine their conversations are driving him up the wall.

I’m guessing that he can’t really decline her visits or calls. If word gets back to JB that he’s declining her calls and visits, he might get cut off financially. 

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SMama

SMama

1 minute ago, Cinnabon said:

I assumed Anna was doing that, but could be .

And since Anna doesn’t work outside the home any money comes from JB. 

I saw Makenzye in a few pictures from the cult family camp in Hilary Spivey’s IG. I hope the rest of the Ms were just not photographed but were able to participate. It would be terrible if one of the few regular outlets they had to socialize is abruptly taken away. 

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lascuba

lascuba

30 minutes ago, merylinkid said:

I can just imagine their phone calls.   Anna babbling on about how he is a martyr for Jeebus and how this will only make their relationship stronger while he just says "uh-huh" and "mmm" every so often.    She takes it to mean he  is wholly on board with everything she says.  

Right? Not to sound sympathetic to that asshole, but imagine just starting a decade long prison sentence and all your spouse wants to talk about is how you can use this time to grow closer to god and each other. No one would want to deal with that.

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Minivanessa

Minivanessa

(edited)
17 minutes ago, lascuba said:

Right? Not to sound sympathetic to that asshole, but imagine just starting a decade long prison sentence and all your spouse wants to talk about is how you can use this time to grow closer to god and each other. No one would want to deal with that.

And if he hears from his dad, I bet JB is forever going on about how God intends for Josh to preach the Gospel while in prison, like some 21st Century St. Paul. As I've said before, the delusion in that man runs deep.

ETA: JB having a son in prison for CSAM would shame him, but of COURSE God has called his firstborn Duggar Princeling to preach the gospel in prison which isn't so bad . . . I suppose that's the idea? Hard to know how JB's mind works - but he clearly thinks he's large and in charge, no doubt despite getting a smackdown from a federal judge when testifying in his son's case. Heh.

Edited by Jeeves
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CalicoKitty

CalicoKitty

2 hours ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

David Waller the husband of Anna's sister Priscilla.  His narrative about how he became "saved" at a young age involves him stealing some pecans.

The way I remember it, David and Prissy pulled off the road and stole pecans from someone's orchard.  Maybe 3-4 years ago??

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SMama

SMama

14 minutes ago, Jeeves said:

And if he hears from his dad, I bet JB is forever going on about how God intends for Josh to preach the Gospel while in prison, like some 21st Century St. Paul. As I've said before, the delusion in that man runs deep.

The delusion in all of them runs deep. At this point they should accept the fact that the FF is a deeply disturbed person who has made some heinous choices. No amount of preaching, not even ten years of Jesus Jail is going to change the rot at the core of the FF’s soul. He is a narcissist (like JB & M), misogynist, pedophile, and doesn’t posses the character traits the Duggars love bloviating about. The FF is best left alone, there’s no saving that level of evil. Had JB and M paid as much attention to their children as they did preaching how the rest of us should live they perhaps would have contained the FF. 
 

I sometimes wonder if the siblings are relieved their brother is incarcerated. The way some of the siblings have guarded their privacy makes me think it should be a weight of their shoulders. It will be interesting to see where they all are once the FF is released. 

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Cinnabon

Cinnabon

2 hours ago, SMama said:

And since Anna doesn’t work outside the home any money comes from JB. 

I saw Makenzye in a few pictures from the cult family camp in Hilary Spivey’s IG. I hope the rest of the Ms were just not photographed but were able to participate. It would be terrible if one of the few regular outlets they had to socialize is abruptly taken away. 

I thought people had said that Anna was living off of the proceeds of the sale of their previous house. But who knows?

1 hour ago, lascuba said:

Right? Not to sound sympathetic to that asshole, but imagine just starting a decade long prison sentence and all your spouse wants to talk about is how you can use this time to grow closer to god and each other. No one would want to deal with that.

Yeah, I can’t stand Josh but I can sympathize with how excruciating that would be. 

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