Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[all fall down]

My dryer is finally being fixed tomorrow (*cross fingers*). It's no smart dryer so I don't think I can blame the router, but it did stop working the week the trial started, so I'm not so sure the router is totally innocent. 😃

[JustRosie]

What happens in the weeks/months leading up to Josh’s sentencing hearing? Thank you. 

[Rabbittron]

9 minutes ago, Namaste said:

What happens in the weeks/months leading up to Josh’s sentencing hearing? Thank you. 

Well if Smuggar does get sentenced to be in the Englewood Colorado federal prison then I am going to put my mom's house up for sale because she wants to drive up and down the street where the prison is located and keep screaming out of the window Smuggar are you enjoying your Colorado vacation? But what I really think is funny all the signs saying do not pick up any hitchhikers all along the road the prison is located on. 

[dariafan]

On 1/2/2022 at 2:45 PM, SJC said:

All of my appliances are working well. I assume that my router has repented and is walking the straight & narrow.

Have you asked your Alexa or Google speaker if they plan  to kill your lately ?  Whoever has to monitor my account must either think I’m hilarious or need help 

[woodscommaelle]

12 minutes ago, Rabbittron said:

Well if Smuggar does get sentenced to be in the Englewood Colorado federal prison then I am going to put my mom's house up for sale because she wants to drive up and down the street where the prison is located and keep screaming out of the window Smuggar are you enjoying your Colorado vacation? But what I really think is funny all the signs saying do not pick up any hitchhikers all along the road the prison is located on. 

I'm in the area.  Let me know when your mom plans on doing this.  I'd love to keep her company :).

First time I saw one of those hitchhiker signs, I was blown away.  Never saw anything like that til I moved to Denver.

[dariafan]

3 minutes ago, woodscommaelle said:

I'm in the area.  Let me know when your mom plans on doing this.  I'd love to keep her company :).

First time I saw one of those hitchhiker signs, I was blown away.  Never saw anything like that til I moved to Denver.

That’s my retirement plan to do in ca near the Scientology base.  Just drive up and down yelling you want freedom ???   So I’m team mom 

[Jeeves]

3 hours ago, Namaste said:

What happens in the weeks/months leading up to Josh’s sentencing hearing? Thank you. 

The federal pretrial services folks will be preparing a presentence report that the judge will consider at the sentencing hearing. This page describes the sentencing process in federal court in the Eastern District of Texas, but I think it's generally applicable to the federal district which is handling Josh's case. And in the meantime Josh is in custody at the local county jail.

ETA: The Federal Bureau of Prisons, not the judge, decides where a person will serve their sentence. https://www.bop.gov/inmates/custody_and_care/designations.jsp. Also, unless somebody in the know lets out the information, we won't know where The Family Felon is ultimately sent by the BOP. That information's not a matter of public record. LATER EDIT: see discussion below; the ultimate destination of The Family Felon should be discoverable after he gets there, but not information concerning his evaluation by the BOP or plans concerning his transportation from one place to another.

Edited January 4, 2022 by Jeeves

[SJC]

24 minutes ago, dariafan said:

Have you asked your Alexa or Google speaker if they plan  to kill your lately ?

I'm afraid to. 😉

[libgirl2]

35 minutes ago, dariafan said:

Have you asked your Alexa or Google speaker if they plan  to kill your lately ?  Whoever has to monitor my account must either think I’m hilarious or need help 

My husband refuses to get one of those. Its enough our TV spies on us! Seriously, I googled something Ireland related on my phone and all of a sudden we are getting all these Ireland travel ads! 

[Zella]

4 minutes ago, libgirl2 said:

My husband refuses to get one of those.

Same here. 

There was actually a murder here in Arkansas a few years ago that centered around how much an Amazon Echo speaker heard. 

On topic: One of the things about Josh's case that was interesting to me is that him syncing his iPhone and his computer is a big part of what brought him down. I don't know that the case against him would have been so strong if he hadn't done that. 

Edited January 4, 2022 by Zella

[hathorlive]

50 minutes ago, dariafan said:

Have you asked your Alexa or Google speaker if they plan  to kill your lately ?  Whoever has to monitor my account must either think I’m hilarious or need help 

We kept asking Alexa where the best place was to hide a body.  She kept telling me to call 911.

9 minutes ago, Zella said:

Same here. 

There was actually a murder here in Arkansas a few years ago that centered around how much an Amazon Echo speaker heard. 

On topic: One of the things about Josh's case that was interesting to me is that him syncing his iPhone and his computer is a big part of what brought him down. I don't know that the case against him would have been so strong if he hadn't done that. 

I've never had such a tight case before. I would have died to testify with that evidence.  I don't think most people understand what happens when they blindly click through messages like "we are syncing the contents of your phone to the computer".

[merylinkid]

17 minutes ago, libgirl2 said:

My husband refuses to get one of those. Its enough our TV spies on us! Seriously, I googled something Ireland related on my phone and all of a sudden we are getting all these Ireland travel ads! 

that's nothing.   My HUBBY searches for motorcycle stuff and I am the one who starts getting the ads.   Very annoying.

 

Josh is learning how prison life works now.   He will be interviewed as part of the presentencing report.   His attorneys also get to prepare their own report.   Where they plead he has learned his lesson and won't do this again so he should go home to his wife and kids.   The judge will laugh hilariously while reading this.   

[Zella]

1 minute ago, merylinkid said:

The judge will laugh hilariously while reading this.   

😂😂😂😂😂

Does this mean we get to look forward to another of Brooks's gloriously snarky retort documents bitch-slapping Josh's lawyers one final time or will we just have to treasure this mental image in our mind's eye? 

[Jeeves]

I expect the judge to announce the sentence along with some commentary on how he arrived at that decision, but I also think he'll be a pro, so no snark will be on display. 

Edited January 4, 2022 by Jeeves
Complete sentences are a good thing.

[Zella]

1 minute ago, Jeeves said:

I expect the judge to announce the sentence along some commentary on how he arrived at that decision, but I also think he'll be a pro, so no snark will be on display. 

That's fair! I noticed he was at his most snarky with the seemingly never-ending motions. I sort of envisioned him as a more functional version of Lloyd Bridges in Airplane whenever he had to make his way through reading them. LOL

[Jeeves]

Yeah. The judge may be amused or otherwise entertained by the defense submissions for sentencing, but he'll do his LOL-ing in private, not in open court. 

[Rabbittron]

27 minutes ago, merylinkid said:

 

 

Josh is learning how prison life works now.   He will be interviewed as part of the presentencing report.   His attorneys also get to prepare their own report.   Where they plead he has learned his lesson and won't do this again so he should go home to his wife and kids.   The judge will laugh hilariously while reading this.   

Anybody want to bet that Smuggars lawyers will request that he goes back to Jesus Jail because it really helped him. 

[ginger90]

1 hour ago, Jeeves said:

 Also, unless somebody in the know lets out the information, we won't know where The Family Felon is ultimately sent by the BOP. That information's not a matter of public record.

Actually, it is:

https://www.bop.gov/mobile/find_inmate/

 

One can also sign up here:

 

https://sheriff.washingtoncountyar.gov/res/Detainee.aspx?bn=4241476

[JustRosie]

1 hour ago, Jeeves said:

The federal pretrial services folks will be preparing a presentence report that the judge will consider at the sentencing hearing. This page describes the sentencing process in federal court in the Eastern District of Texas, but I think it's generally applicable to the federal district which is handling Josh's case. And in the meantime Josh is in custody at the local county jail.

ETA: The Federal Bureau of Prisons, not the judge, decides where a person will serve their sentence. https://www.bop.gov/inmates/custody_and_care/designations.jsp. Also, unless somebody in the know lets out the information, we won't know where The Family Felon is ultimately sent by the BOP. That information's not a matter of public record.

Thank you. 

[sue450]

you can po in joshs name in the find an inmate website

 

[GeeGolly]

For the case management programs I run, we occasionally 'lose' clients. We will call area prisons and jails looking for clients with a criminal history. The prisons/jails tell us if they're there, what their sentence is, etc. As far as I know inmates have very little rights to privacy.

[Jeeves]

At this time the Family Felon is not in a federal institution so that information is subject to state/local laws, not federal.

I based my comment above on this statement in the Bureau of Prisons page I linked to in that post, which includes this statement. I read it - including the part I've bolded - as including inmate location information, but people seem to disagree that it does:

Quote

Note: Although general information regarding the designation or transfer process may be provided, specific information about a particular inmate is not public information and may not be released via the telephone or internet. This information may only be obtained by submitting a written request with an original authorization form signed by the inmate. Due to security requirements, certain information, such as an inmate's pending designation site and/or transfer date, will not be released to anyone even if an original authorization form is provided.

So I suppose it means the process information isn't public, but later you can find where the inmate is once they have arrived.

[ginger90]

2 minutes ago, Jeeves said:

but later you can find where the inmate is once they have arrived.

Yes, this is the case.

As stated in the quoted part, for security reasons, transfer particulars would not be made public by the BOP. 

[GeeGolly]

14 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

Yes, this is the case.

As stated in the quoted part, for security reasons, transfer particulars would not be made public by the BOP. 

We don't want MediPlay parachuting into an intersection and commandeering the transport van to free Josh. Because, you know, they have badges and stuff.

[Chicklet]

36 minutes ago, sagittarius sue said:

Years ago when I visited my grandmother in Wisconsin I would drive past the prison in Portage.  I always had a creepy feeling during the time Jeffrey Dahmer was imprisoned there.

I want to see that movie!

Now I just hear the theme song from SNL's "McGruber" in my mind. Medicorps is just that competent.

[Jeeves]

I wonder how The Felon is going to deal with prison life, and in particular with the inevitable DELUGE of Jesus stuff he's going to get from his family including the in-laws. I don't think they are going to leave him alone. They'll send him Jesus books and fill their calls and visits with Jesus talk, and probably sic prison ministry visitors on him too.

Based on some online gossip (which I found somewhat believable), during the trial JB was pressuring all his kids like crazy to pray and maybe do more in support of Josh, and saying if Josh goes to prison he'll be doing a God-given ministry like Paul. If JB really thinks that, he's even more of a delusional twit than I thought he was. 

Will The Felon grow a pair and tell his family thanks for the prayers, but if all you're going to do is preach Jesus to me, I'm going to block you from calling and visiting me? Because I think the only way he tolerated the 24/7/365 fundie religiosity he lived among, was to indulge in his secret pleasures, some of which were kinda nasty while others were atrocious and the reason why he's locked up. He'll have a few years to deal with it all while living at government expense. I don't know if he'll (a) get religion for real, (b) keep on putting up with it without being a burning true believer, or (c) turn his back on it completely. His track record of being passively dependent on his family suggests it might be (b), but this isn't a short stint in Jesus Jail he's facing so who knows?

[Nysha]

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

We don't want MediPlay parachuting into an intersection and commandeering the transport van to free Josh. Because, you know, they have badges and stuff.

For some reason I visualized John running to the transport van screaming "I'm John Duggar!", ala Leeroy Jenkins, while the Bates brothers smack their heads over how he ruined their meticulous hijacking plans.

Leeroy Jenkins battle cry from 2005.

[Quilt Fairy]

18 hours ago, hathorlive said:

I did a DVR examination of an inmate who called his wife and walked her through making meth. 

At least he was making sure she had an income stream while he was inside.

@hathorlive, now that the trial is behind us, do you have any final thoughts on the evidence presented, the defense arguments, etc.? 

Edited January 4, 2022 by Quilt Fairy

[woodscommaelle]

6 hours ago, woodscommaelle said:

I'm in the area.  Let me know when your mom plans on doing this.  I'd love to keep her company :).

And what I mean by 'keeping her company is' this:  I will be driving up and down the street shouting at Josh just like her, @Rabbittron.  Anyone want to join us?  Party in Denver!!!

 

 

[Rabbittron]

6 hours ago, Jeeves said:

At this time the Family Felon is not in a federal 

 

I have to go back to school because I am reading words that aren't there.  I read this ad family friendly felon. 

[Zella]

6 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

For the case management programs I run, we occasionally 'lose' clients. We will call area prisons and jails looking for clients with a criminal history. The prisons/jails tell us if they're there, what their sentence is, etc. As far as I know inmates have very little rights to privacy.

At the library, we don't call the jail, but we regularly keep an eye on the county's public arrest listings that pop up in the paper and a couple of online sites. It's told us why certain patrons weren't responding to our calls about late books. . . . 

[Scarlett45]

Please keep the thread on topic. General asides about federal prisons etc belong in the Small Talk thread. 
 

Several posts have been removed, further off topic tangents will result in warnings. 

[JustRosie]

What does Josh do all day while in protective custody?  Is in a therapy program or does he spend his days eating chips and staring at the walls?

[Rootbeer]

18 minutes ago, Namaste said:

What does Josh do all day while in protective custody?  Is in a therapy program or does he spend his days eating chips and staring at the walls?

He's in the county jail awaiting sentencing.  Those are not set up with long term programs like an actual prison would be.  So, yeah, he's probably alone in his cell most of the time.  He is undergoing evaluation, including psychiatric, to provide the judge with information to aid in his sentencing, but that probably doesn't happen every day and isn't going to take more than an hour or two when it does.

I would presume that, if Josh felt he had a mental health issue and requested care for it, he would be allowed to see a psychiatrist or psychologist just as he would be allowed to see a regular physician if he was diabetic or had high blood pressure. However, Josh is a Duggar and I expect that he and his family think psychiatry is for people who do not have the correct Jesus on their side and would not consider it ever unless they somehow thought it would help him get a lighter sentence.

[JustRosie]

42 minutes ago, Rootbeer said:

He's in the county jail awaiting sentencing.  Those are not set up with long term programs like an actual prison would be.  So, yeah, he's probably alone in his cell most of the time.  He is undergoing evaluation, including psychiatric, to provide the judge with information to aid in his sentencing, but that probably doesn't happen every day and isn't going to take more than an hour or two when it does.

I would presume that, if Josh felt he had a mental health issue and requested care for it, he would be allowed to see a psychiatrist or psychologist just as he would be allowed to see a regular physician if he was diabetic or had high blood pressure. However, Josh is a Duggar and I expect that he and his family think psychiatry is for people who do not have the correct Jesus on their side and would not consider it ever unless they somehow thought it would help him get a lighter sentence.

Thank you. 

[ginger90]

After suffering through some of Jill’s renovation video, this one came up next, about Anna:

 

 

[emmawoodhouse]

14 hours ago, Rootbeer said:

He's in the county jail awaiting sentencing.  Those are not set up with long term programs like an actual prison would be.  So, yeah, he's probably alone in his cell most of the time.  He is undergoing evaluation, including psychiatric, to provide the judge with information to aid in his sentencing, but that probably doesn't happen every day and isn't going to take more than an hour or two when it does.

I would presume that, if Josh felt he had a mental health issue and requested care for it, he would be allowed to see a psychiatrist or psychologist just as he would be allowed to see a regular physician if he was diabetic or had high blood pressure. However, Josh is a Duggar and I expect that he and his family think psychiatry is for people who do not have the correct Jesus on their side and would not consider it ever unless they somehow thought it would help him get a lighter sentence.

But does SMUGGAR care about the "correct Jesus?" With him, I would venture a guess that pride would preclude him from seeking help, if it was recommended by his interviewers.

[Rootbeer]

9 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

But does SMUGGAR care about the "correct Jesus?" With him, I would venture a guess that pride would preclude him from seeking help, if it was recommended by his interviewers.

I think Smuggar cares about the 'correct' Jesus only insofar as expressing that faith keeps his father writing checks.  If Josh was to renounce his parents' beliefs, Daddy might not be so willing to open his wallet any more.  

Even if he isn't really IBLP or whatever anymore, I think Josh is way too arrogant to ask for counseling, unless he thought it might somehow help his appeal or otherwise benefit him in a material sense.  I don't think he's interested in benefiting psychologically/emotionally from therapy; he thinks he's perfect just the way he is.

[GeeGolly]

Josh would be a difficult client to say the least. He'd be the very smug equivalent to a 'but' client. 'But' clients are clients who aren't ready for change for various reasons. Almost every response is started with "but" and excuses follow. Josh would likely forego the 'buts' and start every response with a condescending smile that would make even the most patient and understanding therapist eventually want to smack him. Josh's excuses would be shrouded in 'facts' the lowly therapist couldn't possibly know about.

He's the kind of client you schedule at the end of the day to give yourself time to recover.

[Quilt Fairy]

1 hour ago, Rootbeer said:

Even if he isn't really IBLP or whatever anymore, I think Josh is way too arrogant to ask for counseling, unless he thought it might somehow help his appeal or otherwise benefit him in a material sense.

From what I've read, his desire to "get better" will definitely affect either the sentencing recommendation or his placement or both.  I'm sure SOTDRT Josh is smart enough to play the game. 

[GeeGolly]

1 minute ago, Quilt Fairy said:

From what I've read, his desire to "get better" will definitely affect either the sentencing recommendation or his placement or both.  I'm sure SOTDRT Josh is smart enough to play the game. 

I've also read many will shun services while maintaining their innocence during the appeal process.

[graefin]

14 hours ago, ginger90 said:

After suffering through some of Jill’s renovation video, this one came up next, about Anna:

 

 

Wow, is Anna on some kind of uppers in that clip starting at 9:53? Is it possible to be giddier to speak more quickly?

[JoanArc]

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

He's the kind of client you schedule at the end of the day to give yourself time to recover.

It’s gotta to suck having someone like Josh pretend to humor you. It’s what he’s done his entire life when he got in trouble, and it always worked. Why wouldn’t it work now, with heathens?

[farmgal4]

On 1/3/2022 at 10:42 PM, sue450 said:

so josh was 6 when that blanket training abuse book came out (to train up a child)    how different would he be today if he had been blanket trained??  in fact the first 5 were born before this book came out.....

I don’t think Josh was blanket trained.  

[SMama]

4 minutes ago, farmgal4 said:

I don’t think Josh was blanket trained.  

I think the blanket training began with the second set of twins.

[Rabbittron]

2 hours ago, farmgal4 said:

I don’t think Josh was blanket trained.  

Blanket train the golden child the perfect boy I don't think so.

[Rabbittron]

3 hours ago, graefin said:

Wow, is Anna on some kind of uppers in that clip starting at 9:53? Is it possible to be giddier to speak more quickly?

I liked when Smuggar came to the restaurant and the parents were leaving the table her dad said to her you will(would) alright. We know how that turned out. 

[GeeGolly]

Maybe Anna should find out where this strip mall is.

[Rabbittron]

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

Maybe Anna should find out where this strip mall is.

This looks like some of the strip malls near both my house and my mom's 

[Nysha]

18 hours ago, Rootbeer said:

Even if he isn't really IBLP or whatever anymore, I think Josh is way too arrogant to ask for counseling, unless he thought it might somehow help his appeal or otherwise benefit him in a material sense.  I don't think he's interested in benefiting psychologically/emotionally from therapy; he thinks he's perfect just the way he is.

Therapy for sex offenders starts with them admitting they are sex offenders. I don't think the Family Felon is willing to do that anytime soon.