S01.E08: The Upside Down

[phoenics]

I LOVE THIS SHOW.  I love everything about it.  I - wow!

I'm so glad I finally caught up - I binged it all in less than 24 hours.  The theme music is EPIC 80s theme music and I get this sweet little nostalgic kickback from it that makes me all giddy and excited like I used to be as a kid in the 80s.  

The characters are great - the plotting superior - just an all around great show.  I'm fascinated by Eleven and her storyline and hope she's not gone for good.  Also I hope that we find out more about the Upside Down - is it a parallel universe that really exists and El just formed a connection to it?  Unwittingly?  Or is it that it didn't exist until El connected with the monster?  If it is a parallel universe - what happened to the people?  Were there ever any people in the Upside Down?  I kinda think there weren't - I think it's just a mirror image of our world... through a cracked mirror.  

When watching this and thinking of the Upside Down, I got the feeling that I had read a book about this a long, long time ago - or had some kind of vague memory of a kind of parallel dimension that bad things came through.  I also totally got the love for Dungeons and Dragons, Spielberg, Goonies, etc.. that clip of the Thing brought back childhood nightmares.  I really think they are going for that kind of effect with poor Wil next season.  I also got a bit of a Roswell vibe from it that made me super happy - just with kids rather than teens... the whole us united against the world thing... loved it.  Also the whole kids being outcast part was very Roswellian... I wish that show would come back or reboot.

Loved the Jonathan/Nancy/Steve arc and their scene at the end running from the monster and Steve freaking out.  I too think that Nancy kinda settled for him in the end, but he really did come through at the end too - I loved how he turned away from his douchebaggery too.  

I really think Netflix has hit upon something huge - their shows tend to have much better plotting and characterization overall... just far superior to most tv shows that run over the course of a season.  Perhaps there is something amazing to having writers be able to have a vision, stick to that vision and write it without interference and then just present it as a work of art to be consumed after it's finished.  I truly like that model... it's why I honestly wish a lot of shows that died over the years (Roswell, The Tomorrow People, Firefly, etc) could find a resurgence on Netflix.

About diversity - Yes I would love more diversity though and totally get the arguments on both sides about why it could have more vs why it doesn't - but still would have liked more diversity.  One of the ways a show can be progressive with diversity but still be realistic to the times is by at least not ignoring the racial reality then.  If you go "realism" w.r.t. not having many people of color because of the demographics of the time, then you at least need to show us the PoV of the people of color you do show and illustrate any difficulties they face because of it.  You might as well just add in more diversity as "real" characters and not just foils for the white characters.  You can't have it both ways on the realism front.  So don't argue that diversity is an "anachronism" for the times, but then be fine with them presenting the PoC characters as paper thin stereotypes where racism isn't even noticed or their point of view is not shown.  Because I'm sure every person of color is still a fully human and fully realized being - which means they shouldn't only exist as "foils" to play off the main white characters who get depth in their storytelling.

But that aside - I do really love this show.  Just gave me such awesome feels and what a ride.  Can't wait for S2.  There will be a S2, right?  

[EarlGreyTea]

2 hours ago, phoenics said:

I really think Netflix has hit upon something huge - their shows tend to have much better plotting and characterization overall... just far superior to most tv shows that run over the course of a season.  Perhaps there is something amazing to having writers be able to have a vision, stick to that vision and write it without interference and then just present it as a work of art to be consumed after it's finished.  I truly like that model... it's why I honestly wish a lot of shows that died over the years (Roswell, The Tomorrow People, Firefly, etc) could find a resurgence on Netflix.

 

I agree. Yes, season two is coming in 2017. I am a little (okay, a lot) wary of season two. Season one was one of my favorite seasons of TV ever, and it would be hard to top it in terms of storyline, characterization, cast chemistry, etc. Frankly it's very difficult to strike gold twice, even for established showrunners. But the Netflix formula, and the fact that there will be only 9 episodes next season, have me hopeful.

I like that this episode could have served as a series finale just fine - some loose ends, but could stand alone if needed. I need a season two because I can't stand the thought of that poor kid Eleven either being dead or being stuck forever in the Upside Down. Without ever having gone to the Snow Ball or discovering maple syrup on her Eggos!

Tidbit for this episode: Originally, Mike was going to carry Eleven to the science classroom, but he couldn't  lift her so Dustin/Gaten had to do it. Might have been a nice touch for Lucas to do it, but maybe he couldn't lift her either, lol.

[blueray]

Wow that was awesome! I have no idea why it took me so long to give it a try. I loved the 80's throw back stuff, such as the nerdy friends and the school bullies. I love Eleven's character, and really hope that she survived. It seems like she did as it showed the sheriff hiding food for her. I'm thinking she got sucked into the other demention. And the end with the kid puking up snakes shows that he was definitely infected. He was freaked out, which makes it seem like he is at least Will.  Overall, I can't wait for next season :).

[Bo-Peep22]

  Hopper selling out Eleven, to me, seemed to have more to do with his daughter than anything else. Not to say that he didn't want to save all the kids or anything but you have to remember...he spent most of his time with Joyce (Will's Mother) and as such began to see himself in her. I think, in his mind, saving Will and reuniting him with his family somehow made up for his daughter being gone (doing all the things he had wanted to do for his daughter for Will.)

   I loved Natalia Dyer's (Nancy) role and she was such a treat to watch. (Does anyone else think she looks a lot like Crystal Reed from Teen Wolf?) I also really enjoyed all the boys and their dynamic. I kind of wish they would have explored Lucas' jealousy a little more because he seemed ready to run Elle over with a car for like 6-7 episodes straight-it was almost weird to see him change his mind so fast.

The pacing of the show was a little choppy at times (I also questioned why no one seemed to give a hoot about Barb) and at times it felt as if the boys cared more about all the cool things Eleven could do than finding their friend (Mike anyways) however overall this was one of the best shows I've seen in quite some time.

[blueray]

Quote

(Does anyone else think she looks a lot like Crystal Reed from Teen Wolf

I thought it was just me. I actually looked up to see if it was her or not. She really looks like her.

[breezy424]

I enjoyed the series.  The actors who played the kids were so good.

IMO, Eleven will be back.  I don't think this was the first time that Hopper left food in that box and that box was empty.  And he left Eggo's.  I don't know how they'll explain it but I don't think she's gone.

I still can't figure out Hopper getting into the car with the 'officials'.  I have no idea if it was the good guys or the bad guys.  I also understand why he made the deal.  He was saving more lives by making it.  It was very sad but he did what he had to do.

As for wishing the cast was more diversified.  The setting was a rural midwest town in the eighties.  That's what rural midwest towns in the eighties looked like.  This setting and decade was used for a reason, and I think most of us understand that so I won't expand on it.  One of things that was important was that the era was 'realistic'.  The buildings, clothes, furniture, electronics, etc.  It was important to make it seem authentic.  Having a racially or ethnically diverse cast would not work.  It wouldn't have been authentic.  Yes.  It's a crazy story but part of being able to be enthralled by it is the normalcy of the setting and life of the era.  Stories don't have to always have ethnically or racially diverse characters.  And actually, stories are better when they are a reflection of real life rather than having a 'token' fill in the blank.  The fact is that 'real' life is not as diverse as so many producers and writers like to think.  And that applies to all racial, ethnic, sexual orientation, etc. groups.  People tend to gravitate to the familiar.

I'm not quite understanding what people want with this.  Should they have had an Asian?  What about a Latino?  What about a gay?  What about an Italian for that matter (pick a group)?  Should Joyce have been a professional instead of a clerk in a general store?  Life is life.  The world is not perfect.  And I don't want 'perfect' in stories because that's not what real life is.  And that doesn't make me prejudiced or a racist.  I'm a realist.

Lastly, I think the reason why they didn't get more into Barb's disappearance and the concerns of her parents was because it was just a consequence of time restraints.  It was eight episodes.  I feel the same about the other boys' parents.  They could only do so much given the number of episodes.  Maybe next season they'll get into that more.  Poor Barb....

Edited November 21, 2016 by breezy424

[SlackerInc]

That was pretty good, but definitely overrated by most, IMO.  A couple questions/quibbles:

--Weren't they a little quick to go for the fire extinguisher?  I mean, I guess I understand wanting to save the house, but I think that's a pretty secondary/tertiary concern compared to making sure the monster gets good and torched.

--Not only did coming for El with guns drawn instead of tranq guns seem ill-advised for their mission, it seems they never came up with any strategy to keep El from doing what she did.  Or was it, on Hopper's part, like Zapp Branigan on Futurama, who won a major battle by "throwing wave after wave of my own men at the killbots until their kill counters couldn't go any higher"?  The woman who seemed to be his right-hand person got shit duty in that case.

[millennium]

The whole series seemed kind of tired to me, possibly because I saw all the movies this show tried to emulate long ago.

I can see why someone who didn't grow up reading Stephen King or watching Spielberg movies might enjoy it.   To them, it may seem fresh.   For me, it was like reheated leftovers. 

I liked the performance of the actor who played the sheriff. 

That's all I got.

[pasdetrois]

Just binged over the holidays. I appreciate that this series can be enjoyed by kids, but I was often bored. All the derivation was predictable. I needed much less of the frantic bicycling and screeching moms and more of the bad guys' back story and monster views.

It's always a mixed bag when you have lots of young actors. However I felt that Millie Bobby Brown and Charlie Heaton were outstanding; the four boys were pretty realistic too.

Random: El's swimming onesie took me to Kanye's "fashion collection," and Steve's voluminous bouffant reminded me of Chewbacca.

Also, the bad wigs didn't promote the storyline at all, nor remind me of the 80s.

Edited January 5, 2017 by pasdetrois

[methodwriter85]

On 12/23/2016 at 9:12 PM, millennium said:

The whole series seemed kind of tired to me, possibly because I saw all the movies this show tried to emulate long ago.

I can see why someone who didn't grow up reading Stephen King or watching Spielberg movies might enjoy it.   To them, it may seem fresh.   For me, it was like reheated leftovers. 

I liked the performance of the actor who played the sheriff. 

That's all I got.

I think the big part of the appeal is that it's basically appealing to the nostalgia of those movies. It's one big long movie, done in the style of the 1980's. That's the draw for the devoted fans- if you're not an 80's nostalgia buff and the homages to 80's scifi movies doesn't make you smile, then a big part of the appeal is lost to you. I don't think it's ever supposed to have been something that felt "fresh"- it's supposed to stir a nostalgic longing for when there used to be movies and t.v. shows like this, and a time when kids were allowed to ride off on their own and explore their world before everyone got too panicked over missing child cases.

That's pretty much a big hook to me when it comes to the show. I simply love the 1980's and this show has done such a great job of making everything look and feel like the 1980's.

[millennium]

1 hour ago, methodwriter85 said:

I think the big part of the appeal is that it's basically appealing to the nostalgia of those movies. It's one big long movie, done in the style of the 1980's. That's the draw for the devoted fans- if you're not an 80's nostalgia buff and the homages to 80's scifi movies doesn't make you smile, then a big part of the appeal is lost to you. I don't think it's ever supposed to have been something that felt "fresh"- it's supposed to stir a nostalgic longing for when there used to be movies and t.v. shows like this, and a time when kids were allowed to ride off on their own and explore their world before everyone got too panicked over missing child cases.

That's pretty much a big hook to me when it comes to the show. I simply love the 1980's and this show has done such a great job of making everything look and feel like the 1980's.

I came up in the 1980s.  I was there.  I lived it.   I remember it.   This series seemed more like a pastiche to me.   It didn't evoke fond memories or stir old emotions.   It did remind me of King, Spielberg and Carpenter.  If you're into the 80s, I would recommend an episode of Black Mirror (also on Netflix) called "San Junipero."  You might like it.  

(Just as an aside, I don't think modern concern over missing child cases is misplaced.   We don't have to worry about monsters from parallel dimensions anymore.   We have monsters aplenty lurking in our schools, neighborhoods, etc.)

[methodwriter85]

2 hours ago, millennium said:

I came up in the 1980s.  I was there.  I lived it.   I remember it.   This series seemed more like a pastiche to me.   It didn't evoke fond memories or stir old emotions.   It did remind me of King, Spielberg and Carpenter.  If you're into the 80s, I would recommend an episode of Black Mirror (also on Netflix) called "San Junipero."  You might like it.  

(Just as an aside, I don't think modern concern over missing child cases is misplaced.   We don't have to worry about monsters from parallel dimensions anymore.   We have monsters aplenty lurking in our schools, neighborhoods, etc.)

Good point about that. I was born in 1985. The Duffer brothers were born in 1984. I think there's a general fascination my age group has with the 1980's because it was the decade we were born in. Some are more fervent than others, but since we didn't really live through them, the movies are really what we have to go by.

[millennium]

On 1/8/2017 at 5:58 PM, methodwriter85 said:

Good point about that. I was born in 1985. The Duffer brothers were born in 1984. I think there's a general fascination my age group has with the 1980's because it was the decade we were born in. Some are more fervent than others, but since we didn't really live through them, the movies are really what we have to go by.

IMO, what makes things seem so great back then (even better than they actually were) is how really bad things are now.   If the country had a bright outlook today, it would be reflected in the arts (movies, music, TV, etc.) and the 1980s would be just a kitschy memory.   That positive, upbeat atmosphere flamed out in the early 1990s and has never returned.   I don't know if it ever will.

I did appreciate some of the music in this series although I could have done without The Clash.   Joy Division was a surprise.   They were a minor band in the 80s, more of a cult following; New Order was by far more popular.   I was heavily invested in music in the 80s but never seriously considered Joy Division until much, much later.   "Shadowplay" is my favorite by them.

Edited January 10, 2017 by millennium

[janie jones]

On 1/10/2017 at 10:58 AM, millennium said:

I did appreciate some of the music in this series although I could have done without The Clash.

I could have done without the same Clash song over and over.  I don't even remember what song they used, but I remember yelling at the TV,  "The Clash had more than one song, you know!"

[millennium]

1 hour ago, janie jones said:

I could have done without the same Clash song over and over.  I don't even remember what song they used, but I remember yelling at the TV,  "The Clash had more than one song, you know!"

"Should I Stay or Should I Go?"

And my answer?   The same answer I've given since the first day I heard that shitty ditty:  

GO!

[janie jones]

Well, yeah.  If you go there will be trouble, and if you stay it will be double, that's quite a strong argument in favor of going, if you ask me.

[fallaway]

On 7/23/2016 at 5:38 PM, smices said:

I think Will is trying to convince himself that he's fine. Or he's keeping it to himself. He's caused enough trouble for his Mom and friends and doesn't want them to worry.

Or the monster gestating inside him is taking over his mind. They showed that clip from "The Thing" for a reason.

I'm thinking there will shades of "Invasion of the Body Snatchers", too. Dennis Hopper was a main character and the crucial reveal. Just a coincidence that we have a character named Hopper in this show?

[Lamima]

Just binge watched today. It was a decent show. Not my favorite, would be Westworld currently, but up there with Walking Dead in that it held my attention and entertained. There were some holes that bugged, but not so many that I had to shut it off after 2-3 episodes (like I did recently with Rectify).

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I loved that when interrogated at the Hawkins Lab, both Joyce and Hopper told Brenner and the other government people to go fuck themselves. No matter how much Joyce wanted to find Will, she wasn't about to trust them or cooperate with them. But I think that's part of the reason why Hopper gave up Eleven's location. He was sacrificing one person in order to save Joyce, Will, Mike, Lucas, and Dustin, and he knew Joyce would never be the one to try to strike a deal.

Hilarious that Dustin suspected the lunch lady was hoarding pudding cups. That's the kind of thing that kids say but never get to prove, so I was glad when he opened the refrigerator and found it full of pudding!

Poor El - she finally got out of the lab, made some friends, and thought she might get to have a normal life, only to sacrifice herself in order to vanquish the demon.

As for how the monster got out in the first place, Mr. Clarke explained that the only way to create a gate/portal to another dimension is with a tremendous amount of energy. El was in the nowhere place which allowed her to astral project to other places. When she touched the monster and it turned around, she was so scared that she screamed and presumably released a huge amount of psychic energy, creating a portal that allowed the monster into her real dimension. Back in the lab, the power went out which was either a sign of her energy, a sign that she created the portal, and/or a sign that the monster was nearby.

I still don't like Steve, but I have to give him credit for going back into the house and helping Nancy and Jonathan kick some ass.

My nitpick is how the Byers managed to repair, clean, and redecorate their house in the month between Will's disappearance and Christmas. It's not like Joyce suddenly got a raise, so how could they afford all of that AND an Atari?

[Ottis]

I don't get the love for this show. It wasn't particularly strange, in the world of sci-fi. It fell into the trope of characters not talking to each other, and the resulting, unnecessary misunderstandings. Worst of all, it focused far too much on the kids, and kid drama, and not nearly enough on what the hell is actually going on with the govt program and the ramifications of what those sorts of powers might do. Many questions were left unanswered, not the least of which was why Will lived and others died. And did they pass an Alien-style egg at one point? I kept waiting for something interesting and aside from the sheriff actually being a good cop, there wasn't much. It was like sci-fi for masses. 

[supposebly]

I kept putting it off because a friend of mine, although loving it also said it scared her a lot. Maybe because she has a son Will's age.

I liked it a lot. Since I didn't grow up in North America it felt more like a homage to all those movies and TV shows, so I wouldn't have been able to tell if the clothes and music were exactly right. I was a teenager in Germany in the 80s and so things were a bit different and also a bit similar. I wish my parents had been so oblivious.

El's actress saved a lot of it as well as the boys and overall, they kept me engaged. Scary, yes but nothing too bad. I don't really see it as Sci-Fi. More horror or fantasy. A bit Mary Shelley's Frankenstein in the idea that science can go too far with a mad and cruel scientist included.

But I'm having a hard time believing in Steve's hair. But then, I have suppressed (repressed?) a lot of the hair of the 80s. 

Edited July 21, 2017 by supposebly

[Paloma]

On 1/8/2017 at 1:29 PM, methodwriter85 said:

On 12/23/2016 at 9:12 PM, millennium said:

The whole series seemed kind of tired to me, possibly because I saw all the movies this show tried to emulate long ago.

I can see why someone who didn't grow up reading Stephen King or watching Spielberg movies might enjoy it.   To them, it may seem fresh.   For me, it was like reheated leftovers. 

I liked the performance of the actor who played the sheriff. 

That's all I got.

I think the big part of the appeal is that it's basically appealing to the nostalgia of those movies. It's one big long movie, done in the style of the 1980's. That's the draw for the devoted fans- if you're not an 80's nostalgia buff and the homages to 80's scifi movies doesn't make you smile, then a big part of the appeal is lost to you. I don't think it's ever supposed to have been something that felt "fresh"- it's supposed to stir a nostalgic longing for when there used to be movies and t.v. shows like this, and a time when kids were allowed to ride off on their own and explore their world before everyone got too panicked over missing child cases.

That's pretty much a big hook to me when it comes to the show. I simply love the 1980's and this show has done such a great job of making everything look and feel like the 1980's.

I didn't love the 1980s (grew up in the 1950s-60s, young adult in 1970s-80s) but my husband and I are both fans of Stephen King and Spielberg and this series had the same appeal of those books and (especially) movies. The 1980s (and even the earlier decades) were not so great for many people, but they were definitely more innocent, especially before mid-1980s. This series made me think about the contrast between my free-range childhood in a small town and my daughter's closely supervised childhood in the mid-1980s-1990s--in mine the monsters were mostly imagined (as far as most people knew), but in hers the monsters were very real and regularly on the news. 

[Casually Observant]

On 9/13/2016 at 2:12 PM, phoenics said:

"Loved the Jonathan/Nancy/Steve arc and their scene at the end running from the monster and Steve freaking out.  I too think that Nancy kinda settled for him in the end, but he really did come through at the end too - I loved how he turned away from his douchebaggery, too. "

I also hope that Steve really has turned away from his douchebaggery fully, and I am glad he came back and helped, instead of running away as we imagine he would have, before he had his epiphany and realization that his friends were sh*t and Nancy was a nice, worthwhile girl he shouldn't take for granted.  Perhaps him seeing her and Jonathan being so ridiculously brave, he just couldn't reveal that he was a coward and a weakling, now could he?  Plus, he needed to defend Nancy from the horrible creature and not look less brave than Jonathan.

Also, in those small towns like that, the selection of choices for romantic partners is kind of limited and you often settle a little bit.  It's true that Jonathan was a very decent guy, but Nancy was attracted to Steve and not Jonathan, and sexual attraction is a very powerful thing. Also, with Jonathan's very poor upbringing, she just couldn't see life with him.

"Yes I would love more diversity though and totally get the arguments on both sides about why it could have more vs why it doesn't - but still would have liked more diversity.  One of the ways a show can be progressive with diversity but still be realistic to the times is by at least not ignoring the racial reality then.  If you go "realism" w.r.t. not having many people of color because of the demographics of the time, then you at least need to show us the PoV of the people of color you do show and illustrate any difficulties they face because of it.  You might as well just add in more diversity as "real" characters and not just foils for the white characters.  You can't have it both ways on the realism front."

I disagree with you completely regarding the 'requirement of forced diversity' seemingly in every show nowadays. What you are saying is we must show difficulties of the people of color in every show even if it isn't a part of the story or if there was no racism or difficulties in reality?  Really?  How so? For what reason? To create a separation and a conflict when there was none? What I liked is that the whites and blacks were just PEOPLE. The sheriff's deputies were white and black.  The kids were white and black. The parents were white and black.  The science teacher's girlfriend was Asian.  It was not an issue.  No one noticed.  Isn't that what we hope for?

"So don't argue that diversity is an "anachronism" for the times, but then be fine with them presenting the PoC characters as paper thin stereotypes where racism isn't even noticed or their point of view is not shown.  Because I'm sure every person of color is still a fully human and fully realized being - which means they shouldn't only exist as "foils" to play off the main white characters who get depth in their storytelling."

Who says they were foils?  Where are you coming from?  When I grew up, the very large neighborhood I grew up in was 95% white. But the 5% non-whites were just PEOPLE. No one cared that they weren't white. They acted the same as everybody else.  In fact, due to their 'uniqueness' they were well known and very popular for the most part. We even voted one black young man our Homecoming King. Why?  Because we liked him.  There was no issue with race even back then (1970's) in my community, at least not amongst the youth who grew up together.

So to my mind, you are inserting conflict where there was none, at least not in my experience.

 

 

On 11/16/2016 at 1:16 PM, Bo-Peep22 said:

 "Hopper selling out Eleven, to me, seemed to have more to do with his daughter than anything else. Not to say that he didn't want to save all the kids or anything but you have to remember...he spent most of his time with Joyce (Will's Mother) and as such began to see himself in her.  I think, in his mind, saving Will and reuniting him with his family somehow made up for his daughter being gone (doing all the things he had wanted to do for his daughter for Will.)"

Now, where did it actually say that he sold her out?  I remember him saying that they agreed not to tell the other people that the military facility was the reason for the missing people. Which kind of sucks. But we were not privy to the conversation.  I reserve the possibility that he did no such thing. She did 'disappear' when she vanquished the monster didn't she?  She knew this would happen, because she said, "Goodbye, Will."   So, please tell, how did the Sheriff sell her out?

"I loved Natalia Dyer's (Nancy) role and she was such a treat to watch."

I felt she was bordering on anorexic and was concerned for her. That Hollywood pressure can be too much for a young actor/actress.  I hope she gets healthier during the hiatus.

The pacing of the show was a little choppy at times (I also questioned why no one seemed to give a hoot about Barb)..." 

Yes! Poor Barb.  Geez!

 

On 11/20/2016 at 10:35 PM, breezy424 said:

"I enjoyed the series.  The actors who played the kids were so good.  IMO, Eleven will be back.  I don't think this was the first time that Hopper left food in that box and that box was empty.  And he left Eggo's.  I don't know how they'll explain it but I don't think she's gone."

Of course she will be back.  She's too important to the story.

"I still can't figure out Hopper getting into the car with the 'officials'.  I have no idea if it was the good guys or the bad guys.  I also understand why he made the deal.  He was saving more lives by making it.  It was very sad but he did what he had to do."

I hope we learn the answer to this.

"As for wishing the cast was more diversified.  The setting was a rural midwest town in the eighties.  That's what rural midwest towns in the eighties looked like.  This setting and decade was used for a reason, and I think most of us understand that so I won't expand on it.  One of things that was important was that the era was 'realistic'.  The buildings, clothes, furniture, electronics, etc.  It was important to make it seem authentic.  Having a racially or ethnically diverse cast would not work.  It wouldn't have been authentic.  Yes.  It's a crazy story but part of being able to be enthralled by it is the normalcy of the setting and life of the era.  Stories don't have to always have ethnically or racially diverse characters.  And actually, stories are better when they are a reflection of real life rather than having a 'token' fill in the blank.  The fact is that 'real' life is not as diverse as so many producers and writers like to think.  And that applies to all racial, ethnic, sexual orientation, etc. groups.  People tend to gravitate to the familiar."

True statement.

"I'm not quite understanding what people want with this.  Should they have had an Asian?  What about a Latino?  What about a gay?  What about an Italian for that matter (pick a group)?  Should Joyce have been a professional instead of a clerk in a general store?  Life is life.  The world is not perfect.  And I don't want 'perfect' in stories because that's not what real life is.  And that doesn't make me prejudiced or a racist.  I'm a realist."

I too, shake my head at the few who are complaining.  Let's give credit where credit is due. 1/4 of the boys were black, 1/3 of the Sheriff & deputies were black.  One of the doctors/teachers was black and the science teacher's date was Asian. They constantly talked about Will Byers being picked on for allegedly being gay.  They made the bullies white kids, made them unlikeable and doled out serious punishment for their transgressions. 

I wonder if those complaining here also complain against the shows that show very skewed lifestyles as favorable and normal when in reality they are rarely like that and very limited.  

 

 

On 12/23/2016 at 7:12 PM, millennium said:

"The whole series seemed kind of tired to me, possibly because I saw all the movies this show tried to emulate long ago.

I can see why someone who didn't grow up reading Stephen King or watching Spielberg movies might enjoy it.   To them, it may seem fresh.   For me, it was like reheated leftovers. 

I liked the performance of the actor who played the sheriff. 

That's all I got."

Yes, me too. I felt like it was similar to one of the lightweight summertime novels I read when I was a kid.  Fun, a little scary, clueless parents (except Sheriff Hopper) and just enough bad kids and good kids to round out the story. Simple fun.  I enjoyed it.  Also loved Sheriff Hopper.

 

On 7/12/2017 at 6:44 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

"I loved that when interrogated at the Hawkins Lab, both Joyce and Hopper told Brenner and the other government people to go fuck themselves. No matter how much Joyce wanted to find Will, she wasn't about to trust them or cooperate with them. But I think that's part of the reason why Hopper gave up Eleven's location. He was sacrificing one person in order to save Joyce, Will, Mike, Lucas, and Dustin, and he knew Joyce would never be the one to try to strike a deal."

Maybe, just maybe he hoped that Eleven was so smart that she would be able to get herself out of their clutches again before too long.

"My nitpick is how the Byers managed to repair, clean, and redecorate their house in the month between Will's disappearance and Christmas. It's not like Joyce suddenly got a raise, so how could they afford all of that AND an Atari?"

Perhaps part of the 'deal' with the military group was to restore Joyce's house to like new and pay for all of her kids medical care and trauma counseling, along with a hefty settlement to keep her quiet!  Either that or homeowner's insurance!

[Mom x 3]

On 7/12/2017 at 8:44 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

My nitpick is how the Byers managed to repair, clean, and redecorate their house in the month between Will's disappearance and Christmas. It's not like Joyce suddenly got a raise, so how could they afford all of that AND an Atari?

This is a small town.  Joyce's son died and she essentially went crazy (to them).  I can easily see the whole town pitching in to help her fix up the house when Will was found to be alive.  

Quote

"I loved Natalia Dyer's (Nancy) role and she was such a treat to watch."

I felt she was bordering on anorexic and was concerned for her. That Hollywood pressure can be too much for a young actor/actress.  I hope she gets healthier during the hiatus.

She was thin, but she looked healthy to me.  Not to be pervy, but when her shirt was off she didn't have pencil stick arms and her ribs weren't protruding or anything.  

[kokapetl]

I found the show quite good, but it seemed a little poorly thought out and underdone. Except for Winona’s acting, that was way overdone. 

I don’t think the police chief sold out Eleven, the circumstances simply required that he make a deal if he was to be freed and assist anyone. Plus I think he knows more about Eleven and the project than what we’ve seen. He must’ve had other knowledge and leverage to bargain with to get that deal. Then again, the lab was staffed with dimwits who should’ve seen their deaths coming.

[Ottis]

On 1/8/2017 at 11:29 AM, methodwriter85 said:

I think the big part of the appeal is that it's basically appealing to the nostalgia of those movies. It's one big long movie, done in the style of the 1980's. That's the draw for the devoted fans- if you're not an 80's nostalgia buff and the homages to 80's scifi movies doesn't make you smile, then a big part of the appeal is lost to you. I don't think it's ever supposed to have been something that felt "fresh"- it's supposed to stir a nostalgic longing for when there used to be movies and t.v. shows like this, and a time when kids were allowed to ride off on their own and explore their world before everyone got too panicked over missing child cases.

That's pretty much a big hook to me when it comes to the show. I simply love the 1980's and this show has done such a great job of making everything look and feel like the 1980's.

The funny thing is, the people I know who love this show aren’t science function fans and aren’t 80s fans (most are too young). This is sci-fi light for people who think it is scary. I did grow up in the 80s, and liked them, and I didn’t think this show was especially 80s aside from the clothes and cars. 

[bettername2come]

Rewatching for the umpteenth time and I just noticed how Hopper comments that they made it look like "that little girl just ran away" and I realized he meant Barbara since they're not acknowledging El's existence at all and all I can think about it all the issues he has after his daughter's death that he'll refer to any girl as a little girl. 

[Taryn74]

49 minutes ago, bettername2come said:

Rewatching for the umpteenth time and I just noticed how Hopper comments that they made it look like "that little girl just ran away" and I realized he meant Barbara since they're not acknowledging El's existence at all and all I can think about it all the issues he has after his daughter's death that he'll refer to any girl as a little girl. 

:(

[Emily Thrace]

On 9/13/2016 at 4:12 PM, phoenics said:

About diversity - Yes I would love more diversity though and totally get the arguments on both sides about why it could have more vs why it doesn't - but still would have liked more diversity.  One of the ways a show can be progressive with diversity but still be realistic to the times is by at least not ignoring the racial reality then.  If you go "realism" w.r.t. not having many people of color because of the demographics of the time, then you at least need to show us the PoV of the people of color you do show and illustrate any difficulties they face because of it.  You might as well just add in more diversity as "real" characters and not just foils for the white characters.  You can't have it both ways on the realism front.  So don't argue that diversity is an "anachronism" for the times, but then be fine with them presenting the PoC characters as paper thin stereotypes where racism isn't even noticed or their point of view is not shown.  Because I'm sure every person of color is still a fully human and fully realized being - which means they shouldn't only exist as "foils" to play off the main white characters who get depth in their storytelling.

To me diversity for diversity sake feel wrong in any kind of historical context. For one its patronising and treats POC as window dressing. For another it minimises and erases the fact that we were excluded from white spaces for so long. Lucas being the only black kid in town is a part of his story and a very real experience for many young POC. Bringing in false diversity is its own form of whitewashing the past . The only purpose it seems to serve is to make white people feel better. I suppose you could argue it creates jobs for POC but this has done that.

I agree that Lucas's character could use some work but that a combination of a lot of things. It not necessarily racist and more a result of his function in the story. Lucas exists to push back against Elle and since she is one of the main antagonists it makes his character seem petty. 

Also in regards to the Upside Down its possible if reality is truly different there then the building and tree roots aren't really there its just how humans interpret things. Our minds do a lot of the creating of our reality it possible if light is different there that none of the building are really there its just how our brains are making sense of something that doesn't make sense. 

Edited July 4, 2019 by Emily Thrace
My computer posted the reply before it was finished.

[phoenics]

Nevermind.

Edited July 6, 2019 by phoenics

[foxfreakinmulder]

I just finished my rewatch of season 1 last night and must say I'm glad I waited until after season 3 to watch from the beginning again. I forgot a lot of what happened. I didn't remember the kids at the school or Hopper and Joyce walking through the upside down. I really enjoyed it.

Casting did such a great job finding these kids. I think Dustin has always been my favorite.

Mike was sweet when he was telling El she could live with him and his family and his mom would cook anything she wanted and of course El asked if she would make eggo's.

I loved that when all the boys finally accepted Eleven they were caring and protected of her.

Yay! The nail bat has made it's appearance.

Steve gets the girl. :-)

On to season 2

[Taryn74]

Anyone else just go in and revisit this show from time to time? I decided yesterday afternoon to give it a rewatch and finished S1 tonight. Dang but I had forgotten just how GOOD this show is! Several scenes made me cry and/or gave me chills for real. So incredibly well acted. I especially enjoyed Jonathon and Hopper each in their own way trying to get Joyce to see reality without being too harsh on her (before they realized she wasn't imagining things) and Jonathon after a certain point just not being able to handle it anymore.

I don't remember if I've shared this later on during the series or not, but the kid who was Mike's double for the first two seasons, is the son of a friend of mine. She shared the van-flipping scene with us (privately, of course) long before the show ever came out and I had actually forgotten about it until that scene aired, and then I was almost fan-girling because I knew one of the kids in the scene. Heh.

I know it gets discussed later on, but I really love the way the other kids are obviously from more well-off families than Will, but they never once make it an issue. The parents may be a little standoffish, but the kids never are. I love that.

[smartymarty]

On 11/24/2016 at 9:48 PM, SlackerInc said:

That was pretty good, but definitely overrated by most, IMO.  A couple questions/quibbles:

--Weren't they a little quick to go for the fire extinguisher?  I mean, I guess I understand wanting to save the house, but I think that's a pretty secondary/tertiary concern compared to making sure the monster gets good and torched.

--Not only did coming for El with guns drawn instead of tranq guns seem ill-advised for their mission, it seems they never came up with any strategy to keep El from doing what she did.  Or was it, on Hopper's part, like Zapp Branigan on Futurama, who won a major battle by "throwing wave after wave of my own men at the killbots until their kill counters couldn't go any higher"?  The woman who seemed to be his right-hand person got shit duty in that case.

Putting out the fire seemed early to us, too. I assumed the monster was dead then, thus didn't understand when it came back.
Your second point makes a lot of sense.

My additional quibble was Will saying he wanted to wash his hands before dinner, which aroused the confusion of his mom and brother. Why not just say "I have to go to the bathroom"? (And after all he'd been through, why wouldn't he tell someone about the large guppies he's choking up?)

Agree with whoever commented on Steve's hair (both that I don't recall any guy having hair like that, and that he looked like Chewbacca).

On 2/4/2017 at 9:47 AM, fallaway said:

I'm thinking there will shades of "Invasion of the Body Snatchers", too. Dennis Hopper was a main character and the crucial reveal. Just a coincidence that we have a character named Hopper in this show?

In the re-make of Body Snatchers, you mean. I watched the 1956 original when I was a kid in the 70s (ran on TV on a weekend afternoon, probably). It was quite scary (pod people!!), whereas the re-make I found lacking.

Quote

I don't get the love for this show. It wasn't particularly strange, in the world of sci-fi. It fell into the trope of characters not talking to each other, and the resulting, unnecessary misunderstandings. Worst of all, it focused far too much on the kids, and kid drama, and not nearly enough on what the hell is actually going on with the govt program and the ramifications of what those sorts of powers might do. Many questions were left unanswered, not the least of which was why Will lived and others died.

I was annoyed by the similarities to other movies/Stephen King, etc. Write something original! I found the season entertaining enough for a summer watch, and will continue watching the following seasons, but hope the "nostalgia" stops. I was quite surprised to read comments here loving the show for that aspect. I graduated high school in 1983; the only aspect I enjoyed was the freedom of kids on bikes.
 

Regarding diversity, realistic or not, the creators CHOSE to set this in a white town. There did exist primarily black towns, as well as towns divided as to black and white (as now). So the question should not be whether realistic or anachronistic, but why did the creators choose a white town? They had options.

[Hotel Snarker]

On 8/4/2022 at 11:26 AM, smartymarty said:

I graduated high school in 1983; the only aspect I enjoyed was the freedom of kids on bikes.

And don’t forget MTV! Video did kill the radio star indeed.