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Track & Field: Insert Latest Scandal here

selkie

By selkie
in 2016 Olympics

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La Dee Da

La Dee Da

I have a ton of respect for what Usain has accomplished and how he did it. But I'm so excited for Andre! He started running four years ago - he's just getting started! Whoooo!

1 minute ago, Growsonwalls said:

On the other hand all this cheering and him running a victory lap with a stuffed animal makes me miss "classic" track and field where the end of the race was marked by stare-downs, walking off the field without a handshake, and accusations of doping flying back and forth before the winner even takes a victory lap. Anyone remember those days of track? 

The CBC is almost squeeing over the brotherly camaraderie between some of the runners although the announcers did say two of the finalists refuse to speak to each other, so maybe it's not all changed?

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Cherpumple
Cherpumple

For those wondering about Michael Johnson's reaction to seeing his record being broken, he was extremely gracious. He was genuinely impressed (almost speechless) with how well Van Nieuwkerk ran and ke

Aliconehead
Aliconehead

Not to be rude. Please call her by name, Michelle Carter.  She worked very hard for this and deserves to be recognized for it and not referred by a male in her life.   This has been a running theme in

MyAimIsTrue
MyAimIsTrue

Did you guys see the clip of the US and New Zealand 5000m racers falling during their semi heat, help each other up, and encourage each other to finish even though one girl could barely walk?  It was

Growsonwalls

Growsonwalls

1 minute ago, galaxygirl76 said:

I don't specifically remember those days but I am old enough to remember the Ben Johnson fiasco.

Maybe the worst example of poor sportmanship was the women's 100m dash in 1992. Gail Devers had specifically not taken medications for Graves disease. She wins the 100m dash and Gwen Torrance finished fourth. Torrance immediately said that three people in the race were dirty. Bob Kersee was having a freakout.

But the worst was in the 100m hurdles a few days later. Gail Devers wiped out on the last hurdles and fell. Notice how no one goes to check on her after her fall. No one hugs her, asks if she's okay. She just wanders past the finish line by herself as if in a total daze. That was old-school track.

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KenyaJ

KenyaJ

16 minutes ago, Snipsa said:

Loved that moment where Bolt went up to Van Niekerk to congratulate him. What a sportsman! 

That was great, especially after seeing Bolt's reaction to van Niekerk's race right after it happened.

And Michael Johnson's reaction to van Niekerk on the BBC was as classy and gracious as you'd expect from him.

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Scovies

Scovies

16 minutes ago, Ohwell said:

Ok thanks, I guess I had forgotten.  

 

Oh yes, the Carl Lewis days.

Those were the days. ESPN did an amazing episode of "30 for 30" about the 100m race in the 1988 Olympics called "9.79*." Really fascinating stuff, if anyone is interested. It's currently on Netflix, at least in the U.S.

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Cherpumple

Cherpumple

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For those wondering about Michael Johnson's reaction to seeing his record being broken, he was extremely gracious. He was genuinely impressed (almost speechless) with how well Van Nieuwkerk ran and kept the focus of his commentary on Van Nieuwkerk, rather than turning it around on himself. He even de-personalized it by referring to it as "the world record" rather than "MY record", which kept the focus squarely on the new Olympic champion where it belongs. He's a real class act!

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galaxygirl76

galaxygirl76

3 minutes ago, Scovies said:

Those were the days. ESPN did an amazing episode of "30 for 30" about the 100m race in the 1988 Olympics called "9.79*." Really fascinating stuff, if anyone is interested. It's currently on Netflix, at least in the U.S.

I really liked that 30 for 30, very well made.

 

Michael Johnson continues to prove that me being a fan of his when he was still running was an excellent life choice.

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Growsonwalls

Growsonwalls

5 minutes ago, Scovies said:

Those were the days. ESPN did an amazing episode of "30 for 30" about the 100m race in the 1988 Olympics called "9.79*." Really fascinating stuff, if anyone is interested. It's currently on Netflix, at least in the U.S.

That is quite possibly the dirtiest race of all time. I think of all the finalists ALL of them had positive tests for various substances. Carl Lewis included. 

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briochetwist

briochetwist

46 minutes ago, Ohwell said:

 

Justin Gatlin was punished for his doping, so he didn't deserve to get booed.  Same thing for that female Russian swimmer.  I think sportsmanship should apply to the crowd in the stands as well as the athletes.

 

I completely agree. I think athletes need to compete, graciously accept their medals and refrain from calling others cheats. Leave the politics to WADA. I'm sorry but I've lost all respect respect for Lilly King. At least 6 American track and field athletes competing in Rio have doping infractions. They've been punished and it should be left to that. Same with Efimova. Lilly King acted like a bully.

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Growsonwalls

Growsonwalls

(edited)
6 minutes ago, briochetwist said:

I completely agree. I think athletes need to compete, graciously accept their medals and refrain from calling others cheats. Leave the politics to WADA. I'm sorry but I've lost all respect respect for Lilly King. At least 6 American track and field athletes competing in Rio have doping infractions. They've been punished and it should be left to that. Same with Efimova. Lilly King acted like a bully.

Also a snotty girl. Anyway we'll see how Lilly King is once she's no longer the teenage phenom. She might have a little more humility.

Anyway did anyone notice the coldness between Blake and Bolt? I didn't see Blake congratulating Bolt. I know there was some whisper that Bolt faked an injury to avoid the Jamaican Olympic trials. Blake has had a rough quad. 

Edited by Growsonwalls
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briochetwist

briochetwist

9 minutes ago, Growsonwalls said:

That is quite possibly the dirtiest race of all time. I think of all the finalists ALL of them had positive tests for various substances. Carl Lewis included. 

Yes! Ben Johnson took the hard fall (as he should) but Carl Lewis and Linford Christie all had positive tests and came away unscathed until the truth came out years later. Not one of them deserved to get that gold medal, hell, they didn't deserve anything other than a disqualification and a suspension.

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Daisy

Daisy

11 minutes ago, Growsonwalls said:

That is quite possibly the dirtiest race of all time. I think of all the finalists ALL of them had positive tests for various substances. Carl Lewis included. 

That's what Ben Johnson was and has been saying all this time, like okay I cheated, but let's not make it out like I was the only one. I had to laugh when he was like Canada didn't protect me enough like other federations protected some people. but realising how dirty that race was i do get his point. 

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briochetwist

briochetwist

2 minutes ago, Daisy said:

That's what Ben Johnson was and has been saying all this time, like okay I cheated, but let's not make it out like I was the only one. I had to laugh when he was like Canada didn't protect me enough like other federations protected some people. but realising how dirty that race was i do get his point. 

I remember being terrified when Donovan Bailey won gold. I couldn't relax for days - kept waiting to hear that he'd failed a drug test!

Sorry Donovan, should never have doubted you!

galaxygirl76

galaxygirl76

1 minute ago, Daisy said:

That's what Ben Johnson was and has been saying all this time, like okay I cheated, but let's not make it out like I was the only one. I had to laugh when he was like Canada didn't protect me enough like other federations protected some people. but realising how dirty that race was i do get his point. 

Yeah, but let's be real here, Canada just doesn't hold the same power as the US and the UK have in track and I'm 1000% sure that that helps immensely. I've seen it happen with DQ's and appeals, it helps a lot if you are from a 'big' country. It sucks.

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briochetwist

briochetwist

2 minutes ago, galaxygirl76 said:

Yeah, but let's be real here, Canada just doesn't hold the same power as the US and the UK have in track and I'm 1000% sure that that helps immensely. I've seen it happen with DQ's and appeals, it helps a lot if you are from a 'big' country. It sucks.

Sadly, I think Canada has let some of it's other athletes down as well. They could have done a better job of fighting for Sylvie Frechette who was completely robbed of her gold medal in synchronized swimming in Barcelona. She did eventually get awarded a gold medal a year later, but she was totally screwed out of it and everyone knew it.

Daisy

Daisy

1 minute ago, galaxygirl76 said:

Yeah, but let's be real here, Canada just doesn't hold the same power as the US and the UK have in track and I'm 1000% sure that that helps immensely. I've seen it happen with DQ's and appeals, it helps a lot if you are from a 'big' country. It sucks.

oh for sure. We [a couple of friends and i] were talking about this today, in boxing a very strong contender got eliminated on judge's decision and twitter went insane. and then later Jennifer Abel (a diver) got a really low score and someone was like is Canada even going to bother to appeal and I was like why? we never win them - the only one I can remember winning period was the Sale/Pelltier fiasco in Salt Lake City, and I honestly feel the only reason why that got any traction was because it had the power of the United States (and media) behind it. I think if that had happened say in Nagano or Torino, it would have been "grumble grumble, Canada got screwed" and things would have been left alone. 

Ben Johnson was really the scrap goat for that race, (and I don't even think - i've seen some documentaries and interviews with the Chef d' Mission and Brian Williams etc - no one was even bothering playing the game - like to this day, I don't even think it came to anyone's mind that "Oh we should protect Ben," or, "ben's cheating but let's do cough cough." it was "Johnson cheated, he's disqualified, and we don't want anything to do with him."

1 minute ago, briochetwist said:

Sadly, I think Canada has let some of it's other athletes down as well. They could have done a better job of fighting for Sylvie Frechette who was completely robbed of her gold medal in synchronized swimming in Barcelona. She did eventually get awarded a gold medal a year later, but she was totally screwed out of it and everyone knew it.

Oi, I remember that. but to be fair the COC really pushed on that. But. that's just by reading accounts. I was really young and don't remember all the details. 

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briochetwist

briochetwist

5 minutes ago, Daisy said:

 

Oi, I remember that. but to be fair the COC really pushed on that. But. that's just by reading accounts. I was really young and don't remember all the details. 

This article explains it much better than I can. It was a travesty and never should have happened. I'm so happy she eventually got a gold, but it had to be a shared gold, even though no one could deny she was the actual winner.

Zuleikha

Zuleikha

I ran track in college, and my coach was a former Olympian. What we all heard was that EVERYONE at the top level was doping--it was just a question of whether athletes could outwit the tests or not. I have no idea if that's true, but it's stuck with me this whole time, and I admit, continues to make me cynical about whether anyone's ever really racing clean. I'm at a point where I don't care anymore. If the records are a fusion of science and biology, so be it.

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selkie

selkie

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I suspect that the rise of more professional track meets and the development of the Golden League (later the Diamond League) has led to the greater camaraderie we see among athletes we see today. When you're doing 5-10 meets a year against the same people, ending up on some of the same flights and meet courtesy vans, doing the Price's reception at the Monaco meet, etc. with tthem then, as long as you've got a language in common, you're likely to start talking to these people you spend more time with in a year than you do visiting your parents on the other side of the country.

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

1 hour ago, Scovies said:

Those were the days. ESPN did an amazing episode of "30 for 30" about the 100m race in the 1988 Olympics called "9.79*." Really fascinating stuff, if anyone is interested. It's currently on Netflix, at least in the U.S.

Seconded. This is great little documentary. 

1 hour ago, Bewitched said:

Carl was dirty (and arrogant) and then performed the worst version of our national anthem ever caught on tape. 

OMG, the Carl Lewis national anthem is a thing of nightmares! I'm sure it's on YouTube, but I beg you....don't search it out! LOL

Snipsa

Snipsa

(edited)

This is what Wayde told reporters after the race about what Bolt said to him when he came to congratulate him:

 

"I was over there (Jamaica) for about two weeks training with him,"  Van Niekerk said.

"He’s been such a huge rock in inspiring me as an athlete.

"He told me back in Jamaica that I would break the world record and he came to me afterwards and said ‘I told you that you can do it’.

"These are guys that inspire me each and every day to be the best Wayde that I can be."

 

 

 

Man, I really, really hope that these guys are running clean, because I love the camraderie on display!

 

Ps. That one gold medal pushed SA up the medal table by more than 20 spots. From 48th to 24th. If ever there was an indication that the table was too heavily stacked in favor of golds...

Edited by Snipsa
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healthnut

healthnut

Yes, 9.79 is very good. 88 olympics was before my time so it was very insightful and disturbing. There's a guy that basically admits to spiking Ben Johnson's beer after the race so he would get popped. Granted, he had doped in the off-season and at that time they didn't test during the off-season. When they enacted off season testing, Flo-Jo retired a week later. Maybe she would've anyway...who knows. Here's a good article about what happened to the guy that claimed to have sold her HGH:

What happened to Flo-Jo's accuser

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MyAimIsTrue

MyAimIsTrue

My boyfriend and I had date night last night so I missed the 100m and 400m races but I love reading about the results here and seeing what little video I can find on both.  Congratulations to Wayde Van Niekerk on shattering the 400m world record and from as classy of an act as there ever was in Michael Johnson.  I got a little bit weepy at hearing his mother was a world class athlete but could not participate due to apartheid.  I also loved seeing 2012 gold medalist Kirani James of Grenada give Wayde a big bear hug after the race.

Usain Bolt.  Those who've been hanging around in the swimming thread know of my extreme dislike of Michael Phelps and Usain Bolt is the complete opposite as I cannot adore that man enough.  He's fun, he's silly, he's all business when he needs to be, and he's a genuine mentor and support system to other racers. 

ETA:  I wonder if Canada's DeGrasse is in any way related to my astrophysicist geek out boyfriend Neil deGrasse Tyson.

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tanyak

tanyak

10 hours ago, briochetwist said:

I completely agree. I think athletes need to compete, graciously accept their medals and refrain from calling others cheats. Leave the politics to WADA. I'm sorry but I've lost all respect respect for Lilly King. At least 6 American track and field athletes competing in Rio have doping infractions. They've been punished and it should be left to that. Same with Efimova. Lilly King acted like a bully.

10 hours ago, Growsonwalls said:

Also a snotty girl. Anyway we'll see how Lilly King is once she's no longer the teenage phenom. She might have a little more humility.

 

I'm glad I'm not on this island alone with regards to Lilly King. There was just something really off-putting about her. I sort of chuckled when Justin Gatlin said he didn't even know who she was. 

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BlackberryJam

BlackberryJam

(edited)

Voice of dissent here, but I don't care if athletes call other athletes out for doping. I think the penalties for doping have been inconsistent and not nearly strong enough. You dope, you get no respect from me. I loathe Justin Gatlin and want him to fail every single time.

The doping situation is never going to improve if athletes never report what they know, if doping results get ignored by the media and swept under the rug, if athletes are suspended and then those suspensions lifted. Right now, looking at Efimova and Gatlin both competing, all I can think is that it's encouraging young athletes to dope because you can get away with it.

Edited by BlackberryJam
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selkie

selkie

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Yay Emma getting the bronze! I remember when she had her big steeplechase breakthrough last year in a Diamond League meet, a whole bunch of more highly regarded African women had just kind of let her get away with building a big lead on the front because they had assumed she was being paid to pace the race and would drop out after a few laps. They've all known who the blonde woman was since.

Also thrilled that the morning track & field show is giving a decent amount of coverage to a pretty exciting women's hammer competition.

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DollEyes

DollEyes

How amazing is Usain Bolt?  Once again Bolt not only proved his greatness, he broke a record in the process. I've got no problem with Bolt nor Michael Phelps' showboating because they've got the skills to back it up, to put it mildly. Both have changed their sport for the better and the Olympics won't be the same without them, as far as I'm concerned. 

That photo of Bolt & DeGrasse makes me smile.  

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briochetwist

briochetwist

2 hours ago, BlackberryJam said:

Voice of dissent here, but I don't care if athletes call other athletes out for doping. I think the penalties for doping have been inconsistent and not nearly strong enough. You dope, you get no respect from me. I loathe Justin Gatlin and want him to fail every single time.

The doping situation is never going to improve if athletes never report what they know, if doping results get ignored by the media and swept under the rug, if athletes are suspended and then those suspensions lifted. Right now, looking at Efimova and Gatlin both competing, all I can think is that it's encouraging young athletes to dope because you can get away with it.

I understand what you're saying, and in a perfect world I'd agree with you. I felt that way at the beginning of the game too. Unfortunately, it's the picking and choosing of who to call out and who to give a 'pass' is what bothers me. At the risk of coming off anti-American (which I'm most definitely not), the American press and people seem to be willing to vilify some and yet support their own athletes who've had doping suspensions. I've seen and heard a lot of announcers, articles and people who are willing to gloss over American drug suspensions while completely trashing athletes from other countries. I'm sure there's probably the same problem with other countries as well, but from where I sit as a Canadian, this is what I'm seeing here. 

It's unfair to call Efimova and others cheaters and treat her badly, while supporting Justin Gatlin, Tyson Gay, Lashawn Merritt, Inika McPherson, Mike Rodgers and Wallace Spearmon. Those are American track and field athletes who have failed drug tests in the past and that's just off the top of my head...

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BlackberryJam

BlackberryJam

I get you, and I'm American and I LOATHE Gatlin. I don't want anyone to pick and choose. You dope, you go. 

I only watched a little of the women's weightlifting after hearing from the announcers that that so many of the competitors were coming off doping suspensions, even the US women's dirty tests were mentioned. If the entire sport is dirty, suspend them all and start fresh. 

I also HATE Lance Armstrong. 

The booing when Gatlin was introduced was mentioned by Ato Boldon on my coverage as a result of Gatlin's previous drug suspension. So it wasn't ignored.

One of my big points is that the athletes themselves need to start discussing it. How many times when someone tests positive do we hear from an athlete, "We all knew X was doping." I want them to be encouraged to report it, call it out, make it known, instead of this culture of keeping your mouth shut until it becomes public. 

And this is just me, but when athletes themselves sweep each other's results and suspensions under the rug or welcome people back from suspension with open arms, it makes me think it's just because they were grateful they weren't the ones caught.

So yeah, Lilly King didn't present herself well, but thank bob someone is out there saying, "This suspension should not have been lifted. Doping is wrong." And thank bob people aren't letting Justin Gatlin off and welcoming him back from his suspension.

But erm...steeplechase is super cool.

I was able to see some of the women's hammer, but heard no commentary. That looked fun.

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Zuleikha

Zuleikha

If I was an Olympic caliber runner I'd want to be a steeplechaser.  It's such a random event to me but it looks like so much fun.

Women's steeplechase wasn't an event when I raced in college, and I'm still sad about it. I really wanted to race it. I'm not sure I'd describe it as fun, though; it's a pretty brutal race.

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selkie

selkie

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There are a lot of American track fans who are not happy that Gatlin has managed to come back after two different doping bans. 

I will admit to a bizarre soft spot for LaShawn Merritt because his attempt to enhance his performance allegedly had nothing to do with the track and was because he didn't read the label on a thing of Enzyte he'd bought at a 7-11 in anticipation of 'boom boom with the ladies'. The security camera footage from the convenience store he brought to his hearing seems to make his story reasonably plausible. 

Snipsa

Snipsa

I have an honest question to those who have a hard stance against anybody previously caught doping.

 

If you have the time, please read this article about the SA Silver medal winner in long jump - Manyonga, who served an 18 month ban for a doping violation - and tell me if you think that it was alright for him to have been allowed back or not.

 

http://www.dailymaverick.co.za/article/2016-08-14-luvo-manyonga-broke-a-deal-with-the-devil-and-decided-to-jump-rather-than-die/#.V7IE-XPRbqA

I have my own opinion on him raking part, but would love to hear from others (PS. I am a staunch supporter of keeping all sports clean...)

Danny Franks

Danny Franks

Only just got to watch Van Niekerk break that 400m record. Amazing. He just turned on the afterburners in the home straight, and ran away from the other two contenders. I had no idea that he had broken 10 seconds for the 100m, 20 seconds for the 200m and 44 seconds for the 400m. That is incredible. Michael Johnson was praising him to sky on the BBC, saying that this guy could be the next superstar to take over from Usain Bolt, and that he wants to see him run the 200m at championship level.

As for Bolt himself? Business as usual. He is just on another plane from the rest of those guys. And I have amused myself imagining Justin Gatlin had just a handful of seconds there where he thought he was going to win. Heh.

And regarding Luvo Manyonga, I absolutely think he should be allowed to compete. Falling into addiction with a harmful, destructive drug is nowhere near being in the same category to me as taking PEDs in an attempt to win fraudulently. I can't believe anyone would think he should be forbidden from competing. At the very least, he can serve as an inspiration to people suffering similar addictions, to show that there is a way out.

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Snipsa

Snipsa

5 minutes ago, galaxygirl76 said:

I firmly believe that testing positive for certain drugs should not lead to a ban but a rehab center(if you test positive on for instance coke you have bigger problems imo)

 

10 minutes ago, Danny Franks said:

And regarding Luvo Manyonga, I absolutely think he should be allowed to compete. Falling into addiction with a harmful, destructive drug is nowhere near being in the same category to me as taking PEDs in an attempt to win fraudulently. I can't believe anyone would think he should be forbidden from competing. At the very least, he can serve as an inspiration to people suffering similar addictions, to show that there is a way out.

You guys summed up pretty much my thoughts, which I couldn't quite put in words.  I just saw a couple of posts on social media from local idiots actually bemoaning him taking part after his infringement/ban... - These were luckily overshadowed by us local fans absolutely chuffed at his (and now Wayde's) performance!

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