S08.E10: Unhappy Holidays

[NewDigs]

Interesting.

I agree that was not a "win" for B. I can't stand Omarosa but it was good to see Bethy get some of her own vitriol back.

Also got a kick out Omarosa saying that she wished she had someone prompting the audience to applaud. (paraphrased) Bethy could barely spit a complete sentence out and you knew the "Applause" sign/person was working overtime.

[ElDosEquis]

I got a pedicure and the woman used a pedafile on my nails.

Dor was saving the GOOD stuff for her and John....http://thefoothillspaper.com/2016/02/19/does-your-parmesan-cheese-contain-sawdust-unfortunately-maybe/

It's amazing that someone with the credentials that care-hole has can be so bankrupt when it comes to dealing with little shit in life - the fuckery she has shown during her scenes with Methenny and her inability to distinguish between 'good' and 'bad' behavior tells quite a bit about her density when it comes to everyday behavior/manners..

[ottergirl]

14 hours ago, WireWrap said:

I think Bethenny will try and tone it down at the reunion because of all the backlash she is getting now. We will hear about her horrid divorce, how hard shared child custody is on her, her medical "scare" and a host of other excuses to try and mitigate her atrocious behavior to Sonja/Luann/John/Dorinda/Jules this season. She will say that she believes everything she said, stands by it but would have said it differently had things no been so bad/tough on her. LOL

I agree.  And I keep being reminded of the very first WWHL after her first episode back, when a caller said to Andy that Bethenny seemed like Jill Zarin, and Andy was visibly upset and surprised. I think he finds Bethenny charming and delightful, as she does herself, and neither one of them can understand the backlash. 

I also remember that in Season 3, in the Bethenny vs. Jill debacle, and then on Scary Island, the viewers (including me) were all very pro-Bethenny, and she said constantly, "The viewers get it. The viewers see it."

Yes, they do, Bethenny. How do you like that now?

14 hours ago, msblossom said:

And that's what is bothering me about this show; no one, err Bethenny, should have that kind of power over their cast mates. It's ruining the dynamic of the show. Essentially if you get frozen out and uninvited to events and trips your scenes will be cut short or non-existent and you run the risk of getting your apple yanked. If your position on HW's hinges on whether or not BF will film with you then TPTB are f'd up. 

Totally agree. You said in one short paragraph what I took about 3,500 words to convey. The power dynamic is wrecking the show, and even more because production is trying to cover it up. Like I said, I'm all in for a show about how women navigate crazy power dynamics, and how one woman wields incredible power, but the edit is trying to tell a different story - about how a brave, plucky truth-teller calls out bad behavior around her - and they're telling not only the wrong story, but they're telling a lie. And what gets me even more hyped up is knowing that the reunion will never address this, but will double down on the original narrative, and try to convince all of us that Bethenny (poor, sick, plucky, single, fibroid-riddled Bethenny) is like us.

Spoiler alert: Bethenny, you're not like us.

One other small thing that occurred to me.  I was reading Shonda Rhimes' book A Year of Yes, and she talks about how because of her insecurity, she was starting to freak out about being asked to appear on Kimmel Live. But she realized, as she was doing it, that this behavior was not acceptable.  As she put it: "The things that you can do when you are at the bottom of the ladder change as you move up. At the top of that ladder, doing many of those very same things makes you an a--hole. I'm being an a--hole."

Bethenny is still acting like she's the plucky, single working class girl speaking truth to power. But that's not who she is anymore, and that's not what she's doing any more.  That behavior that seemed like Greek Chorus now is amped up to where it is coming across as abuse of power. We can see that, Bethenny (specifically the employee hired to read this board) and Andy (aka the production intern). We can see it no matter how you try to cover it up.

And last thing: stop telling us how great the ratings are. Umbelina published a link to the ratings over all the seasons.  They're rising over the course of this season, which is great, but they're still WAY below where they were in Season 4 OR Season 5. They're just starting to get higher than where they were last year. And the lowest rated episodes of all time, since the show got successful? The Bethenny-focused episode last season (All In The Family or whatever) that featured her reuniting with her stepfather and moaning to her therapist; AND Part 3 of the reunion, when apparently many people agreed with me that the reunion was nothing but another episode of Bethenny's talk show, and didn't feel the need to watch it. 

[Yours Truly]

1 hour ago, Duke2801 said:

Nah I've re-watched Scary Island - and even the "I'm up here and you're down here" conversation with Kelly - again.  And even my current Beth vitriol can't make me see Beth as the instigator in those situations.Unless she was doing some truly nefarious things behind-the-scenes.  If anything, those scenes only serve to remind me how disturbingly annoying, vapid, dumb, psychotic, and awful Kelly was (and likely still is.). 

It also reminds me how drastically Beth has changed since those earlier seasons.  In the Monkey Bar scene, she actually sat there fairly calmly and cool-ly while Kelly berated her and went off on her crazy ass Kelly tangents.  Yeah, she looked annoyed, but she was the one who came out of that scene looking, um, not insane. 

The contrast between Bethenny of Yore and the Screaming Banshee of the Berkshires is pretty jarring.

I always felt like Kellys biggest offense was that she was annoying because of her obvious self appreciation. That and the fact that she wasn't quick on the uptake and therefore gave off the worse case of airhead.  Granted that's annoying but at the same time how do you turn that into something dark and devious and worthy of attack?  She really did seem to be an overall nice person, good with her kids and completely out of her depth when it came to confrontation. The "I'm up here, you're down there" conversation happened in response to how Beth did her thing and berated someone right in their face to SOMEONE else when Kelly showed up late for that charity meeting that time. I didn't see anything that warranted Beth to go off on Kelly as nasty as she did which is why from that season on I did not like her (I started watching RHoNY during it's second season). I don't believe that someone who has quirks or traits that annoy you is a reason to be intentionally nasty or hateful to them. I get that no one should have to endure the picadillos of someone elses if they don't want to but at the same time you also can't just steam into someone cause you don't like the way they carry themselves sometimes. Bringing it to someone's attention is one thing cause you want to make them aware of how it comes across but automatically berating or mocking them in the moment serves no one's purpose. But that's the way our Beth operates and yet she was the heroine and Kelly the villain. Huh, what?

I never got it but at the same time Kelly was terrible at trying to handle her and the situation but then again she was completely out of her league with thy bitch named Beth. I mean Lu is a smooth operator and it's obvious even she was winded after dealing with the Bethinator so of course Kelly had no shot taking Beth to task about anything. She ended up being so distraught in Beth's presence the girl had a melt down followed by a break down for crying out loud. I'm telling you Scary Island showed me what having to deal with someone so invested in causing someone else distress can physically and emotionally do to someone. That shit unfolded right before my eyes a whole lot different than most people saw it. Yellchhh, I just got the hibbie Jibbies just recalling how awful that whole things was.

Beth's behavior that season is similar to the way she's been steamrolling people this season and last. It's always been there it's just really full blast nowadays however I've never condoned her bullying ways so when Kelly had that sit down with her I took her to mean that she was way above treating people in the nasty way Beth does which in turn was what was meant by "you're down there". People like to see it like she was asserting some sort of social or success status when I took it to mean that she was outlining how she's not a fan of the catty bullshit women pull with each other and she won't be pulled into that way of dealing with her. I hated that she couldn't pull it off though. I had so much second hand embarrasment for Kelly and pissed that Beth ended up looking good because of that blundered exchange.

After that Kelly uneasiness when around Beth took over and created even more awkward turned ugly interactions which I never thought was ever Kelly's intent. I felt like most of the time Kelly was just trying to blow her nastiness off or push back and not allow Beth to be aggressive towards her but The Countess, she ain't. <shrug>

Edited June 10, 2016 by Yours Truly

[Yours Truly]

59 minutes ago, ElDosEquis said:

I got a pedicure and the woman used a pedafile on my nails.

Dor was saving the GOOD stuff for her and John....http://thefoothillspaper.com/2016/02/19/does-your-parmesan-cheese-contain-sawdust-unfortunately-maybe/

It's amazing that someone with the credentials that care-hole has can be so bankrupt when it comes to dealing with little shit in life - the fuckery she has shown during her scenes with Methenny and her inability to distinguish between 'good' and 'bad' behavior tells quite a bit about her density when it comes to everyday behavior/manners..

Yeah, I'm actually starting to think that she's just stupid. No, not as an insult but as in IS stupid. Her behavior is so very elementary. You can almost hear her strained mental instructions to herself..

..okay, chew the gum but one foot in front of the other, that's it, that's it... No, no don't try to blow a bubble I'm crossing the street... uh oh, step coming up.. maybe I'll just stop chewing til I get across the street... left foot, right, one foot in front of the other...

[zoeysmom]

1 hour ago, Duke2801 said:

 

It also reminds me how drastically Beth has changed since those earlier seasons.  In the Monkey Bar scene, she actually sat there fairly calmly and cool-ly while Kelly berated her and went off on her crazy ass Kelly tangents.  Yeah, she looked annoyed, but she was the one who came out of that scene looking, um, not insane. 

The contrast between Bethenny of Yore and the Screaming Banshee of the Berkshires is pretty jarring.

I am not disagreeing Kelly is definitely one for the record books.  There was some Bethenny behavior that I see be repeated in that conversation and the one in the Berkshires.  When Kelly made it pretty clear they were not going to be friends and told Bethenny she did not appreciate the Madonna comment, Bethenny launched into that she had met Kelly 10 times (later revised to 7) and when at a party at Kelly's house, Kelly was flirting with her boyfriend.  She then struck a blow claiming Kely was a celebrity collector.  Kelly thought the guy was a photographer hired to take photos.  The guy was a photographer (and must have had a camera) but Bethenny  saw beautiful model talking to her man and decided that Kelly was flirting with him.  The other thing Bethenny was guilty of is getting offended when people don't remember meeting her. That is more on her than the other person.  In one episode she launched on a chiropractor when he didn't recall meeting her.

So essentially, Bethenny, when confronted about rude behavior, and the comment was rude, especially when there was not mutual familiarity, goes below the belt.  Bethenny was fairly calm, but Kelly did own the conversation, she set up the meeting, the start time (her terms) and left the meeting after having her say.  Without a lot of explanation from Kelly it was pretty clear Kelly was referencing Bethenny as being immature and offensive in her behavior and Kelly wanted her to come up to her level (polite) that didn't include snide remarks.   it really isn't on the receiver of an insult to be forced to accept the insult.  Had she said nothing there would not have been a conflict.  Bethenny was trying to get a reaction out of Kelly and she did.

Bethenny and I do find her version of the truth to not always be accurate, seems to have a thing about women going after her men.  She also claimed Luann grabbed her date's package at a wedding reception (whether Bethenny was at the wedding is unclear from Ramona's account).  Her humor consists of wild exaggerations and so for me, it is hard to distinguish fact from Bethenny's perceptions.  She also broke her kitchen sink rule.  Kelly was not there to talk about her relationship with celebrities, invitations or a party at her house, where she did not remember Bethenny.  When Kelly left Bethenny went so far as to call Kelly's date imaginary.  Again with the men stuff.

[trimthatfat]

15 hours ago, msblossom said:

And that's what is bothering me about this show; no one, err Bethenny, should have that kind of power over their cast mates. It's ruining the dynamic of the show. Essentially if you get frozen out and uninvited to events and trips your scenes will be cut short or non-existent and you run the risk of getting your apple yanked. If your position on HW's hinges on whether or not BF will film with you then TPTB are f'd up. 

I agree. The options should not be either a) play nice with Bethenny or b)lose your job/have your role reduced. I think Heather saw this coming from a mile away. Luann as well.

[charmed1]

15 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

When Bethenny first came back, she of course got some ridiculous one on one with Andy and the upshot was she wanted her own show and he said she had to do RHONY first.  I look at this way she has done two years, given things a shake and now is obviously ready for her own show again.  Please take Carole with her.  Dorinda tweeted the three constants of Bethenny at a shoot last night (1) arrives late (2) leaves early (3) Carole follows.  So Carole tweeted something nasty back to Dorinda, "Uh yeah. . . Bethenny was walking ahead of me so sure technically I was following her.  So beneath you."  Something tells me there will be a Dorinda/Carole Twitter battle before the Reunion.  Carole needs the ammo and to be relevant.

No way. Last season, Bethenny said she's never late. That must've been a fluke. 

[HumblePi]

On 6/8/2016 at 11:55 PM, Neeners said:

I hate this whole excluding people thing. I'm trying to think if it's been done on other HW shows or not. Definitely on Southern Charm. I don't even really like Sonja much and it's making me feel sorry for her. And Lu being attacked repeatedly makes me feel bad for her, too, and I used to think she was a snob. Ugh. Carole is saying in the previews for next week that she isn't going on the trip if Lu is going, and B is saying that she won't go if Carole doesn't go. WTF grade are these people in, exactly? 

I'm with you on this and find it totally offensive. I'm surprised that Bravo would even allow one of the cast members to totally exclude another one from the group. Bravo had to film Sonja getting her vaginal rejuvenation just to get her in that episode from the Berkshires. She's got a contract like they all do so Bravo had to squeeze a little of Sonja into the episode somehow. I really don't feel badly for Luann because I don't think that Luann can be considered emotionally fragile by any stretch of the imagination. If most women were attacked maliciously in the way that Bethenny attacked Luann, they would have packed up and left.  Boom! Out! All Luann did was complain in front of all of them how offended she is, how she can't stay and has to go but she never gets even close to the front door to leave. Look, they're all part of the franchise and collecting a paycheck for their appearances so they should all be in each episode and invited when the others are invited. Sure, they might dislike each other intensely and dread being in the same room with each other, but that's what they're paid to do and that's why the get to advertise and promote their fashion line, toaster ovens, wine and books for free.

[Yours Truly]

36 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

I am not disagreeing Kelly is definitely one for the record books.  There was some Bethenny behavior that I see be repeated in that conversation and the one in the Berkshires.  When Kelly made it pretty clear they were not going to be friends and told Bethenny she did not appreciate the Madonna comment, Bethenny launched into that she had met Kelly 10 times (later revised to 7) and when at a party at Kelly's house, Kelly was flirting with her boyfriend.  She then struck a blow claiming Kely was a celebrity collector.  Kelly thought the guy was a photographer hired to take photos.  The guy was a photographer (and must have had a camera) but Bethenny  saw beautiful model talking to her man and decided that Kelly was flirting with him.  The other thing Bethenny was guilty of is getting offended when people don't remember meeting her. That is more on her than the other person.  In one episode she launched on a chiropractor when he didn't recall meeting her.

So essentially, Bethenny, when confronted about rude behavior, and the comment was rude, especially when there was not mutual familiarity, goes below the belt.  Bethenny was fairly calm, but Kelly did own the conversation, she set up the meeting, the start time (her terms) and left the meeting after having her say.  Without a lot of explanation from Kelly it was pretty clear Kelly was referencing Bethenny as being immature and offensive in her behavior and Kelly wanted her to come up to her level (polite) that didn't include snide remarks.   it really isn't on the receiver of an insult to be forced to accept the insult.  Had she said nothing there would not have been a conflict.  Bethenny was trying to get a reaction out of Kelly and she did.

Bethenny and I do find her version of the truth to not always be accurate, seems to have a thing about women going after her men.  She also claimed Luann grabbed her date's package at a wedding reception (whether Bethenny was at the wedding is unclear from Ramona's account).  Her humor consists of wild exaggerations and so for me, it is hard to distinguish fact from Bethenny's perceptions.  She also broke her kitchen sink rule.  Kelly was not there to talk about her relationship with celebrities, invitations or a party at her house, where she did not remember Bethenny.  When Kelly left Bethenny went so far as to call Kelly's date imaginary.  Again with the men stuff.

Thank You, It always feels like I'm  the only one who saw how ridiculously rude Beth was, first at the charity event and then during that completely terrible exchange. I think by the time they got to Scary Island Kelly was so frazzled by Beth that she just started spouting nonsense and officially had an axiety attack. I hate that people call it some complete mental break down when in all actually it was at worse an anxiety attack/episode with her trigger being Beth. Coupled with the fact that the other HW's were being so obtuse about it all, yeah I can see how she might have felt like she was losing her mind because everyone was acting like Kelly was this ball of crazy from jump because she mentioned gummy bears in the car at the START of the trip and Beth turned that whole thing some huge hyperbole of how nutty Kelly is cause she made one of her silly Kelly comments that to me wasn't even all that serious or meant to be dissected the way Beth did. Beth turned it into a let's laugh at how stupid Kelly is moment and right there is where think Kelly started getting nervous about where Beth was planning on taking things AND she also got a big indicator or where the other HW's would play into it and join in.

I'm telling you, I saw the build up from when they started out on the trip and Beth was reacting so rudely to Kelly's bouncy excited demeanor which I felt was quite lovely. No bitchiness, no nastiness, upbeat (especially since they were supposed to be passed their conflict and making efforts to get along or at least be civil at that point). I saw rude awakening and saw that Kelly's "oh fuck" moment where she knew it was gonna go south. No because of her but because that's where Beth wanted it to be so Beth made it happen. Boy did she. I think some of it was paranoia on her part especially if what I described was a part of Kelly's reasoning but I also can understand why she would have come up with that theory. Kelly pushed herself into that mental place by overthinking it but Beth had a serious hand in the end result just because Beth had no intention of keeping things light with Kelly from the get go so in turn Kelly's fears were somewhat realized by Beth.

I don't think that is what Beth was directly aiming for it just ended up being the end result but in no way shape or form do I  believe Beth ever intended on playing nice with Kelly for the whole trip. She challenged and questioned Kelly every chance she got in and every interaction they all had with each other.  And what came across so ugly was Kelly's attempted rebuttals and counter attacks which in her mind were defenses. That's how I knew that wasn't really Kelly's brand of interacting with others. By the way she was so disproportinate in her comebacks and that kinda says something about a person. That they are so uncomfortable in nasty exchanges that they completely go overboard and fail miserably.  I could tell how on edge Kelly was from the moment Beth wouldn't let up about the gummy bears. That right there set the stage for what was to come in Kelly mind (and mine) and I think the anticipation is what really did Kelly in at the end.

Thank goodness there isn't anyone else as fragile in this entourage that would completely disintegrate like Kelly.

Edited June 10, 2016 by Yours Truly

[Ellee]

Prior to the season started, wasn't it LuLu, Sonja and Ramona the holdouts on signing their contracts?  Isn't it the second time that the three tried to pull this off? 

I'm wondering if Bravo doesn't have a hand in freezing out Sonja as well as making life difficult for LuLu.   I would imagine that Bravo wants to control the 'pay-as-you-play' plan now and in the future.  Even if it makes the other HWs look bad.   No one really cares how bad they look as long as they remain HWs and pull a good check .... or in some cases, exceptional check.

Sooner or later the 'pay-as-you-play' plan will be the norm.

[Avaleigh]

2 hours ago, Castina said:

A bit of background to the Omarosa vs Bethenny video:

http://www.eonline.com/news/476043/bethenny-frankel-owes-omarosa-10-000-fine-i-did-slam-you-on-the-view

Bethenny, as she does, mouths off with her "funny" digs on the view illustrating how wonderful she is with a real career and successful brand to differentiate and put herself above any comparison to Omarosa.   Her appearance on the Bethenny show is the fallout from that and when Omarosa mentions what Bethenny said on The View, Bethenny denies it and bets her $10 000 she never said it. During a break they pull it up on video and Omarosa is right, Bethenny said it.  

What we see in that clip is Bethenny changing the goalposts and making it about a brand and that is why she starts harranging Omarosa about what her brand is.  So I don't think Omarosa lost that or looks bad.  What that section of video showed was Bethenny trying to weasel her way out of being caught out and making it about brand and not career.  I also think "smart" can be your brand if what you are selling is your ability to perform in the business world.  Not defending Omarosa but I don't think Bethenny won.  I think it's an example of how Bethenny can never admit she is wrong even though she may say the words "you're right, I owe you $10 000" because it's always followed with a BUT.....

Thanks for posting this. It does indeed show Omarosa in a better light. (Did Bethenny give her the ten grand or not?) While I still think that Omarosa was being the rude and condescending person that she has always shown herself to be on every show that I've seen her on (the idea of a mean person like her being a pastor is as ridiculous and laughable to me as Bethenny thought the idea of Luann being a mentor to Sonja was), I concede that her angry attitude with Bethenny didn't come out of nowhere. 

[sasha206]

On 6/9/2016 at 2:59 AM, yourmomiseasy said:

I'm exhausted from Bethenny being on my TV.  I can't imagine having to deal with her in person.  Both Bethenny's and Carole's faces have looked really bad the last couple of episodes.  I don't know if it is their stank attitudes shading my judgement or if they really look all swollen and weird and like plastic surgery dont's.  

How rude to ruin Dorinda's party that she worked so hard to make nice and then sneak out the next morning without saying bye.  Bethenny would not have gone back inside without Carole insisting.

Ramona saying Lu needs all the attention was hilarious.  It's like she got herself confused with Lu.  

Ramona's

They all looked particularly bad this episode.  Ramona and that stupid hair.  Lu's bordello jumper was bad.  And the beach wave/frize/too tanned look in Lu's TH is awful.  Beth's face was never great to begin with but she looked a little jokerish again.  By far, the worst to me this episode was Carole.  And it's the fillers or whatever she's putting in her face.  I've noticed that a lot of these women almost need a full face of make-up b/c when they go more natural, the more unnatural their faces tend to look for me.  

[MollyBrown]

I do love the Christmas episodes.  Bonus points to Lu for bringing a Christmas theme into the fight by me tioning that B is checking her list twice.   It goes well with the ho (ho ho) talk. 

[halkatla]

"For me, negative energy in a group is like a poison and you have to get rid of it"
Bethenny, episode 1 of Martha Stewart´s Apprentice.

[Neurochick]

19 hours ago, lezlers said:

Well that was rude.  I like Bethanny and I assure you, I do have a brain.  I find her funny, honest and witty.  Her behavior on the sleepover was shameful, sure, but I still enjoy watching her and love her talking heads. By the amount of likes on the rare post saying the same, I'm fairly certain I'm not alone.

Don't forget, she's an honorary black woman too. 

And I don't think I'm alone in my Bethenny dislike either.  I don't find it funny or witty to attack people but as they say, YMMV.

[shoegal]

I personally loved this episode, because I loathe the haughty "Countess" and love watching Bethenny take her down!  LuAnn is a snake, IMO, and maybe a skank, too.  Do I remember a comment that Ramona made way, way, way back in the beginning of the series about LuAnn quite possibly being a little too flirty or inappropriate with Mario?  Did I dream this??

[zoeysmom]

3 minutes ago, shoegal said:

I personally loved this episode, because I loathe the haughty "Countess" and love watching Bethenny take her down!  LuAnn is a snake, IMO, and maybe a skank, too.  Do I remember a comment that Ramona made way, way, way back in the beginning of the series about LuAnn quite possibly being a little too flirty or inappropriate with Mario?  Did I dream this??

Ramona said Season 1 her girlfriends (all married) enjoyed flirting with Mario.  No RHONY involved.  The married ladies who married Ramona kissed on the lips. 

[shoegal]

9 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

Ramona said Season 1 her girlfriends (all married) enjoyed flirting with Mario.  No RHONY involved.  The married ladies who married Ramona kissed on the lips. 

I seem to remember a comment she made about LuAnn specifically, I feel like it was maybe to Jill?  Or Alex?  I don't think it was during the first season, but it was something about LuAnn hitting on Mario.  

Added:  Was it during the fortune teller reading in Morocco??  

Edited June 10, 2016 by shoegal

[Pollock]

14 minutes ago, shoegal said:

I personally loved this episode, because I loathe the haughty "Countess" and love watching Bethenny take her down!

She didn't though. She did it the season of the snake thingy, and it was indeed glorious at the time. This year, she just hurled nonsenses and misogynist insults. And she meangirled her. If Luann's nature is being a snake, Bethenny is the scorpion on the back of the frog*. I'm not sure which one is worse but I know which one is killing my interest in the show.

 

*I feel like this is a Survivor final tribal council and I'm juggling with the animal metaphor. Bethenny, the tribe has spoken, get a grip or get the fuck out of the island.

[Midnight Cheese]

Eh, if there was inappropriateness, I doubt it was from LuAnn to Mario.  He probably wouldn't have noticed a Countessy hard-court press, what with his wang having wandered into and out of lots and lots of the UES. 

If there's real substance to the gossip in the tabloids about Dennis Shields and Bethenny, I hope his wife goes HAM on Frankel.  If it's true, I can't think of another franchise where 1 Ho eviscerated another for something but was outed as being guilty of the exact same thing during the exact same time frame. 

[halkatla]

32 minutes ago, shoegal said:

I personally loved this episode, because I loathe the haughty "Countess" and love watching Bethenny take her down!  LuAnn is a snake, IMO, and maybe a skank, too.  Do I remember a comment that Ramona made way, way, way back in the beginning of the series about LuAnn quite possibly being a little too flirty or inappropriate with Mario?  Did I dream this??

But the countess took Bethenny down... It was almost hard to watch, Bethenny has made such a fool of herself and she woke up knowing it, because she´s not stupid, just cruel and crass.

Edited June 10, 2016 by halkatla

[zoeysmom]

16 minutes ago, shoegal said:

I seem to remember a comment she made about LuAnn specifically, I feel like it was maybe to Jill?  Or Alex?  I don't think it was during the first season, but it was something about LuAnn hitting on Mario.  

Added:  Was it during the fortune teller reading in Morocco??  

Mario and Luann have always pretty much been at odds.  So I can't imagine there would be any truth behind it.  I mean of all the RH vs. husbands Luann and Mario have always been pretty much at odds, not Brooks vs. Tamra level or Vicki vs. Slade.  There is a scene the beginning of Season 3 where Luann is mad at Mario and brings it up to Ramona (he called Luann Countless right after her divorce in public) and Ramona tells Luann to call him and Luann is very clear she will not call him.  Even when he finally apologized they had the conversation in Italian.  I am sure if Ramona felt that way she would have brought it up in her most recent blog when she was trying to sure up her position that Luann is a man stealer or they would have run a flashback clip.  You should send your inquiry into Bravo I am sure they would love to use it at the Reunion if it exists. 

Edited June 10, 2016 by zoeysmom

[izabella]

6 minutes ago, halkatla said:

But the countess took Bethenny down... It was almost hard to watch, Bethenny has made such a fool of herself and she woke up knowing it, because she´s not stupid, just cruel and crass.

Yes, that little morning chat with Carole showed only that Bethy was aware she had made herself look really, really bad and that she was out of control.  Her concern was not that she might have hurt Lu, or that she ruined Dorinda's party, but that she, Bethy, screwed the pooch with her ragaholic fits.

[ryebread]

5 hours ago, Gaily said:

I wish Dorinda would post her lasagna recipe.  

I'm just afraid that will give her the idea to write a cookbook. Another HW cookbook.  Or maybe a book on entertaining, in general.  She makes things nice.

4 hours ago, Sampson said:

Carol is not spineless, she is not intellectually vacuous. Take a moment to research her life and you'll see. Out of all the NY housewives I imagine she would be the most interesting one to have conversations with. After her career, she took care of a dying husband, a difficult and admirable task. Then she went on to write a best selling book. Flipping burgers ... I think not.

From her wiki:

Radziwill began her news career at ABC in New York in 1986 as an intern in postproduction for 20/20, a news magazine show.[5] She was later assigned to "Close Up" as a production secretary. She eventually worked for Peter Jennings's documentary unit, producing shows on abortion and gun control, and covering foreign policy stories in Cambodia, Haiti, and India.[6]

In 1991, Radziwill was stationed in Israel and reported on the SCUD missile attacks during the Gulf War. In 2003, during the War on Afghanistan, she spent six weeks in Khandahar, embedded with an infantry unit of the 101st Airborne Division. She produced segments for an ABC-TV show called Profiles From the Frontline. She has won several awards, including three Emmys, one for a story she produced on land mines in Cambodia, and a Peabody

Carole is good at editing Wiki.  She probably wrote that entry herself.  She may have been a good reporter in her day but her behavior and lack of ambition speaks volumes now. 

I said this long ago about Carole - about how it might be hard for someone like Diane Sawyer to be friends with Carole now. (Diane and Carole were/are friends.)  Diane fought hard to make it where she is as a journalist - paved the way for many female new anchors. I think it probably pains her to see a woman, like Carole, go from serious journalist and novelist to the moron that we see today.

[shoegal]

24 minutes ago, Pollock said:

She didn't though. She did it the season of the snake thingy, and it was indeed glorious at the time. This year, she just hurled nonsenses and misogynist insults. And she meangirled her. If Luann's nature is being a snake, Bethenny is the scorpion on the back of the frog*. I'm not sure which one is worse but I know which one is killing my interest in the show.

 

*I feel like this is a Survivor final tribal council and I'm juggling with the animal metaphor. Bethenny, the tribe has spoken, get a grip or get the fuck out of the island.

Semantics about "taking down" aside, I just enjoyed watching Bethenny say these things out loud and to her face, and have LuAnn have to acknowledge and defend.  I personally loved it, and LuAnn was definitely cowed, she's trying to ingratiate herself to Bethenny and Carole both!  Top it off with all of the hideous fashion choices she displayed, the crown jewel being that cheap and horrid lace jumpsuit and booties and I was eating it up!

Edited June 10, 2016 by shoegal

[Knuckles]

2 minutes ago, shoegal said:

I just enjoyed watching Bethenny say these things outloud

You'd love the New York subways, we have lots of unhinged screamers and ranters wandering about. And, many of said screamers make shocking fashion choices as well.

[shoegal]

14 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

Mario and Luann have always pretty much been at odds.  So I can't imagine there would be any truth behind it.  I mean of all the RH vs. husbands Luann and Mario have always been pretty much at odds, not Brooks vs. Tamra level or Vicki vs. Slade.  There is a scene the beginning of Season 3 where Luann is mad at Mario and brings it up to Ramona (he called Luann Countless right after her divorce in public) and Ramona tells Luann to call him and Luann is very clear she will not call him.  Even when he finally apologized they had the conversation in Italian.  I am sure if Ramona felt that way she would have brought it up in her most recent blog when she was trying to sure up her position that Luann is a man stealer or they would have run a flashback clip.  You should send your inquiry into Bravo I am sure they would love to use it at the Reunion if it exists. 

IIRC, the situation was the first time LuAnn was introduced to Mario, so at that time she had no history with him.  I am pretty sure it was during the conversation with the fortune teller in Morocco.  I wondered why Ramona didn't mention it, but she probably didn't want to mention Mario or highlight again that he was a big old cheater the whole time they were married.  Considering that it seems LuAnn has a history of being shall we say, inappropriate with other women's husbands/boyfriends/man friends, etc, I think it's highly likely that LuAnn came on to Mario, who, while slimy, is a good looking man.  I can totally see it. 

Edited June 10, 2016 by shoegal

[izabella]

I actually didn't see Lu as cowed at all.  She went toe to toe with the Beast, kept her cool, and pretty much just let Beasty hang herself.  Lu wasn't really even mad about it; she was resigned to hashing it out then and there since Beasty made such a spectacle.  Lu seemed very confident in herself, while Beasty was losing it. 

I lol'd when she chased Beasty and Carole down when they were trying to leave unnoticed without saying good-bye or thanking their hostess.  If Lu had been cowed, she would have let them leave like they planned to.

Edited June 10, 2016 by izabella

[Midnight Cheese]

The comments about Carole and ambition are interesting.  Now, of course she owes Aviva and the rest of we observers nothing, but -- it's so freaking hard to get published, by major houses, and to have notable editors work with you, to land regular columns in print publications.  Why in the holy hell would she let her focus seem to dwindle to this degree, when she probably has decades of work and life ahead of her, and isn't (and I am NOT no-kid-shaming) raising a family or doing volunteer work out of her ass or something?  It's just a little baffling, especially after Aviva's vicious attacks.  I am curious, I guess. 

[ryebread]

I felt bad for Sonja when Ramona was crouching over, and behind, her at the party basically yelling in ear, "Bethenny is never going to forgive you."  She repeated it 3 or 4 times in that manic tone she gets when she wants to make sure she's heard.   She's a wretched human being.

[shoegal]

6 minutes ago, izabella said:

I actually didn't see Lu as cowed at all.  She went toe to toe with the Beast, kept her cool, and pretty much just let Beasty hang herself.  Lu wasn't really even mad about it; she was resigned to hashing it out then and there since Beasty made such a spectacle.  Lu seemed very confident in herself, while Beasty was losing it. 

I lol'd when she chased Beasty and Carole down when they were trying to leave unnoticed without saying good-bye or thanking ther hostess.  If Lu had been cowed, she would have let them leave like they planned to.

Did she chase them down, or did she talk shit about them to the other ladies trying to win the others  over to her side?  Then she gives them big old hugs and tries to ingratiate herself to the two women who clearly cannot stand her!  LuAnn is kissing the ass that just jumped hers.  I think that's pretty cowed.  YMMV. 

[NewDigs]

12 minutes ago, shoegal said:

Semantics about "taking down" aside, I just enjoyed watching Bethenny say these things outloud and to her face, and have LuAnn have to acknowledge and defend.  I personally loved it, and LuAnn was definitely cowed, she's trying to ingratiate herself to Bethenny and Carole both!  Top it off with all of the hideous fashion choices she displayed, the crown jewel being that cheap and horrid lace jumpsuit and booties and I was eating it up!

I know mileage varies but I didn't see a "cowed" LuAnn. And Bethy seemed unhinged. Not a good look.

I could practically see LuLu's wheels turning and hope she was thinking, "I'm up here..."

Her up close and personal little back-atcha-Bethy scrunch-face was gold. 

And I'll put LuLu's red lace get-up against B's gray onesie any day. Neither wins that one, imho.

[shoegal]

3 minutes ago, NewDigs said:

I know mileage varies but I didn't see a "cowed" LuAnn. And Bethy seemed unhinged. Not a good look.

I could practically see LuLu's wheels turning and hope she was thinking, "I'm up here..."

Her up close and personal little back-atcha-Bethy scrunch-face was gold. 

And I'll put LuLu's red lace get-up against B's gray onesie any day. Neither wins that one, imho.

At least Bethenny knows not to wear her onesie pajamas out in "public".  I wish LuAnn had that much sense.  

Edited June 10, 2016 by shoegal

[NewDigs]

She knew the cameras were there!

That's kinda' sorta' public. lol

[shoegal]

2 minutes ago, NewDigs said:

She knew the cameras were there!

That's kinda' sorta' public. lol

Pajamas you wear on camera vs. jumpsuit you put your label on, sell as part of your "collection" and wear in public to a party in NYC?  Hmmmm, MMV indeed. 

Edited June 10, 2016 by shoegal

[NewDigs]

It was (supposed to be) a joke. 

[ryebread]

2 minutes ago, NewDigs said:

And I'll put LuLu's red lace get-up against B's gray onesie any day. Neither wins that one, imho.

I loved Beth's onesie.  Except it looked like it was cashmere and cashmere makes me scratch.  What I hated was Luann's sequined top.  It looked okay from the front but the zipper!  It was silver and too big and heavy for that delicate fabric,  It was all puckery and looked so cheap.  Another Countess Luann creation?

[lezlers]

1 hour ago, Neurochick said:

Don't forget, she's an honorary black woman too. 

And I don't think I'm alone in my Bethenny dislike either.  I don't find it funny or witty to attack people but as they say, YMMV.

Which, ironically, is what you did by saying no one with a brain could possibly like Bethanny. ;)

Edited June 10, 2016 by lezlers

[Yours Truly]

2 minutes ago, lezlers said:

Which, ironically, is what you did by saying no one with a brain could possibly like Bethanny. ;)

Well there's attack as in raise by wolves, baring teeth and causing destruction  and then there's being sarcastic. I agree with Neurochick. Mileage does vary. <shrug>

[NewDigs]

22 minutes ago, ryebread said:

I loved Beth's onesie.  Except it looked like it was cashmere and cashmere makes me scratch.  What I hated was Luann's sequined top.  It looked okay from the front but the zipper!  It was silver and too big and heavy for that delicate fabric,  It was all puckery and looked so cheap.  Another Countess Luann creation?

I thought the onesie's crotch was hanging too low. Did it have a drop-seat?

Always a main gripe of mine w/ jumpsuits. Well, that and I'm just not jumpsuit-crazy. 

Don't remember the sequined top but I don't think LuLu did her line any favors with that red lace thing.

[zoeysmom]

I think the first time Mario met Luann was at the tennis match.  There was no flirting going on.

Maybe this is the clip where Luann mentions Mario is a handsome guy.  There is nothing friendly between Ramona and Luann in this conversation.http://www.bravotv.com/the-real-housewives-of-new-york-city/season-2/videos/ramona-vs-the-countess 

Here is where Ramona twists what happened.  She claims Luann said Mario wasn't good looking.  Bethenny corrects her.  Bethenny and Ramona start bitching about Luann and the manners stuff. 

http://www.bravotv.com/the-real-housewives-of-new-york-city/season-2/videos/calling-a-spade-a-spade

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

3 hours ago, Yours Truly said:

I always felt like Kellys biggest offense was that she was annoying because of her obvious self appreciation. That and the fact that she wasn't quick on the uptake and therefore gave off the worse case of airhead.  Granted that's annoying but at the same time how do you turn that into something dark and devious and worthy of attack?  She really did seem to be an overall nice person, good with her kids and completely out of her depth when it came to confrontation. The "I'm up here, you're down there" conversation happened in response to how Beth did her thing and berated someone right in their face to SOMEONE else when Kelly showed up late for that charity meeting that time. I didn't see anything that warranted Beth to go off on Kelly as nasty as she did which is why from that season on I did not like her (I started watching RHoNY during it's second season). I don't believe that someone who has quirks or traits that annoy you is a reason to be intentionally nasty or hateful to them. I get that no one should have to endure the picadillos of someone elses if they don't want to but at the same time you also can't just steam into someone cause you don't like the way they carry themselves sometimes. Bringing it to someone's attention is one thing cause you want to make them aware of how it comes across but automatically berating or mocking them in the moment serves no one's purpose. But that's the way our Beth operates and yet she was the heroine and Kelly the villain. Huh, what?

I never got it but at the same time Kelly was terrible at trying to handle her and the situation but then again she was completely out of her league with thy bitch named Beth. I mean Lu is a smooth operator and it's obvious even she was winded after dealing with the Bethinator so of course Kelly had no shot taking Beth to task about anything. She ended up being so distraught in Beth's presence the girl had a melt down followed by a break down for crying out loud. I'm telling you Scary Island showed me what having to deal with someone so invested in causing someone else distress can physically and emotionally do to someone. That shit unfolded right before my eyes a whole lot different than most people saw it. Yellchhh, I just got the hibbie Jibbies just recalling how awful that whole things was.

Beth's behavior that season is similar to the way she's been steamrolling people this season and last. It's always been there it's just really full blast nowadays however I've never condoned her bullying ways so when Kelly had that sit down with her I took her to mean that she was way above treating people in the nasty way Beth does which in turn was what was meant by "you're down there". People like to see it like she was asserting some sort of social or success status when I took it to mean that she was outlining how she's not a fan of the catty bullshit women pull with each other and she won't be pulled into that way of dealing with her. I hated that she couldn't pull it off though. I had so much second hand embarrasment for Kelly and pissed that Beth ended up looking good because of that blundered exchange.

After that Kelly uneasiness when around Beth took over and created even more awkward turned ugly interactions which I never thought was ever Kelly's intent. I felt like most of the time Kelly was just trying to blow her nastiness off or push back and not allow Beth to be aggressive towards her but The Countess, she ain't. <shrug>

Absofuckinglutely, spot on. I was so in the minority back then but praised Kelly for calling out Bethenny. 

51 minutes ago, ryebread said:

I loved Beth's onesie.  Except it looked like it was cashmere and cashmere makes me scratch.  What I hated was Luann's sequined top.  It looked okay from the front but the zipper!  It was silver and too big and heavy for that delicate fabric,  It was all puckery and looked so cheap.  Another Countess Luann creation?

That black blouse was an atrocity!!!!! The giant zipper, and that itchy lace. Maybe they saw their mistake and tookt he bolts of fabric they were going to make it with in RED and made that fabric into jumpsuits... hmmmmm :-) 

[bravofan27]

I liked LuAnn's pantsuit. It was different but I thought it looked cool on her. Bethanny and Carole have formed a tight knit clique. I don't understand why LuAnn keeps chasing them--- the more LuAnn tries, the more they are going to try to shut her out. She should focus on having fun with Sonja. 

[anonymiss]

I don't like that Omarosa clip because it reminds me I consider her one reality TV person even worse than Bethenny. I've never seen anyone steamroll and badger and have delusions of grandeur worse than O.

Edited June 10, 2016 by anonymiss

[Neurochick]

1 hour ago, lezlers said:

Which, ironically, is what you did by saying no one with a brain could possibly like Bethanny. ;)

Bethenny, is that you?  So nice of you to join us. 

[MollyBrown]

1 hour ago, shoegal said:

At least Bethenny knows not to wear her onesie pajamas out in "public".  I wish LuAnn had that much sense.  

Except she was leaving Doro's house in her pj's. The driver and people in her building could see them ;)

[WireWrap]

15 minutes ago, bravofan27 said:

I liked LuAnn's pantsuit. It was different but I thought it looked cool on her. Bethanny and Carole have formed a tight knit clique. I don't understand why LuAnn keeps chasing them--- the more LuAnn tries, the more they are going to try to shut her out. She should focus on having fun with Sonja. 

I think she is doing it so that they can't freeze her out like they are doing to Sonja. Sonja isn't good at playing the "HW game", whereas Luann is an expert at it. LOL

[zoeysmom]

16 minutes ago, bravofan27 said:

I liked LuAnn's pantsuit. It was different but I thought it looked cool on her. Bethanny and Carole have formed a tight knit clique. I don't understand why LuAnn keeps chasing them--- the more LuAnn tries, the more they are going to try to shut her out. She should focus on having fun with Sonja. 

My thoughts and they may prove true next episode is Luann is not going to allow herself to be excluded.  She has been on the show since the beginning and is not going to be put in the corner.  She has done all the stuff RH are suppose to do when they have been unpleasant.  It is a joke that Dorinda includes Ramona after three pretty big dust ups so why wouldn't Luann think she would be included in a trip.

[izabella]

1 hour ago, shoegal said:

Did she chase them down, or did she talk shit about them to the other ladies trying to win the others  over to her side?  Then she gives them big old hugs and tries to ingratiate herself to the two women who clearly cannot stand her!  LuAnn is kissing the ass that just jumped hers.  I think that's pretty cowed.  YMMV. 

She did chase them down.  She spotted them outside putting stuff in the car, and opened the door and asked if they were leaving.  Then she went inside and asked the other women if they realized that they had left.  However, having been spotted, Carole, in her mubledy-voice, talked Beasty into going back inside to say goodbye to their hostess.

Edited June 10, 2016 by izabella