Flip Or Flop - General Discussion

[mojito]

Even one year ago, the CA coast was in either an exceptional or extreme drought (highest drought levels). I wonder if T&C would do well if they went for xeriscapes and alternative energy options in these homes, considering that inventory is undoubtedly getting lower and competition is getting thicker. I'm thinking that there could be a good market for homeowners who want things more simple (less extravagant floors and counter tops) and lower electrical and water costs and are willing to spend their money in a way that reflects those interests/concerns. I'd like the educational aspect of new appliances and technology that will reduce resource usage.

 

Maybe HGTV will come up with such a show and then completely ruin it with pseudo drama after its first successful season.

[Ohmo]

They posted on Facebook,

Can't remember now if that's a profit or not.

 

I think $430K is a profit for the Downey house. I seem to remember the break-even being $373 something, and the asking price was $429,000.

Edited July 5, 2015 by Ohmo

[jcbrown]

 

I wonder if T&C would do well if they went for xeriscapes

I think of this every time we see them put down yet another yard full of sod. With the current drought conditions we have here in CA, it just seems irresponsible to me to put in an expanse of living green lawn. Many municipalities are putting penalties in place for watering lawns except under certain conditions. I wish we saw them be a little responsible about this.

[auntjess]

They did say on Facebook, when asked about the sod, that these were filmed last year, and on the newer episodes they do more drought-tolerant lawns.

[iMonrey]

 

I just started to watch this show and I'm astounded by the budget for renovations. It doesn't make any sense at all. I find it annoying and kind of dishonest about the flipping business.

 

The quotes Steve was giving Tarek in this last one sounded like outright lies. $5K for a total bathroom remodel? Try doubling that. $10K for the kitchen? No way.

[MrPissyPuppy]

Flip or Flop Followup showed up in my (DirecTv/Tivo) lineup next Tuesday, July 14th.  

[Ohmo]

Flip or Flop Followup showed up in my (DirecTv/Tivo) lineup next Tuesday, July 14th.  

 

Thanks. DVR set.  I wish it was an hour instead of half an hour.

[Ohmo]

Season 3 is terrible. Why do people or networks or whoever take a great tv format and change it.

The first 2 years were really good shows. I liked it with Izzy he was a great addition now he is gone and they treat us like imbeciles with their explanation. I also liked the way they bought

houses at the auctions. If Izzy is busy on other projects then take the camera's to where he is working and continue the show. They got rid of the Latin contractor back to all Caucasians. As a Latina I think it is offensive as well as just plain jealousy because the public liked Izzy. It is July 1 2015 the show is not getting any better

BRING IZZY BACK

 

Comment from Flip or Flop FB page about Izzy:

 

We still use Izzy just not as much as we did in season 2. We did almost 90 flips last year. So between so many projects going at once and Izzy and his crew growing their own biz and getting busy with their own retail jobs too, We started using a few different contractors. We also started our own construction company last year (T&C Construction and Design) and its going strong and we are loving doing our own in-house projects as well!

 

Facebook page

 

There are a couple of FB comments saying Izzy should have his own show.  I like Steve just fine, but I'd also totally watch a show featuring Izzy!

[iMonrey]

An Izzy show, on this channel anyway, would be even more detrimental to Izzy's business than Tarek and Christina's. T&C might come off looking like a couple of bumbling fools but we see they do good, thorough work bringing everything up to code and using high-end materials. I'd feel comfortable buying a house from them.

 

What I would NOT do is hire a contractor who is constantly running into "surprises" halfway through a project that should have been apparent on Day 1. And since every remodeling show on HGTV seems to require a big "surprise" in every episode it would make Izzy look incompetent. 

 

That's why I'm suspicious maybe Izzy finally realized how bad this show was making him look and that's why we don't see him anymore. And maybe Steve isn't even a real contractor which is why he doesn't care.

 

 

We also started our own construction company last year (T&C Construction and Design) and its going strong and we are loving doing our own in-house projects as well!

 

See? It sounds like now they've got their own crew to work exclusively on this show so they don't have to worry about getting hired as contractors elsewhere.

[CaptainCranky]

I really do want to like this show. If you get past the constant Tarek mystified looks and whining about reno cost it's cute to watch the young couple and their ideas to upgrade these old homes.

 

However it's not realistic as to their reno cost and other cost they fail to disclose i.e. co-op real estate fees, city inspection fees and either the cost for their line of credit or the percentage they pay their real estate investors.

 

But I have a simple solution. My DVR of the last show cut off before they got to the brag part of how much they made and for me that made the show bearable to watch.

Edited July 8, 2015 by CaptainCranky

[mojito]

 

They did say on Facebook, when asked about the sod, that these were filmed last year, and on the newer episodes they do more drought-tolerant lawns.

I call BS on that because the drought didn't just start. But glad they finally got the memo.

[Peanutbuttercup]

Another show with Tarek whining and complaining about having to meet building codes and address safety issues. It's like he wants to sell people houses that are firetraps, with pipes waiting to explode and garage doors perfectly positioned to take out someone's eye. Just as long as it has builder-grade tiles in the bathroom and laminate floors, he doesn't care about the safety of people who are actually going to live in these houses.

I did have to laugh at the planted cute, chubby, slow-moving white mouse in last night's show. Sorry but anyone with a modicum of life experience recognizes that mouse as having a natural habitat in a cage in a laboratory. Hey producers: you can actually buy grey and brown mice at the pet store. Try that next time you want to try to trick viewers into thinking you filmed an actual wild rodent in a house on Flip or Flop.

 

eta: I noticed that next week's episode is something different called "Flip or Flop Follow Up" -- if you usually dvr this show you'll probably need to set your machine to get it separately.

Edited July 9, 2015 by Peanutbuttercup

[Honey]

Hahaha.  That mouse was an actor, with an agent.  Show some respect.  Willya?

[mojito]

I thought that it was just a starving albino field mouse with a distended stomach...That was probably the most idiotic prop or staged dramatic scene I've ever seen on HGTV/DIY. It was definitely laughable.

 

What happened to the home? My DVR cut it off. You'd think that with digital technology, TV broadcasts could be timed down to the millisecond and these things wouldn't happen. 

[psychoticstate]

My DVR cuts this show off every week and I keep forgetting to set it to record two minutes longer.

 

I love the show.  I live in Orange County and I'm always interested in seeing what's out there in the real estate market and how much it costs.  I do wish HGTV would can these "emergencies" and "surprises" because I like watching the renos just fine without them, unless they are real.  I don't think Tarek is stupid enough to think every flip will be $30K and I also don't think he gripes about the cost as much as the show highlights it.  It's just the role they want him to play.

 

After watching that douchecanoe Armando Montelongo for years on Flip This House and his lying about how every property sold immediately for a profit, I appreciate that this show does report back that not every property sells immediately or even at all.

[iMonrey]

 

My DVR of the last show cut off before they got to the brag part of how much they made and for me that made the show bearable to watch.

 

It sat on the market for a month at $499K and then they lowered it to $479K and sold it. I can't remember what the total profit was. Maybe around 50K.

 

 

Sorry but anyone with a modicum of life experience recognizes that mouse as having a natural habitat in a cage in a laboratory. Hey producers: you can actually buy grey and brown mice at the pet store. Try that next time you want to try to trick viewers into thinking you filmed an actual wild rodent in a house on Flip or Flop.

 

The mouse thing was so phony! It had to be someone's pet mouse, I felt so bad for it. I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt and say they did in fact find a mouse, didn't get it on camera, and then staged a re-creation. In fact I'm usually giving them the benefit of the doubt that most of the stuff they re-create, like the initial walk-thru, are things that actually did happen.

 

Once again, however, I was floored by how unrealistic the quotes were from the contractor. $5K for a complete kitchen gut and remodel? Or maybe he said $7 or $8K, but even so - NO WAY. No way in hell. I have a very small master bath and did an 80% remodel and had to cut corners just to keep it under $8K. That was with doing my own wallpaper removal and painting, and re-using the same toilet and vanity. I had to do my kitchen in stages. Total kitchen remodels are $15 to $20K minimum. 

 

The only thing I can think of is that maybe the contractor is just quoting them the total labor cost, not the cost of new fixtures, cabinets, counters, and appliances. But if so that's misleading, or at least confusing.

[slowpoked]

 

The only thing I can think of is that maybe the contractor is just quoting them the total labor cost, not the cost of new fixtures, cabinets, counters, and appliances. But if so that's misleading, or at least confusing.

I'm thinking that's what it probably is, and not the full cost of the actual remodel. Because everytime T&C goes out to pick tiles, countertops, etc., they compare the prices of each per square foot, and whatever design they end up choosing gets added to the investment on top of the reno budget. At least that's what it shows on the calculator on TV.

[CaptainCranky]

 

 

Once again, however, I was floored by how unrealistic the quotes were from the contractor. $5K for a complete kitchen gut and remodel? Or maybe he said $7 or $8K, but even so - NO WAY. No way in hell. I have a very small master bath and did an 80% remodel and had to cut corners just to keep it under $8K. That was with doing my own wallpaper removal and painting, and re-using the same toilet and vanity. I had to do my kitchen in stages. Total kitchen remodels are $15 to $20K minimum. 

 

The only thing I can think of is that maybe the contractor is just quoting them the total labor cost, not the cost of new fixtures, cabinets, counters, and appliances. But if so that's misleading, or at least confusing.

 

I've decided to ignore the money aspects of the show and concentrate on the ideas of flipping the properties as their cost figures are BS.

Edited July 9, 2015 by CaptainCranky

[mojito]

 

It had to be someone's pet mouse, I felt so bad for it.

Yeah, they went to central casting (friends' kids) to find that mouse.

 

Thanks for the follow-up on the final sale.

[Honey]

I cant wait to see what their little boy looks like.  I think Taylor has gotten cuter as the show's gone on.  I can see her having a little jealousy over her new brother though.  She has been the center of their universe for years.

[zenme]

I cant wait to see what their little boy looks like.  I think Taylor has gotten cuter as the show's gone on.  I can see her having a little jealousy over her new brother though.  She has been the center of their universe for years

 

I agree.  "Tay" or "Tay Tay" looks just like Tarek, but with blond hair.  I bet the little boy will look like Tarek as well.

[iMonrey]

 

I'm thinking that's what it probably is, and not the full cost of the actual remodel. Because everytime T&C goes out to pick tiles, countertops, etc., they compare the prices of each per square foot, and whatever design they end up choosing gets added to the investment on top of the reno budget. At least that's what it shows on the calculator on TV.

 

Except then Steve turned around and said they could turn the half bath into a full bath for $3K. And Tarek specified "does that include tiling and flooring and all the rest" and he said yes. So - that's definitely misleading. Converting a half bath into a full bath for just 3 grand? No. Freaking. Way.

[CaptainCranky]

Except then Steve turned around and said they could turn the half bath into a full bath for $3K. And Tarek specified "does that include tiling and flooring and all the rest" and he said yes. So - that's definitely misleading. Converting a half bath into a full bath for just 3 grand? No. Freaking. Way.

 

And there in lies the problem with this show. There is no resemblance to real world reno cost, especially in SoCal.

 

Cute show if you ignore the money figures and enjoy their ideas to upgrade these homes.

[Taylorh2]

I'm not a regular viewer of this show but I watched about 4 episodes today. I wonder why they don't donate good materials to an organization like "Habitat For Humanity" ?   The contractors go in with sledge hammers and just have at it. Perfectly good cabinets/counters are just destroyed.

 

Also, on one show they put in an offer for $430,000 and the listing agent told them that another offer for $440,000 was coming in.so they offered $440,000 and got the house.

 

How ?

[chessiegal]

Perhaps their offer was all cash with a quick close and the other wasn't. They're having a new show at 9 with behind the scenes stuff, 1 success, and 1 flop. I hope it answers some of the questions posed here. I like the show, they are such a cute couple, and I like Christina's style.

[mojito]

Those foam pop outs they used on the corner of the house and around the windows on a recent show....are they really made of foam? If a kid throws a baseball at it, or someone bumped it with a ladder, won't it get damaged?

[Taylorh2]

I cant wait to see what their little boy looks like.  I think Taylor has gotten cuter as the show's gone on.  I can see her having a little jealousy over her new brother though.  She has been the center of their universe for years.

 

 Thank you.  ;  -)

[roseha]

 

I wonder why they don't donate good materials to an organization like "Habitat For Humanity" ?   The contractors go in with sledge hammers and just have at it. Perfectly good cabinets/counters are just destroyed.

 

 

I thought Tarek mentioned donating materials on one show but not sure when that was.  I do remember that the Scott Brothers (I think it was Jonathan) mentioned donating their old materials in Property Brothers at Home.  I think he may have mentioned Habitat for Humanity.

Edited July 15, 2015 by roseha

[ByaNose]

The Flip or Flop update was interesting. It was amazing to see the Flip staging taken away when the new homeowner bought it & moved in. The house was almost a million dollars but the inside looked like something from the 90's. It really showed how great the staging is until a real person moves in. That said, she seemed like a nice lady.

[MsTree]

Those foam pop outs they used on the corner of the house and around the windows on a recent show....are they really made of foam? If a kid throws a baseball at it, or someone bumped it with a ladder, won't it get damaged?

 

They are made with very high density foam and are covered with thick "chicken wire". Add several coats of stucco, and they are fairly strong. Of course if some brat wants to use a baseball bat, anything can be destroyed. Bumping a ladder shouldn't hurt it unless there was a LOT of force behind the 'bump'. Otherwise, pop outs hold up very well.

[Taylorh2]

They clearly show contractors destroying perfectly good cabinets and countertops.

[ByaNose]

I actually never knew the pop outs were made that way. I thought they were cement or wood. I know nothing about construction & it was interesting to see.

[zivadanielle]

The Flip or Flop update was interesting. It was amazing to see the Flip staging taken away when the new homeowner bought it & moved in. The house was almost a million dollars but the inside looked like something from the 90's. It really showed how great the staging is until a real person moves in. That said, she seemed like a nice lady.

I enjoyed "...Follow Up" too. 

 

Gotta love that lady with the pool table in the dining room...that could be the Mr and Mrs zivadanielle abode LOL.   Her doggies were cute and it was sweet that Tarek and Christina brought over a gift basket with treats for them.

 

The unseen footage was generally pretty amusing...esp the part with Partner Pete and the house that was a pretty big flop! 

Edited July 15, 2015 by zivadanielle

[iMonrey]

So the follow-up was . . . interesting, if random. I mean, they more or less admitted they lied about the profit they made on that big house that ended up being a $9700 loss. And it feels like they just went back and culled three episodes that had a lot of extra footage there wasn't room for. I think there were probably more interesting flips they could have reviewed but they, or maybe the network, decided these three had the best "bonus" footage. 

 

I did like them revisiting one of the houses they flipped and meeting the new owner - although again, there are probably better flips I'd like to see again - and I kind of wish they'd do more of this. I remember that house, where they couldn't make the bathroom as big as they wanted. And even though it looked pretty good, I could kind of tell when the door was open it almost slammed into the counter, so I do think it ended up being a pretty tight space.

 

I'm assuming this was the last new show of the season.

[chessiegal]

On their FB page, they said this was a new series, so I assumed we will see more.

[mojito]

 

Gotta love that lady with the pool table in the dining room...that could be the Mr and Mrs zivadanielle abode LOL.

I know a very middle class couple that has done the same. Food is served up in the kitchen. Another friend has turned their dining room into a play room. Kitchen again. But it seems that more people will use the dining room or formal living room for what it's supposed to be used for, than those who are practical about it. I saw, on a show today, this couple that declared the formal living room "wasted space". This was a couple with kids. My eyes rolled. Why are people so hung up on being so damned conventional as opposed to practical?

Edited July 16, 2015 by mojito

[auntjess]

I see Mike Holmes use the foam a lot, usually under stucco. 
It also insulates.
 

[Angeltoes]

Such baloney - they went to the house thinking they were the first ones to get a crack at it. Go in and there's people all over the place. Where did these folks park since the place looked deserted when T&C pulled up?

[CaptainCranky]

They are made with very high density foam and are covered with thick "chicken wire". Add several coats of stucco, and they are fairly strong. Of course if some brat wants to use a baseball bat, anything can be destroyed. Bumping a ladder shouldn't hurt it unless there was a LOT of force behind the 'bump'. Otherwise, pop outs hold up very well.

I have a ton of foam pop outs on our all stucco home and your definition is a good one.

 

However I seriously doubt if this show and the installation of the pop outs is done the correct way but rather only foam covered by some brown coat and paint.

[meep.meep]

However it's not realistic as to their reno cost and other cost they fail to disclose i.e. co-op real estate fees, city inspection fees and either the cost for their line of credit or the percentage they pay their real estate investors.

I've bought and sold a reasonable amount of real estate in California over 30 years.  I've never heard of co-op real estate fees.  The houses they are flipping are stand alone single-family residences.  Occasionally they mention home owner association fees, but they're not co-operatively owned.  No need for co-op fees.

 

Real estate costs and practices vary widely from state to state and even between areas in one state.  It's not just costs that are different.  In some states, you have to have an attorney to buy or sell houses, for example.

 

What always strikes me as weird about the show, is not getting termite inspections right away, because if the buyers have to get a loan, the lending institution will require a termite inspection.  And unless the house is made entirely out of redwood, in California there will be termite damage.

[CaptainCranky]

I've bought and sold a reasonable amount of real estate in California over 30 years.  I've never heard of co-op real estate fees.  

 

So if you have a listing agent and then a selling agent and they don't split the real estate commission??

 

I'm a real estate broker in two contiguous midwestern states and maybe the term is not correct in CA but we call that a co-op,

Edited July 18, 2015 by CaptainCranky

[Saylii]

So if you have a listing agent and then a selling agent and they don't split the real estate commission??

I'm a real estate broker in two contiguous midwestern states and maybe the term is not correct in CA but we call that a co-op,

I always assumed they were rolling any commissions into their closing costs. Tarek & Christina are also real estate agents, so I imagine they do a lot of their own work to save on their commissions. I would guess they would pay buyer's agents when they have to.

[Saylii]

Tarek's mentioned donating materials once, but I think it was a house they bought mid-flip from another investor and wanted to replace the cabinets. I don't think it had a countertop on it iirc.

It takes time to get cabinets, countertops, and other fixtures out carefully enough to donate. More time = less profit to Tarek.

[Cranky One]

What happened with the Whittier house with the expensive front door and the weird loan? Uverse kept freezing up and I missed that part.

[chessiegal]

What happened with the Whittier house with the expensive front door and the weird loan? Uverse kept freezing up and I missed that part.

 

It took too long to sell, so with the hard money loan, they ended up with a $19,600 profit, which they considered a flop (it took 4 months to sell).

[Cranky One]

Thanks, chessiegal!

[chessiegal]

I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on what they estimate the profit will be vs what it actually turned out to be. At the end of the regular show, they always say something to the effect of "if this deal goes through, will make x amount of money". So if they've finished production of an episode before all the papers are signed, I can understand there being a difference.

[roughing it]

 

If there's a drawback, it's that they're basically admitting the show lied about stuff, because the original episode about the house they bought the big, fancy front door for showed a much higher profit at the end that what it really turned out to be.

I thought they said there was a cash deal, but then the deal fell through.

[mojito]

 

I thought they said there was a cash deal, but then the deal fell through.

Yes, the deal that they mentioned on the show fell though and the house sat on the market for 4 months (at $200/day -- yikes). 

[ShellSeeker]

Hey guys, since the follow up show has started airing episodes, I've started a thread for it and moved some posts. Feel free to discuss all things follow-up over there!