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Wonder Woman (2017)

Kromm

By Kromm
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scarynikki12
scarynikki12

I think that there wasn't a goodbye kiss because Steve knew he wouldn't be able to go through with his mission if he gave in.  When she called his name he slowed his run but then had to force himself

Sakura12
Sakura12

For me they did show how powerful she was. The whole fight with Ares was showing that the mortal men were nothing compared to her and Ares. Steve and his team could not fight a god, but they could con

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methodwriter85

methodwriter85

2 hours ago, VCRTracking said:

It's say to say most people disagree with James Cameron:

James Cameron Says Wonder Woman Objectified Its Star, Is a ‘Step Backwards’ From Sarah Connor

Seriously? Wonder Woman's not a great role model because she's pretty?

Patti Jenkins response on Twitter was class:

James Cameron honestly seems like he's just trying to get publicity for his attempt at rebooting the Terminator franchise which is dead in the water at the moment.

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DollEyes

DollEyes

(edited)

James Cameron needs to have several seats. Contrary to his opinion, there's more than one way for women to be strong, tough and a role model.  Just because Wonder Woman is conventionally beautiful, that doesn't make her message less valid. WW epitomizes the best of all women, regardless of looks, age, size, or color. Kudos to Patty Jenkins for calling out Cameron's man-splaining bullshit in a classy way.  Cameron doesn't get it, but if the film's success is any indication, there are millions of women, men and kids worldwide who do. 

Edited by DollEyes
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Bruinsfan

Bruinsfan

I thought it was quite impressive how the movie avoided objectifying Diana despite the character being played by a beautiful woman whose outfits often exposed a lot of skin. An achievement I very much credit to having a woman at the helm directing it—even with "feminist" male directors there usually seems to be at least a scene or two where the male gaze treatment of leading ladies is very apparent and goes to a skeevy place. (I'll note that for all my criticisms of Zack Snyder, that's one thing he's gotten right in the movies I've seen. His badass women tend to be badass first and foremost, and their attractiveness is incidental rather than the point of the character.)

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Zuleikha

Zuleikha

Yeah, I don't think Wonder Woman was objectified at all. I think James Cameron is misunderstanding what objectification is. He wouldn't be the first person I've seen do that, but it's a bit odd in a filmmaker. He seems to be thinking that objectification is about being called beautiful or wearing skimpy outfits (which WW didn't even do in a conventional sense; she wore armor that was inspired by the appropriate historical references. That great article by the costumer was linked here, right?). But objectification is about a set of visual strategies that literally reduce the person to an object. The camera certainly admired Wonder Woman and Steve Trevor, but it didn't objectify them.  (IIRC, the camera came closer to objectifying Sarah Connor in her opening scene in T2, although I don't think it quite crossed the line and it certainly didn't objectify her in general).

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phalange

phalange

James Cameron's comments are gross on multiple levels, honestly. It's insulting to both Linda Hamilton, by basically insinuating she isn't pretty, and Gal Gadot, by reducing her to just her looks. His entire opinion basically boils down to: 'Wonder Woman can't be a strong character or feminist icon because the actress is too good looking.' He's echoing the old sexist double standard that says a woman can be pretty or she can be strong (or intelligent), but she can't be both. And really, I can only assume he didn't actually watch the same movie as the rest of us, because nowhere in there was Diana objectified in the first place. 

Patty Jenkins' response was perfect. Women are perfectly capable of deciding for ourselves who we look up to and why.

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Bruinsfan

Bruinsfan

Patty Jenkins' response was the epitome of class, but I think Cameron is in need of a roasting like the one Jennifer Wright gave to Bobby Vogel's review for The American Conservative. A measured, classy response isn't going to sink in through that thick a shell of chauvinism and ego, but being told "It’s nice you got an erection, but Gal Gadot was not flirting with you just because she has large eyes and symmetrical features" to the guffaws of many, many third parties might at least be humiliating enough to make him reconsider the next time he has the impulse to knock another director's critically acclaimed movie so he can boast about his own past glories.

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benteen

benteen

Good for Patty Jenkins.  She's truly earned it and her return bodes well for the sequel.

Leaving Thor The Dark World was the best thing to happen to her.  Now, I happened to like that movie but The Dark World is one of the more forgettable MCU entries.  She was able with Wonder Woman to make something truly memorable.

Cameron's comments are stupid but he has had a recent trend of throwing shade onto successful movies like The Force Awakens.  Maybe this is what he does in between taking a dozen years to make another movie.  He's probably just bitter though because he can't make Gal Gadot his fifth wife...or would it be his sixth wife?  I'm not a Tina Fey fan but one of the great lines she has was when she said Kathryn Bigelow knew all about torture because she had been married to Cameron. 

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SnoGirl

SnoGirl

I finally saw it, and as a Marvel girl, Wonder Woman always be number one now.

I waited so long bc I didnt want to hate it. I've been waiting so long for a female Super Hero movie, I was just a nervous wreck. I built it up so much, I didnt think I could ever love it as much as "I know my value" Agent Carter.

I have never been so happy to be proven wrong. I laughed, I cried, and Im kicking myself for waiting so long. It was amazing. 

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HunterHunted

HunterHunted

8 hours ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

Re: James Cameron

Does Gal Gadot resemble some chick who dumped James Cameron a long time ago?

He tends to be involved with very attractive, talented, accomplished women: Gale Anne Hurd, Kathryn Bigelow, and Linda Hamilton.

6 hours ago, MarkHB said:

I think it's a case where people have been spending so many years telling James Cameron that his shit doesn't stink that he's fallen into the trap of believing it.

His problem is that he's a brat who is too used to the accolades. For a long time, he was The Name if you were talking about a filmmaker who had depicted strong women in their blockbuster films: Ripley in Aliens, Sarah Connor in the Terminator films, Neytiri in Avatar, and to a lesser extent Helen Tasker in True Lies. His problem is that right as he's ready to start working on the Avatar sequels and Battle Angel, everyone is talking about Wonder Woman, Gal Gadot, Patty Jenkins, and saying "this is the female hero we've been waiting for." He of course is like, what about me and the female heroes I brought to the screen. He never thought that he would have to share some of that praise with anyone else. The other problem is that he considers himself an auteur because of his passion for coming up with innovative filming techniques. I loved Wonder Woman, but it's fairly conventional. I imagine that chafes at Cameron's hide as much as anything else.

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Chas411

Chas411

Only saw this film today as it was an inflight movie. Didn't follow the comic or the show so had no knowledge or expectations going into it. 

It was amazing!!

i was gutted to lose Steve Trevor though. Obviously a love interest to the lead doesn't always stay the same but is there any chance he'll be coming back in any way shape or form? It's not that I don't think the franchise will continue to shine without him just.. I really liked him..

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Spartan Girl

Spartan Girl

We all loved Steve. Just because I saw the death coming a mile away doesn't make it any less gutting.

14 hours ago, Bruinsfan said:

I'll give him props for the great job he did with Sarah Connor and Ripley (perhaps my all-time favorite movie action hero!), but dude didn't invent or trademark strong, smart, brave women in film.

Sure he deserves credit and so does Joss Whedon, but both Cameron's shitty comments and Whedon's sexist behavior in his own marriage renders their so-called "progressive portrayal of women" moot. And like you said, they aren't the emperors of feminist fiction.

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Bruinsfan

Bruinsfan

I can see a reasonable argument that after what she went through in WWI, witnessing the full horrors of WWII (not just the Holocaust, but also the "good guys" leveling Dresden, Hiroshima, and Nagasaki) might have disheartened her enough to make her give up intervening publicly in military conflicts. Though perhaps she did act in secret to rescue disaster victims the way Clark Kent did prior to his public debut.

Lonesome Rhodes

Lonesome Rhodes

On 10/27/2017 at 3:43 PM, VCRTracking said:

Agreed. After Wonder Woman the idea that Diana would abandon mankind in the last century especially during WW2 is ridiculous. I wouldn't mind that being retconned.

There is no other plausible explanation now that we saw her briefly in current times.  Had she intervened any number of times, millions would have been saved, given her powers. 

I was furious with how they showed her to still be among us and that she never left.  As good as the movie is, the takeaway of what happened just a couple of decades later, with her still around, almost ruins the franchise for me.  YMMV.

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HunterHunted

HunterHunted

(edited)
10 hours ago, Lonesome Rhodes said:

There is no other plausible explanation now that we saw her briefly in current times.  Had she intervened any number of times, millions would have been saved, given her powers. 

I was furious with how they showed her to still be among us and that she never left.  As good as the movie is, the takeaway of what happened just a couple of decades later, with her still around, almost ruins the franchise for me.  YMMV.

I wouldn't mind if they gave her the story from Kevin Grevioux' Odyssey of the Amazons. After WWI, Diana tries to find her way back to Themyscira both to tell them of her success and explain how the Amazon's cannot continue to shut themselves away any longer. She finds that is barred from returning as her mother has said. However, a storm rages and she finds herself swept from one magically protected land to another filled with warrior women all over the globe who have been given magical missions of their own--celtic warrior women, Valkyries, the N'Nonmiton of Dahomey, Ng Mui and the White Crane Temple, and others. With each stop she convinces another warrior or two to join her on her quest and mission. They emerge towards the end of WW2, just early enough to participate in D-day, witness the horrors, and see the atom bomb. Wonder Woman knows that each of the women who left will be barred from returning to their home like she is, but encourages them to travel the earth and tell others in these protected spaces about how they can no longer shut themselves away. It ends when we see one of the other warriors (the Wonder Women) arrive on Themyscira.

So I want it to be an accident that Wonder Woman misses most of World War 2, but I don't want it to be a purposeless or useless accident.

Edited by HunterHunted
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