MSNBC: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (Vaulted)

[represent]

The issue with the Birther Movement, was stated best by Bernie Sanders in terms of what I as black person think, I remember Bernie said way back during the primaries, it was in front of the forum for Hispanic voters, that it was the audacity of Trump to ever think that he actually had a right to ask for proof of birth. Just the other day a Trump surrogate said what's wrong with just asking? Really?

 Bernie points out that nobody asked him for his birth certificate and his father was born overseas just like Obama's. I was no Bernie supporter but he got that one right.  He dug down deep and got the essence of the problem. The question should have NEVER been asked.

He needs to apologize for asking the question.  Low class, Donald J. Trump, needs to apologize to the

honorable President Barack Hussein Obama II and the words have to come directly out of Trump's racist, shitty mouth.

And nice try bigot Joe Scarborough, you see your boy coming up and now you're going to try to make a false equivalent between he and Hillary by showing that tape of Hillary. I heard Hillary say that she took Obama at his word, that's good enough for me. Bye, just bye Joe, nice try. 

Edited September 16, 2016 by represent

[jjj]

Lawrence O'Donnell showed a letter from the Methodist hierarchy that oversees the Flint church visited by Trump, which stated that it would not make its clergy available for political commentary.  I do not believe the letter mentioned Pastor Faith Green Timmons by name, but Lawrence did say that his show and many others had been trying to get her on air for an interview.  This is, first of all, right (of the church to decline) and also brilliant, as she would have become the target of Trump over the next few news cycles if she added anything.  So, the church hierarchy, by stating its clergy are not available for politics, is also underscoring that its churches are not available for politics, as the pastor said about Trump's stump speech.  Anything she would have said subsequently would have allowed Trump to say "aha! she *is* being political!".  Like the Khan family got mired in his muck. 

Yes, I saw that Morning Joe was trying to compare the shutdown of Trump in that church to the many times that other churches have allowed political speeches.  But denominations are different -- and have a right to allow or not allow speeches that are aligned (or not) with their basic precepts.  I can think of several topics that a Catholic church would not allow to be promoted -- and in fact, can't really think of Catholic churches that have hosted political speeches, versus spiritual visits by candidates.  That pastor had every right to decide what would be presented in her church, and it appeared they had been clear about that in advance.  I realize Trump may never have received that message, and his supporters figured no one would stop him once he started his speech. 

Edited September 16, 2016 by jjj

[pennben]

3 hours ago, car54 said:

I never say this, but I can't wait for Hardball tonight--Matthews is going to be all over Trump's Birther press conference.

Joy Reid is going to be guest-hosting Hardball tonight!!!  Woohoo, such a better choice than Matthews.  DVR already set, popcorn ready to be popped. 

ETA:  My bad, apparently she's just going to be joining Chris.  DVR remains set to cover her segment.....finger on the fast-forward button to zip through how I know Matthews will somehow botch today.

Edited September 16, 2016 by pennben

[MulletorHater]

1 hour ago, cattykit said:

Maybe the NYT was stung by LOD's harsh criticism of their euphemism "stretching the truth."  Today they're calling a lie a lie.

Finally!  Maybe the rest of the mainstream media will finally grow a pair and stop treating Trump like a normal presidential candidate.  Rachel and LOD have been on fire this week.

It's obvious that Trump knew he was lying all along.  It's a little late in the day to jump off the "birther" bandwagon now that it's a political liability.  Hopefully, Chris Matthews, Rachel and others will hold Trump--and his surrogates'--feet to the fire.  It's simply not enough to make a craven statement that President Obama is an American citizen--period.  The problem is that Trump followed up his statement with yet another lie, and his narcissism took over yet again when he indicated that Obama should be grateful to him for clearing up this matter.  Journalists should be asking the obvious follow-up questions, i.e. what happened to all those investigators you hired who were allegedly finding out all kinds of things that we just wouldn't believe?  Oh, and what about those tax returns of yours?  Any comment on the Newsweek article about your shadowy business dealings?

I grinned like a Cheshire cat last night when I saw Joy and Rachel discussing this foolery last night.  Joy did an excellent job in explaining why this "birther" lie and other attempts to delegitimize President Obama are sore spots with African American voters, whom the Trump campaign (not him, personally) are belatedly trying to court.

[car54]

Oh lord, some minions of Trumps was just on with Kornake and he says he has a transcript of some former staffer from Hillary's '08 campaign who says they DID  push the Birther idea.   WIll this ever end?????

[TOL]

2 hours ago, represent said:

 

And nice try bigot Joe Scarborough, you see your boy coming up and now you're going to try to make a false equivalent between he and Hillary by showing that tape of Hillary. I heard Hillary say that she took Obama at his word, that's good enough for me. Bye, just bye Joe, nice try. 

Here's the deal with Joe Scarborough: he's a front runner.  I swear if Alabama ever started losing, their #1 fan would probably stop rooting for them.  He prefaces everything with "as I've always said" and then changes his story to fit the narrative. 

When Donald Trump tweeted about Joe and Mika's rumored relationship (which was "deplorable")  Joe was justifiably pissed and was brutal on every move Trump made-- but more than that, completely on the Hillary bandwagon. Until she started lagging in the polls, and now he sniffs around Trump.  

He can be funny- and I usually love the chemistry at the table  (Although Mika bugs with her constant simpering) -- but he's been insufferable lately.  I look forward to seeing what he does if she surges ahead- and wins, which I believe she will

edit to add: He was SO WRONG on the "Hillary started it" and he sounded as loony as the rest of them who try spreading that lie!

Edited September 16, 2016 by TOL

[jjj]

So, the Big Announcement was at a newly opened Trump hotel in D.C.  I turned off MSNBC before the Big Announcement, but now I am reading in the news that Trump appeared briefly, said nothing about Obama, and then had a stream of military officers step up to the microphone to endorse him WHILE THE CAMERAS WERE RUNNING.  So, it became an infomercial for the campaign that many networks carried.  The Washington Post said that even Fox cut away at some point.  And Jake Tapper said this was a television version of web click-baiting, where you end up watching material you never would have clicked on otherwise.

And then Trump took selected media on a tour of his new hotel, but would not include print reporters.  The Post article said networks would not carry the tour because of the way he was treating the press.  And because it was another infomercial.

Honest to gosh, I think that when he is alone with his family and his advisors, he is cackling endlessly and saying "Can you believe these chuckleheads?  They *deserve* me as president because they are so stoopid." 

[stormy]

Michael Steele shows up on MTP Daily and defends MR Trump for not apologizing.  He is pathetic.

[represent]

2 hours ago, jjj said:

So, the Big Announcement was at a newly opened Trump hotel in D.C.  I turned off MSNBC before the Big Announcement, but now I am reading in the news that Trump appeared briefly, said nothing about Obama, and then had a stream of military officers step up to the microphone to endorse him WHILE THE CAMERAS WERE RUNNING.  So, it became an infomercial for the campaign that many networks carried.  The Washington Post said that even Fox cut away at some point.  And Jake Tapper said this was a television version of web click-baiting, where you end up watching material you never would have clicked on otherwise.

And then Trump took selected media on a tour of his new hotel, but would not include print reporters.  The Post article said networks would not carry the tour because of the way he was treating the press.  And because it was another infomercial.

Honest to gosh, I think that when he is alone with his family and his advisors, he is cackling endlessly and saying "Can you believe these chuckleheads?  They *deserve* me as president because they are so stoopid." 

The media is the story of this election and it's a pathetic one.  I can't wait till Dictator Don gets elected and reporters start disappearing, good times ahead for them. Once this election is over I don't think MSNBC and CNN will be seeing me. Like I said before, I hope these networks are completely destroyed since folks are getting their news online more and more. I hope the are completely run off the air, it would be a perfect punishment. I just hope that folks like Maddow, Hayes, Reid and O'Donnell can get good gigs. Maybe they can start a network. Oh scratch that, Dictator Don will be controlling the airways.

I think I heard ABC didn't give him any coverage, they cut coverage or something to that effect.

Edited September 16, 2016 by represent

[jjj]

Here you are, about the punking of the media this morning, including MSNBC, which was showing that meeting room for a long time before I turned it off:

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/09/donald-trump-punks-media-228310

From this piece:  " 'As soon as Donald Trump is speaking germane to the new conversation right now, which is focused on the comments that even he himself said he would hope to address soon, the topic of bitherism,” MSNBC’s Peter Alexander said as he anchored the coverage."  and "In a show of defiance, the major networks collectively voted to pull a camera and erase video of Trump giving a tour of his hotel. But that only came after the lengthy free coverage Trump racked up earlier on Friday."

Edited September 16, 2016 by jjj

[Padma]

Will the MSM every accept the fact that Trump is actually the one who's the liar? I found Jason Miller's statement last night so offensive, but most of the press just reads the final paragraph saying he believes the pres. was born in the U.S.  The first paragraph about how its all Hillary's doing is disgusting.

The second paragraph, how "DT is always a closer and he closed this one. We owe him our thanks" or some such because he spread lies about the president for five years and tried to humiliate him by demanding birth certificate AND college transcripts! Then taking credit for it, as he did again this morning? Really, he has a deep psychological problem. He ALWAYS has to be right. And he will twist ANYTHING any way in order to take a hit at an opponenet.

I started on MSNBC, but couldn't believe how Trump was playing them with the military people endorsing him--40 minutes leading up to his 33 seconds of 3 sentences (two of them lies).  Incredible. Then his people actually physically restrained the pool producer who was supposed to accompany the camera on the tour.

Wolf Blitzer of all people actually had a good interview with Patti Solis Doyle who debunked all the lies regarding Clinton. (Not to mention Obama wouldn't have made a birther his SOS. Also, that was 2007 so who cares? Trump has been leading the birthers for the past five years. I hope that finally the media will nail him on it.  Do we really want someone who lies like this , lies easily all the time?)

Can't wait for Joy and Lawrence and Rachel and Chris H. Dpn't let us down!

[represent]

The media can cover Trump however they want. If he wanted coverage today he should have been forced to put in writing what he was going to say ahead of time, otherwise we're not coming to your conference. What I wouldn't give for the media to go on strike when it comes to Trump events, to literally pick up and have left that conference today as he stood on stage. Now that shit would have been a story. There's plenty of investigative work for them to do because as of now, I think I can count on one hand the reporters who are trying to save this country by doing the leg work of investigative reporting.

Edited September 16, 2016 by represent

[jjj]

Oh, shit, now Trump is saying HRC should get rid of her "bodyguards" (Secret Service) and "then let's see what happens to her."  And Hardball is having an idiotic discussion about this.  Why the hell does Chris Matthews have someone from the American Conservative Union on to say it is hypocritical for HRC to have armed "bodyguards" (Secret Service, guy, and Trump has them, also), because she is "against the Second Amendment".  Another falsehood today.  Concerns about assault weapons is not "against the Second Amendment".

[EyewatchTV211]

4 minutes ago, jjj said:

Oh, shit, now Trump is saying HRC should get rid of her "bodyguards" (Secret Service) and "then let's see what happens to her."  And Hardball is having an idiotic discussion about this.  Why the hell does Chris Matthews have someone from the American Conservative Union on to say it is hypocritical for HRC to have armed "bodyguards" (Secret Service, guy, and Trump has them, also), because she is "against the Second Amendment".  Another falsehood today.  Concerns about assault weapons is not "against the Second Amendment".

Ugh. I always hate this argument. Even if you're against guns in general (not just assault weapons), there's a difference between a notable public figure who is hated by many needing protection of armed security and the general public thinking they need protection from mostly non-existent enemies.

[jjj]

Awwww, Chris Hayes and his ceremonial pitch.  He did a little segment on his show, including pictures of his father and himself at a game last year, and a little group photo of him and his children at the game last night.  I think they both had little Cubs uniforms or jerseys?  (it went by fast)  And he actually got the ball across the plate and into the pitcher's mitt.  Thanks for a little relief from the news, Chris!  Relief pitching!

Edited September 17, 2016 by jjj

[Padma]

3 hours ago, jjj said:

Oh, shit, now Trump is saying HRC should get rid of her "bodyguards" (Secret Service) and "then let's see what happens to her."  And Hardball is having an idiotic discussion about this.  Why the hell does Chris Matthews have someone from the American Conservative Union on to say it is hypocritical for HRC to have armed "bodyguards" (Secret Service, guy, and Trump has them, also), because she is "against the Second Amendment".  Another falsehood today.  Concerns about assault weapons is not "against the Second Amendment".

Oddly, Lawrence showed a clip from the Miami rally, but only the part about the bodyguards disarming. He completely left out the bad part "then let's see what happens to her."  Strange choice, and maybe he shouldn't have shown it at all. It was kind of "well, for Trump that's no big deal." But the "Lets see what happens to her" part was pernicious as usual.

...Sorry, I know. He'll say it was a joke. Don't we have any sense of humor? I haven't looked at Fox today, but it's been nice to see CNN and MSNBC calling him out in so many different ways.

[Ohwell]

I hadn't watched Joy Reid's show until this morning, and it was rough.  She had on Toure, Katy Tur and a black Trump surrogate named Sean Jackson.  She jumped all over the Trump surrogate and wouldn't let him finish his answers to her questions.  I can understand how someone you vehemently disagree with can make your head explode and you want them to STFU, but as a paid professional journalist, I would think you'd have to hold it together and at least be civil to the person whom you disagree with.  She was veering into Chris Matthews territory and I thought she was rude and obnoxious.  I think she comes off as more polite as a panel member, but I won't be watching her show anymore.  I miss MHP.    

[car54]

She cut off that Trump surrogate because he persisted in stating opinion as fact and refused to support those opinions with any verification.

I find when Joy hosts she just will not tolerate it--and after watching so many hosts who let it slide when guests do this, I kind of appreciate her toughness.

[jenrising]

Exactly. She won't let them just lie or not answer the question. Which is what every host should do, but is so rare.

[Padma]

That's a tough call. Because all of these hosts know by now that the Trump surrogates always will lie in defense of him. I'm not saying it to be mean. Time and again, when tasked with defending one of the awful things he has said or done, they will bring out a  talking point that's a lie.  It's either a lie about something Trump said or a lie about someone else (usually Hillary). Or a lie about how he didn't do what you saw him do, or didn't say what you heard him say, or how you just don't understand his sense of humor.  They all lie effortlessly about big things and small ones, just like their candidate.  And its not like they're ever discussing his v. her health care plans...tax proposals...military budget, etc.  It's not like we learn anything from the back and forth.

If I were Joy (et al) I don't know if I'd have any of the Trump surrogates on, even the less offensive ones like Steve Cortes. On the one hand, it's a platform for them to lie. On the other, you might think it's the opportunity to challenge or expose those lies.  I'm just not sure that's what really happens. People who already support Trump just think their surrogates aren't treated fairly. And people who don't support him have the aggravation of listening to lies (not all of which go unchallenged) or seeing a good host look bad because of the apparent rudeness in cutting them off.

I think I'd substitute journalists, political analysts and historians for all the surrogates. I'm sure there are some good looking, lively ones out there who have more worthwhile things to say than any of them.

[jenrising]

True. Really, campaign surrogates are useless time-fillers regardless of who they represent. They're always going to agree with, defend and push their candidate, so there's nothing to actually learn from them. But I guess with 24 hours of news to fill, there's plenty of time for them to do it and lots are willing. 

[car54]

I feel like MSNBC has used Joy as the explainer in chief on virtually every show for the past few days about why Trump's birther movement cuts the so deep for most African American Citizens, and frankly the past day, I've felt like it's really getting to her.   She's spoken with great feeling about that subject and I think hearing someone just flat out lie about it once again probably crosses a line for her.   

And by golly I think Katy Tur must have been on the debate team  in school--they've had her on a lot lately to debunk some of the Trump surrogates and she is one cool-headed debater--she sticks her ground and won't back off when they keep spouting their party line--she demands sources and facts and won't let up on them.

I agree that Steve Cortes is the most bearable of the Trump people--he will just go so far, and he will at least recognize the other side's opinions and if it gets to heated he'll step back.     Thank goodness Boris has not been on for a few days--I was sick of him.

I wish Joy had run that piece that Rachel had on her show last night of the white supremacist secret press conference where they sang Trump's praises and talked about how much his candidacy had encouraged them.   If I was programming I'd run it every single hour until all of the voters have seen it.   

[BennyB]

5 hours ago, Padma said:

If I were Joy (et al) I don't know if I'd have any of the Trump surrogates on, even the less offensive ones like Steve Cortes. On the one hand, it's a platform for them to lie. On the other, you might think it's the opportunity to challenge or expose those lies. 

This was Joy after the aforementioned Steve Cortes let off some steam:

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/09/watch-joy-reid-unloads-on-trump-advocate-touting-candidates-incredibly-non-racist-campaign/

Priceless! ;-D

[Ohwell]

8 hours ago, car54 said:

She cut off that Trump surrogate because he persisted in stating opinion as fact and refused to support those opinions with any verification.

I find when Joy hosts she just will not tolerate it--and after watching so many hosts who let it slide when guests do this, I kind of appreciate her toughness.

But it was the way she cut him off that was just rude.  Like she just wasn't hearing it.  You need to be more professional than that.

[jenrising]

That's impossible. If you don't stop them, they just keep spouting lies and blathering talking points instead of answering the questions. It's a news program, not a beauty pageant. The host's job is to lead the discussion and keep it on topic. If guests are rude enough to not answer what they're asked and lie blatantly, the professional thing to do is make them stop. 

[MulletorHater]

10 hours ago, car54 said:

She cut off that Trump surrogate because he persisted in stating opinion as fact and refused to support those opinions with any verification.

I find when Joy hosts she just will not tolerate it--and after watching so many hosts who let it slide when guests do this, I kind of appreciate her toughness.

And, I applaud her approach.  If someone is lying, call them on it to their faces and shut them down when they persist in lying.

Joy gave a very impassioned explanation as to why African Americans had such a visceral reaction to this "birther" lie.  She cited historical facts to back her up and when Trump's surrogate attempted to deny that racism was at the root of the "birther" foolishness, she wasn't having it.  She also reminded the audience that it wasn't just Trump, but several GOP elected officials have been beating this drum as well.  Best of all, she asked the one question that was shouted from the rooftops in my own household:  Who in the fuck [my word] is Donald Trump to be demanding that President Obama produce his birth certificate?  

Even Nina Turner had to shut down a Trump apologist on Chris Hayes' show.

[jjj]

2 hours ago, MulletorHater said:

Best of all, she asked the one question that was shouted from the rooftops in my own household:  Who in the fuck [my word] is Donald Trump to be demanding that President Obama produce his birth certificate?  

And it is not just the birth certificate.  Lawrence O'Donnell reminded us on Friday that Trump also has asked for the President's college transcript in the past, and his supporters continue to ask for it.  As Lawrence said, "He did not ask Ted Cruz for his transcript, nor Marco Rubio, not even Hillary Clinton, all of whom could be considered as beneficiaries of affirmative action.  He only asked for the transcript of Barack Obama.  And what is different about Barack Obama from all of these, or all the other contenders for the presidency?"  My paraphrase, but this was the gist. 

And it is not like we have seen the Trump grade transcript. 

Edited September 18, 2016 by jjj

[wknt3]

16 hours ago, Ohwell said:

But it was the way she cut him off that was just rude.  Like she just wasn't hearing it.  You need to be more professional than that.

 

15 hours ago, jenrising said:

That's impossible. If you don't stop them, they just keep spouting lies and blathering talking points instead of answering the questions. It's a news program, not a beauty pageant. The host's job is to lead the discussion and keep it on topic. If guests are rude enough to not answer what they're asked and lie blatantly, the professional thing to do is make them stop. 

It's obvious to me that the the conventions of civility and objectivity as practiced by most mainstream television journalists are being abused by Trump spokespeople to just repeat their talking points until the segment time is up. Sometimes you do have to cut them off repeatedly if you don't want your airtime used to spread disinformation or perpetrate the impression that objective reality is debatable. I do understand not wanting everything to become Fox News ("Bill there is plenty of evidence of human activity leading to climate change and here is some -" "That's it this is the no spin zone! You're out of the box! Let's go to commercial") but "politeness" is not more important than facts and reality. Of course perhaps the best approach might be to just not invite on those who abuse civility and simply examine why false claims are false without any defense since you are going to be accused of bias anyways, but there is simply no way to simultaneously achieve civility, access, and accuracy in today's environment so something has to give.

Edited September 18, 2016 by wknt3

[Mumbles]

On that note, I thought Todd actually and surprisingly did a decent job on pushing back with KellyAnne Conway this morning without resorting to yelling or incivility. There's only so much a person can do when a guest is as "on message" as she is but he tried his best.

[represent]

It's about reality tv, but I'm a person who needs a break from reality tv. and I'd like to watch news that is investigative. Yes, please tell me what's going on with ISIS and governments around the world. But give me some investigative, factual reporting into our government and our private sector. The media is supposed to be our last line of defense against the people who would use their power to do harm to us. But now the media is part of the corrupt private sector. I have no interest in seeing the same idiots come on night after night to defend Hillary nor Trump with the same talking points. The media damn well has the republican and democratic platforms for 2016, start there. They are allowed to come and talk about their parties platform policies only, if they even say the name of the opposing candidate their mike will be cut. I don't need you to say Donald Trump's name if you're a Hillary supporter and vice versa. I'm watching the news, and I'm smart enough to listen to the details of the policies and tell the damn difference.  I would like to fucking know why I haven't heard the republican's LGBTQ policy talked about in detail on these news shows because it is absolutely unreal to me. I know it's in there because they mentioned it during the preparations for the convention but haven't since. Yes, let's talk about vouchers, it's a serious discussion about giving parents some choice and what that does to funding of public schools which if you have eyes you can see have pretty much crumbled.  Let's talk about why public schools don't seem to be getting the funding like the rat/mushroom plagued schools in Detroit which on Rachel Maddow covered in detail, in state run by a republican governor. Surrogates are well within their rights to call out opposing parties, and reporters should be fact checking. But I don't want to hear the candidates names come out of their mouths. I just don't understand what else besides vouchers, the republicans plan to do about public education, what are they planning to do about the actual unhealthy, unsanitary school buildings?

Let's truly get to the bottom of why immigration reform wasn't passed in Obama's first term when the democrats had the chance. What the hell actually happened media, tell me. Who exactly is playing games here? I can't figure it out. This is where you come in.  I need to know when opposing parties hide their other agendas in said bills to try and threaten the other party that they won't pass a bill unless.... It's because of Chris Hayes that I know they do that shit. But no one else in the media points that out when the bills are just sitting around not getting passed.  There's a ton of work for the media to do and like I said they aren't doing it and I hope that they all lose their jobs, except a few. Why? Because the rest of us would lose ours in a second for being so incompetent.  I want every news source that depends on advertising dollars to be shut down. I can't wait to HBO's VICE comes on five times a week with real news.

I mean at this point can one really blame a Trump supporter not trusting media?  I hate to say it, but over all they're right and it's not Trump's fault that they can't be trusted. The media is as corrupt if not more as they try to prove Hillary Clinton is...They're in bed with Wall Street too, sucking up those advertising dollars and prostituting themselves out to a reality tv climate in order to collect.

Bill Maher is absolutely correct when he says the money has to get out of the media.

Edited September 18, 2016 by represent

[ruby24]

I feel like there needs to be some philanthropic billionaire who wants to make it his/her mission to fund a non-profit news network committed to reporting on issues, truth and accuracy with no attention to the horserace or worries about false equivalency. Just facts. I don't even know how that would work, really, but I know that money and worries about ratings need to be taken out of the equation somehow, because that's what drives all this nonsense.

Chuck Todd did okay but all of these guys could be so much better when dealing with Conway. She's such a liar and they need to just refute every sentence out of her mouth, don't just let her lie and move on. When I hear her talk, I KNOW that what she's saying isn't true in each false thing she asserts. If I know it, Chuck Todd can know it too.

[Milburn Stone]

1 hour ago, ruby24 said:

I feel like there needs to be some philanthropic billionaire who wants to make it his/her mission to fund a non-profit news network committed to reporting on issues, truth and accuracy with no attention to the horserace or worries about false equivalency. Just facts. I don't even know how that would work, really, but I know that money and worries about ratings need to be taken out of the equation somehow, because that's what drives all this nonsense.

I want to believe anybody would watch that...but I'm not so sure.

[Kemper]

I read the GQ article about Morning Joe/Joe Scarborough.  While I know Joe probably won't be entirely pleased with the way he was portrayed (but we knew all along what an egomaniac & pompous ass he is) but I think the entity that came off looking the worst was MSNBC.  The way the article was written intimated that Joe was really running things and that all the execs, crew and reporters must all cater and kowtow to him.  Besides smirking as I read it, I kept thinking how embarrassing the article must be to the head honchos.   He really seems out-of-control.  Just me?

[Padma]

Chuck did a good job trying to fact check Kellyanne. But she lies effortlessly (as Christie was doing with Tapper on CNN--Tapper also tried to confront and fact check. But, like Chuck, what can you do when people keep lying and shifting the blame to someone else?) Trump U should have offered this kind of training. Kellyanne is very good at what she does. Too bad that what she does is deplorable.

Chuck was very polite but wasn't having it. I liked the final question about his business conflicts of interests. She, of course, lied ("We'll comply with the law"--knowing there is none) and twisted it to the CFF. She just babbles out her talking points. It's scary how these people--Christie, Trump, Conway, Giuliani and the surrogates have no hesitation to lie one day in one way and then change completely the next day. "Earth round!" "Earth flat!" It's easy  for them.  Can you imagine if Trump wins? It's not just him, it's all these others who would be there, including Pence who today said his role model is Cheney.

[annzeepark914]

18 hours ago, Padma said:

It's not just him, it's all these others who would be there, including Pence who today said his role model is Cheney.

Good God a'mighty!  I knew Pence was a lightweight but that truly is frightening (actually, I don't think he has the u-know-whats to be another Cheney).

[MulletorHater]

1 hour ago, annzeepark914 said:

Good God a'mighty!  I knew Pence was a lightweight but that truly is frightening (actually, I don't think he has the u-know-whats to be another Cheney).

That's truly scary.  I read somewhere that when Governor Kasich was approached by one of Drumpf's kids that the proposition went like this (to paraphrase):  "You will be the run who will actually be running the country."  When the governor asked what dear old dad's role would be while he was assuming presidential powers, the response was, "making America great again."

I'm sure that is one of the reasons Pence was selected.  The only difference between him and Cheney is that the latter wouldn't dream of passing legislation that discriminated against the LBGT community.

I can appreciate how difficult Chuck's job was in keeping track of Kellyanne's lies.  I'm still waiting for her to go back on Rachel Maddow's show.  

[TOL]

Joe's BFF is back

As I said above, Joe Scarborough is a front runner. And now that they're besties again, expect Trump's phone "interviews" to return 

[rcc]

So Trump disrespects his girlfriend and his show on twitter but that doesn't stop Joe from going to Trump Tower to kiss his rear for an interview. Scarborough has no backbone.

[NextIteration]

Mrs Arms Greenspan does it again!

Twitter explodes at Andrea Mitchell for declaring Trump ‘tough’ on terror but Clinton ‘off message’

[jjj]

Chris Hayes played an electrifying couple of minutes of President Obama's speech to the Congressional Black Caucus (around :45  past the hour) -- and I know every day what an intelligent mind this president has and what a powerful speaker he is, but wow, he was just on fire.  And he took on the cadence and boom of an impassioned African-American preacher in the pulpit for some sentences, and it made the room quake.  Even through the television. 

Edited September 20, 2016 by jjj

[MulletorHater]

3 hours ago, NextIteration said:

Mrs Arms Greenspan does it again!

Twitter explodes at Andrea Mitchell for declaring Trump ‘tough’ on terror but Clinton ‘off message’

And, she deserves every bit of the scorn and contempt coming her way.  Well, we know what happened the last time we had a president who talked "tough" ("Bring 'em on!") and we're still dealing with the consequences today.  She and her Morning Joe counterpart, Meek-a, can't even hide their disdain for Secretary Clinton.  I often wondered if a little girl named Hillary stole their bikes when they were children.  Otherwise, I don't get the need to take cheap shots at her at every opportunity.

22 minutes ago, jjj said:

Chris Hayes played an electrifying couple of minutes of President Obama's speech to the Congressional Black Caucus (around :45  past the hour) -- and I know every day what an intelligent mind this president has and what a powerful speaker he is, but wow, he was just on fire.  And he took on the cadence and boom of an impassioned African-American preacher in the pulpit for some sentences, and it made the room quake.  Even through the television. 

He will be sorely missed.  To piggyback off of Represent's post, President Obama should have also reminded these Mensa members that some of them were too chickenshit to be seen with him during the 2014 midterm elections and made it clear they didn't want him campaigning with them because of his poll numbers.  This would have also been a perfect opportunity to remind them of what happens when Democrats run as Republican-lite and won't stand up for the principles that Democrats believe in.  After that, he could say, "How you like me now?" and drop the mike.

I'm sorry I missed the speech but will try to catch it.

[Decoda]

So heading into 45 minutes into Brian William's cover a lot in a fast clip (sure) consice, to the point 30 minute program. Sighs. So I guess even though my program guide promises it's a half hour it is now an hour?

Edited September 20, 2016 by Decoda

[jjj]

17 minutes ago, Decoda said:

So heading into 45 minutes into Brian William's cover a lot in a fast clip (sure) consice, to the point 30 minute program. Sighs. So I guess even though my program guide promises it's a half hour it is now an hour?

It is very odd.  They said they were expanding to an hour.  It was a full hour last Monday and Tuesday.  But on a later day (Thursday?) it was a half-hour of Brian W, then a half-hour of the half-size Hardball.  So, MSNBC is keeping us on our toes? 

ETA:  Wow, Brian had quite a scoop (reporting on a Politico scoop) in the final two minutes of his program -- that George H. W. Bush plans to vote for Clinton.  But he had hardly any time to discuss it.

Edited September 20, 2016 by jjj

[BabyVegas]

I caught the tail end of The 11th Hour while waiting for a repeat of All In and all I can say is MSNBC, stop trying to make Brian Williams happen (again). His credibility is shot to high heaven and he doesn't have anything useful or insightful to add. 

[madfortv]

I applaud Joy and Katy for not putting up with lies from Trump's supporters.  Joy's shows are not to be missed by my family.  Her response about President Obama being asked to show his papers was spot on.  It astounds me that that so little attention was paid to Trump demands to see President Obama's transcripts. It has been infuriating for years. 

The tactic of interviewees not answering questions and immediately talking about something else has been taken to the extreme. I don't remember it being this bad in the past. I noticed and wondered why there was no push back. It was allowed to slide and defection became the norm. 

I don't miss MPH at all.  She is too melodramatic.

Andrea Mitchell has been showing her bias lately. She will often report on a topic and throw in a negative comment about Hillary.  When I first noticed, it seemed like a normal part of reporting but now it appears to be a deliberate pattern to put Hillary down even to stretch stories to relate them to Hillary.  I no longer respect Andrea's reporting.  Once nice thing, it allows me to take a quick break when she is on as a guest commentator. Ha!

[oakville]

On 9/18/2016 at 3:52 PM, ruby24 said:

I feel like there needs to be some philanthropic billionaire who wants to make it his/her mission to fund a non-profit news network committed to reporting on issues, truth and accuracy with no attention to the horserace or worries about false equivalency. Just facts. I don't even know how that would work, really, but I know that money and worries about ratings need to be taken out of the equation somehow, because that's what drives all this nonsense.

Chuck Todd did okay but all of these guys could be so much better when dealing with Conway. She's such a liar and they need to just refute every sentence out of her mouth, don't just let her lie and move on. When I hear her talk, I KNOW that what she's saying isn't true in each false thing she asserts. If I know it, Chuck Todd can know it too.

Wasn't CNN funded by a philantropic billionaire Ted Turner? I am tired of the surrogate wars.

[jjj]

On ‎9‎/‎18‎/‎2016 at 0:52 PM, ruby24 said:

I feel like there needs to be some philanthropic billionaire who wants to make it his/her mission to fund a non-profit news network committed to reporting on issues, truth and accuracy with no attention to the horserace or worries about false equivalency. Just facts. I don't even know how that would work, really, but I know that money and worries about ratings need to be taken out of the equation somehow, because that's what drives all this nonsense.

That is what Al Jazeera tried to do in America.  And it failed.  [Washington Post:] "What really doomed Al Jazeera America from the beginning was its decision to offer straight, sober journalism via legacy cable and satellite TV carriers, distribution platforms on which such a product is fast becoming extinct...[it] consistently expressed faith in the existence of a large unmet demand for straight news without opinion and sensationalism."  They poured a ton of money into this effort.   https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2016/01/14/this-is-what-doomed-al-jazeera-america/ 

[junemeatcleaver]

And let's be real, a good percentage of the audience was turned from jump street by Al Jazeera's name and the bad press it's had in the US for years.  Remember the Bush administration weren't fans of AJ.

[cattykit]

1 hour ago, junemeatcleaver said:

And let's be real, a good percentage of the audience was turned from jump street by Al Jazeera's name and the bad press it's had in the US for years.  Remember the Bush administration weren't fans of AJ.

Absolutely.  First and foremost a whole lotta people aren't going to tune to something they assume (rightly or wrongly) is the mouthpiece of a Middle Eastern terrorist organization.  And maybe they did all those things as cited in the article, but the only story I remember them being all over was the Peyton Manning drug scandal.

[car54]

I certainly hope Trump University will be issuing the Trump campaign workers and surrogates their Doctorate in Bald Face Lying and Prevarication.

MTP just had the lamest interview with Sara Huckabee Sanders--she just spouts off their patented lies with such confidence--and Kristin Welker gave her a few "well to be fair there's no proof of that" to counter them.