S07.E06: Rent Like A Champion, HotShot, Windcatcher, Stem Center USA

[yeswedo]

Silicon Valley venture capitalist, Chris Sacca, joins the Tank as a Guest Shark. He finds himself in a heated battle with Lori over a tech education business; two sports fans have a home rental website; an entrepreneur with a unique twist on everyone's favorite hot drink; and an inventor has developed a device that can inflate objects in mere seconds. Also, an update on SWAG Essentials, which did not get a deal in the Tank during season 6.

[roseha]

I have so had it with the goings on on this show.  Why do these brainy entrepreneurs leap to do a deal with Lori just because she offers a little more money or lowers her percentage of the offer by 2 percent or whatever versus the other sharks?  It is just so maddening.  I so wanted to hear air mattress guy (who was very cute though) or the scientific young women say "Lori, how are you going to help me grow this business?  What background do you have in it?"  It seems like it's all about the dollars sometimes.  Maddening.  I can't understand how Lori gets to keep showing up every week.  When Kevin specifically recounted the Greek mythology about the man doomed to roll a stone up the hill, she actually said:  "What's that got to do with Greek mythology?"

There's your nerd partner.

[sadiegirl]

OMG - get rid of Lori. I really do not like her.

 

I liked the new shark. That bidding war with the air mattress guy was crazy. 

 

I go to Japan and coffee guy is right, hot coffee in a can is huge.  Maybe he should have bought their system or something, get the rights for the process for the states.  it probably would have cost less and he would have been making money 6 years ago (assuming people in this country warm up to the idea). 

 

And as much as Mark annoys me at times, I appreciate that even though he's crazy rich, he still seems to understand when things are unreasonably expensive - because $1400/year for that center is crazy expensive.  I'm all for getting girls into the sciences, but apparently we only want the ones with rich parents.

[cooksdelight]

Lori is giving the dumb blonde stereotype some merit.

I wanted Windcatcher guy to go with Robert, I think he would have been the best fit, technology-wise. Great idea, I want one for camping.

I think the tech girls should have gone with the guest shark, who really seemed to have a lot more on the ball about this thing than Lori did.

It ain't all about the money up front, kids!

[atir]

Did I miss how the Stem deal was going to work? Was it a franchise thing a la Sylvan Learning Ctr?

[designing1]

A few weeks back, Lori was talking about how technology-challenged women can be, and tonight she's selling herself as the best partner for the STEM project because she's a woman? This must be her version of the Hair Club for Men: "STEM: I'm not just a partner, I'm a customer!"

[KHenry14]

The Mattress guy really pissed me off. Dude you haven't done anything yet, get over your arrogant self. If the technology really work like he demonstrated, he's going to sell a lot of product, so get with the program. He seems like a Steve Wozniak who needed his own Steve Jobs to run the business. 

Edited October 31, 2015 by KHenry14

[retrograde]

Yeah, the mattress guy seems like he's going to be a nightmare to work with down the road.

[anonymiss]

A few weeks back, Lori was talking about how technology-challenged women can be, and tonight she's selling herself as the best partner for the STEM project because she's a woman? This must be her version of the Hair Club for Men: "STEM: I'm not just a partner, I'm a customer!"

Well yeah. It makes her the opposite of a hypocrite that she's acknowledging the gender gap and then puts her money behind it.

 

I know a lot of people who can't function in the morning without their coffee who are also running late for work and would love to save those precious few minutes with a grab 'n' go coffee. His apparently tastes really good, too. Wish Mark or one of them had given him a pity deal like they have for many certain types of people.

 

Nice to see Lori in something new. I like how she mercilessly went after the deal she wanted as a true shark does, but I had to rewind to see what I was missing when they all started bidding on a quickie mattress/stool. I'm not an outdoorsy person so it was lost on me at first but I can see how a lot of people would want this.

[cooksdelight]

I am the outdoorsy type, love to go camping, kayaking, etc. It takes forever with a hand pump to blow up an air mattress, and even with an electric one plugged into your car's cigarette lighter, it still takes time. I was really impressed with how quickly his inflated, and the fact it can double as a seat around the campfire was a bonus.

I think the reason the coffee guy didn't get a deal was because he wasn't a good presenter. He took an idea from the Japanese, which I agree is a good idea, but he didn't sell it in a way that attracted the Sharks and their money. I think he'll find other investors who have the business know-how to sell it and he'll be fine.

[Latverian Diplomat]

Sacca played it like a straight Venture Capitalist, caring all about "exit strategy", e.g., who's going to buy you out and how soon? Get in, pump up the market value, get out. No heartfelt paeans to entrepreneurship. I'm sure he fits right in, in the Valley. It's kind of funny that they seated him between Cuban and O'Leary, who pulled off two of the great overvalued buy outs in history (Yahoo!/Broadcast.com and Mattel/The Learning Company).

 

I'm really surprised the entrainment valve works that well. He did a live demo, and everything I can find on the web says it works, so I guess it does. Would love to see a live demo.

[starri]

Sacca came across as kind of a douche, with his continued use of buzzwords ("Exit strategy!"  "Pain point!"), but I have to admit, I really laughed when he perfectly read Lori.  He and I also got to the same point with the AirBNB Lite guys, that their ultimate goal is to be bought by AirBNB.  I don't know I didn't go to a sports-focused school, and I really loathe AirBNB for what they've done to housing markets in big cities, so I can't say I was super excited by it.

 

It's really hard for me to get over the idea of coffee in a can. I understand it's actual hot coffee, unlike those coffee-based energy drinks (which I'm too old be converted too), but all I can imagine is a tinny taste to coffee.  Also, I drink it black, so either that stuff is going to be too sweet for me, or it's not going to be sweet enough for the cream and sugar crowd.

[Primetimer]

Look, Lori Grenier is probably a very nice person who pays her fair share of taxes and doesn't have a basement full of hobo bodies. That doesn't mean you should want to do a deal with her -- a lesson two Shark Tank participants fail to heed.

Read the story

[augmentedfourth]

Lori has said some stupid shit in the past, but overall, I don't mind her and think she can be an excellent partner for some people/products. The mattress guy...ehhh, okay, she could probably find a way to make it work. STEM girls, I'm not seeing it. I feel like they didn't think far beyond "Another woman, yay!"

 

Mattress Guy drove me nuts, and I guess that valve must be really something since he got the offers he did. I half-expected someone (Mark, maybe) to offer to just buy him out completely, patent and all, but he probably wouldn't have taken it. Good luck, Lori. I think you're going to need it.

 

I also thought the STEM girls would get an offer from Mark, since that building kit thing whose name escapes me (that just got an update recently) seems to be doing well. Okay.

 

I do love my morning coffee, but it *really* doesn't take that long to make a cup in a Keurig. Especially if you're like my boss who leaves it on 24/7. (I know, I know, true coffee snobs don't love the Keurig, but you'll pry mine out of my cold, dead hands. And I doubt the coffee snobs would find coffee in a can much better.) I'll even say that part of my enjoyment of a cup of coffee is how it smells as I'm making it, so while I thought the coffee in a can was an interesting concept, I doubt I'd be a customer.

[seacliffsal]

The STEM presenters bothered me as they did not ever say what the STEM centers did. Is there a curriculum? Is it all hands on? Who develops the activities, etc. Also, it may be catchy to call something STEM, but high schools across the country have STEM courses and programs. Do the STEM centers provide materials or do the families also have to fund those. The reality is the the STEM centers would be super expensive to maintain as they will have to continually bring in new technology and material so I don't really see how they make a lot of profit. I think that the Sharks really do invest in the presenters rather than the products sometimes, and these young women have a lot of potential, but the business didn't seem like it was very well developed other than the STEM concept which, again, public schools do emphasize. Even beyond that, many schools have robotics teams. I think that Lori is going to be in way over her head and although the young women have math and technology backgrounds, they don't necessarily understand how to run a business.

Even though $1400/year sounds expensive, it's really not as the presenters stated that they offer after school programs. So, parents who use these centers as after school care really come out ahead. The staffing would also be an issue as the $1400/year covers the facility, curriculum, and staffing. I must be focusing on this as the Sharks will grill many presenters about how to make money and for the fine details of the product/business and it seemed liked the Sharks were more 'young women in technology-I'm in....' It's the same way I feel about the deals for women who are "I'm a mom" and then start crying. I am a woman and I want to see competent, well though out businesses presented by women more than mom, technology student, crying women without well developed plans and ideas.

Edited October 31, 2015 by seacliffsal

[atir]

The coffee guy having spent $6M is what scared the sharks. It appeared all 6 liked the product but got concerned about the huge amount of money already spent with no sales to back it up. I don't always understand this. In someways seems shortsighted since all the bugs are out and now all that is needed is marketing. The idea of canned coffee in theaters seemed smart.

I'm wondering about the tinny taste too.

[DasFlavorPup]

I have a feeling that the deal with the mattress guy isn't going to come to pass.  His attitude, combined with his unwillingness to disclose some numbers at the beginning of the pitch, makes me think something is going to fall apart during the follow-up diligence checks when the attorneys get involved.

 

And yeesh, rent my property out to a bunch of college football fans for a weekend?  Sure, right after I get done domesticating this hive of Africanized bees.

Edited October 31, 2015 by DasFlavorPup

[RemoteControlFreak]

Lori is an embarrassment not just to the Sharks but to women everywhere.  

 

And did the STEM for Girls team actually say, "...the opportunity to work with someone like Lori who is such a strong role model in tech?"  

 

What? Lori made her money by designing a wooden jewelry box and selling it on QVC.  How is she exactly a role model in tech?  They fell for her flattery and missed a huge opportunity from Chris.  Idiots.  

Edited October 31, 2015 by RemoteControlFreak

[NYGirl]

All I have to say is I giggled throughout the Windcatcher presentation because the guy's voice sounded like he swallowed helium.  lol

[Eolivet]

The guest shark was pretty Meh to me. Seemed smart, but didn't really stand out (except for his "I'm so rich, I can wear a cowboy shirt instead of a sport coat" chic). Ashton Kutcher is still the best guest shark they've had, to me.

 

Robert hit the nail on the head with the coffee presenter: if you want coffee here, there are plenty of 24 hour places you can get it, which perhaps isn't the case in Japan. Plus, drinking out of a can isn't exactly a fun experience with a cold/room temperature drink -- I can't imagine how a hot drink would taste.

 

I feel like STEM was trying to be Kumon for...science, but it was so unclear what they did (product? classes? both?)

 

Lori would've been a good fit for Windcatcher as it's a great product to demonstrate on QVC, but beyond that, I'm not so sure. But that guy was so greedy, I'm kind of happy he didn't make the best deal for his product. You get what you pay for, guy.

[Latverian Diplomat]

It's really hard for me to get over the idea of coffee in a can. I understand it's actual hot coffee, unlike those coffee-based energy drinks (which I'm too old be converted too), but all I can imagine is a tinny taste to coffee. 

 

I'm wondering about the tinny taste too.

Modern beverage cans have a plastic coating inside (which is it's own issue with concerns about BPA). As far as taste, the craft brewing industry, for example, is moving away from glass bottles to cans, precisely because the coating protects the flavor of the beer as well as glass, without a lot of the expense and hassle of handling and shipping glass bottles. These are people who worry a lot about taste, and they're sold on it.

 

I agree that having a 140 degree shelf stable beverage is unlikely to be something that appeals to people that actually like coffee qua coffee. It did look like his beverages were heavily flavored and sweetened for that reason.

 

And yeesh, rent my property out to a bunch of college football fans for a weekend?  Sure, right after I get done domesticating this hive of Africanized bees.

Well, given the price, I suspect most of their clientele are established people in their 30s or 40s. Ticket sales are also aimed at that demographic, I think.

[saber5055]

The coffee guy having spent $6M is what scared the sharks.

 

He had spent $2 million and had been working on the product six years. No one seemed to care he had spent that time developing and TESTING the product so it was now all ready to launch. Then Kevin spouts his BS about the guy pushing the rock up the hill. Yeah, Kevin, so what happens when the guy gets to the top and pushed the rock over the peak? I totally think all the sharks missed the boat on that hot-coffee-in-a-can deal. It won't taste tinny, beer, soda, energy drinks, even vegetables for pete's sake, are in cans and taste fine. Kevin spouts some stupid imaginary story and all the rest jumped on it like it was the most clever ever.

 

This guy did all his homework and THEN came into the tank. I guess one is suppose to just bring an idea without patents or testing or having manufacturing lined up. Then he/she will get a deal.

 

It takes me a long time to pour and then mix in all the creamers and sugars I like in my coffee. I'd love to run in, grab a can and then take off again. Plus, being able to have a hot coffee in a movie theatre or at a game? Excellent. And regular old coffee in a styro cup gets cold. It wouldn't taste any worse than the COLD coffee in a case (ala Starbuck's) that's in convenience stores and grocery stores now.

 

I'd rather invest in that hot to-go coffee than the STEM thing, which I couldn't figure out. What was the big deal about that, anyone could set up a teaching room to demonstrate engineering marvels to girls.

[starri]

Modern beverage cans have a plastic coating inside (which is it's own issue with concerns about BPA). As far as taste, the craft brewing industry, for example, is moving away from glass bottles to cans, precisely because the coating protects the flavor of the beer as well as glass, without a lot of the expense and hassle of handling and shipping glass bottles. These are people who worry a lot about taste, and they're sold on it.

For something that's served cold, like soda or beer, I get that 100%.  But with something hot, I'd be worried about either tasting the can or the lining.

[sadiegirl]

It's really hard for me to get over the idea of coffee in a can. I understand it's actual hot coffee, unlike those coffee-based energy drinks (which I'm too old be converted too), but all I can imagine is a tinny taste to coffee.  Also, I drink it black, so either that stuff is going to be too sweet for me, or it's not going to be sweet enough for the cream and sugar crowd.

I have not had the coffee in a can (not a big coffee drinker) but everyone who's had it in Japan that I work with says it tastes really good.  And some of those people are real coffee snobs.

[hkit]

I was happy to see Rent Like A Champion do well. I live in Ann Arbor, and was contacted by them a little over a year ago to see if I'd be interested in joining a town hall type discussion about renting my house for up to $5000 or some crazy number for game days. For me, it was an easy no. The football culture is my least favorite part about this town, and I don't want it on my property. My house is my sanctuary when hoards of drunk morons of all ages infiltrate this town in the fall. But it was a neat business, and they really worked hard to get local buy-in. So it's nice to see that they are growing.

 

The air mattress guy made me stabby. A combination of arrogance, lack of polish (pregnancy isn't good for my brand), and just a punchable face. I was screaming watching them trip over each other to give him a deal. I want him to fail. Yes, I'm immature.

 

A VC shark? Yawn. At least the others actually created something before going down the VC route. I'm not really interested in entrepreneurial feedback from someone who has never actually created a company and brought it up from nothing. He seemed a lot less douchey than the GoPro guy, but I'm still not a buyer.

[velitari]

" Then Kevin spouts his BS about the guy pushing the rock up the hill. Yeah, Kevin, so what happens when the guy gets to the top and pushed the rock over the peak?"

He never gets to the top; that's the whole meaning of the Sisyphus myth. He pushes the rock uphill forever. There is no getting to the peak - that's Kevin's point.

[atir]

I could have sworn Dan said he'd spent $6M. Sorry to be so far off.

[Latverian Diplomat]

For something that's served cold, like soda or beer, I get that 100%.  But with something hot, I'd be worried about either tasting the can or the lining.

That's fair, I don't know how well those linings hold up at that temperature (for long periods of time too). But given that the cans had insulated labels that seemed to work really well, I'm betting the interiors have also been put through their paces. A lack of up front product testing did not seem to be the issue for this guy.

Edited November 1, 2015 by Latverian Diplomat

[RemoteControlFreak]

Well, given the price, I suspect most of their clientele are established people in their 30s or 40s. Ticket sales are also aimed at that demographic, I think.

 

 

Who can trash a weekend party house as much as 20-somethings.  The house rental guys kept referring to multi-generational family trip to watch the big game. In my observation, I don't see a lot of families with young children traveling out of town to go college football games.

 

Also, I may have missed this, but did they explain how their service is any different than AirBnB?

 

And, I don't get the coffee thing at all.  It works in Japan because, as Dan said, he walked all over looking for a cup of hot coffee to go and there was nothing available. But in America, hot coffee is available at any corner gas station, convenience store, or hotel lobby.  And the canned product doesn't stay hot outside of its special case. That's the deal breaker.

Edited November 1, 2015 by RemoteControlFreak

[raiderred1]

I hated the guest Shark.  He was a pompous asshole and although I don't care for Lori I was glad she beat him out just for the sheer fun of it.  Oh and the fancy Scully western shirts are so 2008.  

"Windwhatever" was just plain weird and I agree he will be a nightmare to work with.

STEM, uh huh, ok.

I liked Coffee can guy and I hope he becomes successful.  I don't drink coffee but I can see a need for his coffee on the go.

Edited November 1, 2015 by raiderred1

[Latverian Diplomat]

Who can trash a weekend party house as much as 20-somethings.  The house rental guys kept referring to multi-generational family trip to watch the big game. In my observation, I don't see a lot of families with young children traveling out of town to go college football games.

 

Also, I may have missed this, but did they explain how their service is any different than AirBnB?

 

If you say so. In my experience, guys that age like to talk about partying, but at the end of the day they just sit around and drink a few beers. The living room carpet is probably the thing to worry about, because sloppy eaters.

 

They said that they specialize in small market college towns, and they do a lot of field work to identify and recruit homeowners in those markets. AirBnB doesn't actively recruit specific renters , as far as I know, they are just a marketplace. 

[raiderred1]

If you say so. In my experience, guys that age like to talk about partying, but at the end of the day they just sit around and drink a few beers. The living room carpet is probably the thing to worry about, because sloppy eaters.

 

They said that they specialize in small market college towns, and they do a lot of field work to identify and recruit homeowners in those markets. AirBnB doesn't actively recruit specific renters , as far as I know, they are just a marketplace. 

I graduated from Texas Tech University, located in a kind of smallish Texas town, Lubbock, and I can see where this would be a good idea there.  I personally wouldn't do it but I know so many people there that would

[Amarsir]

I liked Chris Sacca. He brought an energy to the den with his enjoyment of investing and willingness to fight for deals. It is probably harder to sell him as a Shark though since he seems like "just" an investor, not a company builder like the others.  Of course the same could probably be said of Kevin at this point, so swapping them out for each other would be fine.  (For what it's worth, he was apparently invited back to do another episode later in the season.)

 

Even though $1400/year sounds expensive, it's really not as the presenters stated that they offer after school programs. So, parents who use these centers as after school care really come out ahead. The staffing would also be an issue as the $1400/year covers the facility, curriculum, and staffing.

Not every day. Looking at their site, you pay $1400 for 42 weeks of 1.5 hours per week. So I would view it more like music lessons than a daycare facility.  A one-day dropoff/pickup isn't really much coverage.

 

Did I miss how the Stem deal was going to work? Was it a franchise thing a la Sylvan Learning Ctr?

It seems that way.  They also seem to sell their own robot kits, so maybe they can expand on that outside the centers?

[columbot]

Lori is a master manipulator. It works almost every time, too. Just study how she talks when she's about to make a deal - she makes grandiose proclamations about how great an investor she is and how successful her previous deals have been. She always looks the entrepreneurs in the eye and makes some kind of personal plea to them. She doesn't talk about their business as much; she only does want when she wants to say "I'm out" in a nice way. She always finds a way to frame the discussion so that the entrepreneurs will feel like they're letting themselves down if they don't pick her. It's a finely crafted persona she has, there.

 

Yeah, the canned coffee works in Japan because people always seem to be on the go there, and they don't have diners/doughnut shops with a perpetual pot of coffee ready to be poured. People there want to go in a convenience store and grab their coffee in a can and get out quickly. That doesn't mean I don't think this could work in America, though. It would be better sold in different venues, because I don't see it appealing to the morning rush market like it does in Japan.

 

I don't like the name STEM Center...when I hear it I think it's some kind of stem cell research thing. Doesn't sound like...uh...whatever it actually is. I must have passed out because I'm still not sure what their business is. Something about girls and robotics? 

[hkit]

If you say so. In my experience, guys that age like to talk about partying, but at the end of the day they just sit around and drink a few beers. The living room carpet is probably the thing to worry about, because sloppy eaters.

 

 

Living in a college town targeted by this company, I can assure you, the returning male alumni in the late 30s/early 40s is the worst behaved demographic. I see it every weekend. They'll arrive with the wife and kids in tow and act like a complete juvenile jackass. A couple of weeks ago, I saw a visiting alumni who was a father, probably around 40, pushing his kid in a bugaboo stroller, calling his wife walking behind them the "C" word, while throwing beer bottles at passing cars and shouting about how he "owns this town". At 9am on a Sunday morning. While I'm sure the majority of guys like to go back and have a beer or two, reminisce, then go home, there are enough that behave like this guy above that I would never take the chance of allowing them on my personal property.

[PepperMonkey]

Lori is my least favourite shark and that includes Kevin AND the GoPro guy. I hate that crap she shills on QVC but maybe it's just because I don't care for her. She's a patent junkie and think that makes her smart and savvy. The final straw for me was when she pulled the "girl card" to get those STEM ladies to pick her while not really saying anything BUT, hey! we're all just girls here. It had the exact opposite effect on me than it seemed to have on them because I was thinking it made her sound stupid and whiny. She got a hard on for that google guy and was not going to let him win on anything if she could bat an eyelash to stop it. Then when the "girls" were talking about what a strong role model she is for women entrepreneurs, I almost swallowed my tongue.

 

Here's hoping both investments fall through or don't work out and they move on to partners that can actually help them. That will give Lori more time to work on her Bed, Bath and Beyond squatty potty endcaps (LOL at google guy for having her number on that one). I'm actually thinking the air mattress guy might be a giant pain in the ass and that might not work out with Lori as a partner at all unless he DOES let her sell it on QVC. I don't think the stem center that yeah, I guess is kind of like Sylvan, but for girls only to succeed in those fields (?) is a clear enough concept to go anywhere right away, if at all.

 

google guy was kind of a douchebag light. I kind of liked him. His western shirts weren't any worse to me than his hipster beard, and in fact, if he had been clean shaven, the western shirts would have bothered me less. (So over the hipster beards, guys, just please stop). Regardless, I can't believe anyone would pick Lori as a partner over him. It doesn't bother me that he's an angel investor that's never built a business himself.

 

TPTB need to think about jettisoning Kevin and bringing on this guy or Ashton as a full time shark.

 

Edited November 1, 2015 by PepperMonkey

[bilgistic]

Lori said something to the Windcatcher guy about them being fellow inventors. Someone needs to tell her that buying someone else's patented doodad and selling it on QVC doesn't make her an inventor.

[Amarsir]

To be fair, STEM Center isn't really a tech company. It's a school. They don't need a guy who worked at Google and invested early in Twitter. The curriculum is already set, and while I'm sure solid it's still aimed at children.  So this isn't exactly cutting edge tech.  They need someone who understands education and franchising.

 

Which actually means they should have partnered with Kevin, really...

[RemoteControlFreak]

Living in a college town targeted by this company, I can assure you, the returning male alumni in the late 30s/early 40s is the worst behaved demographic. I see it every weekend. They'll arrive with the wife and kids in tow and act like a complete juvenile jackass. A couple of weeks ago, I saw a visiting alumni who was a father, probably around 40, pushing his kid in a bugaboo stroller, calling his wife walking behind them the "C" word, while throwing beer bottles at passing cars and shouting about how he "owns this town". At 9am on a Sunday morning. While I'm sure the majority of guys like to go back and have a beer or two, reminisce, then go home, there are enough that behave like this guy above that I would never take the chance of allowing them on my personal property.

Yes. I also live in a college town targeted by this company and every home football game weekend we brace for this kind of bad behavior by returning alumni. The police logs document drunken driving, trashed hotel rooms and bar fights.  The worst seem to be the groups of guys in their mid-30s to mid-40s who show up to  relive their college days, and not in a productive way.

 

It's going to be a tough sell at the start to get people to give up their homes for 1-8 weekends every fall.  Unlike AirBnB, they are asking people to leave the homes they live in. AirBnB renters are mostly dealing in property that's dedicated to rental 365 days a year.  This is why these guys had to go to places like Ann Arbor and South Bend and actively try to convince people to make their homes available. AirBnB doesn't have to do this. There are plenty of takers.

Edited November 1, 2015 by RemoteControlFreak

[PepperMonkey]

Amar, I get what you're saying about Kevin and the STEM entrepreneurs; he probably would have been their best choice. I just don't know at this point if anyone is ever going to pick Kevin again.

Edited November 1, 2015 by PepperMonkey

[Pjxf99]

I lived in Japan for a few years and I'm not a coffee drinker but you could also buy hot chocolate and hot tea in cans--green tea and "milk tea" which tastes like a chai latte. I loved it once I tried it but I avoided it for probably the first year because of the same concerns you all have--I thought it would taste bad. It's great--it doesn't taste funny or tinny. And walking around Tokyo on a cold day with a warm can in your hand....mmmmm....

 

Another reason it works so well in Japan is the prevalence of vending machines. People prefer using a vending machine to interacting with another human being. And they have vending machines that vend hot and cold drinks from the same machine. It's kind of mind boggling, the effort and technology they've put into vending machines.

 

You can see them in this picture-- the red labels mean hot drinks, the blue are cold:

http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/photo/vending-machine-selling-hot-coffee-in-a-can-high-res-stock-photography/148923804

 

There are coffee shops in Tokyo (obviously, Robert!) that are always open--they have 24 hour Dennys! (just with more ramen and less pancakes) But in Japan, convenience stores are also targeted at providing real food 24/7--and the quality of the food is MUCH better than the food in convenience stores here. I wouldn't dream of touching a hot dog in a 7-11 here, but the 7-11's in Japan have the best rice balls that someone somewhere makes by hand (I'm not sure they're made in store but they aren't sitting around on a shelf packaged--although they have those too)

 

At the very least, even if you can't sell Americans on canned hot drinks, I'd think there would be a market in cities with large Asian populations.

Edited November 1, 2015 by Pjxf99

[tomatoflyer]

For me the issue with hotshot is that it doesn't fit in with the American cultural landscape so you'd spend a lot of tim/money convincing people this is something they want. The big issue with the big hotboxes for stores is the amount of space - space is at a huge premium in retail and I think it would be difficult to get stores to go with it, especially since they couldn't sell anything else in there. I can't see this being more than a niche product in the states.

For the air mattress guy, I actually did like him but he seemed more concerned about getting the lowest equity than finding a good partner with expertise in what he wanted to do. He also seemed very closed off, my way or the highway.

Can Kevin stop giving the worst deals?

Edited November 1, 2015 by tomatoflyer

[saber5055]

For something that's served cold, like soda or beer, I get that 100%.  But with something hot, I'd be worried about either tasting the can or the lining.

I have a zillion travel mugs. My coffee tastes the same in each of them, it's put in hot and gradually gets cold. I still drink it. It still tastes the same, regardless of container. That's why food-holding materials are tested. Same as those "cans" of ready-to-eat foods that you heat in the micro, then take out and eat from the container.

And they have vending machines that vend hot and cold drinks from the same machine.

Hot coffee in Interstate rest stops! Yes!

 

Hot drinks get warm, yes, if they sit around, just like cold drinks get warm if they sit around. I still think the hot-coffee-in-a-can is a good investment. Even Cuban wants in down the road.

Edited November 1, 2015 by saber5055

[PepperMonkey]

Bil, Lori DOES have her own patents: have you not SEEN the lovely faux wood jewelry boxes? How that is patentable is beyond me... I guess because it rotates???

[RemoteControlFreak]

I lived in Japan for a few years and I'm not a coffee drinker but you could also buy hot chocolate and hot tea in cans--green tea and "milk tea" which tastes like a chai latte. I loved it once I tried it but I avoided it for probably the first year because of the same concerns you all have--I thought it would taste bad. It's great--it doesn't taste funny or tinny. And walking around Tokyo on a cold day with a warm can in your hand....mmmmm....

 

Another reason it works so well in Japan is the prevalence of vending machines. People prefer using a vending machine to interacting with another human being. And they have vending machines that vend hot and cold drinks from the same machine. It's kind of mind boggling, the effort and technology they've put into vending machines.

 

You can see them in this picture-- the red labels mean hot drinks, the blue are cold:

http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/photo/vending-machine-selling-hot-coffee-in-a-can-high-res-stock-photography/148923804

 

There are coffee shops in Tokyo (obviously, Robert!) that are always open--they have 24 hour Dennys! (just with more ramen and less pancakes) But in Japan, convenience stores are also targeted at providing real food 24/7--and the quality of the food is MUCH better than the food in convenience stores here. I wouldn't dream of touching a hot dog in a 7-11 here, but the 7-11's in Japan have the best rice balls that someone somewhere makes by hand (I'm not sure they're made in store but they aren't sitting around on a shelf packaged--although they have those too)

 

At the very least, even if you can't sell Americans on canned hot drinks, I'd think there would be a market in cities with large Asian populations.

 

If it's true that there are coffee shops open 24 hours a day, then why did the HotShot guy say that he wandered Tokyo for hours trying to get a cup of hot coffee, until he stumbled upon the canned stuff?

 

And why do you think that the taste for canned coffee in Japan translates to a taste for canned coffee among Asians in America?  

Bil, Lori DOES have her own patents: have you not SEEN the lovely faux wood jewelry boxes? How that is patentable is beyond me... I guess because it rotates???

Actually, they are real wood. I have one -- though I would not have bought it had I known at the time that this despicable Lori Grenier character were behind it.  It's unique enough in the layout of the compartments and function to patent.   I mean, Steve Jobs patented a staircase, so....

[bilgistic]

I know she has those jewelry boxes. She had the full-length mirror jewelry box years ago and hawked it on QVC. Most of her "inventions" (she claims to have "hundreds"), though, are others' that she's acquired through various avenues including Shark Tank and sold the product on QVC. See: Readerest.

[RemoteControlFreak]

I know she has those jewelry boxes. She had the full-length mirror jewelry box years ago and hawked it on QVC. Most of her "inventions" (she claims to have "hundreds"), though, are others' that she's acquired through various avenues including Shark Tank and sold the product on QVC. See: Readerest.

Is she claiming to have invented the Readerest?  I think she's just selling it. It was a Shark Tank product that's perfect for the QVC audience.

[bilgistic]

She claims to have hundreds of inventions.

[RemoteControlFreak]

She claims to have hundreds of inventions.

I think they're all variations of jewelry boxes or items that she's bought from other people in exchange for ownership of the patent. She's a massive self-promoter. I don't trust her as far as I can spit, and that's not very far.

[saber5055]

And why do you think that the taste for canned coffee in Japan translates to a taste for canned coffee among Asians in America?

 

If I go to Japan, I might be more comfortable eating in a Tokyo MacDonald's than sushi at a corner cookerie. By the same token, if Japanese tourists come here, or move here, they might be more comfortable grabbing a hot canned coffee than getting a styro cup, then pouring and mixing and putting a lid on it. It's what you are used to, or what you grew up with. In some countries, sheep brains are a standard food staple. So if they find sheep brains on an American menu, they'll be okay ordering it. While I, on the other hand, would not.