Leon Brown: So Here's Me

[DakotaJustice]

7 hours ago, Gramto6 said:

I typed in scholastic book services and scholastic book club and both came back with nothing found so sad...

You might be searching in the wrong place. There's a Wayback Machine search and an Internet Archive search, you want to use the latter. Like this? You should get tons of results back then you can filter by year, format, etc.

https://help.archive.org/hc/en-us/articles/360018359991-Search-A-Basic-Guide

[TurtlePower]

13 hours ago, Gramto6 said:

My God, she looks huge! Let's hope it is just the angle and her clothes...

I wouldn’t have known it was her had it not been pointed out. Looks more like a middle-age woman there.

Mariah posted a pic of Audrey a few days ago and I don’t think it’s the clothes—she appears bloated and unhealthy. It can’t help her self esteem seeing herself like that, either, especially having been an athlete. 

[Twopper]

16 hours ago, Gramto6 said:

My God, she looks huge! Let's hope it is just the angle and her clothes...

For a moment I thought she was in a bear costume.   A dancing black bear.

I'll show myself out....

[deirdra]

4 hours ago, TurtlePower said:

I wouldn’t have known it was her had it not been pointed out. Looks more like a middle-age woman there.

or Tony Padron

[Irate Panda]

If she said she’s depressed maybe she’s on medication that made her gain weight.    I don’t follow Mariah’s page enough to know Audrey’s happenings, but Mariah claims to be doing all this exercising and eating “healthy” and she’s still hefty.  I never really thought about either of their weights because there’s usually something snark worthy in their posts.  Besides the family’s propensity for fucked up eyebrows I guess I never gave much though to their looks because they’re all pretty average looking. 

[suomi]

Isn't it ironic that most anti-depressants cause weight gain which, depending on the person's body image, causes or adds to feelings of unhappiness? 😞

[TurtlePower]

9 hours ago, suomi said:

Isn't it ironic that most anti-depressants cause weight gain which, depending on the person's body image, causes or adds to feelings of unhappiness? 😞

It’s wrong on SO many levels. I have refused some medications for this reason—I was like, HELL NO, let me find another way to deal with it (one being steroids for inflammation and another an antidepressant). 

Unless she’s said so, we can’t know if Audrey’s on meds that might cause that, but if she is, it’s gotta be horrible. Nothing’s worse than going from fit to flab for an athlete (and for a young woman what should be the physical prime of her life). Couple years ago, I gained weight following a bad knee injury and it was devastating. It was my own fault, I fell victim to complacency. I’m back on track now but during that time it was like, wow, this happened to me. The athlete. It was embarrassing.  

So, I feel like Audrey is in “pretend to be happy” mode. I’m guessing she’s not, she looks very unhealthy and probably feels it, too. She and Mariah are probably in denial over their calorie intake as well (and, uh-oh the holidays are coming up). 

Mariah and her dumb-ass brunches. 

[DakotaJustice]

10 hours ago, suomi said:

Isn't it ironic that most anti-depressants cause weight gain which, depending on the person's body image, causes or adds to feelings of unhappiness? 😞

I've been on Wellbutrin for years without any weight gain issues. I think it's a matter of perhaps having to be more diligent about eating and exercising. 

When I first started antidepressants, about 15 years ago my doctor put me on Prozac. I felt great immediately, but I did end up gaining 5 pounds in 2 weeks - because I stopped caring about how much I ate. I was having large sub sandwiches for lunch where before I'd have a tuna salad, for example. It wasn't because I was hungrier or anything, it was just because it became a much lower priority. 

After talking to my doc, he switched me to Wellbutrin and I haven't had any issues since. 

I think it's a lot like getting older - after menopause, it's more challenging to lose/keep off weight, but far from impossible. In fact I got down to my lowest weight ever - 126.5 - at the age of 52.5. Too skinny for me to maintain. My body wants to be 142.

If you look at past seasons, Mariah was slim - first few seasons. The first episode Meri gave Mariah a granola bar and said "that's breakfast"! I think at that time that's what Mariah was happy with. She's freaking huge now which makes me believe that despite all the personal training and yoga, she's spending most of her time being a lump and growing herself like a mushroom, and Auj is in lockstep.

Edited October 13, 2019 by DakotaJustice

[Kohola3]

1 hour ago, TurtlePower said:

Mariah and her dumb-ass brunches. 

Drudge is an adult so can make her own choices. If she was an athlete then she knows what she is doing is not going to help the situation.  If she chooses to hitch her wagon to the Shilling Society and place herself under Pudge's control then she's going to have to dill with the consequences.

[DakotaJustice]

58 minutes ago, Kohola3 said:

Drudge is an adult so can make her own choices. If she was an athlete then she knows what she is doing is not going to help the situation.  If she chooses to hitch her wagon to the Shilling Society and place herself under Pudge's control then she's going to have to dill with the consequences.

I don't disagree with this, but if she's suffering from depression then she might feel unable to extracate herself from the situation. 
Of course I don't know them personally, but I'm guessing this isn't a very healthy relationship - there seems to be codependency and I bet Mariah is bossy and overbearing - just like dear old Mom, and hasn't had any experience or example of what a healthy, coequal partnership is.

[Yeah No]

4 hours ago, DakotaJustice said:

I don't disagree with this, but if she's suffering from depression then she might feel unable to extracate herself from the situation. 
Of course I don't know them personally, but I'm guessing this isn't a very healthy relationship - there seems to be codependency and I bet Mariah is bossy and overbearing - just like dear old Mom, and hasn't had any experience or example of what a healthy, coequal partnership is.

Man, you really nailed it here.  I've been thinking this for a long time but you put it much better than I would have.  I would think a move to a new area when they went to Chicago might have been even more stressful, and when you add new area stress with a dysfunctional/codependent relationship plus being away from any support system Auj may have had back home and it's no wonder.  It looks to me like Mariah is getting everything she wants from this relationship but Auj may be suppressing feelings of knowing it's not the healthiest or best relationship for her.

[Yeah No]

17 hours ago, suomi said:

Isn't it ironic that most anti-depressants cause weight gain which, depending on the person's body image, causes or adds to feelings of unhappiness? 😞

It does suck, although when I was on Zoloft almost 20 years ago I did not gain weight.  Then again I was so depressed I didn't feel much like eating either.  Plus I'm embarrassed to say I went back to smoking during that time after being off cigarettes since the early '80s.  Thankfully once I got over the depression I got off the cigarettes, but it was THEN that I gained weight despite dieting.  I had to go on Jenny Craig to lose the 30 lbs. I gained.  Although that was before menopause so it was much easier to lose weight then.

[Mahamid Frauded Me]

Maybe Sludge should just take a break, go home, spend some time with her family and old friends ( if she has any left ) I say this because I agree with you that I think Mariah probably does not allow her because she is controlling. It seems Audrey gave up everything to follow Pudge and now has lost her identity. Seems she really isn't doing much other then schlepping bad cloths like the rest of them. 

[ginger90]

[xwordfanatik]

So, what is Pudge chomping down now?  She almost looks maniacal there.  

[DakotaJustice]

43 minutes ago, xwordfanatik said:

So, what is Pudge chomping down now?  She almost looks maniacal there.  

Sugar high from the pancakes. 

[LilWharveyGal]

1 hour ago, xwordfanatik said:

She almost looks maniacal there.  

I actually think this is the best she's looked, facially, in a long time. But we're so used to her constant squint that maybe seeing her eyes is disconcerting. 😄

No comment about the giant carby brunch. Again. On a Monday.

[Kohola3]

Is every place she eats overheated in some way?  Who wears tank tops in October in Chicago?  With the southwesterly winds off the lake I bet the wind chill made it pretty nippy.

[TurtlePower]

15 hours ago, ginger90 said:

She looks good here. No weird eye squints, nothing weird at all. 

See? I’m not snarky all the time. 

[laurakaye]

4 minutes ago, TurtlePower said:

She looks good here. No weird eye squints, nothing weird at all. 

See? I’m not snarky all the time. 

And - dare I say it - does her hair actually look clean?

That's a mighty big stack of syrup-drenched pancakes there.  I hope she's chowing down post-yoga because if not, down-dog is going to be unpleasant.

[Natalie68]

17 hours ago, xwordfanatik said:

So, what is Pudge chomping down now?  She almost looks maniacal there.  

I spy pancakes and is that Canadian bacon on top of it?  Give it up Mariah.  You cannot be a health focused blogger/inspiration for the downtrodden if you eat like a Sumo wrestler in training.  Checked the menu at that place.  Not gonna lie, it looks yummy.  By the way Mariah, they have a section called lighter fare.  Perfect for after a workout.

3 hours ago, TurtlePower said:

She looks good here. No weird eye squints, nothing weird at all. 

See? I’m not snarky all the time. 

I took the baton and ran with it.

[HighlandWarriorGrl]

5 hours ago, laurakaye said:

And - dare I say it - does her hair actually look clean?

I think we may have caught her after her 2nd Sunday of the month bath . . . Folx, that’s the cleanest day of the month for our Mariah!

Sorry . . . I just couldn’t pick up the “less snarky” baton.  She’s just too insufferable and I’ve jumped on the poor Sludge bandwagon. 😒

[xwordfanatik]

50 minutes ago, HighlandWarriorGrl said:

I think we may have caught her after her 2nd Sunday of the month bath . . . Folx, that’s the cleanest day of the month for our Mariah!

Sorry . . . I just couldn’t pick up the “less snarky” baton.  She’s just too insufferable and I’ve jumped on the poor Sludge bandwagon. 😒

Yeah, Mariah invites the snarkiest part of my COL irritability.  I do fill sorry for Sludge.  She'll always be Ed McMahon to a nasty version of Johnny Carson.

[B in Lee]

On 10/13/2019 at 10:39 AM, TurtlePower said:

It’s wrong on SO many levels. I have refused some medications for this reason—I was like, HELL NO, let me find another way to deal with it (one being steroids for inflammation and another an antidepressant). 

Unless she’s said so, we can’t know if Audrey’s on meds that might cause that, but if she is, it’s gotta be horrible. Nothing’s worse than going from fit to flab for an athlete (and for a young woman what should be the physical prime of her life). Couple years ago, I gained weight following a bad knee injury and it was devastating. It was my own fault, I fell victim to complacency. I’m back on track now but during that time it was like, wow, this happened to me. The athlete. It was embarrassing.  

So, I feel like Audrey is in “pretend to be happy” mode. I’m guessing she’s not, she looks very unhealthy and probably feels it, too. She and Mariah are probably in denial over their calorie intake as well (and, uh-oh the holidays are coming up). 

Mariah and her dumb-ass brunches. 

I'll throw this out there for consideration: I don't think Mariah is homosexual.

This family has a proven track record of doing unexpected, outrageous, puzzling things all for the sake of attention and ratings for their show. I can totally hear Kody saying, "Hey, here's an angle we haven't explored. How about exploring how a plyg family embraces and accepts a gay couple? Should be good for a season or more, yes?" I mean, there's the rainbow nuptials to be planned and executed on a GRAND scale. Then we can follow them while they are doubly persecuted while trying to adopt a kid - I mean, coming from a plyg background AND being a "same sex couple"? Ratings Gold! as we appeal to as many focus groups as possible. {Can you tell that the Browns, and their antics, have really left me jaded?}

These two young women don't seem to be happy at all. They seem stressed, depressed, and looking for sympathy and/or help. Mariah's SJW rants are just overblown; homosexual couples are NOT "persecuted" in America these days. One is more likely to experience bodily or property damage by wearing a MAGA hat these days than by waving a rainbow flag. This makes me wonder if they are either working on some school project to try to demonstrate just how badly homosexual pairs are treated in Today's America, or they are being encouraged to act out a plot line to keep this miserable family's miserable show on the air for a few more seasons.

Just some food for thought.

[suomi]

I've always wondered if her orientation is a pose. Perhaps she would be single and unattached if she limited herself to a heterosexual life and what kind of storyline is that when your sisters are getting married and birthing babies? Her personality sucks and I bet her offers in the hetero world were few and far between. "A lid for every pot" ... yeah, unless no one is interested in you.

As soon as Audrey came on the scene my opinion of Mariah leaned toward LUG - Lesbian Until Graduation. Some LUGs concentrate better on their education because their physical needs are being met while they aren't distracted by a bunch of hetero drama, and they have someone they can flaunt online. There isn't a whole lot of stigma attached to experimenting with your sexuality. 

[DakotaJustice]

I'm with you guys. 

[Kohola3]

14 hours ago, B in Lee said:

I'll throw this out there for consideration: I don't think Mariah is homosexual.

I have been saying (and posting) that since day one.  I think it's all a big pose for media consumption and shock value.  She's in love with herself, she doesn't need anybody else.

11 hours ago, suomi said:

Lesbian Until Graduation

Love it!  Perfect title for Princess Pudge.

[questionfear]

15 hours ago, B in Lee said:

These two young women don't seem to be happy at all. They seem stressed, depressed, and looking for sympathy and/or help. Mariah's SJW rants are just overblown; homosexual couples are NOT "persecuted" in America these days. One is more likely to experience bodily or property damage by wearing a MAGA hat these days than by waving a rainbow flag. This makes me wonder if they are either working on some school project to try to demonstrate just how badly homosexual pairs are treated in Today's America, or they are being encouraged to act out a plot line to keep this miserable family's miserable show on the air for a few more seasons.

Just some food for thought.

You're incorrect about the relative safety of being gay in America. GLAAD has a partial list of major hate crimes against the LGBTQ community in 2019, just for a reference: https://www.glaad.org/blog/incidents-anti-lgbtq-hate-violence-2019

[TurtlePower]

16 minutes ago, questionfear said:

You're incorrect about the relative safety of being gay in America. GLAAD has a partial list of major hate crimes against the LGBTQ community in 2019, just for a reference: https://www.glaad.org/blog/incidents-anti-lgbtq-hate-violence-2019

You know, it’s getting better but I still don’t understand. Why does it matter to some total stranger if people are gay—it matters enough to harm them? Why? Same as why would it matter if you’re wearing a red coat? It. Doesn’t. Matter. 

Even for the religious folk who say it’s a “sin”; it’s still none of their business. They should hate everyone equally then because everyone “sins”. They should work on their own shit before pointing fingers. 

Edited October 16, 2019 by TurtlePower
Auto-incorrect

[neh]

38 minutes ago, TurtlePower said:

You know, it’s getting better but I still don’t understand. Why does it matter to some total stranger if people are gay—it matters enough to harm them? Why? Same as why would it matter if you’re wearing a red coat? It. Doesn’t. Matter. 

Even for the religious folk who say it’s a “sin”; it’s still none of their business. They should hate everyone equally then because everyone “sins”. They should work on their own shit before pointing fingers. 

I completely agree with you Turtle. IMO, in this country we are too much in others bedrooms. 

[Kohola3]

37 minutes ago, neh said:

IMO, in this country we are too much in others bedrooms. 

While there are lots of crazy ass Christian groups that are all up in people's faces, there are countries throughout the world where being gay is illegal and, in some, is punishable by death.  So I have to say the US is pretty tolerant overall in comparison.

[MonicaM]

Mariah's the type who would never understand that she has haters and detractors because she's a smug, condescending, narcissistic, egomaniac.  It has nothing to do with the fact that she's gay, or at least living a gay lifestyle.  

[xwordfanatik]

Mariah has been a spoiled brat since day 1, quite apart from coming out as a young adult.

59 minutes ago, MonicaM said:

Mariah's the type who would never understand that she has haters and detractors because she's a smug, condescending, narcissistic, egomaniac.  It has nothing to do with the fact that she's gay, or at least living a gay lifestyle.  

This.

[Mahamid Frauded Me]

Interesting theory. Maybe Pudge thinks Sludge is that sister her mom never was able to have.  She lived in her little princess castle her whole life, so I really don't think she has much of a relationship with her half siblings at all. When they went to Utah was there any posts about them seeing Fat Tony and McKankles ?

[Teafortwo]

I really don't think anyone, and especially someone from a fundamentalist mormon family, would ever pretend to be gay. She could have gotten plenty of attention from being the only child interested in pursuing plural marriage. She may be a LUG, or scared of boys, I'll grant you that, but I do not think the coming out was pretend.

[Fosca]

22 hours ago, B in Lee said:

homosexual couples are NOT "persecuted" in America these days. One is more likely to experience bodily or property damage by wearing a MAGA hat these days than by waving a rainbow flag.

Both of these depend tremendously on where you are in the US.  At the risk of oversimplification:  Big City?  Let the rainbow flag fly!  Rural area/small town?  MAGA all the way!  I've lived in both Big City and Small Town in the past few years, and the differences are really striking.

I suspect Mariah acts the way she does because 1. She's still in the throes of "Identity is all", in much the same ways that former smokers often can't shut up about how others shouldn't smoke or a new convert to a religion can't talk about anything else; and 2. Without this identity of "Lesbian all the way", she has no real identity unless she wants to be "Daughter of Polygamist with four wives!", which won't go very well with the crowd she hangs out with and wants to make money from.  If she's not Super-Gay, she's just like everyone else, a face in the crowd, and she won't be that (she is trying out Ms. Bali Yoga Queen of Chicago, but that's apparently not working well).  Besides, she's taking after her mom, Ms. Flagstaff-Fashion Lularoe.

[Twopper]

20 hours ago, Fosca said:

If she's not Super-Gay, she's just like everyone else, a face in the crowd, and she won't be that (she is trying out Ms. Bali Yoga Queen of Chicago, but that's apparently not working well).  Besides, she's taking after her mom, Ms. Flagstaff-Fashion Lularoe.

I think this is true.  We had a discussion that the reason Meri has such atrocious taste in her hair, make up, and clothing is that she was in the cocoon of the poly culture during the 70's, 80's, 90's and 00's.   I think growing up in that same cocoon kept Mariah from seeing the progress that the the LGBT community was making during that time--especially the LG people.  She probably does think it's still 1950, because her parents think that way.  I don't for a minute believe Kody and his harem are truly supportive of her being gay, much less Super-Gay, but if it works for the show, they are going to go along with her as long as TLC cameras are rolling. 

Well, that's my theory and I am sticking to it---at least for today🙂

[Yeah No]

On 10/16/2019 at 9:36 AM, questionfear said:

You're incorrect about the relative safety of being gay in America. GLAAD has a partial list of major hate crimes against the LGBTQ community in 2019, just for a reference: https://www.glaad.org/blog/incidents-anti-lgbtq-hate-violence-2019

Considering how many gays there are in the US that is still a very small number.  And if you consult the  FBI statistics you'll see the number ticks up and down in the short term but over the long term these hate crimes have gone down in the past 20 years.  Plus there's always the reporting effect in that more of these crimes are probably being reported today than in decades past.  So it's probably better than it looks.

I still think Mariah et. al. are being influenced into thinking there is far more prejudice against gays today than there really is.  And I don't say that to claim the prejudice that still exists is not still a problem.  It is, but it's just not as big a problem.  When I heard that Mayor Pete got re-elected after coming out as gay, and not by a small margin, that was some evidence to support that.  I'm not sure that would have been possible 20 years ago in that part of the country.

[Yeah No]

10 hours ago, Twopper said:

I think this is true.  We had a discussion that the reason Meri has such atrocious taste in her hair, make up, and clothing is that she was in the cocoon of the poly culture during the 70's, 80's, 90's and 00's.   I think growing up in that same cocoon kept Mariah from seeing the progress that the the LGBT community was making during that time--especially the LG people.  She probably does think it's still 1950, because her parents think that way.  I don't for a minute believe Kody and his harem are truly supportive of her being gay, much less Super-Gay, but if it works for the show, they are going to go along with her as long as TLC cameras are rolling. 

Well, that's my theory and I am sticking to it---at least for today🙂

You and I think alike because that sounds just like my theory, LOL.

I think Kody and some or all of the wives put on a politically correct stance for the camera but who knows if they really do accept Mariah being gay or super gay?  I have felt that since the moment she came out to them on TV that they are at the very least not comfortable with it but don't want to be known as prejudiced on TV because then they could be the target of hate in return.  So it's no wonder that Mariah would generalize from her family's culture to the rest of the world disproportionately.  It's really such an insular culture that it would be easy to do that.  The only reason it doesn't seem that way with the Browns is because of the TV show, but that is misleading.  I think they try to act more sophisticated about things than they really are.  

I think the "super gay" thing is a phenomenon that comes out of feeling very repressed about being unable to be open about one's sexuality for a long time and wanting to shout it from the rooftops for everyone to see and hear once the person decides to risk be open about it.  Mariah does come from a culture that is pretty repressive of gayness in general so I do understand where that come from with her to some extent.  Of course personality also plays a role and her being the narcissist she has big "look at me aren't I wonderful?" tendencies as well.

And FWIW, my gaydar does go off with Mariah.   She does seem gay to me for reasons I can't explain.  I just don't see her with a man.  Audrey however does not ring as many bells with me on that dimension.  I think she may actually be a little bisexual and one of those college gay women that grows out of it and ends up marrying a man eventually.  Which may explain her depression as she struggles with that issue.

[Twopper]

8 hours ago, Yeah No said:

I think the "super gay" thing is a phenomenon that comes out of feeling very repressed about being unable to be open about one's sexuality for a long time and wanting to shout it from the rooftops for everyone to see and hear once the person decides to risk be open about it.  Mariah does come from a culture that is pretty repressive of gayness in general so I do understand where that come from with her to some extent.  Of course personality also plays a role and her being the narcissist she has big "look at me aren't I wonderful?" tendencies as well.

And FWIW, my gaydar does go off with Mariah.   She does seem gay to me for reasons I can't explain.  I just don't see her with a man.  Audrey however does not ring as many bells with me on that dimension.  I think she may actually be a little bisexual and one of those college gay women that grows out of it and ends up marrying a man eventually.  Which may explain her depression as she struggles with that issue.

I think Mariah's other issue is the need to stand out in some way from all the other Browns. I think as an only child, but surrounded by 12 other children plus Robyn's crew that Kody adopted and then more children of Kody's with Robyn she felt not only lost but a bit different without full blooded sibs.   I think Meri saw that and overcompensated by providing her more than the other siblings got (such as a private college v a state university)

Also birth order probably plays a part.  The first 5 Brown children arrived within 25 months of each other.  The first was Logan who as a boy probably got a lot of attention, then a girl (Mykelti, I think), then Mariah, Maddie, and another girl.  

[Yeah No]

29 minutes ago, Twopper said:

I think Mariah's other issue is the need to stand out in some way from all the other Browns. I think as an only child, but surrounded by 12 other children plus Robyn's crew that Kody adopted and then more children of Kody's with Robyn she felt not only lost but a bit different without full blooded sibs.   I think Meri saw that and overcompensated by providing her more than the other siblings got (such as a private college v a state university)

Also birth order probably plays a part.  The first 5 Brown children arrived within 25 months of each other.  The first was Logan who as a boy probably got a lot of attention, then a girl (Mykelti, I think), then Mariah, Maddie, and another girl.  

I think you're right.  She probably has a little of that "lost child" syndrome too, which given her dominant personality would have been hard on her.  I've written before about that myself.  In some ways she never felt a part of the group, and may not have even felt accepted by them in some ways.  Now all of that is being projected onto her gayness and how the world is not accepting her for that either.

[Sandy W]

9 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

I think you're right.  She probably has a little of that "lost child" syndrome too, which given her dominant personality would have been hard on her.  I've written before about that myself.  In some ways she never felt a part of the group, and may not have even felt accepted by them in some ways.  Now all of that is being projected onto her gayness and how the world is not accepting her for that either.

Another factor may have been their peculiar family structure.  Instead of a parental unit guiding and nurturing Mariah into an adult life of compassion for others, Mariah had Meri, who no doubt instilled an attitude of "you and me against the world".  Kids are perceptive and even if Meri didn't outright express her resentment of time spent with "the others", Mariah would feel it and the results would be either anxiety or a defensive "I don't GAF" shield.

[questionfear]

10 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Considering how many gays there are in the US that is still a very small number.  And if you consult the  FBI statistics you'll see the number ticks up and down in the short term but over the long term these hate crimes have gone down in the past 20 years.  Plus there's always the reporting effect in that more of these crimes are probably being reported today than in decades past.  So it's probably better than it looks.

I still think Mariah et. al. are being influenced into thinking there is far more prejudice against gays today than there really is.  And I don't say that to claim the prejudice that still exists is not still a problem.  It is, but it's just not as big a problem.  When I heard that Mayor Pete got re-elected after coming out as gay, and not by a small margin, that was some evidence to support that.  I'm not sure that would have been possible 20 years ago in that part of the country.

Yes, hate crimes have gone down. But objectively, it's still less safe to be gay in this country than to be straight. That's not to say things aren't better, I know they are on a broad cultural level, but that doesn't change the fact that it's still sometimes tougher to be a minority. It doesn't excuse Mariah being a brat or any other issues, but there's absolutely subtle and not so subtle prejudice against the LGBT community.  

I'm 38, and when I was 19 and in college in Boston someone called my a dyke out their truck window while driving down the street. That's less likely now, true. 12ish years ago, a woman screamed at me in the line for the ladies room at Penn Station that I didn't belong in the women's bathroom. I'm a cisgender woman, but I can present somewhat masculine because I have short hair and consider myself butch. I politely explained that in fact I am female, and all I got in return was a sneer. I think about that incident anytime the subject of bathroom bills comes up, for example. When I was 20 I had a note on my car when I went to work calling me a "cute

Spoiler

faggot

" (I spoiler tagged it since it's an offensive word).

When my son was born i had to go to court to legally adopt him because I was worried that if the culture swung more conservative again my parental rights would be in danger, even though I was legally married to his mother and my name is on his birth certificate as the second parent. I'm very lucky that my state protects my rights but there are states where I can absolutely be fired for being openly gay. And it's always in the back of my head that not everywhere is super welcoming. I'm very conscious of holding my girlfriend's hand in rural areas of my state. I get cagey answering questions about my personal life at work if I don't know someone well. It's not that the world is overtly homophobic, but there's lots of big and small ways that people can make life more difficult for someone who is gay. 

I don't meant to write an essay, but I want to be clear that it's not all perfect sunshine and rainbows because marriage equality passed. I'm also not 20 and newly out anymore, so I don't need to drape myself in a pride flag and make everything about how gay I am. In that sense, absolutely, someone like Mariah can be a huge pain and kind of obnoxious. On the other hand, just because she's over the top doesn't mean she's wrong...it's not that world isn't safer, but safer doesn't mean safe and it doesn't mean everything's fixed and happy. 

[Twopper]

2 hours ago, CocoPuffs said:

I can’t quite put into words what I’m thinking so it won’t be as eloquent as some of you, but it’s not that I think Mariah is “pretending to be gay” per se. What I mean is in her mind, she probably thinks she is. I know she thinks she’s this super-woke intellectual who has all the answers to the world’s problems, but in actuality she’s still very young, very immature and has very little life and real world experience. I too do not believe she ever felt that she fit in among her siblings, which I feel is pretty evident in some of the things we’ve seen on the show. I also don’t think she ever truly believed in her church’s teachings. She just said the “right” things to make her look like the golden child in Kody’s eyes. (I might add that with children, it’s very important that they develop their own personal faith apart from their parents once they are older. Most of us want our children to believe as we do, but I don’t want mine to just believe because I believe. I want it to be personal to them. If not, it won’t take much for them to fall away from faith. They’re just towing the line, and the moment doubt comes, faith is out the door). But I digress.

Anyway I think she made friends with and latched on to the identity of those who befriended her. The irony is she thinks being this LGBT outlier has made her intellectually superior to everyone else, but really - with no depth to her own faith - she was an easy target for the first group who would make her feel the acceptance she was craving. 

Well, I don't think she is pretending.  What I mean by "super gay" is "gay" plus being very "woke" plus mentioning one or both aspects of her life in every other sentence lest we forget for a minute that she is "queer."  Her comment about white shoes being queer comes to mind as an example.

2 hours ago, questionfear said:

Yes, hate crimes have gone down. But objectively, it's still less safe to be gay in this country than to be straight. That's not to say things aren't better, I know they are on a broad cultural level, but that doesn't change the fact that it's still sometimes tougher to be a minority. It doesn't excuse Mariah being a brat or any other issues, but there's absolutely subtle and not so subtle prejudice against the LGBT community.  

Maybe it's because I have a trans relative that I tend to think that the prejudice against the LG part of the LGBT communities has been lessened while it has gotten stronger against the trans.   My relative is FTM and is not quite 5 feet tall, and I really worry about his safety;  he looks like Peter Pan.

[questionfear]

4 minutes ago, Twopper said:

Maybe it's because I have a trans relative that I tend to think that the prejudice against the LG part of the LGBT communities has been lessened while it has gotten stronger against the trans.   My relative is FTM and is not quite 5 feet tall, and I really worry about his safety;  he looks like Peter Pan.

I think you're probably right, especially in terms of overt discrimination and bias attacks. There's a truly frightening number of attacks on the trans community, especially MTF who are also people of color. It's scary because while overt discrimination against the LGB portion has gone down somewhat (so it's more subtle/legal challenges than concerns about walking down the street type safety), it seems like trans people have a much bigger physical safety issue, and that's something that needs to be addressed. (I recognize this discussion is slightly off topic)

[Fosca]

A lot of it is also "visible minority" vs. "invisible minority".  Butch women and feminine men (of whatever sexual orientation(s)) and many transgender people are often a lot more visible and get a lot more harassment than those that "fit in" better.  I suspect Pete Buttigieg might not have been re-elected if he presented as feminine, for instance.  Plus the whole "I know him, he's not a <insert perjorative here>" helped too, I'm sure.

Mariah, while not the most femme person, also isn't all that butch, so she needs to proclaim her gayness far and wide to make sure no one misses it--which again is not uncommon for someone her age and in her circumstances.  If she's still being like this in 10 years, that will be a lot more unusual.  I wonder if she was a lot less open about it when she was in a less-gay-welcoming place like Utah (or at least Utah outside of Salt Lake City)--I can't remember, did she come out in college or after?

[deirdra]

I think Mariah could be asexual and since she has no interest in men assumes she is gay. Before donning white sneakers, in the THs she seemed to embrace polygamy for the sisterhood, while her sisters talked about their future husbands. She & Audge act like roommates even when Kootie isn't around to disapprove.  Not everyone wants/needs a man or a woman.

Edited October 18, 2019 by deirdra

[slf]

23 hours ago, questionfear said:

Yes, hate crimes have gone down. But objectively, it's still less safe to be gay in this country than to be straight. That's not to say things aren't better, I know they are on a broad cultural level, but that doesn't change the fact that it's still sometimes tougher to be a minority. It doesn't excuse Mariah being a brat or any other issues, but there's absolutely subtle and not so subtle prejudice against the LGBT community.  

I'm 38, and when I was 19 and in college in Boston someone called my a dyke out their truck window while driving down the street. That's less likely now, true. 12ish years ago, a woman screamed at me in the line for the ladies room at Penn Station that I didn't belong in the women's bathroom. I'm a cisgender woman, but I can present somewhat masculine because I have short hair and consider myself butch. I politely explained that in fact I am female, and all I got in return was a sneer. I think about that incident anytime the subject of bathroom bills comes up, for example. When I was 20 I had a note on my car when I went to work calling me a "cute

  Reveal spoiler

faggot

" (I spoiler tagged it since it's an offensive word).

When my son was born i had to go to court to legally adopt him because I was worried that if the culture swung more conservative again my parental rights would be in danger, even though I was legally married to his mother and my name is on his birth certificate as the second parent. I'm very lucky that my state protects my rights but there are states where I can absolutely be fired for being openly gay. And it's always in the back of my head that not everywhere is super welcoming. I'm very conscious of holding my girlfriend's hand in rural areas of my state. I get cagey answering questions about my personal life at work if I don't know someone well. It's not that the world is overtly homophobic, but there's lots of big and small ways that people can make life more difficult for someone who is gay. 

I don't meant to write an essay, but I want to be clear that it's not all perfect sunshine and rainbows because marriage equality passed. I'm also not 20 and newly out anymore, so I don't need to drape myself in a pride flag and make everything about how gay I am. In that sense, absolutely, someone like Mariah can be a huge pain and kind of obnoxious. On the other hand, just because she's over the top doesn't mean she's wrong...it's not that world isn't safer, but safer doesn't mean safe and it doesn't mean everything's fixed and happy. 

Yeah, I mean off the top of my head I can recall multiple instances of violent attacks on gay couples in the past two years just because they held hands (like the couple that was stabbed on Capitol Hill or the couple that was attacked with friggin' boltcutters- and most of the ones I know of happened in big cities so just living in a major metro won't guarantee you experience non-violent homophobia). Seconding that marriage equality laws didn't end homophobia; I see that argument all the time and it'd be laughable if it weren't so tragic.

In my experience, people from repressive backgrounds tend to over compensate when they come out and people from very in-your-face communities (like the Southern Baptist community I was raised in) tend to bring that same, uh, zeal when they join a new one. With Mariah I think it's an odd combination of the two.

[TurtlePower]

Agree with many of you that I don’t think Mariah is pretending to be gay. I also agree she’s going through the “in your face look I’m gay” phase, which hopefully won’t last long. There’s a difference being out there and being obnoxious; I hope she finds that balance but, it’s Mariah. Everything she does requires an announcement  

[Sofa Sloth]

Mariah’s latest paper on restorative justice is on her website for those who mentioned earlier they wanted to read it https://www.mariahlianbrown.com/justice

Also a new unflattering photo: