Season 3 Discussion

[mittsigirl]

Cheese and Pickle Sandwich. I find them delicious but I unseen eating them all my life.

Never heard of it before, will have to make one for my British/Scottish husband-thanks!

Edited November 25, 2015 by mittsigirl

[charmed1]

Where did you guys see a cat? I saw a very small dog that Carolina was petting, but I missed the cat.

[Christina]

I own my home and my mother lives with me. I pay the bills, she does general housekeeping. Everyone calls it my mom's house. Someone approached her once and asked for her number, because it was unlisted. It is not, it is just in my name, because I'm the homeowner. It doesn't bother me that people think I live with her because other people's opinions about me don't matter, but it bothers her.

 

She also picked out and painted the living room, and has decorated the first floor with her stuff. It doesn't bother me because I don't care about furnishings. I'm 39 and have lived here 9 years with my teenager, and we combined our households. There is no reason to argue over whose knick knacks are on the wall; these things just don't matter to some of us.

 

I also thought that the told us his job on the show. I did watch some of the audition videos, and don't remember if his was one of them, but his company was mentioned and that he could work from home. He actually lived in Colombia for a while. However, I don't remember specifically what he did.

 

This show leaves out sooooooo much information that could make us like them.

[cooksdelight]

This show leaves out sooooooo much information that could make us like them.

Understatement of the year. It's why past couples like Brett & Daya, and several others, want nothing to do with this show anymore. I think we need to give Fernando the benefit of the doubt unless someone says otherwise.

Back on topic of the episode now, please. :)

[KarmaG]

Could Josh's mom look more depressed? As strict as dad is, he seems to be trying. There were smiles and tendrils of warmth. But the mom just seems to unhappy. I understand the cameras are not for everyone, but to not even crack a smile?

 

I pointed it out previously in another episode thread but his mom has smiled and chuckled with Aleks when she came late to the Scripture reading.

[Kangatush]

To those who want to play the Mark "my ex wife/4 kids in diapers" drinking game, please be careful. This week is a 2 hour episode, and Mark is not worth destroying your liver over. :)

Speaking of Mark, his passive aggressive interplay with Nikki is driving me mad. He's not happy. He's said it in so many words. But he's going to make her be the one to decide to go home (which I so wish she does) so he can spend the next 20 years bitching about how she left him too. If you've spent slightly over a month together and you already need a "vacation" and to give each other space, that's a huge red flag.

Where are Aleksandra and Josh going to live after the wedding? Please let them get their own place.

I understand that Kyle isn't fully comfortable airing all his family business on TV (even though it looks like they do next week), but Noon deserves to know the backstory, even if he tells her off camera. That's the real life stuff you deserve to know about your spouse.

How much do I love Fernando's mom? She is a horrible person. If I had to spend time with her in real life, I'd stab her with a fork. But, since I'm on the outside, I just get to enjoy the bile.

[trimthatfat]

Didn't she say it's too expensive or she can't afford it (something like that) after being told that dress cost $2400? I think she was looking for a cheaper dress than that. Maybe she never had the fantasy wedding she always dreamed off and now is making up for it, which is why she's wanting a dress and all of that.

Then her priorities, IMO, are still out of whack. If you are broke, you either rent a dress or head to a discount store and find a simple white dress. I don't know when this was filmed, but if it was filmed between March-June, she could have found a nice dress off the rack for under $200 due to prom season, and then for even less if it's between July-August because stores wants to get rid of their inventory. If she wanted a fantasy wedding, she could save that for their 5 or 10 year anniversary. I just don't understand the point of planning a wedding if you don't have money - particularly, if you have a minor child and your spouse can't work. God forbid there was an emergency where she needed money.

 

And if she is lying about her finances to mislead Devar, that's a much bigger problem.

Edited November 25, 2015 by trimthatfat

[Tara Ariano]

Loren's bachelorette party upsets Alexei; Noon finally meets Kyle's mom; Aleksandra wonders if she's too young for marriage; Carolina has drama with Fernando and his mom; Melanie is stressed; Mark's trust of Nikki is tested.

[JocelynCavanaugh]

Considering he was helping his family when he was in Jamaica, I don't think he needs to change his beliefs. Clearly he has a strong belief system that, imho, is family oriented. The only thing that needs to change is his status so he can actually work here and help Mel.

 

If he marries Melanie, then she is his primary family unit. It's not very "family oriented" to put others above the spouse you chose. 

[locomoco]

If he marries Melanie, then she is his primary family unit. It's not very "family oriented" to put others above the spouse you chose. 

Family is family... one you're born into, another you choose to join into. One doesn't necessarily have draw a line to say that one is more important than the other.

[JocelynCavanaugh]

Family is family... one you're born into, another you choose to join into. One doesn't necessarily have draw a line to say that one is more important than the other.

Well, apparently you do in Devar's case because his intended wife isn't okay with this arrangement, nor should she have to be.

[locomoco]

Well, apparently you do in Devar's case because his intended wife isn't okay with this arrangement, nor should she have to be.

That's Melanie's problem. She's marrying someone who has different opinions on supporting family. If they're going to be tying the knot, they had better come to some consensus on the subject.

[WhoAmIReally]

If Melanie knew anything about immigrant culture, she would realize that it would be considered unusual not to send money home.  I think she's the victim of cultural undereducation mixed with "bag-lady" fear:  you think no matter how hard you work/save, something bad is going to happen you and you're going to end up alone on a street corner, wearing a babushka and eating baked beans from a can.  Thus, any threat to your security (money) is exaggerated in your head. 

 

She's also pretty set in her ways and used to spending how she wants/needs.  Maybe she's mad that Devar seems to be horning in on her wine supply.  If they had a Trader Joe's up there, she'd be buying him the three-buck Chuck for sure.  She'd be drinking the finer five-dollar blend.

[RCharter]

If Melanie knew anything about immigrant culture, she would realize that it would be considered unusual not to send money home.  

Exactly!  He comes from a different culture, where people routinely send money home, especially men.  It's pretty much been him and his sisters since his mother left, and he already comes from a culture where I believe it is expected of male children to help support the family.  I think Mel feels like he is going to send money home to spite her, or that it means something.  I don't get the impression that it is.  And while she is broke now, I think her insistence that he use all his money on the family Devar has with her isn't really based on need, but on principle.  She has a household with her and Hunter, she met Devar on holiday and had to have known he didn't have much money.  So, to me then, she wasn't particularly in need of any financial help when she met Devar, she wasn't trying to find a man to help her financially.  She can afford her little household with her and Hunter.  I can't imagine Devar adds so much additional expense that she would need any and all income he makes.  

 

I think she would be better off keeping their accounts separate and making him pay for his own expenses.  That way she doesn't get resentful because she feels like he is taking advantage of her and after he pays his portion of the expenses for the month he can do what he wants with his money.  My parents have always maintained separate accounts and they have NEVER fought about money.  They have fought about plenty of other things in life, but never about money.

[millennium]

Why exactly is Nikki marrying Mark anyway? Is her life that bad at home that she's willing to spend the next twenty years of her life with an asshole old enough to be her grandfather? I just can't figure out what she could possibly see in Mark and how marrying him is better than living in the Philippines. Even if she just wants a green card surly she can do better than him.

 

I have no sympathy for Nikki.   She's not a stupid woman.   She knows exactly what Mark is, and what she got herself into.   And apparently it's a price she's willing to pay because she's still there.    I'm not justifying or absolving Mark's bad behavior, but at the same time I think Nikki has little cause for complaint.   She ought to look at the big picture and be overjoyed that she's finally in this country, not pouting because she doesn't get treated like a princess too.

 

Who is Nikki to expect to "cut the line" in the immigration process AND be treated to a fairytale romance?  What has she done to deserve that, other than try to game the process?   There's a certain kind of man who goes looking for a mail order bride -- and he's not "Mr. Right."   Nikki knows that.   They all know that.   In that light, her complaining comes off as spoiled and selfish.  

 

Nikki made her bed, now she can sleep in it, zebra stripes and all.

[RCharter]

^^ I get your reasoning.  I totally do.  I guess I feel sad for a system where she is so desperate she has to marry Mark just to have a decent life.  That's such a sad choice.  Mark and all his weirdness....or poverty.

[millennium]

If things truly are that desperate for Nikki back in the Phillippines, then she should be on her knees thanking God that she got out rather than whining that Mark doesn't spend enough time with her.    Jeezus, Nikki, watch TV, read a book, listen to music, go for a walk, amuse yourself.   I'm sure the living conditions are better than where you were.  I'm sure everything is better.   She shows no gratitude or appreciation of where she is, just complains about what she isn't getting.

Edited November 26, 2015 by millennium

[Raja]

If things truly are that desperate for Nikki back in the Phillippines, then she should be on her knees thanking God that she got out rather than whining that Mark doesn't spend enough time with her. Jeezus, Nikki, watch TV, read a book, listen to music, go for a walk, amuse yourself. I'm sure the living conditions are better than where you were. I'm sure everything is better. She shows no gratitude or appreciation of where she is, just complains about what she isn't getting.

One of The Rock's wrestling promotions stitch "know your role and shut your face" only Nikki and all of their roles are to provide eye rolling drama for the viewers until the weddings then come back for the recap before the next cycle starts.

[cooksdelight]

What I gathered from this episode is that Nikki's every waking moment is monitored by Mark. And he tells her what she should do.... "Aren't you going to get in the water, Nikki?" (multiple times). I think some of her complaints are stemming from this. Would anyone want to have all their movements watched by someone, criticized, etc?

[RCharter]

What I gathered from this episode is that Nikki's every waking moment is monitored by Mark. And he tells her what she should do.... "Aren't you going to get in the water, Nikki?" (multiple times). I think some of her complaints are stemming from this. Would anyone want to have all their movements watched by someone, criticized, etc?

I find her situation sad, all joking aside.  And I think she feels so insecure because Mark constantly holds the threat of sending her back over her head, which is why she wants to bring a child into the situation.  I'm not sure if that was his MO with wife number 1, and maybe thats why she had children she wasn't ready for.  I just hope she can make it for the two years, and once she feels empowered with her green card/citizenship...make a run for it.  I'm not sure what Mark's feelings are, but it would be awesome if she could go to school and get some education under her belt so she could be away from him for most of the day.

 

The "aren't you going to x?" multiple times has always been a way to trip up my temper, so bless her for not losing it on him.  

[cooksdelight]

Mark wanted people to see him cavorting in the waves with a hot young babe in a bikini. Period. He could care less if she wanted to get in the water for any other reason, in my opinion.

[Dobian]

After Aleksandria's mom made the comments about polygamy, I imagined the director on site suggesting afterward that they tune in to this fun show called Sister Wives on TLC that night, lol.

 

All I know is that when I visit someone in their country I want them to cook me their kind of food, why would I want them to cook mine?

 

Fernando's mom is doing a great job in her quest to derail this engagement, essentially calling the girlfriend a crazy Colombian drug smuggler.  That house would make for a great sitcom if she moves in.

Edited November 26, 2015 by Dobian

[millennium]

Mark wanted people to see him cavorting in the waves with a hot young babe in a bikini. Period. He could care less if she wanted to get in the water for any other reason, in my opinion.

 

I agree.   But the way I see it, they're both using each other -- so why is it Nikki alone who gets sympathy?   The "Big, Bad Mark"/"poor Nikki" set-up strikes me as more than a bit sexist. 

[locomoco]

so why is it Nikki alone who gets sympathy?

Because she's basically still a child, being micro-managed, and controlled by a man who has already enjoyed a full lifetime.

 

The vibe I get out of Mark is that when he got married the first time, he thought he was going to get an exotic, subservient wife who would cater to his every whim. He would work, and come home to a clean house and dinner would be on the table for him, and he would watch the sunrise with his new bride every night.

 

Then they started having kids. Instead of getting all the attention, he had to share his wife's time and affection with his kids. I'm sure he made sure to vocalize his dissatisfaction with his wife.

 

After having more kids and losing more and more attention, Mark probably shut down, and buried himself in work and played the victim/martyr for being ignored at home after saving his wife from poverty in the Philippines.

 

I'm sure after a certain point, after she got her green card/citizenship, his wife just got fed up with complaints that no person would ever be able to live up to, she left him. He probably sued for full custody of the kids, and was then left in charge of raising 4 kids in diapers.

 

Going full martyr, I'm sure he mentioned that his wife left him with 4 kids in diapers non-stop to anyone who would listen to him - this was his way of garnering sympathy and admiration for doing such a good thing. I'm sure all the while, he was resentful for spending all those years he was a single father when his first wife was supposed to be taking care of them and still catering to him on hand and dirty feet.

 

Current day. After raising his kids, he wants to reset the clock to a time when he can go back to just enjoying a young, sexy, exotic, subservient wife who will cater to his wants and needs - and his wants and needs only. No kids are going to mess things up this time.

[millennium]

I respectfully disagree about Nikki being "basically still a child."   If she's old enough to sign up for the visa program and leave home, she's no longer a child.   She may give that impression for the cameras, but I suspect that women in Third World countries are in many ways more mature and worldly-wise than their American counterparts simply because their survival depends on it.

Edited November 26, 2015 by millennium

[millennium]

Current day. After raising his kids, he wants to reset the clock to a time when he can go back to just enjoying a young, sexy, exotic, subservient wife who will cater to his wants and needs - and his wants and needs only. No kids are going to mess things up this time.

 

Yes, but he made all of that clear to her.   He was up front about it.   He is not trying to change the contract -- she is.    She came here with full understanding of the situation.    Looking at it objectively, she's the one making waves, which seems to me in poor taste and taking advantage, since Mark covered the expense of bringing her here and opened his home to her.  

[RCharter]

I respectfully disagree about Nikki being "basically still a child."   If she's old enough to sign up for the visa program and leave home, she's no longer a child.   She may give that impression for the cameras, but I suspect that women in Third World countries are in many ways more mature and worldly-wise than their American counterparts simply because their survival depends on it.

But at 18, I believe American females could do the same, and I would still say they are basically children.  I don't know that girls grow up faster, or if thats something we tell ourselves so we feel better about their awful conditions and bad situations.  And even if it is, that doesn't make it right.  You can be a child in a horrible condition and survive, but still be a child.

[Raja]

I respectfully disagree about Nikki being "basically still a child."   If she's old enough to sign up for the visa program and leave home, she's no longer a child.   She may give that impression for the cameras, but I suspect that women in Third World countries are in many ways more mature and worldly-wise than their American counterparts simply because their survival depends on it.

Old enough for that but not old enough to marry without parental permission in her homeland.

Edited November 27, 2015 by Raja

[RCharter]

Yes, but he made all of that clear to her.   He was up front about it.   He is not trying to change the contract -- she is.    She came here with full understanding of the situation.    Looking at it objectively, she's the one making waves, which seems to me in poor taste and taking advantage, since Mark covered the expense of bringing her here and opened his home to her.  

I think Mark took advantage from day 1. He clearly took advantage of a power imbalance. She lives in a poor country and he wanted to get a child bride that he could control.  And he works double time to control her by constantly threatening to "send her back."  If she is making waves,its because he has likely changed from the eager suitor in the Philippines that she thought would be her savior to this guy who keeps telling her he is going to "send her back."  If she was living in poverty, or if her family is counting on her to send money/bring them over, she likely feels intense pressure when he talks about how he is going to send her back.  And I can understand her wanting to bring in a child so she could have some assurance of not having to go back.

[RCharter]

 

 

I'm sure after a certain point, after she got her green card/citizenship, his wife just got fed up with complaints that no person would ever be able to live up to, she left him. He probably sued for full custody of the kids, and was then left in charge of raising 4 kids in diapers.

 

Going full martyr, I'm sure he mentioned that his wife left him with 4 kids in diapers non-stop to anyone who would listen to him - this was his way of garnering sympathy and admiration for doing such a good thing. I'm sure all the while, he was resentful for spending all those years he was a single father when his first wife was supposed to be taking care of them and still catering to him on hand and dirty feet.

 

Oh and trust and believe, if Nikki leaves him, he will be the martyr all over again.  The story will be that she just up and left him and he has no idea why.  There will be no mention of the threats to send her home, there will be no mention of how much he talks about his ex-wife, there will be no mention of the Von Trapp train whistle, there will only be stories about how he bought her a car and she drove off in it.

 

I wouldn't at all be surprised to learn that he advocated for full custody, so that he could spin the story to "she left me high and dry with four kids in diapers!"  I wish we could hear her side of the story.  At the very least, I could see him trying to hold the kids over her head the way he holds the threat of going back home over Nikki's head.  

[millennium]

I think Mark took advantage from day 1. He clearly took advantage of a power imbalance. She lives in a poor country and he wanted to get a child bride that he could control.  And he works double time to control her by constantly threatening to "send her back."  If she is making waves,its because he has likely changed from the eager suitor in the Philippines that she thought would be her savior to this guy who keeps telling her he is going to "send her back."  If she was living in poverty, or if her family is counting on her to send money/bring them over, she likely feels intense pressure when he talks about how he is going to send her back.  And I can understand her wanting to bring in a child so she could have some assurance of not having to go back.

 

Again, I disagree that Nikki is a "child bride."   If she were marrying a guy 22 years old, you probably wouldn't describe her as a "child bride."   Let's take Mark out of the equation and see Nikki as the 19-year-old woman she is.  

 

Nikki knowingly and willingly made a deal with the devil.   She could have applied for immigration the way everybody else does.   Instead she used her assets -- in this case, her age and her gender -- to appeal to the unsavory desires of a man three times her age as a means of getting to America, having somebody else foot the bill, and ensuring her a place to live once she got here.   Now I'm supposed to feel sorry for her?   Why?   She got exactly what she deserves.    I reject the idea of Nikki as a poor innocent in all this.    She's working an angle every bit as much as Mark is.  I think her pouting and petulance are an act.

Edited November 26, 2015 by millennium

[WhoAmIReally]

  I'm not sure what Mark's feelings are, but it would be awesome if she could go to school and get some education under her belt so she could be away from him for most of the day.

 

In the first episode, when he was Skyping her, he asked what she was going to do when she got here--get a job, go to school, what?  She wouldn't answer and he was really frustrated.  Episode Two, he asked her the same thing, as did Elise.  She had no interest in going to school.  Considering that he both bought her a car and is begging her to find something to do, I don't think he wants to keep her under his thumb.  Remember how pissed he got when she called him away from his work?  Sadly, I can't even imagine her reading--wonder if she finished high school--I think it only goes up to age 16 in the Phillippines, so maybe.  Hopefully she can take a couple of classes at a community college. 

[RCharter]

Again, I disagree that Nikki is a "child bride."   If she were marrying a guy 22 years old, you probably wouldn't describe her as a "child bride."   Let's take Mark out of the equation and see Nikki as the 19-year-old woman she is.  

 

Nikki knowingly and willingly made a deal with the devil.   She could have applied for immigration the way everybody else does.   Instead she used her assets -- in this case, her age and her gender -- to appeal to the unsavory desires of a man three times her age as a means of getting to America, having somebody else foot the bill, and ensuring her a place to live once she got here.   Now I'm supposed to feel sorry for her?   Why?   She got exactly what she deserves.    I reject the idea of Nikki as a poor innocent in all this.    She's working an angle every bit as much as Mark is.  I think her pouting and petulance are an act.

I would always call a 19 year old girl a child bride, because I think 19 year olds are children.  Especially when compared with 58 year old men, but even if they were marrying a 19 year old boy.  Than I would call them both children.

 

Nikki did make a deal with the devil.  I'm not going to credit the devil for it.  She could have applied for immigration the same way, and as a young girl with no education and no job abilities she would have had zero chance of getting the chance to immigrate.  So then her options are "live in poverty or marry Mark," and to me, that is no real choice at all.  I don't think any woman deserves Mark, especially if it was only between him and living in third world poverty.

 

I think Nikki is a 19 year old child, a girl.  And thats exactly what I was at 19, exactly what my sister was at 19, and every other girl is at 19 years of age. 

 

The fact that they have to face sleeping with men like Mark to escape poverty doesn't make them any less a child.  Oh and let us never forget that he actually met her when she was 16.

[RCharter]

In the first episode, when he was Skyping her, he asked what she was going to do when she got here--get a job, go to school, what?  She wouldn't answer and he was really frustrated.  Episode Two, he asked her the same thing, as did Elise.  She had no interest in going to school.  Considering that he both bought her a car and is begging her to find something to do, I don't think he wants to keep her under his thumb.  Remember how pissed he got when she called him away from his work?  Sadly, I can't even imagine her reading--wonder if she finished high school--I think it only goes up to age 16 in the Phillippines, so maybe.  Hopefully she can take a couple of classes at a community college. 

If she doesn't even understand the concept of school, and all she has been raised for is to think that this is the best she can do that doesn't make me feel happy for her, and it doesn't make me like him any more.  He purposefully picked someone who had no other prospects, and now he suddenly wants her to do all this stuff (and I don't wonder if some of that is for the camera).  Here is a newsflash Mark....19 year old girls who have an education don't want anything to do with you.  19 year old girls who have been exposed to an education don't want anything to do with you.  The only 19 year olds that are interested in you are desperate ones who can't do any better because they are living in poverty.  Those are the only 19 year olds that are interested in the specimen. He picked a poor child from a poor village so he could be the boss of her.  Now suddenly she should become Amal Clooney, because Mark is such a specimen?  I would hope for her sake that she realizes that she can do better than Mark, and that an education is part of that.  But in the US we grow up with those ideals of betterment through education.  I doubt that was her path.

[biakbiak]

Given many times he has referenced her going back home, I think Nikki is pretty well aware and was aware before she came how tenuous who situation is, I can completely understand why she might not want to even think about school or jobs until she at least has her green card because what happens if she does have to go back, it would be even more disappointing if she had started to plan/dream.

While they both might be getting something out of this Nikki seems to be trying to build a relationship whereas Mark wants to recreate a marriage he had 20 years ago and force Nikki into that mold regardless of her feelings or personality.

[WhoAmIReally]

I understand the "poor Nikki" point of view.  She is in a bad situation.  But I don't think she should be rewarded with citizenship for it.  Any marriage vows between these two would be a travesty at this point--neither loves the other nor is looking out for the other's interests.

[merylinkid]

She's 19.   I don't care what nationality she is, she is still 19.   Your brain is not even fully formed at that age (this is a fact, it's is still developing things like long range planning and understanding consequences, that's why teenargers are morons, they want to be adults but they can't process like adults with fully finished brains).   She might have thought she knew what she was getting into.   Okay, I go with this nice American man who seems to want to marry me and give me a great life, and all I have to do is sleep with him for a couple years to get my green card.   I can handle that.

 

Then she gets here and finds the zebra sheets on the bed, the nasty floor, the geriatic kitchen and the guy cannot. stop, talking. about his ex-wife.   All of sudden it doesn't seem so doable.   Then he wakes her up with a train whistle because HE has decided it's time she got up and ... did something, but what we don't know.   She can't drive.   She can't get a job yet.   She might not be able to go to school.   Oh that's right, she's supposed to be at his beck and call, not touch the windows, fold the towels his way and listen to his stories about his ex-wive who left him with 4 kids in diapers over and over and over and over.   

 

No she should not be damn grateful he "rescued" her.   She should expect to be treated with decency and respect as his fiancee.   Not molded into the image of his ex-wife and badgered into doing things she doesn't want to do.   No is a complete sentence whether it is about getting into the water or having sex with him.   

 

The threats to send her back if she doesn't measure up are borderline abusive.   Hell, I would say it is abusive.   It's just another control mechanism.   Drive the car I picked out for you, get up when I  say get up.   Do everything I say exactly how I say it, or back on the first plane to the Philliipines you go.   You try living like that for 5 minutes and see how grateful you feel.

[Honley Lass]

Right on!!!  Best summary of Nikki's plight that I've seen yet.

 

eta:  Obviously this was meant as a response to merylinkid's comment...I goofed!

Edited November 27, 2015 by Honley Lass

[ethalfrida]

She's 19.   I don't care what nationality she is, she is still 19.   Your brain is not even fully formed at that age (this is a fact, it's is still developing things like long range planning and understanding consequences, that's why teenargers are morons, they want to be adults but they can't process like adults with fully finished brains).   She might have thought she knew what she was getting into.   Okay, I go with this nice American man who seems to want to marry me and give me a great life, and all I have to do is sleep with him for a couple years to get my green card.   I can handle that.

 

Then she gets here and finds the zebra sheets on the bed, the nasty floor, the geriatic kitchen and the guy cannot. stop, talking. about his ex-wife.   All of sudden it doesn't seem so doable.   Then he wakes her up with a train whistle because HE has decided it's time she got up and ... did something, but what we don't know.   She can't drive.   She can't get a job yet.   She might not be able to go to school.   Oh that's right, she's supposed to be at his beck and call, not touch the windows, fold the towels his way and listen to his stories about his ex-wive who left him with 4 kids in diapers over and over and over and over.   

 

No she should not be damn grateful he "rescued" her.   She should expect to be treated with decency and respect as his fiancee.   Not molded into the image of his ex-wife and badgered into doing things she doesn't want to do.   No is a complete sentence whether it is about getting into the water or having sex with him.   

 

The threats to send her back if she doesn't measure up are borderline abusive.   Hell, I would say it is abusive.   It's just another control mechanism.   Drive the car I picked out for you, get up when I  say get up.   Do everything I say exactly how I say it, or back on the first plane to the Philliipines you go.   You try living like that for 5 minutes and see how grateful you feel.

Absolutely!!! 

[WhoAmIReally]

We all agree she's in a terrible situation.  What is the answer?  Should she marry him, knowing he's incapable of change, just to get citizenship?  Or should she go home to her old life and try to snag another creep on the internet? 

Edited November 27, 2015 by WhoAmIReally

[MrsSmartyPants]

I understand the "poor Nikki" point of view.  She is in a bad situation.  But I don't think she should be rewarded with citizenship for it.  Any marriage vows between these two would be a travesty at this point--neither loves the other nor is looking out for the other's interests.

This isn't a reward.  She is EARNING every bit of that green card (if she ever gets it).  

[Neurochick]

I agree.   But the way I see it, they're both using each other -- so why is it Nikki alone who gets sympathy?   The "Big, Bad Mark"/"poor Nikki" set-up strikes me as more than a bit sexist. 

Yes, it is sexist, but here's why.  Women in the US are still paid less than men; decades ago women were paid a hell of a lot less than men.  Up until a few decades ago, many women in the US were like Nikki, their survival depended on marrying a man who could provide for them.  That creates a system where the man, in this case Mark, holds all the cards, the situation is completely unequal, that's why I feel more for Nikki.

Edited November 27, 2015 by Neurochick

[LillysPad]

Mark will always play the 'poor me" card.

If they marry, he will find a way to turn it around so that others will feel sad for him. Even his daughter said he was a strange person, That says a lot when your own flesh and blood can say that.

If they marry, maybe the ex will help her escape too. ;)

[Miss Chevious]

I'm just catching up with is episode but the first thing that hit me was wow how much time as passed? Elise's hair had a majorly grown out roots problem. That looked to me like at least three months worth of dark roots! Either they filmed her later or it should be almost wedding time, judging from her hair.

Mark and Nikki's relationship is like that one big item you wanted for Christmas, waited weeks to get and when you finally did, it wasn't as great as you thought it would be. Nikki thought she was getting a well off sugar daddy to lavish her with love and attention. Never mind that he was old, that was the trade off for her to get to America. Instead she got a domineering creep determined to make her over into first wife 2.0. Now she's stuck with the "Specimen". Mark wanted some pretty young thing to fawn over him, be available for sunrise services and be willing to be the first wife he never had. Now he's stuck with a petulant teenager who isn't as malleable as he thought. Her best move would be to do a Mohammed. That is, stick with your partner no matter how loathsome they are long enough to get the green card then beat it. Hopefully she can find someone without a whistle.

Poor Kyle. He doesn't want contact with his family, is uncomfortable just talking about them. Those producers gotta manufacture the drama somehow.

Ditto the drama with Fernando's mom and Carolina. I can't help but wonder if they're making a lot of this up. Same with Aleksandra/Josh's family.

Thank goodness we didn't see too much of Loren and Melanie. Their prospective grooms are in for a rough ride.

Edited November 28, 2015 by cooksdelight

[WhoAmIReally]

I'm just catching up with is episode but the first thing that hit me was wow how much time as passed? Elise's hair had a majorly grown out roots problem. That looked to me like at least three months worth of dark roots! Either they filmed her later or it should be almost wedding time, judging from her hair.

She had about the same amount of roots showing when she met Nikki, it just wasn't as noticeable because her hair was blown straight and forward.  I noticed it then and shook my head.  Shook my head!  Some noticeable roots are cool; hers were not.  Hopefully this means she's going to grow it out to its natural color and give it a rest.  It must be fried. 

 

I forgot to mention this earlier, but I was absolutely appalled when Nikki told Mark "Shut up!" in the car.  It was not said in a joking way--it was really nasty.  I was brought up to believe that saying that to an adult (when you were a kid or when you were an adult) was inexcusable.  It meant you had no respect for the person and were dimissing them in the rudest way possible.  As an adult, I would never say it to a partner or allow them to say it to me.  It may be a little thing, but it shows a lot about how much you value the person you say it to.  Mark should have shut up on his own, of course, but her saying it was not cool.  If Mark told her to shut up, can you imagine the ruckus it would raise on here? 

 

Also, if I was Elise, I might have another little talk with my father about how Nikki's just here to use him after hearing how she considers her dad a weirdo.  Again, she's showing contempt for the person she's supposed to be "in love" with.  Right, we know he's a weirdo, but if someone who was going to marry my father said that in front of me, I would be plenty pissed.  But I guess Elise has already warned him in the first episode, and Mark seemed oblivious. 

 

God help those losers.

Edited November 29, 2015 by WhoAmIReally

[millennium]

Yes, it is sexist, but here's why.  Women in the US are still paid less than men; decades ago women were paid a hell of a lot less than men.  Up until a few decades ago, many women in the US were like Nikki, their survival depended on marrying a man who could provide for them.  That creates a system where the man, in this case Mark, holds all the cards, the situation is completely unequal, that's why I feel more for Nikki.

 

Nikki's survival doesn't depend on Mark.   There's a whole country full of people in the Philippines who aren't 19 and female and exploiting it to snag a depraved sucker from the United States, and they all survive somehow.

 

Nikki elected to throw in with Mark, not for survival but for an express upgrade to her quality of life.

 

I have a couple friends who married their husbands not because they loved them but because they had bright, wealthy futures.   Today those friends aren't what I would call happy, but they are very, very comfortable.    Beautiful homes, the nicest cars, they have lifestyles I can only dream of.   But they still complain about how their Mark doesn't understand what's important to them and how lonely that makes them feel, or how he only cares about his work or spending time with his friends or they worry that his eye is straying.   I listen politely but I can't muster the least bit of sympathy for them.   They traded their souls for creature comforts.

 

Nikki did the same.   She didn't have to.  She could have stayed with her family and friends in the Philippines and carved out a  life for herself like everyone else there.   No, it wouldn't have been the same quality of life many enjoy here in the United States but maybe she could have found someone to love for honest reasons.   Someone who'd love her back and would want to have children with her.

 

But Nikki sold her future to Mark, and how she's reaping what she sowed.    At least she still has the option to get out, go home, and start over.  Whether she will remains to be seen.  

 

My guess would be no.   Given her behavior in the car, on the beach and in that restaurant, it's my feeling that ol' Mark is going to have his hands full very soon.   Nikki may seem like the underdog now, but just give her time.   She's going to eat him alive.

Edited November 29, 2015 by millennium

[still hoping]

ITA millennium! I think Nikki has little ambition, and quickly "settled" on Mark. I think she probably envisioned a better lifestyle of course.

 

I really wonder if they will go through with this, neither one seems happy. Skyping is different from real life. They may deserve each other.

~~~~~~

Melanie is so delusional about having a big wedding, More and more I think she is "in love with love" and "in lust with Devar" but nothing real or long lasting there. I think she is excited to be the center of attention, the daring woman who found love on a beach and now has her fantasy wedding. Delusional.

 

~~~~~~~~~~~

It is simply painful for me to watch Alexandria and Josh. His family was a little better this time but ...ewww...something not right.  I fear that Alexandria is playing out some self hatred and guilt trip...maybe she feels she was "bad"? I truly wonder who or what happened in Prague to make her feel like this, she was ripe for Josh to "convert". I think he also plays into her being "bad"..he forgives her..how noble

~~~~~~~~~

I saw some "spark" between Fernando and Carolina in the car when he was teasing her to say "here for green card". I guess I am always the contrary thinker but I don't find him totally repulsive, I think he seems pretty intelligent and he may have a snarky sarcastic humor going on.

He is not ugly and yeah he is overweight but he could improve. I find it funny that people tip toe around saying anything about women on tv..the so called "plus size" winner of Project runway who I personally thought was gross...but it is ok to say it bout a guy. (I am a woman)

I think they may really "make it".

 

And of course I am all team Noon and Kyle - that is the love story 

Edited November 29, 2015 by still hoping

[Neurochick]

I have a couple friends who married their husbands not because they loved them but because they had bright, wealthy futures.   Today those friends aren't what I would call happy, but they are very, very comfortable.    Beautiful homes, the nicest cars, they have lifestyles I can only dream of.   But they still complain about how their Mark doesn't understand what's important to them and how lonely that makes them feel, or how he only cares about his work or spending time with his friends or they worry that his eye is straying.   I listen politely but I can't muster the least bit of sympathy for them.   They traded their souls for creature comforts.

 

 

The bolded words prove my point.  Men still make more than women.  So women, many times are in a position where they feel they have to get married to men to have a bright financial future.  I would feel sorry for those women just because we don't live in a society where ALL men and women who do the same job, make the same salary.  

[BradandJanet]

I hope Nikki goes to school and prepares herself for a career. Of all the people on the show this season, she's going to be the one who needs it most. 

Edited November 29, 2015 by BradandJanet

[millennium]

The bolded words prove my point.  Men still make more than women.  So women, many times are in a position where they feel they have to get married to men to have a bright financial future.  I would feel sorry for those women just because we don't live in a society where ALL men and women who do the same job, make the same salary.  

 

The women I was speaking of had professional careers of their own and would have been able to support themselves rather well, even if they never got married.    But it wouldn't have been enough either financially or socially to put them in the circles where they wanted to be.    Also, after they got married, they abandoned their careers to become housewives.

Edited November 29, 2015 by millennium