S10.E18: Satan Loves Confusion

[Former Nun]

I don't think the shorter hours were a factor when Briana started school.  For the most part, its young women graduating from high school choosing the career out of a sense of wanting to help--I don't think stability and flexibility enter a teenager's mind.

[SheTalksShit]

I think it's actually reasonable that Brianna is so suspicious of Brooks and angry about her mother's relationship with him.

 

In previous posts I've been somewhat harsh on Brianna and said she's a grown woman and Vicki has the right to date whoever she pleases and even move her boyfriend into her house if she chooses. I still believe this. However, if my mother were dating a man with no job, car, bank account, teeth, values, character, or reputation and who was a proven liar with outstanding child-support debt, I would not like the guy and would be angry that my mother -- who had recently given up a substantial sum in a difficult divorce from her second husband -- was dating said guy. And I would not want my children to get the idea that he was their "grandfather" or to form any sort of relationship with him. Brianna sees her mother's vulnerability and thinks that Brooks has exploited that huge weakness to gain a nice home and a very good repair and maintenance lifestyle. Then the guy said some nasty things and further antagonized her. I really can't blame her for being upset, still. She may be right that Vicki is losing everyone over this fool.

 

For me, the most telling thing is that Vicki never married the guy who was "the love of her life" [whisper] and allegedly has cancer [/whisper].  The one smart thing she did in the relationship.

I think that's what sparks Brianna's CONCERN, but what sparks her ANGER, imo, is the fact that her mother is w/a man who told her husband to start hitting her. 

 

Brianna's husband is no prize, either, but that's neither here nor there, I suppose. 

[Htm222]

I totally disagree. Brianna was like 40 years old at 18 and wanted to get married. A lot of women pick nursing and education majors precisely because they are more conducive to family life

[SheTalksShit]

K, as much as I want to believe Brooks on his cancer, things simply aren't adding up. He told Megan on Twitter that he will never provide her w/his medical records because they're private and he doesn't believe she's sincerely concerned, yet he was fine with providing what he claims is his PET scan to the world? He sent Megan a cease and desist letter and she's scoffed it off, so if they actually DO go to court (which I doubt they will, at this point, since he'd actually have to prove he did actually have cancer) he'd surely have to provide those medical records. And despite the fact that she's scoffed at his lawsuit and continues to discuss her belief that he does not have cancer, there's been no talk from him about taking further action, which I find odd. A man whose broke and desperate for cash isn't suing? And a man with cancer (which I'm sure costs a fortune in medical bills) breaks up with his wealthy girlfriend of 4 years? And yes, he's the one who broke up w/her, according to Tamra and I believe her because I don't believe Vicki would ever dump him and Vicki hates to be alone. Bottom line is, it doesn't make sense! It doesn't add up. 

 

Unless he provides proof in his medical records, I simply don't believe it. 

Edited October 7, 2015 by SheTalksShit

[Miss February]

Thank you both for bringing this up, as I have a question regarding Tamra and her new found faith and others views on it....

Isn't someone's finding a particular path and in this case, Christ, be a good thing that shouldn't be dismissed so fast and with seeming prejudice? Everyone travels a different path, who am I to say that she isn't sincere?  In her way, she might be.

I hope that I am not offending anyone. I really am just curious as I'm not a Christian. (if that matters).

 

I agree with this.  And, even though it kind of seems that Tamra is confusing Christianity with therapy, her conversion still seems sincere to me.  I'm greatly irritated and somewhat doubtful, however, at Vicki's professions of faith.

Edited October 7, 2015 by Miss February

[RedheadZombie]

OK, I can't be the only one who caught this. Brianna describes Vicki's home thusly: "Since Brooks moved into the house with my mom, it feels heavy and uncomfortable. And there's just a - kind of a nasty feeling when you walk through the door". Paranormal fans out there - heavy/uncomfortable/nasty feeling when you walk in. We're talking classic signs of a demonic presence. Good one Brianna.

[RedheadZombie]

And don't forget David's warning to the girls that fingers up the butt should never happen. NEVER.

Is that what he meant? I swear to God, I thought he was telling the girls that unlike Tamara, mommy doesn't allow anal. Shannon followed David's statement with - "never".

I adored Shannon's horse story, but what the hell do you do with the horse while you're in the store? She's 51 not 151, there couldn't have been hitching posts on Main Street.

I was confused when David called Sophie "Sophia". Does he not know his daughter's name? I've never heard Shannon call her anything but Sophie. And David better get the shot gun out. Sophie is a thirteen year old who looks like a college student, and Stella is ten going on thirty.

[Ubiquitous]

Am I mistaken, but when they do baptisms, doesn't the church provide a cheap(?) simple tunic for your dunking so you don't mess up your dress-up clothes?

[PhilMarlowe2]

Saint Heather is wonderful for not telling anyone about David's affair. She continued to treat Shannon like garbage all last season knowing this , to the point of kicking her out of her house, constantly telling Shannon not to yell at her, and having that huge fight with Shannon and David at one of those dinner's from hell. You know, the dinner where Terry was demeaning David for being in the construction business and calling him a "penis". And Heather just sat there and let him go on and on.....Yes, Heather is such a lovely person and so full of compassion. I don't believe for one minute that she didn't tell Terry about David's affair. 

 

Thank you! Heather and Tamra trying to retcon last season in light of this new information is laughable. Regardless of whether Heather knew of this affair or not, Heather was horrible to her last season. I mean, even the brief flashback they showed - Tamra proclaiming, "Shannon's marriage is in shambles, she drinks way too much and she's a sad soul," while Heather solemnly nods, "I agree!"- is enough to remind that their behavior was inexcusable.

[AnnaMayWong]

Oh yes, I agree totally with everything you said. I hope what I said about Brianna didn't come off as some kind of a defense of Brooks. I think they're all equally awful. It's one of those rare situations where no one is right.

If I'm going to side with anyone on this issue it's Vicki even though it causes me physical pain to do so. She's always kept her relationship with Brooks very seperate from her relationship with Brianna. She's never demanded that Brianna have her kids around Brooks or stay in the same house as Brooks or anything like that. While I dislike Brooks as much as anyone where Brianna really loses me is where she takes Vicki's relationship with Brooks personally. It has nothing to do with her. It's not about her. Her mother was willing to have him stay in a hotel when she came to visit for cripes sake. I think Brianna has legitimate reasons to dislike Brooks and not want her Vicki to be in a relationship with him but to me all of her whining never sounds like concern to me. To me it just sounds like she's bitching and moaning about how hurt SHE is and how sad SHE is and how ANGRY she is and it all sounds so very self centered.

Everyone is so terrible in this stupid relationship. The only smart one is the son who would rather look at the menu than talk to Vicki.

BravA/BravO !!

[CreamedPeas]

This episode bummed me out. I don't know why I watch the OC housewives. There is so little I like about it anymore. Shannon has always been my favorite and she annoyed the hell out of me tonight. I thought the colonic thing wasn't funny and she was trying to act stupid about it and she just looked well, stupid. She's always funny and tonight she was acting like trashy Tamara and when she kept saying how Heather and Tamara are her friends was ridiculous. I thought she was the smart one who saw through Heathers self promoting, fake, leech bleeding, know it all shit. And Tamara's white trash, lying, bad acting, attention screaming shit. I'll watch the finale but don't care that its over. When NJ (before all the cast changes last season) and NY housewives end, it bums me out. Not the OC anymore. I've never watched Atlanta. Do you guys like that one? I love my junk food TV....but this one, I'm done with.

PS. I will still come here to read your remarks. You guys crack me up!! (I'm from Kansas. We say, "you guys".)

[ScoobieDoobs]

I like to think we enjoy equal-opportunity snark here. When Housewives or their spouses slaughter grammar, it's worthy of a few snide remarks. I mean, really, does David think saying, "Shannon and I's relationship" is correct? It even sounds ridiculous! And while this particular example was on WWHL, I've heard Tamra say "I's" about a dozen times over the years. Grates on my ears every time.

 

 

Hey, I'm not big on correcting anyone's grammar, but I haven't heard anything this blaring since Gretch was on.  Well, a few eps ago, Tams said to Shannon & Heather she wanted to get "you guys's" opinions/feedback on something.  Oh, but I expect Tams to speak like a moron -- because she's uneducated & she is a moron.  But I thought David was educated.  I thought he may even have a graduate degree.  Yikers, when I heard him say "Shannon & I's relationship", it reminded me of Gretch.  Sniff, it almost made me miss her.  Not really, but almost.

Edited October 7, 2015 by ScoobieDoobs

[ScoobieDoobs]

I still have a hard time trying to figure out how Briana could not accept the apology and the drunken statement for what it was.  I thought Ryan threatening to throw  out 64 year old Judy was far more abusive and Briana gave her husband a total pass and in fact made excuses and refused to apologize for his idiotic behavior.

 

There are just so many inconsistencies with Briana-how is it her mother's family who does not like Brooks, as she claims,  is visiting as soon as she leaves, with Brooks in the house?  How is it she loved seeing her father when he came out for her high school graduation and in six years she would not have him at the wedding and now claims some sort of mistreatment?  Briana might do well to polish up on her Christian high school and college education and look to forgiveness instead of condemnation.

 

And what about Michael saying a few eps back, how he has no probs with Brooks & he thinks Briana is just being "weird"?  Hey, I don't blame Briana for not liking or trusting Brooks.  He's a con artist & a penniless, unemployed bum.  Would anyone be especially surprised if he is faking cancer, just to get sympathy (from viewers, NOT Vicks) & justify not having a job?  Eh, Michael's opinion on Brooks doesn't impress me much.  He should be more concerned & protective of his mother -- yeah, even if it is Vicks.

 

But Briana is going overboard with the Brooks hate.  I get why she doesn't want her kids having any involvement with Brooks.  But I suspect she's being egged on by raging Ryan, the fugly nutcase.  I wouldn't be surprised if he's the cause of her going on endlessly about Brooks whenever she's on cam now.

 

I can't blame Briana for discussing the weight gain because they show flashbacks & it's unfortunately very noticeable. She used to be much thinner in the early seasons.  Are the producers showing the flashbacks of Briana when she was much thinner to highlight her weight gain?  Pretty cruel, Satan Andy, if that's what you're doing.

Edited October 7, 2015 by ScoobieDoobs

[AnnaMayWong]

Being a nurse does not preclude shallowness nor a sense of entitlement. That is based on character regardless of upbringing or job/career choice. ANY job/career contains such individuals.

It is wonderful that Brianna completed University.

It is wonderful that Brianna works in Hospital.

Brianna is no monster.

Brianna is spoiled.

Brianna is pampered.

Brianna is arrogant.

She virtually always had access to a certain escalated level of living. Presently, THAT LEVEL IS BOLSTERED BY VICKI in varying ways. Not that there is anything wrong with a parent proffering help, especially, if said child shows initiative in general drive and acts, academics, jobs,...which Brianna has shown.

It's very easy to claim that you don't particularly care for the extra extraS, tangible and intangible, when you actually have it. However, all of those little taken for granted 'don't needs-don't wants' are viewed differently when absent.

Furthermore, Brianna, an adult, has CHOSEN to participate on this program. A program within an umbrella franchise that has birthed massive cottage industry media. The existence of which relies on extreme commentary, ruthless snark, thorough privacy invasion, and, at times, outright lies. She has to deal just as everyone else does.

Brianna has not simply delved into her mom's semi- 'personal' business, she has dived and immersed herself into it, PUBLICLY. She has exhibited a fervent and very vocal willingness to air personal' business just as Vicki and many others have done. That does not mean that she is a vicious virago or a maniacal maven. But, it does mean that she is a Fame'ho'--in the making.

*

Edited October 7, 2015 by BookElitist

[AnnaMayWong]

...And, if Ryan Vieth can be dissected and discussed--a child reared to realize that his poor pitiful and sad cry for mommy was both pointless and meaningless, then, surely, with her stabler and rather doting family, Brianna's actions should be just as closely scrutinized.

Ryan AND Brianna are BOTH adults.

In addition, they are BOTH adults with health afflictions. (Yes, I know that Ryan bears the onus of inflicting his.) On this forum, Ryan has been held accountable for many many a misdeed and deplorable acts. So, as both are adults, if Ryan can be held responsible for the near entirety of his actions, then so can Brianna.

*

Edited October 7, 2015 by BookElitist

[AnnaMayWong]

OK, I can't be the only one who caught this. Brianna describes Vicki's home thusly: "Since Brooks moved into the house with my mom, it feels heavy and uncomfortable. And there's just a - kind of a nasty feeling when you walk through the door". Paranormal fans out there - heavy/uncomfortable/nasty feeling when you walk in. We're talking classic signs of a demonic presence. Good one Brianna.

There very well may be the tainted miasma of a demonic presence, if Tamra has recently 'walked through'.

[imjagain]

Thank you both for bringing this up, as I have a question regarding Tamra and her new found faith and others views on it....

Isn't someone's finding a particular path and in this case, Christ, be a good thing that shouldn't be dismissed so fast and with seeming prejudice? Everyone travels a different path, who am I to say that she isn't sincere? In her way, she might be.

I hope that I am not offending anyone. I really am just curious as I'm not a Christian. (if that matters).

Thank you for sharing your POV. I can see what your saying.

[SheTalksShit]

And what about Michael saying a few eps back, how he has no probs with Brooks & he thinks Briana is just being "weird"?  Hey, I don't blame Briana for not liking or trusting Brooks.  He's a con artist & a penniless, unemployed bum.  Would anyone be especially surprised if he is faking cancer, just to get sympathy (from viewers, NOT Vicks) & justify not having a job?  Eh, Michael's opinion on Brooks doesn't impress me much.  He should be more concerned & protective of his mother -- yeah, even if it is Vicks.

 

But Briana is going overboard with the Brooks hate.  I get why she doesn't want her kids having any involvement with Brooks.  But I suspect she's being egged on by raging Ryan, the fugly nutcase.  I wouldn't be surprised if he's the cause of her going on endlessly about Brooks whenever she's on cam now.

 

I can't blame Briana for discussing the weight gain because they show flashbacks & it's unfortunately very noticeable. She used to be much thinner in the early seasons.  Are the producers showing the flashbacks of Briana when she was much thinner to highlight her weight gain?  Pretty cruel, Satan Andy, if that's what you're doing.

Where/when did Briana discuss her weight? 

[Booger666]

"l understand that Brianna doesn't like Brooks, and yes she has reasons to feel that way. She can like or dislike whoever she wants My issue is that she never shuts up about it. She's stated her case over & over again, and at some point (way before now) she should just stop."

I respectfully disagree. I believe Vicki is the one who makes it an issue because, as others pointed out, Vicki acted like she accepted Briana's decision not to have a relationship with Brooks to get Bri to move into her house, but then after Bri moved in Vicki kept trying to get Bri to change her mind. Early on in the relationship Vicki was the one who kept going on about how she brought it up and couldn't get Bri to change her mind. And, then Vicki tries to get others to bet Bri to change her mind. Vicki doesn't listen to or respect other peoples opinions, she just keeps harping on to get her way. If Vicki didn't talk about it Bri might not either. Hopefully Vicki, Bri and Brooks are gone for good and we'll never know.

Does anyone else remember this: At one of the earlier reunions where Vicki and Bri were really going at it over Brooks it kept escalating until Bri says something like "I know what he's done to you". Like there was something really nasty he did and my first thought was some type of abuse, but it could be that he cheated on Vicki or stole from her. And Vicki, who shrieks over everyone in a fight stopped stone cold and just looked at Bri. It was like she couldn't reply because it was true. I may not be remembering it correctly, but I was always under the impression that Bri didn't like Brooks at first because it started as an affair, but it crossed over into anger because of something Brooks did to Vicki.

Regarding all the questions about doesn't Shannon have gloves? I'm sure she does. When I pick up the dog poop with gloves I still double wash my hands after.

[Beden]

 

I adored Shannon's horse story, but what the hell do you do with the horse while you're in the store? She's 51 not 151, there couldn't have been hitching posts on Main Street.

Well, actually, depending on where she grew up, they might have hitching posts on Main Street. I've tied a horse to a parking meter on occasion--putting a quarter in the meter, of course.  And there is usually a convenient tree or bench around if necessary.

[IKnowRight]

I hope he shook Terry's hand.

Bahahaha! I was actually thinking...I can't even imagine the places where Eddie's hands have been!!

[Yours Truly]

*Heather and Terry are repulsive if they behaved with such calculated, cool, and supercilious precision toward a woman that they knew was being humiliated. Heather, especially, behaved in a strangely jealous and vindictive manner to someone who had done exactly what(?) to her.

*

See THIS! I don't get this. So Heather gets kudos because there was ONE rumour she didn't repeat but instead shared personal inside true information about Shannon to strangers at a table that was gossiping about Shannon? That's better? I mean David having an affair is true but at the time it was still rumored not some actual fact that Heather and Tamara had absolute proof off so giving them kudos for not sharing information they couldn't possibly know was absolutely true at the time is cucko kado to me. WOW!

[Duke2801]

Did I miss an episode where Brooks backtracked on his cancer in a conversation with Shannon?

 

....no?  I never said or implied that.  I'm doing what every single one of us on this thread is doing - speculating. 

 

But Brooks didn't go to her doctor! How dare he! Personally I don't believe any of them, not Brooks, not Vicki, not Brianna, not any of the other women

 

 

I know she was miffed about that. But she still doesn't strike me as the type who would change her mind about something unless she had good reason to. 

[motorcitymom65]

See THIS! I don't get this. So Heather gets kudos because there was ONE rumour she didn't repeat but instead shared personal inside true information about Shannon to strangers at a table that was gossiping about Shannon? That's better? I mean David having an affair is true but at the time it was still rumored not some actual fact that Heather and Tamara had absolute proof off so giving them kudos for not sharing information they couldn't possibly know was absolutely true at the time is cucko kado to me. WOW!

Heather didn't share any personal inside true information. She was at a table talking about the text (or note, I cannot even remember which now) that David had sent. The note that she knew Shannon had already talked about on camera with Tamra. It wasn't a big secret. Heather has aplogized for talking about it, but said that since it had already been remarked on by Shannon it was hardly a secret. Shannon also talked about the text - to the audience - before that lunch when she went to the doctor about her heart issue. She talked all about it in her TH interview. She was telling us about it herself, so I am not sure how it could have possibly been any big secret. Should Heather have talked - of course not. She has said as much. It is hardly anywhere near telling people about an affair that she apparently knew for a fact was going on.

[Yours Truly]

How about the word of somebody who actually liked Brooks and had absolutely nothing to gain by doubting his cancer story.

 

Because that would be Shannon. Or is she an unreliable source too? 

They are all unreliable because everyone takes what they want from different conversations and present it in whatever context they processed it in. Different people take in information differently and then retell that information differently and no one knows what the daily details, decisions, CHANGES of decisions, etc. etc. Brooks has made so for a bunch of people to gather round and piece together bits and pieces of information, some more genuine (Shannon) than others (Brianna) and think they have a pretty good and acurate gist of anything to the extent that they can point fingers and OFFICIALLY claim any wrong doing doesn't wash for me. It isn't about thinking Brooks isn't lying, it's about how disgusted I am at how, what is no where near clear cut proof, is presented as some absolute smoking gun. Hey, I'm all about doubts. I'm all about keeping distance based on small amounts of bad vibes in the air. Have opinions til the cows come home and base personal decision on that "not quite right" feeling. Hell, go ahead and believe whatever with whatever information is out there but I don't approve of witchhunts and I don't approve of blantant invasions. (Please no talk of who shared what on a reality show). Being on a reality show is not some all encompassed excuse to do whatever the hell you feel like doing to another cast member. The end.

 

This "investigation" has been so messy and conducted with such malice. There's so much stuff that isn't substantial but they gloss over a lot of the gaps in their own "revelations" with the small amount of semi-credibal details, not information, just off details that would cause legitamate doubt however the details that DO hold SOME weight is few and far between AND the messengers of some of these suppossedly relevant details are HIGHLY questionable. No, it's not that I'm a Brooks fan or a Vicki fan it's that the "evidence" against Brooks presented this season is an insult to my intelligence. I can't jump on that train just because this that and the other about Brooks.  I haven't been convinced and considering the hot mess game of "Cancer Telephone" that has occurred this season I'm deciding to cast a vote of not guilty in the court of public opinion based on not enough hard core evidence. Court adjourned.

Edited October 7, 2015 by Yours Truly

[pamme64]

Indeed.  

 

But I couldn't help but think:  So, last year Heather pretty much knew David was fucking around on Shannon and she was *still* a raving bitch towards her? You would think she could garner up some empathy towards Shannon instead of kicking her out.  That makes what happened that much worse to me.

 

It would, however, explain a little more about why Terry was so upset with David and his comments to Heather and his sort of delayed reaction.  She told him, he thinks back to his comments, and thinks David is a womanizing lothario.

Instead of raving bitch, maybe look at it as Heather freaking out as to how to handle the situation as she just found out about David's indiscretion.  Heather wasn't going to tell Shannon anything, but there she, in her home and upset,.... and she panicked.  

Better to be a raving bitch then to destroy someone like she could have.  I think Heather also mentioned that she did not tell Terry what she heard until very recently, so Terry calling him a penis was all on them (david and terry).

Of course, just my perspective.... 

[pamme64]

I am one who thought Shannon stole the episode with her antics. And it showed a side of David that he could be appealing. But I wonder if he would have been so helpful, prioir to affair and exposure. I doubt it.

Brianna has never lived in an average setting, or not for many years. She goes from one expensive house to another. That seems like too much house for a young military guy, but don't lets argue it, I know some make more moemy, etc etc....jist seems unnecessary, I guess is my point. Wonder if his work peers live in similar houses.

 

And now I'm wondering what some of you consider 'average' for a home.  We all come from different walks of life, we all have our own average, mine is that I don't find Vicki's home or Briana's to be a big deal or that expensive when I take some factor's into consideration. (location, tax base for the county, property value, income based on location).  Stuff like that. 

[zoeysmom]

Where/when did Briana discuss her weight? 

Never.  There is a built in excuse factory working overtime claiming her weight gain is a result of thyroid issues.  Briana hasn't said it.  Just as many people who struggle with weight gain post thyroid surgery also enjoy some weight loss due to synthetic thyroid.  Nor has she said she takes medication that causes it.  I believe Briana is overweight because she consumes more calories than she burns off.  She lost weight after the first baby and it looks like she has trimmed down a bit for the Reunion.  Briana, is a nurse, as she is fond of reminding us, if her excessive weight was due to a medical condition she would let us know  or at the very lest her mother would.  There may come a time it is a priority but right now it seems she enjoys eating and drinking alcoholic beverages.  Just as Briana is a nurse who works at two different hospitals-she doesn't have two jobs that make it sound as if she is working excessively.

 

On a side note in the world of delving into these folks medical conditions-Ryan with his "major back surgery" and short time later travelling and picking up his children.  Was it really major? Or was it just back surgery? I mean the guy was in a bad way the day Vicki left and 10 days later he is enjoying the good life in the OC.    

[pamme64]

I agree with this.  And, even though it kind of seems that Tamra is confusing Christianity with therapy, her conversion still seems sincere to me.  I'm greatly irritated and somewhat doubtful, however, at Vicki's professions of faith.

Point taken! Vicki does seem to be grasping at straws with her declaration's of 'it's Satan's work'.  All these years and now she's bringing up Satan? It does seem a bit contrived.

[freeradical]

What's interesting is I listened Howard Stern interview the comedian guy (Steve Rannazzisi) who lied about being in WTC on 9/11. He gave an interview today apologizing and trying to explain that he did it on some level to think it would make people include and notice him.

Then I watched this episode of the OC and Brianna drops that Brooks turned pancreatitis into cancer, then backtracked when pressed.

These both made me really feel like Brooks for his own reasons dredged up past diagnoses to put himself in the spotlight. And it's too late to turn back.

Examples... Brian Williams, the lady who helped the Dannamora prison escapees in NY, sometimes something small turns into a point of no return. Maybe Brooks was afraid Vicki would throw him out and used cancer with her, one person, out of desperation and it got a new life of its own.

People Lie. They do. For deep dark reasons of need. And maybe he's one of them .

Hey Now! This is the reason, however unbelievable, some people could or would do this. HIPPA will be the ultimate card for him to play. It's a disorder. Hey Now!

[Cherrio]

Ya know, I see a lot of criticism of Brianna and I do understand some of it....but here we have a child who grew up fairly privileged with a dysfunctional family:  Divorce, step parent, a mother who is dysfunctional to say the least, being part of a reality show, the break up of a relationship she seemed to really care about but we still have this person who decided to become a nurse.  So, whatever one has to say about Brianna, her shallowness at times about hating OK and being happy to be in the OC so she can get her nails and hair done, she's still an active nurse.  A profession her mother was totally against.  Remember that scene?  So what I'm saying is that being a nurse is one tough job.  Not one that a shallow spoiled rich kid is going to choose....unless there's something else there.  I give her full credit for that and she has stuck with it.  And I give her a pass about a lot of things that seem shallow to others.  She could have worked for her mother but instead she went for something that is one tough career - an emergency room nurse.  Something I wouldn't want to do as a career in a million years.

 

Why she chose to marry Ryan?  I think it was more about need than want.  Her comments about the family home?  I think that is what she has been 'taught'.  And I get it to a certain extent.  I also get that she defends her husband because she 'needs' him and I also get why she is so against Brooks because she sees something that is not totally ok.  Yeah, she's screwed up to a certain extent but I also understand why. She has her medical issues and how her selfish mother dealt with it.  It's about Vicki, not Brianna.  But she can't detach herself like Michael from her mother because she is her 'mother'.

 

Bottom line - Brianna is screwed up but she also has, and I can't think of the right word, a certain determination and lack of spoiled shallowness given her career.     

I agree with your post and also Wirewraps.     

         I have already posted that I think Brianna's "behavior" comes from a place of concern for her mother.    I don't think she would have a problem with a man living with her mother if he was reputable, employed and has a good background.  Heck, I think both Brianna and her brother would welcome it because it would lessen the crap Vicki heaps on them.   Not that I think that will happen because what normal man would put up with Vicki?

                  So, this treatment of Vicki by Brianna and Ryan comes from years of putting up with VIcki.    There are consequences to the way she behaves, manipulates and lies.

                   Along with telling Ryan to beat his wife, Brooks also called Vicki a whore and said he was going to beat her ass the next time he saw her.

                    I would never accept that for my mother. 

                    I give Brianna a lot of credit for not enabling this sick and twisted relationship.

[Yours Truly]

Ya know, I see a lot of criticism of Brianna and I do understand some of it....but here we have a child who grew up fairly privileged with a dysfunctional family:  Divorce, step parent, a mother who is dysfunctional to say the least, being part of a reality show, the break up of a relationship she seemed to really care about but we still have this person who decided to become a nurse.  So, whatever one has to say about Brianna, her shallowness at times about hating OK and being happy to be in the OC so she can get her nails and hair done, she's still an active nurse.  A profession her mother was totally against.  Remember that scene?  So what I'm saying is that being a nurse is one tough job.  Not one that a shallow spoiled rich kid is going to choose....unless there's something else there.  I give her full credit for that and she has stuck with it.  And I give her a pass about a lot of things that seem shallow to others.  She could have worked for her mother but instead she went for something that is one tough career - an emergency room nurse.  Something I wouldn't want to do as a career in a million years.

 

Why she chose to marry Ryan?  I think it was more about need than want.  Her comments about the family home?  I think that is what she has been 'taught'.  And I get it to a certain extent.  I also get that she defends her husband because she 'needs' him and I also get why she is so against Brooks because she sees something that is not totally ok.  Yeah, she's screwed up to a certain extent but I also understand why. She has her medical issues and how her selfish mother dealt with it.  It's about Vicki, not Brianna.  But she can't detach herself like Michael from her mother because she is her 'mother'.

 

Bottom line - Brianna is screwed up but she also has, and I can't think of the right word, a certain determination and lack of spoiled shallowness given her career.     

Just remember nurses aren't saints and just with every profession there are bad apples. I'm not saying it's not commendable that Brianna is a nurse. It absolutely is but that also depends on what kind of nurse she is. There are plenty of "just doing my job", "overwhelmed and eyerolling" nurses out there so I'm not going to go as far as assuming she's "one heck of a gal" just cause she wears scrubs. I say this to just balance out logic not cause I'm trying to bash Brianna. Just something to keep in mind is all.

Eh, I have met some pretty horrible people who are nurses. A lot of people pick it because it is a relatively flexible and stable career that pays well for the total number of hours worked, which often does not exceed 30 or 40. It is a hard job but it isn't like only saints go into nursing or healthcare careers in general. I do think she works hard but she is still an annoying camera presence. And she didn't 'need' to marry anyone. She seems like an emotionally volatile, insecure person (at that time anyway) who latched onto the first person who paid attention.

You beat me to it.

[pamme64]

K, as much as I want to believe Brooks on his cancer, things simply aren't adding up. He told Megan on Twitter 

 

That stopped me cold! He used Twitter.....  just like the big boys do when they're going to start a legal battle? Lol, Brooks still providing the laughs.  

[Freckledbruh]

Point taken! Vicki does seem to be grasping at straws with her declaration's of 'it's Satan's work'.  All these years and now she's bringing up Satan? It does seem a bit contrived.

Vicki used to spout religious stuff in the first few seasons (and being hypocritical about it of course) so I don't see it as anything new.

[freeradical]

Well, actually, depending on where she grew up, they might have hitching posts on Main Street. I've tied a horse to a parking meter on occasion--putting a quarter in the meter, of course. And there is usually a convenient tree or bench around if necessary.

Funny story Beden!

I was so excited to hear her story! I grew up in Olympia, WA and we would ride our horses in to get candy, lots of candy! It was semi-rural but ahh, good times. I think some of the old Mom and Pop stores kept the hitching posts as a relic/conversation starter about how long that store had been there. You could still park your horse there though!

Edited October 7, 2015 by freeradical

[Scrambled Fog]

Briana has 2 nursing jobs.

She is an pediatric ER nurse and an adult ER nurse.

[Yours Truly]

Hey, I'm not big on correcting anyone's grammar, but I haven't heard anything this blaring since Gretch was on.  Well, a few eps ago, Tams said to Shannon & Heather she wanted to get "you guys's" opinions/feedback on something.  Oh, but I expect Tams to speak like a moron -- because she's uneducated & she is a moron.  But I thought David was educated.  I thought he may even have a graduate degree.  Yikers, when I heard him say "Shannon & I's relationship", it reminded me of Gretch.  Sniff, it almost made me miss her.  Not really, but almost.

I'm educated and I butcher the English language all the time. I don't get the big? I mean we live in a world where we have the language we officially learn in school during our childhood and then adjust it throughout our lives in real life interactions which includes a lot a slang (at least in my world). I don't know anyone that goes through their day enunciating their words with proper grammer and the like. When talking to my co workers and friends I'm comfortable and let the Imma's and dontcha's, wanna's and the like fly. When answering the phone or greeting clients, then of course, gotta be on point but speaking incorrectly is pretty much the norm and I wouldn't expect it any other way. I expect properness for someone who is giving a presentation, speech, addressing a group of people and mostly in a professional situation not while have casual conversations with other people. That would be mind numbing.

Edited October 7, 2015 by Yours Truly

[TexasGal]

Too bad David doesn't share the same sentiment as Meatloaf:  "I would do anything for love, but I won't do that." 

 

So this episode was good for something, the mystery of what Meatloaf won't do is solved.

 

Am I mistaken, but when they do baptisms, doesn't the church provide a cheap(?) simple tunic for your dunking so you don't mess up your dress-up clothes?

 

When I was baptized as a teenager, yes that was the case.  But, not sure if they would ship a robe/tunic out there to some schmancy hotel for your pool baptism.  Plus, Tamra probably wouldn't be caught dead in one.

[Yours Truly]

"l understand that Brianna doesn't like Brooks, and yes she has reasons to feel that way. She can like or dislike whoever she wants My issue is that she never shuts up about it. She's stated her case over & over again, and at some point (way before now) she should just stop."

I respectfully disagree. I believe Vicki is the one who makes it an issue because, as others pointed out, Vicki acted like she accepted Briana's decision not to have a relationship with Brooks to get Bri to move into her house, but then after Bri moved in Vicki kept trying to get Bri to change her mind. Early on in the relationship Vicki was the one who kept going on about how she brought it up and couldn't get Bri to change her mind. And, then Vicki tries to get others to bet Bri to change her mind. Vicki doesn't listen to or respect other peoples opinions, she just keeps harping on to get her way. If Vicki didn't talk about it Bri might not either. Hopefully Vicki, Bri and Brooks are gone for good and we'll never know.

Does anyone else remember this: At one of the earlier reunions where Vicki and Bri were really going at it over Brooks it kept escalating until Bri says something like "I know what he's done to you". Like there was something really nasty he did and my first thought was some type of abuse, but it could be that he cheated on Vicki or stole from her. And Vicki, who shrieks over everyone in a fight stopped stone cold and just looked at Bri. It was like she couldn't reply because it was true. I may not be remembering it correctly, but I was always under the impression that Bri didn't like Brooks at first because it started as an affair, but it crossed over into anger because of something Brooks did to Vicki.

Regarding all the questions about doesn't Shannon have gloves? I'm sure she does. When I pick up the dog poop with gloves I still double wash my hands after.

And once Vicki realized she couldn't change Brianna's mind she let it go. Brianna won't.

[freeradical]

I am as sick of hearing about Brianna's weight as I am of Cancer, and Donald Trump! Who cares! It's so shallow. It breaks my heart people spend so much time thinking and talking about someone's weight. Come on!

[Yours Truly]

Heather didn't share any personal inside true information. She was at a table talking about the text (or note, I cannot even remember which now) that David had sent. The note that she knew Shannon had already talked about on camera with Tamra. It wasn't a big secret. Heather has aplogized for talking about it, but said that since it had already been remarked on by Shannon it was hardly a secret. Shannon also talked about the text - to the audience - before that lunch when she went to the doctor about her heart issue. She talked all about it in her TH interview. She was telling us about it herself, so I am not sure how it could have possibly been any big secret. Should Heather have talked - of course not. She has said as much. It is hardly anywhere near telling people about an affair that she apparently knew for a fact was going on.

How did she know for a fact? My point is that a looooooottt of talk isn't fact. Did she walk in on David and the mistress? Also my point that it was wrong for her to include the information she received from Tamara about the email David sent to Shannon even though it was true. These women weren't talking about that email. They didn't know anything about it. Heather offered up that bit of information. That's still some inexcusible shit. A bitch tells a group of women at a table about a email my husband sent me about wanting a divorce. Huh, what? That doesn't come across as fucked up? Oh but she never told Terry about Shannon's affair? Call me crazy but I'm not giving credit to ANYBODY for keepin my name out their mouths! Point Blank Period. That's not something you should throw someone a parade for. That's just common fucking decency. Unbelievable. And what makes it even more unbelievable is the fact that Heather didn't actually succeed in keeping Shannon and David's name out of her mouth. So the gossiping is okay because the subject was just about David's request for a divorce and NOT the affair? Come on! Am I in bizarro world?

Edited October 7, 2015 by Yours Truly

[Cherrio]

They are all unreliable because everyone takes what they want from different conversations and present it in whatever context they processed it in. Different people take in information differently and then retell that information differently and no one knows what the daily details, decisions, CHANGES of decisions, etc. etc. Brooks has made so for a bunch of people to gather round and piece together bits and pieces of information, some more genuine (Shannon) than others (Brianna) and think they have a pretty good and acurate gist of anything to the extent that they can point fingers and OFFICIALLY claim any wrong doing doesn't wash for me. It isn't about thinking Brooks isn't lying, it's about how disgusted I am at how, what is no where near clear cut proof, is presented as some absolute smoking gun. Hey, I'm all about doubts. I'm all about keeping distance based on small amounts of bad vibes in the air. Have opinions til the cows come home and base personal decision on that "not quite right" feeling. Hell, go ahead and believe whatever with whatever information is out there but I don't approve of witchhunts and I don't approve of blantant invasions. (Please no talk of who shared what on a reality show). Being on a reality show is not some all encompassed excuse to do whatever the hell you feel like doing to another cast member. The end.

 

This "investigation" has been so messy and conducted with such malice. There's so much stuff that isn't substantial but they gloss over a lot of the gaps in their own "revelations" with the small amount of semi-credibal details, not information, just off details that would cause legitamate doubt however the details that DO hold SOME weight is few and far between AND the messengers of some of these suppossedly revelate details are HIGHLY questionable. No, it's not that I'm a Brooks fan or a Vicki fan it's that the "evidence" presented this season is an insult to my intelligence. I can't jump on that train just because this that and the other about Brooks.  I haven't been convinced and considering the hot mess game of "Cancer Telephone" that has occurred this season I'm deciding to cast a vote of not guilty in the court of public opinion based on not enough hard core evidence. Court adjourned.

In a real court, there is more often than not real hard core evidence as you describe.  Circumstantial evidence when put together during deliberations is what convicts someone with a beginning, middle and conclusion of evidence that has the jury deciding on a verdict of guilty.

               The evidence can present a persons background, past behavior, behavior before, during and after said incident.  Often other people will add what the defendant has said or how he acted. Examples are endless in actual trials.

           Then when put all together , using common sense and life experience a jury will convict.

             So, at this point in the "trial" of Brooks he is not doing well. The case has not concluded yet, but so far not good for him for reasons way too numerous and have already been mentioned many times here already.

[Scrambled Fog]

I'm sick of hearing about what's his name and his out of control cells.

I blame Bravo for this cockamamie storyline and the useless conversations it has fueled.

Whether or not the unregulated cell story is true, the ultimate choice to air the material, and to air it in the manner in which it has, rested witn Bravo and Bravo alone.

I wanna slap Bravo and Andy Cohen upside the head w/ a used emesis basin for that and the pimped out baptism storyline no one buys or cares about.

Edited October 7, 2015 by Scrambled Fog

[zoeysmom]

I agree with your post and also Wirewraps.     

         I have already posted that I think Brianna's "behavior" comes from a place of concern for her mother.    I don't think she would have a problem with a man living with her mother if he was reputable, employed and has a good background.  Heck, I think both Brianna and her brother would welcome it because it would lessen the crap Vicki heaps on them.   Not that I think that will happen because what normal man would put up with Vicki?

                  So, this treatment of Vicki by Brianna and Ryan comes from years of putting up with VIcki.    There are consequences to the way she behaves, manipulates and lies.

                   Along with telling Ryan to beat his wife, Brooks also called Vicki a whore and said he was going to beat her ass the next time he saw her.

                    I would never accept that for my mother. 

                    I give Brianna a lot of credit for not enabling this sick and twisted relationship.

Vicki isn't exactly a great catch. She is a serial adulterer, she is incredibly self-absorbed, she lies, she is jealous of anyone who has a husband who provides and isn't even particularly good friend.  Let's say Vicki found a working father of three-is Vicki going to devote time to his children?  Is he going to be okay with Vicki making 14 trips a year to see Briana, and her extensive travel schedule due to work.  I swear from reading Vicki's Facebook she is gone most of the time.  Florida a couple of times a year, Mexico twice a year, back to Illinois, New York and usually a European vacation thrown in plus RH travel.  Then there is the staying at the office working until 1:00 am, and of course twice yearly visits from Briana.  I see Vicki as the type that has someone her terms and schedule.  Add the fact she is over 50, certainly not a stunner and a reality star the available pool begins to dwindle.  What Briana doesn't listen to is her mother's need for companionship?  Briana still wants to be the center of her mother's world and doesn't comprehend relationships are a two way street.

 

So Briana's vitriol regarding Brooks gets old.  At some point Brooks did uproot and move to California, it was Briana saying he didn't have a job, not Vicki not Brooks, it was Vicki that wanted him to undergo cosmetic dentistry and wanted a standing ovation for it, it is Vicki that takes him to Mexico, that accompanies Brooks to Mississippi, New York and sometimes Florida. I just think Vicki's need for companionship outweighs her quality in companionship.  When I see the two of them on screen I always feel like they are schilling their latest endorsement.

[RedHawk]

I am as sick of hearing about Brianna's weight as I am of Cancer, and Donald Trump! Who cares! It's so shallow. It breaks my heart people spend so much time thinking and talking about someone's weight. Come on!

Sadly, weight is a topic that just won't die. During Andy's one-on-two chat with the Beadors, when Shannon said she wanted David to see Nicole one night when both couples were in some restaurant for "the comparison", Andy asked, "Why, did she gain weight or something?" Yes, if Nicole had gained 3 lbs Shannon would have emerged triumphant.

 

Far too many people are critical of others for being overweight and even underweight. I'm ~45 lbs overweight and very aware of the appraising/critical glances. Sigh. I do note Brianna's weight but what I also saw was that she looked very pretty at the lunch with Tamra. She was clearly enjoying a little freedom and a nice tall Bloody Mary, just as many mothers of small children do when they get a break.

Edited October 7, 2015 by RedHawk

[Cherrio]

And now I'm wondering what some of you consider 'average' for a home.  We all come from different walks of life, we all have our own average, mine is that I don't find Vicki's home or Briana's to be a big deal or that expensive when I take some factor's into consideration. (location, tax base for the county, property value, income based on location).  Stuff like that. 

As far as Vicki's home, while she may of paid a lot more money than someone would in another state for the same thing.....I also do not find it at all nice.

      In Orange County, Coto de CON-zo is not considered prime real estate. It is very inland, not near the ocean at all.   Vicki does not live anywhere near Heather who lives in Newport Beach which IS a real beach community.

         People who want more house for the money might buy in a place like Coto, because they would never be able to afford a community like Newport Beach or another beach community.

[jennylauren123]

Oh, pleeeeze, NO!!   Now, like, you know, we're veering into "colloquialism" for all the, you know, grammar that, like, people are too lazy to, you know, like, learn and use?  Next we'll hear:  David and I's relationship.   Tonight it's just going to be him and I.    Me and him are going to Cabo.   Et-thetera, like, et-thetera, you know...

 

On Watch What Happens Live, when Shannon and David were on, David DID say, "Shannon and I's relationship."

 

Bad grammar is bad grammar. Language does evolve--very slowly. For example, ending a sentence with a preposition is largely considered OK now. However, "I" and "me" are not interchangeable, no matter how many people just don't get it.

Edited October 7, 2015 by jennylauren123

[Yours Truly]

In a real court, there is more often than not real hard core evidence as you describe.  Circumstantial evidence when put together during deliberations is what convicts someone with a beginning, middle and conclusion of evidence that has the jury deciding on a verdict of guilty.

               The evidence can present a persons background, past behavior, behavior before, during and after said incident.  Often other people will add what the defendant has said or how he acted. Examples are endless in actual trials.

           Then when put all together , using common sense and life experience a jury will convict.

             So, at this point in the "trial" of Brooks he is not doing well. The case has not concluded yet, but so far not good for him for reasons way too numerous and have already been mentioned many times here already.

And the way the "evidence" is presented as well as the environment it's presented in is controlled. Also, a jury is forbidden to discuss information about the trial outside of the deliberation room as well as while the trial is still being conducted to keep from forming opinions and swaying each other before all the evidence is presented. There's also people monitoring how information is presented, whether it's relevant and whether the information gathered has any merit, whether the orgins are legit etc. etc. Common sense is actually suppossed be superceeded by actual facts. These women have speculated, theorized and pieced together this that and the other along the way forming opinions of one thing and another then taking those opionions into the next round of speculation and incomplete information gathering. Hell they could prove tomorrow that Brooks is lying and I would still feel comfortable with my stance on the lack of relevant proof presented up to this point. It isn't about protecting Brooks it's about shutting down this need to be cavalier with such a serious issue and then go about it in such a gauche, disheartening way cause ya know... JUSTICE...

 

Is proof to this degree necessary to not like Brooks or not want to deal with him? Absolutely not. But when accusations of this magnitude are lobbied around publicly and certain invasions take place in order to try and create a foundation of doubt just so you can have that much bigger of a platform to display your disdain for another person then yeah. If you're being this noisy and making my feel good show feel less good with huge declarations and accusations then Imma need more than a bunch a Nancy Drew wannabee's harping on and on and on about something they should just let go of already. It's annoying and morally corrupt, Faye Resnick style.

Edited October 7, 2015 by Yours Truly

[zoeysmom]

As far as Vicki's home, while she may of paid a lot more money than someone would in another state for the same thing.....I also do not find it at all nice.

      In Orange County, Coto de CON-zo is not considered prime real estate. It is very inland, not near the ocean at all.   Vicki does not live anywhere near Heather who lives in Newport Beach which IS a real beach community.

         People who want more house for the money might buy in a place like Coto, because they would never be able to afford a community like Newport Beach or another beach community.

Vicki paid $1.1 million back in 2001, when Briana was 14, a home she lived in for all four years before heading to college.  Vicki was unable to sell it for $2.89.  I believe at one time she and Donn wanted to sell it and bought another house at the top of the market.  Don't know if it was still a million upside down like she claimed to Brooks but some piece of property was sold after Donn and Vicki separated.  I agree about Coto-it can get very hot and you can tell by the other wives talking about driving all the way out there.  Tamra lives about 20 miles southwest of Coto, Heather and Shannon live 30 miles northwest and Meghan lives in Newport Beach.  Vicki's house is smaller, inland and she wanted  more money than Meghan and Jim paid http://www.latimes.com/business/realestate/hot-property/la-fi-hotprop-meghan-king-jim-edmonds-house-20150707-story.html.

[Duke2801]

And now I'm wondering what some of you consider 'average' for a home.  We all come from different walks of life, we all have our own average, mine is that I don't find Vicki's home or Briana's to be a big deal or that expensive when I take some factor's into consideration. (location, tax base for the county, property value, income based on location).  Stuff like that. 

 

I think it's fair to say that the majority of Americans do not live in homes as "huge, large, and grand" (per her obnoxious S3 tagline) as the Vickster's.   Or even as big as Brianna's. 

 

 

I'm educated and I butcher the English language all the time. I don't get the big? I mean we live in a world where we have the language we officially learn in school during our childhood and then adjust it throughout our lives in real life interactions which includes a lot a slang (at least in my world). I don't know anyone that goes through their day enunciating their words with proper grammer and the like. When talking to my co workers and friends I'm comfortable and let the Imma's and dontcha's, wanna's and the like. When answering the phone or greeting clients, then of course, gotta be on point but speaking incorrectly is pretty much the norm and I wouldn't expect it any other way. I expect properness for someone who is giving a presentation, speech, addressing a group of people and mostly in a professional situation not while have casual conversations with other people. That would be mind numbing.

 

This is a point I agree with you on. (<-----ooops ended in a preposition!)  I was an English major and I get paid to write copy every Monday-Friday. I know the grammar rules. That doesn't mean that I'm going to write every single "informal" sentence correctly, as in here on a forum or in a Facebook post.  And it sure as hell doesn't mean that I'm going to use correct sentence structure every time I speak out loud. 

 

Now if David was an English professor and I saw him WRITE a sentence that started out with "Shannon and me..." or the like, then YES, all bets would be off.  But simply talking out loud?  Nah, he gets a pass. From me at least. 

 

Gretchen and her butchering of the English language though?  Yeah, that was still snark-worthy...