Unpopular Opinions

[Nanrad]

I feel like they're trying to sell me on Joe Caputo, nice guy, but I'm not buying.  Isn't this the guy that would jack off the second a weeping inmate left his office during season 1?

I don't think they are trying to sell Caputo as a "nice guy." His arc this season was about him giving up fighting for the little guy and doing something for himself. He used to be optimistic and happy and now he hate fucks a woman who made made his life miserable when she worked for him and he fights everyday just to provide him inmates with basic things. He's depressed and lonely and under appreciated (but, not because he's "nice") Caputo has serious flaws and jacked off to an inmate (who cried as she left his office), but he's not trying to have a relationship with them (Healy w/Red) or raping them (Bennett/Pronstache/Donut Man). And he does know that what he did was disgusting and even the series basically pointed that out. He may rationalize it, but he knows it. Also, he isn't pushing his own agenda, resentment, etc on the inmates.

[mytmo]

Every day I fell asleep watching an episode up to the A Titting and A Hairing episode.  The Pennsatucky storyline saved this series for me.

 

I was bored with everyone else - cliche'

[Jade Foxx]

I can't even get past the third episode. Not even to hate-watch; I'm just bored with it all.  

 

Have at it, my friends.

[DianeDobbler]

Yeah, I think the Boo/Pennsatucky relationship was the best part of S3, although I don't enjoy Pennsatucky as much apart from Boo, nor Boo as much apart from Pennsatucky. Pennsatucky seems to calm Boo down and bring out a genuinely very sweet, caring part that feels natural (so it makes Lea Delaria's performance more natural, as she can telegraph stuff sometimes) and Boo humanizes and relaxes Pennsatucky, and brings out her brains and vulnerability. I hope they're a bigger part of the show next season.

 

Caputo - I give the jerking off stuff a pass, as it was the premiere. I'm not all that strict about show "canon" because it often takes a little time for the writers to start writing "for" and actor and shaping a character. I'm happy to throw out early stuff if later writing re-sets or modulates.

 

After watching three seasons I realize I enjoy the prisoners (save the meth heads and Norma) way more than the cos, even though the cos have some good material. Healy's quasi toxic "nice guy" routine is creepy. I wish the writing would get the needle out of the poor, poor Healy groove. While recognizing his comic chops, I just didn't enjoy Pornstache in S1 and S2. Or Bennett. Didn't like Donuts even before he turned into a rapist. Taryn Manning says the Donuts actor was pissed off when his character became a rapist, and I also got the impression the actor had just played a rapist on his previous job before OITNB. I could see him getting irritated at that particular typecasting, but he does look typecast to me, the sort of scary cliche'd inbred kinda guy you see in every "the south is scary" movie. Even though Litchfield isn't the south. Love Wanda and O'Neill, individually and together, but that's about it for the guard and admin side. Could do with less Caputo and with getting rid of Fig, while recognizing both actors are talented.

Edited July 1, 2015 by DianeDobbler

[midge]

My UO is that I like LPs acting.   Is it an UO to want to slap Norma?

[Sweets McGee]

  Is it an UO to want to slap Norma?

No! I will join you on that one! :)

 

I also think not caring about Ruby Rose is a popular opinion but I'm on board with that one. I also hated the standing there naked in the bathroom scene. We get it, she's hot, and you're Netflix so you can show us.

 

I think my actual UO is that I still like Piper.

[Chaos Theory]

Liking Piper is 50/50. On here it is unpopular but Afterellen I think still likes her. I like her myself but then I don't consider being white, blonde and an asshole reason to hate someone; at least not on tv.

[ChromaKelly]

I can't stand Morello. I don't find her endearing, my heart doesn't break for her, and I don't care that she's lonely. She is a toxic, unstable person. She needs a psych eval. I hate her voice (ok that's shallow but I do) and I the whole I'm a little sweetheart routine is annoying.

I like Suzanne as a character, but IRL she should be in a psych ward, not gen pop.

[DianeDobbler]

I, also, like Laura Prepon's acting on this show.  I think she just nails the two most important aspects of Alex - being believable as the worldly, savvy, not-much-money background, tough, cynical former drug operator - and being totally in love with Piper. Whenever she sees Piper her face and eyes become warm/happy. Even if she's wary at first, one sentence in and her face softens.

 

Did some more reading on prisons and based on what I've read as typical prison-issue supplies, I find it difficult to believe that minimum security Litchfield doesn't issue toothbrushes and the prisoners have to get it from commissary, and if they're short-funded, they're out of luck.

Edited July 2, 2015 by DianeDobbler

[heatherchandler]

Ruby Rose is a terrible addition to the show and I hope they don't bring her back next season. All the hype about her is based on her looks and nothing else.

I really enjoy the MCC storyline and how it affects the CO's, I enjoy them almost as much as the inmates in S3.

I kind of ship Caputo and Fig now. :S

Ruby is the WORST actress. Awful. When she walked in on Piper talking to the guard, her line reading was cringeworthy, laughably bad. Why was she added to the show???

Agree with both of your other points.

[lovemytvshows]

I, also, like Laura Prepon's acting on this show.  I think she just nails the two most important aspects of Alex - being believable as the worldly, savvy, not-much-money background, tough, cynical former drug operator - and being totally in love with Piper. Whenever she sees Piper her face and eyes become warm/happy. Even if she's wary at first, one sentence in and her face softens.

 

Agreed on all counts! I've honestly never seen her in anything else and I had to go Youtube some That '70s Show clips for comparison and that was godawful bad. Not just her but the whole show. Just cringe-worthy and unfunny and the laugh track made it worse in my opinion. And that is probably why I'm stunned that how good LP is in OITNB. I found her portrayal of Alex (everything including mannerisms, stance, laugh, smirk, eyebrow wiggle, etc) to be very natural and nuanced and not at all overplayed or overblown. It gives Alex a very unique personality (cool, calm & collected, snarky wit and humour) than that of most of the other inmates. That said, I'm sure there'll be someone out there that's on the totally opposite side of the fence to me, but to each their own I suppose.

[Zuleikha]

Caputo - I give the jerking off stuff a pass, as it was the premiere.

It's not just that for me. It's also the way he pursued Fischer when he was her boss. I'm not sure if Jenji even realizes she wrote Caputo as engaging in workplace sexual harassment because so much of the storyline was seen through his POV, which was shown to be sincere and non-malicious. But he was repeatedly inappropriate with her and while it was subtle enough that Fischer is unlikely to win a claim in court, I think his firing of her was at least partially about his non-reciprocated feelings. He's never been written as acknowledging, understanding, and regretting the lines he crossed with Fischer, and until that happens, I can't root for him or see him as even a mostly decent guy,

[baky]

I like Aleida. Am I the only one? I mean, she's a shitty mom but there's still something that makes me like her character. And I loved her backstory 

[DianeDobbler]

Zulheika, I haven't seen the Caputo/Fischer episodes yet, so that could possibly alter my opinion. I'm not sure I agree with some of Jenji Cohen's character-point-of-view choices, because often she doesn't circle back and let us know the show doesn't really expect us to find specific character behavior root-able (Morello having Christopher beat down, and OITNB encouraging Christopher-hate in general). The actor playing Caputo kind of agrees with your point of view, and in the interview I read describes firing Fischer as knee-jerk and something he probably regretted as soon as he did it.

 

Even though I haven't seen that episode(s), I wonder if it correlates at all to the episodes in S1 where Healey felt perversely betrayed by Piper and stuck her in SHU for homo-dancing with Alex. As I recall, Caputo called him out and made Healey get Piper out, telling Healy Piper just got under his skin, putting her in SHU was personal, and the prison was going to get in trouble. FF and Caputo lets personal feelings warp how he treats somebody under his supervision.

 

Either here or elsewhere I mentioned that I didn't mind Healey THAT much. I hereby withdraw that and see what everybody else was saying about him. He's just that guy who, when he does "nice things" for a woman, is running up an invoice. He wants to be some benevolent figure to them, but if they don't play along, he retaliates. I suspect his hatred of lesbians is pure ego - he doesn't want these women finding comfort with each other, he wants to be some beloved, important figure to the women and maybe fantasize that they're secretly in love with him. He probably thought he and Piper had connected and she looked to him as the person in Litchfield who understood. It's all about his fantasies and ego.

 

Maybe this is unpopular - I am so glad Pornstache is off the show. I can see that Pablo Schreiber is talented, but I just didn't enjoy the character at all. He actively got on my nerves, every single thing about him. It wasn't his behavior, per se, but the full package.

 

P.S. I think Ruby Rose was the basest sort of stunt casting, it was exploitative, pandered to "Hot lesbians!" and although the actual script was low key, it was all about the marketing stunt, and goes against everything OITNB has been praised for being.

 

And, speaking of the prison getting in trouble, Sophia is a former fire fighter. She's now indefinitely in SHU. Her wife is a smart woman. Surely there is some way to raise enough of a stink to make the prison get her out. The ex-firefighter stuff is journalism bait, Sophia's whole family is media-ready, and, not to be shallow, even a couple of years ago transgender issues were trending.

Edited July 4, 2015 by DianeDobbler

[Soobs]

My extremely UO is that I enjoy watching Healey's scenes. He strikes me as a conflicted person who wants love and acceptance but can't stop himself from lashing out at people around him unpredictable ways. And then he can't understand why his life sucks even though it's largely his own making. It strikes me as realistic that someone so emotionally unconscious would be in a therapeutic power position in a prison. I also liked his scenes with Red because he sees her as an equal and he obviously desperately seeks her attention and approval. I'm interested to see if it helps him grow or if he stays stuck.

[lovemytvshows]

P.S. I think Ruby Rose was the basest sort of stunt casting, it was exploitative, pandered to "Hot lesbians!" and although the actual script was low key, it was all about the marketing stunt, and goes against everything OITNB has been praised for being.

 

No arguments here. I don't see the appeal of her (acting or looks-wise) aside from the fact that she is part of the "Look at me! I'm Australian!" fad/gimmick that Hollywood seems to be caught up in (i.e. Rebel Wilson, the Hemsworths, etc). Yael Stone is Australian but that's been low-key and it hasn't overshadowed her performance.  

 

I know RR has her fans but to me she lacked the...I don't know what you want to call it - the presence...that Laura Prepon had that made Alex for me. Unabashed Vauseman fan here obviously.

[Captanne]

TBH, I had never heard of Ruby Rose and had no idea who she is.  So, for someone who came to her character cold, I thought she was lifeless and shallow.  What that did was tell me that Piper is, herself, lifeless and shallow.  I'm not judging or casting aspersions but I am saying it told me a lot about her character.  No matter what one thinks of Alex, she is/was her lover over many years and they have a lot of history behind them.  That Piper would throw her over (and throw it in her face) for a two dimensional ingenue says more about Piper than anything else.  (God knows I got nothing from the character whose name I can't even remember.)

 

PS:  While it's easy and lazy to base a character's cache on the actress' personal life outside the show -- it's very dangerous to do that because then you have audience members who only see half the story.  

Edited July 5, 2015 by Captanne

[Crim]

I agree about Laverne Cox. It was much better in season 1, before the high praise and publicity and her being everywhere. Now, watching her performance in that light, I just cringe.

 

My UI is that I do not like Big Boo at all. While I enjoyed her episode and, especially, the Pennsatucky stuff and I think the writing for her is good, I just don't like her or Lea DeLaria. She is like Black Cindy to me: she grates. But in Black Cindy's case I see it as intentional; I think the show wants me to like Big Boo and/or find her funny. I don't.

[Aja]

My UI is that I do not like Big Boo at all. While I enjoyed her episode and, especially, the Pennsatucky stuff and I think the writing for her is good, I just don't like her or Lea DeLaria. She is like Black Cindy to me: she grates. But in Black Cindy's case I see it as intentional; I think the show wants me to like Big Boo and/or find her funny. I don't.

I totally agree with this. I just binge-watched for the first time from the first episode right through to the S3 finale, and I have to say that overall Big Boo is my least favorite of the inmates. It really bugs me that she's such a nuance-free cliche, especially with how well-rounded and fleshed out a lot of the other characters are. Even her backstory was totally on the nose. I like her S3 relationship with Pennsatucky because it's the first time there was any indication that she was extremely intelligent (something I did not glean from any of her previous scenes, particularly when she just sort of casually ratted out Red) and had another facet to her personality besides "I'm butch! Watch me butch!" To show kindness and compassion to someone who should be her enemy, and to be outraged at the way Pennsatucky has been treated by men, gives a lot more humanity and strength to her character than just swaggering around making pussy jokes.

 

I also agree with the unpopular/popular opinion that Piper and Alex and everything that revolves around them (Stella, panties, love/hate/love/hate/love/hate) are the most boring parts of the show.

Edited July 6, 2015 by Aja

[archer1267]

Natasha Lyonne is not a very good actress, and her character is one of the least compelling. I honestly didn't even notice that she was gone.

 

 

Thank you! I don't miss her either, and am relieved that I'm not the only one. I think it's because she seems to play the same smart-ass character in each film I've seen her in (although the could be said for a LOT of actors out there!). 

 

With the exception of Gloria, I don't find the Latin crew all that interesting.

 

 

Yes! I really like Gloria, although I'm only midway through S3 and know that may change. 

 

My unpopular opinion: I LOATHED Pornstache but now, after seeing his mom visit Daya, I'm kind of missing him, especially with Bennett gone. Go figure.

[Crim]

My unpopular opinion: I LOATHED Pornstache but now, after seeing his mom visit Daya, I'm kind of missing him, especially with Bennett gone. Go figure.

I doubt this is an unpopular opinion (but maybe?): I don't miss anyone related to Daya and the baby, because that storyline cannot end quickly enough. I didn't even hate it; it's just been on screen for ages compared to everything else and, every episode where it was included, I was aware it had to go on and thought "Oh, man, still how many months to go?"

[Ripley68]

I like Alex and think LP's acting is fine. I love her sarcasm, and don't think she was being overly paranoid.  I don't see what she sees in Piper.  Piper is not good looking to me, and I don't think she looks waspish, I also think the actress isn't very good.  I did however like the panties story line.

[rue721]

My extremely UO is that I enjoy watching Healey's scenes. He strikes me as a conflicted person who wants love and acceptance but can't stop himself from lashing out at people around him unpredictable ways. And then he can't understand why his life sucks even though it's largely his own making. It strikes me as realistic that someone so emotionally unconscious would be in a therapeutic power position in a prison. I also liked his scenes with Red because he sees her as an equal and he obviously desperately seeks her attention and approval. I'm interested to see if it helps him grow or if he stays stuck.

 

I agree. Healy is an ignorant and erratic creep, but something about him is compelling to me. I also like Katya -- or at least, I find her interesting. I wish she had a larger part. (And I'm interested in her mother, too. Maybe they showed her in earlier seasons -- I don't remember. But isn't her mother likely to be around the same age as Healy and Red? That's awkward. And how is Katya's mother influencing Katya and Healy's relationship/what's her opinion on it?).

 

Another UO:  I wish they would just get rid of Piper. She doesn't fit into the show anymore (imo).

 

Another UO:  Nicky's likeable imo because she's a wisecracking horndog, but I don't think she's an especially interesting character. If we never get another flashback for her, that would be fine with me. I hope she comes back because I like the way she fits in with the other characters/storylines within the prison, but I don't need her to be a central character or anything.

 

Another UO:  Leanne being Amish made her even LESS interesting to me.

 

Another UO:  I missed both Bennett and Pornstache.

 

Probably not an UO:  I loved Caesar. My fingers are crossed that we'll get to see more of him next season!

 

Maybe an UO:  Stella made no sense to me as a character and I hope she never comes back. (Her laser focus on Piper was especially inexplicable -- it seemed like she never even spoke with anyone else?). But tbh, I was riveted in Stella's scenes, becuase Ruby Rose was hot as hell in them. I appreciated the eyecandy.

 

Maybe an UO:  Doggett's storyline was maybe the best part of the season imo -- the actress KILLED it. But I don't really like how they softened up her character so much. I kinda liked Doggett better when she was an incorrigable bitch.

[poppy-]

I like Aleida. Am I the only one? I mean, she's a shitty mom but there's still something that makes me like her character. And I loved her backstory

 

Well, Gloria likes her, and I trust Gloria.....

Aledia is a terrible person both from a mom perspective and a Sofia perspective- but  played by such a good actress. I loved the variety of reactions she was able to convey when the camp counselor used the term "acclimated" when speaking to her.

 

 

Healy's quasi toxic "nice guy" routine is creepy. I wish the writing would get the needle out of the poor, poor Healy groove.

 

Eh, I think we're supposed to despise him.  Just because he's pathetic doesn't mean he's not an awful person.  What he did to Piper in S1, what he did to the other counselor....

 

I don't think either one of those is the worst... in the current season, maybe Leanne? She's got nothing going for her, really.  Fig didn't do anything horrible this time around, but the golfing corporate shill took her place as Big Bad Boss had less awareness of his own evil, which made him worse than her. Piper is pretty nasty.  Oh- the rapist. Yes, he's the worst.

Edited July 11, 2015 by poppy-

[Portia]

So glad I'm not the only one who hates Norma. All the emphasis on her pretty much ruined this season for me. I think the actress portraying her is embarrassingly bad. When casting a mute character, you'd think they'd try to find an actress who can make more than two facial expressions.

[mercfan3]

Boy, so I guess it's more unpopular that I liked Norma. 

Edited July 13, 2015 by mercfan3

[islandgal140]

I liked Norma in her original limited capacity as Red's mute non-sexual bottom bitch but I hated the Cult of Norma stuff and how she let that muck mouth meth head bully and harass that poor girl. 

 

I never heard of Ruby Rose and never knew she was 'a thing' until reading it on here. She is striking but for me personally, the accent kills everything. The Australian accent is just my least favorite to put it lightly. Some are better than others. Ruby's is like a screw driver to the ear. Very nasally and twangy to me.

 

I thought the selling dirty panties story was just disgusting. All the talk of vag juices was just too damn much. There were points where I thought I would get physically ill especially when Piper's brother and sister-in-law were trying to come up with a way to sell more panties and come up with a correct formula for vag secretions. Ugh!

 

Of all the inmates, the only one I truly hate is Morello. Bitch is dangerous and evil and is still victimizing her victim. I found it offensive that the show seemed to play it for laughs. She doesn't deserve any kind of happy ending. I hope she and her new hubby get found out and she either gets years tacked on or sent to the shu or max.

 

I didn't miss Nicky this season. Not that I don't like her but I pretty much forgot about her once she was off canvas.

 

I both enjoyed and found terrifying the privation of the prison because it has some footing in reality. I thought it was a perfect umbrella story. 

 

Way too much time wasted on Alex's back story. Really didn't need to be shown that the dangerous drug lord was indeed dangerous and capable of murder. I am sure he didn't get where he is by just using harsh language. 

 

I don't find Poussey interesting.

[lovemytvshows]

The Australian accent is just my least favorite to put it lightly. Some are better than others. Ruby's is like a screw driver to the ear. Very nasally and twangy to me

 

This! Thank you for taking the words out of my mouth!

[EllenI]

My god, this. A thousand times this. I don't feel sorry for Healy. Sure, he's trying to find true love, but by 'buying' a bride, it just seems to be because he knows he can't get a wife any other way. It's actually really pathetic. Sure, he may have some family issues, but that should never excuse his atrocious behaviour toward women, and especially women of colour. Sure, he's mentored a few women but it seems like he treats the white women better than any other. I love to hate this guy, because he's truly something, but in the worst way possible. I don't see how he can, or should, be working in a women's prison. I can't even imagine how he treats men who are better than him. He's also extremely immature and hope his wife leaves him. She may be pathetic for becoming a mail order bride, but he's worse.

 

I'm also fine with Sophia in small doses, but Gloria's a much better character and though I felt for Sophia when those women were ripping off her hair and bullying her in her own salon, Laverne Cox can't sell it as well as the actress who plays Gloria. 

 

I honestly don't see the hype with Ruby Rose, besides the fact that she looks hot. The material they gave her showed very little of her acting chops and I hated her storyline with Piper. Is it just because Ruby's hot or is there some other reason that I've missed? 

 

Soso's storyline was extremely well done and one of the best. But I don't really ship her and Poussey (yet).

 

I hate Black Cindy, Janae and I'm not even fond of Taystee or Suzanne. The only girl out of the 'black group' I like is Poussey and this season didn't even have Poussey in a compelling storyline. It started off interesting but faltered. 

 

Thank god for less Morello this season. She looks like a cutie pie but she's probably the worst of the lot, only because she acts innocent and naive and good but she's a stalker, bigot and compulsive liar. She also constantly treats herself like a victim and I'm not entirely sure if she's 100% aware of it or if she's that mentally ill. 

 

I still like Bennett, way more than I like Daya, and that's because I feel like Matt McGorry is a better actor and I know he only left because of his other show. If he didn't have HTGAWM, he would have most likely stuck around. 

 

I kind of wish we saw at least two prisoners escape in the finale. I can't imagine all of them sticking around, and thought they would at least try to find their way around the lake. 

 

I don't care about the Alex cliffhanger. I would be just fine if we find out that she was actually killed next season. Both Alex and Piper are too toxic for one another, anyway. 

Y'know, I bet we'll see more of Healy's backstory in the coming season. There has to be a reason that he is so lesbian-hating/fearing. Remember the scenes they showed of Healy as a child, with his insane mother? I wonder if, at some point, he walked in on his mother in a lesbian encounter or something. I actually love Sam Healy. I think that he actually DOES want to help the girls. He may not be very effective, but I believe he has a genuinely warm heart, and that he had grand visions of his role at the prison, but because of the leadership (Fig in particular), none of his visions could be realized. I loved the scene where Murello got married, and Healy and red were gazing at one another. There is something there - probably just a bond due to their similar ages and the amount of time Red has been at Litchfield, but I think they truly care about each other.

[EllenI]

Obviously, this is no longer an "unpopular" opinion, but I agree with those who said they don't like Stella (Ruby Rose). What is there to like about her? Her accent, poor acting, and well, I'll go back to her accent, cancel out anything positive about her character or her job as an actress. She is very beautiful - very much like Angelina Jolie - but there was no buildup to her character. She just showed up at a sewing machine one day, and then Piper decided to have sex with her (of course).

 

And come on ... Piper collected, and was able to HIDE, all that contraband that she found while she was searching for a cell phone, so that she could somehow find a time when no one else was around and secretly hide all of it among Stella's things and ruin her release? That was a giant "Come ON!" moment for me.

 

I was so hoping that Stella would be released and get off the show. In fact, it's be great if she'd take Piper with her.

 

 

 

 

[Neurochick]

I'm watching season two now and I detest the racism in the show. The white characters are presented as well rounded while the black characters all seem to be one note. Also the white characters as a whole are presented more sympathetic than the black characters.

[sev]

UO: I'm bored by the backstory clips. They worked for a while, but starting season two they feel forced. Maybe I don't need backstory clip for every character, or maybe sometime I don't need 10 minutes of clips when 2 lines of dialogue would convey the same amount of information... "show! don't tell" doesn't mean "bore! don't tell".

[jsm1125]

While I want to see backstories from Maritza and SoSo, I'm just as interested in seeing them from Angie, Gina, Blanca, and Maria, as the latter four have been on the show since season one and are compelling in their own right. I still get a chuckle out of Gina's small scene in the first season, where she chews out Aleida for not knowing her name when demanding favors from the kitchen staff.

 

While I did not miss Larry in the slightest this season, I did miss Polly and thought she was an interesting character. She seemed to have a decent sense of humor and good comic timing.

 

I had no problem with Piper originally kicking Flacca out of the panties business, as Flacca seemed like all she wanted to do at the time was undermine Piper and go behind her back.

[jsm1125]

I'm watching season two now and I detest the racism in the show. The white characters are presented as well rounded while the black characters all seem to be one note. Also the white characters as a whole are presented more sympathetic than the black characters.

YMMV, but I think Taystee (who is presented as having so much potential but is never given a reasonable chance to display it), Poussey (who is arguably the best overall 'person' in Litchfield, was the only one to see through Vee's bullshit from the beginning, and is sympathetic in her loneliness), and arguably Suzanne are presented plenty sympathetically. Watson isn't on enough (and did absolutely nothing of note this past season) for me to determine how she is portrayed, and even Cindy was seen having a genuine change of heart and fondness for Judaism.

[eXiled]

I did not enjoy this season very much at all.

 

Suzanne and Piper have become caricatures. It's like Uzo was told to act more mentally challenged and Taylor was told to play to the rafters--constant mugging and shouting. I hope Suzanne and Piper return to their Season One personalities.

 

I still ship Vauseman. When they were allowed  genuine (non-silly) moments, their chemistry still shone through for me. It's just that the writing was terrible and Schilling's mugging became a little much.

 

I've seen praise for Poussey and Samira Wiley, but she doesn't do anything for me at all. I don't dislike her. I just don't care. She's barely a step above Janay to me as a character for some reason. I think Soso will make her more interesting, actually.

 

I like Big Boo. I dislike Pennsatucky. Tucky's backstory and rapes upset me, but learning more about her did not change my mind. Personally, I think Big Boo could do better than to hang out with a anti-everything-except-meth loser like Tucky. Boo can be an asshole, but she's shown moments of intelligence and wit. I've never seen that from Tucky.

 

I wanted to know MORE about Chang. Loved her bit of backstory and hoped to see her integrated more, but I guess her invisibility means she'll remain background. She's great to me.

 

So glad I'm not the only one who saw through Morello's bullshit. I tolerated her because Nicky loved her (though I never understood that). Her casual/proud ignorance and racism bugged from the beginning, and despite Yael Stone being adorable, I wasn't surprised to learn her delusion about Christopher was about more than him just not visiting. Discovering that they were NEVER a real thang to begin with....yasss! And now he's being roughed up by thugs. The man's only crime is not loving this crazy chick. Also, I'm a Brooklynite who has never heard an accent like hers before. Unforgivable.

 

Also love to the posters who mentioned that most of the Latina actresses are Puerto Rican and/perhaps Dominican. Mexicans are not a thing in New York. They're just not. Why the rest of the country believes that everyone who speaks Spanish is Mexican is so perplexing. I feel the same thing whenever I watch Devious Maids. Not one of the leads is Mexican, yet, because the bulk of the United States might find that difficult to understand, all the actresses must pretend. I cringed during a scene last season when they talked about making tamales and it reminding them of home. Yeah right.

 

Despite me shipping Vauseman I feel it might be time for Piper to leave. If this season was any indication, her character will only worsen. I liked her narcissism, know-it-all-itis, and cluelessness when it came to general prison life, but I can't abide kingpin Piper. Taylor Schilling morphed into a bug-eyed mental patient in a few of her scenes, so it may be time for Chapman to get an early release before the stress has her talking to mops and throwing pie.

[DianeDobbler]

Upon reflection, I do think Uzo Aduba's character became way too much of a "special person" stereotype, complete with her revirginization. They were hitting every cliche with her. But, I think she's a strong actress, on my list of the strongest on OITNB, and maybe ironically, I enjoy her most when she gets to play scenes where she's processing what others are saying and trying to tack back and forth, or assume a "listening pose" or something - it's very funny. For example, when it was her turn to be interrogated about Red's beating, she played it as sort of being very patient and cooperative with people who weren't as bright as she was. Ditto when everyone was hitting her up about the direction they wanted Suzanne's fan fic to go in, and how she played both "I'm trying to hear you out" AND "Fed up" at the same time. Enjoy this more than when it's a big Suzanne platform kind of moment, as those are written a little one note and leave the actress having to work too hard.

 

Others on my list of the show's best all round actors are Adrienne C. Moore (Black Cindy), Taylor Schilling (Piper) and Kate Mulgrew (Red). It's been said that a performer doesn't have to have the widest range in the world if the range or note they have is matched well with their character. In that category I put Natasha Lyonne. I've seen some of her work now since OITNB, and while I wouldn't want to attend a Natasha Lyonne film festival, she's perfectly cast as Nicky and I like it a lot.  Yael Stone (Morello) can be hit and miss - really good with some stuff, less so on others. Sometimes she's very technical and not so much with my feeling her, although that's certainly not true of her Morello's backstory. I also put Laura Prepon in the "Well cast" category.

 

I think a little Samira Wiley (Poussey) goes a long way, same for, and increasingly, Danielle Brooks (Taystee). But no two actresses/characters work my nerves like Emma Myles as Leanne and the actress whose name I forget who plays her cohort. Also the singer who played Norma was/is a horrible actress.

 

Lea Delaria just improved as the seasons went on. She's a big personality but can come off like an amateur actress telegraphing everything. I like her in scenes with Pensatucky because she just mostly focuses on her, having a conversation, and the actress/character's genuine intelligence and humanity comes across in a much more natural way.

[Chaos Theory]

Uzo Aduba has become the "face" of the show. On one hand it is nice to see a POC become the face of a show on the other season 3 had far more deserving POC; Lavergne Cox and Selinis Leyva had stand out performances.

[Chaos Theory]

I am finding the portrayal of Piper as borderline offensive.  I really liked her the first season but more and more the show is making her the worst kind of white privilege.  I know some people like that but I find it offensive.

[kickedinthehead]

I'm not sure how unpopular this is, but I hated almost everything about Season 3. Including "Stella"; I had no idea who Ruby Rose was beforehand, but (sorry, Ruby Rose) I don't think she's remotely "hot" or beautiful, at least not as this character.

I semi-liked Norma in the first couple of seasons, but she lost me with that ridiculous "Cult of Norma" storyline in Season 3.

I also hate Piper and Alex, *especially* together; I end up fast-forwarding through many of their scenes together, because I so.do.not.care.

Piper's little side "business" -- just, ugh.

I thought the Morello/Christopher story was one of the better ones of Season 2, but I agree that Christopher didn't deserve a beating and if that was supposed to make me find Morello more endearing or think that Christopher "got what he deserved" or somesuch -- fail.

(Also, I couldn't care less about Morello's new husband.)

And while I suppose I prefer Big Boo in her scenes with Pennsatucky to most of her other scenes, this isn't saying much -- because I DESPISE Big Boo. So their friendship didn't do much for me. (Pennsatucky, on the other hand, is one of the more interesting characters; I hated her every bit as much as Big Boo in the first season, possibly even more so; but she's become far less grating and obnoxious and I more or less tolerate her now... although for no real reason, I tend to find Taryn Manning slightly off-putting).

Other characters I don't hate as much as Big Boo, but don't care for, include Nicky, Sophia and (sorry) Poussey.

(Black Cindy is also very annoying, but -- not sure why -- I'm occasionally amused by her. Although, again, as with most of Season 3... her Judaism story failed to engage me.)

 

As for Healy and Red -- meh. Their story didn't bug me as much as some, but I wasn't greatly invested in it, either.

That brings me to another unpopular opinion; Healy, in general, is actually one of my favorites on this show. I can see why others hate him and I'm not sure how I'd feel about such a person in real life, but I do think the character is compelling, and (despite some of his more questionable actions) has a good heart underneath. I enjoyed his relationships with Pennsatucky in Season 2 and with Lolly in Season 4 (I still have four episodes left to go of Season 4, so I'm not sure if anything else happens there). I also think his scenes with Caputo are kinda funny, in a dorky sort of way.

Speaking of Caputo -- I have mixed feelings about him. I like him when he's playing with a band, interacting with Healy and some of the other staff, and (sometimes) when he's interacting with the prisoners. However, I really don't care about his love life (other than his creepy crush on Fischer in the first couple of seasons, which was at least more interesting than his sex scenes with Fig, etc.), and I'm not really into his MCC/warden story (and find that arc somewhat predictable). His Season 3 flashback also bored me.

 

Finally -- after 9 episodes, I can definitely say that Season 4 is a HUGE improvement over Season 3. Depending on how things go in the last four episodes, it might turn out to be my favorite season (so far, I'd still say Season 2 is my favorite).

Edited June 18, 2016 by kickedinthehead

[Chairperson Meow]

I actually don't hate Healy that much.  I want to.  I feel like I should, but I see a lonely man who wants to help these women and believed he was but is now realizing that he hasn't been.  He grew up in a different time and is now realizing that he has his own baggage he never dealt with.  But a good therapist is one who needs a therapist.  Every good psychologist will tell you that.  I also find the parallels between him and Caputo so interesting.  Plus, it's just...damn.  If you've ever been the nerd or unpopular in school or socially awkward, you just feel for Healy.  

[knaankos]

On September 4, 2015 at 3:55 PM, eXiled said:

 

Also love to the posters who mentioned that most of the Latina actresses are Puerto Rican and/perhaps Dominican. Mexicans are not a thing in New York. They're just not. Why the rest of the country believes that everyone who speaks Spanish is Mexican is so perplexing. I feel the same thing whenever I watch Devious Maids. Not one of the leads is Mexican, yet, because the bulk of the United States might find that difficult to understand, all the actresses must pretend. I cringed during a scene last season when they talked about making tamales and it reminding them of home. Yeah right.

Not a hard question. It's because Mexico has 10 times the population of Dominican Rep and Puerto Rico combined 

[ciprus]

Posted something similar in the thread for season four, but I think it belongs here too.

I've had it with Crazy Eyes. Yes, she's an innocent soul and everything, but she shouldn't be in gen pop. She's a lose canon and can be very dangerous as evidenced by this and previous seasons and her flashback.

She needs professional help and does not belong in prison! For her own sake and the other inmates. She indirectly caused that kid's death, beat Kukudio to a pulp. She would have beat her to death if she hadn't been stopped. The straw that broke my back was her part in Poussey's death. I don't blame her, she cannot help herself obviously, she has issues - but she needs to go away. I'm starting to hate her character because she sucks everyone around her dry, they try to help her and things go south because of it. She's in the wrong place, and is getting on my nerves.

[millennium]

On 6/18/2016 at 4:45 PM, kickedinthehead said:

I'm not sure how unpopular this is, but I hated almost everything about Season 3. Including "Stella"; I had no idea who Ruby Rose was beforehand, but (sorry, Ruby Rose) I don't think she's remotely "hot" or beautiful, at least not as this character.

I semi-liked Norma in the first couple of seasons, but she lost me with that ridiculous "Cult of Norma" storyline in Season 3.

I also hate Piper and Alex, *especially* together; I end up fast-forwarding through many of their scenes together, because I so.do.not.care.

Piper's little side "business" -- just, ugh.

I thought the Morello/Christopher story was one of the better ones of Season 2, but I agree that Christopher didn't deserve a beating and if that was supposed to make me find Morello more endearing or think that Christopher "got what he deserved" or somesuch -- fail.

(Also, I couldn't care less about Morello's new husband.)

And while I suppose I prefer Big Boo in her scenes with Pennsatucky to most of her other scenes, this isn't saying much -- because I DESPISE Big Boo. So their friendship didn't do much for me. (Pennsatucky, on the other hand, is one of the more interesting characters; I hated her every bit as much as Big Boo in the first season, possibly even more so; but she's become far less grating and obnoxious and I more or less tolerate her now... although for no real reason, I tend to find Taryn Manning slightly off-putting).

Other characters I don't hate as much as Big Boo, but don't care for, include Nicky, Sophia and (sorry) Poussey.

(Black Cindy is also very annoying, but -- not sure why -- I'm occasionally amused by her. Although, again, as with most of Season 3... her Judaism story failed to engage me.)

 

As for Healy and Red -- meh. Their story didn't bug me as much as some, but I wasn't greatly invested in it, either.

That brings me to another unpopular opinion; Healy, in general, is actually one of my favorites on this show. I can see why others hate him and I'm not sure how I'd feel about such a person in real life, but I do think the character is compelling, and (despite some of his more questionable actions) has a good heart underneath. I enjoyed his relationships with Pennsatucky in Season 2 and with Lolly in Season 4 (I still have four episodes left to go of Season 4, so I'm not sure if anything else happens there). I also think his scenes with Caputo are kinda funny, in a dorky sort of way.

Speaking of Caputo -- I have mixed feelings about him. I like him when he's playing with a band, interacting with Healy and some of the other staff, and (sometimes) when he's interacting with the prisoners. However, I really don't care about his love life (other than his creepy crush on Fischer in the first couple of seasons, which was at least more interesting than his sex scenes with Fig, etc.), and I'm not really into his MCC/warden story (and find that arc somewhat predictable). His Season 3 flashback also bored me.

 

Finally -- after 9 episodes, I can definitely say that Season 4 is a HUGE improvement over Season 3. Depending on how things go in the last four episodes, it might turn out to be my favorite season (so far, I'd still say Season 2 is my favorite).

I share many of your opinions.  The question that plagued me after I finished this season (and had a shower, because it left me feeling gross) is "why do I watch this shit?"

The only answer I can come up with is "because it's on."

I'm a voracious consumer of content.   Against my better judgment I will lower my own viewing standards on occasions when I find myself in need of something new to watch.   Summer is a particularly vulnerable time for me because TV turns into a wasteland.

I swore off this show after Season 3 and that whole "Norma as jailhouse Christ" malarkey.   I felt so miserably stupid and gullible for having sat through it.

I had already decided not to watch Season 4.   But then I started seeing reviews "Best season ever!" and "Darkest season ever!" and "This season may propel OITNB into the realm of top 5 best shows ever!" (seriously, some mendacious reviewer wrote that).

Another article I read was "Best Way to Watch Season 4 of Orange Is the New Black," with the reviewer recommending an approach consisting of viewing blocks:   Episodes 1-3 to get reacquainted ... Episodes 3-6 to warm up to the new characters ... but starting with Episode Seven, it's on!   You won't be able to stop after that!"

It sounded like some kind of dramatic ascent on the level of Breaking Bad.

So I caved.

I kept waiting for the action to take off, to get nuts, to break new ground.   I'm such an idiot.   Season 4 was the same shit show Orange Is the New Black has always been, populated by broadly drawn comic book villains and the despicable women they oversee (except of course for the token, wide-eyed innocent, and the predictable conclusion of that particular story line). 

Filming scenes of depravity, torture and violence is not automatically socially relevant.   It does not "shed light" on the shadowy corners of society.   It's just an attempt to sensationalize prurient interests and morbid curiousity, nothing more.   It's pornography in that sense.

I felt slimed after watching Season 4.    I didn't empathize with even one character, I hated them all.  

But not as much as I hated myself for getting suckered again.

[ElsbethTascioni]

3 hours ago, ciprus said:

Posted something similar in the thread for season four, but I think it belongs here too.

I've had it with Crazy Eyes. Yes, she's an innocent soul and everything, but she shouldn't be in gen pop. She's a lose canon and can be very dangerous as evidenced by this and previous seasons and her flashback.

She needs professional help and does not belong in prison! For her own sake and the other inmates. She indirectly caused that kid's death, beat Kukudio to a pulp. She would have beat her to death if she hadn't been stopped. The straw that broke my back was her part in Poussey's death. I don't blame her, she cannot help herself obviously, she has issues - but she needs to go away. I'm starting to hate her character because she sucks everyone around her dry, they try to help her and things go south because of it. She's in the wrong place, and is getting on my nerves.

I totally agree. She should have never been sent to jail in the first place. She's clearly a danger to herself and others, and has mental health issues. The same was true for Lolly. She shouldn't have been in jail, but we have a messed up healthcare system that doesn't really address mental illness appropriately.

[mercfan3]

I think that's the point of her character. No she shouldn't be in jail, and no one has advocated for her. The only people who have taken care of her at all are her friends in prison. 

 

My unpopular opinion will probably always be that I really like Piper. I know she was an ass this season, but I still like her. 

[DianeDobbler]

I totally agree about Crazy Eyes. As directed, and as is played, Bailey had Poussey down, and then Crazy Eyes, who is no lightweight, kept throwing herself on him. It appeared to me half the time Bailey was frozen and forgot where his hand was vis a vis Poussey, because he was desperately trying to get the relentless Crazy Eyes off him, and every time she landed on him she brought Poussey that much closer to suffocation. IMO she is as culpable, if not more, for Poussey's death and doesn't belong in general pop.

What with cutting costs by stuffing the prison to the brim, I'd like Orange is the New Black to figure out that max is max, and medium or minimum security is minimum security, and it's unlikely that anyone would choose a MINIMUM security prison to stuff with hard cases, because that would pretty much turn it into something other than a minimum security prison, and a whole bunch of minimum security inmates would have grounds to get a court-mandate transfer on the grounds their sentence has suddenly become max security - against the law, I think. That "sometimes we're minimum, and sometimes we're a zoo" about that place drives me crazy based on everything I've read about minimum security. How many minimum security/max/in-between hybrids are there?

Cindy/Tova and the new Muslim prisoner (I didn't not get her name) went a little over-rapidly from adversaries to buddies, particularly the way they did it. They're both tough, smart, and sarcastic - I didn't believe the abrupt "You read that?" Me too!" Hi five! I believe they'd learn how to be allies and on the same wave length, but not that way.

Finally, could use with less focus on some of the guys, AND I thought Tastee coming out from the crowd to react to Pousey's body looked 100% theatre, not real.

Edited June 21, 2016 by DianeDobbler

[knaankos]

On September 4, 2015 at 3:55 PM, eXiled said:

Suzanne and Piper have become caricatures. It's like Uzo was told to act more mentally challenged and Taylor was told to play to the rafters--constant mugging and shouting. I hope Suzanne and Piper return to their Season One personalities.

\

They are not the only ones. Several characters are now caricatures. Suzanne, Piper, Lolly, Black Cindy are the worst offenders. I think it's the writers trying to make everyone so unique, but it's making it just unrealistic. 

[HeySandyStrange]

On 6/18/2016 at 5:01 PM, Chairperson Meow said:

I actually don't hate Healy that much.  I want to.  I feel like I should, but I see a lonely man who wants to help these women and believed he was but is now realizing that he hasn't been.  He grew up in a different time and is now realizing that he has his own baggage he never dealt with.  But a good therapist is one who needs a therapist.  Every good psychologist will tell you that.  I also find the parallels between him and Caputo so interesting.  Plus, it's just...damn.  If you've ever been the nerd or unpopular in school or socially awkward, you just feel for Healy.  

I agree totally with most of this. While Healy definitely can be close-minded, judgmental, and overbearing, the show has done a good job of showing how he got that way and giving glimpses of the lonely, well-meaning person underneath. It's hard for me not to feel some empathy for the guy when I see the sadness lurking under the surface. I have to give the actor props, he has done a great job humanizing the character while not glossing over Healy's more problematic traits and ideas.

[ciprus]

19 hours ago, DianeDobbler said:

I totally agree about Crazy Eyes. As directed, and as is played, Bailey had Poussey down, and then Crazy Eyes, who is no lightweight, kept throwing herself on him. It appeared to me half the time Bailey was frozen and forgot where his hand was vis a vis Poussey, because he was desperately trying to get the relentless Crazy Eyes off him, and every time she landed on him she brought Poussey that much closer to suffocation. IMO she is as culpable, if not more, for Poussey's death and doesn't belong in general pop.

That's the way I saw it too. I don't know if I think she's more culpable than Bayley since he and the other CO's are supposed to be professionals, but if not for her, Poussey would not have died. Suzanne is dangerous and she's had a hand in two innocent people dying. She's harmed several more, stalked and harassed people and I just wanted her to STFU in the finale. Her jabbering is no longer cute. I thought Taystee would lose her shit on her in the finale, but by some miracle she kept her cool.

[DianeDobbler]

I, personally, think Uzo Aduba (Suzanne) is more effective playing smart-funny than crazy-funny, and better at both than playing rage or/and vulnerable.  Suzanne is challenged, but smart in a bunch of ways. I think a favorite scene of mine was when she was being interrogated about V, and she was cooperative while also being alert for where the interrogation was going, and quite funny (smart) while doing it. But the bit with Poussey's death? And that doesn't even come into play in the investigation, that a heavyset inmate was constantly launching herself onto Bailey from a height (Bailey was on the ground himself, in a compromised position), driving him more forcefully into Poussey? There was nothing about that entire situation that was right, BUT, IMO that's mitigating in that particular event, and it's completely ignored. I do think Suzanne is dangerous and shouldn't be in general population. Furthermore I struggle as to how either she or Poussey remained in that weird, not-found-in-real-life synthesis of max, jail, and minimum security that describes Litchfield, given their respective family's resources. Suzanne doesn't belong in jail, nor does she belong in what passes for prison psych, since that's basically the lunatic asylum circa a couple of centuries ago. She belongs, IMO, in secured, assisted living. I know there are non-prison places like that.

Furthermore, minimum security is not a walk in the park, but that shit that happens on this show doesn't happen in minimum security as a regular thing, and I think if everything that HAS happened in minimum security happened in real life to the extent it has on this show, a whole lot of lawyers would be suing with the assertion this is not the sentence their client received. The only difference between max and minimum seems to be more bars to get through in order to travel from Point A to Point B.

There was quite a lot of writing to results this season, instead of earning it. I thought the camera did a 360 around Daya around five times too many at the season finale. This season also didn't pay enough attention to Taystee and Poussey to justify the ultra theatrical, ultra-choreographed moment when Taystee separated herself from the crowed, had her agony moment, and lay down beside Poussey's body. I was extremely distracted by how inorganic that looked and played. It just felt as if the show was up its own butt with that.

On the upside, I enjoyed Poussey's backstory. I am not the biggest fan of Samira Wiley's acting, but I thought that backstory, and that night in NY and how she looked, and how she played it, suited her to a tee and she did a great job.

P.S. - I rewatched to see if Daya pulled the trigger, as some here believe she did. I heard no shot, didn't see it happen. The scene cut to Poussey without Daya doing anything but hold the gun on him.

Edited June 22, 2016 by DianeDobbler