Race & Ethnicity On TV

[Joimiaroxeu]

Quote

But then critics also loved Greenleaf & Queen Sugar, and they both flopped too

I'm curious: by whose metrics/analysis have these shows been deemed "flops"? They've both done very well for OWN and been renewed for second seasons. I think it would probably be pointless to measure them against shows that aren't aimed at mostly non-White audiences, or use largely non-White aesthetics, or have premises based in non-White cultures--especially ones that aren't on broadcast networks.

[Neurochick]

5 hours ago, MissAlmond said:

I know hardcore baseball fans of all races/sexes/ages who most certainly would follow the progression of the first female baseball player, no matter her race, and discuss how she was doing incessantly.  None of them were interested in weekly watching a fictional first female baseball player whose stats were made up by a showrunner and career progression dictated by storyline. 

I'm confused.  What you described is a drama and isn't that what Pitch is?  It's not a documentary.

[MissAlmond]

46 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

I'm confused.  What you described is a drama and isn't that what Pitch is?  It's not a documentary.

They like to follow players stats, which is something hardcore baseball fans are passionate about.  Fictional characters stats are made up.  The success/failure of the first REAL female baseball player isn't the same as a fictional character whose fate most certainly has already been determined by the showrunner/writing staff.   When this type of fan wants to see baseball, they watch baseball.  Not a weekly drama about baseball.  This elusive difference is probably why Fogelman/FOX can't figure out why they aren't watching Pitch.  But I come from a baseball town and get it.

Edited December 19, 2016 by MissAlmond

[MissAlmond]

4 hours ago, ribboninthesky1 said:

I don't watch baseball - do you think a general, fictional show about baseball would have piqued hardcore fans' interest?

A movie, yes.  Tuning in every week for a fictional (not documentary)TV series? I just don't see it.  That's what fantasy baseball teams are for ;-)

ETA: Hmmm, until I just mentioned it, I had forgotten about fantasy baseball.  Now that's "fiction" real hardcore baseball fans would be interested in; many already play.  However, the big difference is while the baseball team is fictional, it's still using real players, their current stats and follow those players/stats throughout the season.  So if your best player is injured in real life and out for the season, your fantasy team has to reflect that.  If a TV show somehow managed to capture that (and the only thing I can see working is a live, interactive game show), yes hardcore baseball fans would probably tune in. 

Edited December 19, 2016 by MissAlmond
add'l comment

[Ms Blue Jay]

I'm pleasantly surprised that "Pitch" and "The Good Place" are named as safe bets to be renewed for second seasons.

http://tvline.com/2016/10/03/renewed-tv-shows-2017-renewal-scorecard-cancelled-series/3/

4 hours ago, ribboninthesky1 said:

I don't watch baseball - do you think a general, fictional show about baseball would have piqued hardcore fans' interest?

For me, yes.

For me, "This is Us" is a 'better' show than Pitch - better acting, less cliched writing, etc. - but I still enjoy the hell out of Pitch and absolutely love and appreciate the diversity.

Edited December 19, 2016 by Ms Blue Jay

[topanga]

23 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I'm pleasantly surprised that "Pitch" and "The Good Place" are named as safe bets to be renewed for second seasons.

http://tvline.com/2016/10/03/renewed-tv-shows-2017-renewal-scorecard-cancelled-series/3/

For me, yes.

For me, "This is Us" is a 'better' show than Pitch - better acting, less cliched writing, etc. - but I still enjoy the hell out of Pitch and absolutely love and appreciate the diversity.

I sure hope Pitch and The Good Place get renewed. I love both of those shows. 

And while I agree that This Is Us is a better made show than Pitch, I'm more emotionally invested in Pitch. Maybe because the lead character is a WOC. I still love This Is Us, mind you. It's one of the shows I look forward to every week. *Sigh* Is it January yet? 

[Ms Blue Jay]

1 hour ago, MissAlmond said:

They like to follow players stats, which is something hardcore baseball fans are passionate about.  Fictional characters stats are made up.  The success/failure of the first REAL female baseball player isn't the same as a fictional character whose fate most certainly has already been determined by the showrunner/writing staff.   When this type of fan wants to see baseball, they watch baseball.  Not a weekly drama about baseball.  This elusive difference is probably why Fogelman/FOX can't figure out why they aren't watching Pitch.  But I come from a baseball town and get it.

I'm a huge fan of baseball that also enjoys Pitch.  I think a lot of people who are interested in a real life subject are also interested in fictionalized accounts.  This is like saying a science fan wouldn't like science fiction.  I'm sure a lot of them do.

[ribboninthesky1]

3 hours ago, MissAlmond said:

When this type of fan wants to see baseball, they watch baseball.  Not a weekly drama about baseball.  This elusive difference is probably why Fogelman/FOX can't figure out why they aren't watching Pitch.  But I come from a baseball town and get it.

Interesting, thanks for sharing your perspective. I wonder how true that is for any fictional sports-themed show - like why watch fiction when they can see the real thing? Black women headlining drama and sci-fi is hot, and I wonder how much TPTB were counting on viewers that were very vocal in supporting shows like Sleepy Hollow and Empire. 

5 hours ago, xaxat said:

Yet, despite being a baseball fan and enjoying the pilot, I stopped watching after the first episode. Maybe I'll binge over the Holiday.

Maybe other fans felt the same. 

1 hour ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I'm a huge fan of baseball that also enjoys Pitch.  I think a lot of people who are interested in a real life subject are also interested in fictionalized accounts.  This is like saying a science fan wouldn't like science fiction.  I'm sure a lot of them do.

Thanks for sharing your perspective as well. Reading that article made me wonder if Sleepy Hollow's fate will drive renewal decisions for Pitch.  That's probably a reach, though. 

6 hours ago, DearEvette said:

And -- back on topic -- speaking of CBS, it really chaps my ass that they are stacking their WOC leads on shows on their All Access channel.  So in order to see Michelle Yeoh and Sonequa Martin-Green on Star Trek and Cush Gumbo & Erica Tazel on The Good Fight you have to pony up 6 to 10 bucks a month.  The message of course is if you want more diversity on CBS you have to pay extra for it.

I read elsewhere there's additional controversy - Martin-Green's character won't be a captain, which is unusual?  Not a Trekkie, so I'm not well-versed. So not only stuck behind a pay wall, but the lead can't even have the same rank? CBS...CBSing, as usual. 

[MissAlmond]

1 hour ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I'm a huge fan of baseball that also enjoys Pitch.  I think a lot of people who are interested in a real life subject are also interested in fictionalized accounts.

Look, I don't want to rag on Pitch and I hope for its fans sake the show is renewed.  FOX is having a horrible year so, in spite of the low ratings, it wouldn't surprise me if they did renew it.  And yes, certainly there are sports fans who enjoy fictionalized accounts.  But experts have repeatedly said TV shows based on sports usually don't do well ratings wise (NBC had to work out special arrangements with Direct-TV to continue Friday Night Lights) and some worried about Pitch's chances of success (or let's leave it at high ratings) for this very reason.  The TV audience today is greatly fragmented, so why is it hard to believe a lot of people who enjoy sports keep their dials tuned to sports channels?

 I guess my biggest beef is with Dan Fogelman running around claiming Pitch's low ratings were due to some not accepting the female lead.  It drives me crazy when entertainment people run around making all sorts of excuses for low ratings when the truth sometimes is staring them in the face.  Didn't he go "hmmm" when FOX itself didn't give a damn their scripted shows were pre-empted during the Cubs-Indians World Series and instead danced in the hallways when Game 7 was guaranteed?  Fogelman, like another certain show about to return to FOX, should have taken a hard look on who his audience might really consist of instead of getting snitty at those who didn't tune in the way he thought they should. 

Edited December 20, 2016 by MissAlmond

[Ms Blue Jay]

3 minutes ago, MissAlmond said:

The TV audience today is greatly fragmented, so why is it hard to believe a lot of people who enjoy sports keep their dials tuned to sports channels?

Pitch is on while the baseball season isn't.  It's a perfect match for certain baseball fans like me.  There's a bunch of people who switched from live-tweeting baseball to live-tweeting this show.  

[MissAlmond]

55 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Pitch is on while the baseball season isn't.  It's a perfect match for certain baseball fans like me.  There's a bunch of people who switched from live-tweeting baseball to live-tweeting this show.  

Pitch "was" on during the baseball season.  FOX moved the air date to coincide as it led up to the playoffs.

 Blue Jay, I'm not doubting you and I'm happy you enjoy the show.  But I'm talking about ratings and why many thought the show never took off the way Fogelman/FOX thought it would and Fogelman's never ending spin. A TV series isn't a one-off fictional account like a book or movie, in Pitch's case it was a 10 week commitment.  The sports fans "I" know weren't interested in investing their time with Pitch. One huge reason is this first fictional female baseball player's stats were made up by a team of writers.  The hardcore baseball fans I know are deeply into stats.  They know the stats, not only of their own favorite teams, but the opposing ones they're slated to go up against.  That's what makes the game interesting to them. When the baseball season ends, a lot turn their attention to fantasy baseball teams which requires knowing real player stats - again!  That's just how they roll. 

However, I now return this board back to its regularly scheduled discussions since this conversation is no longer on topic and might go into extra innings. 

Edited December 20, 2016 by MissAlmond

[Trini]

Relevant to this thread and the Fox discussion: Black Lightning is in development at Fox.

Quote

Black Lightning, the big DC drama package with Greg Berlanti (Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl) producing and Mara Brock Akil & Salim Akil (The Game, Being Mary Jane) writing and producing, has landed at Fox with a pilot production commitment. ...

... Black Lightning was one of DC Comics’ first major African-American superheroes, making his debut in 1977. In the books, Jefferson has two daughters, both of whom have followed in his superhero footsteps: Anissa Pierce, aka Thunder, who is a member of the Outsiders, and Jennifer Pierce, aka Lightning, recruited by the Justice Society of America. ...

 

The only other superhero/comic book TV series (that I know of) with a black lead have been Luke Cage, Blade, and M.A.N.T.I.S. (<-- Anybody remember that one??)

[ribboninthesky1]

I believe there was Spawn as well in the 90s, but I think it was animated vs live action?  Never heard of M.A.N.T.I.S - learn something new everyday!

[Trini]

Yeah, MANTIS was short-lived, but I remember watching it as a kid because, yeah, not many (or any) shows with a black superhero.

[DearEvette]

Anybody planning to watch Emerald City?  Dorothy is Latina and much older.  The cast is international and diverse and the story looks much darker.  The visuals look pretty interesting.

 

[allyw]

1 hour ago, Trini said:

Relevant to this thread and the Fox discussion: Black Lightning is in development at Fox.

 

The only other superhero/comic book TV series (that I know of) with a black lead have been Luke Cage, Blade, and M.A.N.T.I.S. (<-- Anybody remember that one??)

This seem like something I would watch but I hate Fox.

[jhlipton]

5 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

For me, "This is Us" is a 'better' show than Pitch - better acting, less cliched writing, etc. - but I still enjoy the hell out of Pitch and absolutely love and appreciate the diversity.

For me, it's the opposite.  I enjoy This Is Us, buy love the way Pitch subverts a lot of the tropes -- Cara deleting video from her phone, Ginny and Mike acting like adults after realizing their attraction to each other. 

2 hours ago, ribboninthesky1 said:

Martin-Green's character won't be a captain, which is unusual?  Not a Trekkie, so I'm not well-versed. So not only stuck behind a pay wall, but the lead can't even have the same rank? CBS...CBSing, as usual. 

 Benjamin Sisko (Deep Space-9, the best of the Star Trek serieses) started as a Commander and became Captain later. Maybe it's a black thing (not entirely kidding). 

1 hour ago, DearEvette said:

Anybody planning to watch Emerald City?

I'll give it a look-see, but I'm not holding my breath...

[Ms Blue Jay]

People who like baseball for the statistics is a particular group, though.  A lot of people like baseball for other reasons besides statistics!  Some people like baseball for the drama, the machinations behind the scenes, the players, being able to look up to successful people in the public eye who we can relate to or who look like us (and by this I mean players of different races), for the game itself, to cheer on a team to win, the list is endless, and a lot of these themes relate to the show Pitch.  I watch every baseball game that my team plays and I barely care about statistics.  I know other people like me as well.  Just giving a different perspective.  

@jhlipton, interesting viewpoint.  I'm such an admirer of Milo and Sterling's acting that it pretty much leaves other television actors in the dust in comparison, but I like thinking of the ways I could find Pitch superior.  Just the fact that the star of the show is a black woman makes it subversive in my eyes.  But This is Us was also extremely clever in 'forcing' mainstream America to relate to a black man.

I'm really disappointed that The Good Fight and Star Trek Discovery are on this CBS All Access channel.  I already spend so much money on cable.  That makes me really sad, because I definitely want to watch both.

Edited December 20, 2016 by Ms Blue Jay

[Irlandesa]

10 hours ago, Dee said:

Out averaging CW shows isn't exactly a huge deal, because CW shows are routinely among the lowest rated shows on television.

True but the CW is available in about 30% more homes than OWN. 

5 hours ago, topanga said:

And while I agree that This Is Us is a better made show than Pitch, I'm more emotionally invested in Pitch. Maybe because the lead character is a WOC. I still love This Is Us, mind you. It's one of the shows I look forward to every week. *Sigh* Is it January yet? 

I am too but I think it has to do with the fact that I see Pitch as a workplace drama which is more my thing than a family drama.  However, I do think it's one thing that could be damning the show as well.  Some might not see it as a workplace drama but rather a show in the sports genre which is a tougher sell.  I gave up on TIU rather quickly because, like I said, family dramas aren't my thing.  I could change my mind but everything I read indicates twists/revelations are becoming its signature. Great drama while the ideas are flowing but it can become painful once they dry up yet you still need them. I'm happy that Pitch started to move away from flashbacks/twists.

2 hours ago, MissAlmond said:

I guess my biggest beef is with Dan Fogelman running around claiming Pitch's low ratings were due to some not accepting the female lead.  It drives me crazy when entertainment people run around making all sorts of excuses for low ratings when the truth sometimes is staring them in the face.  Didn't he go "hmmm" when FOX itself didn't give a damn their scripted shows were pre-empted during the Cubs-Indians World Series and instead danced in the hallways when Game 7 was guaranteed?  Fogelman, like another certain show about to return to FOX, should have taken a hard look on who his audience might really consist of instead of getting snitty at those who didn't tune in the way he thought they should. 

I've read a lot of Pitch interviews and I don't recall him saying this.  Was it on Twitter?  Or in an interview for his other show?

I think the hope was that the promotion during the World Series would help the show. I don't know if it would have been better to wait until spring or if going in the fall was the right plan.

[In2You]

My thing with Pitch is that most of the episodes were damn boring.  Also Ginny as a African American woman would have her owe struggles I  a sport that boasts a very white lineup and audience however none of that was ever a factor. the writers were too busy trying to be faux progressive while falling to the same old tropes by pushing her towards Mike.

[In2You]

On 12/18/2016 at 7:56 PM, maraleia said:

Pitch is on FOX that's why it's underperforming. They haven't given it any promotional coverage outside of their own network.

I don't know why people keep saying this when the show had plenty of promo outside of the regular Fox channel prior to its premiere. 

[MissAlmond]

11 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

People who like baseball for the statistics is a particular group, though.  A lot of people like baseball for other reasons besides statistics!  Some people like baseball for the drama, the machinations behind the scenes, the players, being able to look up to successful people in the public eye who we can relate to or who look like us (and by this I mean players of different races), for the game itself, to cheer on a team to win, the list is endless, and a lot of these themes relate to the show Pitch.  I watch every baseball game that my team plays and I barely care about statistics.  I know other people like me as well.  Just giving a different perspective.  

MLB's own website has a section on each player's stats and talks about the connection between statistics and the game . . .

Quote

For more than a century, statistics have been a staple of the game of baseball. Arguably no sport has a closer relationship with the stats that chronicle its every play.

Although the baseball industry has undergone a drastic and well-chronicled evolution in the statistical realm, many basic numbers have nonetheless maintained significant importance.

True, standard stats are rarely the central focus of Major League Baseball's decision makers -- who often utilize proprietary metrics -- yet they are ubiquitous in baseball writing and mass media. As such, most baseball fans have at least a basic understanding of the terms defined in this section.

Standard stats are widely used by those who play fantasy baseball.

 . . .and the only behind the scene machinations I care about is our manager putting together a winning team.  But having these two different perspectives is closer to the reason why Pitch's ratings weren't what Fogelman/FOX thought they would be. 

Now I'm off to do some last minute Christmas shopping.

[proserpina65]

14 hours ago, ribboninthesky1 said:

I wonder how true that is for any fictional sports-themed show - like why watch fiction when they can see the real thing?

Speaking as a hard-core fan of English and European football (soccer), I can say I'm not really interested in watching the few shows I've ever come across which follow a fictional football/soccer club, simply because it can't match the weirdness and excitement of the real thing.  That said, I did watch the hell out of Footballers' Wives when BBC America ran it, because it was almost more ridiculous than real-life.  Almost.

[memememe76]

Pitch took longer for me to connect. Flashbacks don't work on that show. 

I think the show is pretty diverse. Three prominent black characters, 2 Hispanic characters, 3 white characters and an Asian character. Granted, it took awhile for the writers to write Blip and Evelyn in an interesting way. I am to the point now that I will follow Evelyn'so journey as close I do Ginny's.

[Raja]

On 12/19/2016 at 4:55 PM, Trini said:

 

 

The only other superhero/comic book TV series (that I know of) with a black lead have been Luke Cage, Blade, and M.A.N.T.I.S. (<-- Anybody remember that one??)

 

On 12/19/2016 at 5:28 PM, ribboninthesky1 said:

I believe there was Spawn as well in the 90s, but I think it was animated vs live action?  Never heard of M.A.N.T.I.S - learn something new everyday!

I remember him, the star was one of the detectives on Cagney and Lacey.

[GHScorpiosRule]

On 12/19/2016 at 8:28 PM, ribboninthesky1 said:

I believe there was Spawn as well in the 90s, but I think it was animated vs live action?  Never heard of M.A.N.T.I.S - learn something new everyday!

 

43 minutes ago, Raja said:

 

I remember him, the star was one of the detectives on Cagney and Lacey.

Carl Lumbly, who also voiced Martian Manhunter, J'onn Jones on JL/JLU!

[Kel Varnsen]

On ‎2016‎-‎12‎-‎19 at 7:55 PM, Trini said:

Relevant to this thread and the Fox discussion: Black Lightning is in development at Fox.

 

The only other superhero/comic book TV series (that I know of) with a black lead have been Luke Cage, Blade, and M.A.N.T.I.S. (<-- Anybody remember that one??)

Which is actually a pretty good average for black males. Googling tells me they make up about 7% of the US population, and I don't think there have been 40 super hero shows. Of course it does show how other demographics aren't doing so good.

[Trini]

1 hour ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Which is actually a pretty good average for black males. Googling tells me they make up about 7% of the US population, and I don't think there have been 40 super hero shows. Of course it does show how other demographics aren't doing so good.

It's not.

If we only count live-action TV shows adapted from comic books (based on these lists), there's 53. 2 out of 53 is only 3.8%. There are even more if we count superhero shows not directly from comics -- like Heroes, Bionic Woman, No Ordinary Family, Power Rangers, etc. (Maybe even shows like Chuck and Buffy tVS)

Edited December 22, 2016 by Trini

[In2You]

On 11/28/2016 at 7:03 PM, nosleepforme said:

Well, they had at least one Black character audition for the musical with Mrs. Patty and Babette lusting for him if I remember correctly. And wasn't there a woman of color too when Lorelai went "hiking" in the last part? Not exactly progress, but you take what you can get.

 

Most of the new characters were people that the Palladinos knew from other stuff they've done (Bunheads) or had a Parenthood-connection. I wouldn't call it casting as much as "shoehorning people you know into the show". 

We shouldn't be "taking what we can get". That's the kind of excuse that has these white producers and writers continuously ignoring calls for diversity.

Static Shock was a cartoon I loved as a kid and as a fan of Black Lightening I've been asking about a show for him for years. I hope his daughters are also included.

[Silver Raven]

20 hours ago, Trini said:

It's not.

If we only count live-action TV shows adapted from comic books (based on these lists), there's 53. 2 out of 53 is only 3.8%. There are even more if we count superhero shows not directly from comics -- like Heroes, Bionic Woman, No Ordinary Family, Power Rangers, etc. (Maybe even shows like Chuck and Buffy tVS)

The Greatest American Hero ...

[Dee]

Speaking of Buffy, if there was ever a show/'universe' in the modern television era that received a constant free pass on its incessant racism, it's BtVS/AtS.

Edited December 23, 2016 by Dee

[vibeology]

13 hours ago, Dee said:

Speaking of Buffy, if there was ever a show/'universe' in the modern television era that received a constant free pass on its incessant racism, it's BtVS/AtS.

No kidding. I love Buffy and Angel but when I watch it now its insane just how white it is (in Southern California!!!!!) and how poorly the two shows dealt with race issues when they bothered to acknowledge them at all. J August Richards did so much to save Gunn from being a flat out stereotype and still the episodes where he's with his vampire fighting gang make me cringe for the way they portray black people.

Buffy was even worse. Kendra was just so poorly written, Forrest was there I guess and then the show spent it's final season making jokes about how funny it was that a girl from China spoke Chinese.

I love the shows and I didn't notice these things as a teenager in the late 90s/early 2000s but I see them now as an adult and I don't get how people who lived in LA (mostly Joss, but I'll hold Noxon, Greenwalt, Minear, Fury, Petrie, Bell, Espenson, DeKnight and Rand Kirshner responsible) at the time didn't think it was strange that their shows were full of white people when that wouldn't have been the demographics around them at the time.

[ribboninthesky1]

16 hours ago, Dee said:

Speaking of Buffy, if there was ever a show/'universe' in the modern television era that received a constant free pass on its incessant racism, it's BtVS/AtS.

But lissen, Joss!is!feminist! So he deserves all the praise! Get on board, Dee. /sarcasm 

I never watched either show, and I'm okay with that. 

Edited December 23, 2016 by ribboninthesky1

[LeeLeePanda]

On 12/19/2016 at 8:28 PM, ribboninthesky1 said:

I believe there was Spawn as well in the 90s, but I think it was animated vs live action?  Never heard of M.A.N.T.I.S - learn something new everyday!

Spawn was animated and featured at least one black writer (Gerard Brown, who is a relative of mine!).

[ribboninthesky1]

Cool, @LeeLeePanda! Is he still in the industry? Does he share any perspectives on how the industry has evolved from a writer's perspective?

[DearEvette]

SYFY just cast the character of Bobbie Draper in their show The Expanse.  In the books Bobbie is a tall, imposing amazonian soldier of Polynesian heritage.  They cast an actress named Frankie Adams who is a 6 foot tall amazonian boxer of Samoan heritage.  I haven't read the books but from what I hear the casting is spot on.  Good on them.  The Expanse is already light years ahead of many shows in their ethnic diversity across the board.

[Neurochick]

14 hours ago, DearEvette said:

SYFY just cast the character of Bobbie Draper in their show The Expanse.  In the books Bobbie is a tall, imposing amazonian soldier of Polynesian heritage.  They cast an actress named Frankie Adams who is a 6 foot tall amazonian boxer of Samoan heritage.  I haven't read the books but from what I hear the casting is spot on.  Good on them.  The Expanse is already light years ahead of many shows in their ethnic diversity across the board.

I'm thinking of watching season 1 of this show.  It's on Amazon Prime.  Is it worth it?

[DearEvette]

I love it.  But....  it took me awhile to get into it.  The first episode is rather a slog and my first time out I gave up because it felt a little too expositiony.  But I came to it again after the show had aired all of its episodes and I was in a different mind-set and I binged it.  I think this is a show where bingeing works to its advantage.  It builds momentum and you get to know the characters real well and the storyline -- disparate seeming at first -- converge very nicely toward the end.

If you already have Prime then I say go for it.  I am re-watching in prep for season II.

[Raja]

4 hours ago, Neurochick said:

I'm thinking of watching season 1 of this show.  It's on Amazon Prime.  Is it worth it?

The Expanse is the closest thing to hard Science Fiction to air in a while. It may be the jewel in the crown of SyFy network reemergence into genre shows.

[ribboninthesky1]

I'm about 5 episodes in, and I enjoy it a lot.  The only thing that bugs me is having to use subtitles because there's a fair share of mumbling, muzzled dialogue mixed in with some kind of patois (of course, if you're used to patois, it's probably not an issue).  I hate using subtitles. But I like the details - I've already rewatched parts of episodes to keep all of the puzzle pieces together. 

[Haleth]

On 1/3/2017 at 8:06 PM, DearEvette said:

SYFY just cast the character of Bobbie Draper in their show The Expanse.  In the books Bobbie is a tall, imposing amazonian soldier of Polynesian heritage.  They cast an actress named Frankie Adams who is a 6 foot tall amazonian boxer of Samoan heritage.  I haven't read the books but from what I hear the casting is spot on.  Good on them.  The Expanse is already light years ahead of many shows in their ethnic diversity across the board.

You're going to love Bobbie.

[Danny Franks]

On 04/01/2017 at 1:06 AM, DearEvette said:

SYFY just cast the character of Bobbie Draper in their show The Expanse.  In the books Bobbie is a tall, imposing amazonian soldier of Polynesian heritage.  They cast an actress named Frankie Adams who is a 6 foot tall amazonian boxer of Samoan heritage.  I haven't read the books but from what I hear the casting is spot on.  Good on them.  The Expanse is already light years ahead of many shows in their ethnic diversity across the board.

Bobbie is going to be awesome as well. She's a favourite of nearly everyone who reads the novels, but I was one of many worried that they'd never find anyone who fit the casting requirements. Fortunately, Frankie Adams looks perfect for the role.

The Expanse has been particularly good at casting diversity, and keeping with the diversity of the books. Naomi and Avasarala, the two other main female characters,  are played by British-Dominican and Iranian actors. Of the four main male characters, one is Indian-Canadian. And a lot of the secondary and tertiary characters are played by actors of various ethnic backgrounds.

Part of the reason for this is that, in the world envisioned by the authors, ethnic identity is really a thing of the past. Most people are a lot more polygenetic, like Naomi in the books being described as a mix of African, Asian and South American. The main 'racial' signifiers are whether your were born on Earth, Mars or the Belt, not whether your skin is a different colour. 

[jhlipton]

6 hours ago, Danny Franks said:

The main 'racial' signifiers are whether your were born on Earth, Mars or the Belt, not whether your skin is a different colour. 

In most shows, they would use that as an excuse to use white or mixed people only.

If I can dip into the world of movies for a second, what do the fine folk here think of Ruth Negga playing Mildred Loving?

[Neurochick]

On 1/4/2017 at 2:32 PM, Raja said:

The Expanse is the closest thing to hard Science Fiction to air in a while. It may be the jewel in the crown of SyFy network reemergence into genre shows.

I watched the first two episodes, I think I'll stay. 

I laughed though when I saw the UN building still in the same spot after 200 years, I guess no more superstorms ever hit Manhattan.  Also the Freedom Tower and the Statue of Liberty are still there; I guess to show the audience that "this is New York City."

Edited January 5, 2017 by Neurochick

[ribboninthesky1]

1 hour ago, jhlipton said:

If I can dip into the world of movies for a second, what do the fine folk here think of Ruth Negga playing Mildred Loving?

From what I've read, Mildred identified as "Indian" vs black or Negro, so I've no particular opinion of Negga's casting. 

[Silver Raven]

I keep wondering why we have to keep getting British and Australian actors to play Americans.

[BoogieBurns]

1 hour ago, jhlipton said:

If I can dip into the world of movies for a second, what do the fine folk here think of Ruth Negga playing Mildred Loving?

She looked a heck of a lot like her, so it's easier for me to make that leap. I don't actually know anything about Negga, except that she is on the cover on a magazine at my house and it catches my eye every time I pass. Whatever race she is, I am a fan of her vibe. If Zoe Saldana looked anything like Nina Simone, people may have been more forgiving. Or Zendaya with Aaliyah, etc. 

[Ceindreadh]

50 minutes ago, Silver Raven said:

I keep wondering why we have to keep getting British and Australian actors to play Americans.

Ruth Negga is Irish/Ethiopian, not British. 

[DearEvette]

2 hours ago, BoogieBurns said:

I don't actually know anything about Negga, except that she is on the cover on a magazine at my house and it catches my eye every time I pass. Whatever race she is, I am a fan of her vibe.

I enjoy her work.  I keep stumbling across her in shows I watch.  She was on Misfits -- that was where I first saw her and really liked her in that.  Then I came across her in this show called Love/Hate.  I wasn't crazy about the show but I liked her.  I tuned in for Preacher just for her and she is fantastic as Tulip O'hare in that.  She is my dream cast for River Tyburn if they ever get around to making Ben Aaronvotich's Rivers of London book(s) into a series.

I also thinks she looks like Mildred Loving and I also think they did a good job of casting Joel Egerton because he also closely resembles Richard.

[Silver Raven]

5 hours ago, Ceindreadh said:

Ruth Negga is Irish/Ethiopian, not British. 

Same thing.  :)

 

Just kidding.