S07.E08: The Cavi-Art Of War

[WireWrap]

Heather didn't just commented casually if Sonja's line would be sold at K-Mart , we all saw the previous scenes with her remarks about how a picture doesn't make a line, how a dress doesn't mean anything and while all that is true the fact remains IMO that Heather seemed to be a little bit irritated that Sonja even dare to show up with a dress from her collection.

 

Kristen was nice enough to admit that in the past she has been catty about Sonja and her products, Bethenny was honest enough to admit that she had thought this was all a fantasy but seemed really excited when she found out that Sonja actually had some clothes in her line, Sonja will never set the world on fire with her collection, heck she probably won't be able to sell a dozen of dresses as overpriced as they are but in last night episode she was at an event where she was trying to showcase her collection, would it have killed Heather to be a little bit more gracious?

 

I wonder how would Heather react if one of her castmates would question Heather's investors at one of her YT events and ask her if the line will be sold at the dollar stores? Heather would go ballistic.

1 dress does not make a "collection" though, Heather was right about that and the party was not so that she, Sonja, could showcase her clothing line, it was about being on a magazine cover (a magazine no one ever heard of before or since BTW). She only wore 1 of her dresses in the article, the 1 she wore at the party, all of the others were by a different designer. Oh, and Heather did say the dress Sonja had on was beautiful.

[TexasGal]

The best part of that job application is in the screen cap from the write-up.... What types of computer software are you proficient in? And she answered "Micros(??)", Instagram, Tinder, Word, and Twitter". OMG I'm dying.

(Oh!  I can be helpful!)  I work in the restaurant industry, Micros is software used for orders, receipts, etc.  So, she must have had some actual relevant work experience, in addition to her fabulous knowledge of Instagram, Tinder, Twitter and staplers.

 

Lu looked amazing at the caviar dinner.  I loved that red lipstick on her.

[jennylauren123]

The thing about having a bad childhood and then becoming successful as an adult is that it can make you very thankful for all that you have and for all that you have accomplished.

 

You're also thankful for being more in control of the trajectory of your life than you were as a helpless child. You get a chance to be the amazing parent that your parents couldn't be.

 

Beth really needs to develop--and this is a cliche--an attitude of gratitude. She's hurting herself by being so negative, and she's hurting her daughter, too, who could grow up thinking that life is miserable, based on the tears and stress her mother exhibits so often.

[jaync]

I appreciate that Bethenny puts her weekends with her daughter above a weekend at Dorinda's house in the Berkshires, which looked beautiful by the way in the promo for the next episode.

Except she didn't put her daughter above the weekend, since she does go to the Berkshires. (Which she probably whined and bitched about once she got there.)

[Neerbeena]

Ramona was clearly drunk at Dorinda's party.  Same old Ramona who talks shit about the other women to their faces but any kind of criticism makes her nasty and vindictive.  It looks like Dorinda replaced Sonya as her closest, bestest friend. 

 

The lighting in that room made all the ladies look fantastic, particularly LuAnn and Dorinda.  

 

Kristin and her clothes are beyond gorgeous.

 

Bethenny gives me a headache and enough of those fake shrink sessions.

[Boofish]

I think I have a soft spot for Carol and Heather because it seems to be the only genuine friendship in this entire franchise.

[Vicky8675309]

I've completely gone off Heather. Bossy bitch who wishes ill will on her "friend" Sonja. I realize they aren't friends but I don't like her throwing shade on her delusional colleague. Bitch couldn't even pick Target or Macy's.

I'm liking Bethanny and can feel her pain. If she is acting then give her an Emmy. I'm sure people are not polite all the time with their therapist especially when dealing with touchy/sensitive issues. It seemed healthy and natural that she got upset when he pushed her and got confrontational and then started to deal with the issue. I'm sure there is projection and a whole host of other defenses that go up and a good therapist helps with getting past all that (but I defer to people who do therapy or have had therapy…though I am sure I need it…lol)

Edited May 27, 2015 by Vicky8675309

[izabella]

If Heather is wishing ill on Sonja, she can come sit by me so I can pour her a drink.  I haven't forgotten that Sonja defrauded those people out of millions of dollars.  Has she even been forced to pay that after her appeal was lost?  Are those people still waiting for her to pay a penny of that judgement , while she plays Lady of the Crumbling Manor on the UES and gets gold facials and goes on trips with "the girls"?

[WireWrap]

I've completely gone off Heather. Bossy bitch who wishes ill will on her "friend" Sonja. I realize they aren't friends but I don't like her throwing shade on her delusional colleague. Bitch couldn't even pick Target or Macy's.

I'm liking Bethanny and can feel her pain. If she is acting then give her an Emmy. I'm sure people are not polite all the time with their therapist especially when dealing with touchy/sensitive issues. It seemed healthy and natural that she got upset when he pushed her and got confrontational and then started to deal with the issue. I'm sure there is projection and a whole host of other defenses that go up and a good therapist helps with getting past all that (but I defer to people who do therapy or have had therapy…though I am sure I need it…lol)

But she isn't in therapy at all, this is just for the show, she does not see this DR or any therapist once filming ends. This was/is all about excusing/explaining her caustic behavior to everyone in her life, it is nothing more than a PR move IMO. 

If Heather is wishing ill on Sonja, she can come sit by me so I can pour her a drink.  I haven't forgotten that Sonja defrauded those people out of millions of dollars.  Has she even been forced to pay that after her appeal was lost?  Are those people still waiting for her to pay a penny of that judgement , while she plays Lady of the Crumbling Manor on the UES and gets gold facials and goes on trips with "the girls"?

The last I heard/read, they have not been paid anything! Not. 1. single. cent.

[MatildaMoody]

But she isn't in therapy at all, this is just for the show, she does not see this DR or any therapist once filming ends. This was/is all about excusing/explaining her caustic behavior to everyone in her life, it is nothing more than a PR move IMO. 

 

How do you know she isn't in therapy at all? I get this guy being just for the show because no reputable Shrink would allow their sessions to be filmed, but how does that equal to she is not getting ANY therapy off the show? 

[LotusFlower]

If Heather is wishing ill on Sonja, she can come sit by me so I can pour her a drink.  I haven't forgotten that Sonja defrauded those people out of millions of dollars.  Has she even been forced to pay that after her appeal was lost?  Are those people still waiting for her to pay a penny of that judgement , while she plays Lady of the Crumbling Manor on the UES and gets gold facials and goes on trips with "the girls"?

WORD! She lost the appeal and yet is still doing everything in her power to not pay up.

[sasha206]

 

Dorinda’s still a puzzle to me.  She obviously has some kind of hostility towards John.  He must really lay it down in the bedroom because I don’t really get them.  And it’s not my job to get them – she’s entitled to be happy with whomever.  But somebody who’s truly happy with someone will not sit by and calmly film scenes about how disgusting everybody else in the room thinks he is.  She had no problem telling him in no uncertain terms to back off her daughter – she couldn’t find the words to tell that room full of bitches “enough!”?

 

True, although to me, she just looked shocked and hurt and was trying hard to keep it under control before John came back. 

 

I think it's one of those things where even though you bitch about your parents or lover, you don't appreciate someone else bitching to you about them.  

[izabella]

True, although to me, she just looked shocked and hurt and was trying hard to keep it under control before John came back. 

 

Dorinda looked terribly hurt, and I'm surprised she didn't push Ramona out of her chair.  At the very least she should have smirked at her and said she wasn't going to take any criticism about her boyfriend from a woman who is still bringing salmon to her serial cheater husband and wishing he would come back to her.

[Avaleigh]

I don't know what to think about Heather's intentions regarding the Kmart comment. Heather is a smart person so she'd have to know that Sonja isn't going to be able to luck out in getting a huge retailer like Kmart or Target or whatever and it doesn't matter if those aren't high end they're still out of Sonja's league IMHO. Then of course we have the fact that Heather knows perfectly well how delusional Sonja is so no way do I think that Heather imagines Sonja envisioning her line ending up in Kmart even though that would be a great accomplishment for her. Sonja is the person who stupidly talks about how Diddy comes on her yacht or whatever the hell she said--of course this nutty lady is going to think that her line is going to end up at Saks or Bloomingdales.

 

I also got a vibe of Heather wanting to point out that there isn't anything wrong with Kmart was her way of trying to score points with the average viewer. I agree with her points I just felt like she was unnecessarily mentioning something that viewers already know as a way to emphasize the fact that Sonja thinks she's above being associated with that type of retailer. I already know that Sonja is a ridiculous and delusional mess so having Heather come across as a little aggressive there seems a little mean spirited.

 

At the end of the day though I obviously don't have any problem with mocking Sonja myself and I think Sonja should hear the truth about herself more than she does. I thought Kristen's apology sounded ridiculous. I guess she was just trying to be nice but I thought it made her sound kind of stupid. 

 

Sonja's desperation just oozes through my screen. I'll pity her but then she'll say something and I remember all the ridiculous things she's said and done over the years and it minimizes the sympathy I feel for her.

No,  the best line of the night was when the job applicant was asked so where are you now?  The response:  I'm here.  Priceless.  The stapler was gravy.

Easily my favorite bit in the episode. It felt genuine to me.

 

I feel sorry for Dorinda. It has to be hard to be the new one on these shows. I know they all make fun of each other but I got the impression that Dorinda felt like she was probably being mocked hardcore behind her back about John.

 

I haven't seen every episode this season and I'm behind on the threads but does something seem off about Dorinda's voice to anyone else? She sounds sort of slurry to me like she takes a lot of pills. I don't know, I just get that constantly medicated vibe.

Edited May 27, 2015 by Avaleigh

[ancslove]

I still like both Heather and Bethenny, and it's been fun watching them circle each other. I do think that it's different when you bring up a sensitive personal issue as a conversation topic, and someone else brings it up. I can't blame Bethenny for wanting any talk about her daughter or her divorce to be on *her* terms. And I think Heather would give that consideration to Luann or Carole, but she's not thinking like that yet with Beth.

[Avaleigh]

Dorinda looked terribly hurt, and I'm surprised she didn't push Ramona out of her chair.  At the very least she should have smirked at her and said she wasn't going to take any criticism about her boyfriend from a woman who is still bringing salmon to her serial cheater husband and wishing he would come back to her.

It must be hard to adjust to the cameras the first time around. Finding out things like this on camera--I don't know, I feel like I'd be mortified. 

 

I will say that I appreciated that Luann could at least sort of own that she'd said something unlike Ramona who suffers from some sort of disease when it comes to rarely being able to admit any wrongdoing. I agree with those who don't think Ramona has changed at all she'd just been taken down a few pegs. She's just as thoughtless, insensitive, obnoxious, and selfish as she's always been. Sure I feel sorry for her for what happened with Mario, but I can't ignore the way that she treats people whether we're talking about co-workers, friends, employees, or family.

[Thumper]

I couldn't even listen to/follow that whole caviar blow-up.  Ack!!  I wanted to enjoy the caviar experience at a posh place I will probably never get to.  (Not sure I'd like caviar, but that is beside the point.)  I just can't with the arguing and fighting.  Makes me anxious.  These women are so confrontational.

 

As for Beth and WWHL, when I saw it was just her and Andy, I "clicked".  Figured it was just more of the Betthany Redemption Tour.

[JennyMominFL]

OK, I know this is silly but can someone tell me exactly what Carole's Trader Joe item was.  There is a pretty new one here in Orlando and I want to get one,lol

[WireWrap]

How do you know she isn't in therapy at all? I get this guy being just for the show because no reputable Shrink would allow their sessions to be filmed, but how does that equal to she is not getting ANY therapy off the show? 

Bethenny has said that this Dr/therapist is the only one she has gone to. I take her at her word on this as she is still singing the same old sad song from years ago, she has not moved on 1 bit IMO.

 

I still like both Heather and Bethenny, and it's been fun watching them circle each other. I do think that it's different when you bring up a sensitive personal issue as a conversation topic, and someone else brings it up. I can't blame Bethenny for wanting any talk about her daughter or her divorce to be on *her* terms. And I think Heather would give that consideration to Luann or Carole, but she's not thinking like that yet with Beth.

Heather did not bring up the subject that night, Bethenny did and has throughout the entire season so far. IMO Heather was just trying to show support/sympathy with/for Bethenny.

[lunastartron]

Heather's reference to K-Mart "disrespects those who have spent years honing the craft" of translating Grey Gardensesque psychosis into "sexy J" sartorialism. Would Little Edie ever shop at a chain store? I don't think so! Sonja's chagrin at Heather's remarks makes at least as much sense as the premise that "it was kind of like writing an e-mail (for me)" constitutes an attack . . . Heather is free to disdain and dislike Sonja. Lady Morgan has never really been a good friend to her. But, for me, Heather's tunnel-vision focus on Sonja undermines the idea that Heather is quick to make amends and/or move on. I get it - Sonja has been, at various points, rude and entitled in her conduct toward Holla - but then why continue the pretense of being so interested in Sonja's projects and welfare? Just two weeks ago, she was screaming that she would NEVER enter Sonja's vestibule again. And yet we're now watching her don a well-wisher mask in the guise of supporting Sonja while hustling to find Kristen in order to talk sh*t the first chance she gets.

[WireWrap]

Heather's reference to K-Mart "disrespects those who have spent years honing the craft" of translating Grey Gardensesque psychosis into "sexy J" sartorialism. Would Little Edie ever shop at a chain store? I don't think so! Sonja's chagrin at Heather's remarks makes at least as much sense as the premise that "it was kind of like writing an e-mail (for me)" constitutes an attack . . . Heather is free to disdain and dislike Sonja. Lady Morgan has never really been a good friend to her. But, for me, Heather's tunnel-vision focus on Sonja undermines the idea that Heather is quick to make amends and/or move on. I get it - Sonja has been, at various points, rude and entitled in her conduct toward Holla - but then why continue the pretense of being so interested in Sonja's projects and welfare? Just two weeks ago, she was screaming that she would NEVER enter Sonja's vestibule again. And yet we're now watching her don a well-wisher mask in the guise of supporting Sonja while hustling to find Kristen in order to talk sh*t the first chance she gets.

Ummmm, because Heather is paid to say something about Sonja's delusions of grandeur and she is paid to appear at whatever function they, production, schedules including Sonja's house/function/whatever. They all are, except Bethenny that is. LOL

[Vicky8675309]

I forgot sonja defrauded people. Was that recent? In other words, did Heather help Sonja despite her defrauding people? If so then Heather only cares about how Sonja treated her (heather) and so the ill will comes from a place of selfishness and not from a place of "defender of justice".

This HW series shouldn't keep criminals on the show. I mean recent criminals who committed acts of violence, fraud, theft….not talking about a public intoxication (even though I want Kim off BH---I'll go with use of a lethal weapon--Kingsley as a reason to fire her). I can't stand Theresa from NJ or Porsha from ATL. Did Sonja knowingly defraud people or was it due to neglect or ignorance. Sorry, I don't remember the details about it.

[Beden]

 

 I hate "therapy" scenes, but I really hate hers for some reason. And they seem to go on FOREVER.

Apologies if this has already been hashed out but what the frig kind of therapist would agree to allow a session(s) with a patient be filmed for a fucking reality show? The psychologists/psychiatrists I know (socially and childhood friends) are adamant about doctor/patient confidentiality. Isn't this a violation of professional conduct?..you know the kind which can get your license lifted or something? Assuming that Bethenny gave an okay for this, why the hell would the Dr? It doesn't make him look good in that he's either a total jerk or needs either publicity or money.

 

I know I wouldn't call him to sign on as a patient based on this.

[lunastartron]

I realize that the fourth wall is germane to much of the tension that arises between these women, but the problem with point that "Heather is paid" to do everything that might across as objectionable is that's it's just as applicable to everyone - Aviva "was paid" to create conflict and initiate BookGate; Bethenny "is paid" to behave abrasively toward Heather; Ramona "is paid" to be rude because it will inevitably precipitate fights. Sonja, too, can't be accountable for any obnoxiousness toward Heather because she's got to earn that pay.

[lunastartron]

Vicky (can't quote on my handheld), to answer your question: yes, Sonja defrauded people way before Heather joined the show and the toaster oven debacle ensued. She reneged on the film production project because she was getting divorced, a process that began before she herself became a Housewife.

[Celia Rubenstein]

Heather did not bring up the subject that night, Bethenny did and has throughout the entire season so far. IMO Heather was just trying to show support/sympathy with/for Bethenny.

 

It was unclear to me who said exactly what that led to the exchange in question.  Given how Bethenny has been called on the carpet for not attending enough events by The Countess, I can see her feeling the need to explain to everyone in advance that she is going to have to leave early and why.  That may well have been what led Heather to start prying about the specifics of her custody/visitation arrangement.  I seriously doubt Bethenny would delve into such a sticky, painful topic with Heather, who she really was not getting along with very well.

 

Plus, if you listen closely to their exchange, Bethenny was lodging some feeble protests while Heather was hammering her for info, saying "no no" and "I'm not saying" and "I don't want to..." but she kept getting cut off by Heather who just kept pressing the subject and telling Bethenny her opinion of the situation.   She seemed to be trying to get off the subject of visitation, so I don't know why she would have brought it up in the first place if it was something she didn't want to talk about on camera. 

 

I think Heather saw a chance to get a little screen time while forcing a discussion that she knew would please production more than anything.  That and she is a control freak who is compelled to continually stick her nose in where it doesn't belong and share her opinion.  Why she thinks Bethenny would have the slightest interest in hearing her opinion or advice about what Bethenny needs to do re: custody and visitation just escapes me. She really thinks she knows it all.  

[WireWrap]

I forgot sonja defrauded people. Was that recent? In other words, did Heather help Sonja despite her defrauding people? If so then Heather only cares about how Sonja treated her (heather) and so the ill will comes from a place of selfishness and not from a place of "defender of justice". This HW series shouldn't keep criminals on the show. I mean recent criminals who committed acts of violence, fraud, theft….not talking about a public intoxication (even though I want Kim off BH---I'll go with use of a lethal weapon--Kingsley as a reason to fire her). I can't stand Theresa from NJ or Porsha from ATL. Did Sonja knowingly defraud people or was it due to neglect or ignorance. Sorry, I don't remember the details about it.

It was about 9 - 10 years ago but Sonja sells it as if it fell apart because of the lead actors demands. In other words, she says/claims it was not her fault that she never had the money she claimed/lied about when she signed the contract.

Apologies if this has already been hashed out but what the frig kind of therapist would agree to allow a session(s) with a patient be filmed for a fucking reality show? The psychologists/psychiatrists I know (socially and childhood friends) are adamant about doctor/patient confidentiality. Isn't this a violation of professional conduct?..you know the kind which can get your license lifted or something? Assuming that Bethenny gave an okay for this, why the hell would the Dr? It doesn't make him look good in that he's either a total jerk or needs either publicity or money.

 

I know I wouldn't call him to sign on as a patient based on this.

These are not real therapy sessions, it is all done for the show, not for real life help.

[Lola16]

 

Bethenny cries a lot. I wonder if she was in the midst of a nervous breakdown when she was filming this? If she was my friend I'd be exhausted by her. And I hope her therapist is charging her extra, she's really snarky to him and he's trying to help her.

 

Snarky?  More like rude.  Therapist asked her about her feelings about her step father's apology and she goes on an all out offensive.  He didn't ask you to dive deep about your orphan raised by wolves childhood you ass, he asked how did the apology make you feel?  Relieved?  Happy?  Validated? It isn't that hard.  I hope he has some vodka in his water bottle.

[Lola16]

 

Bethenny cries a lot. I wonder if she was in the midst of a nervous breakdown when she was filming this? If she was my friend I'd be exhausted by her. And I hope her therapist is charging her extra, she's really snarky to him and he's trying to help her.

 

Snarky?  More like rude.  Therapist asked her about her feelings about her step father's apology and she goes on an all out offensive.  He didn't ask you to dive deep about your orphan raised by wolves childhood you ass, he asked how did the apology make you feel?  Relieved?  Happy?  Validated? It isn't that hard.  I hope he has some vodka in his water bottle.

[WireWrap]

It was unclear to me who said exactly what that led to the exchange in question.  Given how Bethenny has been called on the carpet for not attending enough events by The Countess, I can see her feeling the need to explain to everyone in advance that she is going to have to leave early and why.  That may well have been what led Heather to start prying about the specifics of her custody/visitation arrangement.  I seriously doubt Bethenny would delve into such a sticky, painful topic with Heather, who she really was not getting along with very well.

 

Plus, if you listen closely to their exchange, Bethenny was lodging some feeble protests while Heather was hammering her for info, saying "no no" and "I'm not saying" and "I don't want to..." but she kept getting cut off by Heather who just kept pressing the subject and telling Bethenny her opinion of the situation.   She seemed to be trying to get off the subject of visitation, so I don't know why she would have brought it up in the first place if it was something she didn't want to talk about on camera. 

 

I think Heather saw a chance to get a little screen time while forcing a discussion that she knew would please production more than anything.  That and she is a control freak who is compelled to continually stick her nose in where it doesn't belong and share her opinion.  Why she thinks Bethenny would have the slightest interest in hearing her opinion or advice about what Bethenny needs to do re: custody and visitation just escapes me. She really thinks she knows it all.  

Oh for the love of Pete. Bethenny has never had a problem saying she did not want to discuss anything and that was all she had to say. Bethenny was explaining her situation and Heather was saying things to show support towards Bethenny. Heather was trying to find a common bond, children, with Bethenny and Bethenny got her panties twisted all in a knot to further her poor wittle Bethenny storyline. JMO

[sasha206]

Maybe I was raised by wolves but I never thought asking someone about their custody arrangements would be considered some huge invasion of privacy.  I've never met anyone that seems to feel shamed because they have their child half of the time.  And Bethenney seems to do nothing but talk about her self and her trials and trevails.  I mean, this is the woman who told two widows that they need to "rebrand death."

[LotusFlower]

Apologies if this has already been hashed out but what the frig kind of therapist would agree to allow a session(s) with a patient be filmed for a fucking reality show? The psychologists/psychiatrists I know (socially and childhood friends) are adamant about doctor/patient confidentiality. Isn't this a violation of professional conduct?..you know the kind which can get your license lifted or something

Confidentiality has obviously been waived. Those aren't hidden cameras in the room.

[Celia Rubenstein]

Oh for the love of Pete. Bethenny has never had a problem saying she did not want to discuss anything and that was all she had to say. Bethenny was explaining her situation and Heather was saying things to show support towards Bethenny. Heather was trying to find a common bond, children, with Bethenny and Bethenny got her panties twisted all in a knot to further her poor wittle Bethenny storyline. JMO

 

But see, that was my point. I think Bethenny was trying to say she didn't want to discuss it but Heather is such a bulldozer even Bethenny couldn't be heard (and that is saying' something, lol).  I didn't think Heather sounded supportive at all.  Maybe she meant to, in her own super controlling way.  But  Heather telling someone they "need to fix" something that she should realize the person had spent a fortune in legal fees and hours of time and buckets of tears dealing with was not going to come off as "supportive" or an attempt at bonding.  It sounded ignorant and bossy to me. 

 

Maybe I was raised by wolves but I never thought asking someone about their custody arrangements would be considered some huge invasion of privacy.  I've never met anyone that seems to feel shamed because they have their child half of the time.

 

Bethenny is under a gag order regarding her divorce and custody case.  That is why Heather should have avoided the specific topic of custody, not because Bethenny has anything to be ashamed of. 

Edited May 28, 2015 by Celia Rubenstein

[LotusFlower]

I think Heather saw a chance to get a little screen time while forcing a discussion that she knew would please production more than anything. That and she is a control freak who is compelled to continually stick her nose in where it doesn't belong and share her opinion. Why she thinks Bethenny would have the slightest interest in hearing her opinion or advice about what Bethenny needs to do re: custody and visitation just escapes me. She really thinks she knows it all.

Control freak? This description sounds like Bethenny. Not Heather. Bethenny, after all, had no qualms telling Dorinda what she thought about her arrangement concerning her bf John staying overnight - all unsolicited advice.

Maybe I was raised by wolves but I never thought asking someone about their custody arrangements would be considered some huge invasion of privacy.  I've never met anyone that seems to feel shamed because they have their child half of the time.  And Bethenney seems to do nothing but talk about her self and her trials and trevails.  I mean, this is the woman who told two widows that they need to "rebrand death."

Exactly. What makes it even weirder is that Bethenny is one who gets really personal with people. And yet she doesn't seem to like it when the shoe is on the other foot. Or probably more likely - when she doesn't like the person asking the questions.

[JAYJAY1979]

I.l think.had heather asked if.Sonja was selling her clothes in sears...it wouldn't have been as bad..since Sears does sell evening wear.

I'd.rather have seen a full.scene of Ramona and her cute business partner interviewing staff vs another bethanny therapy session...just my thought

[LotusFlower]

Bethenny is under a gag order regarding her divorce and custody case. That is why Heather should have avoided the specific topic of custody.

There is no gag order involving custody. Obviously, as Bethenny has talked about it on camera.

[WireWrap]

But see, that was my point. I think Bethenny was trying to say she didn't want to discuss it but Heather is such a bulldozer even Bethenny couldn't be heard (and that is saying' something, lol).  I didn't think Heather sounded supportive at all.  Maybe she meant to, in her own super controlling way.  But  Heather telling someone they "need to fix" something that she should realize the person had spent a fortune in legal fees and hours of time and buckets of tears dealing with was not going to come off as "supportive" or an attempt at bonding.  It sounded ignorant and bossy to me. 

 

 

Bethenny is under a gag order regarding her divorce and custody case.  That is why Heather should have avoided the specific topic of custody, not because Bethenny has anything to be ashamed of. 

Bethenny has talked about her custody agreement on the show by saying that she gets Bryn 50% of the time a number of times, my understanding was that the gag order was on the divorce, not the custody, otherwise Bethenny has broken that gag order time and time again. Again, Bethenny has never had a problem saying something and she said NOTHING!

 

I.l think.had heather asked if.Sonja was selling her clothes in sears...it wouldn't have been as bad..since Sears does sell evening wear.

I'd.rather have seen a full.scene of Ramona and her cute business partner interviewing staff vs another bethanny therapy session...just my thought

Heather could have only said that the dress was beautiful to Sonja and Sonja would have called her a liar. Sonja is pissed that Heather calls her out on shite. JMO

[Celia Rubenstein]

My understanding of the gag order is that it pertains mainly to Bethenny mentioning Jason, be it in reference to either their divorce or the custody case.  sSo she is walking a fine line discussing the issue of Bryn's custody and her not being able to change off the scheduled days, which was what Heather was talking about.  It could be construed as commenting on Jason's behavior, which she is not allowed to do. 

 

You can't really separate the divorce and custody case when it comes to the gag order.  That would be like saying Bethenny has to stay mum on Jason regarding their divorce, but she can call him a selfish lying mother effer regarding custody, which would make no sense at all. 

Edited May 28, 2015 by Celia Rubenstein

[Otherkate]

But see, that was my point. I think Bethenny was trying to say she didn't want to discuss it but Heather is such a bulldozer even Bethenny couldn't be heard (and that is saying' something, lol).  I didn't think Heather sounded supportive at all.  Maybe she meant to, in her own super controlling way.  But  Heather telling someone they "need to fix" something that she should realize the person had spent a fortune in legal fees and hours of time and buckets of tears dealing with was not going to come off as "supportive" or an attempt at bonding.  It sounded ignorant and bossy to me. 

 

 

That was what bothered me and would have killed me if I were on Bethenny's side of the conversation. Maybe I'm identifying too closely with her here, but then again, it helps me understand her side of it. I would have come away from that feeling awful, upset, and judged. Sure, it might not be what Heather intended (I really don't think that it was), but that's how I would have felt with the Oh you need to fix that, oh I don't like that. Wtf do you think these people and their lawyers have been doing? Just hush. It's rude and thoughtless, and, yes, ignorant, IMO. And it's up to Bethenny who she wants to discuss it with - maybe she wants to talk about it with Lu, Carole, whoever and not with Heather? So what? Take a hint.

 

Exactly. What makes it even weirder is that Bethenny is one who gets really personal with people. And yet she doesn't seem to like it when the shoe is on the other foot. Or probably more likely - when she doesn't like the person asking the questions.

 

I totally agree with this. Bethenny does do this to other people. Hopefully this helps her realize that she should also butt the hell out of people's personal business when they're hinting that they don't want to talk about it, but I doubt it. B doesn't seem terribly capable of growth.

[WireWrap]

My understanding of the gag order is that it pertains mainly to Bethenny mentioning Jason, be it in reference to either their divorce or the custody case.  sSo she is walking a fine line discussing the issue of Bryn's custody and her not being able to change off the scheduled days, which was what Heather was talking about.  It could be construed as commenting on Jason's behavior, which she is not allowed to do. 

Bethenny has already broken that gag rule then, as she has talked about it prior to this last episode if that is true. As we are not privy to that information then we do not know if there is a gag rule concerning custody in effect.

[Neurochick]

Heather , you are way too smart to not know that Bethenny can't talk about the terms of her divorce or custody, what kind of crap is asking her in an underhanded way what are the terms of her custody agreement? , she is prevented by a gag order to talk about it and you are way too savvy and nosy not to know this.

Heather and her passive aggressiveness drives me nuts. Not even Ramona or Luann who have known her for years have dared to asked her directly about her custody agreement, what would make you think that she would give you that kind of information?

Nothing but a cheap shot IMO

 

I disagree.  Bethenny's storyline is how she can't spend time with the other women because of the situation with her daughter.  That has been mentioned in the show.  If she Bethenny seriously can't talk about this, maybe she shouldn't be on the show.  Bethenny's like, "I have to go pick up my daughter" or "I can't go away for the weekend because it's the weekend with my daughter."  So why is Bethenny even on the show?  Does she really need the cash, or is she just there to hawk Skinnygirl; and yes, I did see her drinking a bottle of it in the furniture store.  

[LotusFlower]

My understanding of the gag order is that it pertains mainly to Bethenny mentioning Jason, be it in reference to either their divorce or the custody case.  sSo she is walking a fine line discussing the issue of Bryn's custody and her not being able to change off the scheduled days, which was what Heather was talking about.  It could be construed as commenting on Jason's behavior, which she is not allowed to do.

And yet Bethenny talks about it (custody) on camera. Which either means your interpretation is wrong, or she's violating the order. Sorry, but it's the former.

[Celia Rubenstein]

And yet Bethenny talks about it (custody) on camera. Which either means your interpretation is wrong, or she's violating the order. Sorry, but it's the former.

 

No, she can't talk about JASON.  Please re-read my post above, I don't want to be repetitive. 

[WireWrap]

No, she can't talk about JASON.  Please re-read my post above, I don't want to be repetitive. 

Heather did not ask any questions about Jason, not once. She did not ask anything other than generalities to what Bethenny was already telling her and again Bethenny never said "I can't talk about it" or "I don't want to talk about it" to Heather nor did she try to IMO.

[Neurochick]

Apologies if this has already been hashed out but what the frig kind of therapist would agree to allow a session(s) with a patient be filmed for a fucking reality show? The psychologists/psychiatrists I know (socially and childhood friends) are adamant about doctor/patient confidentiality. Isn't this a violation of professional conduct?..you know the kind which can get your license lifted or something? Assuming that Bethenny gave an okay for this, why the hell would the Dr? It doesn't make him look good in that he's either a total jerk or needs either publicity or money.

 

I know I wouldn't call him to sign on as a patient based on this.

 

Here's what I think.  Many years ago I used to work for a physician.  Whenever he'd be on TV, his secretary would get upset because the next day the phone would ring off the hook, people wanting to make an appointment with him.  I would not be surprised if that therapist's phone rang off the hook this morning, calls coming from people who saw him on TV.

 

I think we here think differently because I believe that we on this board view anonymity differently.  I mean we are here, not on Facebook talking about this but on an anonymous message board; and that tells me that we have a different view of privacy, anonymity and boundaries, than many people today.  I was telling someone that today it seems like everybody wants to show themselves on Youtube and Instagram and Facebook and Twitter and here I am, wanting to be anonymous.  I guess I'm the odd duck.  I wouldn't make an appointment with a therapist who puts themselves on TV but as I said, I'm an odd duck.

[Mozelle]

But see, that was my point. I think Bethenny was trying to say she didn't want to discuss it but Heather is such a bulldozer even Bethenny couldn't be heard (and that is saying' something, lol).  I didn't think Heather sounded supportive at all.  Maybe she meant to, in her own super controlling way.  But  Heather telling someone they "need to fix" something that she should realize the person had spent a fortune in legal fees and hours of time and buckets of tears dealing with was not going to come off as "supportive" or an attempt at bonding.  It sounded ignorant and bossy to me. 

 

 

Bethenny is under a gag order regarding her divorce and custody case.  That is why Heather should have avoided the specific topic of custody, not because Bethenny has anything to be ashamed of. 

 

But that isn't what happened, though. The editors came back to that scene mid-conversation, and Heather was saying that she thought Bethenny said she didn't get to see Bryn for six days. As Heather was clarifying her mishearing (which means that Bethenny is the one who somehow made mention of six days), Heather said something like, "Oh, OK. I thought you were saying that you didn't get to see her for six days. That's why I was like, 'Oh, you need to fix that.'"

 

It wasn't just some random proclamation of, "You need to fix your custody situation." Given what we've seen over the past seven weeks, Bethenny was very likely talking about why she needed to leave early and very likely talking about whatever the arrangement is (which I have to believe because we're talking about Bethenny here) and how that affects her as a mother. Heather was making a clarifying statement because she initially misheard/misunderstood Bethenny's statement.

Edited May 28, 2015 by Mozelle

[LotusFlower]

No, she can't talk about JASON.  Please re-read my post above, I don't want to be repetitive.

She can't talk about Jason in relation to their divorce proceedings. She is under no gag order in relation to their custody case, which of course was settled long ago. Ergo - no gag order. (There can't be a court order if there's no case. Parties can sign a confidentiality agreement, but that's different, and we obviously know there is none here - because Bethenny freely talks about her custody of Bryn)

[motorcitymom65]

Bethenny has already broken that gag rule then, as she has talked about it prior to this last episode if that is true. As we are not privy to that information then we do not know if there is a gag rule concerning custody in effect.

This whole thing about a gag order is very confusing to me. Do we have someone with knowledge that can help? From what I read of the custody deal, it was just that it was sealed, but I never read there was a gag order. Are they the same thing?

I honestly didn't expect for Beth to discuss anything about her divorce or Bryn on the show. But she has. She has talked and cried about how she picked out every fucking thing in her home, but that Jason gets to live in it while she wonders around wthout a home. I was surprised when she said this in the first episode, because she was clearly talking about issues with regard to their divorce. She was clearly saying that he was doing something that she didn't like but that she had no choice. As others have pointed out, she has also talked about only having Bryn 50% of the time. She has been talking about her issues nonstop, so it seems kind of late to become offended when others try to engage her in conversation.

Beth actually backed off of Heather in her blog. She said that Heather is curious but that she believes it comes from a good place. Beth put the blame a bit on herself and said that she just tends to not trust people. I am wondering if watching the last couple of episodes made her realize just how much she has shared and how silly she looks in hammering away at Heather for being interested. She said on camera that she has a hard time having sex with a man because she heard her mom engage in noisy sex after being beaten. As far as issues of privacy go, that would be pretty much at the top of my list and she told the world. After sharing so much, it seems ridiculous for her to pretend that she doesn't like to share her life or her issues. I can sympathize with how hard it would be to discuss some of this with the world. That would be one of many reasons I would never want to be on a reality show. She has made different choices and decided a long time ago that she was fully prepared to share most everything.

[The Evil One]

Regarding B and her therapy sessions, obviously confidentiality has been waived and he is someone who describes himself as a "TV psychologist" (though if you google him, his credentials/education are impressive and not from Hollywood Upstairs Medical College). That said, I don't think any therapist would have had an issue with Bethenny's "snarky/rude" reaction - as long as it was real and genuine. There is a therapeutic relationship wherein a therapist can see how you cope in other relationships by how you cope with them. Example, if Bethenny shuts down and becomes snarky when things get tough with Dr. Amador, chances are she does the exact same thing in other relationships. Behavior like Bethenny's isn't consider "rude" in a vacuum by a therapist; it's informative.

But back to the episode, I don't think B was ready to be back on this show. It's great ratings bait, but when you're breaking down to a virtual stranger in CB2, you're still too raw.

Lastly, gosh, I like Dorinda. She seems like a fun, straight shooter. Maybe the women dislike John for elitist reasons - he doesn't "look" the part or they worry about her money. I still dislike him because, frankly, he's gross and inappropriate. He has a lovely woman who cares very much for him on his arm and he leers at anything that moves. I'm not asking the guy to be blind, but show some respect for your girlfriend. I find him disrespectful to Dorinda.

[Celia Rubenstein]

She can't talk about Jason in relation to their divorce proceedings. She is under no gag order in relation to their custody case, which of course was settled long ago. Ergo - no gag order. (There can't be a court order if there's no case. Parties can sign a confidentiality agreement, but that's different, and we obviously know there is none here - because Bethenny freely talks about her custody of Bryn)

 

As I explained above, that would lead to a nonsensical result.  Having to keep silent about someone with regard to the divorce  but being free to trash them in reference to the custody case makes no sense.  So I am sure the essence of the gag order was incorporated into any agreement they made regarding custody, which is why we don't hear Bethenny specifically commenting on Jason's behavior or attitude with regard to either aspect of their case.  Essentially, she is still subject to that gag order's terms even thought the custody case is technically settled. 

 

Merely remarking upon getting Bryn for six days or whatever is not commenting on Jason in any way, so Bethenny is free to do that.  But veering into a discussion about how she needs to change things with Jason is a trickier subject and I think that is why Bethenny didn't want to talk about it with Heather.  It would be pushing the envelope maybe a little too far.