Michelle and JimBob aka J'Chelle and Boob

[Micks Picks]

Would you believe my mom took me to a hotel and we watched XXX movies?

[3girlsforus]

Micks Picks.... now THAT's progressive LOL

[Barb23]

I don't know how old you are, 3girlsforus, but your mom sounds pretty progressive to me. Good for her! My mom came to the 5th grade menstruation movie with me, and that was about it! Not one additional word was EVER said. Although we did have some rollicking laughs about it years [and years] later. LOL!

3girlsforus - I got a good laugh at your first post. I can picture your mom walking thru a hotel lobby with a whiteboard and an arm full of books.

For some reason, my mom & I didn't even go to the puberty movie at school. Even with an older sister, periods & sex weren't and still aren't subjects discussed around my mother. Thank goodness (for my husband's sake) there were trashy romance novels I read. Now who couldn't learn from "he thrust his throbbing manhood into her waiting inferno" Lol.

[JoanArc]

 

Now who couldn't learn from "he thrust his throbbing manhood into her waiting inferno" Lol.

 

I guess that's why the Duggar girls are constantly told that romance novels are badbadbad. And, apparently women never look at porn.

[GEML]

My mother sat me down at 14 and explained it all. I thanked her and told her I knew all of that , and what's more, had explained everything to both younger sisters. She never said a WORD to them. (And they did not marry young or have big church weddings, so they did not get books .)

Which is why I'm pretty confident that the Duggar kids know more about sex than people think they do. Those wedding receptions are a free for all. No one is watching who is talking to whom, or listening in. Information of all kinds is being exchanged....

[JoanArc]

 

Information of all kinds is being exchanged....

 

Hopefully some body fluids, too.

[GEML]

It does happen....Amish and Hutterite weddings for example.... There is no way to completely control your children.

[Wellfleet]

My mother sat me down at 14 and explained it all. I thanked her and told her I knew all of that , and what's more, had explained everything to both younger sisters. She never said a WORD to them. (And they did not marry young or have big church weddings, so they did not get books .)

Which is why I'm pretty confident that the Duggar kids know more about sex than people think they do. Those wedding receptions are a free for all. No one is watching who is talking to whom, or listening in. Information of all kinds is being exchanged....

 

Agree. I think it's a solid given that the Duggar kids know far more than Boob thinks they do. He's delusional if he thinks his kids actually are as he portrays them on TV. I'm not saying that the older ones are out every night, doing meth and drinking. But they've been exposed to things he wouldn't approve of them knowing, that's for sure. Even for kids who've been directly-isolated as they have, information gets around. It's like that line from Jurassic Park - "Life will find a way..."

[andromeda331]

I'm kind of amazed how many moms talk to their daughters about sex. No parents talked to their kids about sex growing up and it wasn't that long ago. My mother never said a word to me I remember asking her and she freaked out and that was the end of the discussion. Even when I dated it never came up. We had a sex ed class in middle school but I learned everything though the gossipy hallways of middle and high school. Most of the parents I knew in middle and high school including my own were amazingly oblivious to teenage sex despite increasing number of pregnancies. By the time I graduated high school more then half my class were parents. It wasn't the sex crazed that JimBob and Michelle claim but normal teens with hormones with no one talking to them. So they were left alone to make decisions on their own.

[Gianthambeast]

Agree. I think it's a solid given that the Duggar kids know far more than Boob thinks they do. He's delusional if he thinks his kids actually are as he portrays them on TV. I'm not saying that the older ones are out every night, doing meth and drinking. But they've been exposed to things he wouldn't approve of them knowing, that's for sure. Even for kids who've been directly-isolated as they have, information gets around. It's like that line from Jurassic Park - "Life will find a way..."

How could they avoid knowing about it when Blob and Michelle are giving them an eyeful of simulated coitus on a public golf course.   *barfs*

[Barb23]

I agree that the kids know more than Boob & MEchelle think they do & sure hope they have normal teen conversations when they fellowship with others. How did Jill know what "bad things" romance novels contained or that they even existed if the kids were that sheltered growing up? But Jilly had access to the secret computer password did she not? Wonder what excuses she used when MEchelle came across the sites she was on. She had to learn about finger licking your husband's fingers somewhere.

[GEML]

(Laughing) I remember when someone smuggled in a Playboy to the parsonage and every kid at church gathered around to look at it during a "time of fellowship." We all look to "agree it is just as sinful as everyone always said" but we couldn't make that decision until we'd looked, now, could we??

Edited March 25, 2015 by GEML

[Mrsjumbo]

My mother wouldn't even say the word Sex much lest tell me about it. I'm thankful she at least signed the permission form to see the "changing bodies" filmstrip, because she never explained monthly periods either. Good thing I was a voracious reader & figured things out on my own, sex- wise.

[Jynnan tonnix]

I remember the menstruation filmstrips from back in the day (1973-ish?) as well ...they must have still been fairly heavily euphemistic when it came to actual sex, though, because although they taught about egg/sperm/conception, I still recall being pretty fuzzy on the details about how it all happened. Somehow I pictured that if a man and a woman "slept together", the sperm would crawl their way over the sheets. I had to ask my mom, and she cleared it up for me, very briefly. Then I wanted to know whether you "had to do that every time you wanted a baby?" (ugh! lol), and what it felt like (mom said, "pleasant"). I think I was around 13. Seems that most kids who are not Duggars know a whole lot more than I did by 13 these days.

[Portia]

Hee hee. Pleasant.

[frenchtoast]

Folks, can we move the first sex talk to the Prayer Closet? It's starting to get off-topic. It's fun to hear everyone's stories, and it'd be fun to hear how we all told our own kids (if we have). The Small Talk Prayer Closet is a better place, though. See you there!

[3girlsforus]

I'm asking this question here because it's about Michelle but the conversation started in Jill's thread. There is a lot of discussion that Michelle has long term guilt about something to the point that she might view JimBob as what she deserves as a punishment for whatever it is she feels guilty about. Most of the conversation implies that she feels guilty for something most of us considers normal from her youth, like secular music, pre-marital kissing, had a beer,  etc. But with her mental break, her bulimia, her apparent bouts with depression,  I am starting to wonder if maybe something sexual happened to her when she was young. I could see that she might blame herself if she was molested or raped. Without proper support and therapy it can be really difficult to get past that. I just wonder if there is something more from her teenage years than just guilt that she didn't court and keep herself to side-hugs before marriage. 

[JoanArc]

I could see her having had an abortion pre-Jim Bob.

[3girlsforus]

That would explain a lot. There would be guilt from pre-marital sex. Guilt from terminating the baby. It could explain how she doesn't seem to have much of an emotional bond with her kids. There could even been extra guilt if JimBob doesn't know.

[Absolom]

I don't see anything that dark or dramatic happening to her.  Jim Bob would have a lot more to say about that and would probably have never gotten involved with anyone with that kind of past.  I see a spoiled youngest in the family who is used to getting her own way who ended up with her identity tied up with childbearing who has hit either peri-menopause or menopause and has to deal with being a grandma.  It hits some women very, very hard.  You should have heard my MIL wail about how she was "too young," this meant the end of her life as she knew it, and other nonsense.  

[Wellfleet]

I don't see anything that dark or dramatic happening to her.  Jim Bob would have a lot more to say about that and would probably have never gotten involved with anyone with that kind of past.  I see a spoiled youngest in the family who is used to getting her own way who ended up with her identity tied up with childbearing who has hit either peri-menopause or menopause and has to deal with being a grandma.  It hits some women very, very hard.  You should have heard my MIL wail about how she was "too young," this meant the end of her life as she knew it, and other nonsense.  

 

Wow, an abortion for Me-chelle. I don't know what to think on this one. As 3girlsforus says, it would neatly explain a whole lot. But as absolom says, Me-chelle is more than likely just a spoiled and lazy narcissistic lastborn. My youngest sister is a textbook lastborn in MANY ways, and she completely FREAKED OUT anticipating her 30th birthday. You'd have thought she was being marched off to the gas chamber - none of us could understand it. She "sobered up" in short order but leaving her youth behind, as she described it, was a really significant event for her.

Edited March 27, 2015 by Wellfleet

[GEML]

No, she's not guilty enough for an abortion or even third base pre-marital sex. And you're talking to someone who had heard thousands of confessions/testimonies over the years.

I think she might have dated someone and things went too far, too fast and he blamed her. He likely would have been much older - say a senior when she was a freshman, and talked about how much "power" she had over him sexually. I think she was scared by something, but also kind of intrigued and proud of herself too, and this split emotion scared her.

So along comes Jim Bob, he acknowledges that power (he's clearly lusting after her) but also deepens that shame someone else made her feel. Then offers her a way out - religion and marriage to harness that special power. Plus, he gets laid.

Sometimes it doesn't have to be that big of a "sin" it simply has to be about the timing of it.

[Mrsjumbo]

Personally, I think it was that miscarriage that made her snap. Sometimes I think 1 significant event can affect your whole life forever.

My older sister is like this. Scared of her own shadow, beyond shy, doesn't have any friends, etc. Looking back at home movies she was a very outgoing, peppy firstborn. My brother was hit by a car when she was 6 (he lived) & she witnessed it. After that she became like a recluse & would skip school & hide from her friends when they wanted her to come out to play. That was one event 50 yrs ago but it had a lasting impact. My mom doesn't believe in psychiatrists- it's a shame & I think they did her a real disservice.

And imagine if MEchelle had talked through with a NORMAL counselor after her miscarriage. She would not feel so guilty & baby- obsessed, I would bet.

[GEML]

I get the miscarriage, but that doesn't explain how she walked into the Jim Bob world in the first place. Or this notion that she's this terrible person, which I genuine think that part (but only part) of her believes and goes back to before meeting him.

[SmallTownMom]

I read somewhere that Mechelle nursed her babies for 6 months, then handed that child over to a buddy, I guess so that she could concentrate on popping out the next blessing.  This makes me crazy!!  You expect your daughters to chart your cycle, and raise your kids!   I sure didn't want my daughter knowing so much of my very personal life, and I have zero interest in her sex life as well.

 

Aside from all that, and not that Mechelle cares, but look what you are missing!!  Little kids are just so much fun!  Yes, lots of work, and I am pooped when I watch my 2 granddaughters for a whole day.  Our 2 1/2 year old is so smart and funny, and of course the most beautiful toddler on the planet.  Our younger one is 10 weeks today, already smiling and cooing at us.  She's so responsive and those smiles melt my heart!!  I remember those days with my daughter and I am now loving it all over again with her girls.

 

So your daughters raise your kids, do all the housework, the homefooling, etc.  Grandma does the laundry and the boys are lazy and useless.  Mechelle, you make me sick.  You have stifled those kids in every way that matters. 

[NikSac]

How could they avoid knowing about it when Blob and Michelle are giving them an eyeful of simulated coitus on a public golf course.   *barfs*

 

Exactly... they are so freaking obsessed with sex, I'm pretty sure the kids know a LOT about it.

 

Although you can count me in the crowd who heard nothing about it from my parents, and I'm 'only' 41. I snuck around the library in high school and listened to my friends' stories.

[GEML]

I think there are lots of parents out there that are surprised to learn that while they might not like children as much as they thought at certain ages (babies, toddlers, preschoolers, school age, pre-teens, teens, college age, adult) there are ages that they really really do like and enjoy their children. I'm never doing to be the best toddler mom, but I'm a great teenager one.

But Michelle never really seems to enjoy her children much at any age except for perhaps pregnancy and early babyhood, when they are mostly extensions of herself.

[JoanArc]

All the kids are getting older, so any favorite age if passing quick, and will soon be gone forever (except adulthood). Jim Bob loves him doe-eyed adoring virginal teen girls, but I agree, Michelle could care less about any kid not on the tit.

[Literata]

 

Jim Bob loves him doe-eyed adoring virginal teen girls

This has never really bothered me as much as it has lately. I used to consider his fascination with his daughters' love lives to simply be a function of his Gothardite weirdness, but he's really over the top. The kiss-demonstration scene kind of sealed it for me. It's almost as if he's thinking of the girls as extensions of MEchelle, or as MEchelle many years ago, when they were first together. You just know he's spent Jill and Jessa's wedding nights either really depressed over what's undoubtedly happening or really interested in how things are going with their "deflowerings." Both of those potential reactions are pretty repulsive. 

[Gianthambeast]

This has never really bothered me as much as it has lately. I used to consider his fascination with his daughters' love lives to simply be a function of his Gothardite weirdness, but he's really over the top. The kiss-demonstration scene kind of sealed it for me. It's almost as if he's thinking of the girls as extensions of MEchelle, or as MEchelle many years ago, when they were first together. You just know he's spent Jill and Jessa's wedding nights either really depressed over what's undoubtedly happening or really interested in how things are going with their "deflowerings." Both of those potential reactions are pretty repulsive. 

 

I think you're onto something here.  I mean, he's already arranged it so that the older girls perform most of the functions of sister-wives (all the mothering, cooking, household chores, etc.).  He's so disgusting.

[Literata]

 

He's so disgusting.

Yes. And I've always been bothered by the fact that the girls all wear their hair long and wavy because "Daddy likes it that way."

Edited March 27, 2015 by Literata

[Literata]

I was just thinking ... I used to give Boob somewhat of a pass, thinking that MEchelle was driving the bus and Boob was along for the ride because he was so grateful to get to f--- her. But after the Josiah thing and the weirdness around the older girls -- appearing to think he's their boyfriend -- I'm thinking this guy is every bit as much a wackjob as his wife, and probably even a bit more of a problem, in that he clearly has a temper.

[truthtalk2014]

Yes. And I've always been bothered by the fact that the girls all wear their hair long and wavy because "Daddy likes it that way."

Well Daddy does have their heart!  Why not their hair?

[BitterApple]

I think most fathers are horrified at the thought of their daughters having sex but Boob is obsessed with it. Do you guys think the J'Slaves have enough self awarennes to know how pervy that is or is this just normal in their world?

[GEML]

It's not normal even in their world, but their families are so isolated from each other they may not know it. I thought it was interesting that Jill told Jim Bob to stop it on her wedding day. I think by then she finally had been out and about enough (and maybe Derick had commented) to realize, oh, ok, this isn't how all families are.

Josh doesn't talk that way, for instance. That type of humor wouldn't go over well in Washington.

[Literata]

Watched Jill's wedding episode again tonight. Boob showed what seemed to be genuine emotion -- after all, his girlfriend was marrying someone else, so he was sad -- but the only emotional reaction MEchelle seemed to have was when messy little Josie was on the steps of the altar, licking her fingers and then touching her sisters with them MEchelle thought that was very funny. Of course.

I was reminded of the stark difference, also, between MEchelle and Kelly Bates. I did see the first episode of the grammatically challenged "Bringing Up Bates," and Kelly was talking in a very concerned tone about how she thought her daughter Alyssa was beautiful, but since she had gotten married and moved away, she didn't seem to be eating properly and needed "to get a bunch of meat on her bones." Do you think MEchelle would notice anything like that about a particular daughter, and that it would register as something about which a mother should be concerned?

[Joe Jitsu913]

Jim Bob has always treated his J'Slaves like his sugar dolls (blech). I have oftened wondered if there has been sexual abuse/incest within the family. They are so isolated from "the wolves", it makes you wonder.

[GEML]

I'm pretty confident there is no incest or abuse. I don't even think his daughters do intimate things such as cut his hair, lay out his clothes, or put on his cologne, and other little gestures that happen in plenty of other families. I think he has the mind of a 17 year old and the immature humor to match, but I honestly don't think there is anything else.

[BitterApple]

I think Michelle would notice a weight gain, not a loss. These are the same parents who forced a teenaged Jana to go to Weight Watchers for an extra five pounds of baby chub.

[Joe Jitsu913]

I'm pretty confident there is no incest or abuse. I don't even think his daughters do intimate things such as cut his hair, lay out his clothes, or put on his cologne, and other little gestures that happen in plenty of other families. I think he has the mind of a 17 year old and the immature humor to match, but I honestly don't think there is anything else.

I don't just mean Jim Bob, but in general. They are so focused on sex and sinning. Why? Has something happened within the family? Pure speculation on my part, but it wouldn't surprise me.

[JoanArc]

I don't just mean Jim Bob, but in general. They are so focused on sex and sinning. Why? Has something happened within the family? Pure speculation on my part, but it wouldn't surprise me.

 

Perpetual fear of something happening make everyone easier to control than actually having something happen. One the kids kiss someone in 5 minutes of privacy and realize they're not going t hell, Jim Bob loses a lot of his power.

 

Remember, Cell Phones can steal your soul!

[GEML]

One child kisses before engagement - the whole mystique is lost. You start seeing your sibling kissing her fiancé good night and realizing, wait, they aren't tearing off each other's clothes and rutting like animals on the floor of the living room! Maybe it doesn't have to be like Mom and Dad said! It's a kiss, and they look happy!

(Wink) then the next kid is pregnant and the whole program is shot.

[Wellfleet]

The Duggar preaching on sex, and it being mainly the man's desire and the woman should comply right away, because as Michelle told Jessa it doesn't take too long, reminds me of the book Clan of the Cave Bear where the guy would say OOG or something and point and the girl (Ayla) would rush to him and bend over.  Really romantic.

 

Did Me-chelle really tell Jessa that sex "doesn't take too long..." ??? OMG, that's hilarious! I guess there's a little secret about Boob that's out of the bag now too. LOL.

Edited March 28, 2015 by Wellfleet

[Micks Picks]

Yes Wellfleet, she did say it.  It was on the episode where she and Jessa were at Starbucks or whatever.  It was in the group of episodes where Michelle was trying to interact with the kids.  Played chess with one, who barely knew her.  

[Darknight]

This has never really bothered me as much as it has lately. I used to consider his fascination with his daughters' love lives to simply be a function of his Gothardite weirdness, but he's really over the top.

The kiss-demonstration scene kind of sealed it for me. It's almost as if he's thinking of the girls as extensions of MEchelle, or as MEchelle many years ago, when they were first together. You just know he's spent Jill and Jessa's wedding nights either really depressed over what's undoubtedly happening or really interested in how things are going with their "deflowerings." Both of those potential reactions are pretty repulsive.

It's creepy a father would think like this.

Yes Wellfleet, she did say it. It was on the episode where she and Jessa were at Starbucks or whatever. It was in the group of episodes where Michelle was trying to interact with the kids. Played chess with one, who barely knew her.

It was one if the boys. Michelle said there was nothing else to do since she's not pregnant. So for 15 years you didn't do shit with thus child now you want to try to do something with him because you're bored.

[JoanArc]

Does Michelle ever carry a purse? I saw a recent picture of her - with her iphone tucked into her armpit. Classy. I don't remember ever seeing her with one. What mother doesn't carry a purse packed full of stuff for the kids? (I know, I know)

[JenCarroll]

This has never really bothered me as much as it has lately. I used to consider his fascination with his daughters' love lives to simply be a function of his Gothardite weirdness, but he's really over the top. The kiss-demonstration scene kind of sealed it for me. It's almost as if he's thinking of the girls as extensions of MEchelle, or as MEchelle many years ago, when they were first together. You just know he's spent Jill and Jessa's wedding nights either really depressed over what's undoubtedly happening or really interested in how things are going with their "deflowerings." Both of those potential reactions are pretty repulsive.

I agree with you.

Although, I have to say, the kiss demonstration was (probably unintentionally) hilarious. Carefully explaining that they should tilt their heads rather than ramming straight into each other. "Now, you may not ever have thought about this before, but each one of you has a nose right there in the middle of your face..." Ladies and gentlemen, JimBob Duggar, Master of the Blindingly Obvious!

[GEML]

The thing about Jim Bob and Michelle to me is that even when they talk about their children's sex lives, it's still only as an extension of themselves. They want to talk about it to remind their children we, your parents, are still having sex. I don't think he's hung up on his children's/daughters' sexuality as much as he's desperate to tell people "I've still got it" and without a baby every 18 months he's afraid people won't believe him.

[3girlsforus]

I think he's obsessed with sex in general. It's all part of being developmentally stunted and really never proceeding beyond the emotional maturity of a teenager. It's all 'look- look - kissing' or 'we have sex... giggle, giggle'. That kind of behavior is pathetic enough but when he turns all that immaturity to the subject of his children it becomes super creepy even if his intentions are not.

[CarolMK]

I agree that Jim Bob is obsessed with sex, and not in a healthy way. Michelle might not be so much, but she doesn't do anything to try to stop him from smooching and groping her all the time either. I'm glad that the Bates parents don't behave this way on their show. The only time I remember seeing them kiss is when they were alone celebrating Gil's birthday, they don't find it necessary to show off in front of their kids and the cameras all of the time.