S01.E14: Whisper of the Ax

[thewhiteowl]

 

Elizabeth is humiliated at a public budget hearing when her staff fails to find the corruption that exists in her microloan program. Also, the investigation into Marsh’s death continues.

 

[kaygeeret]

Hoping there are some commenters out there.

 

As an intermittent, but semi invested viewer, I don't know who the person was the FBI was looking for at her house at the end and I couldn't read the envelope.

 

It wasn't the daughter I'm sure.  DO they have a nanny (altho' I thought all the kids were too old for that) or a housekeeper?

[knitorpurl]

They were at the friend's house where they were having dinner at the beginning of the show (sorry I can't remember her name). That was the teddy bear that Elizabeth sat on at the table when her friend told them she lost custody. And the envelope said ' Bess'

[Netfoot]

I think that was a cracking good episode!

 

Senator Turdbreath got his ass handed to him, we saw some illegal military action on foreign soil go pear-shaped, "Bess" turned on her best buddy and ally from the CIA which can't help but come back to bite, and even Stevie begins to behave in a sort of reasonable fashion!

 

Only part I didn't like was the guy with the dog.  I love my dog and he goes with me everywhere, but I wouldn't dream of walking him into someone's office, especially if that office was in the White House!

[Beach Party]

In the bar, Jay feed the Senator's staffer the made up info about the Vietnamese lady.  That put a little egg on the Senator's face when he realized she speaks English.  But even if she didn't speak English her interpreter would've translated her success story.  I'm still unclear why speaking English was so dramatic; the program wasn't supposed to teach English As A Second Language.

[bros402]

Only part I didn't like was the guy with the dog.  I love my dog and he goes with me everywhere, but I wouldn't dream of walking him into someone's office, especially if that office was in the White House!

Her office is actually in the State Department.

 

But I am operating under the assumption that she asked him to bring his dog.

 

Also, it seems that the break did the show a world of good.

In the bar, Jay feed the Senator's staffer the made up info about the Vietnamese lady.  That put a little egg on the Senator's face when he realized she speaks English.  But even if she didn't speak English her interpreter would've translated her success story.  I'm still unclear why speaking English was so dramatic; the program wasn't supposed to teach English As A Second Language.

 

Because people become more emotionally invested in something if it is spoken in their own language - hearing it through a translator diminishes the impact, and media and politicians could debate for weeks over the translation of words.

[missbonnie]

Such a good episode tonight. I figured out that the bear was going to show up again and I felt bad for Elizabeth when her friend said, I know why you have to do this, but I will never forgive you for it. She was truly between a rock and a hard place and really didn't have a choice.

[mwell345]

First time watcher and I really liked it. 

 

I liked Mike B bringing the dog with him, but that's because if I could bring my dog with me to work, I would.

 

Glad I found this!

 

If someone could explain to me what her two friends do (in terms of jobs), I would appreciate it. I'm talking about the two she had dinner with.  I was unclear as to what their jobs were.  Thanks.

Edited March 2, 2015 by mwell345

[Netfoot]

You should re watch from episode one to get the full picture.  But in a nutshell, Téa was a CIA analyst, and the two women were and remain her close friends and fellow analysts.  When a suspicious death occurred at the start of the series, Téa asked them to help by undertaking an off-book, clandestine investigation into the circumstances of that death.  One (Isabelle) agreed and has been slowly investigating, and the other (Juliet) now appears to be spying for the people who (apparently) caused that death.

 

Her office is actually in the State Department.

 

I realize this, but in TV-Land, where this show is set, her office seems to be in the White House.  Right next door to the White House Chief of Staff.

[dubbel zout]

They were all in the CIA together and are helping Elizabeth figure out who killed her mentor.

 

Nice to see Stevie finally buying a clue that a college degree isn't a waste of time for what she wants to do in life. She's still an idiot, but at least now she'll be trying to improve that. 

[Xantar]

Stevie is an idiot, but she's a true to life idiot. How many of us have met drifting late-teens/early-20s people who would rather just sit down with the parents and write a novel? And Stevie's pathway in this episode was quite realistic. She stumbled on her passion by complete accident. My concern was that the show seemed to be treating Stevie as a righteous person and a moral compass when she really wasn't. At least now her storyline is much more sensible. The looks on her parents' faces when she announced she was applying to Georgetown were hilarious. Tim Daly and Tea Leoni really sold the "keep my face super still so I don't crack up" expression.

 

I don't care very much for the bureaucratic wrangling of the week on this show, but they don't actively annoy me. And the hunt to uncover the plot behind the previous SOS's death is actually turning out to be really interesting. I really wasn't sure I would like this show, but as it turns out I'm on board at least until the end of the season.

[Beach Party]

The Senator's second hearing went down a little like when the prosecution forced O.J. to try on the gloves. Backfired!

 

The episode did a nice job in showing how Elizabeth herself should've been more careful (same accusation she made to her staff).  She divulged sensitive information to her friends without an ongoing surveillance of them.  I felt bad for how her one friend was put through a polygraph while the privacy of her own home was violated.  The friend said she understood but wouldn't forget that treatment. Then it was discovered that her other friend had fled.  The judge made a good call in not granting her custody of her kids!

 

Mike B seems like a prick.  I don't like the way Elizabeth has taken him into confidence while closing the door on her own staff.  But this is the tension the writers and actors want to create.

Edited March 2, 2015 by Beach Party

[Sandiscot]

 

Because people become more emotionally invested in something if it is spoken in their own language - hearing it through a translator diminishes the impact, and media and politicians could debate for weeks over the translation of words.

 

In addition to that, she was able to explain how she learned English. So not only did the $200 microloan enable the village to become self-sufficient, provide a school for the children, the kids then passed on what they learned to their parents. Pretty good use of $200.

 

On another point, when does the White House Chief of Staff ever give consent for black ops?

[myril]

They were all in the CIA together and are helping Elizabeth figure out who killed her mentor.

 

Not her mentor, her predecessor as Secretary of State was killed, that is what Bess is investigating. Her mentor  at the CIA is now POTUS and alive and kicking.

 

An okay episode. Though in real I find the micro-loan idea very interesting, couldn't quite make myself care about it in this episode, Only interesting thing about that was how Bess got back on Burke, foe for life now even more I guess.

 

Interesting turn at the end. But still open, who his the master mind behind the murder.

[Netfoot]

On another point, when does the White House Chief of Staff ever give consent for black ops?

 

Yeah!  We all know that job belongs to the President's Daily Briefer!

[TimWil]

Good God I hate Stevie. I wouldn't be unhappy if she was kidnapped by ISIS.

[dubbel zout]

Her mentor  at the CIA is now POTUS and alive and kicking.

 

What was Elizabeth's relationship to the CIA agent who was killed, just a co-worker/friend? I thought he was more than that (in a professional sense, I mean).

[sinkwriter]

 

Not her mentor, her predecessor as Secretary of State was killed, that is what Bess is investigating. Her mentor  at the CIA is now POTUS and alive and kicking.

 

Wasn't her friend and fellow CIA agent her mentor? The one that she confided in about the investigation of her predecessor, and he got killed for it? (Or he was the one who brought to her attention the question of what happened to her predecessor, my memory is failing me.) George, wasn't that his name?

I feel really bad for Elizabeth's friend, the one who was truly helping her and now their friendship and alliance may be ruined. But it's so terrible, to have to doubt someone you felt you knew and trusted, so I feel for Elizabeth too. What a mess. I hope somehow, someday, they'll be able to repair their friendship. Her friend did say she understood why.

[Calamity Jane]

Maybe it's because I watched a few episodes of State of Affairs and Scandal, for which I need a good memory scrubber by the way, but I really enjoyed this episode. Overall, the weekly plots dovetail and yet stand alone, they're actually believable, and the acting is really good. Loving it.

[Texasmom1970]

Good God I hate Stevie. I wouldn't be unhappy if she was kidnapped by ISIS.

I am a full fledged member of this group. Even when she is asking her parents for a shit load of money for college she still tries to be self righteous. I'm doing it for myself not for yall. So annoying! I would be telling her then get your independent ass out of our house, pay your own bills, buy your food and then you can act like you do, maybe. She acts like a bratty teenager not a twenty something year old. If she were kidnapped they would bring her back, having to put up with her is torture.

Edited March 3, 2015 by Texasmom1970

[shapeshifter]

Not my favorite episode, but then I wasn't expecting too much.

Really not happy about Bebe's character (Nadine) having to take the fall.

I was sure that Teddy Bear was a spy camera/recording device. It wasn't but it might as well have been.

And it wouldn't be an episode of Madam Secretary without a shot of Tim Daly's bare knees.

[memememe76]

I really hope that it's not the end of Marin Hinkle. I love her. And Elizabeth needs friends. And I don't buy that this new guy with the dog as her new buddy. I dislike all characters that breeze by the secretary/reception without a care in the world. 

[bros402]

Stevie is an idiot, but she's a true to life idiot. How many of us have met drifting late-teens/early-20s people who would rather just sit down with the parents and write a novel? And Stevie's pathway in this episode was quite realistic. She stumbled on her passion by complete accident. My concern was that the show seemed to be treating Stevie as a righteous person and a moral compass when she really wasn't. At least now her storyline is much more sensible. The looks on her parents' faces when she announced she was applying to Georgetown were hilarious. Tim Daly and Tea Leoni really sold the "keep my face super still so I don't crack up" expression.

At least Stevie wasn't wasting her parent's money while drifting aimlessly at an expensive college.

 

On another point, when does the White House Chief of Staff ever give consent for black ops?

 

Because we all know he's the Assistant President, duh.

 

(Also, it's a way they can make use of a good actor)

[Netfoot]

If she were kidnapped they would bring her back, having to put up with her is torture.

 

Like when my dog Budweiser was dog-napped.  He was a really cute puppy, but really bad-behaved.  Which is why the dog-nappers brought him back after only 24 hours!  (Really.  No kidding.)

 

Stevie is pretty bad, but I think it's a Young-People-Are-Insufferable point being made by the writers.  And at least, in this episode, we are starting to see just a soupçon of maturity and common sense starting to appear. 

[Julie23]

This show has really grown on me, I am enjoying it. The actors are top rate, the writing is believable and we even had a failure this week, so everyone isn't perfect either! Now that I have sworn off Scandal and probably won't watch State of Affairs anymore even if it does come back, this show satisfies my political intrigue show watching.  

[HurricaneVal]

I missed the first half so I was a little confused in the second half, but I was quite amused at Stevie's snotty little announcement to her parents there at the end.  She had to make it clear that she was "winning" by only going back to college because that's how she could keep her really awesome intern job, while all the time her parents are doing all they can to let her keep thinking that.

[Netfoot]

Yeh, she's getting them to pay $25,000 so she can keep an unpaid internship.

[dubbel zout]

Hey, she gets college credit!

[Netfoot]

Which means she doesn't actually have to study.....

[bros402]

Yeh, she's getting them to pay $25,000 so she can keep an unpaid internship.

To be honest, with the faculty discount, and it seems like she was doing well academically before her mother became the SoS, she might get a full ride, between the discount and scholarships.

[kwnyc]

 

Even when she is asking her parents for a shit load of money for college she still tries to be self righteous.

Yeah! I'd be saying: there are some very nice community colleges in the DC Metro area. Go to one of THEM so you qualify for the internship. And if you're serious about getting a degree, then we'll talk about a 4-year school.

 

(Actually, my sister in the DC area is having this conversation now with her high school senior son: they were considering sending him to Montgomery College for 2 years because the 4-year schools he's applied to are SO expensive).

[betsyboo]

(Actually, my sister in the DC area is having this conversation now with her high school senior son: they were considering sending him to Montgomery College for 2 years because the 4-year schools he's applied to are SO expensive).

My nephew just did same. Two years at MoCo and then two years at Salisbury. No post-school debt and just as good education. He's a cop now.

[Guest]

Stevie didn't bother me too much this time. I got her asking for the loan as being a cutesy way to tell her parents she was going back to school.

 

I'm still confused by what happened with the friend. How did the fact that she told the President it was an accident prove she was guilty of anything?

[needschocolate]

I'm still confused by what happened with the friend. How did the fact that she told the President it was an accident prove she was guilty of anything?

 

I think it was like this - the friend and George were assigned to look into the plane crash, They told the president that it was an accident, The president then knew they were lying, since it was not an accident.  George and the friend were the only people at the CIA that knew about the crash not being an accident.  George is dead, so the friend must be the one who tipped off the bad guys ()getting the information by bugging the purse of the other friend. The fact that she fled (and the fact that when Beth first approached her, she acted like she knew nothing about any of this) implies that she is guilty and was the one who tipped off the bad guys.

 

I don't get George - he knew it wasn't an accident, and told Beth it wasn't an accident, so why did he tell the president it was an accident?  Are we supposed to think the president is behind this?  Actually, I thought they alluded to the president possibly ordering the crash/murder episodes ago, and was surprised that they told the president now. 

 

If series are going to do these multi-episode mysteries, they need remember that the most of the audience is not going to allocate a bunch of brain cells to remembering the ongoing story.  Superfans may pay close attention and analyze the details, but shows don't survive if only the superfans are watching.  Therefore, they need to refresh the memories of the regular viewers - have a "previously on" at the beginning, put a little bit of the ongoing story in each episode instead of skipping a few episodes, and don't have 4-5 week breaks between episodes.  Every time I tune in to a show and find myself thinking "Wait.. What was that story? Who was that guy? I thought they caught him already...." or have to pause the show so that my couch-mate and I can discuss the little bits we remember in hopes that enough of the story comes back to us, I get that much closer to finding something else to watch. 

[Netfoot]

George is dead...

 

We think George is dead.

 

 

...and don't have 4-5 week breaks between episodes.  Every time I tune in to a show and find myself thinking "Wait.. What was that story? Who was that guy? I thought they caught him already...." or have to pause the show so that my couch-mate and I can discuss the little bits we remember in hopes that enough of the story comes back to us, I get that much closer to finding something else to watch. 

 

Toatly!  I don't understand how all the mid-season hiatus, two week breaks,  and all the rest that chop up the smooth progression of a season can be anything but bad for a show.  The only thing more annoying is the Final-Saga-of-Well-Know-Trilogy-Part-One which is now affecting every movie from Harry Blotto to The Herbert.

[luvly]

I don't get George - he knew it wasn't an accident, and told Beth it wasn't an accident, so why did he tell the president it was an accident?  Are we supposed to think the president is behind this?  Actually, I thought they alluded to the president possibly ordering the crash/murder episodes ago, and was surprised that they told the president now. 

 

I think this is an issue of two different plane crashes. The plane crash that the president was referring to wasn't Secretary Marsh's but the one that happened years earlier in Dubai, the one with the Iranian nuclear physicist. So, at the time of the crash, George and Juliet were the two people who investigated and came to the conclusion that it was a mechanical failure due to the jack screw. Whether or not both of them were actually lying at the time is still up for debate but I'm guessing that, at the very least, George genuinely thought it was an accident but once he saw the same issue pop up again he realized that both of the planes had been meddled with.

[Guest]

 

If series are going to do these multi-episode mysteries, they need remember that the most of the audience is not going to allocate a bunch of brain cells to remembering the ongoing story.  Superfans may pay close attention and analyze the details, but shows don't survive if only the superfans are watching.  Therefore, they need to refresh the memories of the regular viewers - have a "previously on" at the beginning, put a little bit of the ongoing story in each episode instead of skipping a few episodes, and don't have 4-5 week breaks between episodes.  Every time I tune in to a show and find myself thinking "Wait.. What was that story? Who was that guy? I thought they caught him already...." or have to pause the show so that my couch-mate and I can discuss the little bits we remember in hopes that enough of the story comes back to us, I get that much closer to finding something else to watch. 

 

The series debuted September 21st. I think I watched it live or the very next day.  This was episode 14 - 5 1/2 months later.  For a show that didn't immediately become must-see for me, there is no way I'm going to remember all these details. I like the show, but I'm not obsessively watching it.  I think I speak for a good deal of the audience of the show.  They need to get a more consistent viewing schedule or make things clearer.

 

Or I could say "I totally agree with what you just said."

[kwnyc]

If it weren't for boards like this, I'd also be totally confused. (Last week on Person of Interest, a character appeared who hadn't been seen in a couple of seasons, and I totally didn't recognize him...however, the other folks on that board pointed that out, so I got what could be an important plot point). I need Cliff's Notes for mah stories!

[Dowel Jones]

Although mention was made of the lack of funding for oversight of the programs, I find it difficult to believe that MS would hold her staff of 6 people directly and completely responsible for not seeing the corruption of the microloan program.  This is the Dept. of State, remember.  They have quite a few things going on in everyday business, and unless you dedicate one full time person to watch over how each dollar is spent on each of the myriad programs that State manages across the world, things are going to occur.  You correct the error, and you move on, unless your staff is involved.

[candall]

I can't keep up with the Mentor George Murder (Or Not?) thread, either.  Don't care.

 

Fortunately they have lots of other threads going, including COTW, so I'm happy.  I love this show.

 

I was certain the college enrollment requirement was going to be a wink-wink deal cooked up between Elizabeth and the guy at Microloans--who would turn out to be another one of Elizabeth's many, many, many friends.  Oh well.